As interesting as this is it has a few holes. You're confusing "originate" with "born Human" the three birds were never human and where born from Humans. The Ordeals are born from Ayin's mind because the entire building of lob Corp is born from his mind and thus when combined with the NE create the Ordeals. There is Nosferatu and the Bloodfiends and how they predate Ruina.
Your reasoning and theory-crafting is very interesting! Unfortunately as pointed out by other comments it is all built on a misunderstanding of the provided lore (Abnormalities *are not* human, they just come from humans, bottom right of the map is the Great Lake, etc.). Still a good vid tho. Other note: The discussion on which abnos are natural and which are company-born is still very interesting, the Black Forest Birds and Nosferatu are definitely natural, but what about, say, Giant Tree Sap? Or the Magical Girls? Fascinating to think about, isn't it?
the great lake thing, i admit, was a huge blunder on my part. also the scriptwriting in the video was… poor to say the least. i never really wanted to insinuate that the abnos were human, just that theyre human in the sense that theyre someones unconscious given form. unlike distortions which technically are human since they can be reversed, abnormalities as weve seen cant be reversed or killed, since they arent an actual human at their core but they still came from a human actually giant tree sap is another one of the only abnormalities for which its stated in the log that it was found by lobotomy corp near/in the outskirts, so its definetly natural. what i also have thought about is that you can make the case for the birds that lobotomy corp extracted apocalypse bird from the unconscious of one person and then it split into the three birds, which would make them not natural (personally i dont believe that but its just a possible alternative to my theory); but whats interesting is you cant make the same case for the magical girls since they dont have some sort of ‘together’ form like the birds, they were originally planned to have one but it was cut in development ofc, so it may be that weve just never seen the form.
@@danoffical On Giant Tree Sap, I'm personally not *completely* convinced by the log, just on the grounds that Yesod explicitly says that they falsify abnormality records and the company isn't just gonna write "oh yea we extracted this one from Timothy" since the whole extraction business is privileged information. On the Magical Girls we do see what happens when they combine/what they summon, [LoR Spoiler] in Library of Ruina we see they would have summoned Jester of Nihil.
@@lachlanmccormick3486 i always assumed that the jester was more of the villain who all the magical girls face but who corrupts them, not what they summon when theyre all together or what they create. maybe originally he was supposed to spawn when all the magical girls broke out but iirc there was a moment in wonderlab that hinted to all of the magical girls being able to combine into one being so i cant really be sure for the tree sap thing you may be right yeah, its been a while since i fully replayed lobotomy corporation so i didnt remember that yesod had that line
I think the birds still are abnos tho, in their history, it is referenced that they passed judgement on animals and those animals had social structures, they could come from this collective fear of the head and A, B and C corp and manifested into a society that takes place in the forest outside the city instead of coming from who knows where like most abnos, that said, cogito itself could be naturally made and there could still be a river of it flowing in the forest Long side-note: I don't think white knight is a special kind of abno, he is supposed to be the anti-christ, the counterpart to the true savior, the flying skull of the sins (haven't played LC in a few years) All of white knights thing can be interpreted as a play by him to gather followers and deceive people, meanwhile, the only 100% positive abno in the whole game is the one with the power to stop it
My personal favorite reading of WN is a direct parallel of Carmen, Ayin, Hod, and The Head, cause if you consider Judas as a direct analogy to Hod, it's basically 1:1 with her backstory.
Did the Church of Gears even exist prior to the White Nights and Dark Days? Cults can gather followers very quickly even in the real world, and we have seen multiple Distortions use others to expand their power. (The Thought Chef from Distortion Detective, for one.) It's not unreasonable to say that Eileen's grief over her father turned her into a Distortion after the White Nights and Dark Days. (Unless I am missing something?) To me, it seems that the main factor stopping Ordeals from being contained is the fact that they don't have a singular thing that one can call a body. They are formless until enough Enkephalin is produced, and formless intangible beings are difficult to stuff into a containment room. Finally, I don't think the Ruins are going to be useful in understanding Cogito because they aren't unique to L Corp. Any corporation in the city could sent expeditions to the Ruins, and it wouldn't make sense for the Ruins to only be meaningful to L Corp. My guess is that the Singularities were originally discovered by humans prior to some apocalypse, and the Ruins are the remains of the old civilization. Thus, people venture into the Outskirts and the Ruins to try and learn the secrets of the past civilization (to get rich) while trying to not get killed by said secrets. Also, nobody proved that the birds did not originate from a human. Maybe some hapless explorer in the Black Forest just happened to get thirsty and take a sip of natural Cogito.
@@danoffical Somewhere in distortion detective is mentioned also I think it was name dropped in LC (in the 100% cutscene) and in a book in LoR. Also in the map scribble from DD there is some trees drawn to the west of the city, I think that is the black forest
@@the_fenix_3247 oh wow yeah i mustve missed that, damn that sucks still i dont really think it changes the theory a lot, at most it just proves that the birds come from the outskirts if Ezra's map depiction of the black forest is accurate
@@danoffical Yeah the birds most likely come from the outskirts, or at least the original ones since I think the ones we interact with are extracted from the well since is not confirmed if abnormalities are one of a kind, though this is just a theory I have
@@the_fenix_3247 it could be that back when Carmen was working in a lab in the outskirts was when they had been able to contain the actual three birds, then when lobotomy corporation was created we see a version of the birds manifested by Ayin's memories, just like how Ayin was able to manifest his memories of the Head's attack for the white midnight. The three original birds could have been killed when the Head raided Carmens lab, since we see a few dead creatures in the cg where Binah is facing off against Gebura
limbus maniacs get ready for limbus stream monday edit: also spoilers edit again: i didnt know that you have to wait for 23 hours before streaming for the first time so looks like the monday stream is cancelled
![LibraryOfRuina - The Librarian of Death MOD [EN]](/img/n.gif)
As interesting as this is it has a few holes.
You're confusing "originate" with "born Human" the three birds were never human and where born from Humans.
The Ordeals are born from Ayin's mind because the entire building of lob Corp is born from his mind and thus when combined with the NE create the Ordeals.
There is Nosferatu and the Bloodfiends and how they predate Ruina.
Your reasoning and theory-crafting is very interesting! Unfortunately as pointed out by other comments it is all built on a misunderstanding of the provided lore (Abnormalities *are not* human, they just come from humans, bottom right of the map is the Great Lake, etc.).
Still a good vid tho.
Other note: The discussion on which abnos are natural and which are company-born is still very interesting, the Black Forest Birds and Nosferatu are definitely natural, but what about, say, Giant Tree Sap? Or the Magical Girls? Fascinating to think about, isn't it?
the great lake thing, i admit, was a huge blunder on my part. also the scriptwriting in the video was… poor to say the least. i never really wanted to insinuate that the abnos were human, just that theyre human in the sense that theyre someones unconscious given form. unlike distortions which technically are human since they can be reversed, abnormalities as weve seen cant be reversed or killed, since they arent an actual human at their core but they still came from a human
actually giant tree sap is another one of the only abnormalities for which its stated in the log that it was found by lobotomy corp near/in the outskirts, so its definetly natural.
what i also have thought about is that you can make the case for the birds that lobotomy corp extracted apocalypse bird from the unconscious of one person and then it split into the three birds, which would make them not natural (personally i dont believe that but its just a possible alternative to my theory); but whats interesting is you cant make the same case for the magical girls since they dont have some sort of ‘together’ form like the birds, they were originally planned to have one but it was cut in development ofc, so it may be that weve just never seen the form.
@@danoffical On Giant Tree Sap, I'm personally not *completely* convinced by the log, just on the grounds that Yesod explicitly says that they falsify abnormality records and the company isn't just gonna write "oh yea we extracted this one from Timothy" since the whole extraction business is privileged information.
On the Magical Girls we do see what happens when they combine/what they summon, [LoR Spoiler] in Library of Ruina we see they would have summoned Jester of Nihil.
@@lachlanmccormick3486 i always assumed that the jester was more of the villain who all the magical girls face but who corrupts them, not what they summon when theyre all together or what they create. maybe originally he was supposed to spawn when all the magical girls broke out but iirc there was a moment in wonderlab that hinted to all of the magical girls being able to combine into one being so i cant really be sure
for the tree sap thing you may be right yeah, its been a while since i fully replayed lobotomy corporation so i didnt remember that yesod had that line
I think the birds still are abnos tho, in their history, it is referenced that they passed judgement on animals and those animals had social structures, they could come from this collective fear of the head and A, B and C corp and manifested into a society that takes place in the forest outside the city instead of coming from who knows where like most abnos, that said, cogito itself could be naturally made and there could still be a river of it flowing in the forest
Long side-note: I don't think white knight is a special kind of abno, he is supposed to be the anti-christ, the counterpart to the true savior, the flying skull of the sins (haven't played LC in a few years)
All of white knights thing can be interpreted as a play by him to gather followers and deceive people, meanwhile, the only 100% positive abno in the whole game is the one with the power to stop it
My personal favorite reading of WN is a direct parallel of Carmen, Ayin, Hod, and The Head, cause if you consider Judas as a direct analogy to Hod, it's basically 1:1 with her backstory.
Did the Church of Gears even exist prior to the White Nights and Dark Days? Cults can gather followers very quickly even in the real world, and we have seen multiple Distortions use others to expand their power. (The Thought Chef from Distortion Detective, for one.) It's not unreasonable to say that Eileen's grief over her father turned her into a Distortion after the White Nights and Dark Days. (Unless I am missing something?)
To me, it seems that the main factor stopping Ordeals from being contained is the fact that they don't have a singular thing that one can call a body. They are formless until enough Enkephalin is produced, and formless intangible beings are difficult to stuff into a containment room.
Finally, I don't think the Ruins are going to be useful in understanding Cogito because they aren't unique to L Corp. Any corporation in the city could sent expeditions to the Ruins, and it wouldn't make sense for the Ruins to only be meaningful to L Corp. My guess is that the Singularities were originally discovered by humans prior to some apocalypse, and the Ruins are the remains of the old civilization. Thus, people venture into the Outskirts and the Ruins to try and learn the secrets of the past civilization (to get rich) while trying to not get killed by said secrets.
Also, nobody proved that the birds did not originate from a human. Maybe some hapless explorer in the Black Forest just happened to get thirsty and take a sip of natural Cogito.
3:06 isn't that the great lake?
the great lake? is this mentioned somewhere? i just assumed it was the black forest since it sort of made sense
@@danoffical Somewhere in distortion detective is mentioned also I think it was name dropped in LC (in the 100% cutscene) and in a book in LoR.
Also in the map scribble from DD there is some trees drawn to the west of the city, I think that is the black forest
@@the_fenix_3247 oh wow yeah i mustve missed that, damn that sucks
still i dont really think it changes the theory a lot, at most it just proves that the birds come from the outskirts if Ezra's map depiction of the black forest is accurate
@@danoffical Yeah the birds most likely come from the outskirts, or at least the original ones since I think the ones we interact with are extracted from the well since is not confirmed if abnormalities are one of a kind, though this is just a theory I have
@@the_fenix_3247 it could be that back when Carmen was working in a lab in the outskirts was when they had been able to contain the actual three birds, then when lobotomy corporation was created we see a version of the birds manifested by Ayin's memories, just like how Ayin was able to manifest his memories of the Head's attack for the white midnight. The three original birds could have been killed when the Head raided Carmens lab, since we see a few dead creatures in the cg where Binah is facing off against Gebura
limbus maniacs get ready for limbus stream monday
edit: also spoilers
edit again: i didnt know that you have to wait for 23 hours before streaming for the first time so looks like the monday stream is cancelled