Train Simulator - German & Austrian Signalling Guide
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- Опубліковано 1 жов 2018
- This video is a remake of the German signalling guide that I made in 2015. Since then, my knowledge of German signals has expanded and now includes Austrian signals too. Along with this, an upgraded PC and microphone, as well as a much wider variety of routes and trains seemed to warrant a new guide!
In this video, we take a look at track side signs, signal aspects, and PZB within Germany and Austria, as well as taking a look at the LZB system. The information in this video applies just the same to German routes and trains within Train Sim World as it does within Train Simulator.
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Routes featured:
RSSLO Suedbahn
RSSLO Tirol Austria
RSSLO Arlbergbahn
Konstanz to Villingen
Hamburg to Hanover
Hamburg to Luebeck
Munich to Augsburg
Munich to Garmisch-Partenkirchen
Munich to Rosenheim
Mittenwaldbahn
Cologne to Koblenz
Koblenz to Trier
Mannheim to Karlsruhe
Semmeringbahn - Ігри
I've been SO scared using PZB as it seemed so complicated... up until now!!! Thank you!!!
Hi there PTGRail
Amazing video, like always:
A few additions I'd like to make:
Speeds on Speed restricting signals (Hp2) only apply for the following station, junction and/or level crossing. You may accelerate to the previous line speed afterwards. That's also why such speed restictions are calles Zs3 signals, and permanent speed restrictions are called Lf7's
Clear signals always have 500Hz's deactivated - it doesn't matter when you release, if the signal is clear, release whenever you want, if it clears after you have passed the 500Hz, you must abide by the lower speed restrictions and would've gotten a ZB anyways: Don't release early, you might have hard luck.
Crawl towards red signals at a speed of at least 10kph before stopping, otherwise you may get 500Hz restrictive, which is a pain to get out of.
You forgot LZB End-Procedure: The LZB End lamp starts flashing as you approach LZB end. You have (if i'm not mistaken) 10 seconds to acknowledge with PZB/LZB frei, at which moment the lamp stops flashing and now is constantly illuminated. You must now abide by all trackside signals and follow PZB procedures.
Cheers,
Prof
EDIT: Depending on the book it's either Hektometertafel or Kilometerposten. It doesn't really matter :)
Fine detective work on the German words, here in the Nertherlands we write it as Hectometerpaal. Paal = Pole and Tafel in German is Sign in English or Bord in Dutch. About your edit, it kinda does matter to be honest. Other than that, I would like to know what you mean with all the abbrevated signals. (e.g. Hp2, Zs3 Lf7 etc...) It would make your explanation even better. thank you and great work on those extra pro tips ;-)
Dude I gotta say thank you so much. I was so confused about PZB/LZB in TSW/TSC. I wanted to learn so bad but was so confused but here you are with a very easy to understand video that I can listen to while playing TSW/TSC and understand what I am seeing on screen. Thanks bro! You're a life saver!!
A Hectometer is 100 meters, so I guess it would make sense that those signs are called that. Great video as always!
Your right, on mainland Europe we measure distances on rails and roads in hectometers instead of the better know mile posts or kilometer posts most other countries use. Greets from the Netherlands....
Indeed this is correct. Bonus info about hectometers: You may have heard of a unit of area called a "hectare", this is short for "square hectometer", which is 100 meters x 100 meters.
Another video of the highest quality, with the amount of time put in really showing! Great work Peter!! :)
Thanks! It took a lot of work to put this together. Glad it shows :)
Notes for this video:
1. I've covered all major signal aspects in this video, but ended up having to cut out certain minor signal aspects due to an inability to get the simulator to display the aspects needed - such as protection signals in Austria.
2. If you find any inaccuracies in this video, please leave them as a reply to this comment, so if I can verify it I will amend this comment to make note of any inaccuracies which need correcting.
Update 1 - If you are approaching a stop signal, and it clears before you have reached the 500hz magnet, it does not matter if you press PZB free/release before or after you reach this magnet, as the magnet won't be active if the signal has cleared. The speed limits given only apply if the signal clears after you have passed an active 500hz magnet.
Update 2 - When I mentioned acknowledge the PZB for a speed restriction in a type U train, using a reduction to 60kph as the example, I was incorrect in saying that you only have to slow to 60kph. In this instance, you will still have to slow to 55kph. At this time, you should then be able to release from monitoring and accelerate back to 60kph. This would be even more noticeable if the speed reduction was from 100kph to say 80kph - you would have to acknowledge the PZB, and slow all the way down to 55kph before being able to accelerate back to 80kph.
Update 3 - When going from LZB to PZB, you need to press the PZB free/release key, not the acknowledge key as I said in this video.
Update 4 - LZB is not in fact a moving block system as I previously said, but still relies on fixed signal blocks. The difference between LZB and PZB is that LZB utilises continuous train control, whereas PZB only utilises intermittent train control.
Amazing video!! Just wondering if you could create a guide for signalling in the U.S. (where I live). Thanks so much!
My problem with creating a US signalling guide is that so many different railroads utilise different signalling systems and rules. I need someone to provide me with a list of the different US railroads within TS, and information on the different rules and signal aspects utilised by these railroads.
Ah, okay. Sorry if I'm coming out like a pushy person. It's just that your signalling turorials are SOOOO amazing. I literally know more about British and German/Austrian signals than my home country's :P It would be especially great if you could find info on the Metro North Railroad and Amtrak signals. Once again, I love this channel and how committed you are to Train Simulator. As soon as I get my new computer, I will dedicate most of my channel to Route Learning videos and the like. I would totally be a Patreon supporter if I had the funds. For now, you can consider me a dormant supporter :) Anyways, have a good day/night/evening!
Hello sir, I d'ont want to take to much of your time. I want to know, if you agree to respond, how much money have you spend on train simulator? If you don't want to respond, there is no problem.
Btw, you video quality is incredible!
I'm not too versed in the lineside stuff, so I can't comment on that. But I have taken the actual train operations to heart...
First complaint; you mention you should release from 1000 hz _specifically_ before the 500 hz magnet if the signal is clear (25:17)-as if not releasing will result in 500 hz monitoring, which is not the case. If the signal is clear, 500 hz monitoring won't be a problem. You can release whenever you want, no need to worry about extra monitoring if you wait too long to release. That even includes not releasing at all.
[This also isn't the best advice, as it is slightly risky. Someone could get in a habit of doing this, then mistakenly release when their signal is not actually clear.]
Second, when mentioning 1000 hz in the content of 60 kph, you say that a mode U train has to slow down to _only_ 60 kph (39:20). That's not true, PZB does not know the speed limit, so will still force the train down to 55. It's overkill and not very smart but PZB ain't that smart!
This is where PZB release is so useful: release from the 1000 hz monitoring, and you can get your mode U train back up to 60 faster than waiting for monitoring to expire.
[Unlike the first problem, this is directly telling people to do something that _will_ result in an emergency brake. Dangerous move right there.]
And the only other thing I have is that you probably should have covered the transition from LZB to PZB as well, as this involves "acknowledging" the 'ende' indicator using the PZB Release button (not acknowledge. Its a bit odd.)
Wow, it's pretty hard for me to imagine how much work this must have taken to produce such a detailed guide. Thanks so much, truly amazing work. You should be paid paid to produce technical videos. You have a real talent!
Idk why im just now seeing this. This is amazing information that I never knew. Thanks for this man!
Thank you so much Peter, I've been blagging it on German route until now, but you've helped me enjoy my routes more now. Superb production too.
Brilliant guide Peter, much clearer and far more comprehensive than your earlier one. Well done and thank you.
As always, an excellent video. One thing I might have added - While you can differentiate the type of signal (home vs. distant) by the shape of the signal and the orientation of the lights, you can also tell what kind of signal it is by the signage on the pole holding up the signal itself. The red and white vertical checkerboard for a main signal and the white rectangle with a black X in it for a distant signal. Oh yeah, let's not forget that repeater signals don't have any of those bits of signage on their poles. That's all I have to add, again, excellent video and thanks for taking the time to make it..
You know, I actually knew about the cross on a distant signal and red and white colouring of the main signals. Got no idea why I didn’t mention them. Doh! I’ll add the information to my pinned comment on here :)
Excellent video, very informative, great shots and editing. Lovely naration as well! You are a legend.
Superb video with great information on the signal system within Germany and Austria and vastly help me in driving locomotives within TSW.
Hello from Ottawa Canada!
"PZB is also used in (list of countries) ... and one route in Canada." Whoohoo, O-Train Trillium Line (aka Line 2)!
You're an intelligent individual and this shows in all of your content, excellent work. Keep it up and i look forward to all of the future guides/tutorials you create. Because of your content I've been purchasing AP DMU's 🙈
Did you get his iq score or something?
Hello @PTGRail, thank you so much for your amazing effort, even I learned so many articles about PZB/LZB safety systems, I have learned too some great infos watching your video tutorial and reading some of the commentaries at the bottom to improve my basic knowledge. Always much appreciated and your video explain better than reading some manuals instructions coming with German locos. You are the best teacher on TS. You might have to be remunerate by DTG for your great work. Thank you again.
Absolutely fantastic stuff!! Very much enjoyed this 😀 thanks for the efforts
Thank you for this amazing video with great explanations. I have watched a few videos but never got the right answers but now I've cracked it. This is the best video of them all. Thanks
Thank you from the bottom of my heart for this video, which helps me a lot!
Excellent video, you've covered it so well, thank you!
Very usefull video,enjoed watching it,will now try putting it into practise, thankyou for making it
This was way too helpful. I never got pzb but I get it all now. Sounds very cool and I’m gunna go check it out now
Thanks man! I tried to plan this video in such a way it really shows you how everything works, rather than just telling you. I hope it helps you out! :)
At 6:25 the kilometer distance marker versus the hectometer marker. In the metric system is 1 kilometer 1000 meters, kilo means 1 thousand. Hecto means 1 hundred so 1 hectometer is 100 meters. The distance marker shows the number 25 with a 4 below, meaning 25 kilometer plus 4 hectometer, meaning that distance from the given location is 25 thousand plus 4 hundred meter or 25.4 kilometer, being the same as 254 hectometer. So the distant marker is a combined kilometer and hectometer marker, official called a hectometer sign placed every 2 hectometer (200 meters) along the route. A hectometer sign at a distance of 10 kilometer exact from a given location would show the number 10 with the number 0 below, this to avoid confusion with the 10 speed limit marker of 100 km/h. See by example at 6:46 the sign with the numbers 69 and 0, placed on the electricity pylons, not being the speed limit signs of 690 km/h but the 690 hectometer post at the distance of exact 69 kilometer from a given location.
Thank you so much, excellent video!
Great guide, I understood two points with PZB where I was going wrong before and having penalty brake incidents.
Glad this guide was able to help you out! What were you struggling with?
Brilliant, thank you.
This is brilliant. I just found your channel and subscribed but see that you haven't posted anything in a couple of months. I hope you are well and hope to see more videos in the future.
I will be back soon! ;)
@PTGRail Awesome video, indeed you are the train instructor of TSW/TS and on YT... One thing though, the later part with the ICE on the Karlsruhe map, that map had a lot of bugs, especially erratic signalling. At the time it was mostly on that route, but other routes had some signalling bugs as well sometimes... in that department Dovetail has come a long way.
Excellent thankyou. Much clearer than Matt's from trainsimworld.
LZB system is being planned to be momentarily phased out along with other equivalent systems in other EU Countries. It will be replaced with European Train Control System (ETCS) to facilitate interoperability.
Great tutorial!
Thank you!
Nice video
I hope signals didn't change on german train routes in Train Sim World 2020. I want to run trains without any assistance from the game to attatch some gravity to the drivers experience. Thanks for the upload. You did a great job putting it into full quide.
THEY did not. and tsw 2 too. there is another tutorial(my comment below) by Matt peddlesden. German trains with all safety enlabed are awesome to drive
There is a lot of routes to drive when you return!
Gosh what a task to do this video well done Peter... will you be doing it all again with the updates or just add them as caption overlays ?
Who would have ever thought train driving was so complicated…
There’s an awful lot more to driving trains than most people realise
Isn't it fascinating that not even two neighbouring countries with the same official language can agree to merge their signalling systems? in East Europe we've got the same system all over since the 1950s.
Great video! Can you do a video about building a german route with signals?
The best.......I’m speechless
Thanks! I hope this video helps you out 🙂
Thank you. Super fast reply :)
@@PTGRail ur still alive mate?!
Hello PTGRail.
Hey. First of all, I just want to say that you've done a really good job making this video!! :) But I have one thing to say, maybe you could have split the video in half? 50% German and 50% Austrian signalling, and not just going between them? :)
Massive thanks for this very informative video must have taken an age to make
Thanks! It sure did - I basically spent 6 hours a day for a week making this.
Awesome video. By the way what is the classification for the EMU featured at the end?
Thanks! It's a BR 420. :)
Very interesting to see how different countries have choosen to signal there railways.Be interested to see other countries i.e France,Czech Republic etc do it.Dont know if you have produced anything on them?
Thank you for explaining of how the PZB and LZB systems works, but one thing I still don't understand while I'm playing Train Sim World 3 myself, is how do you know when you have to slow down to stop at an abroaching station and also how you know when to skip a station if you don't have to stop there when there is no 1000hz applied if you turned off the stopmarker in the settings of the game? Which board signs you have to watch for?
some stations have a so called Haltestellentafel 1km before the station:
bar.wikipedia.org/wiki/Datei:Haltestellentafel.png
This is not very reliable though, as not all stations have it. The realistic way to know it is to download a so called „Buchfahrplan“, which shows the various stops, signals and speed limits on a pdf document. You can then compare that to your location on the route by the help of the little white kilometer boards hanging on the catenary mast
Fyi: There are actually 3 main signalling standards: Hv, Hl and Ks. Hv beeing the oldest is what you described. The green flashing light is part of the Ks system. Hv has been developed in the 1920s, Hl in the GDR in the 60s and Ks after Germany reunited in the 90s. Hl is probably the most complex - i highly recommend the wikipedia article "German signaling systems".
As for train control systems: Additionally to PZB and LZB there also is ETCS, which is a relatively new (2000+) european standard. From the operators perspective it is rather similar to LZB, however depending on Operation Mode (Level 1, Limited Supervision) you still have to watch out for outside signals.
ETCS isn't simulated in any of the simulators so probably why he doesn't mention it.
@@tgm9991 there certainly is software which does simulate it (the main one known to me being ZuSi 3 - a German train simulator originally designed for driver training, but also having a version for the general public), but those are not the common simulators. It's also only deployed on very few railways in Germany and only in the past 10 years. Most German railroads are 100+ years old
great video, but what about speed limit 25 km/h and which signal signals it?
Could you also make a Dutch signalling guide video?
Another problem with the 2020 editions of TS and TSW is that they don't model headlights correctly, so that running in the dark it's very difficult if not impossible to read signage, including those critical Lf6 speed reduction warnings.
Thank you so much from Russia!
Thanks for taking the time and patience and put out this guide, comes in handy :)
PZB can be really confusing, although, just to clarify:
1- you don't need to acknowledge PZB passing flashing greens signals, right?
2- you must acknowledge PZB passing the speed reduction warning (before the reduction itself comes)
3- so after passing the 70km/h main indication(where the speed reduction comes at force) at correct speed, I don't need to acknowledge?
Thanks!
1. If it's just the flashing green signal, no. If it indicates a signal other than line speed, yes.
2. Yes, you need to acknowledge the warning boards, but only if those boards are displaying a speed change below 100kph. So, going from 140 to 120 doesn't require an acknowledgement.
3. Correct. You're good to go so long as the signal is clear and there are no further speed reductions displayed.
Hi there! Thanks for your comment. Let me try and reply to the best of my knowledge:
1) You might have to, I'm not certain! It's best to do it anyway as it's best to be safe that sorry :p
2) Yes, if the speed limit reduction is from a speed above 85kph to a speed below 85kph. For example dropping from 100kph to 60kph, you must acknowledge the warning, but you don't need to acknowledge the reduction itself. 160kph - 100kph, you shouldn't need to acknowledge anything. 80 - 40kph? I'm not completely sure!
3) No, you definitely don't need to press PZB acknowledge where the speed restriction comes into force.
@@parkerhansen5025 Thanks for clarify!
@@PTGRail Thanks again. Unfortunately the TSW Rapid Transit route that you have mentioned doesn't work at all with PZB, it's somewhat broken. I think it might be related with the route signaling itself. (sorry for little mistakes, English is not my native language)
You actually forgot about a few austrian signs. One being the phantograph down sign which gets used at certain borders and at certain other times. Also another one is the no Overhead wire sign.
an older version of PZB is used in Serbia
Please also do this for American Systems... Thanks
40:48 IIRC, LZB isn't a moving block system. It's a continuous (as opposed to intermittent like PZB) cab signaling system that is overlaid on traditional fixed blocks. A true moving block system can put moving stop targets on the back of a moving train. LZB still relies on fixed blocks for train detection.
Thanks for the info, I will add this correction to the pinned comment :)
But it's still the closest one to a moving block system that's widely in use.
@ it's not close to a moving block at all LZB is just a system that's overlayed on conventional fixed block signalling that can get information continuously and from further away and presents it in the cab. A moving block is where the block moves with the train and the size changes depending on speeds and isn't really feasible on the mainline quite common on metro systems though.
Is there a tutorial for england and USA?
Hello. Great guide , i finally understand all the signalling and markers on the german routes in train sim world 2 but i don't understand how you are supposed to know how far it is to the next station? Is there a marker for this? Thanks in advance and sorry for my english.
You know how far from a station you are from either knowing the route or in the Sims by cheating and putting the overlay on
@@tgm9991 Agreed. TSW2 doesn't provide any obvious hint of an approaching station except from the overlay. I suppose real life drivers have a checklist of sections to be covered on hand and prior knowledge of the route.
@@joeljustin Real life drivers route training is probably more challenging than learning the actual rolling stock as they can't be left alone on a route unless they know it like the back of their hand they need to know the locations and names/numbers of every signal, level crossing, bridge, junction and station at least in the UK they do.
Can we get a guide with US signalling?
What program does he use to have this graphics?
8:21 is it just me or the cable for the OLE counterweight does not go around the pulley?
Hectometer posts are called like that because tyhey indicate the number of hectometers from a given location! 1hm = 100m
what signaling system does the tyne and wear metro use
PZB is also used in Serbia and Montenegro.
and Israel
1:50
You got the punktformige right. Zugbeeinflussung, not so much.
Zug-beh-eing-flusung.
It's not half as complicated as it sounds here, the system is very old, but still one of the safest, if not the safest under the sun...
What are some good German routes that make good use of PZB/LZB?
Best ones are Konztanz-Villingen (good for training PZB as it's detailed and reliable), Berlin-Leipzig + Hamburg-Hannover (good for LZB use). Frankfurt high speed and Augsburg-München for traveling at enormous speeds up to 300 kph. Additionally, I haven't tried Bremen-Münster but that seems to be a very good route, too.
Unfortunately for sim players, we don't get to do the prep a real-life DB driver would. Before he ever climbs into the cab, he has calculated the weight of his consist and pulled the appropriate braking curves from DB's extensive library; this graph tells him, for any given speed, when and how hard to break to conform to the PzB deceleration parameters.
In the sims, all we can do is guess (or just hammer on full-service brakes at every yellow, and deal with the huge speed loss).
8:55 is there a DTG voyager nearby? 😂
Can we get an American guide next?
As I replied to a previous comment: My problem with creating a US signalling guide is that so many different railroads utilise different signalling systems and rules. I need someone to provide me with a list of the different US railroads within TS, and information on the different rules and signal aspects utilised by these railroads.
@PTGRail If you want a good way to demonstrate (at least certain types of) US Signals, I would recommend using RUN 8 Train Sim, as it lets you control signals in real time while opperating a train, and it will also let you go through all of the various aspects that the signals can display.
Also, If you want a good guide to rules and aspects, this is a good place to start: signals.jovet.net/rules/
As for the railroads within TS, all four of the Class I roads (UPRR, BNSF, CSX, and NS) are represented to at least some degree.
@@PTGRail I understand, could you possibly do a Northeast corridor signalling guide?
13:55 actually it is orange not yellow :P
0:45 the engine sounds weird on that locomotive
That's the Siemens ES64 U2 Taurus. Powering up, they sound quite musical. It's even cooler when trying to accelerate with slippery rails in the snow! See this clip: ua-cam.com/video/aRf30pVGMp4/v-deo.html
@@PTGRail That was the Tirol Addon Taurus right? The Tirol Addon Taurus actually doesnt really match up with the real sound. The Semmeringbahn Taurus sounds more realistic and better actually.
Hey! You have made a great video but in reality there are 3 commonly used Signal systems in Germany:
H/V ( Hauptsignal/vorsignal ) the most common one, used on Semaphore signals
KS Signale ( Kombinationssignale ) most new one, commonly found on single-track railways and at Frankfuhrt Hbf
HL Signale ( i think Hauptliniensignal but i don't know the real name :/ ) ex-GDR (DDR) signals, also called "a book with 18 signals" (i may be wrong about it)
If you want me to explain the HL signals and SK signals on the line between Augsburg and Donauwörth or the (very rare) EZMG signals let me know in the replies please
Sure, I’m always interested in learning more about signalling! Especially as I’ve just become a signaller for real here in the UK. :)
Make another video tsw 2020 tee vally line
I believe the LZB is bugged. I recently drove a Just Trains Railjet on the Munich- Augsburg LZB line and I actually managed to catch up another train in front because the system stopped noticing the red signals (I should have coupled up just to see what happens). My train finally broke when coming to the end of the LZB section and emergency braked which I couldn’t release from, so had to quit the game. This is infuriating. The ÖBB 1116 is the single most enjoyable loco I drive in TS and I have no other routes where I can really thrash it. I only hope TS 2019 resolves the problems.
german signalling is so confusing, why with the speedboards don't they just say the actual number?
Larger numbers on the same space. And multiplying it by 10 isn't sooo difficult...
A
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