How NOT to Choose a Flight Instructor
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- Опубліковано 24 бер 2022
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-Jon - Авто та транспорт
One of the CFI’s I used to help me practice emergencies while my main CFI was gone was this type: Totally upfront about his eagerness to go to the regionals…. AND 200% invested in making me super safe and better. The guy gave his all to all his students til his last day. That’s pretty cool and something to think about - drive to get into the next thing doesn’t matter when they’re also giving their all to you right now. ❤️
I started at a part 61 flight school, which closed due to covid when I had 10 hours. I ended up switching to a different airport to finish my training. Instead of using a flight school, I ended up working with an independent CFI who was a full-time engineer during the week and a flight instructor on weekends and after work. My experience was actually really awesome. I was my CFI's first student, but she was passionate, studied at least as hard as I did for each lesson, loved coming to the airport, and was more than happy to answer questions outside of our scheduled lessons. She also cared about me personally a lot - one time, I accidently left my phone in the FBO on a 90*+ summer's day. She looked up my dad's number online, called him up, and told him I'd left my phone there. When I got back to the FBO, she'd drove the five miles into town and bought me a McFlurry and put it in the freezer at the FBO until I arrived, because she knew my car had no air conditioning and it was a 1.5 hour drive one-way from my house to the airport. And even though it's now been almost a year since I finished my private, we still stay in touch and I count her as one of my good friends. She helped me become a very good, precise pilot and the DPE said I was one of the best prepared candidates he had ever had. I guess I just wanted to say that it is possible to have a brand new CFI and have a good experience! :)
How did you find that independent CFI?
@@laupha She was recommended to me by the guy who was the airport manager/A&P-IA who ran the maintenance shop on field. As I was renting the airplane from the FBO, it made sense to go with the instructor he recommended.
@@kristinewberg7656 Thank you. That was a good way to find out. Good for you!
Just received my pilots license yesterday. I passed the checkride. I’m thankful your videos. They’ve helped me out. Love the content!
yoo Congrats!
Congrats Eric!! I'm glad they were able to help you out!
Another great video; great points and the role play was wicked funny.
A bit of a problem though- if everyone followed your advice here, how do CFI’s get the first 200 hrs dual given? As a freshly rated CFI that was hard advice to hear you giving. Especially since I have taught flight (hang gliding) for 20 years, including being recognized as the US instructor of the year. I also worked at a major ski resort as an instructor and then as a supervisor, teaching others how to teach. I have less than 5 hrs “dual given” in my logbook. But I’ve spent MANY years devoted to the art and challenge of teaching, and I love it.
My point is, I wish you would have quantified your advice a bit more- logbook credentials are certainly something, but far from the whole story. You should suggest people ask about the instructor’s other life experience if they’re newer to being a CFI. Also suggest people try to get a feel for what type of person the instructor is, as a human being. Do they approach instructing with professionalism and take pride in their instruction and providing value to their clients?
Respectfully, Ryan Voight in NY
These are all some solid points and great questions to ask. I have to say though, saying time builders are a red flag isn’t exactly fair.
I am a classic time building instructor, but I love the job. I can’t do this as a career though, it’s financially straining. I want to own a house and car some day. It’s just the reality of the industry. Flying 4 cylinder 3,000 lb planes just isn’t going to provide me with a comfortable QOL.
That being said, I am upfront about this with my clients, but I assure them that I am going to give it my best effort and not treat them like a cash/time cow. I build personal relationships with my clients and want them to be safe and proficient pilots. I get to know them well, their jobs and families. I would consider every student I’ve taught a friend and I still keep in touch with a lot of them. This personal relationship we build motivates me to keep them safe and ready for those adverse events. I love flying and don’t want to look back at any point if my career and say “jeez that was miserable.” I even enjoyed my time instructing at ATP lol.
Keep up the quality content, I recommend all of my students to watch your videos. You and the Jason’s help motivate me to be a good CFI. To all of those reading this, not all time builders are bad instructors. If you suspect your instructor is, send them this video and have a chat with them.
Been there experienced this. Had a Commercial Instructor who openly stated he hated going to a particular Aerodrome which was a short grass field. He spent more time in the air birdwatching answering his phone during ground briefings and intensely criticised everything I did. If I knew then what I know now I would have dumped him much earlier on. Any reservation you have take notice of it and monitor and don’t be afraid to ask any pertinent questions.
Great info! Thank you!
I only fly with 6 stripe flight instructors
Those are the best for sure
All good stuff!!! One question I wished I had asked of my ppl instructor is availability during winter. The instructor I used was a great instructor, a career instructor… but he snow birded. Started instruction in June, I was close to being ready for the check ride in September and he was gone and came back in May. It was almost like starting over, and probably added 20 hours to my training. Availability is huge, especially in an area that frequently has bad weather days.
Helpful information. The link to the syllabus doesn’t seem to be working.
Thank you Jon for this great informative video! You are one of the best and honest in this industry. I went through everything you mentioned in this video.
Glad it was helpful!
Always good info, I did my solo at 20 hours no problem and I enjoy flying solo as to date over 40 hours but I have hit a bump where the schools schedule and my schedule don't work. I can only fly weekends for the most part but often the CFI or the plane is not available on Saturdays. I wish your were still in Venice.
lmao love the intro ! you got me laughing and your vid '' thumbs upp'd'' with the 1st 10 seconds
My CFI-A instructor rocks. He's not going through crazy amounts of ground school with me. 20 has been enough with about 10 in the air before sign off. The chosen DPE is well known for not being a stickler on FOIs and regards the CFI checkride as being a poor litmus test for how well an applicant will actually instruct. As long as you know a decent amount of the PTS, and in the air talk a lot and spot intentional mistakes by the DPE well (getting uncoordinated in stall, getting too slow etc), you will easily pass.
Absolutely an eye opener. Today i ceck 3 flight schools and 2 of them sound so fake and cheesy.The pitch was just like you did it… oh yeahhh , we help you. You can do it in 40 hours and this is the cost, they told me.
Well, i did my “ home works” and i did find out aswell to need at list 70ish hour , so almost the double of what they ask . I walk away immidiatly. However , tomorrow i’ll go back to one i temporary choose and i will ask of the dual giving amd such mentioned from you.
A huge THANK YOU 🙏🏼. Cheers ,. Sam
I see this all of the time!
Awesomeness thanks
Jon I wish you were still instructing here in Florida. I have gone through 2 instructors that both said they were there to stay, I go in for a scheduled flight and find out they quit for another flying job. Unfortunately the only other flight school near me is basically just a pilot mill and the instructors don't really care about you.
I'm finishing my CFI cert this month so I am watching this on what NOT to do!
Thanks for your videos, this is great!
Glad you enjoy it!
Nice video and good points made. Your primary point is something I learned sort of the hard way. That said, a lot of people are in a similar situation that I was when I started....the idea of interviewing and choosing from multiple instructors/schools/aircraft/etc doesn't work if there's only one small airport in your area with one school and a small number of instructors. Great in theory but not so much in the real world.
Still, a person can use your advice to guide and steer their schooling from a new or poor instructor.
It can be difficult in rural areas or places that are just so busy you have to take what you can get. At least being aware of what exactly you're getting may help save a little time and frustration in the long run. It's also very possible to find a good cfi you may be commuting an hour or two to their location. That used to seem like a big deal in FL, but less so after living in Alaska for a bit.
It's really quite simple. Go up with an instructor, and make sense or what you did, and if you learned anything. Do they make you feel comfortable or stressed out? A good teacher is a good teacher, and I'm looking for a good teacher, even if they are not named Bob Hoover. Anyways, judging a CFI by his teaching hours, and subsequently rejecting him/her because it doesn't fit in a box, is like airlines using the 1500 hr TT for hiring pilots. Seat time does not equate to core qualifications. Everyone has to start somewhere. Also, if you're worried about your progress, go fly with a different CFI and ask them to judge your progress. Most people get married knowing less about their mate than you're proposing a prospective student know about their CFI>
yeah I do 30 hours steep turn
Good advice.
Glad it was helpful!
Thx for the questions to ask, I had only come up with 4-5 of them
Glad to help!
If you have any other questions about choosing a CFI, feel free to send them in an email to CFI@fly8ma.com leave your number in that email and we will give you a call so we can help answer your questions to the fullest!
Depending on where you live or how many flight schools are in your area you simply may not have much to choose from. I'm on my third instructor now within 4 months and have 10 hours in my book. The first guy has no availability even though he said he did. The second guy blew off an appointment four times. The guy I'm playing with now has 100 hours to go and he's out of there.
Planes very greatly. They all have different power and handle differently. Also everyone flies differently and uses very different techniques. With a 150 horsepower motor a little throttle takes you up pretty quick, but a 100 horsepower motor on a hot day doesn't seem to have much effect. Summonstructors seem to set their pitch and use power to land while another instructor sets power, doesn't touch it, and uses pitch to come in. Multiple instructors will confuse you.
The in understanding that we live in a real world and not an idealistic world, what can we do when good options just aren't there? I feel that if I can just gain enough skill to solo as a student pilot I'll be all right.
When people find a good instructor they should consider themselves lucky because they're really are a lot of bad ones out there. The question is, how can we charge forward toward our goal despite unfavorable circumstances?
I took a year to get my PPL. I did it with exactly 40 hours. Weather gets in the way most places.
Unfortunately the industry creates instructors who don't want to teach. Trying to find a low hour time building job is like finding a needle in a hay stack! I'm currently working towards my CFI cert and I find the idea of teaching students to fly very rewarding. CFIs should watch this video lol! I definitely had 1 or 2 instructors who hated their jobs and i felt the repercussions. Anyways keep the blue side up friends! (unless you're doing spin training)
Unfortunately too true! I’ve experienced similar CFIs who were only doing it to get their hours in. What they promised and delivered were two different things
Serious question - how do you get to be a 200 hour given instructor if all potential students have watched this video. Are some people compatible with low hour CFIs and vice versa? What's the advice for selling yourself as a 50 hour given CFI? This is all great advice - but CFIs have to start somewhere
If you're a new CFI be humble, find an experienced CFI to mentor you, sit in on ground and flight lessons from an experienced CFI, find students who already know how to fly (i.e. tailwheel, commercial, BFR students), ensure you have the right resources to use when you have questions about how to teach effectively to a given student, spend extra time preparing for each lesson to help make up for your lack of experience, use a detailed syllabus (like the one on the FLY8MA website, link in description), you'll build to 200hrs quickly if you follow those steps.
just started CFI ground training this week - any advice for how to put our best foot forward with a new prospective student without scaring them away from a new instructor?
1. Have a syllabus and follow it (you can download ours for free, link in description).
2. Know what you're going to do with the student BEFORE they show up.
3. Don't bill for time that YOU have to look up answers to their questions, and never respond to a question with "you don't need to know that". If you don't know, say so and go find out for them asap.
4. Work under an experienced CFI who is willing to spend a little time with your student here and there to fill in any gaps you may not be able to yet.
5. Price yourself accordingly, you deserve to charge for your time when YOU ARE PROVIDING VALUE to the student.
6. Remember honesty and a hunger to keep making yourself better will go a long way to quickly making you a good cfi that students will want to train with
I work as otr trucking man and out 4 to 6 weeks but I pick up quickly and have 6000 hrs flit sim too
Quick question... ideally how many HOURS a week should I be shooting for to train for my private pilots? Thanks and love the videos!!
You can try and fly 2-5 hours per week with 6-15hrs per week of study
Heads up; syllabus link renders (almost) blank page.
Unfortunately, I do not live in the United States. If I did, I would probably do the ultralight route. As you do not need a license for single seaters. And I know that in some cases you can get a waiver for ones with two seats, and I’m sure that I could get one so that I could have another Sided person sitting next to me to navigate. Very worst I could fly a single place ultralight with cameras and some sort of audio system reading the instruments. And somebody cited guiding me from the ground. But unfortunately, my country is super strict on flying so I do struggle quite a lot here. Flying is a very big important part of my life, but unfortunately I struggle because I am blind. Although I have never let those barriers stop me.
you had me at stripies aahaha
now while stripies are cool, but, can i also get gold stars, because if not that might be a deal-breaker
I started flying in January and today I only have 15 hours, initially it was on me trying to fly only 2 days a week but lately both weather and school issues. Does anyone have a good, solid number of hours by which my solo should be done? I am currently preparing for it.
There isn't an hour number to solo by. It depends on how often you fly, how well you "take" to flying, and circumstances like if you're switching instructors and planes. I also flew 1-2 times a week and I soloed at 33 hours. However, that was due to a 4 month break in flying due to covid, new plane (started training in high wing, soloed in low wing), new instructor, new airport, and bad weather during which I chose to keep flying with my instructor and work towards other requirements while we waited for good weather.
Are you a CFI? Work for any flight schools in FL? I plan to head down to Sarasota in the next 6 months. Any recommendations of flight schools in that area? Thanks so much for this page!!!
Yes! Still instructing, however not in FL...I moved to alaska a few years ago and teach up here. In the Sarasota area I'd call up Sarasota Aero Club... 941-681-0009
I really disagree with the first two questions. I was the first student of my first CFI and from the HARDEST MEANEST DPE in the world on my private check ride he said "This is an easy pass". I barely passed IFR with a super experienced instructor. My taildragger instructor would constantly go on "I have 20,000 hours and no one else knows anything about flying." He shocked the crap out of my by putting the power in (I was struggling a bit on the landing) and I nearly ran us off the runway. He blamed it on me. He doesn't understand positive exchange of controls. He also told me I don't have to worry about sumping because the fuel trucks do it. He later crashed his plane after losing his engine at about 300 feet. Sumping related, idk. Definitely not a good habit though.
I think with aviation and any industry really, I'd take passion and desire over experience. Experienced people tend to get burned out.
I agree with you, many experienced pilots are very proud of that experience. And tell you as much. They tend to feel they've seen it all and I think that leads to an atrophy of their skills.
Hey John, thanks for this video! I wish I had it when I was starting. I want to actually get your opinion on the other side of this scenario.
How should a fairly new instructor approach a similar situation with a potential customer that sought them out to train towards a PPL because they know or have heard how well you help other people understand aviation and the associated skills? They could have been friends for a few years, coworkers, friend of a friend, etc
Hello Sir I have suggested to other Influencers in this field having cameras in the cockpit of training aircraft and used as a valuable de-brief tool and would it contribute to transparency. The recordings after every lesson to be kept by the student and Flight School. I wonder if Flight Schools will embrace this. What are your thoughts?
Some flight schools are getting on board with it. We've used cameras inside and outside the airplane to record lessons and debrief students for almost 10 years now. It's a great tool to be able to show what actually is going on vs what the student recalls
The flight hour thing seems a little strict. My school has few students, and those students just dont schedule flights. Its also one of the only 141 schools in a big radius
Note : i visit 3 more schools beside the forst 3 .
I’m sooooo glad to watch this video first and open my eyes .
They will milk you like a cow , 1 of them told the minimum was 100-110 hours . YOU WISH I replay, and walk away immidiatly without even saying goodbye.
Yet another another one told was doable in just 30ish hours and no more then that. soond like a BS.
I choose the one not more convenient but the most honest from the beginning, put in front of me black on white, and, once back and ask all the dettails from the above video , without hesitation they show me any requests i did without blinking of an eye .
Hope to see you in the sky in 6-8 months .
THANK YOU AGAIN 🛫🛫🛫
Glad it helps!
This seems like really good advice. I am curious about 100% pass rate though. If use an instructor with a 100% checkride pass rate, aren't you increasing the risk that they're going to take you further than is necessary in order to maintain that 100% pass rate? E.g. they're going to sign you off for check ride until you do consistently do steep turns at +/- 0 feet rather than +/- 100 feet that the ACS requires.
Not that high standards are bad, but impossibly difficult standards can be used to stretch out training. It seems to me that expecting a 100% pass rate encourages impossibly difficult standards.
Am I missing something?
I don't need my students to do steep turns to +/-0 feet or even +/-50' to maintain my 100% pass rate. I simply train them to reliably meet ACS standards or better. Typically this takes between 50-70 hours (which is still below the national average of 73.1 hours). If you have an instructor that is prepared to teach effectively, it will only benefit you in the end.
Is $75 an hour typical for CFI prices?
Pretty typical now, I'd say you find anywhere from $50-$150/hr for regular instruction, $200-$300/hr for specialty instruction such as back country, off airport, etc.
But more importantly, how many of them are safe pilots out there because of your channel website and content? I mean, I’m not trying to condone it. Even though I personally don’t have a problem with it. But just think of all the licensed pilots who get help from this channel. I’m completely blind and obviously will never be given a license, but I have had many opportunities to fly, in various waze. And all of them involved somebody cited sitting beside me. And this channel I have found to be incredibly helpful. Especially videos on aborted takeoffs and hand propping and stalling properly and some of the practice manoeuvres and especially this one about flight instructors and all the information that you have. So I myself can’t hold a license, but I find all of this information thoroughly helpful.so I think that you’ve probably saved quite a few lives out there I reckon. So I would like to say thank you on behalf of all the pilots out there. Legit, or sick bird. We all appreciate your content.
Thank you for the kind words.
@@fly8ma.comflighttraining199 no worries. Thank you for keeping the dream alive and safe for us.
I want to get pilot licence in your scool
Wheare are your pilot scool location
Hey!
We are located in Big Lake Alaska! Our ground school is all online though, so you can do that in the comfort of your own home and still have contact with our CFI's!
If you have any other questions on how to get started send us an email at CFI@fly8ma.com
Heya
Where was this 1 year ago?
Hopefully you didn't have to bad of an experience with a CFI.
Those questions are more like asking about their credentials which everyone hates. So, basically, you are saying a student should never fly with a brand new instructor just because he doesn't have enough experience of teaching someone.
Wow Jon, way to crap on all new instructors. If all students took this approach when picking a CFI (>250 dual hours, number of annual sign-offs etc.), you wouldn’t have ended up where you are either. Sure a new instructor still has a lot to learn but many new instructors like myself actually have more up to date experience and are often more motivated than a seasoned instructor. There is a big difference between maintaining a syllabus (typically what the CFI inherited from their CFI with little afterthought) and actually developing a detailed lesson plan, sharing this before each lesson (often days ahead, supported by reference videos) and then providing feedback (I provide an email summary of achievements). CFI may not be my full time job, but the students I have realize that I do it for the fun of teaching and derive my satisfaction from their progression (we’re certainly not doing it for the money). Since it’s just a hobby, it means I’ll be around to help them with their commercial and CFI too if they so choose.
New instructors have their place, and you can certainly use a new cfi...but of course a new student being educated about what they're really getting helps a lot too😉
Darren, I completely agree with you. My CFI is a new instructor and so far I’m really happy with the way my ppl training is going. She also is not a full time CFI though her goal is to eventually go to the airlines, she has a full time 9-5 job and dedicates all her free time to teaching. I did ask her after my introductory flight how long she had been teaching and how many hours she had and she was honest about her low hours and the fact that she was a new CFI but I decided to give her a chance because I liked her teaching style. I’m glad I stuck with her as my instructor because she’s a great teacher, I feel safe flying with her, she’s calm and encouraging, and she knows what she’s doing.
If that were the case, new instructors would never get any new students because they don't have enough of dual given.
200 is nice, 1,000hrs is better, but at the end of the day no one says you CANNOT use a 0 time CFI, just proceed with caution.
Advocating new CFIs or low hours is something to avoid is ridiculous.
I'll care more about flight instructing when I make more than a mcdonald's worker
You Private pilot School was really good. I scored an 87. The average score is 84. The questions that I got wrong we're kind of trick questions but I didn't get a single question wrong because I didn't know the material. You pretty much covered it all.
That is awesome!! Thank you for letting us know how you did!
Well, unfortunately I only have 2 flight schools to choose from within 60 miles of me. About to start my flying chapter, guess we'll see what I can get out of my limited choices.
😓 p♥r♥o♥m♥o♥s♥m