intel XMPs and motherboard QVLs are a useless mess.
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- Опубліковано 18 жов 2023
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#intel #ddr5 #overclocking - Наука та технологія
TL;DW: don't buy DDR5-8000 mem kits for your 14th gen CPU unless you're buying an Apex and don't mind potentially having to fix stability problems.
Don’t buy 14th gen at all!!! It’s the same chip, MC is still a potluck so you might as well buy a cheaper 13900k.
@@AGairsoft1yah intel said it’s the same chip.
Hoping for just a better IMC, but was a bit dissapointed to find out it is exactly the same 13th gen memory controller, my 14900KF samples IMC was worse than my best 13900K. So luck is needed indeed :/
@@Luckyn00bOC my 14900K is very slightly better. Which why I finally have a DDR5-8000 "stable" screenshot.
@@ActuallyHardcoreOverclocking can you do a video of your 8000 stable please
Gigabyte QWL is "does it boot into windows?"
😅
This has been an issue since the DDR3 days with even the cheapest AM3 boards having DDR3-2000 kits in their QVL. Sometimes even 3x2 kits for a 4-dimm board, without any further explanation.. or ASUS, who technically supported DDR3-2200 on their cheap P55 boards but when you look in their QVL its only with one stick inserted lmao.
I think they could split the QVL into 2 tiers:
1. Will work on >99% of CPUs. (for those who want something that just works out of the box)
2. Will work on a CPU with an average memory controller. (for those who want to push the limits a bit, but are not willing to bin tons CPUs for IMC quality)
Showcasing what a board can do with a top 1% CPU should not be done in the QVL. The purpose of the QVL is to show what parts should work together without issues.
For some reason this has always been true whether intel or amd in my mind. Even with QVLs, it meant playing silicon lottery once trying any kit that pushed the top end.
I feel like it's gotten worse with DDR5.
Memory maker. "It's not our fault. It's the MB maker." MB maker, "It's not our fault. It's the memory maker's fault." I saw much of this blaming back-and-forth in the early days of PC gaming. "Place your money on the table, and I'll spin the wheel of memory."
except in this case they will both also blame intel because the memory controllers being all over the place in terms of silicon quality is intel's fault.
Unless your buying a motherboard with only 2-DIMMS (2 slots for memory and NOT 4) Don't bother trying to run memory above 7800, because it wont work and will never work. And I also wish people understood what frequency actually does. There is MILLIONS of users trying to buy 8,000 + because they think "MORE IS BETTER!" and have ABSOLUTELY no idea what they are doing in the Bios. Reddit posts and UA-cam video comments just reinforce that with the kind of questions I am see'ing. Don't buy uber high frequency memory kits unless you actually understand how to overclock and thoroughly understand the mechanics of secondary and tertiary timings.
I have Trident Z5 DDR5-6000 16GBx2, but my latency numbers are CL40-40-40-76 1.30v. This is on my Z690 ROG Strix "E" mobo. I'm going to buy the new Intel 14900K to replace my 12900K. Will this same memory I already have continue to work? Or would you recommend that I scrap the above memory and buy different? You seem to know a great deal about memory so I wanted to get your opinion. Thanks in advance!!!
@@dabneyoffermein595 DDR5-6000 isn't horrible, but those timings aren't great for that speed. Have you tried tightening the timings on them?
@@idontneedthis66 How would I tighten the timings, those are the timings straight off the box from the manufacturer? Is there a way to change them? I would try to do that in a heartbeat if you think it would work.
@dabneyoffermein595 You change the timings in the BIOS. Have you even set the XMP-profile? The memory won't run at the advertised speed and timings unless you set the XMP-profile which you also do in the BIOS.
@dabneyoffermein595 Just my two cents here but think really long and hard about what a 14900K can do for you that the 12900K can't. I'm trying to save some money for you, maybe better spent on something else that would actually be a bigger bang for the buck. The 14900K is more or less just a re-branded 13900K, unfortunately.
This is grotesque. I can't believe that QVLs are being used as a marketing tool. I absolutely do not need a list of 'might work sometimes' memory modules, I need a list of 'guaranteed to work'.
I wonder if Intel is pushing it, the AMD QVL's seem much more sensible.
I am so happy you made this video - it needed to be said. It is also my understanding that XMP and QVL lists are exactly like you describe. And the reality was the instability you show, different brands, different speeds, different capacities, its problematic and unstable. Great vid
If you want a better sp rating.
Flush the cpu socket and cpu pads with electronics spray. Like a deep cleaning spray. Use a whole can. Then let it all dry up, 24 hours. Then using latex gloves only, reinstall it all and retest. Do the same with ram slots. I've seen a huge amount of ???? Come out of ram slots on brand new boards. Maybe flux idk.
But I have had fantastic luck with this process. Finger oil, or manufacturing oils idk. But its definitely something and the flush fixes. Go ahead, find out.
THERE IS SOMETHING GOING ON WITH THE INTERCONNECTS ON THESE BOARDS. DIG DEEPER
I remember when motherboards were capable of higher memory speeds but the manufacturers would warn you about possible issues. For example, the GA-990XA-UD3 (rev. 1.x). It says DDR3 2000 (O.C.) as the highest rated speed. I have this board. It can do over 2000Mhz, but requires a good Phenom II x6 with a lot of tweaking, or an FX series CPU. Same with the Evga X58 SLI boards. I can make it do DDR3 2400 with specific memory ICs, but 2000 is the highest QVL since that's the highest speed that should just work.
Hey BZ, what a fascinating video you uploaded! You have given so much information for your viewers to dissect. Keep uploading more of these types of videos BZ so there will be more discussion from your viewers about your videos!😊😊
Love these videos.
Question for you, I recently finally upgraded to AM5, got a 7800X3D & paired it with a set of 2x16GB G.Skill Neo EXPO 6000MHz CL30 memory kit - I am fairly certain that's one you & others highly recommend for AMD's side of things, you did some timings up for Hardware Unboxed when they did their Memory Timings video for AMD CPU performance - I'm just wondering if the timings on there that you gave them should "just work" for my setup, and secondarily, if the 1.25V SOC is actually needed for those timings?
Right now I'm running stock EXPO @ 1.35V VDIMM, 1.2V SOC and everything seems perfectly fine, as it should, since that's "stock EXPO" and all.
I guess there's always more optimism involved, as in "If we were to give Buildzoid enough time in our lab, could he do it?". On my 690 apex at the beginning I had some memory that wouldn't do its XMP yet I did better by manually tweaking it according to hints on your channel. I put it down to the combined newness of both ddr5 and 690 tech.
except it's not about fiddling with settings it's just a matter of binning more CPUs.
Buy a kit and hope it runs XMP! This is where we are at.
Buying a memory kit rated somewhere in XMP-6400 to XMP-7200 range is still an option.
Nice. Hopefully mems actually good or whats the point. Edit: ahhh i just needed to wait a few mins 😬
Seen the new Micron 24gb dimms in UK have you had any samples yet?
Any problems with coil whine on your Gigabyte boards? Gigabyte has the best slot layout for modern oversized GPU coolers, but I have read LOTS of reviews mentioning obnoxious coil whine.
I've not had any on the new boards. The original Z790 Master had coil whine when memory stress testing.
Xmp used to be set and forget. Now it is useless. My cpu supports 6400 with 4 dimms, my MB supports 6400 with 4 dimms. My ram does way more but I can't get it to run anything above 5600. Everyone writes that it is supported but it doesn't work. The point of xmp was that I wouldn't have to tune it manually let alone have to downclock it...
I don't necessarily mind that they put the fastest kits on the QVL's of boards that can do it in theory if you win the silicon lottery, but they really should at least highlight those rows in the QVL in RED or something that tells you it's not guaranteed. Like hey our board has been able to do this before but there's a good chance your CPU and/or RAM combo might not, buy at your own risk.
Now putting speeds on the QVL of a board with a 4 slot daisy chain topology that will NEVER get that speed working, no matter how golden of a golden sample your CPU is, that's just BS.
This is exactly what happened to me - very annoying when building such high budget and high performance systems.
I remember having these same problems fifteen years ago.. The story remains the same..
I love your videos!
Stupid question but were you able to run the RAM stable at 8000 with OC?
Thanks in advance
He was afaik, he said on twitter
I think you mentioned before we're just better off going for a lower clock and tightening timings. Either way I'm one of those guys that just wants xmp to work. I never knew the qvl worked like this. I actually thought they tested multiple cpus and they would all have to pass these settings....
I don't know if this has changed in the last 12 months, but in my experience it can be very difficult to find for sale the exact memory kits listed on a given QVL. I've always just stuck with moderately rated memory (a few pegs below the supposed limit, maybe a few pegs above JDEC), set XMP (or whatever that board maker calls it), and left it alone. It's almost always successful and gets me properly functional and stable RAM at a reasonable cost, even if my CPU might be just okay.
Thank you!!! I love these videos. Mostly because now I don’t seem insane. I have a 13900k I can’t get to post at 7200. WITH RAM THAT MSI SAYS WILL WORK!!! I have to drop my ram down to 7000 to get it to work.
Always have to be tweaking the system to make it perform better!😅😊
What is the Max ram speed you can reliably use on a asus z690 strix-f with a 13900k? My boards qvl says 6600 but I feel the 13900k should go higher considering the qvl says the same for the 12900k.
Again you amazed me by your review.
Very helpful to hear a savvy tech testing marketing claims.
Could you dive into USB audio stutter in Windows 11 on Z690 i7-13700k? Or any 13th gen?
Pulling my hears out from frustration not being able to fix this stutter. Never ever happened on my old i7-7700😊
Planning on getting i9 14900k and Msi Mpg Z790I Edge with 7200cl34 kit. My concern is that is the mobo good enough to handle such power hungry cpu and how far should I expect to manually overclock the rams? Don’t really see a point to spend over double amount more in the motherboard. xd
Hi.
What is the formula for tWtrl and wrwrscl subtimings? i know for tfaw is rrdsx4
What ddr5 to buy October 2023, some low effort content soon mr. BZ?
Note to Intel, supply binned CPU to BZ
So many people on the OC forums wanting to run 64gigs of RAM at 6000 CL30 with a 14900K.
What’s the likelihood of that happening with the average 14th gen CPU?
that should probably work as long as it's 2x32 and not 4x16.
@@ActuallyHardcoreOverclocking thank you. I was hesitant as it’s on a very average Gigabyte motherboard but good to know.
According to the video, looks like I'm kinda lucky to run xmp 7200 34-42-42-84 1.45v with 13700k and asus tuf z790. Always was used kingston kits, but this time bought ddr5 Patriot Viper Venom (yeah naming is pretty lame) but this kits not so long in hight and got 33-42 C temps. But most short one with same A-Die that I saw was out of stock and it was teamgroup t-force classic
Yay, a new BZ rant! :)
Finally explains everything! Thank you.
From where is that RAM Test binary? EDIT: Seems to be Karhu's RAM Test that is more user firendly than Prime95 :)
On a RYZEN 7950X3D system with a validated ECC implementation (single bit errors are logged, two-bit errors halt), how can linpack still fail? The problem must be in the IMC if the data can make it back and forth through RAM without triggering ECC, right? Maybe it needs gear 2?
I've never used ECC memory soooo I have no idea what it should behave like.
maybe your FCLK is too high or the SOC voltage is either too low or too high
@@TheBackyardChemist so anything? 😁 I'm burnt out on it for now because the turnaround time on this server board is so slow, training can take 15 minutes and it just freezes if it fails. So 20 minutes per iteration after resetting the CMOS!
@@shanent5793 Is linpack stable at stock? It is a very heavy load, and maybe the cores are unstable.
@@TheBackyardChemist with 2 DIMMs and cleared CMOS it boots up at 4800 CL40 and runs linpack for days. If I tighten to 5200 CL36 and auto PBO it's still 24/7 stable. SoC is around 1.00 V per HWINFO64 while the BMC says it's 50mV higher. There's no way to adjust the RAM voltage, it's fixed at 1.1V so I haven't tried to go faster.
Now with 4 DIMMs, it boots at 3600. Setting 4800 manually fails to train. 4800 + SoC 1.10V manually set boots but fails linpack, and locked up while idling over night. 4000, auto PBO is 24/7 stable.
Going from 3600 to 5200 was worth about 3% in Cinebench and made no difference in Starfield (133 fps). The Python, SQLite and Java application that I work on is better with the higher capacity of 4 DIMMS. I'm leaving it at 4000 for now, though I might look at it again during Christmas break, unless ThreadRipper 7000 is miraculously available 🙏
Dear BZ, thank for all of your work, sharing the in and outs of what hardware does potentially causing issues for us. I really liked that video, great job as usual, much appreciated. /Kind Regards ToMmYye_
All recent Intel boards I have are one dimm per channel. Can't be asked to waste time on 4 dimm boards.
Hi,
Do you have any information about average SP Score in Asus mobo for 14900k? I am trying to find any source, but can’t find anything :( It would be really helpful because I dunno if I should return mine..
For some reason the dark hero is more expensive than the apex encore here in Canada??
IME make sure both the ram maker and the mobo maker claim each other, if the ram maker doesn't have a list, goodbye to them - you wouldn't let a mobo maker get away with it.
also, based on many videos watched at this point - just get a good secondary-timed 6000 and move on with your life (this ignores the people who OC for the fun of doing and don't care about resulting performance, or don't that much because the journey is the thing for them).
For most people - XMP 1, plus, as in Giga land, enable those two settings in bios "high bandwidth" and "low latency" for great (relatively speaking) timings. The tuning beyond, unless you like that specifically, is not really worth it.
And here i was thinking (oh well 14th gen is bad but hopefully it has a good IMC..) oh boy was i wrong.. now i wonder if there's a big difference between a 12th gen and a 14th gen IMC, let's how much better (or worse) is the best 12th gen IMC vs the worst 14th gen IMC.
Can you review Apex Encore Z790 by Asus?
I know this is probably a complete duplicate of original Apex Z790, but you don't have a review on it either.
I just bought Encore board and will be testing it, would love to see your input
Buildzoid you should donate your schaisse quality 13900K to motherboard manufacturers with instructions to make new "shadow-qvl's" with that level of mem-controller. Would be a much more informative qvl list 😂 You can hit the xmp with any crap cpu you happen to get your hands on!
Is this less relevant for AMD since they seem to top out their QVLs at 6000 where mobo difference matters less or is it just that AMD has less variance in their controllers? (Or is it just as relevant for them just at 6000 instead of 8000?)
no, read the comments from various people who use AMD - either way, you can be screwed.
@@xBINARYGODx just infinite fabric things tbh it benefits speed more than intel imc(12-14th gen), some zen 4 cpus can go above 6200mbps like top 1% at 6800mbps.
It is less relevant for AMD generally because it's well known 6000 is the sweet spot. This is mostly for people who have a ton of money to spend on an expensive ram kit to find out it's really just a fake QVL list. If you aren't doing any of that stuff just buy 2 sticks of 6000 low latency sticks that run at safe speeds. The minor performance drop is worth saving money and headaches.
@@Navi_xoo I don’t think so because 8000 is well above the ‘sweet spot’ for Intel too. It’s just that some Intel parts get there easy and some do not.
Is it better to use xmp 1 or 2
people say XMP 1 load only primary timings and the mobo does the rest(auto), XMP 2 load all xmp timings.
some times the auto timings are lower = better but it depends if it's stable
try XMP 1 see all timings, then XMP 2 see all timings and then decide
I will let you know if my Master x does the 8200mhz xmp my 48g kit is rated for, just delded my 14900k today build should be done soon
What pisses me off the most, is that I have a system (Z790 Aorus Master, 13700k) that runs fine with 2 sticks of G-skill F5-6400J3239G16GX2 at 6400 using XMP, but I do not know if I can use another 2 sticks to take my system to 64GB now... I asked G-skill, who only told me to try it and see...
So now that the memory is half as cheap as when I built my system (first new build in 10 years), I may end up with 2 sticks I can't use, or have to lower the speed to below what I paid for.
I did do some research before building this system (since I hadn't built one in so long), so I chose what I thought was a good compromise at the time between speed and price, and it works absolutely fine, but not knowing if the memory controller can take 4 sticks at XMP 6400 is really bothersome. So now I'm waiting for the price of 96GB 6400 to come down significantly enough so I can @replace@ the 2 dimms I have and never have to worry about this again for another 10 years...
In general XMP only works for the kit. If you try to mix even copies of the same kit the settings will have to be different and the profiles on the stick aren't going to account for that
It all comes down to experiementing with your system to see what works or doesn't work and how well it performs. The kerfuffel in this matter is that you have to be shelling out the bucks to pay for your experiments!😮😊
You're not gonna get anything over 5600 to work with 4 sticks
Hi buildzoid, I shouldn't post here, but will do it, anyways, cause I don't know where else to put it!
I am currently on a 1st gen ryzen 5 1400 CPU with MSI B350 Tomahawk, 16 GB GSkill FlareX 3200 CL14 Samsung B-Die running in dual channel and gtx 1060 6 gb and I am planning to upgrade to ryzen 7 5800x3d. Is that motherboard good for daily use? I plan on using that CPU for the next 6-8 years until I will upgrade again, so the motherboard will have to keep it cool. I have Lian Li Lancool 216 case with 2 more lian li uni fans sl140 daisy chained to the top as exhaust and 1 more noctua nf a14 pwm as psu shroud intake for cooling. What do you think? Is that CPU gonna be fine for 6-8 years use on that motherboard or should I change the motherboard?
Maybe find a B550 motherboard if you want to try memory & bclk oc
@@emini6 I'm not interested in overclocking either the ram or the CPU. I will run them at 3200 CL14 and the timing and settings recommended by dram calculator (safe) for Samsung b-die and use PBO for the Ryzen 7 5800X3D.
Will that B350 tomahawk not be fine?
@@rOb3r7sMArTe7 welcome to the channel, it's all about everything overclocking and some build advice from the teacher BZ.
I have that 3d zen 3 cpu, it's mandatory to change the fclk(Infinite fabric Hz) as high as possible(1800-2000), mine tops at 1900 without any errors(Linux mce check).
Yeah that b350 is ok and fine, but it goes well with b550
he never said that@@emini6
its not mandatory @@emini6
QVL are pointless, you don't know how many CPU were tested and were actually working with a given kit nor how good they are (average SP for example).
In the first place, I don't even understand how Intel can state 8000+MHz. Most (90%+) people are dumb, they just enable the damn XMP profile if they even read the QVL in the first place to choose their memory. It would be fun if this bites Intel back (RMA or class action).
Recently a guy with an ASUS ROG STRIX Z790-E GAMING WIFI bought a 7600MHz kit which was listed on its QVL, guess what, surprise (or not), he couldn't even boot with XMP (has to lower it to barely 7200)...
I'm sure no RMA or class action can be had. Intel said it "can" (read "some CPUs"). And it's also XMP, so nothing guaranteed. BZ here demonstrated that the 8000 MT/s holds. Surely there's a CPU out there that will be able to do 8200 or 8266 MT/s. And that's enough for Intel's claims, legal-wise. In reality is more like "hey, some CPUs work with 8000 so most likely it will work with 7200 with any random CPU".
5:32 was DDR4 this bad?? I wasn’t in tune with it back then, but DDR5 seems to just be a pain…do 4 dimms not work at all? I can’t even boot with 4 dimms on anything but stock 3800mhz. It just feels like it’s some stupid bios setting to open up the memory controller to allow it, when don’t the claiming board manufacturers roll out a guide for it if supposedly works…
ah man im currently really sad bc im hella affected on this one right now bc im on QVL Listed 16GBx2 7600MHz CL36 Ram Kit with an 14 900K on a Mag Z790 Tomahawk Max Wifi and the xmp profile is not stable.. I can chill on the desktop for 8 hours but as soon as I hop in a game im crashing and tm5 usmus.cfg gives constantly errors..
what about shit IMCs and degrading die (and eventual sudden CPU death)? does enabling XMP still voids the warranty(CPU RMAbility)?
what is your question?
If that CPU is ryzen yes cuz amd have the tools(amd PSP) to check the cpu conditions & records. Intel have iME on the motherboard chipset, but idk if intel have the tools for checking the CPU maybe with voltage checks for damage, but they can just replace it under warranty just say the cpu died and play dumb
This is why my rule of thumb is to either just go Jdec or only slightly above with reasonable timings. The benefit is just not worth the headache personally. The last CPU i seriously overclocked was the i7920 and i only pushed that to 3.8ghz. I still watch technical overclocking content cos it's interesting and sometimes I gleen useful tips to tweak stuff but I already do too many things the hard way in my life lol.
I feel like intels pcore ecore is strategy is making it hard for them to do the tight bins they prefer. The issue is that theyre marketing the memory as "up to" the performance of the top 10 or 20 percent of chips instead "at least" the performance of the bottom 10 or 20 percent.
In my opinion anyways. Feel free to call me out if im missing something lol
I wonder actually if the spread is higher on i9's and i7's than it is on the lower core count chips..
Cause there's no discount sku an i9 with a bad imc can become
nah intel always binned really loose. The only reason the cores are rather consistent these days is because they need to be able to hit the really high turbo boost speeds. Back in the DDR3 days when CPUs shipped at less than 4GHz stock your cores could do anything from say 4.5 to 5.2 at the same voltage depending on how good the chip was.
@@ActuallyHardcoreOverclocking gtk. Thanks!
It's just they market their products to make them seem better than what they are so they can boost their sales and improve their bottom line!😂😊
I got a 7200 teamgroup pro create 16x2gb w a 14900fk coming in on Sunday with the MSI Z790 Pro A wifi. Imma squeeze as much OC out of the ram as possible and then upgrade mobo in the future when I''m not broke again lol
Can i use a 14900K i9 Intel chip in my socket of my ASUS Strix "E" DDR5 Mobo? Will I actually get 6GHz on a Z690 Mobo?
Yes
@@omegaPhix Oh, excellent, I'm going to order the 14900K tonight and I really appreciate it. I can't wait to get 6GHz on my z690 gaming PC!!!!!
@@dabneyoffermein595 Remember, it's six gigahertz on one core not all of them
@@emini6 ok, single core only, got it. I use a product / game called MSFS-2020 among other racing games.....Single core 6GHz should work good, I think I can use the Intel utility to control the cores that the game uses if memory serves me right. (can't remember the name). But my goal is to take out my 12900K from my Z690 DDR5 Mother Board (it's a ROG Strix "E") and put the 14900K into the existing mobo CPU socket and then put the Corsair closed-loop cooling back onto the new chip, taking the 12900K out and seeing about selling it (I have the original packaging) hoping to gain 1 entire Gigahertz (I'm currently sitting at 5.0 GHz on a good day-in turbo mode in the BIOS settings). I also try to use the XMP but some people tell me to turn that off. If I remember correctly, my memory is some of the early Trident Z5 DDR5 F5-6000U4040E16GX2-TZ5RS (DDR5-6000 16GBx2). CL 40-40-40-76. 1.30v Memory. So I'd like to pop in this new Intel chip (14900K) and see if that gives me more lanes on my PCI bus and faster graphics for my gaming. If I need to upgrade to 64GB RAM from 32GB RAM, let me know that as well and thanks so much for all the help !!!
What's a nice "sweet spot" frequency for DDr5 that most Intel CPUs should be able to do just fine? Currently running 4266c16 BDIE and was considering switching to DDR5.
it depends on the board. If you have a cheap 4 dimm board you're not getting past 7200
@@Neucher alright thanks. I have a D4 board anyway so I’d need a new one :) was planning to just get a cheap t create kit and oc that.
@@IIHydraII if you don't want to be bottlenecked frequency wise z790i edge is the best board for the price. It can do 8000 if your CPU and RAM can.
@@IIHydraIII too have 13900k/4200c15 and have thought about going DDR5. I was hoping for an MSI Z790 Unify-X but since it didn't come out, I felt like $650+ for an Apex just wasn't worth it for me. If you do go this route you'll probably want to watercool your RAM for best results. Have fun!
@@Neucher awesome, thanks for the suggestion :)
That's a well deserved rant
Are the 2x24GB any good on AMD X3D cpus?
slightly worse than 2x16gb a-die but ehhhh if you really need the additional 2x24gb RAM go for it.
M-dies yes for more tighter timings at around 6000-6800mbps(average to top 1% cpus)
what "RAM Test" tool is that?
Karhu RAM test.
@@ActuallyHardcoreOverclocking thanks.
64 gskill s5 5600mhz +14900k xmp works from box. the kingston 4x8gb xmp doesnt work on 5600 and bsod my every day...
This is why I stuck with DDR4
As long as everyone knows this, I don't see how its a problem. Even if they don't know, they will find out eventually.
Intel has fell off for sure though.
I was helping some flightsim bro with his intel rig I think it was a 12700 or maybe a 13700
he fried a channel on his imc running XMP
he then RMA'd everything, but did the CPU last (this is when I started helping him), which of course was the problem
anyway he was too "busy" to properly setup his new cpu
I did my best to turn down the voltages, but he didn't want to spend the time he needed to, to help me check everything
and even with XMP off and on ASUSS default settings
fried a channel on his IMC within a week on his new CPU
so their were multiple voltages that were way too high (I had turned down I think the SOC which was way too high, but obviously something else was too high also)
I think he just gave up on PC's after that, which was sad cause its hard to find flightsim bros
Intel as fallen so far...
It's about time you build the Mother of mother boards and show those big idiots how it's done.
And people say AMD has a hard time with memory. Yeah...
I'd like to see how high the memory can go on the cheapest new gigabyte Z790 Aorus Elite X against the £1000 motherboard (Gigabyte z790 Aorus xtreme X)
cheap 4 dimm board = good luck getting past 7200. Maybe the top of the top CPUs can do 7600.
@@Neuchernew Gigabyte z790 x series boards will at least run 7800mhz stable
@@Decki777 Dual rank ?
7600 should work as long as you don't get a trashbin CPU.
Guru of PC's!
Was suprised when i switched from z790 hero that could only stable 7200, to a gigabyte z790 xtreme x which would boot 8000 and game for only 10-30 minutes with their preset for 2x24 hynix 8000. Im not fluid with gigabyte Ocing. Would like to see an Gigabyte ddr5 oc video. Have you tried the gigabyte ram presets ? Oh my gskill 2x24 7200 works fine at 7600 no tweaking. Also ASUS had / have a "Ram QVL guaranteed to work" on the mobos overview sales pages. Im not saying where they have it so it wont get taken down. I screen shotted it and their mods went quiet about it when i posted it. :)
yeah the gigabyte 8000 2x24 preset is just as unstable as the kit's own XMP profile.
6:26 yes
Rant video 🥳🍿
i got lucky and my apex-e + 14900k xmp with ddr5 8000 cl38 m die 2x24gb kit. Zero errors after 7 hours of stability testing. And zero crashes maybe its not 10000% solid but pretty good.
Hey Buildzoid, you might want to take a look at AMD mobos and their QVL lists too. Many of them also have 8000mts DDR5 listed.
Could be 2:1 mode
@@emini6 I'm sure it is but Intel could go Gear 4 mode and hit 8000mts too.
@@jjlw2378 true, but we don't know how the motherboard manufacturers put up their qvl lists with what mode/gear and top% cpu quality
@@emini6 it must be a 2:1 mode. AMD cpu's barely do anything over 6200 for average or 6400 for better than average CPU (1:1 mode).
@@volodumurkalunyak4651 I know, it's just that motherboard manufacturers don't wanna put extra details on their lists, hopefully they listen to us and do it. Also 1:1 mode for zen 4 goes at a range of 6000-6800mbps(average to top 1% cpu quality)
Winter is coming...................14th gen might just be useful, after all!
P.S. How much is the responsibility of the MB mfg, and how much is the responsibility of the controller on the cpu, like with AMD. My 2700 won't run 4 sticks of 8GB 3200MHz\CL14 but my 5600X will on a B450M Mortar.
I think it's both and it's only the thing of which of them you hit first. First Zen and Zen+, it was most likely the memory controller. Zen 2 and Zen 3 had better memory controllers so onow there were more cases where the MB was the limiting factor.
Why I just read what AMD said when it came to the RAM speed specification, yes it can run faster, I also know it will be stable, and in the long run stable tends to win.
Wish i seen this video before i went and got 7200mhz gskills. After few days of tweaking i managed to get them stable on 7000mhz 😢 with the asus z790a prime wifi and 14600kf
42:04 wtfh is intel smoking 8000+mbps(not MTs) showing that slide. Idk if their engineers really changed the IMC and told marketing the truth or marketing is just guessing with the QVL lists from motherboard manufacturers.
I know for a fact some people compare QVLs and make their purchases based on that, so you’re not wrong it’s marketing. I haven’t trusted QVLs since ddr5 came out.
Glad I stuck with ddr4
I can't get 7200 XMP to work with my 13700K on a Z790-F
I run the same cpu and motherboard, and a g.skill TridentZ5 6400c32 32GB kit set to 7200c32-43-16-39-32, trfc450 and trefi65536 etc.. It's mostly there now, but it has been a fight to say the least. I've had to hunt sweet spot voltages for both mc (1.475v) and cpu vddq (1.31v), in addition to dram vdd (1.58v) and vddq (1.54). For some reason my cpu hates synced dram vdd and vddq, it won't train unless vddq is at least 20mv under vdd. Good luck.
poor baby
@@spaghettilocomotive Thanks for this reply. I might try buying a g.skill kit
I've always wanted an Apex but my fingers always put a Hero in my shopping basket.
The Apex Encore is US$649 MSRP while the Dark Hero is US$699 MSRP
@@ExtremeExtollingat this price point who cares get the one you think is the coolest tbh
I got a z690 hero for $249.
@@ExtremeExtolling 😮
@@ronniekregar3482 👍
I miss the days you could buy binned cpus from third party websites
this could have been 5 minutes. you are going round in circles.
BZ is trying to make us understand the ramifications of using boards and CPUs that to perform up to snuff like the manufacturers claim they are going to!😅😊
Nah nope sorry if you needed that much info in a sort time, some of us pay attention
You would be a really good guest for Moore's Law is Dead. Especially with this recent 14th gen launch
Z790 aorus master here. Can’t get 48gb 7200, 32gb 7800 or even 32gb 6000 to work on my 3 kits of ram on 14900k. Not even at stock settings. Am a computer expert with 1000 builds under belt. Shit is so trash like peak amd ASUS ram issue level
XMP is a LOTTERY! It is not a guaranteed speed. Only the default slow speed is guaranteed. If you happen to win the silicon lottery, great. If not, oh well.
hmmm, how many years has it been that BZ's claimed he's done with the Intel memory controller and how many more years until he's actually done with it? 😜
Yes, it's arguable that he is actually done with it, but it's funnier this way. :D
And here I found out yesterday when checking the bios on my X470 board that my ram was accidently running at 2133 :P
I miss Intel having real cores.
Why not just call out every MB manufacturer that lists non working QVL's, and intel and most RAM makers ... as literal liars?
If they say that XMP should work with QVL's, and they dont, then are they not just lying?
The only QVL list I trust is APEX's (including z790 apex and encore), gigabyte? Their QVL list is a joke...
Both company's qvl list sucks tbh, but that apex board has good records on hwbot so it depends on the cpu quality
I cant run even 7000mhz (with 7400 kit) on 14700kf
The real question is if multi billion dollar companies like Microsoft, Amazon google and others don't need ram that runs at above 5600mhz why would you considering that they top engineers in the us to work for them
The real question is if multi billion dollar companies don't run their cpu cores past 3ghz, why would you?
Also, coming from your "im sick of running a channel" video. Try making your topics smaller and put out shorter videos. Maybe label them though so us old schoolers who like the long form ramble can get our fix
1st
Just forget Intel and DDR-8000 altogether.
Intel sampling buildzoid? They must be getting really desperate!
I got sampled for 12th and 13th gen too.
The guys over at Intel are just beginning to like BZ!😊
When AMD is more consistent and can achieve memory speeds that Intel can't reliably, that is a big deal.
Even though those memory speeds are almost useless for AMD. But Intel was for a long time "better" than AMD when it came to this.
Amd cant hit more rofl, they are way worse. 1:4 memory divider doesnt stress IMC or ram because of the lack of throughput so It was an invalid test. Just because Buildzoid showed it doesnt make it possible with current mb and Ryzen imc. He even said something to that extent in his vid.
@@impuls60 I said that it is next to useless on AMD (literally 1 or 2 benchmarks could see an improvement, so in some extreme OC scenario it is viable - possibly). I'm not trying to claim that it is a game changer. i'm just saying that it is weird feeling when AMD can hit stable 8000 (even though it is useless) and Intel has more troubles with it, despite them being a company that sort of always had this big edge in running RAM much, much faster.
And yes, Infinity Cache and other bottlenecks again make it useless on AMD CPU's. I just thought it was funny that AIB's claim those speeds for Intel, yet, you will have to be super lucky to hit some of those. And in some cases it is straight up fantasy.