Making 8620 Billet Round Lobe Camshaft with Monster Monarch Series 90 Huge Lathe DRO action
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- Опубліковано 13 лис 2020
- In this video I go thru a new way for me to make a Round lobe cam blank for a diesel competition engine. If you want to see how I did it before Just look back a couple of years in my videos and you can see how I was doing them or I will link it at the end of the video. This camshaft will have a different than normal intake and exhaust sequence so I have to make this non standard custom blank. It will be heat treated and finish ground by the cam grinders. I hope you enjoy all the turning action and chip making. Thanks for watching!
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yaaaa monarch my lights got dim when you fired up the giant
i love the sound the old girl makes (Monster Monarch) when it starts up
Air raid! lol
That's the reason we're called machinist we can do anything that's needed to get the outcome we want. I absolutely love your monarch well all great American made machines. I've worked with them from flat belt drive VBM with 48" table to hydraulic open side planets. And hydraulic 12' diameter VBMs. Lathes with 60' beds and 60" chucks ya ride on. Sure miss it too.
Big machines are fun times!
Thanks for taking the time Brian. The crybabies don’t bother me either.
Brian, it has been said; a clean desk is the sure sign of a sick mind! poppy's workshop says HI
I must say that "YOU" are one of the best on UA-cam. You are honest and very good at what you do! You do not waste time showing every micro-inch of material removal, you and Keith Fenner are truly original and informative! Keep up tour "Great" work!
Wow, thank you! Being in the same league with Keith Fenner is an honor. I am just Getting it done. :-)
It goes without saying just how skilled of a craftsman you are Brian. For me, your videos have made me realize what I should be doing. And that is not working for someone else. I've been welding since I was a junior in high school. Done a lot but not all, iron worker, millwright, pipe welder, fitter, fabricator, etc.. I've been very fortunate to have learned from men that have forgotten more than I'll ever know. But, I'm 48 now and am going into business for myself. I'm opening a fab shop near Kingsport, TN come the first part of 2022. I'm currently binging your videos. Thanks for sharing your skill and knowledge. Where's a good place to start looking for machinery? I'm striking out.
Brian i enjoy all of your video's even seeing if the old DOG DODGE will run i always learn some thing from you and i have been at this 4 59 year's or i forgot them & you just refreshed my mind??? if some viewers don't like all the chips let clean your lathe there are some people how cant stop complying Keep the videos coming.
.
Thanks for the encouraging words!
Nice cam blank! We did a fair amount with 8620 back in the day with Reynolds, carburized and hardened.
Don’t sweat the complaints about chips on your machines. People whine that my shop is too tidy and waste time cleaning. Can’t make people happy either way!
Everybody needs a purpose in life. :-)
@@bcbloc02 You forgot the last part; "If you're making chips, you're making money."
In a shop it is a balance between your co-workers complaining you left the machine dirty and the boss saying you are spending too much time cleaning, you can't please them all!!!
@Tsunauticus III You can't imagine how much time I've saved!!
There are people that spend there time polishing the machine and people that use it to make parts.
In the 80s work in shop had a bunch of presses , most 40 ton n up. They drew so much current had to start em one at a time.
The fly wheels where huge , like a foot across n 10' in diameter. When you start the monarch reminds me of them.
The biggest one once power was off would free coast a long time. Most machines where from 1920's learned set up there , worked 2nd running a paper tape CNC , but got old belt driven engine lathes set up for next day's run .
Turned lots of cast on old engine lathes. Crazy times.
Thanks Brian , many things you do bring good memory's around.
I had to click thumbs up before even seeing the video after reading the title. You are not playing fair Brian! LOL.
Enjoyed Brian!
ATB, Robin
Thanks Robin!
Very cool! Can't wait to see the finished camshaft!
Very nice work
Making a mess equates to making money. Good to see making chips. 👍
Nothing but pure talent!! 👍🏻👍🏻😁
Top job Brian
Hope bailey is feeling well. Your work is always of interest to me. Thanks.
Baily doing ok, just getting old an onery.
I thought you were making a cam, not a blank which is super interesting in itself but if it WAS a cam, Baily'd have his own treat box and quite probably a whole CASE to get a wag on it. And hogging that much metal with no chips would be like cutting firewood with no chips. Got to have chips! Thanks, Pal and good to know you cornered the world market with this/these! GBWYall!
a thing of beauty, lots of shops would even take this on.
Excellent video keep up the good work 👍👍👍👍
The beard suits you! Keep it!
you sure are amazing... Renaissance man
That's a cool project
Interesting job.
Looks great ! Love that Beast of a Lathe you own. Has always I Liked,shared. All my very best.
Thanks!
Very impressive Brian. I hope it passed the Bailey test.
I'm impressed, I'd have screwed it up (more) for sure!... I'm always sweating bullets when working with a valuable piece of stock.. don't screw up, don't screw up, don't screw up
That lathe reminds me of the big hydroelectric generators when they startup...
And probably uses up all the power generated by that turbine! 😂
Returning it to earth, where the electrons can again be taken by the generator and sent back to Brian's barn.
SO FN EPIC
BEST MACHINING CAMSHAFT VIDEO ON UA-cam
impressive video my friend!
Nice job!
Very neat, thanks.
Another Job well done Brian! Yes If you are using your machines Your getting them dirty!
Nice having the large thru hole, Nice job looks great.
It made dealing with the vibration much easier. It is why I wanted a series 90 instead of an older NN they only had a 2.5" thru hole.
I run a 50" NN lathe work. It is the most rigid lathe I have ever run. I just got done turning 3- 35" diameter split bronze bushings. THey weighed about 2,000 lbs each. They look real similar to thrust main bearings in a car engine. The boring bar I used was about 8" x 12" x 8' long.
that's pretty cool
buen trabajo bcbloc02..gracias por tu tiempo..un saludo y mucha salud
Being able to change feed direction while the spindle is turning is a very nice feature. I’m a bit envious of that.
That's a feature of such big lathes. They are normally for production and "way is money " :-) With 10 HP you can make such deep cuts no problem.
@@bernardwill7196 thought it was a 40hp motor on that lathe
@@bernardwill7196 Those .100doc cuts were actually pretty light but all the tool will take. Hopefully I will get to really chew on a piece sometime and use all 40hp of the lathe sometime.
@@stuarthardy4626 You are right :-)
I'm waiting for the 40hp too.
very nice.
Brian I love the way you own up to your mistakes. Plenty would not. Fair play to you !
Looks like it's time to find the world's biggest steady rest for the world's biggest lathe!
I have been looking but no luck.
Awesome job. I really enjoyed watching this video. Keep up the good work. I hope Baily aproved.
I bought him off with a dog bone since I botched the position on the one lobe and had to fix it.
Great work nothing wrong with CNC I just love manual milling it's great figuring out order of operations I'm fortunate to be exposed to both and yes if we don't catch something in time we fix it. Bailey didn't catch you in time that really surprised me
Baily doesn't like to be on the concrete anymore at almost 16 his arthritis bothers him.
Brian, looks like you were pushing the limits of that Lathe on that project. Always enjoy your videos. Gary
Oh yeah, almost stalled it a few times. LMAO
You are truly amazing. It is so refreshing to see you actually making and fixing parts that others would not even attempt. Do not concern yourself with the trolls complaining about chips they are just a sad part of the crazy times we are living in. If your shop was hospital clean they'd be bitchin about that. Keep up the good work.
Jimmy Diresta's motto is "I make" i told him mine is "I Fix" :-)
Wow!!!
Like #154
Thanks for the video!
bailey is ok with those chips
Hey Brian 😀👍🤙
Blast from the past. Many years ago I had to do that same job on a bunch of cam blanks. Except it was on a much smaller lathe. I built an adjustable follow rest out of a couple of roller tappets to provide support at the nearest bearing journal.
I have a follow rest for my little Monarch I was going to try to use once but I never got it dialed in.
Big machines turning big parts make a lot of chips. You need to make an extension for the tailstock center.
That would help! More proper sized cutters would help too.
There is a workshop in Southern Queensland, here in Australia, named *Cutting Edge Engineering*, run by a man named Kurtis. (You would call him a "guy", I would call him a "bloke", John Mills would call him a "lad", and some other sections of society would refer to him as a "chap" For this discussion, let us use the generic term "man".) You will like his broad but gentle Australian accent, and his unique turn of phrase ("We'll centre drill it, and then poke a live centre up its arse...")
Kurtis and friends do heavy work on a lot of large hydraulic equipment, and he seems to know what he is doing. One of his shop-made tools is a fixture that mounts either a three-jaw or four-jaw chuck into the tailstock of his large lathe, using an M5 taper. The video describing its manufacture is here is here,
ua-cam.com/video/-E1NkckJdbs/v-deo.html
I am no mechanical engineer; in fact, I am no engineer of any sort; I do hobby-shop machining, and am happy in my haze of oil smoke, among piles of mixed chips, pushing dull tools beyond their limits, but I think I can recognise good ideas when I see them. You chaps, and many others too, may be interested in what Kurtis did.
It is for you to decide what use it may be to you.
@@gregbrodie-tyrrell3473 he is a sharp dude
Tail stock in the way try moving tool post down the slot.
Chips only way once found out my old sharper hadn't been used for 2 years and made me sell it
Size matters That's what I call a lathe!!
It does the job. :-)
Ggreat work Brian, maybe you and Steve Summers coul catch up one day.
Steve has a project to do for me so we certainly will! :-)
Nice work as usual Brian, That big Lathe sure turned out to be a nice addition. Are you eventually going to move the other machinery in the old shop down to the Barn Shop? Your operation appears to work similar to mine, there is always something else that needs attending too and that kind of stuff has to wait!
As far chips on your machine, My machinery usually has chips on them too. Yeah they get a proper cleaning when there is nothing else to do or it's time for maintenance. Sometimes I get sick of the mess, have too many tools out and have to stop, pick then start over. Usually it's rake off the heavy stuff as it builds up to keep the chuck, spindle or working area underfoot clear. When I am starting something new, I might do a better job of it. But chips are a fact of life in a working shop.
Cheers.
Yes the other metal working machines will be coming to the barn shop. One of the reasons I need to fix the forklift so it is reliable.
Weld it up ... Bloody hell , that's a carton . Standard fee over here when Mr Bozo drops by !!! Good job , Cheers .
Good to know I am not alone! lol
@@bcbloc02 No you are not alone !!!
I need that saw
I think they made millions of them, I doubt it would be too hard to find one. It is a great saw.
Happy Saturday another great job ,all the corn picked , where did it go this year ?
Yes I finished harvest a week and a half ago. I had soybeans this year so no drinking that stuff. lol
Next shop update: Monster cam grinder!
I don't have the room or the profiles so I would probably have to go modern and do it cnc. It is possible if I was smart enough I could use a 4th axis on the Cincinnati CNC to machine cams.
@@bcbloc02 is your CNC machine a runner or it needs a touch up?
Dale Pomraning it ran when I got it but it’s been sitting several years. The fact I don’t know how to run it has always made it a low priority
@@bcbloc02 I am considering trying to use my hydraulic tracer to at least rough out lobes. if it works you could just mount a tool post grinder and grind them too. I'm planning on making profiles on my cnc bridgeport.
@@goodservices155 I see no reason that shouldn't work.
I love the "Monster Monarch" awesome machine! I'm curious to know the lift and duration on those pulling diesels, never messed with any of them, I've just built gas burners. Take care Brian
Depends on engine and application durations run from 180-260 snd lifts of .250 to .500 at the cam. A lot of engines run 1.6-20 ratio rocekrs so lifts up to 1" at the valve do exist.
@@bcbloc02 hmm lots different than gas burner, and i bet that they prob have alot of pressure on the nose, with a inch of lift. Interesting
Ain't nothing wrong with a shop full of chips, a busy shop is a mucky shop! I'd rather be bogged down with chips than sat at my bench polishing and giving names to all my spanners...
Great to see ya.
? When I think of cams , I think oblong lobes. Is that a feature that will be added later?
The cam gets copper coated then rough ground for the bearing and gear fits and to put the lobes on with the correct lift duration and orientation. Then it gets heat treated so only where the copper was taken off by the grinding does it get hard. Then it gets straightened and finish ground. All these steps is why it is an expensive process.
I never thought about how a machine shop makes billet camshafts Brian! Can you point me to where I can learn more? What kind of grinder allows you to make the egg shaped profile of a cam? Thanks for making this video.
They have grinders with rocking centers that follow a master that produces the lobe profiles. Don't know that there is a lot out there showing the process.
well done, nice. Welding aside how long did this job take? Chips chips and more chips. Worked for a company that had a staff of 3 to handle chips and another guy who cleaned out machines when material was changed. Recycler paid top dollar only for chips sorted by material type and cutting fluid.
Hard to say because it was spread over a couple of days since I don't get huge blocks of time to work on things. Probably spent 6 hours on all the turning maybe.
👍👍
looks like you be case hardening your camshaft, with 8620, but it gives it flex with block flex under load, to you get involved in building camshafts often?.
when I had Ways redone on my Bridgeport that a couple years ago that shop was rebuilding a VanNorman Camshaft grinder.so I got to see one of those machines.
Nice video. Something mesmerizing about watching chips curl off a project. Did you ever get the coolant tray repaired for the monarch?
Yes I got it all welded up to functional that is why I could run coolant on this project.
Enjoyed....curious on time estimate to complete...my guess is 6 hrs then add weld time repair another 2?
I would say you are real close.
Very cool watching you do that, sir. Always wondered what it took to make the cam blanks and I like how you dealt with the flex by choking up on it. Who does the lobe grinding? Hope all is well there. - TZ
Comp, Crane, Camcraft and Bullet all offer custom cam grinding services.
I know most custom guys are really scretive about lift/duration/overlap of their cams. What is the difference in diameter of the planned lobe base circle vs the cam core diameter? What separation angle do diesels of this magnitude run between the lobes? Do you bother to pre-twist the cam prior to grinding? I am just curious as to how similiar a "high performance" gas engine is to what you have planned.
No phase twist in the cam, haven't really thought it to be a big issue as these cams are relatively large compared to the automotive sizes. I made the cam so it can go up to .500" lobe lift Most of the diesel stuff runs a 98-110LS.
That’s cool! So what is cam for? Assuming that it will be CNC’d to get lobes machined in, but how did they machine cams and cranks before CNC? Are you going to heat treat it afterwards?
Duplicating lathes and pantographs of cam lobe profiles.
In the description Brian says the cam grinder will treat it after the lobes are on.
That part is super critical if the cam is to last.
The cam gets copper coated then rough ground for the bearing and gear fits and to put the lobes on with the correct lift duration and orientation. Then it gets heat treated so only where the copper was taken off by the grinding does it get hard. Then it gets straightened and finish ground. All these steps is why it is an expensive process.
That my friend is a lot of machining. Does the blank get any heat treatment?
The cam gets copper coated then rough ground for the bearing and gear fits and to put the lobes on with the correct lift duration and orientation. Then it gets heat treated so only where the copper was taken off by the grinding does it get hard. Then it gets straightened and finish ground. All these steps is why it is an expensive process.
@@bcbloc02 Is that the "nitriding" process.
Hiya Brian
Can't you spin the toolpost around 180 degrees and mount the tool on the other side?
What grade steel does one use for a camshaft like that? Just curious.
It is in the title :-)
Nice work. Did Bailey catch the goof or was he off taking a supervisor nap. LOL
Baily doesn't like to be on the concrete anymore so he didn't catch it until final qc.
That coolant will save you buying lots of too bits and carbide
That is the idea! Makes it lots easier to hit size as well when tight tolerances are necessary.
Do you have a catalog or website of all the cummins parts that you make? Are they for sale or do you just make them for hobby?
I make most everything as a custom one off but can make about anything and I do sell everything, hardly any of what you see on my channel is for myself. If there is something you are looking for email me bcbloc02 at yahoo dot com
Mr. Block how old is the Monarch ? Maybe the spindel bearings must be adjust a little.
The Monarch is about 60 years old. I don't think there is anything wrong with the spindle bearings.
Can I ask what steps you take after this? Does that blank get sent to a cam grinder with specs, or do they just want to know lift/duration and they grind a standard profile? I'm assuming you had to cut this because it goes to an engine that most cam companies wouldn't have any blanks in-house to work with.
The cam gets copper coated then rough ground for the bearing and gear fits and to put the lobes on with the correct lift duration and orientation. Then it gets heat treated so only where the copper was taken off by the grinding does it get hard. Then it gets straightened and finish ground. All these steps is why it is an expensive process. I choose the lobe profiles from a catalog of available profiles and they grind the cam based on that and the specs I give them.
@@bcbloc02 Thanks for the explanation. That's a heck of a lot of work for a custom bumpstick.
Question Brian: Is that for your hyster project? Thanks,
I don't think so its all buttoned up and running
No, the cummins for the hyster is running, this is for a competition engine configuration.
Thanks! I wasn't sure since Brian had mentioned he was going to modify that engine for the Hyster.
Would you ever consider turning a part like that from rough between centres Brian....or do you think you'll get too much deflection...?
The length to diameter ratio is too much and you will get chatter if you try to work it all between centers without additional support.
@@bcbloc02
Ok...
Good video Brian...👍
Brian does your big machine have a stead?
It does not. Waiting for you to find me one in the oilfield shops. :-)
@@bcbloc02 IS it a 40" ? or 42" N&R might have one for a 40.....
@@10swatkins Mine is a 40" swing
@@bcbloc02 I have your phone number and a lead maybe.... There is a machine tool reseller here that lists 4 40"ers on his floor now.... When is a good time to call you ?
May I add to your comments of chips on your machines; "if you are making chips, you are making money".
how much does a lathe of that size cost to run electricity wise?
I don't know. My old lathe was like 25cents an hour so probably a dollar. These stupid new meters you can't tell how much electricity you are using at a particular time.
1:15 , Air raid ?!
He looks a little like Eric Clapton (for any guitar players who might be watching...lol)
Is that going into one of your machines I guess I don’t understand why nobody else can do that
Have you read Brian’s intro ?
I am sure there are lots of people that can do it there just aren't any that are doing it.
I love my big Johnson saw!