986 Making The Joule Thief
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- Опубліковано 11 лют 2021
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Love this. Also big shout out to big Clive for having part in naming this. Just the name joule thief sparked a fascination 👍
Glad you mentioned him! ..... I thought it was his article in EE that kicked it all off (but I was obviously wrong)
Rimstar Org is where i first learnt it
It's interesting to watch how inventions progress throughout the ages, with people building on the idea's of others. The original voltage booster using a vacuum tube in the 1930's, then 1950's versions proposing transistors, and then the patent you mentioned in the 1980's that uses a JFET. And of course Kaparnik then mating it to an LED in 1999. An update about every 20-30 years. Perhaps this video will inspire someone to come up with yet the next iteration, as it seems we're about due!! 😊😊😊
Back to basics - love it. Thank you.
cheers mate
I'm excited I hope to see more of this kind of stuff in your channel Thanks Rob for all your time and work I really appreciate you this video made my day :)
I started with the joule thief and played about with it using it to charge a capicitor instead of light a LED, seeing how high a voltage i could get. Then i used qucs circuit simulator to test various configurations so that i didnt put too much voltage onto the transistor. Eventually i got my joule thief to light a neon bulb with a single nicad cell.
Only major mod required was a voltage limiter so prevent the off signal to the transistor from exceeding the reverse breakdown voltage of the emitter base junction. So yes, i effectively duplicated the camera flash unit you mentioned.
I love joule thief circuits. They are so simplistic and a great way to drain the last bit of energy from flat AA batteries. Great video Rob.
cheers mate - they are pretty interesting circuits that's for sure
@Rob fascinating as always... Not sure how you do it, but as random as these subjects seem to pop up, they also seem to answer the very question I've been pondering.. It's uncanny! Now I'm off to look at that patent, hope it's what I'm hoping it is as it will avoid a lot of head-scratching!
Excellent lesson. Thanks.
Your coffee looks like mud. Exactly how I like mine :-D Love joule thiefs. Nice Rob!
lol - I do like it strong - cheers mate
Blocking oscillator's are very similar using a 2N 2222 it will run for ages then start flashing using a dead AAA battery. If you don't want to wind coils use Ferrite RF chokes twisted together at one end and parallel to each other.
I once attended an inspirational lecture. The lecturer asked "who in here can draw?"... A few (say 10%) raised their hands. He then drew a stick figure on the white board , pointed at it and asked "who in here can draw?" and most people rised their hands this time.
Perfection is the enemy of good ;)
And it can work when it's just a plastic form. I uses three inch plastic pipe cut one inch thick. Speaker wire approximately 16 Guage wrapped in a toroidal arrangement. .
A few thoughts:
1) This oscillating circuit reminds me of that on/off switch for atmospheric electricity from YESTERDAY'S video. Perhaps a transistor could be employed for that in a similar fashion.
2) For crude measuring of wire length, if you stand in a "crucifix" pose with your arms stretched out and fingers straight, the distance from the tips of your middle fingers is close to your height. A wire held between fingertips of outstretched arm and opposite shoulder is fairly close to 1 meter for the average adult male, which appears to be what Rob is doing.
3) I wonder how much longer the "war of the currents" would have lasted, if Thomas Edison had known about the "joule thief" circuit in the 1800's!!!
Robert,
Your channel is what's good about the internet. Thanks, I find your optimism to be uplifting.
wow - cheers ate and thank you for taking the time to post
I've wound a metal core but not sure which wire goes where? Advice would be appreciated.
Thanks for sharing your work
Yes I want to know more about them.
Really good circuits are the ones that are very forgiving of the selection of component values. Circuits that work no matter how much they are abused.
The joule thief is a good example!e, its basically a blocking oscillator. For years now, I have used this circuit configuration with step down transformers in reverse, as high voltage generators for all sorts of applications, such as power supplies for Geiger Muller tubes, spark generators and bridge wire exploders for rocket motor ignition ( vaporising nichrome wire fuses). A transformer with a 9-0-9 or 6-0-6 volt secondary output, with a mains voltage rated primary, is easy to wire in reverse in a joule thief configuration. Connecting a 9 volt, pp3 size battery to the low voltage side of the transformer and fitting a rectifier voltage doubled to what was the mains side of the transformer can deliver an output DC voltage of close to a 1000 volts. ( The crest factor of the switching voltage giving more than that a sine wave would generate.) The circuit is very forgiving and works with a wide range of component values. As the mains transformers tend to self oscillate at high audio frequencies, there is a very satisfying high frequency whine that comes from the transformer when operating. This falls in frequency to a low buzz as it charges the output capacitor. One of my exploder configurations delivers approximately 20.5 joules at 800 volts DC. This is sufficient to vaporise the tip of a screwdriver shorted across the output contacts. Needless to say a one inch length of fine nichrome wire, is instantly vaporised with a bang when switched across the output, even at the end of a long length of twin flex bell cable.
The circuit can be refined to make it even more robust with the addition of a few extra passive components, AC coupling across the transistor base bias resistor, while increasing the resistor value, protecting the circuit against shorting of the high voltage output, protecting the transistor from high current spikes associated with stopping the oscillation. Addition of a reverse biased diodes on the base and collector can protect both from any high voltage spikes and excess reverse voltages.
(These small V-0-V output transformers were common place in the mains supply back-up of 1970s transistor radios, wired in half bridge configurations.)
that is an awesome post mate and thanks for writing it - I totally agree with your sentiments here
ha ha ' the joule thief ' yes, and ' hole flow ' of electrons in semi-conductors, or, as one of my electronics instructors said, about teaching us resistors...' he is alone in the world ' with a heavy irish accent, i still laugh when i hear Jack Kearney....good day in england, sir, from central alberta canada
So glad you covered this, because I have an idea to use a joule thief as an electro-static discharge device or ESD device with no need for a ground wire! Just an LED or something to dissipate the stored energy through work! Do you think this is a possibility?
Really interesting, thanks 👍
what happens if you turn it into an LC circut?
Great video as always - thanks
Glad you enjoyed it
Nice to see you plaing with JT... trying to charge a capacitor. discharge it by short circuit, then recharge it ... etc... When I did it, with each recharge the capacitor charged faster ...
I was just reading about these. Do you know what would happen if you ran 2 or 3 chained in a series?
Very good!
Sure you can get it to work easily, but tuning your circuit will ALWAYS increase efficiency.
yep you are absolutely right but that's not the point here - quite a few folks have problems getting it to work at all and even more believe they have to replicate exactly - which is just not right in my mind
@@ThinkingandTinkering true enough. Making it accessible to everyone is definitely the first hurdle.👍
@@ThinkingandTinkering go rob you statment is so true your boy is getting the hang of this youtube stuff also
@@brandonboulton2776 cheers mate - I really agree with that
@@ambersmith6517 lol - isn't he though - I was pretty impressed by his last video - he is most definitely getting there lol
Awesome video Robert these circuits are very interesting and can learn alot just from experimenting with them I hope to see you build an ssg and revive some dead batteries also the ssg circuit if you place a capacitor on the run battery side and charge battery in the charge side give it a spin with a drill and you have a bedini wind generator cheers mate :)
Anyone try a piezo element across the battery or capacitor of a joule thief
Great Video !
Glad you enjoyed it
Awesome explanation about Joule Thieves!
Thank you kindly!
This is awesome. Would this be something similar to how people run three phase on a 240v supply mate? Thanks though really interesting
You can use a flat bifilar spiral with air core.
There's a lot of nice optimizations, like instead of having the output of the LED go to ground, send it to the source. It is then at higher voltage than the source so it will go right back into the circuit.
Hey Rob, just been thinking about that clever Relay motor braking circuit -- was wondering if anyone inventive like yourself as ever used that concept to do the 'opposite' i.e. switching relays or perhaps getting capacitors to switch relays to 'amplify' or at least change the waveform of a generating voltage/current ? Not 100% sure if the question even makes sense but sometimes naïveity can sometimes stumble into around something less naïve, haha at least i hope
Make one out of a relay normally closed contact inline with the coil but be careful
nice idea ate - cheers
Thats a nice useful little beastie ... should work out well enough to fool my scr, so weird how your timing works out for my projects, uncanny really.
I would just like to ask here amongst some of you...
What do you all think is the best application for a Joule Theif?
Solar battery trickle charge maybe?
Intermittent laser blaster drive for surface cleaning metals of rust or whatnot?
Also, has anyone here happened to work out efficiencies of a finely tuned joule thief circuit in its bare bones, or in general as a whole?
Those are just some of my questions and ideas, but I'm curious as to see if anyone has any more. I feel like asking questions is the best way to start good meaningful conversation(s) and topic discussion(s). 😁
And let me take a moment to thank Rob here for having this passion and tenacity to keep posting these lovely videos!! You're doing a jolly good 'ol job, mate! Cheers to you and your endeavors ☕👌😄
I use it for peltier powered LED's. When using only body heat the voltage produced is too low for even Joule thiefs using typical silicon transistors to work. Vintage germanium transistors can boost from as low as 0.1V.
Morning Rob, I get 5 days to work on things as we got a snap lockdown. Lol Australia where tennis is more important than the average Joe on the street.
ah well you get five days of concentration mate! - always a bright side lol
A nut works but not very efficient. I remember Big Clive converting a torch light bulb he managed to fit the circuit and a white led inside the bulb. He used a tiny ferrite bead and very thin enameled wire.
I had issues getting the coil polarity correct every time I try to build one. LOL Never get it right the fist time.
I wonder if you could use a circuit like that to perform cheap electrolysis. You got my brain going now you rascal ;)
Does the battery discharge quicker
I dunno
Hmmm...
This is a wonderful, and versatile circuit.
I seem to have missed your intent of this video.
it's a stepping stone
Put an AM radio next to it and you get some mad sounds.
..... An AM radio is actually an essential tool when working with a variety of electronic equipment. I first used one to do the ignition timing for the earlier Kettering ignition cars . Later along with the FM the radio was useful for RC model hobbies for gauging faults in transmitters . ......
...
Sorry for the duplicate post, didn't realize I was posting from my "non-member" account. :) @Rob fascinating as always... Not sure how you do it, but as random as these subjects seem to pop up, they also seem to answer the very question I've been pondering.. It's uncanny! Now I'm off to look at that patent, hope it's what I'm hoping it is as it will avoid a lot of head-scratching!
Search " crazy jt circuit " on UA-cam.... resonance mskes volts go up with more leds
Just for fun, wonder if you can make it work with an air core inductor.
There's no requirement for a solid core. Hackaday project 160271 shows a coil etched on a PCB.
Yes it works
Big Clive claimed that he invented the Joule thief.
Actually, he only claimed to coin the term, which he did in an on-line 2002 "how-to", 3 years after Kaparnik's article that mates an LED to a self-oscillating voltage booster.
Clive goes out of his way to credit people he gets ideas/info from, and definitely credited Kaparnik in that posting.
Question;
Tesla captret to a home made crystal battery( and or home made super capacitor to a joule thief to power a led, would it work indefinitely? I've a small glass nic nac id like to light from underneath and not plug in or change a battery
Another Idea;
Earth power like a earth battery? To a joule thief to power all these solar led lights that won't charge in my garden, I've plenty low voltage wire to string em to
Tesla captret to a
Super capacitors to a
Crystal battery to a
Joule thief to a
Tuneable oscillator to a
Electromagnet ( a coil ) to
Replace the magnet in a hendershot generator
So the bias can be set correct to eliminate fire hazard?
That's Hadleys take on a
New Improved Hendershot Generator.
I wonder what would happen if you used LEDs in a bridge rectifier
they would light up and rectify
@@ThinkingandTinkering and you would probably drop a few bolts right but it does that anyways doesn't it
Nice. The same principle is widely used in what is called a step up converter. It usually is better controlled and has a well defined output voltage but certainly the principle is the same. It will convert to for example 24V when you only have 9V available.
What you could do and is quite interesting is to use a relay to do that. Wire it up like an old fashioned door bell, that is put the coil in series with the normally closed contact. It will oscillate. Then collect the high voltage spikes over the coil with a hv diode and high voltage capacitor over the coil. ( hv diode from microwave oven is ok, I'm sure you have it around. Capacitor from microwave oven is bad. It'll have a bleeding resistor in parallel which will prevent high voltage ). I think it will produce maybe hunderds of V. Maybe 1000 or more. Keep capacitor value below 100 nF as to not kill anyone. It would be a great video. Don't mention me. I couldn't care less.
.....the use of relays along those lines were called vibrator circuits rather than oscillator circuits . I remember the valve radios in cars required vibrator step up of voltage to operate the valves. I remember a project in our Australia Electronics magazine for replacing your vibrator circuit with a power transistor circuit . It's topsy turvy if you think it all through. I perceived the Japanese as being the first to introduce solid state car radios . In that period solid state meant semiconductor design cos it didn't have glass components. .Today solid state essentially means the contrary ie - use of glass , well as the electrolyte/separator material in the modern lithium batteries anyway ...
@@charlesdickens6706 Yes. It figures is is not an original idea though i did not know about these. I guess you're a bit older than I am. 54 ... Thanks for commenting.
hans is talking getting parts out of "junk" charles is from australia and old school these things are close to my heart some of those ozzys are just incredable "warpspeed poida mark wiseguy mack to name a few " any one who knows where to get parts has gained wisdom along the way if you guys ever post some where like thebackshed or any where else please let me know i would enjoy reading your thoughts on any subject this is especially true with the older generation we lose more every day of the ones with only comes from a life time of living wisdom back then when you was owed nothing and your word was truth if you didnt like something you rolled up you sleeves it once was known that bitching fixed nothing you know the ones that built and died for the things we take for granted we think our selfs smarter yet these things are not maintained we let them be taken little by little back then they knew freedom was providing every thing for yourself what you could not provide the community came together locally other things god would make a way threw a good freind neighbor or a church it would private no one would no and next time you would be that one keeping it to yourself no need for a big way to big den of vipers telling you how to live and robing you with out you realizing it there was some bad people that didnt see those words in the book of good news and truth clearly saying we are all equal one of the being done wrong warned that if you allow these horrible thing next it will be you pure wisdom now it is all of us just not as bad in some ways back then they new if you let things to be provided for them then the same gains control and freedom is lost having a business in a town was a privilege given from the people back then they knew latest new things dont bring happyness they knew to walk softly but carry a big stick they knew right from wrong and new life was a blessing they new what the new sears roebuck catalog coming in the mail was good for they new it was wrong to hate others you dont see eye to eye with they prayed for and helped people they didnt agree with they knew all peoply have right not given there creator not gov them bad people in town was the ones that didnt care if everyone knew they smoked some herb and got a little rowdy after drinking white lightning on the weekends they knew that god bible roof plenty food a loving family good friends helping others in need and freedom was the things that was good and brought happyness they opened doors for said yes mam to knew women where diff from man not unequal to they had the most important job there ever was or ever will be that few or no man can do a women was to be put on a petestal appreciated loved and treasured we have very little happyness always bussy and are good at complaining we have no answers and the older generation has no purpose in nursing homes they go we are to bussy they have nothing of value to add our problems are new nothing like they lived threw i know most will not give them the time of day there are a few that are not completely blind like myself i see well enough to know i cant see nothing i am ranting about myself by the way i never see until its to late i can see my grandpaw shaking his head say there is no use get a big smile and tell a joke to quikly change the subject some saying are just truth the only thing we learn from history is we learn nothing from history tell me how we are better off sorry for rant rob is trying to teach how to learn and encourage and this downer dont belong here but i guess that is way it is called a rant sorry to all offended
Can you make a video how a fly back transformer work, why it work and how it is wound up, what to do if you want to make your own Flyback transformer. I want to create a bigger version of fly back transformer. I want to use it to power high current applications like an electric stove, gyser, iron and so on. Please my brother from another mother 🙏
Good video. Good luck
Thanks, you too!
@UC04cdP4OJPkCgWQQ3i7QG2g it was the good luck part that threw me off.... that would be like wishing Bruce Lee luck in a fight.....riiiigghhyyyT
Love you buddy
@@MaintenanceMouse So let me understand now you still have problems with my viewing time and when I commented I now have problems with what I said. Stop, take care of it
@@Inventive101 he doesn't need luck....
But after seeing your channel, maybe you do?
What is this Rade-ee-o you speak of?😁
Try using a veriac
cheers mate
I find if a person has a stronger interest in Bedini circuits than they do just standard solid state joule thief/boost circuits, it's a good litmus test that they don't know what they're talking about. Measuring voltage in vs voltage out and leaping to the assumption that free power is being generated is a huge red flag. You, of course, passed the test and got a subscribe long ago.
It's funny that you compair the jeweltheif to the Bedini SSG motor, when it does absolutely no mechanical work at the same time as being a "buck boost" converter. The coil is a major part of a "aether pump", and the jewletheif is pathetic when it comes to its coil size.
That is what I see.
(Check out my bedini tributes on my channel please for more info)
I thumbs upped at 3secs in.... I’m winning
awesome lol
@@ThinkingandTinkering vacuum tube jule thief...LOL ok
The energy going in is always more than the recovered energy so what is the point of Joule Thief circiut when it consumes energy ? I dont get it sorry if its just for fun ok cool.
You can get *all* of the energy out of a non-rechargeable cell that would otherwise get thrown away.
it basically boosts the voltage from an unusable to usable level - so allows scavenging from low voltage sources like partially discharged batteries and thermoelectric generators
@@ThinkingandTinkering ok i got it.
Robert ive been doing electronics for 45 years and still into it.
Ok so you lost me at the collapse of the fiald..... it's constantly collapsing? Are you using ac or dc?... the way I always thought, it was the electrons inducing a fiald in the rod or ring. Eventually an electro magnet, and inducing electrons in the next coil the more tuns the higher volt lower amp, less turns lower volt higher amp. What am i missing?
.......essentially the magnetic field might require say ½ a millisecond to build up to full strength. However when disconnected from the power the field collapses much quicker ,say ½ a micro second , that's a thousand times faster to unload all that energy than it built up under say 12 volts potential. Conservation of energy means it unloads at a thousand times increased voltage if energy remains constant ideally. Nothing is ideal so it'll result in maybe around 400 volts resulting from the initial 12 volts applied ( maybe the collapse is 10 microseconds duration , I was guessing ). This used to happen in the primary windings of old Kettering ignition automotive coils, then that 400 volts would be stepped up to 30k volts by the secondary of the coils (they are transformers ). As for modern cars, I'm just not up to speed.and the wiring diagrams are not useful . I'd guess modern cars are along the lines of cdi .
no such thing as etectrons my friend try looking at it like this magnetism amps is same thing everything wants to be equal with everything around it the magnetism want to be equal with the things around it it will leak out with the path of least resistants the mor turns on output the more paths the votage is the speed of the magnetism leaking out on the input coil batt side the path of least resistants is into the core intill it is full when core is full if out put coil not hooked into anything the coil can not leak the magnetisom out so the input coil heating up is path of least resistance we call that a short i hope this has helped some one i am horrable at explaining things but so many closed doors will open when you think like i tryed to explain instead of in sothing that dont exist
@@ambersmith6517 I've never heard such things in chemistry, small engines, or any other science classes in school.... you're saying there are no electrons around the nucleus of an atom, and no free electrons in a conductor.... I understand it's an old theory and we can't really see them to tell if they are really what we think they are. But last I learned they were calling it an electron cloud, and we have been observing atomic properties for thousands of years.
Sorry, but where did you learn this? I feel as if someone just told me the earth is flat, and I just can't get behind it.
@@charlesdickens6706 ok, I get it... I didn't realize he only powered it for a second.... Kinda like a stater, or distributor coil. it reminds me of a demonstration my small engines teacher showed the class. He ran a 12v car battery through a coil, on a metal table with a rod in it. Every one formed a chain, one person touches the rod, and the last person touches the table... even though its a large volt no one feels it till someone let's go.... of course as soon as I heard that I had to be the one to do it first.
Couldn't you just wind it around the nail and then bend the nail around in a torroid?
I wonder what effect it would have bending it round?
@@sarahhoward9081 it will work. I got this circuit to work using an M6 nut but it won't be very efficient.
yeah for sure - it would be quite like a flyback transformer then as the 'toroid' would have a gap in it
@@ThinkingandTinkering unless you spot weld it...
Er sollte genau zeigen,nich so viel reden!
Ich habe genau gezeigt.
Hi Rob, do you believe Bedini,s claims on the school girl motor, I have no success at all, kind regards 😷😷😷🍺🍺🍺😂😂😂
well I have my opinion on I tm mate - but it's just that - my opinion - who knows if I am right or not - I don't cheers
Ah, the Joule Thief. Fascinating until you understand it. And your comment about rubbish is prescient. Everything is rubbish until it isn't.
for sure lol