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Also, sellers (and some buyers) think old = VINTAGE, in all caps, so the price is ridiculous. I've seen a 3 dollar brace for 75 dollars because it was old. Something to take into consideration when buying. Old on its own doesn't mean a whole lot. Videos like this will save your butt.
Don’t forget those who list anything more than a week old as “VINTAGE”… or people who add “Sweetheart” in the description because they’ve seen that word in other Stanley plane listings… or the worst of all who will try to sell a very late model piece of English made junk with the description “could be 1920’s or 1930’s vintage I think….” I’ve seen all three terms used to describe a 1970’s English “Acorn” branded POS that someone had slipped a Stanley lever cap on. The seller knew he was being dishonest by deliberately not showing any part of the base except for tiny glimpses you could just spot… the bright red paint would have given it away…
Saw a stanley block plane in an overcrowded antique shop for $250....I thought my vision was tricking me, so I asked for it to be taken out of the case...the woman wind the counter seemed offended that I thought it should be $2.50!
I saw someone selling a busted up Dunlap plane for $1200 on Facebook Marketplace. When I emailed the seller to find out if that was a typo, they verified that the price was correct because "we had it appraised" so I let them know that they had been severely misled, but wished them good luck. Maybe they'll get lucky and they can part a fool from his money.
@@jimthesoundman8641 funny, because I bought an old dunlap in the original box, still in the wax paper bag, with the typed instructions, never used, for 15 dollars.
'Vintage' is actually a wine word meaning year of production and has nothing to do with being old - although it could, if that makes sense. Wine or tool 'vintage' could be this year or a hundred years ago, it just means age. So, when a tool is described as vintage, why does it suddenly mean 'old'? Here in UK we have even more weird sayings like classic, vintage and veteran vehicles - what do they actually mean? What separates them? My point is this, don't be fooled by the word 'vintage' when it is being used by someone who doesn't have a clue what they are talking about.
For people that are in Europe/UK, don't sleep on Record planes. They are just as good and often less sought after (= cheaper). People completely sleep on some of the Record models, it's definitely worth knowing about them. Record kept the "fully machined" solid frogs up until the mid 50s so they are a lot easier to find than Stanleys with similar frogs here.
@@techheck3358Can't link to a website here, look for info on how to date record planes. For bench planes, basically any plane that still has a single part cast yoke (as opposed to 2 part stamped steel yokes) should be a great user. anything with the old frog style is from the 50s or before and should be great.
Just found out that my grandfather still has some of HIS grandfathers old Canadian-made Stanleys that I can restore -- from what I can tell, I have a #3 and #5 that are somewhere in the Type 11-12 range and a #4 type 5. I love the story that tells, my great-great-grandfather got his #4 shortly after immigrating and used it to build houses in Toronto. After returning from WWI he upgraded to some more "modern" planes, but still kept his trusty #4 as his main go-to despite its quirks
The open areas in the frog of the post-war planes is going to have no effect on the function of the plane. The edge of the blade is beyond the end of the frog so the end of the frog is fulcrum. Using the plane will pivot the blade at that fulcrum pulling it away from the frog. When cutting the load is on the bottom edge of the frog and on the lever cap. The rest of the frog is not under load.
Hey Rex, great job on the timeline! I bet if you hired a designer, you could get really nice looking timeline poster that you can sell. Collectors would probably love it
I have a wartime 5 1/2 and one of the interesting "features" of wartime planes is sometimes they would use older, leftover bodies and machine them to fit newer parts. Mine has the sole cut for frog adjustment but has no adjustment hardware haha. It is a CHAMP of a shooting plane though! Enjoyed this breakdown a ton
I just bought a smooth bottom number 7 type 13 for $32, it needs restored but I can do that. I also bought a Stanley victor from 1954 for $3.25 all it needed was sharped. All of my planes were bought at bargain prices because I'm not paying crazy prices and I take my time and watch for a deal.
Thanks for the overview. A girlfriend from 45 years ago gave me a No 5 that belonged to her deceased uncle. Move after move, I dragged that thing around forever ... didn't know much about hand planes until I restored it about 8 years ago and have been hooked ever since. A few years back, I bought a No 7 (type 11), off Craigslist that was in pretty rough shape for $15. Turned out it was mostly surface rust and restored beautifully. Hate that small adjustment wheel though. :)
@@RexKrueger Yeah, I don't use it all that much anyway (that's what the 8in jointer is for), but I could always throw a Cosman AdjusStar on it. Those work better/easier than even the bigger adjustment wheels.
6-7 years ago, when plane prices on eBay were more reasonable, I bought a #5 type 16, a #5 type 17, and a #3 type 11. The type 17, though often criticized as an inferior WWii plane works damn near as well as the type 16. The #3 excels over the Asian #4 I bought a couple years ago and has become my scrub plane. Looking for a type 18 or 19 #4 for the majority of the surface smoothing with the #3 used as the last tool t touch the wood. Great video, Rex!
My planes are at least 80+ years old. Baileys. From my late father and I'm 77. Restored them and coated the blades do won't rust. Very proud of the collection. The speaker is accurate about availability and prices. But, become knowledgeable.
I have three older Stanley planes that are my go-to workhorses. Now I'm inspired to figure out just when they were made. Thanks, Rex -- I always enjoy your friendly talks.
I really appreciate this video. Guys talk like vintage planes are still super common and cheap. It’s nice to hear someone recognize that what was true 10-20 yrs ago just isn’t anymore. I ended up buying a couple of new Stanleys and… they’re not bad. They took a bit of work, but no where near restoring a vintage plane. I am starting to hate the plastic tote & knob, but I’m a wood worker. I’ll make replacements when they bother me too much.
Thanks. I find your information about the "Sweetheart" era "Very Interesting". I bought an old Stanly No. 80 scraper plane, probably at a yard sale, sometime in the mid-'90's. It was in good condition, but the blade had some pitting so I bought a replacement at my local Woodcraft store and was surprised and a bit disappointed to find that it only has one edge instead of the two my original one has. Now, all this time has gone by and it wasn't until recently I looked at it and discovered it has the very same SW logo as the center one as shown in your video. The plane works perfectly with the now properly sharpened replacement blade for a Stanley number 80 scraper plane.
Totally agree with you...got mine at a flea market for 5 bucks. It still had a price tag on it! 15 min. of sharpening and tuning and I wouldn't trade it.
I have to say, this information was really great so I ran off and bought a Miller Falls jack plane. All I needed to do was tighten to tote and sharpen the iron. It looks brand new and at was $35 delivered. My other two workhorses are older Stanley planes (I think pre-WWII but I haven't dated them. My smoother might actually be a Frankenstein) and the Miller Falls easily out preforms them. I'd certainly look at Miller Falls for budget minded plane buyers. The Stanley name carries a price tag.
I just came back to this video after purchasing my own planes. This video makes so much sense now that I have a basic understanding. I’ll also add that for a beginner, even the “type 21” (cordovan Color) planes are good starter planes. Just don’t pay too much for them.
Another nice thing about the Sweetheart era planes is the lateral lever. The little wheel that engages with the iron spins on a bearing. They deleted that feature sometime in the '30s, I think. No idea if it makes the iron adjustment smoother or easier, but it seems that it should. Modern premium plane makers like Lie Nielsen have this feature as well. That said, I have a couple of 1950's Type 19s and they're excellent tools. Avoid Type 20s, though.
Actually, that two piece lateral was introduced in type 6 (1888) and was used all the way through type 19 (1961). With type 20, they started using a single piece stamped steel lateral.
I have my great grandfathers Stanley number 5. I'm not sure of the date of it but it's a work horse I use and love. It has a corrugated sole that I never see on any others.
my highschool tech dept was equiped with post war mainly stanley hand tools and they were excellent and by the time i was there had withstood 30 odd years of kids abusing them with no noticable harm. that could have been because of the violent ex cabinetmaker teacher in charge of them of course . this has instilled in me a true appreciation of hand tools and especially well equiped workshops .
I believe one should mention "Made in England" Stanleys as well, those are dominating the European flee markets, but have a comletely different timeline.
Indeed. And from what I've read online they maintained their quality a little longer in the post war period than the USA made planes. Eg the ones with the brown composite material tote and knob are still very good users (so not the black plastic).
I started buying handplanes a few years ago. Got really into the history. Stanley also made tools under contract for other companies like Fulton Keen Kutter Craftsman etc. Over the years they aquired other plane makers like Union which they made planes under the union branding, I am also a fan of non stanley planes like Millers Falls. One interesting thing is the hightly sought after bedrock planes that a couple of modern brands are making a copy of today were even made for other brands. I have a Keen Kutter Bedrock plane. I liked that you didnt go to hating on the type 19s I have one and its always worked fine.
I just bought what seems to be an old new in-box type 19 Stanley #4. It was made between 1948 to 1961. It was $50 on Ebay. It works well. In fact, it's my best performing plane.
Using the info I've gotten from this presentation, I scored a S/B no6, type 19 just today. Paid too much, pbly, but, it's just $$ !! My Dad had a 3, 4, & 5 back in his heyday; so do I, and now a 6. Why? Because....Thanx, Rex. Learning a lot, became patron, building tools. And, I blame you, Mister (lol)
Totally agree on the post war planes. I have a number 4 and number 6 that were my grandfather’s planes. The number 6 was never used. Just a beautiful plane.
Thank you, Mr. Kruger! I've bought a 16 & (I think) a 20. And a Kobalt Stanley copy. It looks like its all interchangeable w/ the Stanley. All mine are No. 4s & I need to find a jointer. I can use 1 of them as a scrub. Have a GREAT day, Neighbor!
I have some English made post-war Stanley planes, and I like them a lot. I've used Lie Nielsen and I've used Sweethearts - but for my modest DIY use and budget, the Stanleys (and some Records) are more than good enough. I do prefer to use modern thicker irons with them, though.
I picked up 3 post war #5s for $35cdn each. That’s about $25usd each. Phenomenal value. Thanks Rex. I probably would have never bought them without your channel. And, I had a ton of fun tuning them up. One is permanently set as my scrub plane, and I finally flattened my work bench with it (also, thanks for the forgotten bench. It’s a real beast with the vice installed)
I have 2 post WW2 UK built stanleys and a Record plane. All 3 of them are pretty solid planes. Was able to plane down a solid indian rosewood slab from a bad bad saw mill
I just bought my first vintage plane and started reworking it yesterday. I believe it to be a type 17 bailey no4, because it has steel hardware and adjustment adjustment wheel and no frog adjustment screw. It was completely locked up and abused. Someone used a grinder on the iron and the sole had apparently never been flattened. It was rough. After a couple hours scrubbing and flattening it cuts amazing. Then i find this video and course. Ive got to get the course now. Thanks for your inspiration into hand tools.
The completer the listing, the more you pay but the less of a gamble it is. I have a No 4, No 6, No 78 and the 151 spokeshave. All were 5 bucks aside from the No 6. Patience and looking at second hand listings does wonders. But look more general, as in handtools or handplanes.
Thank you Rex. I really Appreciate the great info and the chart that I think is very valuable information. I look forward to watching all of your videos.
For a long time (from new!) I've had a 1976 UK Stanley number 4. Nothing whatever the matter with it. I did drop it and snap the handle, and rather than gluing it, I made a new one from a nice piece of reclaimed Brazilian mahogany. Slight more shapely than the original (sideways bulbous-ness, rather than flat sided). I have a few others now, and some woodies, but I still use that one for certain jobs.
Darn good course on restoring planes - comprehensive and then some. Working my way through it with an old rusty plane. Grab the free Stanley Timeline in the notes - best graphic there is for showing the different generations of planes and which ones to get and which to avoid.
Great video, I'm totally with you on post war Stanleys, my daily driver is one, £25 ebay steal, looks like cruft next to my dozen other Stanleys (all also ebay buys but clearly earlier than my no.4), it took me about an hour to clean up and tune and out performs the lot - I can take wafer shavings, crank it down for deep cuts, no chatter, blade stays sharp for ages. I surfaced my home built laminate bench with it, I've jointed 2-piece guitar bodies with it. Dream plane.
Thanks Rex. Great to see useful information inspiring folks to enjoy woodworking and antique tools. Would like to see a video on the stanley 289 and stanley 140 some time. Skew blade planes are awesome.
Thank you Rex! The timeline is a wonderful gift. Just a quick note on the Timeline printout: On my Mac, with Epson Ecotank printer, I had to select "fit" on the Adobe print dialog. This allowed the far left and far right of the landscape print to print. Otherwise it cut off a lot of the text on both margins. With that "Fit" option selected, however, it prints everything just fine. Now I need to find some better paper and make me a frame to put it in the shop. Or maybe I could do a carving. Or inlay. OK....maybe just the decent paper and frame! ;). Thanks again, Rex. I hope you had a great holiday. Best wishes for your continued growth and success in 2024.
Thanks, Rex! Just found a type 17 no. 5 at the flea market for $25! Cleaned up really nice and no pitting. Just have to learn how to use this thing lol
I bought a £30 No4 from Ben Crow's Vintage Toolshop back in late 2018 and it's been great. Not sure what edition it is (plus, it'll likely be an English made one, which the comments here suggest have a different timeline), but the only problems I've ever had have been my own doing - the handle is cracked and I made an arse of repairing it earlier this year. When I can get back into my shed/workshop in the spring, that's the first thing I'll be tackling (after a tidy)
Great video! I've been wanting to get my first hand plane but never knew what to get and all the types and "numbers" made my head spin and I never pulled the trigger on any since I didn't want to get a lemon or get tricked into paying more for a practical tool than I needed. Just ordered my first one after watching this video. Will check out your restoration course if it comes in rough shape.
Love to see you cover some of the other Stanley/Bailey copies. Millers Falls, Sargent, Union (not X) planes. Shelton's efforts at innovation have been much reviled, but their excellent Stanley No 4 copy is a great bargain and my go to plane.
Last week i inspected some type now fresh new in the box authentic Stanley #4 and #5 with zero backlash and no split yoke. very nice still affordable planes but i have enough. If there was a #3 i would have absolutely bought it. #3 i love for bevels.
I have a #3 Stanley Handyman that is a great. Its every bit as good as the regular #3 I have. There are other brands (Sargent, Miller Falls) and rebranded ones like Craftsman. They can all be tuned up to work well. I like my Craftsman #5 made by Millers Falls better than my Stanley #5.
Throwing this out there. I'm working on a pile of old planes (Miller's Falls, Stanley and 1 or 2 oddballs but good users) that I'll be selling through Can I Have It on Facebook. I will NOT be asking crazy money because, like Rex, I want these tools used not tossed in a scrap heap. Keep your eyes open for the auction. I have a type 17 #7 that'll probably go up first. STEEL ADJUSTMENT WHEEL, NOT PLASTIC.
Thanks for clearing up a lot of this. Knew nothing about the types when I bought my first plane off eBay. Just knew it was cheap and close to No. 5 size. Restored it after watching your early plane resto videos and it’s a champ. Now I know it’s definitely post war because of the frog. Very cool.
Type 18 (1946-47) is essentially the same thing, but due to post-war hardwood shortages, they had to use random hardwoods and so they painted the tote and knob black.
Just a side note: If you are looking for a daily user and don't care about the collectability, there are a lot of good "non-Stanley" brands out there. Perfectly serviceable planes were made by a host of companies, Sears (Craftsman or Dunlap or Fulton), Millers Falls, and Sargent planes tend to pop up quite often and are quite adequate for most peoples needs, at a price much lower than most Stanley planes. However, do your research, and beware of sellers who try to jack up the price just because it's old.
@@richardsinger01 Yeah, but weren't they marketed as a premium brand back in the day? I've never owned one, but I would have thought they would still be more expensive than Stanley's even now. I was trying to let everyone know that there were quality "daily drivers" which were still pretty cheap if you didn't care about the brand name.
I think my Stanley is one of the earlier ones with the plastic handle and, honestly, aside from restoratio, there was nothing wrong with it. It shaved like an absolute dream
Sargent VBM made between 1910 to 1918 are some if the best planes ever made. VBM should be marked on rhe blade as well as the cap iron. Front knob will be beaded at rhe bottom. Iron is 15 per cent thicker. Later models have the rear tote moved back away from the blade . Casting is heavier. Knobs and totes are indian rosewood. Some planes can also be labled Fulton but make sure they have the beaded front knob so they are of the same vintage. Have a fairly full set of Stanley type 10 / 11's that are great. But my Sargent VBM's are a dream to use. Have 6 jointer planes all pre 1918. The best is a Fulton (Sargent VBM) that i paid $35 for at an auction because no one knew what it was . Dead flat and will joint an 8' board like a dream.
Great chart Rex, thanks for sharing. Every time I go to the flea market I end up with another Stanley plane. I now know why I was getting them so cheap! All but one is WW2 or later!
One more thing about the union plane, on the top there are only tiny shiny spots, thats where the blade really sits on so the actual supported surface is even smaller than those ribs
I just watched this and your video on plaining some lumber from a box store. I just retired and want to build some projects without my power tools. What 4 or5 plains would I need to get started. Thx……great vids!
Really nice video. Very informative. I wonder if mention should be made of brands such as Wards Master Quality, Rockford and some iterations of Craftsman (emphasis on SOME). I have picked up some of these brands at second stand stores they tuned up nicely without too much fiddling. They cost next to nothing.
For me I would rather save up and purchase a Lie Neilson or Vert. Nothing against purchasing old Stan’s. But I for one would rather spend less time restoring to actually using it in a project. And if you decide to go with old Stans. I would recommend purchasing a new blade and chip right off the bat. Trust me it’s worth it. I have a few fellow hobbyists that have a handful of old barn finds and all they do is sit on a shelf. More of a conversation piece then a everyday jack. Lol I know it’s crazy.
I have restored about a dozen stanley planes from type 3 to 20. My #4 type 19 got turned into my smoother because it so true and solid. Also love my 5 1/2 but those can be a pain to find without the C bottom
For some reason I ended up with more type 13 planes than any other type. They work great and they were all cheap. I also have a no, type 17 with a steel knob. It is fricking heavy but sometimes I really like the heft. I have a few post war planes and I agree, they work just fine. I all depends on how good they are set up.
Nooooooo! Stop telling everyone the secrets! Its gonna drive up the prices on type 18 and 19 planes! Good thing i already have a full set...... or two. Post war planes rule. This is the first time ive ever seen a video that actually verified my thoughts on the post war stuff. Nice work
@RexKrueger thanks for the lesson. Antique tools are highly under rated if you ask me...they were made to be used and passed on. Today's stuff...cheaply made and mass produced...
I never knew about the bed thing! To add my own anecdata, I have three Stanley's with the new bed, which are my three best planes. They all work great. I also have a 5 with the old bed, which I retired because I just couldn't get it to work well. That's an early version with the tiny, reversed adjustment screw, so I also think you're dead on when you suggest avoiding those.
Rex I have a block plane and it has a Stanley SW blade.... please do a video about restoring one...also I have a India handplane no.5 type with ridges on the base, and plastic tote which needs restoring, let me know what you think. Thanks dude...OORAH!!
I wish this was released a year ago, would save me a ton of research. For the Europe, I think best deals can be found on Record planes (my opinion is that records are nicer than UK Stanley, but both work fine in the end)
I own about 25 hand planes, and only 3 are Stanleys. I'm located in the USA, and I also prefer the Record planes simply because they're a bit heftier than Stanleys.
thanks rex! my collection so far: no 4 miller falls not vintage, but works ok no. 4.5 type 5 ? bought for $55 in working order, makes the shavings fly (wish i knew about the backwards knob when I bought it LOL) no. 5 type 11 bought for $20 in working order, feels great in the hand no. 7 type 7 ? currently in boat anchor condition LOL, iron is worn down within 1/2 inch if the slot
Something that I just learned recently is that almost all of these planes don't use 1/4"-20 UNC (American Unified Coarse) threads, but 12-20 BSW (British Standard Whitworth). Don't be like the person who had my post-war No. 5 previously, and replace the front knob by jamming a 1/4"-20 bolt into a old wooden door knob and call it good. You'll mess up the threads and widen the hole in the casting, so replacement parts won't fit! The US used BSW threads until steel was widely used over iron in threaded fasteners, so this will apply to other kinds of antique machinery as well. Victor Machinery Exchange is the only place I can find that still sells a tap and die in this specific thread pitch for a consumer price ($12 for either).
Brilliant review of a complex topic, Rex! Your wealth of industry knowledge and crystal clarity in imparting it earn you a unique position. Thanks for the useable time-line!
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Hey Rex, how about the Stanley Bailey? Are they good?
Also, sellers (and some buyers) think old = VINTAGE, in all caps, so the price is ridiculous. I've seen a 3 dollar brace for 75 dollars because it was old. Something to take into consideration when buying. Old on its own doesn't mean a whole lot. Videos like this will save your butt.
Don’t forget those who list anything more than a week old as “VINTAGE”… or people who add “Sweetheart” in the description because they’ve seen that word in other Stanley plane listings… or the worst of all who will try to sell a very late model piece of English made junk with the description “could be 1920’s or 1930’s vintage I think….” I’ve seen all three terms used to describe a 1970’s English “Acorn” branded POS that someone had slipped a Stanley lever cap on. The seller knew he was being dishonest by deliberately not showing any part of the base except for tiny glimpses you could just spot… the bright red paint would have given it away…
Saw a stanley block plane in an overcrowded antique shop for
$250....I thought my vision was tricking me, so I asked for it to be taken out of the case...the woman wind the counter seemed offended that I thought it should be $2.50!
I saw someone selling a busted up Dunlap plane for $1200 on Facebook Marketplace. When I emailed the seller to find out if that was a typo, they verified that the price was correct because "we had it appraised" so I let them know that they had been severely misled, but wished them good luck. Maybe they'll get lucky and they can part a fool from his money.
@@jimthesoundman8641 funny, because I bought an old dunlap in the original box, still in the wax paper bag, with the typed instructions, never used, for 15 dollars.
'Vintage' is actually a wine word meaning year of production and has nothing to do with being old - although it could, if that makes sense. Wine or tool 'vintage' could be this year or a hundred years ago, it just means age. So, when a tool is described as vintage, why does it suddenly mean 'old'? Here in UK we have even more weird sayings like classic, vintage and veteran vehicles - what do they actually mean? What separates them? My point is this, don't be fooled by the word 'vintage' when it is being used by someone who doesn't have a clue what they are talking about.
For people that are in Europe/UK, don't sleep on Record planes. They are just as good and often less sought after (= cheaper). People completely sleep on some of the Record models, it's definitely worth knowing about them. Record kept the "fully machined" solid frogs up until the mid 50s so they are a lot easier to find than Stanleys with similar frogs here.
are you aware of a similar guide for record planes? or some overview?
Yes, the record planes are as good.
@@techheck3358Can't link to a website here, look for info on how to date record planes. For bench planes, basically any plane that still has a single part cast yoke (as opposed to 2 part stamped steel yokes) should be a great user. anything with the old frog style is from the 50s or before and should be great.
Just found out that my grandfather still has some of HIS grandfathers old Canadian-made Stanleys that I can restore -- from what I can tell, I have a #3 and #5 that are somewhere in the Type 11-12 range and a #4 type 5.
I love the story that tells, my great-great-grandfather got his #4 shortly after immigrating and used it to build houses in Toronto. After returning from WWI he upgraded to some more "modern" planes, but still kept his trusty #4 as his main go-to despite its quirks
The open areas in the frog of the post-war planes is going to have no effect on the function of the plane. The edge of the blade is beyond the end of the frog so the end of the frog is fulcrum. Using the plane will pivot the blade at that fulcrum pulling it away from the frog. When cutting the load is on the bottom edge of the frog and on the lever cap. The rest of the frog is not under load.
Hey Rex, great job on the timeline! I bet if you hired a designer, you could get really nice looking timeline poster that you can sell. Collectors would probably love it
Agree, I would love a nice looking poster version to hang in the shop
I have a wartime 5 1/2 and one of the interesting "features" of wartime planes is sometimes they would use older, leftover bodies and machine them to fit newer parts. Mine has the sole cut for frog adjustment but has no adjustment hardware haha. It is a CHAMP of a shooting plane though! Enjoyed this breakdown a ton
Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year! Thank you from Moscow, Russia!
I just bought a smooth bottom number 7 type 13 for $32, it needs restored but I can do that. I also bought a Stanley victor from 1954 for $3.25 all it needed was sharped. All of my planes were bought at bargain prices because I'm not paying crazy prices and I take my time and watch for a deal.
Type 11 with the 3 pat dates are my personal fav ive found
Oh my, this is so true. I have No. 4, 5, 6 and 7 all Type 19 and they are amazing!
Thanks for the overview. A girlfriend from 45 years ago gave me a No 5 that belonged to her deceased uncle. Move after move, I dragged that thing around forever ... didn't know much about hand planes until I restored it about 8 years ago and have been hooked ever since. A few years back, I bought a No 7 (type 11), off Craigslist that was in pretty rough shape for $15. Turned out it was mostly surface rust and restored beautifully. Hate that small adjustment wheel though. :)
I won't even use a plane with the small wheel anymore. Go big or go home!
@@RexKrueger Yeah, I don't use it all that much anyway (that's what the 8in jointer is for), but I could always throw a Cosman AdjusStar on it. Those work better/easier than even the bigger adjustment wheels.
6-7 years ago, when plane prices on eBay were more reasonable, I bought a #5 type 16, a #5 type 17, and a #3 type 11. The type 17, though often criticized as an inferior WWii plane works damn near as well as the type 16. The #3 excels over the Asian #4 I bought a couple years ago and has become my scrub plane. Looking for a type 18 or 19 #4 for the majority of the surface smoothing with the #3 used as the last tool t touch the wood. Great video, Rex!
My planes are at least 80+ years old. Baileys. From my late father and I'm 77. Restored them and coated the blades do won't rust. Very proud of the collection. The speaker is accurate about availability and prices. But, become knowledgeable.
I have three older Stanley planes that are my go-to workhorses. Now I'm inspired to figure out just when they were made. Thanks, Rex -- I always enjoy your friendly talks.
I like to think of them as fireside chats.
@@RexKruegerThe bIggest fireside since the Viking burials, the way you move about 😂 - but yes, wonderful videos, very kind of you to share!
I really appreciate this video. Guys talk like vintage planes are still super common and cheap. It’s nice to hear someone recognize that what was true 10-20 yrs ago just isn’t anymore. I ended up buying a couple of new Stanleys and… they’re not bad. They took a bit of work, but no where near restoring a vintage plane. I am starting to hate the plastic tote & knob, but I’m a wood worker. I’ll make replacements when they bother me too much.
Merry Christmas Rex & family. Thanks for all you do. Take care & stay safe.
Thanks. I find your information about the "Sweetheart" era "Very Interesting". I bought an old Stanly No. 80 scraper plane, probably at a yard sale, sometime in the mid-'90's. It was in good condition, but the blade had some pitting so I bought a replacement at my local Woodcraft store and was surprised and a bit disappointed to find that it only has one edge instead of the two my original one has. Now, all this time has gone by and it wasn't until recently I looked at it and discovered it has the very same SW logo as the center one as shown in your video. The plane works perfectly with the now properly sharpened replacement blade for a Stanley number 80 scraper plane.
I use, among other planes, a cheap Stanley handyman plane. And it work just fine just as long you set it correctly and keep the blade sharp.
Totally agree with you...got mine at a flea market for 5 bucks. It still had a price tag on it! 15 min. of sharpening and tuning and I wouldn't trade it.
I have to say, this information was really great so I ran off and bought a Miller Falls jack plane. All I needed to do was tighten to tote and sharpen the iron. It looks brand new and at was $35 delivered. My other two workhorses are older Stanley planes (I think pre-WWII but I haven't dated them. My smoother might actually be a Frankenstein) and the Miller Falls easily out preforms them. I'd certainly look at Miller Falls for budget minded plane buyers. The Stanley name carries a price tag.
I just came back to this video after purchasing my own planes. This video makes so much sense now that I have a basic understanding. I’ll also add that for a beginner, even the “type 21” (cordovan Color) planes are good starter planes. Just don’t pay too much for them.
You bought your planes from your self 😮 , hope you didn't over pay ! ... Lol, sorry I couldn't resist! 😅😂😂😊
Mr krueger has been a great inspiration to me to start my woodworking journey and channel.
Thankyou sir.
Seriously. I’m start8ng out and Rex is by far my favourite channel.
Another nice thing about the Sweetheart era planes is the lateral lever. The little wheel that engages with the iron spins on a bearing. They deleted that feature sometime in the '30s, I think. No idea if it makes the iron adjustment smoother or easier, but it seems that it should. Modern premium plane makers like Lie Nielsen have this feature as well.
That said, I have a couple of 1950's Type 19s and they're excellent tools. Avoid Type 20s, though.
I wonder if that's really true. I'm going to get a 20 next year and try it.
Actually, that two piece lateral was introduced in type 6 (1888) and was used all the way through type 19 (1961). With type 20, they started using a single piece stamped steel lateral.
I have my great grandfathers Stanley number 5. I'm not sure of the date of it but it's a work horse I use and love. It has a corrugated sole that I never see on any others.
my highschool tech dept was equiped with post war mainly stanley hand tools and they were excellent and by the time i was there had withstood 30 odd years of kids abusing them with no noticable harm. that could have been because of the violent ex cabinetmaker teacher in charge of them of course . this has instilled in me a true appreciation of hand tools and especially well equiped workshops .
I believe one should mention "Made in England" Stanleys as well, those are dominating the European flee markets, but have a comletely different timeline.
Indeed. And from what I've read online they maintained their quality a little longer in the post war period than the USA made planes.
Eg the ones with the brown composite material tote and knob are still very good users (so not the black plastic).
I started buying handplanes a few years ago. Got really into the history. Stanley also made tools under contract for other companies like Fulton Keen Kutter Craftsman etc. Over the years they aquired other plane makers like Union which they made planes under the union branding, I am also a fan of non stanley planes like Millers Falls. One interesting thing is the hightly sought after bedrock planes that a couple of modern brands are making a copy of today were even made for other brands. I have a Keen Kutter Bedrock plane. I liked that you didnt go to hating on the type 19s I have one and its always worked fine.
I just bought what seems to be an old new in-box type 19 Stanley #4. It was made between 1948 to 1961. It was $50 on Ebay. It works well. In fact, it's my best performing plane.
Merry Christmas, Rex! Thanks so much for your videos.
Great video, Rex. Interesting to hear your comments on SW Era, WWII and post war era plans. Thanks for sharing.
Using the info I've gotten from this presentation, I scored a S/B no6, type 19 just today. Paid too much, pbly, but, it's just $$ !! My Dad had a 3, 4, & 5 back in his heyday; so do I, and now a 6. Why? Because....Thanx, Rex.
Learning a lot, became patron, building tools. And, I blame you, Mister (lol)
Totally agree on the post war planes. I have a number 4 and number 6 that were my grandfather’s planes. The number 6 was never used. Just a beautiful plane.
Thank you, Mr. Kruger!
I've bought a 16 & (I think) a 20.
And a Kobalt Stanley copy.
It looks like its all interchangeable w/ the Stanley.
All mine are No. 4s & I need to find a jointer.
I can use 1 of them as a scrub.
Have a GREAT day, Neighbor!
Thank you Rex, for another great year. Your videos are always one the highlights of my UA-cam week. Merry Christmas and Happy New Year.
I love the reverse spinning adjustments like on those earlier Stanley's and the Sargents. But I'm also left handed so it feels more ergonomic.
The different knurled adjustment wheel on a type 18 feels fantastic as well.
I have some English made post-war Stanley planes, and I like them a lot. I've used Lie Nielsen and I've used Sweethearts - but for my modest DIY use and budget, the Stanleys (and some Records) are more than good enough. I do prefer to use modern thicker irons with them, though.
I think you nailed it and I share your thoughts totally.
Record tools are extremely underrated.
Thanks for all the information. I’ve been wanting to get a Stanley 4. Just afraid to take the leap.
I picked up 3 post war #5s for $35cdn each. That’s about $25usd each. Phenomenal value. Thanks Rex. I probably would have never bought them without your channel. And, I had a ton of fun tuning them up. One is permanently set as my scrub plane, and I finally flattened my work bench with it (also, thanks for the forgotten bench. It’s a real beast with the vice installed)
I have 2 post WW2 UK built stanleys and a Record plane. All 3 of them are pretty solid planes. Was able to plane down a solid indian rosewood slab from a bad bad saw mill
I just bought my first vintage plane and started reworking it yesterday. I believe it to be a type 17 bailey no4, because it has steel hardware and adjustment adjustment wheel and no frog adjustment screw. It was completely locked up and abused. Someone used a grinder on the iron and the sole had apparently never been flattened. It was rough. After a couple hours scrubbing and flattening it cuts amazing.
Then i find this video and course. Ive got to get the course now. Thanks for your inspiration into hand tools.
Whatever you do don't buy Millers Falls planes. There's nothing wrong with them I just want to keep the prices lower...
The completer the listing, the more you pay but the less of a gamble it is.
I have a No 4, No 6, No 78 and the 151 spokeshave. All were 5 bucks aside from the No 6.
Patience and looking at second hand listings does wonders. But look more general, as in handtools or handplanes.
Hey Rex - Great time chart. Thanks a lot for this treat. Gershom Ratheiser (the Netherlands)
Thank you Rex. I really Appreciate the great info and the chart that I think is very valuable information. I look forward to watching all of your videos.
For a long time (from new!) I've had a 1976 UK Stanley number 4. Nothing whatever the matter with it. I did drop it and snap the handle, and rather than gluing it, I made a new one from a nice piece of reclaimed Brazilian mahogany. Slight more shapely than the original (sideways bulbous-ness, rather than flat sided). I have a few others now, and some woodies, but I still use that one for certain jobs.
Darn good course on restoring planes - comprehensive and then some. Working my way through it with an old rusty plane. Grab the free Stanley Timeline in the notes - best graphic there is for showing the different generations of planes and which ones to get and which to avoid.
Great video, I'm totally with you on post war Stanleys, my daily driver is one, £25 ebay steal, looks like cruft next to my dozen other Stanleys (all also ebay buys but clearly earlier than my no.4), it took me about an hour to clean up and tune and out performs the lot - I can take wafer shavings, crank it down for deep cuts, no chatter, blade stays sharp for ages. I surfaced my home built laminate bench with it, I've jointed 2-piece guitar bodies with it. Dream plane.
Fun editing on this one, Rex! Spiced up the presentation nicely. Looking forward to what you get up to in 2024.
I got a WW2 #5. It is an amazing plane. I want to get a #4 to go with it.
Thanks Rex. Great to see useful information inspiring folks to enjoy woodworking and antique tools. Would like to see a video on the stanley 289 and stanley 140 some time. Skew blade planes are awesome.
I agree, I mostly have type 13-15. But I love my type 19 #7. It's a great plane. Solid, works great.
Thank you Rex! The timeline is a wonderful gift. Just a quick note on the Timeline printout: On my Mac, with Epson Ecotank printer, I had to select "fit" on the Adobe print dialog. This allowed the far left and far right of the landscape print to print. Otherwise it cut off a lot of the text on both margins. With that "Fit" option selected, however, it prints everything just fine. Now I need to find some better paper and make me a frame to put it in the shop. Or maybe I could do a carving. Or inlay. OK....maybe just the decent paper and frame! ;). Thanks again, Rex. I hope you had a great holiday. Best wishes for your continued growth and success in 2024.
Thanks, Rex! Just found a type 17 no. 5 at the flea market for $25! Cleaned up really nice and no pitting. Just have to learn how to use this thing lol
I blame Rex for introducing so many of us to used planes and raisng the cost. ;-)
I bought a £30 No4 from Ben Crow's Vintage Toolshop back in late 2018 and it's been great. Not sure what edition it is (plus, it'll likely be an English made one, which the comments here suggest have a different timeline), but the only problems I've ever had have been my own doing - the handle is cracked and I made an arse of repairing it earlier this year. When I can get back into my shed/workshop in the spring, that's the first thing I'll be tackling (after a tidy)
Nice job Professor Rex.
I have a ww2 model. I like it. I like the story behind them. It works well. I also have a sweetheart same size. Can't really tell the difference!!
Great video! I've been wanting to get my first hand plane but never knew what to get and all the types and "numbers" made my head spin and I never pulled the trigger on any since I didn't want to get a lemon or get tricked into paying more for a practical tool than I needed. Just ordered my first one after watching this video. Will check out your restoration course if it comes in rough shape.
Rex. Thanks so much for this information. It is so valuable.
I have watched you for several years and I appreciate all your expertise.
Keith D.
Love to see you cover some of the other Stanley/Bailey copies. Millers Falls, Sargent, Union (not X) planes. Shelton's efforts at innovation have been much reviled, but their excellent Stanley No 4 copy is a great bargain and my go to plane.
Great break down. Almost like reading Patrick's blood n gore lol
Last week i inspected some type now fresh new in the box authentic Stanley #4 and #5 with zero backlash and no split yoke. very nice still affordable planes but i have enough. If there was a #3 i would have absolutely bought it. #3 i love for bevels.
I have a #3 Stanley Handyman that is a great. Its every bit as good as the regular #3 I have. There are other brands (Sargent, Miller Falls) and rebranded ones like Craftsman. They can all be tuned up to work well. I like my Craftsman #5 made by Millers Falls better than my Stanley #5.
Throwing this out there. I'm working on a pile of old planes (Miller's Falls, Stanley and 1 or 2 oddballs but good users) that I'll be selling through Can I Have It on Facebook. I will NOT be asking crazy money because, like Rex, I want these tools used not tossed in a scrap heap. Keep your eyes open for the auction. I have a type 17 #7 that'll probably go up first. STEEL ADJUSTMENT WHEEL, NOT PLASTIC.
Thanks for clearing up a lot of this. Knew nothing about the types when I bought my first plane off eBay. Just knew it was cheap and close to No. 5 size. Restored it after watching your early plane resto videos and it’s a champ. Now I know it’s definitely post war because of the frog. Very cool.
Type 19 is about the same but with rosewood tote and knob.
I am very happy that I finished my Type 15 colleciton of 2-8 and 2C-8C.
Type 18 (1946-47) is essentially the same thing, but due to post-war hardwood shortages, they had to use random hardwoods and so they painted the tote and knob black.
Just a side note: If you are looking for a daily user and don't care about the collectability, there are a lot of good "non-Stanley" brands out there. Perfectly serviceable planes were made by a host of companies, Sears (Craftsman or Dunlap or Fulton), Millers Falls, and Sargent planes tend to pop up quite often and are quite adequate for most peoples needs, at a price much lower than most Stanley planes. However, do your research, and beware of sellers who try to jack up the price just because it's old.
Record planes in my opinion are as good as the best Stanleys.
@@richardsinger01 Yeah, but weren't they marketed as a premium brand back in the day? I've never owned one, but I would have thought they would still be more expensive than Stanley's even now. I was trying to let everyone know that there were quality "daily drivers" which were still pretty cheap if you didn't care about the brand name.
I think my Stanley is one of the earlier ones with the plastic handle and, honestly, aside from restoratio, there was nothing wrong with it. It shaved like an absolute dream
Sargent VBM made between 1910 to 1918 are some if the best planes ever made. VBM should be marked on rhe blade as well as the cap iron. Front knob will be beaded at rhe bottom. Iron is 15 per cent thicker. Later models have the rear tote moved back away from the blade . Casting is heavier. Knobs and totes are indian rosewood. Some planes can also be labled Fulton but make sure they have the beaded front knob so they are of the same vintage. Have a fairly full set of Stanley type 10 / 11's that are great. But my Sargent VBM's are a dream to use. Have 6 jointer planes all pre 1918. The best is a Fulton (Sargent VBM) that i paid $35 for at an auction because no one knew what it was . Dead flat and will joint an 8' board like a dream.
So that's why my planes were so affordable! Fine by me, as I am certain that the tools are not the limiting factor concerning my finished projects.
Rex - Happy Holidays to you and your family. Your videos are educational and quick to the point.
Great chart Rex, thanks for sharing. Every time I go to the flea market I end up with another Stanley plane. I now know why I was getting them so cheap! All but one is WW2 or later!
great content, as always! Thanks for taking the time to share with us!
One more thing about the union plane, on the top there are only tiny shiny spots, thats where the blade really sits on so the actual supported surface is even smaller than those ribs
I just watched this and your video on plaining some lumber from a box store. I just retired and want to build some projects without my power tools. What 4 or5 plains would I need to get started. Thx……great vids!
Really nice video. Very informative. I wonder if mention should be made of brands such as Wards Master Quality, Rockford and some iterations of Craftsman (emphasis on SOME). I have picked up some of these brands at second stand stores they tuned up nicely without too much fiddling. They cost next to nothing.
For me I would rather save up and purchase a Lie Neilson or Vert. Nothing against purchasing old Stan’s. But I for one would rather spend less time restoring to actually using it in a project. And if you decide to go with old Stans. I would recommend purchasing a new blade and chip right off the bat. Trust me it’s worth it. I have a few fellow hobbyists that have a handful of old barn finds and all they do is sit on a shelf. More of a conversation piece then a everyday jack. Lol I know it’s crazy.
I have restored about a dozen stanley planes from type 3 to 20. My #4 type 19 got turned into my smoother because it so true and solid. Also love my 5 1/2 but those can be a pain to find without the C bottom
For some reason I ended up with more type 13 planes than any other type. They work great and they were all cheap. I also have a no, type 17 with a steel knob. It is fricking heavy but sometimes I really like the heft. I have a few post war planes and I agree, they work just fine. I all depends on how good they are set up.
Nooooooo! Stop telling everyone the secrets! Its gonna drive up the prices on type 18 and 19 planes! Good thing i already have a full set...... or two. Post war planes rule. This is the first time ive ever seen a video that actually verified my thoughts on the post war stuff. Nice work
@RexKrueger thanks for the lesson. Antique tools are highly under rated if you ask me...they were made to be used and passed on. Today's stuff...cheaply made and mass produced...
I never knew about the bed thing! To add my own anecdata, I have three Stanley's with the new bed, which are my three best planes. They all work great. I also have a 5 with the old bed, which I retired because I just couldn't get it to work well. That's an early version with the tiny, reversed adjustment screw, so I also think you're dead on when you suggest avoiding those.
Love the word "anecdata". I'll start throwing it around from now on.
Rex I have a block plane and it has a Stanley SW blade.... please do a video about restoring one...also I have a India handplane no.5 type with ridges on the base, and plastic tote which needs restoring, let me know what you think. Thanks dude...OORAH!!
I downloaded the Stanley Plane Timeline. I believe it will make a cool poster for my shop wall. Thanks, and Merry Christmas!
I wish this was released a year ago, would save me a ton of research. For the Europe, I think best deals can be found on Record planes (my opinion is that records are nicer than UK Stanley, but both work fine in the end)
I own about 25 hand planes, and only 3 are Stanleys. I'm located in the USA, and I also prefer the Record planes simply because they're a bit heftier than Stanleys.
I am the guy this video is for. Thank you
Interesting, I actually prefer the Wards Master planes. Great planes made by Stanley for Wards.
Very interesting information, Rex. Best to you for 2024. I enjoy your videos greatly.
thanks rex!
my collection so far:
no 4 miller falls not vintage, but works ok
no. 4.5 type 5 ? bought for $55 in working order, makes the shavings fly (wish i knew about the backwards knob when I bought it LOL)
no. 5 type 11 bought for $20 in working order, feels great in the hand
no. 7 type 7 ? currently in boat anchor condition LOL, iron is worn down within 1/2 inch if the slot
Fantastic video. Cheers Rex. Merry Christmas.
Something that I just learned recently is that almost all of these planes don't use 1/4"-20 UNC (American Unified Coarse) threads, but 12-20 BSW (British Standard Whitworth). Don't be like the person who had my post-war No. 5 previously, and replace the front knob by jamming a 1/4"-20 bolt into a old wooden door knob and call it good. You'll mess up the threads and widen the hole in the casting, so replacement parts won't fit!
The US used BSW threads until steel was widely used over iron in threaded fasteners, so this will apply to other kinds of antique machinery as well.
Victor Machinery Exchange is the only place I can find that still sells a tap and die in this specific thread pitch for a consumer price ($12 for either).
Rex
Very good video, pretty sure if you ever show it to Paul Sellers is going to give you an Attaboy pat on your shoulder.
Happy New Year
One of your best videos, thanks
Thanks slot, I learned so much today.
Brilliant review of a complex topic, Rex! Your wealth of industry knowledge and crystal clarity in imparting it earn you a unique position. Thanks for the useable time-line!
Already downloaded the chart. Thank you good sir.
Sweetheart Era for life!
(Though I do have a soft spot for the type 17s)
Tons of great information in this video thank you .
So excited for the course, Rex! I have been hesitant to buy vintage because of the daunting task of restoring… this seems much more approachable!
Boughta 19 number 4 in almost pristine condition for 60 bucks, best deal for a scrub conversion plane