Hi, thank you for the video. I'm a beginner and know nothing about moped. I hope you would upload more tutorial for the grande. I have a 1980 048 model grande that stop running on me. I clean out the carburetor and it still won't run. I think it is an electrical issue because I notice some of the wire are corroded. I'm at a total lost. I have been researching on the model and luckily found this video. Thank you so very much and please don't stop uploading videos.
akaiyanagiteru Thanks for commenting on the video, I knew this wouldn't be a popular video when I made it, but I thought it would help people out. Glad to hear it is of use to you. This was the first bike I learned on, it seems so simple now, but back then it was hard. I can help you with yours. When you cleaned the carb, did you clean the main jet as well? You should be able to stick a thin guitar wire through it to clean it. You cna check to make sure the exhaust is not clogged too. To test the electrical, all you have to do is wrap a wire around the spark plug like I did, and connect it to ground. You can try cleaning the plug and making the gap smaller. Best to buy a new plug to be safe, NGK BPR5HS. It could be your condenser or HT coil, you can get those very cheap online.
cyrex686 Thank you so very much for your help but please have patience with me because I'm new to all of this and have no knowledge on anything auto or mechanical related things. So far right now I'm cleaning the mufffler and buying a new spark plug. I know for sure that I have to change out some or all of the electrical wires because some of them have corroded and broken off. When I took off the muffler I notice the part where the engine is connected to the muffler is very dirty and very black. How would I go about to clean that? And what precautions I should be aware of? Do you think I need to take the engine apart and clean it? I'm not too sure what to do or how to go about it because right now the bike seem like everything need to be fix and I'm feeling overwhelm because I want to do it right and not mess it up, especially when I don't know anything. Thank you so very much again for your help, I really do appreciate it. You are a life saver!
Oh I forgot to mention, when I clean the carburetor I also clean out the jet. I also made sure that there was good gas flow where the gas was going into the carburetor. That's why I was at a lost to why the bike wouldn't idle unless I held onto the throttle and the bike would only started once. Thank you so very much!!!
akaiyanagiteru Happy to help, I was in your place once too. You can test to see if the muffler is blocked by just blowing in it. To decarbonise, basically find anything you can, a dremel with wire brush attachments, little screwdrivers, dental picks, wire brush, tooth brush. Just be careful not to remove metal, only the carbon buildup. Did it run at all before you took it apart? To redo the wires, you will need a puller for it, until you do that, doing any electrical fixes will be a huge pain, or impossible. I'd suggest you get a new condecser and coil just to be safe, get generic ones off ebay or aliexpress figure out a way to mount them later, they will be really cheap. The coil on mine died. A big piece of advice is to work on one thing at a time if you can, that way if you mess with something and it won't start, you know where to look. If it was working ok, then stopped suddenly, I can almost gaurntee you it is electrical, then carb, and other stuff is a smaller possibility. Taking off the engine in this thing is super easy once you have done it a few times. Takes 20 minutes. Suggest you spray down everyhting with WD-40, take a wire/tooth brush to it, then clean that off using a can of brake cleaner. Not necessary, but it will make any work you do a lot easier.
I got a citta with a single wire coming out of it, it's the black ignition wire. The point next to this exit point is used for my head and tail light attachement point which is a red wire that attaches to that shoe. I'm trying to figure out what makes my engine not run well! This video helped a bit.
Hi Mate, thanks for the video. I was riding my Ciao today and it just died. Engine turns over no problem. I have no spark and no head or tail lights when cranking on the pedals. Could you please give me an idea what might be the cause and where to start looking? Many thanks Max
Hello brother! I have the engine of ciao and I'm fixing it on my bicycle. Can u please tell me which way the engine runs (clockwise or anticlockwise) when the clutch is facing you! Since it's a two stroke can it run both ways or will the ignition timing go wrong?
Been a while, but I think clockwise. Just turn the pulley on the moped clockwise and make sure that the back wheel turns counterclockwise. If you are not using the old gearbox, you will need some gear reduction using probably two pulleys. Look on Mustie1 youtube channel for some ideas. I'm not sure if the timing will work both ways. You might need to modify the cam that activates the points, either rotate it or add a weld bead onto it. Good luck with your project, be sure to post it!
Hey, great video. I also have original wiring. I'm curious about how you rewired the coils. Desolder old and resolder new wires? This is my first time.
Yup, simple as that. Practice on some random wires first. Use lead solder, not lead free. Use flux from plumbing section of hardware store, flux core isn't enough. May need to sand the contacts. You will need a flywheel puller.
Yes, but they are usually dried out, so just use an external one rather than trying to find a direct replacement and a flywheel puller. I believe they are only in the Bravo and Ciao. The grande has another coil where the condenser would go, so the condenser has an external mounting point on the frame. I think you can leave the old one in and just use an external one.
You have a great video and very informative. I have a 1978 Ciao with some electrical problems . First, there is no spark. I checked the voltage before the coil, and found out that it was only 5. Volts AC. The other problem is that the right directional works but, not the left. The headlamp works , but not the speedometer lamp or the tail lamp. What do you think the problem is? Thanks in advance. Chris
Sounds like you hve some wiring problems. All you can really do is look at the wiring diagram and probe for continuity. Turn signal should be the easiest. As for the 5V from the coil, I'm not sure what's going on there. Does it at least run?
No, It does not run yet. It has been setting in a neighbors yard for about 20 years . Since I wrote you , I was able to get all of the wiring problems done except the brake light. I found that the carburetor is not allowing the fuel to pass to the bowl, very little anyway. I do have spark now that I cleaned the points.
Good to hear about your progress. You can get a new float needle for the dellorto 12/12 carb. My local motorcycle shop ordered one, was cheap. Make sure the gas cap vent is not blocked. IIRC, the brake light is weird, normally closed switch.
something still is not right with the carb. The fuel does not seem to get to the bowl. I have purchased and installed a rebuild kit. I found that one of the jets was clogged so, I replaced that. I force feed the carb with some good gas and it ran for a few seconds so , I know that the engine will in fact run. I was thinking of just replacing the carb with a Dellorto 13.13 and use a #50 jet. What do you think ? Thanks
I've got 3 wires from the motor. One goes to the ht coil, one to the condenser, and the last one isn't connected at all. I have no spark, or at least very weak. You mention that the 2 cables connected to the breaker is ignition and "turn signal"? I have no turn signal lights on this moped so it seems strange that there would be a cable for it.
@@cyrex686 it's a Baghee kinetic, around 1990. It worked when I bought it but something happened that made it lose like 85% of its power and finally not run at all. Checked the carb and fuel flow.
@@goolgehatter1597 Does it work just at low speed, but bog down at high speed? Could be clogged muffler. That 3rd wire could be lights or kill switch. If it is kill switch, maybe just connect it to ground. You should try a new condenser, coil and plug too. They are $5 on ebay for generics. Your local shop will have condensers. Any one will work. Did you clean the points?
@@cyrex686 I think the weak spark is the problem, i tried adjusting the points but made it all worse. they are difficult to set. I'll hace a look on ebay for parts :)
Finally someone asked after 7 years. I just searched and you can actually just buy a round M8 coupler nut off ebay for under $5 www.ebay.com/itm/164293918470 If you want one right now, you could make one: Buy a long M8 bolt and two nuts. Cut the head off the bolt and put the body of the bolt in a drill. Now, tighten the two nuts onto the threaded portion of the bolt. With the drill running, hold the nuts up to a grinder and grind them round. Those two nuts should work just as well once you take them off.
@@cyrex686 haha I looked through the comments and didn't see anyone ask. Thanks for the indepth writeup! I will be grabbing one off ebay. Thanks again!
I have some issues with my Ciao, almost certain it's electrically related cuz I have good compression and air/fuel feed, but it's very difficult to start and the spark seems weak.. I've already replaced the condenser and points, and it still runs but with the same difficulty starting and lack of low end power. Here's a bit more info: it's a 1971 single speed rigid frame Ciao, dual coil with internal condenser, Malossi 64cc kit, case matched and cut crank, 12mm Dellorto clone, Techno circuit pipe. I tried installing stiffer Malossi springs in the front single speed clutch and that was when I realized somethings definitely wrong. Seems like the engine and clutch aren't revving/spinning up fast enough to engage even the weakest set of the new springs. Maybe these springs are meant only for models with the lighter flywheel or electronic ignition, but I kinda doubt that. Do you know of a way to test the inner ignition coil or the flywheel/magneto itself?
Oh man, that's weird. Sounds like a really nice bike, better then mine lol. Can't say I know how to test it other than to measure resistance precisely with a 4 wire resistance tester or just two multimeters. You need to know what it is supposed to be, maybe find that online. Did you try swapping the HV coil? A new spark plug/boot is never a bad idea. Maybe the idle/low speed jet on the carb?
Hi! I saw that you also have the electrical diagram for this engine, you can leave a PDF file to download this diagram. Thank you very much in advance!
That sounds like a good idea, that way you could get a timing advance at higher speeds, so a bit more power. Not to mention, it won't wear out, won't need adjustment, and is more reliable. My moped is in a garage 300km away at the moment, but who knows maybe next summer I'll look into that and some other stuff.
cyrex686 thanks buddy, can you tell me what are the symptoms i look for when ignition starts to wear out , so i can fix it early and avoid pushing my moped for kilometers to get it home...
Best thing is just to carry some spare parts: Spark plug, spark plug tool, spark plug wire, condensor, HT coil, some wire, maybe a points file (or just nail file) and adjustable wrench. You can get that stuff generic off ebay for next to nothing.
cyrex686 yes, behind the flywheel. My condenser is mounted on the outside of the engine and it has a third coil on the inside. Yours are the only one i have seen except mine witch has the condenser on the outside.
The wiring diagram is in the manual. You should be able to find it for download. It should show how the coils are connected to each other and to the condenser.
Was looking on UA-cam and saw this it has helped a lot but will need more info ...the one I'm working on needs a lot of work and I have a some what clue what I'm doing but no clue were to fine parts or what to even look for .just started working on mine and one works the other is a little harder to Pedal and wants to start but dosnt turn over was wondering what I should check ...or just take it apart.
Would help to know what you have to know how to fix it. If the engine wont turn by hand then it is likely the piston stuck in the cylinder. There are lots of methods of unsticking a piston from a cylinder if you google that. It won't run well after though, will need to hone the cylinder and need new rings.
They have a electrolyte liquid in them that dries out over time. Since these are 30-40 year old engines, it is assumed they have dried out and need to be replaced. Even if still working, they might not work as well as a new one, more noticeable if it is cold and/or wet. It is best to replace them, as well as the HV coil, spark plug wire, spark plug boot, and the spark plug as well. They are all cheap and generic on eBay.
Great video, thank you! Just what I needed to get my Vespa Grande up and running.
Hi, thank you for the video. I'm a beginner and know nothing about moped. I hope you would upload more tutorial for the grande. I have a 1980 048 model grande that stop running on me. I clean out the carburetor and it still won't run. I think it is an electrical issue because I notice some of the wire are corroded. I'm at a total lost. I have been researching on the model and luckily found this video. Thank you so very much and please don't stop uploading videos.
akaiyanagiteru Thanks for commenting on the video, I knew this wouldn't be a popular video when I made it, but I thought it would help people out. Glad to hear it is of use to you. This was the first bike I learned on, it seems so simple now, but back then it was hard.
I can help you with yours. When you cleaned the carb, did you clean the main jet as well? You should be able to stick a thin guitar wire through it to clean it. You cna check to make sure the exhaust is not clogged too.
To test the electrical, all you have to do is wrap a wire around the spark plug like I did, and connect it to ground. You can try cleaning the plug and making the gap smaller. Best to buy a new plug to be safe, NGK BPR5HS. It could be your condenser or HT coil, you can get those very cheap online.
cyrex686
Thank you so very much for your help but please have patience with me because I'm new to all of this and have no knowledge on anything auto or mechanical related things. So far right now I'm cleaning the mufffler and buying a new spark plug. I know for sure that I have to change out some or all of the electrical wires because some of them have corroded and broken off. When I took off the muffler I notice the part where the engine is connected to the muffler is very dirty and very black. How would I go about to clean that? And what precautions I should be aware of? Do you think I need to take the engine apart and clean it? I'm not too sure what to do or how to go about it because right now the bike seem like everything need to be fix and I'm feeling overwhelm because I want to do it right and not mess it up, especially when I don't know anything. Thank you so very much again for your help, I really do appreciate it. You are a life saver!
Oh I forgot to mention, when I clean the carburetor I also clean out the jet. I also made sure that there was good gas flow where the gas was going into the carburetor. That's why I was at a lost to why the bike wouldn't idle unless I held onto the throttle and the bike would only started once. Thank you so very much!!!
akaiyanagiteru Happy to help, I was in your place once too. You can test to see if the muffler is blocked by just blowing in it. To decarbonise, basically find anything you can, a dremel with wire brush attachments, little screwdrivers, dental picks, wire brush, tooth brush. Just be careful not to remove metal, only the carbon buildup.
Did it run at all before you took it apart?
To redo the wires, you will need a puller for it, until you do that, doing any electrical fixes will be a huge pain, or impossible.
I'd suggest you get a new condecser and coil just to be safe, get generic ones off ebay or aliexpress figure out a way to mount them later, they will be really cheap. The coil on mine died.
A big piece of advice is to work on one thing at a time if you can, that way if you mess with something and it won't start, you know where to look. If it was working ok, then stopped suddenly, I can almost gaurntee you it is electrical, then carb, and other stuff is a smaller possibility.
Taking off the engine in this thing is super easy once you have done it a few times. Takes 20 minutes. Suggest you spray down everyhting with WD-40, take a wire/tooth brush to it, then clean that off using a can of brake cleaner. Not necessary, but it will make any work you do a lot easier.
I got a citta with a single wire coming out of it, it's the black ignition wire. The point next to this exit point is used for my head and tail light attachement point which is a red wire that attaches to that shoe.
I'm trying to figure out what makes my engine not run well! This video helped a bit.
What kind of symptoms do you have? It is not idling well, or low top speed?
Why my piaggio ciao got about 19v on light wire?thanks
Hi Mate, thanks for the video. I was riding my Ciao today and it just died. Engine turns over no problem. I have no spark and no head or tail lights when cranking on the pedals. Could you please give me an idea what might be the cause and where to start looking? Many thanks Max
I'm going to guess bad ground or kill switch.
Hello brother! I have the engine of ciao and I'm fixing it on my bicycle. Can u please tell me which way the engine runs (clockwise or anticlockwise) when the clutch is facing you! Since it's a two stroke can it run both ways or will the ignition timing go wrong?
Been a while, but I think clockwise. Just turn the pulley on the moped clockwise and make sure that the back wheel turns counterclockwise. If you are not using the old gearbox, you will need some gear reduction using probably two pulleys. Look on Mustie1 youtube channel for some ideas. I'm not sure if the timing will work both ways. You might need to modify the cam that activates the points, either rotate it or add a weld bead onto it. Good luck with your project, be sure to post it!
Why my piaggio ciao light wire got about 19v?
What is the voltage reading on the red wire feeding the H.T. coil?
Hey, great video. I also have original wiring. I'm curious about how you rewired the coils. Desolder old and resolder new wires? This is my first time.
Yup, simple as that. Practice on some random wires first. Use lead solder, not lead free. Use flux from plumbing section of hardware store, flux core isn't enough. May need to sand the contacts. You will need a flywheel puller.
Isn't there a condenser behind the flywheel?
Yes, but they are usually dried out, so just use an external one rather than trying to find a direct replacement and a flywheel puller. I believe they are only in the Bravo and Ciao. The grande has another coil where the condenser would go, so the condenser has an external mounting point on the frame. I think you can leave the old one in and just use an external one.
You have a great video and very informative. I have a 1978 Ciao with some electrical problems . First, there is no spark. I checked the voltage before the coil, and found out that it was only 5. Volts AC. The other problem is that the right directional works but, not the left. The headlamp works , but not the speedometer lamp or the tail lamp. What do you think the problem is? Thanks in advance.
Chris
Sounds like you hve some wiring problems. All you can really do is look at the wiring diagram and probe for continuity. Turn signal should be the easiest. As for the 5V from the coil, I'm not sure what's going on there. Does it at least run?
No, It does not run yet. It has been setting in a neighbors yard for about 20 years . Since I wrote you , I was able to get all of the wiring problems done except the brake light. I found that the carburetor is not allowing the fuel to pass to the bowl, very little anyway. I do have spark now that I cleaned the points.
Good to hear about your progress. You can get a new float needle for the dellorto 12/12 carb. My local motorcycle shop ordered one, was cheap. Make sure the gas cap vent is not blocked. IIRC, the brake light is weird, normally closed switch.
something still is not right with the carb. The fuel does not seem to get to the bowl. I have purchased and installed a rebuild kit. I found that one of the jets was clogged so, I replaced that. I force feed the carb with some good gas and it ran for a few seconds so , I know that the engine will in fact run. I was thinking of just replacing the carb with a Dellorto 13.13 and use a #50 jet. What do you think ? Thanks
I've got 3 wires from the motor. One goes to the ht coil, one to the condenser, and the last one isn't connected at all.
I have no spark, or at least very weak.
You mention that the 2 cables connected to the breaker is ignition and "turn signal"?
I have no turn signal lights on this moped so it seems strange that there would be a cable for it.
What moped is it? Do the wires all some from the same place?
@@cyrex686 it's a Baghee kinetic, around 1990. It worked when I bought it but something happened that made it lose like 85% of its power and finally not run at all. Checked the carb and fuel flow.
@@goolgehatter1597 Does it work just at low speed, but bog down at high speed? Could be clogged muffler. That 3rd wire could be lights or kill switch. If it is kill switch, maybe just connect it to ground. You should try a new condenser, coil and plug too. They are $5 on ebay for generics. Your local shop will have condensers. Any one will work. Did you clean the points?
@@cyrex686 I think the weak spark is the problem, i tried adjusting the points but made it all worse. they are difficult to set. I'll hace a look on ebay for parts :)
Hey there, I would be interested in the adapter piece you made on the lathe. Are you selling these? Thank you
Finally someone asked after 7 years. I just searched and you can actually just buy a round M8 coupler nut off ebay for under $5 www.ebay.com/itm/164293918470
If you want one right now, you could make one: Buy a long M8 bolt and two nuts. Cut the head off the bolt and put the body of the bolt in a drill. Now, tighten the two nuts onto the threaded portion of the bolt. With the drill running, hold the nuts up to a grinder and grind them round. Those two nuts should work just as well once you take them off.
@@cyrex686 haha I looked through the comments and didn't see anyone ask.
Thanks for the indepth writeup! I will be grabbing one off ebay. Thanks again!
What a strange way to create a spark. Thanks for elaborating!
I have some issues with my Ciao, almost certain it's electrically related cuz I have good compression and air/fuel feed, but it's very difficult to start and the spark seems weak.. I've already replaced the condenser and points, and it still runs but with the same difficulty starting and lack of low end power.
Here's a bit more info: it's a 1971 single speed rigid frame Ciao, dual coil with internal condenser, Malossi 64cc kit, case matched and cut crank, 12mm Dellorto clone, Techno circuit pipe.
I tried installing stiffer Malossi springs in the front single speed clutch and that was when I realized somethings definitely wrong. Seems like the engine and clutch aren't revving/spinning up fast enough to engage even the weakest set of the new springs. Maybe these springs are meant only for models with the lighter flywheel or electronic ignition, but I kinda doubt that.
Do you know of a way to test the inner ignition coil or the flywheel/magneto itself?
Oh man, that's weird. Sounds like a really nice bike, better then mine lol. Can't say I know how to test it other than to measure resistance precisely with a 4 wire resistance tester or just two multimeters. You need to know what it is supposed to be, maybe find that online. Did you try swapping the HV coil? A new spark plug/boot is never a bad idea. Maybe the idle/low speed jet on the carb?
Hi! I saw that you also have the electrical diagram for this engine, you can leave a PDF file to download this diagram. Thank you very much in advance!
martysgarage.info/manuals/vespa-grande.pdf
@@cyrex686 Thank you very much for this nice gesture of help! ❤❤
Hi, i read on a forum that you can swap the old ignition with modern electronic one. Can you look more into it and make a tutorial if possible ?
That sounds like a good idea, that way you could get a timing advance at higher speeds, so a bit more power. Not to mention, it won't wear out, won't need adjustment, and is more reliable. My moped is in a garage 300km away at the moment, but who knows maybe next summer I'll look into that and some other stuff.
cyrex686 thanks buddy, can you tell me what are the symptoms i look for when ignition starts to wear out , so i can fix it early and avoid pushing my moped for kilometers to get it home...
Best thing is just to carry some spare parts: Spark plug, spark plug tool, spark plug wire, condensor, HT coil, some wire, maybe a points file (or just nail file) and adjustable wrench. You can get that stuff generic off ebay for next to nothing.
hi.. do you know how i can buy a Vespa bravo in U.S? thanks
Can't find one on craigslist? Maybe see if someone on Moped Army has one for sale.
كيف يتم تركيب لفيبركه وعندي مشكلاه في البق متعه لمبىيج تحك كيفش تصليحه
do you know how the wiring is done inside the ignition. i have an old piaggio ciao and i only find yours that look like mine.
You mean inside the case?
cyrex686 yes, behind the flywheel. My condenser is mounted on the outside of the engine and it has a third coil on the inside. Yours are the only one i have seen except mine witch has the condenser on the outside.
The wiring diagram is in the manual. You should be able to find it for download. It should show how the coils are connected to each other and to the condenser.
Was looking on UA-cam and saw this it has helped a lot but will need more info ...the one I'm working on needs a lot of work and I have a some what clue what I'm doing but no clue were to fine parts or what to even look for .just started working on mine and one works the other is a little harder to Pedal and wants to start but dosnt turn over was wondering what I should check ...or just take it apart.
Would help to know what you have to know how to fix it. If the engine wont turn by hand then it is likely the piston stuck in the cylinder. There are lots of methods of unsticking a piston from a cylinder if you google that. It won't run well after though, will need to hone the cylinder and need new rings.
I forget, did I reply to you in a PM?
Why do you need a condenser? doesn't it have one in the stator?
They have a electrolyte liquid in them that dries out over time. Since these are 30-40 year old engines, it is assumed they have dried out and need to be replaced. Even if still working, they might not work as well as a new one, more noticeable if it is cold and/or wet. It is best to replace them, as well as the HV coil, spark plug wire, spark plug boot, and the spark plug as well. They are all cheap and generic on eBay.
Hy. i got a Piaggio SI and i got 1 Wire !!!
Seriously, one coming out of it? No lights then?
At my Piaggio at well
Full waring video plz....
Plz attach diagram pdf
ive connected a powerbank to my engine 😂