10 Comic Book Superheroes Who Created Their Own Worst Enemy

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  • Опубліковано 18 жов 2024
  • Sometimes your nemesis only exists because of you.
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КОМЕНТАРІ • 288

  • @SAPProd
    @SAPProd 4 роки тому +157

    A lot of these remind me of the Trial episode from BTAS and the quote from the District Attorney Van Dorn:
    “I used to believe Batman was responsible for you people but now I see nearly everyone here would have ended up exactly the same, Batman or not. Oh, the gimmicks might be different, but you'd all be out there in some form or another, bringing misery to Gotham. The truth is, you created him.”

    • @jarianharris8240
      @jarianharris8240 4 роки тому +18

      Boom. Exactly.

    • @Eisenwulf666
      @Eisenwulf666 4 роки тому +2

      While i do agree it's a great speech, i don't agree with her conclusions.

    • @SAPProd
      @SAPProd 4 роки тому +6

      @@Eisenwulf666 please elaborate.

    • @sean9177
      @sean9177 4 роки тому

      @@Eisenwulf666 supposition

    • @Codex951
      @Codex951 3 роки тому +4

      Well damn...I actually agree with that.

  • @Nx57ytre
    @Nx57ytre 4 роки тому +255

    How is it Reed's fault if Doom is a stubborn asshole who ignored his warning and decided to continue his experiment?
    "That jerk is going to pay for trying to be nice to Doom !!"

    • @lightspeed7312
      @lightspeed7312 4 роки тому +8

      IKR.

    • @khawarparvez7679
      @khawarparvez7679 4 роки тому +3

      Yeah was thinking to same

    • @CUF17
      @CUF17 4 роки тому +9

      Ikr? Some of these are a stretch in terms of the hero CREATING their enemy. In some of these cases, the bad guys are ALREADY bad and just come across the good guys at some point and declare revenge. Batman, Aquaman and Ant-Man are the only solid ones here imo.

    • @seanbigay1042
      @seanbigay1042 3 роки тому +1

      That's one thing that makes the bad guys bad. There's no telling what will set them off.

    • @madsgrams2069
      @madsgrams2069 3 роки тому +1

      Yeah, Doom is just a grade A @-hole.

  • @alexr4505
    @alexr4505 4 роки тому +16

    Jules self-love outro hits every time, its fr invigorating 💯

  • @JorenMyers
    @JorenMyers 4 роки тому +22

    Jules, I love your insistence on positivity.
    "What the world needs now is love, sweet love."

  • @jarianharris8240
    @jarianharris8240 4 роки тому +35

    Glad to see Hank and Ultron were on the list. That is literally a Frankenstein and his creation type thing. Strange and Mordo was a good one too, as well as Spidey and Venom.

  • @JIMBO8472
    @JIMBO8472 4 роки тому +27

    Joker:"you knocked me into that vat of chemicals, that wasn't easy to get over, dont think that I didnt try.."

    • @pandre925
      @pandre925 3 роки тому +2

      “I know you did.” 👍🏾👍🏾

  • @coolcomics
    @coolcomics 4 роки тому +12

    I love the positive messages at the end of jules videos man there just what I need

  • @roguelebeau4572
    @roguelebeau4572 4 роки тому +43

    I’ve never taken the time to comment on your videos, but I want to thank you for your continued end messages of love and support during these difficult times. Keep on doing what you are doing. Your message is being heard and appreciated ❤️.

  • @DeetsterB
    @DeetsterB 3 роки тому +4

    Jules I simply love watching your videos. If only so I can hear you say I’m awesome.
    But tonight you went above and beyond with your monologue about us being our own worst enemy. I started to tear up.
    You, Jules, are definitely awesome! Never forget it!

  • @DeetsterB
    @DeetsterB 3 роки тому +3

    Thank you, Jules, for that message at the end. I must have needed to hear because I started to cry.
    Love your videos.

  • @tysondennis1016
    @tysondennis1016 4 роки тому +54

    “Everyone makes their own demons”

  • @tompatchak8706
    @tompatchak8706 4 роки тому +20

    Jules, thank you for your end messages. Very helpful in the time we are in AND dealing with shit in my life.

  • @drei602
    @drei602 4 роки тому +4

    Thanks Jules, for bringing back attention to mental health. Just never know when someone needs that encouragement.

  • @lightspeed7312
    @lightspeed7312 4 роки тому +95

    No Barry and Eobard? This is literally the biggest example of a hero creating his own villian

    • @TheWonderRabbit
      @TheWonderRabbit 4 роки тому +35

      How? The Flash was long dead by then.
      Eobard wanted to be Flash’s best friend, travelled back in time, discovered he was in fact Flash’s greatest enemy and the revelation drove him mad.
      He created himself.

    • @jarianharris8240
      @jarianharris8240 4 роки тому +4

      Yeah I was expecting that one too

    • @lightspeed7312
      @lightspeed7312 4 роки тому +8

      @@TheWonderRabbit In a way the kind of created each other actually.

    • @TheWonderRabbit
      @TheWonderRabbit 4 роки тому +8

      @@lightspeed7312 What did Barry do, other than exist 300 years before Eo was even born?

    • @koyinproductions9053
      @koyinproductions9053 4 роки тому +3

      He beat Eobard up, when he travelled to the 25th century.

  • @pennywisenibbles4949
    @pennywisenibbles4949 4 роки тому +48

    Venom technically isnt a villain but more of an anti-hero

    • @robertagu5533
      @robertagu5533 4 роки тому +6

      Can't imagine HE created his own worst enemy unless one counts anything involving Carnage.. I think

    • @pietrocatalano4285
      @pietrocatalano4285 4 роки тому +11

      He was a villain. He became better over time.

    • @robertagu5533
      @robertagu5533 4 роки тому +1

      @@pietrocatalano4285 also true, alot of others started out similarly

    • @winggweeps
      @winggweeps 3 роки тому

      Now

  • @danieluthor
    @danieluthor 4 роки тому +358

    Rest in peace t'challa 🥺✌

  • @MrEandc4life
    @MrEandc4life 4 роки тому +19

    Jules, I am a recovered addict and today a random addict asks me if I could get anything around here......my hear sank, I felt none of my progress mattered. Your pick me up speach was ledg

  • @beacon666
    @beacon666 2 роки тому

    This is by far my favourite channel and I’ve only recently started to read comics but it’s so nice to watch videos like this without spoiling an entire comic

  • @sauravagarwal4412
    @sauravagarwal4412 4 роки тому +19

    You should have included the DCEU's version of Black Manta as well.
    His origin story was similar to the comic you just spoke about, although considering his actions in the film, I can see why you might have left him out

  • @stephendwyer6210
    @stephendwyer6210 4 роки тому +5

    This was so satisfying. Cheers Jules

  • @aaroncaldwell3769
    @aaroncaldwell3769 2 роки тому

    Out of all the people in whatculture this guy is always my favorite always saying things so nice that we are always not alone and we always have some one i love he always leaves a nice message at the end of the video thank you so much there were times i need that but didnt know i needed it

  • @mahirgangwal1665
    @mahirgangwal1665 4 роки тому +17

    Sometimes, it's a superhero's massive ego that creates villains.

  • @BurttheBard
    @BurttheBard Місяць тому

    I LOVE listening to when Jules narrates because he always has that kind message at the end ❤

  • @AnuprashChetia
    @AnuprashChetia 4 роки тому +109

    Hey WhatCulture !
    You said that there is no iconic rogues gallery in all of comics than Spider-Man's.
    You forgot Batman and his rogues gallery !!!

    • @jimorpia4913
      @jimorpia4913 4 роки тому +22

      And Flash’s, they’re literally called the Rouges

    • @pietrocatalano4285
      @pietrocatalano4285 4 роки тому +4

      Oh, dear, this is going to become a very heated discussion...

    • @titanhades4331
      @titanhades4331 4 роки тому +19

      Flashs, though, is not iconic. Batmans and Spidermans, at least, are known by people outside of comic lovers. Very few not into comics don't have a clue about most of Flashs.

    • @stephendwyer6210
      @stephendwyer6210 4 роки тому

      @@titanhades4331 agreed! I'm one of these people tbh. Not a hugh Flash fan!

    • @sunshinesooperman5110
      @sunshinesooperman5110 4 роки тому +1

      Agreed. I would even say that once you get past the Green Goblin, the Sinister Six (not sure how truly “iconic” Kraven is, although he is formidable), Venom and Carnage, I don’t think Spider-Man’s bench of rogues is nearly as deep as Batman’s. ALTHOUGH anyone who’s ever read The Superior Foes of Spider-Man know Ol’ Webhead has the most hilarious rogues’ gallery, no contest.

  • @m1lkchoc96
    @m1lkchoc96 4 роки тому +8

    so almost all the villiant start from having salty feeling.

  • @sean9177
    @sean9177 4 роки тому +2

    I liked the ending there. Thank you for reminding us we're not alone

  • @jamsywamsy
    @jamsywamsy 2 роки тому

    I love those little support messages that Jules leaves at the end of these videos.

  • @ernestogiron7623
    @ernestogiron7623 2 роки тому

    Great video, and an even better message at the end, thank you, truly.

  • @randallpetroelje3913
    @randallpetroelje3913 4 роки тому

    Your a good man and narrator!!! Many Thanks 🙏!! Keep up the good work. Nothing but love from across the pond 👍

  • @jobrodgers-foster3403
    @jobrodgers-foster3403 4 роки тому

    Great video , great message from u to all of us in the audience !!! Thank u so much for providing this video !!!

  • @StrictlyParanoia
    @StrictlyParanoia 4 роки тому +1

    Beautiful message at the end! Thank you

  • @jarianharris8240
    @jarianharris8240 4 роки тому +1

    Beautiful message at the end as well.

  • @MuciusSkaevola
    @MuciusSkaevola 3 роки тому +2

    The thing is, since the flashback in the killing joke is completely imaginary we don't know if it's batman the cause for the creation of the joker. But in the original red hood comic book, the joker totally is responsible for his disfiguration, and escaping by the chemical waste basin was a part of his plan since his helmet was designed as a diving helmet though it was probably damaged in a chase, leading to filter issues. As usual the red hood escaped, but the last time he did was when he willingly jumped into the chemical waste basin of the monarch card company factory, leading to a character transformation. That said, red hood was already an important nemesis in batman's early career.

  • @louislopez80
    @louislopez80 3 роки тому

    Beautiful message at the end, good sir!!

  • @davidclayton5328
    @davidclayton5328 2 роки тому

    The ending got me. Thanks Jules thanks alot man.

  • @davidbowden2194
    @davidbowden2194 3 роки тому

    I needed that message today
    Thank you

  • @nefarioust8760
    @nefarioust8760 4 роки тому +10

    I needed that end message, thank you

    • @tompatchak8706
      @tompatchak8706 4 роки тому +2

      All of his end messages make me cry and smile at the same time

    • @CarbideSix
      @CarbideSix 4 роки тому +1

      I second that emotion.

  • @CV_BBS_3303
    @CV_BBS_3303 3 роки тому +2

    2:01. It didn't kill Namor and his gang. They were saved by Reed Richards from another universe. Namor and Black Panther even team up to fight God King Doom later in the story

  • @Lauren.E.O
    @Lauren.E.O 4 роки тому +1

    Great topic!

  • @ek64712
    @ek64712 2 роки тому

    Love the ending note.

  • @themerciless1907
    @themerciless1907 3 роки тому

    Thanks for the positive messages at the end!

  • @jenssyromero3947
    @jenssyromero3947 3 роки тому

    Great message at the end definitely had me thinkin

  • @GuillermoGonzalez-kp7zv
    @GuillermoGonzalez-kp7zv 4 роки тому +1

    Woah this ending actually made me happy

  • @pandre925
    @pandre925 3 роки тому +1

    So you’re telling me Black Manta only exists because Aquaman couldn’t hear him over the ROAR OF THE GODDAMN OCEAN? 🤦🏾‍♂️

  • @98nh3609
    @98nh3609 4 роки тому +2

    Not for nothing, but how did Reed, Aquaman, and Wally West create their worst enemies? Dr.Doom didn't listen to warnings because of a college "rivalry" Aquaman couldn't control not being able to hear a cry for help. And one of the few times Wally didn't want to screw up the time lines his enemy did so against his wishes and the tread mill exploded.

    • @downtown_clownybrown
      @downtown_clownybrown 4 роки тому

      not to mention reed and doom aren't exactly enemies. i mean sue and reed allowed valeria to live in latveria with doom for a while

  • @jamalvargas6146
    @jamalvargas6146 4 роки тому +15

    Not comics but Stan smith and Santa Claus which he started giving Steve a assault rifle and shooting jolly old st nick good episode of American dad

  • @PowerHouseDream
    @PowerHouseDream 4 роки тому +1

    It was avengers and new avengers run where Black Panther blew the bomb on Namor and the Cabal . But they escaped and ended up on battle war.

  • @ivanob965
    @ivanob965 4 роки тому +1

    Can't wait for the three Jokers vol.3

  • @THEMOPTOPCHANNEL
    @THEMOPTOPCHANNEL 2 роки тому

    That bomb in Secret Wars killed NO ONE!Namor,& the entire Cabal survived, & made it to the Maker's earth...tell that part!

  • @dcdemon5951
    @dcdemon5951 3 роки тому +2

    Did he really say spider man has the best villans while Batman exists?

  • @U.S.CyberSoldier50
    @U.S.CyberSoldier50 4 роки тому

    Ultron & Brainiac are my most favorite Supervillains + Cyborg & Ironman are my favorite Superheros !!!

  • @eatschmitt4265
    @eatschmitt4265 4 роки тому +1

    So idk if there’s something like this but as someone wanting to get into comics I’d love a list of comics for those trying to figure out where to start

    • @avalanche1990
      @avalanche1990 4 роки тому +1

      theres a comics channel on youtube called Comics explained he does an easy to follow rundown on them. he gets asked that alot and it depends on the kind of story you want to read. check out his videos and it might help you out

    • @eatschmitt4265
      @eatschmitt4265 4 роки тому

      @@avalanche1990 thanks for the info. I’ll definitely check it out

  • @yeetkakashi2284
    @yeetkakashi2284 3 роки тому

    Dude I love jules, every time I see him pop up on a video I get all happy 😁

  • @TheBlackGamer666
    @TheBlackGamer666 3 роки тому +1

    to be honest you could say that every hero creates his/hers villans. Good and evil co-exist. If one gets big the other will to. for example, before the first Hero appears there is no Villan, and vice versa. After their apperance after a while getting the ropes on Heroism/Villany BUM There is the first obstacle, and thus the cicle continues

  • @juanmata9814
    @juanmata9814 4 роки тому

    1. Hulk and Red Hulk
    2. Weapon H and Dario
    3. Wolverine and Sabertooth
    4. Superman and ultraman
    5. Conner Kent and Superboy Prime
    6. Scarlet Witch and Thanos
    7. Batman and the Joker
    8. The Flash and Reverse Flash
    9. Captain Atom and Major Force
    10. Spiderman and The Green Goblin
    These are my favorite Best mortal enemies in both DC and Marvel comics ever

    • @lxglkclan1909
      @lxglkclan1909 4 роки тому

      Batman and Joker and number 7 yu must be a marvel fan btw I’m not hating so don’t get offended

    • @juanmata9814
      @juanmata9814 4 роки тому

      @@lxglkclan1909 none taken I was in a hurry didn't have time to think it threw

  • @Zeus_Almighty
    @Zeus_Almighty 3 роки тому

    Great words at the end...

  • @amanzeihedioha
    @amanzeihedioha 4 роки тому +6

    Have a Nice Day.

  • @unpopularquasar
    @unpopularquasar 3 роки тому

    'he created his worst enemy when he didn't hear a little boy on the noisy ocean'

  • @JYDY-if5rf
    @JYDY-if5rf 4 місяці тому +1

    They forgot one venom and carnage and punisher and jigsaw

  • @CelticVictory
    @CelticVictory 4 роки тому

    "What good can a man who talks to fish do in a fight?" Considering that sharks are fish, quite good if it's underwater.

  • @drewneedsmoresleep6680
    @drewneedsmoresleep6680 3 роки тому

    In the MCU they could save a lot of time and energy just getting Tony Stark to apologize to the supervillain that we all know he created

  • @thequietrevolution3404
    @thequietrevolution3404 3 роки тому

    The worst, of course, is *Hank Pym's* creation of *Ultron.* Not only did he create his own worst enemy, he created mankind's worst enemy. In the end (or future), *Ultron* eliminates all life on Earth. Even *Kang the Conqueror* couldn't change the outcome, regardless of how many time-jumps he tried.

  • @jacksithlord1301
    @jacksithlord1301 4 роки тому

    You guys rock

  • @jarodM6
    @jarodM6 4 роки тому +2

    Batman has the most iconic rogues gallery Spider-Man has the second best rogues gallery.

    • @FlexStyleZ
      @FlexStyleZ 4 роки тому

      Thor rogues better than Spidey

    • @lxglkclan1909
      @lxglkclan1909 4 роки тому

      @@FlexStyleZ I’m sorry I’m a Dc fan and I don’t watch Marvel but if your gonna say iconic everyone knows joker Marvel and Dc fans I don’t know not one of Thor’s villains but it may just be me

    • @FlexStyleZ
      @FlexStyleZ 4 роки тому

      @@lxglkclan1909ignorance is not an excuse to make baseless statement. Go read some Thor comics and then we’ll discuss

    • @lxglkclan1909
      @lxglkclan1909 4 роки тому

      @@FlexStyleZ name one person that you know that does not no the joker

    • @FlexStyleZ
      @FlexStyleZ 4 роки тому

      @@lxglkclan1909 are you an idiot? Seriously? I weren’t even talking about the Joker and being well known by casuals doesn’t make him a better villain.
      Educate yourself

  • @Sleeper-Work
    @Sleeper-Work 4 роки тому +1

    Thumbnail looks like batman reaching out to the bloodborne hunter

  • @BfordOfficial
    @BfordOfficial 3 роки тому +1

    Wait maybe I'm confused where was Martian Manhunter at fault?

  • @parodontaxnexera5803
    @parodontaxnexera5803 2 роки тому

    Best video

  • @matejaboskovic7580
    @matejaboskovic7580 4 роки тому

    My first time seeing a popular channel with only 6 comments lol

  • @tarrbaby7318
    @tarrbaby7318 3 роки тому

    You mean to tell me,aquaman can talk to fish but cant hear someone yelling for help?🤔

  • @mark1eyeball
    @mark1eyeball 3 роки тому

    Hank Pym exists in the MCU but Tony Stark created Ultron using his AI assistant Jarvis as a mental template for Vision. This actually still pisses me off to no end

  • @prestonrodenkirch8412
    @prestonrodenkirch8412 3 роки тому +1

    Batman DID NOT create Joker. Joker dropped himself in the acid. Also Joker is actually responsible for Bruce becoming Batman. Everyone has it backwards.

  • @alexmoore7255
    @alexmoore7255 4 роки тому +6

    Namor and Thanos didnt die
    Just Saying
    \0_0/

    • @Popcultureguy3000
      @Popcultureguy3000 3 роки тому

      Yeah, he escaped with The Maker, and Thanos wasn’t anywhere near that bomb. Namor died later after Secret Wars by a version of the Squadron Supreme whose members were all the sole survivors of dimensions destroyed by The Cabal, a squad of villains that was formed by Namor to destroy alternate Earths that collide with theirs, which would end up destroying both Earths and the dimensions they belong to alongside of them.

  • @alehandroarries6995
    @alehandroarries6995 3 роки тому +1

    How many kings does Marvel have?
    I know of Thor T'Challa Namor and BlackBolt

  • @shadowdragonlord2295
    @shadowdragonlord2295 4 роки тому

    Top ten most humiliating defeats

  • @anthony1468
    @anthony1468 3 роки тому +1

    Superman-Lex Luthor

  • @DadOfCall
    @DadOfCall 3 роки тому

    Always better with Jules absolutely crushing another listicle. 🤺

  • @bmvthemoviefanatic7282
    @bmvthemoviefanatic7282 4 роки тому +1

    Not to be THAT guy, but I've always subscribed to the idea made explicit in Arkham City. In an interview tape with Hugo Strange, Joker discusses his origin and how he fell into the Acid because of Batman. HOWEVER, then Strange states that Joker has told a number of different origins to him and they keep changing, with the only consistent detail being Batman. So I don't think Batman ACTUALLY created the Joker. I think Joker has just dreamt it up that way as a way of convincing himself that he and Batman are somehow connected, even all the way back to their origins. That being said, in other media like "Gotham" or Batman '89 this is clearly not the case. I'm just saying for the comics, which also may not be true.

    • @wallywest4727
      @wallywest4727 4 роки тому

      Arkham City is its own thing and nothing it says matters. Batman created the Joker, him falling into the acid caused by Batman is the only thing we really know about his origin and is the only constant in it, Joker never imagined it as Batman himself as talked about it and regretted it.

  • @michaelcraff
    @michaelcraff 3 роки тому

    😲 Now that I think about it, that is messed up how Batman accidentally created The Joker!

  • @almightyt.a.p.472
    @almightyt.a.p.472 3 роки тому

    Impulse is easily my favorite Flash.

  • @isaiahortiz5171
    @isaiahortiz5171 3 роки тому +1

    Black manta's story is so sad😕

  • @fultoncunha8926
    @fultoncunha8926 3 роки тому

    I came here for harmless entertainment and I leave nearly in tears because jules tells me I'm worth it?

  • @LibertyBridgeProductions
    @LibertyBridgeProductions 4 роки тому

    Jewls is a rlly nice guy I think

  • @mousumibose1860
    @mousumibose1860 4 роки тому

    amaaaaaaaaaaaaaazing

  • @chrisgodfrey1880
    @chrisgodfrey1880 4 роки тому +3

    To whoever wrote this list, the bomb didn't kill namor, thanos, and the cabal. They escaped with the assistance of the maker. Though black panther didn't realize this until much later. This channel specifically out of the what culture channels gets a lot of facts wrong. Really need to have your writers fact check things a bit more before releasing lists and videos

    • @downtown_clownybrown
      @downtown_clownybrown 4 роки тому +1

      thank you! i literally jus paused the video right after that part to post something similar

    • @chrisgodfrey1880
      @chrisgodfrey1880 4 роки тому

      @@downtown_clownybrown No problem, it was probably my favorite major marvel comic event of the last decade so I have the facts for it locked in my head pretty tight lol

  • @insuranceinsight6001
    @insuranceinsight6001 4 роки тому

    Joker is Batman's greatest failure? Or is it that Joker is.....inevitable...

  • @b3games146
    @b3games146 3 роки тому

    not every universe, in flash point the joker is crazed Martha wayne who is not created by batman but actually leads thomas to become batman.

  • @stevengalloway8052
    @stevengalloway8052 3 роки тому

    Hold on now. I'd pit Batman's rougues gallery against Spider-Man's anytime... 😏

  • @lazrus01
    @lazrus01 3 роки тому

    The only umbrage I take with this is calling D'Kay "creature". Just because she's an alien and not fully mentally stable, does that really deserve the moniker?

  • @Orthane
    @Orthane 3 роки тому

    Every time you pronounce Aqua as Akwa I get conniptions.

  • @MidnitePizzamon
    @MidnitePizzamon 4 роки тому

    The bomb didn’t kill Namor. They escaped.

  • @GalazyProductions
    @GalazyProductions 4 роки тому +1

    Ant-Man has to be on here
    Edit: good he is

  • @BigDexMedia
    @BigDexMedia 3 роки тому +1

    Superman & Lex Luthor?

  • @ezraholt3174
    @ezraholt3174 4 роки тому +1

    Am I crazy or do a lot of these not actually create their own enemy?

  • @yohanpanlilio6196
    @yohanpanlilio6196 4 роки тому +2

    What about punisher and jigsaw

  • @kidsoulworld6879
    @kidsoulworld6879 4 роки тому

    technically the joker was created by society the same way Batman was and batman accidentally finished it off when Jack fell into the chemicals

  • @luissantiago5163
    @luissantiago5163 4 роки тому

    Oh awesome. Cool

  • @Diezel_Mayweather
    @Diezel_Mayweather 3 роки тому

    You might want to do some more research Namor the Cabal escaped the planet before it exploded . They even helped each other defeat God KingDoom

  • @DragonZord979
    @DragonZord979 4 роки тому +1

    I love you Jules but I have to disagree with you on who has the best rogues gallery. Batman has a far superior gallery and although they may not have effected the DC universe as a whole as much as Spider-Man's villains have in the Marvel universe, Batman's villains are much more complex and interesting.

  • @flameilitarydcuo1593
    @flameilitarydcuo1593 4 роки тому

    Itd make my day if wc replied to my comment

  • @kevinedie4119
    @kevinedie4119 4 роки тому

    It was the Third Secret Wars Namor was killed by T'Challa not the Second (although it was just Called Secret Wars whereas the second was called Secret Wars II)

    • @downtown_clownybrown
      @downtown_clownybrown 4 роки тому

      it also didn't kill him. namor and the cabal escaped to the ultimate universe with maker reed richards