To really distinguish between Legion and Shatterpoint I would love for Legion units to be bigger and more epic. Increasing the core unit cap from 6-8, and 1200 points instead of 800 for a standard game would really help you get the "flavor of each army or Faction Identity that you mentioned in another video" with a massive droid army vs smaller elite Clone forces or more Imp Armor vs Rebels with endless tricks up their sleeve, not to mention more units, in general, would be awesome. Way more epic.
i will be looking for your video that resume the ministravaganza, you always really professional on the news delivery, always on time! thank you for your passion!
I am excited for the news about legion, I have heard a bunch of crazy rumors so it will be nice to hear what is actually coming. I also hope they show us more units and not just more details on the ones they have already. previewed I think the apocalypse model is amazing so I am excited to see it. I am also curious what other models are coming up and if there will be more details there. Shatterpoint is meh, but I think that is largely due to the system they chose to implement for it.
I don't know whether Legion will get any major announcements, but I think my main hopes are Gungans and Hutt Cartels. I just hope AMG keeps going strong with it. I don't have any interest in Shatterpoint, primarily because of the scale. I prefer smaller minis with large environments. To that end, I also like spec ops for small-scale stuff, I just wish teams were more configurable.
Unfortunately I'm done with Xwing and atomic mass games. It left such a bad taste in my mouth I'll probably never invest in another game by them again. They should have just ended those games from the beginning instead of teasing us along the way. That's not the way to get loyal followers.
If they are done with it then that's fine. What I didn't like is they release 2 new factions for armada then killed it. Xwing they say they are doing upgraded reprints then kill it. Legions next I'm guessing.
@@blindman9997 I’m already half done with my homebrew, cooking it like chili. Almost done, uses MOST of AMG’s new ‘schtuff’ but I ‘refined’ list building & I ‘created’ a key for generics and limited ships for generic and limited upgrade cards, more akin to 2.0 🤗 multiplay/quick build cards and Vader in defender are ‘properly’ centered for ‘other’ than standard play. Huge ships work just fine as well… There is no kings stamp on our toys. Just remember that and have a good time! (Make something that works for you and a friend, don’t worry about Legion, I’m pretty sure that’s AMG’s ‘bread & butter’ for the last two years)
I think it is time to speak with our wallets. If we embargo AMG, maybe they will realize that they made a mistake canceling some of our favorite games. I know tons of people who completely stopped buying Games Workshop products, and I think once these companies go out of business because of their decisions they may realize they needed to actually make the products that customers actually want. I do enjoy Legion, but I can live without buying any more Legion from this point on.
They canceled X Wing and Armada because they weren't making enough/any money. You're not going to get them to bring the games back by not giving them money.
@dpenn89 That is true, but it is more a message to the gaming industry as a whole. We will stop supporting companies that don't support the games we want. I think that is perfectly fair honestly. We are the reason they are in business to begin with after all.
Really looking forward to these streams. I really think they are going to announce second edition for Legion.... It's a great opportunity since they are re-sculpting the original starter boxes.
@andyablluxembourg8627 OK, just pointing out that XWing and Armada players are not 100% going to ignore AMG because our favorite games weren't profitable anymore. There's no "us" here.
I think Key Operations could be introducing scenario play to Shatterpoint. I always loved the old Lord of the Rings scenarios, where you had set layouts, teams, objectives. This could absolutely work for Shatterpoint. - Maybe along with certain terrain pieces as releases too (Like MCPs Hydra tank and Crisis battles. ) Maybe a pack of tile layouts for the Death Star escape and a scenario there?
Don’t despair, buy some hot wheels and play gaslands. Just wait for 3.0, I would presume… like they were planning on ‘obfuscating’ with the whole dang time….
Can't wait for the Legion reveals. Also, gotta love all the salt; people feel the need to click a video they have no legitimate interest in just to shit-talk. The entitlement is real. Like I get being upset because your game got canned (hi, I have owned X-Wing and Armada collections too), but it kinda disgusts me that people default to being spiteful when the games getting shelved was a CLEAR CONSEQUENCE of the financial fallout of their parent companies. Do I approve of their every choice? No. But do I think they're the devil because they got dealt a bad hand financially? Also no. Games go out of production ladies and gentlemen, I promise this is not new, especially in trying financial times. Don't want to support AMG because of it? Cool! Shut up, act your age, and spend your money elsewhere instead of acting like a child throwing a tantrum for attention.
With that logic, no one should ever voice displeasure about any decision made by companies. Yes, speaking with the wallet is an important tactic, but it doesn’t have the specific effect you want. You get that by both not spending money AND voicing your frustration. The voicing it establishes a clear reason for the loss in sales. Otherwise, companies like AMG could look at the losses and say, “Well, guess miniature games don’t sell anymore, so let’s can the others within three to four years and design different ones.” That’s just spitballed example, but lack of clarity results in potentially wrong inferences. Also, I disagree with your assessment that the games were a bad hand to be dealt. X-Wing had taken a hit from the conversion kit costs, but the community was still very large and active. If you inherit a financial sinkhole, you don’t drag it on for YEARS and release a whole new ruleset to further fracture the community. They had a great opportunity to bring back the frustrated players and perhaps streamline conversion costs… but they didn’t do that. Instead, they did nothing of positive consequence and only NOW stop development. This IS actually how grown-ups react - someone does something stupid or harsh, and you’re gonna hear about it. The bigger the decision, the more you hear about it.
@@catchaaron why don't you tell it to AMG and not Crabbok, then? Because as it is you're not reaching your target audience. I see zero benefit from people saying "Fuck AMG" in Crabbok's comments section. I'm not sure you can say that a rules update is an attempt to fracture the player base is a good-faith argument. 2.0 trashed the community in a lot of places, 2.5 can easily be seen as a last gasp to breathe some life back into the dying areas. I'd argue Asmodee is to blame for removing the games from FFG. I don't think AMG can be fully held responsible to maintain the FFG standards on two games they had forced on them, likely without the resources to spend on them (clearly, since there's been no new molds for X-Wing in years). Not to mention the two OTHER games that got forced on them. Going from 1 to 5 games is difficult in the best of circumstances. But Crabbok has literally gone over the financial trouble that Asmodee has faced, so regardless of any pre-existing investment of time and resources AMG has been forced to trim the fat. In this case, it was the two lines that sold the least and cost the most to make. Again, I'm not saying I agree with every choice they've made, but the timing of the end these two games is a clearly financial choice. Let's not pretend this is a surprise or out of nowhere. This is not some super surprise back-stab, it was clearly telegraphed beforehand for years. Armada hasn't gotten anything new to speak of, so there should be no difference to anyone playing it except model availability If you wanna say bitching accomplishes something that's your opinion, I think actions do significantly more, but I think you can at least agree the bitching should be targeted at the company directly, not wasting space on videos done by content creators. Complaining about AMG in the comments section here does nothing but make it unpleasant for everyone.
@@ARCcommand you misunderstood my remark about the new ruleset - I never claimed it was their effort to trash the game - that’s just the unintended consequence of damaging a system that honestly didn’t need changing. 2.5 completely shifted the squad building nature to benefit an aces-only mindset, they added a ban list to target ships and cards that didn’t work with their new rules, and changed up same-initiative resolutions that frankly already had a baked in solution from the old points system. Let’s not forget that this dogfighting game now has Scenarios in which you could win a match in some of them WITHOUT EVER ATACKING THE ENEMY - not exactly dogfighting. 2.5, as Crabbok has noted before, is more in keeping with the hero-centric gameplay that AMG already has with MCP and Shatterpoint. In short, 2.5 was way too quick after 2.0 and changed the game in many ways into something it fundamentally wasn’t. You are over generalizing 2.0’s impact. Since we’re on Crabbok’s comment section, let’s note what he’s pointed out. First, the conversion packs made many large-collection players upset, due to cost for updating all they had. Very valid point there. Second, 1.0 builds were out of control with grossly overpowered ships, abilities, and older rules that needed addressing. It was so bad you never saw the iconic classic ships in squads unless they were flying Biggs, Palp Aces, or just wanted to goof off. They weren’t competitive due to the printed points value and insane strength of newer ships. Third, 2.0 DID fracture the community, but the rule changes and points overhaul were sorely needed. The rules weren’t the issue, cost of conversion was. Now, no one here griefing about AMG with X-Wing is down-voting Crabbok. If I’m wrong and some are, KNOCK IT OFF! That only hurts Crabbok’s channel and its ratings. If you think commenting only to AMG works, then you’re assuming they care about any/all comments pertaining to sunsetted games. You and I both know they don’t. That’s why communication has been so dismal from them the past couple years, and they told Crabbok “When there’s something to say about X-Wing and Armada, we’ll say it”. In other words, stop bothering us because we won’t answer. So where do you go to voice your frustration? Anywhere AMG might see it that isn’t its own forums or comments where they can remove them. It would be foolish to rage on a Games Workshop-based video, but pretty likely they’d see it here. Yeah, Armada wasn’t a surprise, but even Crabbok here has noted that X-Wing was a bit of a surprise. He’s also noted that conversations did exist about making cheaper models through sprues, but suddenly that was thrown out the window. I don’t think AMG wanted to kill it from the outset, but I do think that’s what ended up happening. For all of 2.0’s issues with the points app being buggy at first to the conversion costs, it wasn’t nearly as devastating internationally as 2.5 was. I completely agree that actions do significantly more… but why limit your frustration to just that? Voice it, boycott it, buy it, post about it, this isn’t a “only choose one option” here. To claim you can either complain or not buy is an either-or fallacy.
Road map for Shatter point and 2 streams. No road map for legion, just a discussion on future plans. 3 streams for crisis protocol. Yes AMG I can read between the lines. Sorry legion guys, seems you are getting the X wing 2.5 treatment and eventual drop.
@@ManiGonzales OK then lets see what they got. I always wanted a horde of Storm Troopers. But the way they handled Armada left a bad impression. I still will never support shatter point.
As a father of 6, I approve of your dad jokes!
To really distinguish between Legion and Shatterpoint I would love for Legion units to be bigger and more epic. Increasing the core unit cap from 6-8, and 1200 points instead of 800 for a standard game would really help you get the "flavor of each army or Faction Identity that you mentioned in another video" with a massive droid army vs smaller elite Clone forces or more Imp Armor vs Rebels with endless tricks up their sleeve, not to mention more units, in general, would be awesome. Way more epic.
I hope that they don't make the same mistake that they made in X-Wing! That would be traumatizing!
When I read the title I thought bless you, then I realized what it was
i will be looking for your video that resume the ministravaganza, you always really professional on the news delivery, always on time! thank you for your passion!
I am excited for the news about legion, I have heard a bunch of crazy rumors so it will be nice to hear what is actually coming. I also hope they show us more units and not just more details on the ones they have already. previewed
I think the apocalypse model is amazing so I am excited to see it. I am also curious what other models are coming up and if there will be more details there.
Shatterpoint is meh, but I think that is largely due to the system they chose to implement for it.
During their 5 year retrospective I bet they don’t mention Armada!
Thanks for the continued info and heads up on everything in the industry! I always look forward to your videos 😀 Keep the Force Alive!
Excited but wary for the Legion news. I reeeeaaallly hope they get it right, but they haven’t always been on the right side of things
Pst gungans
It will be interesting to see what AMG shows us.
No way to get a Venator. 😢 looks like I’m doubling down on 3D printing.
Didn’t know about Spec-Ops, I’ll have to read up on it.
So excited for the Legion news!
I don't know whether Legion will get any major announcements, but I think my main hopes are Gungans and Hutt Cartels.
I just hope AMG keeps going strong with it. I don't have any interest in Shatterpoint, primarily because of the scale. I prefer smaller minis with large environments. To that end, I also like spec ops for small-scale stuff, I just wish teams were more configurable.
Very excited for the Legion news! I'm hoping that the Shatterpoint news changes up ways to play the game to spice things up more
I am literally afraid of what they might say about Legion. I'm afraid that AMG will mess it up.
Awesome
Wonder if this is where they announce legion 2.0
Unfortunately I'm done with Xwing and atomic mass games. It left such a bad taste in my mouth I'll probably never invest in another game by them again. They should have just ended those games from the beginning instead of teasing us along the way. That's not the way to get loyal followers.
Definitely don’t try turning to games workshop. Treatment of fans is abysmal with them
Gaslands! MUD in your eye AMG!!!
(ScreeeeeeeecccCCCCCcccchhhhhh)
If they are done with it then that's fine.
What I didn't like is they release 2 new factions for armada then killed it.
Xwing they say they are doing upgraded reprints then kill it.
Legions next I'm guessing.
@@blindman9997 I’m already half done with my homebrew, cooking it like chili. Almost done, uses MOST of AMG’s new ‘schtuff’ but I ‘refined’ list building & I ‘created’ a key for generics and limited ships for generic and limited upgrade cards, more akin to 2.0 🤗 multiplay/quick build cards and Vader in defender are ‘properly’ centered for ‘other’ than standard play. Huge ships work just fine as well…
There is no kings stamp on our toys. Just remember that and have a good time!
(Make something that works for you and a friend, don’t worry about Legion, I’m pretty sure that’s AMG’s ‘bread & butter’ for the last two years)
Will the streams be on Twitch or UA-cam?
I believe Twitch starting out then eventually UA-cam.
Hyped about Legion
I think it is time to speak with our wallets. If we embargo AMG, maybe they will realize that they made a mistake canceling some of our favorite games. I know tons of people who completely stopped buying Games Workshop products, and I think once these companies go out of business because of their decisions they may realize they needed to actually make the products that customers actually want. I do enjoy Legion, but I can live without buying any more Legion from this point on.
They canceled X Wing and Armada because they weren't making enough/any money. You're not going to get them to bring the games back by not giving them money.
@dpenn89 That is true, but it is more a message to the gaming industry as a whole. We will stop supporting companies that don't support the games we want. I think that is perfectly fair honestly. We are the reason they are in business to begin with after all.
Hoping for some cool updates for legion!
Just wondering. What was the road map for armada right before they killed it a few years ago.
Legion ‘full scale battles’ = 1200 points?
Really looking forward to these streams. I really think they are going to announce second edition for Legion.... It's a great opportunity since they are re-sculpting the original starter boxes.
Is Ministravaganza only a online even/stream ?
Not really interested in AMG anymore.
Ministravaganza does not interest us anymore, amg can forget any armada and xwing player paying any interest to them anymore!
Alright cool, legion shatterpoint and mcp players are still interested 🥰
@@riverbean18 your time will come ;-)
X-Wing refugee here: I'm very much excited for Legion updates.
@@dpenn89 i'm happy for you, but i'm just sad about my 2 beloved games
@andyablluxembourg8627 OK, just pointing out that XWing and Armada players are not 100% going to ignore AMG because our favorite games weren't profitable anymore. There's no "us" here.
I am really interested in what happens next with legion.
I am not interested in shatter point or MCP. I will catch legions updates later.
I am kind of curious to see the turn out for this.
Translated to, ‘ooooooo a piece of candy…’
🙄
Can’t wait for some new legion models
Definitely looking forward to the new Legion details to come out!
I think Key Operations could be introducing scenario play to Shatterpoint. I always loved the old Lord of the Rings scenarios, where you had set layouts, teams, objectives. This could absolutely work for Shatterpoint. - Maybe along with certain terrain pieces as releases too (Like MCPs Hydra tank and Crisis battles. )
Maybe a pack of tile layouts for the Death Star escape and a scenario there?
Fuck AMG, I'm out and taking my money elsewhere
Don’t despair, buy some hot wheels and play gaslands. Just wait for 3.0, I would presume…
like they were planning on ‘obfuscating’ with the whole dang time….
Can't wait for the Legion reveals.
Also, gotta love all the salt; people feel the need to click a video they have no legitimate interest in just to shit-talk. The entitlement is real.
Like I get being upset because your game got canned (hi, I have owned X-Wing and Armada collections too), but it kinda disgusts me that people default to being spiteful when the games getting shelved was a CLEAR CONSEQUENCE of the financial fallout of their parent companies. Do I approve of their every choice? No. But do I think they're the devil because they got dealt a bad hand financially? Also no. Games go out of production ladies and gentlemen, I promise this is not new, especially in trying financial times.
Don't want to support AMG because of it? Cool! Shut up, act your age, and spend your money elsewhere instead of acting like a child throwing a tantrum for attention.
With that logic, no one should ever voice displeasure about any decision made by companies. Yes, speaking with the wallet is an important tactic, but it doesn’t have the specific effect you want. You get that by both not spending money AND voicing your frustration. The voicing it establishes a clear reason for the loss in sales. Otherwise, companies like AMG could look at the losses and say, “Well, guess miniature games don’t sell anymore, so let’s can the others within three to four years and design different ones.” That’s just spitballed example, but lack of clarity results in potentially wrong inferences.
Also, I disagree with your assessment that the games were a bad hand to be dealt. X-Wing had taken a hit from the conversion kit costs, but the community was still very large and active. If you inherit a financial sinkhole, you don’t drag it on for YEARS and release a whole new ruleset to further fracture the community. They had a great opportunity to bring back the frustrated players and perhaps streamline conversion costs… but they didn’t do that. Instead, they did nothing of positive consequence and only NOW stop development.
This IS actually how grown-ups react - someone does something stupid or harsh, and you’re gonna hear about it. The bigger the decision, the more you hear about it.
@@catchaaron why don't you tell it to AMG and not Crabbok, then? Because as it is you're not reaching your target audience. I see zero benefit from people saying "Fuck AMG" in Crabbok's comments section.
I'm not sure you can say that a rules update is an attempt to fracture the player base is a good-faith argument. 2.0 trashed the community in a lot of places, 2.5 can easily be seen as a last gasp to breathe some life back into the dying areas.
I'd argue Asmodee is to blame for removing the games from FFG. I don't think AMG can be fully held responsible to maintain the FFG standards on two games they had forced on them, likely without the resources to spend on them (clearly, since there's been no new molds for X-Wing in years). Not to mention the two OTHER games that got forced on them. Going from 1 to 5 games is difficult in the best of circumstances.
But Crabbok has literally gone over the financial trouble that Asmodee has faced, so regardless of any pre-existing investment of time and resources AMG has been forced to trim the fat. In this case, it was the two lines that sold the least and cost the most to make. Again, I'm not saying I agree with every choice they've made, but the timing of the end these two games is a clearly financial choice. Let's not pretend this is a surprise or out of nowhere. This is not some super surprise back-stab, it was clearly telegraphed beforehand for years. Armada hasn't gotten anything new to speak of, so there should be no difference to anyone playing it except model availability
If you wanna say bitching accomplishes something that's your opinion, I think actions do significantly more, but I think you can at least agree the bitching should be targeted at the company directly, not wasting space on videos done by content creators. Complaining about AMG in the comments section here does nothing but make it unpleasant for everyone.
@@ARCcommand you misunderstood my remark about the new ruleset - I never claimed it was their effort to trash the game - that’s just the unintended consequence of damaging a system that honestly didn’t need changing. 2.5 completely shifted the squad building nature to benefit an aces-only mindset, they added a ban list to target ships and cards that didn’t work with their new rules, and changed up same-initiative resolutions that frankly already had a baked in solution from the old points system. Let’s not forget that this dogfighting game now has Scenarios in which you could win a match in some of them WITHOUT EVER ATACKING THE ENEMY - not exactly dogfighting. 2.5, as Crabbok has noted before, is more in keeping with the hero-centric gameplay that AMG already has with MCP and Shatterpoint. In short, 2.5 was way too quick after 2.0 and changed the game in many ways into something it fundamentally wasn’t.
You are over generalizing 2.0’s impact. Since we’re on Crabbok’s comment section, let’s note what he’s pointed out. First, the conversion packs made many large-collection players upset, due to cost for updating all they had. Very valid point there. Second, 1.0 builds were out of control with grossly overpowered ships, abilities, and older rules that needed addressing. It was so bad you never saw the iconic classic ships in squads unless they were flying Biggs, Palp Aces, or just wanted to goof off. They weren’t competitive due to the printed points value and insane strength of newer ships. Third, 2.0 DID fracture the community, but the rule changes and points overhaul were sorely needed. The rules weren’t the issue, cost of conversion was.
Now, no one here griefing about AMG with X-Wing is down-voting Crabbok. If I’m wrong and some are, KNOCK IT OFF! That only hurts Crabbok’s channel and its ratings. If you think commenting only to AMG works, then you’re assuming they care about any/all comments pertaining to sunsetted games. You and I both know they don’t. That’s why communication has been so dismal from them the past couple years, and they told Crabbok “When there’s something to say about X-Wing and Armada, we’ll say it”. In other words, stop bothering us because we won’t answer. So where do you go to voice your frustration? Anywhere AMG might see it that isn’t its own forums or comments where they can remove them. It would be foolish to rage on a Games Workshop-based video, but pretty likely they’d see it here.
Yeah, Armada wasn’t a surprise, but even Crabbok here has noted that X-Wing was a bit of a surprise. He’s also noted that conversations did exist about making cheaper models through sprues, but suddenly that was thrown out the window. I don’t think AMG wanted to kill it from the outset, but I do think that’s what ended up happening. For all of 2.0’s issues with the points app being buggy at first to the conversion costs, it wasn’t nearly as devastating internationally as 2.5 was.
I completely agree that actions do significantly more… but why limit your frustration to just that? Voice it, boycott it, buy it, post about it, this isn’t a “only choose one option” here. To claim you can either complain or not buy is an either-or fallacy.
No one cares anymore.
No, YOU don't care. Which leads to the question, why bother watching and commenting? Does putting down other people's hobbies bring you joy?
@@ARCcommand well, yeah!
Can’t wait for the talk on Shatterpoint and the new mando and bounty Hunter packs
I have been watching your older MCP videos and would love to see more coverage
Time to ruin legion starts in...
Who the hell even cares ? They destroyed the one game they were in charge of I cared about.
Road map for Shatter point and 2 streams. No road map for legion, just a discussion on future plans. 3 streams for crisis protocol. Yes AMG I can read between the lines. Sorry legion guys, seems you are getting the X wing 2.5 treatment and eventual drop.
Legion roadmap is Saturday at 9am
@@ManiGonzales OK then lets see what they got. I always wanted a horde of Storm Troopers. But the way they handled Armada left a bad impression. I still will never support shatter point.