Spent hours questioning my hookup of the spa, went through the whole troubleshooting list disconnecting pumps and retrying. You saved my night! Electrician wired it wrong. Thank you!!
Bought a like new 2017 jetsetter from a friend for 500 bucks(seem like a deal) anyways got it home got it set up and called a handy man to wire it all up 220, wiring all ran sub panel in and he calls and says keeps tripping breaker in sub panel when neutral is hooked up and it’s above his pay grade! This video is exactly what I needed to see!! He hays a 30amp and 20 amp in sub panel and not the one 50amp gfi breaker, so no place for neutral except to ground. Going to try and find the right breaker tomorrow and it should be fixed. Thank you for shedding light for us non electrical guys!
I laughed so hard when you said the electrician sometimes doesn't know any better but thank you for all your videos you do a good thing for us contractors out here trying to make a living I try to give work the best I can but sometimes I just need to go out at it myself to pay the bills
I found this video to be very informative I wired my spa Box exactly the way you told Me Too! To find out that I have A110 converted to 240 I had to call and get guidance from the spa company master spas that I needed to move the 3 white wires from the red AC to the white AC or I would be Popping the breaker in the sub Box once I switched those wires it no longer was tripping the fuse the fuse thanks for all your information I enjoyed your video very Informative
Good job. Nice short video and to the point. You messed me up at first when I seen 2 white conductors. But then you explained what you did to identify your ground conductor. Here in Canada the ground conductor is usually green or bare copper. Thanks for sharing this.
Yesterday I went to a service call , had about 80 volts to ground , disconnected every one at a time , pumps & heater . Found it was the heater, disconnected the heater. But here’s my question the breaker was wired correctly, at the hot tub there in no neutral connection terminal only the hots and the ground bar. Why doesn’t the breaker see the imbalance and ground? Why isn’t the water grounded via the pumps impeller shaft ? Why didn’t the breaker trip?
The neutral and ground MUST NOT be bonded at a sub-panel ( spa panel ). They should only be bonded at the main service panel. If you bond them anywhere other than the main service, the neutral return current now has multiple paths, including though your ground wire.
I hear you but will say that if you do not bond them you cannot make the system introduce voltage in the water of the tub and if you do not bond them I can introduce voltage.. My way it is impossible to put voltage in the water.. If you don't believe me let's do a video and you show me how your way is safer..
Thanks for posting this video...I had to go behind the guy who installes the GFCI breaker and properply land the nuetral to the GFCI breaker for the 120v control voltage.
I wired the hot tub correctly with a 2/50 amp gfi sub panel . The pump works the heater works the lights work but when i push the test buttton on the gfi breaker it does not trip. Any Suggestions
I followed your instructions perfectly but when I attach the wires to the hot tub, it trips the breaker at the main box in the house. The Gfc does not trip at all. Any suggestions? ThNks
I recently removed my hot tub, and the 220v wire is just left open in my backyard where the tub connection was there. Seeking suggestion, if I install a junction box to split this 220v to two 110v using one common neutral and one 110 hot to the black wire and the other 110 hot to the red wire. Or Should I completely replace the 50a GFCI Breaker. Thanks for all your videos.
Well made informative video. Slight criticism, you could slow down just a bit with explaining the wiring connections in the disconnect. The other criticism is the ground wire could have some green tape on it. Thank you
Good video, not sure how to get to all your videos that may shed some light on my issue. Here's my scenario: I have three wires coming from my house panel, but I have a four wire hot tub; it's a Hydroquip. I have 50A breaker at the sub with the pigtail. What is the proper way to wire when you are going from a 3-wire supply to a four wire tub. I ran a fourth wire, what I think should be a neutral, since there is a neutral slot in the pack. The breaker resets immediately when I turn on the outside breaker. I have disconnected every load, it still resets immediately upon trying to set the breaker. I have lifted the neutral wire from inside the sub box, which is on the same terminal strip as the pigtail. When I lifted the wire, the breaker sets, but there is nothing happening at the hot tub, no lights, no nothing. If you could direct me to a preexisting video; I am more of a visual person. If none available, I sure could use some guidance. Thanks for your help. Nick
I’m running a spa panel too but I have a split bus panel as my main that’s full I could use tendem breakers to make room my idea is to put move the hot water heater to the lighting section then take the 60 amp from the lighting section to use for the hot tub in place we’re the water heater breaker was then put a 70 amp for the lighting section the wires for it are already 4 gauge. Is this idea ok or do I need to replace the panel? The service lines are 200 amps I noticed. Any advice I appreciate.🤩👍
Question: My new spa requires a 4 wire 40amp connection.. I could only find 30 and 60 amp disconnects... I have a 40amp gfci breaker going in the panel, I intend to install a 6/4 wire to that 40amp gfci in the panel, then run that to a 60amp non-fuse disconnect breaker, then a 6/4 from that disconnect to the spa connection. Incase I ever get a new tub that requires a 50amp instead of 40 the wire will be sufficient. Does that sound correct? Is it typical to only find 30 and 60 amp disconnect switches?
Spa Guy, Need to wire up a hot tub, but location does not allow the 5 foot minimum distance between hot tub and GFI box. Heard that a barrier may allow to pass inspection, but no easy way to do that either. Would adding a waterproof plastic electrical box and mounting the spa disconnect inside count as a barrier and pass inspection?
Great video appreciated. I think my test button is actually pushed in and stuck. Still trouble shooting to see if the hot tub is fine, heater pump etc but I am sure it is. Is there a way to pop it back out or just replace the breaker? I keep pushing it to pop it out but there is no movement in the button. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Spa Guy NEC says that after the main breaker the neutral bar is not to be bonded. This is considered a sub panel so the bonding wire has to be removed.
Ehouse 29 The spa guy keeps making that mistake bonding the neutral on sub panels, hopefully 1 day he will take a minute to read the NEC and understand that’s not correct.
@@franciscosanchez2779 i see him do this and see his comments about it and i shake my head too. I enjoy his channel and content but he just wont admit this isnt to code and could make people hook up their own tub and get a failed inspection or even cause someone to have problems.
Our hot tub was working fine and suddenly started carrying 7 volts in water even with all power off to the house. Haven’t found a technician that has been able to resolve it. Any advice would be helpful. Thanks!
I have a morgans hot tub. 3 wires red yellow and black. I grounded the yellow hooked up red and black. Everything worked and heated. After the breaker was off it popped and smoked. Now the box is hooked to the meter cause I dont have up to date breaker box in the house. Has twist in fuses. What could cause this?
Thanks for the helpful info. I had one question, my house doesn't have a 'neutral', just the two hots and a ground. What do I do with the 4th/neutral wire coming out of the tub? Just cap it?
My gcfi wont trip but sometimes one of the hot lines (black) in my case will go dead and not have any voltage. The panel will still get power and nothing trips off, just the pump stops running and heater of course. Reset GCFI and then everything works again, Im thinking the gcfi is starting to fail.
I have a GFCI question about adding additional equipment to a hot tub... I want to add a 120 volt blower system to a hot tub that does not have one. Can I install a GFCI 120 Outlet or any kind of GFCI breaker in between the GFCI breaker that is outside the hot tub cabinet or would I have to install its own service? Basically what I'm asking is will a 120 GFCI breaker work if it is inside the loop of the 240 GFCI breaker that is on the outside of the hot tub on the pole?
@@SpaGuy i was also thinking of making the switch a variable dimmer type one as most blowers are super loud when on max because its 120v would a standard house type dimmer work? i dont think most blowers pull more than 15 amps? ever seen that type of modification?
Hello. My 230v pool pump does NOT have a neutral. It only have 2 loads and 1 ground. What do you recommend I use as a breaker? Since it has no neutral, should I even use a gfci? My main breaker box is an old one so ground and nuetral are bonded. My pool pump on high is 7.5 amp and on low its 2.1 amps. Thank you
Hello, I need some guidance. I replaced my spa. My old spa had 3 wires configuration (h,h,g), the new one is a 4 wires configuration (h,h,n,g). There is a gfci. My electrician connected a netrual wire directly from the main panel in the house to the spa to test. The gfci trips everytime we turn it on. Is this because he did not connect the netrual from the gfci or is there something wrong with the spa. Thank you for your help.
I have a hot springs jetsetter, 3-wire system. Directions tell me to hook it to a 20 amp GFI. Unfortunately my box has one Ground Bar, not a separate ground and neutral bar sure. What do I do?
on the feed side of the GFCI ground and neutral are the same.. The white wire get to the neutral bar and ground to the ground even though they are shorted together.. If it is a 115V use a 20A GFCI and put the curly wire here the other white wires are.. The GFCI does the work from there..
so i have a 3 wire sundance it worked just fine off a gen now that i have it wired into the gfci its tripping as soon as the breaker is turned on... so 4 wire sub panel to disconnect then 3 wire disconnect to tub Feed RED - Hot lug Black - Hot lug White - neutral bar lug Green - Ground bar Load RED - Hot terminal on breaker Black - terminal on breaker White - capped both ends Green - Ground bar White pigtail - neutral bar and the bonding rod installed correct? i have seen some videos where the bonding rod is not installed but they just connected all the green and white to the neutral bar which is the same thing if the bonding rod is installed?
found my own problem.... thats what i get for buying a disconnect box/GFCI breaker 2nd hand for $20 vs the 100 at the DIY stores...it was a bad GFCI breaker!!! it was wired right...heres how i found it ..if u wanta test to see if your GFCI breaker is actually working disconnect the loads from it or disconnect the load lines on the tub, and try just truing on the breaker by itself no load on it if it still trips the breaker has to be bad
I love your videos, thanks for sticking with it. I'm about to install a new spa panel, it will have a 50 AMP CFGI for the tub but the panel has two more spaces for circuits. I'd like to install a 15amp (AFCI) circuit to power a plug on the far end of my yard (20 feet from the spa). Is there any issue installing another circuit in the spa disconnect panel? I can feed the panel with a dbl 60AMP since I used 6/3 wire.
This question is not pertaining to a home owner. As someone who refurbishes various hot tubs, I am wondering what you do about your gfci breaker feeds for various tubs. Do you just use a 60 amp gfci for all tubs or do you change out the breaker depending on the load of each specific tub? Is it bad to oversized the breaker for testing purposes? I often see tubs that need a 40, 50 and 60 amp breaker.
Most tubs use a 50 amp GFCI and That is what I would normally use for all tubs.. a 60amp need is very rare and would be something like a swim spa usually.. Many tubs especially with Balboa controls can me used with 3-4 pumps by using the dip switches to set the heater to turn off when the 3 or 4 pump comes on.. In those cases you could do a 60amp and allow the pumps to run with the heater.. Another thing is the length of the wire and wire gauge.. 6 gauge wire is good for up to 55 amps on a normal run and some would say 65amps on a short run.. so 50amp is standard in my opinion and I rarely see a 40 or 60.. Also local code would be another consideration.. a tub with as 5.5 heater and a 3hp pump would pull 34 amps so a 40 would work with 8 gauge wire but I don't think using a 50 with 6 gauge would be an issue.. The other thing is what if someone buys a one pump tub and later wants a 2 pump running 6 gauge and a 50 amp breaker would cover both tubs.. Every now and then you will find a 2 pump tub with a 5.5 heater with (2) large hp pumps lets say 16 amp.. 16+16+22= 54 which is at the upper ability for a 6 gauge wire and would need a 60 amp breaker unless you set the heater to go off when pump 2 comes on.. Just note it would be rare for a tub to have (2) 16 amp motors but they are out there.. Thanks, Spa Guy
@@SpaGuy thanks for the input 👍. It’s always great learning from someone with lots of time and experience. You do a great job on your videos I hope to see them continue. Have a great day.
Hey Spa Guy, we have an Air Conditioner box outside, can we hook into that box to get our 220or 240 volts need for the hot tub or do I need to run a whole new complete line from the box?
I am setting up mine too but another idea i thauhgt of is installing a 240 volt outlet I have one for outdoor rated and put a groung fault breaker avove it and then do the reast from the house as usal. than wire a 240 volt plug to the hot tub and plug it in.
What happens if I do not have a neutral wire from the main breaker to the GFI box? I am trying to use an existing circuit that has a 40 amp breaker and the white wire is not connected. this circuit use to go to an air conditioner... Thanx a bunch
Hi, I came home and the breaker in the house, the house main as well as the hot tub gcfi was tripped. My heater died and needed to be replaced. Should this happen? How would it get past the GCFI outside? I have a Sundance. I checked all wiring in GCFI, looks good, test works. Only thing I don't know is what happens to the white neutral that leaves the GCFI to the spa pack.
My GFI test button started to get stuck and I have to mess with the on/off position to get it out and get the tub to get power again. It is now stuck and won't come out and tub does not get any power.
How do I verify after install that the GFCI part of the breaker is wired properly to work in case something goes wrong? In the video you mentioned that it will still work as a breaker if you only ran the 3 wires but not 4 wires, so I am wondering how to make sure that the GFI will trip if needed. Thanks!
You should still have neutral from the house connected to piggyback from GFCI on insulated bar; it will still work as GFCI even there is no neutral to control box of the spa. Is better to not to have neutral in the control box if not used; sometimes it works like inductor and can cause tripping
Hey Spa Guy. Love all your videos sir. Especially when u repo the tubs solo. U are the man bro. Hey I was wondering where I can find a cover to the spa pack u have in this video. I got a 2007 coleman 481 from a friend but that cover is missing. I tried contacting Balboa havent got a response. Any idea where I can find one?
Great video, love how clear and concise it is! I have a Jacuzzi tub with no neutral. You commented that because of this the GFCI will not work as a GFCI. Should I have a GFCI in the main panel then? Currently it does not. Thanks!
They say house a GFCI even with that system and just don't use the neutral cap it off.. I don't what the purpose it is but if you get an electrical inspection they might require it..
You don't need a neutral from the device to the tub if the tub doesn't require it, just from the panel (where you get power for the tub from). The gfci device uses the neutral to detect current imbalances (ground faults) and that's how it protects the tub and those inside it.
@@MrJonSchell Sir are you saying if installing a Sundance Hot Tub that only requires 3 wire I should wire 4 wire to the spa disconnect box gfci and then 3 from the disconnect box to the tub?
@@josephgraham1065 correct. You could technically get it to work by putting the neutral tail under a ground screw (assuming it's grounded/bonded to the main panel) but that is most likely a code violation (have to keep your bonds and neutrals separate after your first disconnect). Also it's my experience that with that size of cable most places don't carry stock on the 2 wire version (you said 3 wire, we don't count the ground) so you'll have to buy the 3 wire version anyway and just tape the neutral wire in the spa pack and also hot tub control box
@@MrJonSchell thanks for answering me. So just to be clear I'm going to wire the sub panel to main box normally. Then only run 2 hots and ground to tub. Hook up pigtail to neutral bus inside sib panel. Thanks
Thank you for this video. I have had a few issues and has helped me work through them. But I am still a little stuck. 1st issue I had is I had a bad breaker in the main panel. One side would read 120v, other side was dead. replaced that. second issue is the white/neutral to hot tub was not on the GFCI breaker in sub panel but to the neutral bar, here is what is weird, the GFCI breaker was NOT tripping. and hot tub was running. I moved the neutral from tub to the GFCI breaker. but I suspect I have a bad GFCI breaker as the test button won't do anything, how do I verify other than just replacing it. there is power going to tub. Both hots coming off the GFCI are showing 120v on a meter, common lead is going to the neutral coming out of GFCI breaker. it is an ECO SPA hot tub.
Hello, Mr spa guy. I like your short videos. I have a spa and I believe that mine is a sundance older model and I may need some parts. Can you please help me. This is my first time of having a spa. I need help. Thank you
LOL.. Ok so if they are what happens? Next I'll make you a deal.. We can meet up. You can wire it like you want and I will be able to cause voltage to be in the water easily.. Then we wire it like I want and you try anyway you want to put voltage on the water except tying the ground and neutral together.. The bet is 1000.00 cash if I can put voltage in the water the way yours is wired you pay me.. If you can put voltage in the water the way mine is wired I pay you.. By the way I will be filming it for youtube.. Are you gonna take me up on the bet? My way is the safest I betcha!!
@SpaGuy If neutral and ground are bonded at the sub panel, you introduce a condition known as objectionable current. For example, if a fault condition occurs on a device and the neutral and ground are bonded at the sub panel, you create 2 paths for the fault current to return. The problem with this is that devices connected to either the main panel or sub panel can potentially receive this objection current and damage said devices. I would say that if you have problems when the neutral and ground aren't bonded at the sub panel, double check at the main panel that the ground and neutral are bonded there, and that your ground wire is running continuously back to the main panel. For any viewers conflicted and want to do their own research, refer to NEC code 250.24(A)(5).
Yes I have a Sundance. So my question is what do I do with the Neutral from the GFI to the tub at the tub end (cap it?)? And also the line going from the panel to the sub-panel (GFI) do I connect the neutral as normal? Please any help is appreciated.
@@SpaGuy 1) If a ground fault occurs, it needs ONE low impedance path (ground wire) to the main panel which transfers current to the transformer and back to the main panel’s breakers to clear the fault. With ground and neutral bonded, current can travel on both ground and neutral back to the main panel. 2) If the load becomes unbalanced and ground and neutral are bonded, the current will flow through anything bonded to the sub-panel (enclosure, ground wire, piping, etc.) and back to the main panel. 3) It's been NEC since 2008.
It's a dangerous mistake to run the household ground into the box and then bond it to neutral. It's also against code. If you must bond neutral and ground, then do not connect the home's ground conductor and drive a separate grounding electrode at the spa's breaker panel. To appreciate how dangerous this is, imagine that the neutral coming into the spa's panel is lifted, and all current feeding the spa now runs through the ground conductor back to the home's grounding system and to where it's bonded to neutral at the service entrance. Essentially, the homes' grounding system is now carrying the neutral's potential voltage, and every grounded appliance has neutral potential voltage on its case.
If you wire it the way you suggest the current could be put on neutral or ground.. If you wire it the way I suggest the breaker trips every time.. With regular breakers I agree with you but I have seen gfci breakers pout voltage in the water of a hot tub too many times and it is unsafe to wire it that way..
@@SpaGuy 1) Bond neutral and ground at service (required) and in spa sub-panel. 2) Disconnect (lift, cut, corrode) neutral from main panel inside sub-panel or main panel. Operate spa. 3) Ground conductor is now functioning as neutral, is likely undersized, and has energized every device in the home that has a ground conductor (including spa). 4) This will not trip GFCI, but any other loads in sub-panel will energize ground even if GFCI is tripped.
LOL... What you missed is this video was shot on green screen and when I keyed the screen it keyed the green ground wires and made them white.. I will say this if someone can get confused about 2 ground wires being white instead of green they should probably not be working on a breaker of any kind.. Thanks..
Bonding of grounding conductors and neutral conductors depends on the location of breakers- not the age of the home as you ssid "the olddr houses." You absolutely DO NOT bond neutral &ground wires together @ ANY spa. It's the National Electrical Code, doesn't matter where you're from.
You cleary did not listen to what I said.. I said in older homes the Neutral and Ground are connected together in the breaker box and that is a fact.. There is no difference in the two other than the color of the wire.. Newer homes they are separated..
The thumbnail shoes the neutrals installed to the ground? This is absolutely unsafe and against code….. you should remove that thumbnail as mistakes like this can cause fires and cost lives….. 😢this is horrible advice…. And you shouldn’t be posting garbage like that
Spent hours questioning my hookup of the spa, went through the whole troubleshooting list disconnecting pumps and retrying. You saved my night! Electrician wired it wrong. Thank you!!
Electricians wire them wrong all of the time and then act like they don't.. Glad to help!!
Bought a like new 2017 jetsetter from a friend for 500 bucks(seem like a deal) anyways got it home got it set up and called a handy man to wire it all up 220, wiring all ran sub panel in and he calls and says keeps tripping breaker in sub panel when neutral is hooked up and it’s above his pay grade! This video is exactly what I needed to see!! He hays a 30amp and 20 amp in sub panel and not the one 50amp gfi breaker, so no place for neutral except to ground. Going to try and find the right breaker tomorrow and it should be fixed. Thank you for shedding light for us non electrical guys!
That is a completely different set up than this.. 6 or 7 wire and one gfci.. the other breaker is not a gfci..
Thank you. You should be a hot tub installation teacher. Very easy to understand. YOUR THE MAN!!
I laughed so hard when you said the electrician sometimes doesn't know any better but thank you for all your videos you do a good thing for us contractors out here trying to make a living I try to give work the best I can but sometimes I just need to go out at it myself to pay the bills
I found this video to be very informative I wired my spa Box exactly the way you told Me Too! To find out that I have A110 converted to 240 I had to call and get guidance from the spa company master spas that I needed to move the 3 white wires from the red AC to the white AC or I would be Popping the breaker in the sub Box once I switched those wires it no longer was tripping the fuse the fuse thanks for all your information I enjoyed your video very Informative
Good job. Nice short video and to the point. You messed me up at first when I seen 2 white conductors. But then you explained what you did to identify your ground conductor. Here in Canada the ground conductor is usually green or bare copper. Thanks for sharing this.
This is exactly what I was looking for! Thank you so much for making a to-the-point, easily understood video on this.
Thanks spa guy. got me through it..... Now I'm soakin' in 104!
Yesterday I went to a service call , had about 80 volts to ground , disconnected every one at a time , pumps & heater . Found it was the heater, disconnected the heater. But here’s my question the breaker was wired correctly, at the hot tub there in no neutral connection terminal only the hots and the ground bar. Why doesn’t the breaker see the imbalance and ground? Why isn’t the water grounded via the pumps impeller shaft ? Why didn’t the breaker trip?
Lol.... Neutral wire problem solved! Thank you very much.... As soon as you said it I know exactly what I did wrong
The neutral and ground MUST NOT be bonded at a sub-panel ( spa panel ). They should only be bonded at the main service panel. If you bond them anywhere other than the main service, the neutral return current now has multiple paths, including though your ground wire.
I hear you but will say that if you do not bond them you cannot make the system introduce voltage in the water of the tub and if you do not bond them I can introduce voltage.. My way it is impossible to put voltage in the water.. If you don't believe me let's do a video and you show me how your way is safer..
@@SpaGuy I hear what you're saying, but code says to not bond the ground to the panel in this case right? So wouldn't this fail an inspection?
@@caddy92480 you're 100 percent correct
This is a hack job…..
Thanks for posting this video...I had to go behind the guy who installes the GFCI breaker and properply land the nuetral to the GFCI breaker for the 120v control voltage.
Awesome information!!!Thanks so much. You helped troubleshoot new wire hot tube. Thanks..
Great video. Thanks for the information and knowledge that you shared.
Spa Guy rocks! Thanks.
I wired the hot tub correctly with a 2/50 amp gfi sub panel . The pump works the heater works the lights work but when i push the test buttton on the gfi breaker it does not trip. Any Suggestions
Do you have videos showing us how to replace the breakers inside this breaker box?
I don't..
I followed your instructions perfectly but when I attach the wires to the hot tub, it trips the breaker at the main box in the house. The Gfc does not trip at all. Any suggestions? ThNks
This is exactly what I needed.
I recently removed my hot tub, and the 220v wire is just left open in my backyard where the tub connection was there. Seeking suggestion, if I install a junction box to split this 220v to two 110v using one common neutral and one 110 hot to the black wire and the other 110 hot to the red wire.
Or
Should I completely replace the 50a GFCI Breaker.
Thanks for all your videos.
Depends on what you plan on using the former hot tub wires for.remember the wires and breaker should be rated for 60 amps.
Well made informative video. Slight criticism, you could slow down just a bit with explaining the wiring connections in the disconnect. The other criticism is the ground wire could have some green tape on it. Thank you
where did you get a panel with the breaker sideways!? Because the breaker wont fit and allow for the wire space.
Good video, not sure how to get to all your videos that may shed some light on my issue.
Here's my scenario: I have three wires coming from my house panel, but I have a four wire hot tub; it's a Hydroquip. I have 50A breaker at the sub with the pigtail. What is the proper way to wire when you are going from a 3-wire supply to a four wire tub. I ran a fourth wire, what I think should be a neutral, since there is a neutral slot in the pack. The breaker resets immediately when I turn on the outside breaker. I have disconnected every load, it still resets immediately upon trying to set the breaker. I have lifted the neutral wire from inside the sub box, which is on the same terminal strip as the pigtail. When I lifted the wire, the breaker sets, but there is nothing happening at the hot tub, no lights, no nothing. If you could direct me to a preexisting video; I am more of a visual person. If none available, I sure could use some guidance.
Thanks for your help.
Nick
Thank you, Spa Guy. Just what I needed to get it up and running.
I’m running a spa panel too but I have a split bus panel as my main that’s full I could use tendem breakers to make room my idea is to put move the hot water heater to the lighting section then take the 60 amp from the lighting section to use for the hot tub in place we’re the water heater breaker was then put a 70 amp for the lighting section the wires for it are already 4 gauge. Is this idea ok or do I need to replace the panel? The service lines are 200 amps I noticed. Any advice I appreciate.🤩👍
if i replaced the bulb in my but the light still doesn't turn on, does it just mean the breaker needs to be replaced?
How do you wire a three wire tub to the sub panel gfci?
Question:
My new spa requires a 4 wire 40amp connection.. I could only find 30 and 60 amp disconnects... I have a 40amp gfci breaker going in the panel, I intend to install a 6/4 wire to that 40amp gfci in the panel, then run that to a 60amp non-fuse disconnect breaker, then a 6/4 from that disconnect to the spa connection. Incase I ever get a new tub that requires a 50amp instead of 40 the wire will be sufficient. Does that sound correct? Is it typical to only find 30 and 60 amp disconnect switches?
Spa Guy, Need to wire up a hot tub, but location does not allow the 5 foot minimum distance between hot tub and GFI box. Heard that a barrier may allow to pass inspection, but no easy way to do that either. Would adding a waterproof plastic electrical box and mounting the spa disconnect inside count as a barrier and pass inspection?
Robert I don't know the answer to that question..
doesn't the neutral have to be connected to the breaker and panel but not running to the hot tub ? On a 3 wire hot tub ?
You can do that but I don't see how it makes any difference.. On a 3 wire system it would not play a part in the breaker tripping..
Great video appreciated. I think my test button is actually pushed in and stuck. Still trouble shooting to see if the hot tub is fine, heater pump etc but I am sure it is. Is there a way to pop it back out or just replace the breaker? I keep pushing it to pop it out but there is no movement in the button. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
You can’t bond the neutral bar on a sub panel, you would fail inspection.
Why is the bonding rod in the the box?
Spa Guy NEC says that after the main breaker the neutral bar is not to be bonded. This is considered a sub panel so the bonding wire has to be removed.
Ehouse 29
The spa guy keeps making that mistake bonding the neutral on sub panels, hopefully 1 day he will take a minute to read the NEC and understand that’s not correct.
It prevents what's called a ground loop
@@franciscosanchez2779 i see him do this and see his comments about it and i shake my head too. I enjoy his channel and content but he just wont admit this isnt to code and could make people hook up their own tub and get a failed inspection or even cause someone to have problems.
Our hot tub was working fine and suddenly started carrying 7 volts in water even with all power off to the house. Haven’t found a technician that has been able to resolve it. Any advice would be helpful. Thanks!
I have a morgans hot tub. 3 wires red yellow and black. I grounded the yellow hooked up red and black. Everything worked and heated. After the breaker was off it popped and smoked. Now the box is hooked to the meter cause I dont have up to date breaker box in the house. Has twist in fuses. What could cause this?
all your videos are very helpfull, thanks for all the info
Thanks for the helpful info. I had one question, my house doesn't have a 'neutral', just the two hots and a ground. What do I do with the 4th/neutral wire coming out of the tub? Just cap it?
Cap it..
My gcfi wont trip but sometimes one of the hot lines (black) in my case will go dead and not have any voltage.
The panel will still get power and nothing trips off, just the pump stops running and heater of course.
Reset GCFI and then everything works again, Im thinking the gcfi is starting to fail.
I have a GFCI question about adding additional equipment to a hot tub... I want to add a 120 volt blower system to a hot tub that does not have one. Can I install a GFCI 120 Outlet or any kind of GFCI breaker in between the GFCI breaker that is outside the hot tub cabinet or would I have to install its own service? Basically what I'm asking is will a 120 GFCI breaker work if it is inside the loop of the 240 GFCI breaker that is on the outside of the hot tub on the pole?
You do not use 2 GFCI's.. Wire the blower into the existing system and add a switch to turn it off and on..
@@SpaGuy i was also thinking of making the switch a variable dimmer type one as most blowers are super loud when on max because its 120v would a standard house type dimmer work? i dont think most blowers pull more than 15 amps? ever seen that type of modification?
Hello. My 230v pool pump does NOT have a neutral. It only have 2 loads and 1 ground. What do you recommend I use as a breaker? Since it has no neutral, should I even use a gfci? My main breaker box is an old one so ground and nuetral are bonded. My pool pump on high is 7.5 amp and on low its 2.1 amps. Thank you
That is a question for a local electrician.. There is nothing to hook a neutral to on a 230V pump..
Hello, I need some guidance. I replaced my spa. My old spa had 3 wires configuration (h,h,g), the new one is a 4 wires configuration (h,h,n,g). There is a gfci. My electrician connected a netrual wire directly from the main panel in the house to the spa to test. The gfci trips everytime we turn it on. Is this because he did not connect the netrual from the gfci or is there something wrong with the spa. Thank you for your help.
I have a hot springs jetsetter, 3-wire system. Directions tell me to hook it to a 20 amp GFI. Unfortunately my box has one Ground Bar, not a separate ground and neutral bar sure. What do I do?
on the feed side of the GFCI ground and neutral are the same.. The white wire get to the neutral bar and ground to the ground even though they are shorted together.. If it is a 115V use a 20A GFCI and put the curly wire here the other white wires are.. The GFCI does the work from there..
so i have a 3 wire sundance it worked just fine off a gen now that i have it wired into the gfci its tripping as soon as the breaker is turned on... so 4 wire sub panel to disconnect then 3 wire disconnect to tub
Feed
RED - Hot lug
Black - Hot lug
White - neutral bar lug
Green - Ground bar
Load
RED - Hot terminal on breaker
Black - terminal on breaker
White - capped both ends
Green - Ground bar
White pigtail - neutral bar
and the bonding rod installed correct?
i have seen some videos where the bonding rod is not installed but they just connected all the green and white to the neutral bar which is the same thing if the bonding rod is installed?
found my own problem.... thats what i get for buying a disconnect box/GFCI breaker 2nd hand for $20 vs the 100 at the DIY stores...it was a bad GFCI breaker!!! it was wired right...heres how i found it ..if u wanta test to see if your GFCI breaker is actually working disconnect the loads from it or disconnect the load lines on the tub, and try just truing on the breaker by itself no load on it if it still trips the breaker has to be bad
I love your videos, thanks for sticking with it. I'm about to install a new spa panel, it will have a 50 AMP CFGI for the tub but the panel has two more spaces for circuits. I'd like to install a 15amp (AFCI) circuit to power a plug on the far end of my yard (20 feet from the spa). Is there any issue installing another circuit in the spa disconnect panel? I can feed the panel with a dbl 60AMP since I used 6/3 wire.
This question is not pertaining to a home owner. As someone who refurbishes various hot tubs, I am wondering what you do about your gfci breaker feeds for various tubs. Do you just use a 60 amp gfci for all tubs or do you change out the breaker depending on the load of each specific tub? Is it bad to oversized the breaker for testing purposes? I often see tubs that need a 40, 50 and 60 amp breaker.
Most tubs use a 50 amp GFCI and That is what I would normally use for all tubs.. a 60amp need is very rare and would be something like a swim spa usually.. Many tubs especially with Balboa controls can me used with 3-4 pumps by using the dip switches to set the heater to turn off when the 3 or 4 pump comes on.. In those cases you could do a 60amp and allow the pumps to run with the heater.. Another thing is the length of the wire and wire gauge.. 6 gauge wire is good for up to 55 amps on a normal run and some would say 65amps on a short run.. so 50amp is standard in my opinion and I rarely see a 40 or 60.. Also local code would be another consideration.. a tub with as 5.5 heater and a 3hp pump would pull 34 amps so a 40 would work with 8 gauge wire but I don't think using a 50 with 6 gauge would be an issue.. The other thing is what if someone buys a one pump tub and later wants a 2 pump running 6 gauge and a 50 amp breaker would cover both tubs.. Every now and then you will find a 2 pump tub with a 5.5 heater with (2) large hp pumps lets say 16 amp.. 16+16+22= 54 which is at the upper ability for a 6 gauge wire and would need a 60 amp breaker unless you set the heater to go off when pump 2 comes on.. Just note it would be rare for a tub to have (2) 16 amp motors but they are out there.. Thanks, Spa Guy
@@SpaGuy thanks for the input 👍. It’s always great learning from someone with lots of time and experience. You do a great job on your videos I hope to see them continue. Have a great day.
Hey Spa Guy, we have an Air Conditioner box outside, can we hook into that box to get our 220or 240 volts need for the hot tub or do I need to run a whole new complete line from the box?
You have run a dedicated system for your tub You cannot tie into other systems..
Thank you 😊 mr. Spa guy your info was right on ...👍👍👍..
You are very welcome my friend.. Thanks for watching.. Spa Guy
Is it ok if the ground from the main to the disconnect is not installed?
Did you watch the video?
dont you need a ground wire from the spa panel to a grounded rod ?
ground wire goes to main panel where it is grounded
I am setting up mine too but another idea i thauhgt of is installing a 240 volt outlet I have one for outdoor rated and put a groung fault breaker avove it and then do the reast from the house as usal. than wire a 240 volt plug to the hot tub and plug it in.
This is a positive comment for the algorithm 😊
Great Video, well explained. Thanks a lot.
What happens if I do not have a neutral wire from the main breaker to the GFI box? I am trying to use an existing circuit that has a 40 amp breaker and the white wire is not connected. this circuit use to go to an air conditioner... Thanx a bunch
Hi, I came home and the breaker in the house, the house main as well as the hot tub gcfi was tripped. My heater died and needed to be replaced. Should this happen? How would it get past the GCFI outside? I have a Sundance. I checked all wiring in GCFI, looks good, test works. Only thing I don't know is what happens to the white neutral that leaves the GCFI to the spa pack.
My GFI test button started to get stuck and I have to mess with the on/off position to get it out and get the tub to get power again. It is now stuck and won't come out and tub does not get any power.
How much cost to replace it?
I live in mesa, Arizona. Are the codes the same for all of Arizona?
Your local codes can vary..
How do I verify after install that the GFCI part of the breaker is wired properly to work in case something goes wrong? In the video you mentioned that it will still work as a breaker if you only ran the 3 wires but not 4 wires, so I am wondering how to make sure that the GFI will trip if needed. Thanks!
You should still have neutral from the house connected to piggyback from GFCI on insulated bar; it will still work as GFCI even there is no neutral to control box of the spa. Is better to not to have neutral in the control box if not used; sometimes it works like inductor and can cause tripping
hit the test button? GFCI breaker should have a test button
Hello. In the main panel I have a connected neutral and ground. And my gfci immediately trip. What is the problem?
If yours is a new wire watch this video ua-cam.com/video/Er2VuJ1e8Js/v-deo.html
Nice overview Thanks 😊
Hey Spa Guy. Love all your videos sir. Especially when u repo the tubs solo. U are the man bro. Hey I was wondering where I can find a cover to the spa pack u have in this video. I got a 2007 coleman 481 from a friend but that cover is missing. I tried contacting Balboa havent got a response. Any idea where I can find one?
Does it matter if the black wire is on the black and red on red wire? My breaker is wired red to black.
It doesn't..
Thank you
Great video, love how clear and concise it is! I have a Jacuzzi tub with no neutral. You commented that because of this the GFCI will not work as a GFCI. Should I have a GFCI in the main panel then? Currently it does not. Thanks!
They say house a GFCI even with that system and just don't use the neutral cap it off.. I don't what the purpose it is but if you get an electrical inspection they might require it..
You don't need a neutral from the device to the tub if the tub doesn't require it, just from the panel (where you get power for the tub from). The gfci device uses the neutral to detect current imbalances (ground faults) and that's how it protects the tub and those inside it.
@@MrJonSchell Sir are you saying if installing a Sundance Hot Tub that only requires 3 wire I should wire 4 wire to the spa disconnect box gfci and then 3 from the disconnect box to the tub?
@@josephgraham1065 correct. You could technically get it to work by putting the neutral tail under a ground screw (assuming it's grounded/bonded to the main panel) but that is most likely a code violation (have to keep your bonds and neutrals separate after your first disconnect). Also it's my experience that with that size of cable most places don't carry stock on the 2 wire version (you said 3 wire, we don't count the ground) so you'll have to buy the 3 wire version anyway and just tape the neutral wire in the spa pack and also hot tub control box
@@MrJonSchell thanks for answering me. So just to be clear I'm going to wire the sub panel to main box normally. Then only run 2 hots and ground to tub. Hook up pigtail to neutral bus inside sib panel. Thanks
Generally is it worth while to get a free spas that you see often in classified ads?
Thank you for this video. I have had a few issues and has helped me work through them. But I am still a little stuck. 1st issue I had is I had a bad breaker in the main panel. One side would read 120v, other side was dead. replaced that. second issue is the white/neutral to hot tub was not on the GFCI breaker in sub panel but to the neutral bar, here is what is weird, the GFCI breaker was NOT tripping. and hot tub was running. I moved the neutral from tub to the GFCI breaker. but I suspect I have a bad GFCI breaker as the test button won't do anything, how do I verify other than just replacing it. there is power going to tub. Both hots coming off the GFCI are showing 120v on a meter, common lead is going to the neutral coming out of GFCI breaker. it is an ECO SPA hot tub.
Craig, if the test button doesn’t trip the breaker then it needs to be replaced.
My tub just started tripping the breaker.Been working fine for ten yrs.Any tips are welcome.Thanks
Is it a gfci breaker?
Thanks man, super informative
Hello, Mr spa guy. I like your short videos. I have a spa and I believe that mine is a sundance older model and I may need some parts. Can you please help me. This is my first time of having a spa. I need help. Thank you
www.hottubpartsofamerica.com
You saved me!! That damn neutral I put it in the wrong spot.☹️
I wish I could have seen you wire it in. detail by detail
I have plenty of other videos on this subject..
Mr hot tub you never bond the neutral and the ground after the service disconnect, that is no only code violation but very danger installation
2:10 wrong wrong wrong!!!!!!! Neutral and ground should NOT be connected!!
LOL.. Ok so if they are what happens? Next I'll make you a deal.. We can meet up. You can wire it like you want and I will be able to cause voltage to be in the water easily.. Then we wire it like I want and you try anyway you want to put voltage on the water except tying the ground and neutral together.. The bet is 1000.00 cash if I can put voltage in the water the way yours is wired you pay me.. If you can put voltage in the water the way mine is wired I pay you.. By the way I will be filming it for youtube.. Are you gonna take me up on the bet? My way is the safest I betcha!!
@SpaGuy If neutral and ground are bonded at the sub panel, you introduce a condition known as objectionable current. For example, if a fault condition occurs on a device and the neutral and ground are bonded at the sub panel, you create 2 paths for the fault current to return. The problem with this is that devices connected to either the main panel or sub panel can potentially receive this objection current and damage said devices.
I would say that if you have problems when the neutral and ground aren't bonded at the sub panel, double check at the main panel that the ground and neutral are bonded there, and that your ground wire is running continuously back to the main panel.
For any viewers conflicted and want to do their own research, refer to NEC code 250.24(A)(5).
Yes I have a Sundance. So my question is what do I do with the Neutral from the GFI to the tub at the tub end (cap it?)? And also the line going from the panel to the sub-panel (GFI) do I connect the neutral as normal? Please any help is appreciated.
Yes connect everything as normal except put a wire nut on the white wire in the Sundance Pack since it is unused..
You bonded the neutral and ground bars together in the spa panel??? Very wrong.
LOL.. You people keep saying that but no one can tell me why.. Is it because you will have too much ground??
@@SpaGuy 1) If a ground fault occurs, it needs ONE low impedance path (ground wire) to the main panel which transfers current to the transformer and back to the main panel’s breakers to clear the fault. With ground and neutral bonded, current can travel on both ground and neutral back to the main panel. 2) If the load becomes unbalanced and ground and neutral are bonded, the current will flow through anything bonded to the sub-panel (enclosure, ground wire, piping, etc.) and back to the main panel. 3) It's been NEC since 2008.
BEAST!!!
How to wire 3 wire spa to a GFCI breaker
Don't use the white wire coming out of the breaker going to the tub do attach the curly white wire to the neutral though..
@@SpaGuy When you say "Don't use the wire wire coming out of the breaker" what do I do with it?
Thanks!
It's a dangerous mistake to run the household ground into the box and then bond it to neutral. It's also against code. If you must bond neutral and ground, then do not connect the home's ground conductor and drive a separate grounding electrode at the spa's breaker panel.
To appreciate how dangerous this is, imagine that the neutral coming into the spa's panel is lifted, and all current feeding the spa now runs through the ground conductor back to the home's grounding system and to where it's bonded to neutral at the service entrance. Essentially, the homes' grounding system is now carrying the neutral's potential voltage, and every grounded appliance has neutral potential voltage on its case.
If you wire it the way you suggest the current could be put on neutral or ground.. If you wire it the way I suggest the breaker trips every time.. With regular breakers I agree with you but I have seen gfci breakers pout voltage in the water of a hot tub too many times and it is unsafe to wire it that way..
@@SpaGuy Think "floating neutral", so the ground is serving as neutral. It's the rest of the house that is in danger, even after the GFCI trips.
Give me one example of how voltage can be put on neutral or ground without tripping as breaker..
@@SpaGuy 1) Bond neutral and ground at service (required) and in spa sub-panel.
2) Disconnect (lift, cut, corrode) neutral from main panel inside sub-panel or main panel. Operate spa.
3) Ground conductor is now functioning as neutral, is likely undersized, and has energized every device in the home that has a ground conductor (including spa).
4) This will not trip GFCI, but any other loads in sub-panel will energize ground even if GFCI is tripped.
good
adding the white sheeth to the ground just confuses people. Just leave it exposed like people are use to seeing.
LOL... What you missed is this video was shot on green screen and when I keyed the screen it keyed the green ground wires and made them white.. I will say this if someone can get confused about 2 ground wires being white instead of green they should probably not be working on a breaker of any kind.. Thanks..
Bonding of grounding conductors and neutral conductors depends on the location of breakers- not the age of the home as you ssid "the olddr houses." You absolutely DO NOT bond neutral &ground wires together @ ANY spa. It's the National Electrical Code, doesn't matter where you're from.
You cleary did not listen to what I said.. I said in older homes the Neutral and Ground are connected together in the breaker box and that is a fact.. There is no difference in the two other than the color of the wire.. Newer homes they are separated..
The thumbnail shoes the neutrals installed to the ground? This is absolutely unsafe and against code….. you should remove that thumbnail as mistakes like this can cause fires and cost lives….. 😢this is horrible advice…. And you shouldn’t be posting garbage like that
So I can use a regular breaker at the panel and a gfci breaker at the spa panel? Could this be installed the other way around?