@@AilinOGriobhtha Flavio has truly been reborn. I mean he has come back to the sport after receiving a lifetime ban. To be fair to him though it didn’t say in the rules that it was not allowed so technically he didn’t break any rule that was in place at the time. Lol
well that's a different kind of cheating where a crash was forced to give a win to a different driver, in this instance he meant engineering "cheating".
@@cessactdm I do realise that it was engineering type cheating that was being discussed but the particular comment I was responding to mentioned Flavio Briatore. He is of course known for the incident in Malaysia but I could of also brought up the very strange options available to Micheal Schumacher in 1994. The traction control option that they accidentally left in the system of only one of their cars and could only be accessed via a certain sequence of button presses. Of course they never used it or the traction control system that wasn’t traction control. They did manage to win a world championship despite Micheal making a “mistake “ in Adelaide and not finishing. All in a team led by Flavio, who we can’t really blame for the engineering “mistakes”, I mean he is just a T Shirt salesman after all.
@@sloppynyuszi Yeah it’s funny about that. Honestly looking at the situation and the racing IQ of Fernando I would not be surprised at all if the origin of the idea came from him whilst driving the car. A gentle message to the team along the lines of “Gee guys if we get lucky and catch a safety car in the next few laps we will be in a great position for the win here”. Fernando is that good at thinking about the situation of the race which we have seen time and again. Of course he is pretty good with the whole sergeant Shultz routine as well lol
My favourite “rule bend” was in 1999 when 3 F1 teams found out that the sensor in the grid to detect false starts was activated exactly 1 second before the lights went out. So they intercepted the signal from the sensor and set up a system that would beep in the driver’s ear 0.99 seconds after the activation so they would start the moment the lights went out. They were caught at a race in Germany when the start lights malfunctioned amd stayed on but these 6 cars moved at the exact moment they should have turned off. From the next race, the sensors were turned on at a random time before the lights went out.
Is this true??? I've never heard this before. But do remember that start. The one where Frentzen and Hakkinenn both went even though the lights were still on red
@@Phoenix1664it was the 1999 European GP. I believe you are thinking of the right incident. It is true, though there is some speculation that the lights didn’t malfunction, but purposely kept on to catch the cheaters. There is no evidence that this is true, though.
@@n.w.owhoknowstheshadowknow58 that is not always true. Look at the 2007 spy gate scandal. The way information is obtained can sometimes definitely be cheating. That being said, the 3 teams weren’t punished. The means of this way of cheating was just removed
As far as I can tell, Formula 1 is the most multi-dimensional sport in the world… two simultaneous championships encompassed by a design and engineering competition where teammates are often rivals.
@@Spankster. Yes it’s quiet a dichotomy. You have maybe 1000 people including two drivers who all work together to make the fastest car. Then the only guy that you really need to beat home and make sure you’re faster than on a Sunday is that same guy who you worked with to make the car better.
Kind of. It's always about 1 team coming up with avoiding regulations or finding loopholes and other teams pointing to the loophole so the FIA ban it or just trying to compete with a winning team. And there is also Ferrari fucking up in a Ferrari way
The true geniuses don't find ways to break the rules..... They find ways to figure out what the rule book DOESN"T say..... The great Smokey Yunick once told of the NASCAR rule that the gas tank had to hold 26 gallons.... But nowhere did it mention the fuel line.... So Smokey made a fuel line that held 6 gallons.....
The best way to gain an advantage in sports is to find a way to take advantage of existing rules that allow you to have an edge within the confines of the game’s existing rules. Using my favorite sport of hockey for example, so back in the day when there were no penalties for hitting someone in the head and a player by the name of Scott Stevens realized as long as he didn’t commit any other penalties while hitting an opponent in the head like elbowing, interference, or charging to name a few, he could intentionally injure and take out the other teams star players with a headshot without breaking any existing rules at that time. To Scott Stevens credit, it worked and he wasn’t penalized for giving at least a dozen opponents star players a concussion throughout his career.
@@BobbyBoucher228 thats a really bad example in my opinion, he literally just found a way to intentionally harm people without penalty you shouldnt really give credut to something like that... like wow, so smart of people to just cut off heads 2000 years ago, because they didnt have a rule against it, credit to them for figuring that out
Loved Mclarens extra brake pedal for brake steer and the fact it was only the media taking pics of the car after an event that it was detected and outlawed.
Was really surprised that he didn't mention this one! That was quite a scandal in the mid-90s. Then we had allegations of traction control as well in the mid to late 90s.
Please dont say that... he was an icon yes but a terrible commentator. I have watched F1 since 1992 and he is by far the worst of them and on top of that his voice was pain to listen to.
Well he surmise the F1 series in a whole Stating that F1 is about cheating..and it can be said in the last 3 decades for sure there was always the engineers of these teams coming up with all types of shenanigans to circumvent the rules and personally I think they did a damn good job of it..
@@edbr2379There is so much more to spygate. Like how they nearly got away it until Alonso threatened Ron Dennis that he would tell the FIA all about it after an argument they had which led Ron to run to the FIA first and essentially say that if Alonso tells you we have been spying on Ferrari he's lying which only got them resulted in them investigating the matter further. Ferrari were also first made aware of this when they received a random email from the guy who was asked to print copies of Ferrari documents. The guy who also leaked the information from Ferrari was doing so out of spite after he failed to get a promotion and a few years after spygate all came out he unfortunately committed suicide.
@@jimijames6449yes we as Brits are well aware of the spelling difference. We're also aware of homophones, puns and wordplay. Sometimes we like being "naughty" with words.
Cheating in Motorsport is amazing to hear about. Darrell Waltrip told stories on Dale Earnhardt Jr’s podcast about shedding weight on the fly and using nitrous to qualify faster and they’d hide the nitrous bottle in the pipes of the roll cage inside the car. Absolutely genius stuff. It’s so creative and innovative. Is it dirty? Absolutely, but it’s simultaneously brilliant stuff.
My favorite cheat was when Ferrari was apparently adding extra fuel into their engines around 2019. They found out at what rate the FIA fuel measurement system was reading the fuel, and managed to create a fuel system that pulsed extra fuel through in the milliseconds between when the device was measuring. I can’t even begin to imagine the engineering and coding that went into that, but they pulled it off. Until they were caught they had a very fast car
1.They were never caught 2. That was not a cheating pu as the fia never claimed it as such (not even in one of their usual statements) 3. All the so-called "secret agreement" between Ferrari and Fia had stood because Ferrari's bosses literally sh*t in their pants for having made something in a grey zone, as a matter of fact we don't even know if it was them controlling in some way the flow meter sensor, that was just a huge speculation (the fia doesn't know as of today what they even did with the pu in the first place). Not to mention Ferrari used that PU for like 2 or 3 races whereas Mercedes used Das (illegal system) for the whole year or Redbull using asymmetric braking for 1 year and a half (or mclaren using exceptionally illegal wings for 3/4 of the season), ludicrous and disgusting double standards towards teams based in britain
@@TheFoggyjonesloopholes are great. Cheating isn’t. Mercedes’ DAS blew my mind. Perfectly legal bit of trickery and a phenomenal piece of engineering. Ferrari coming from nowhere to win in monza. Lewis Coming from nowhere to win in silverstone. Max coming from nowhere to win in Holland. Not so cool.
@@EleventhMonkeytbf i think rep damage will only be to the team who cheated not the manufacturer as the teams mostly operate as standalone company and parent company only really gets involed when they are struggling. Take what renault did in 2008 as a example. How often do you hear people blame renault for it. I very rarely hear it as its allways big flavio who gets the blame.
The cooperate side of toyota would only of known what the ceo of TTE told them. You really think the heads of toyota really got involed in the engineering/design/r&d etc of all the cars they manufacture for sports or commercial or industrial use.
@@brianshorey I’m in Australia so it’s probably impossible to find here but thanks for letting me know. I would love to read it. Even at that price it is probably worth it
The reason F1 cars have wings is because Colin Chapman was at Indianapolis in 1963 when Smokey ran a huge wing on his car. The Lotus GP cars had wings shortly afterwards.
The US are generally fans of sports that are in stadiums and it’s a great marketing thing really. Everyone gets a great view… they took motocross, put it in a stadium and called it supercross for example.
Drive to survive has made MANY MANY people in the US fans of F1, even outside of the show. I now watch all the races and follow the teams before the show drops after the season.
i know here in australia we haven't invented seats we just play our pro sports in random paddocks, no one knows when or where. we should look into these things called "stadiums"
Lancia took cheating to the next level when they were in rallying. Absolute pirates. Pretending to have issues with their seatbelts on the start line so that they could let the dust settle before setting out. Sending team members out onto the course to put road salt on icy patches to help since they didn't have AWD. Constantly skirting and sometimes transgressing the rules. Great story.
I went there in 2019 and "it's just driving in circles" , there , I said it ! But not only that , the first 170 or so laps is just fuel saving , only after the last pitstop they actually show their speed and it's a sprint to the finish .
When the soort routinely has to hold hearings wherein teams argue about what counts as a hole versus an edge (this was Brawn's double-diffuser), you know the teams are trying absolutely everything. Williams's mass-dampener. McLaren's f-duct. Mercedes's double-DRS. All of those were in the last 20 years, and those are the ones we know about.
The problem here in comparing F1 to NASCAR is that Chris knows very little about NASCAR, and Joe doesn't know anything about racing at all. The cheating in NASCAR is every bit as clever and technologically advanced as in F1. Look at the twisted sister cars and tell me they weren't playing in the same gray areas as the 2017 T-wings.
@@DJP946 There's more engineering talent here than a lot of European fans want to credit. An American put wings on his cars years before Colin Chapman, and sucker fans years before Gordon Murray.
How do you cheat in Nascar? My understanding is that the brick they use to hold down the accelerator pedal and the string they tie to the steering wheel to keep it turning left have to be standardised?
@@trev3971Engineering talent in the US? Absolutely. But engineering in NASCAR is nowhere near F1. To quote Clint Bowyer: “These Damn Europeans And Their Spaceship Cars”
I would so buy that book. Loved Murray Walker so much. He made so many errors but they were all endearing and was so part of his charm. Nobody was a bigger cheerleader for British drivers, especially his beloved Nigel Mansell. Chris, please write that book.
@@enniol8043 Don’t worry Murray has you covered. He did his own book and I’m pretty sure you can find it on UA-cam as an audio book with Murray narrating it. The man could make watching grass grow sound bloody exciting and worth continuing to watch lol
@@Jcnbusiness I bought the audio book and listened to it. He narrated it and hearing his voice again brought back my childhood. If Murray was speaking about a driver, you could bet it was his teammate that was having an issue.
the Lotus 78 was the first 'wing-car.' But it was a compromise so didn't work on all circuits. The Lotus 77 was the 'adjustable' car that Peterson hated so left after one GP (in 1976). The first proper 'wing-car' was the aching beautiful Lotus 79.
A friend of mine was convinced most people cheated, especially in karting. He said about having 2 identical helmets, one filled with lead. So, when you pulled into the weighing area, you would pass the normal one to your mechanic who would go off to the van. Then, you would suddenly turn around and shout, "Hey, bring my helmet back, I need it for weighing in!" Of course, he would bring the lead-lined helmet!
indeed schumacher turned up to the formerly annual FIA driver weigh in... with a helmet where the padding was removed and was replaced with lead shot. ferrari then could race with 20kg less weight in the car. because of that, we now weigh the driver at every race.
When Chris said that formula one is more complex than nascar, he wasn't lying or trying to take a dig at NASCAR in any way. Formula 1 is technically more complex than NASCAR because of all of the different electronics in telemetry and different technology formula 1 uses compared to NASCAR. Mechanically NASCAR engineers are probably better than formula 1 engineers.
The rally car cheating was brilliant because the illegal bypass was spring loaded so it would disappear when the components were taken apart for inspection.
"Oval racing is boring" says someone that has never watched oval racing. These cars are doing 190 mph for hours on end, WOT 90% of the race. That takes more concentration than anything else
My favorite cheating story is a car that had a DRS rear wing but no one could prove it because they didnt have high speed cameras yet and the officals could not find the mechanism that caused it everytime they inspected the car.
That 1995 celica GT-Four was a terrible car even with the illegal turbocharger. I remember Kankkunen talking about it with his co-driver Nicky Grist on a podcast a while back.
In go karting in the UK, the drivers used to hide a tennis ball in their race overalls to wedge into the exhaust down the straights to provide more back pressure and performance from the engine ha
F1 in the 90’s we saw soooo many crooked deviants in all positions in the sport: a driver, person(s) within teams (Flavio for example), FIA, Bernie.. These days it’s about reading the regulations, and trying to find a grey area and exploit that until other teams suspect something which will lead FIA to investigate and either consider it okay or not allow it and you have to remove it from the car. If so then they’ll tighten up the regs so that it can’t be explored anymore.
No there definitely is cheating if there is a rule that an engine can only take a certain amount of fuel at max volume and you don't obey by those rules and get caught. The only reason Ferrari cheating a couple of years ago was swept under the rug by the FIA is because Ferrari makes them a shit load of money with their regignition and prestige within motorsports
There's one true story about them having lead shot (bb's or whatever), and it was put inside the rails/frame. After the race would start, they'd pull the release and it would empty out. Suddenly the car was hundreds of pounds lighter. The inspectors wouldn't find the release hole because it was located at the spot where the jack was put to raise the car up.The jack was plugging/covering the hole.
Wasn't the saying in NASCAR, "if you ain't cheating you ain't trying"? Been a fan of F1 since i was a kid and you only saw it in USA on Wide World of Sports, and I still watch it and respect it hugely, but there is a difference in the racing styles between F1 and NASCAR (which I haven't watched in 25 yrs) in that open wheel racing things get stretched out a lot and there's not as much overtaking or even side by side racing, which is the major draw in NASCAR so on merit of viewing it depends on what you want to see. But both sports have had MASSIVE cheating scandals over the decades and always will have, it's racing
This makes total sense especially when he was talking about the Toyota car when it was in a drag race the Toyota just disapreaed into the distance .every one knew they were cheating .Read Dwain Chambers book and ask me how Usain Bolt can beat the worlds best sprinters while they were on drugs and not just one person at least 5 drug takers he beat then look at Ben Johnson win on drugs and dont laugh when you find out Usians trainer was a fully qualified chemist
NASCAR having shot or ball Barings in the side panels that dropped all the shot out to make the car lighter after the initial weight check before but not after the races in the 80s.
Most of the "cheating" in F1 isn't cheating but finding loopholes or grey areas that aren''t explicitly ruled out. Then the are serious, explicit cheating which results in bans or fines unless you're Ferrari then it'll probably be a slap on the wrist at most.
'Mark Donohue did some Formula One racing too'.... "Dark' mark Donohue DIED in a Formula One crash, during practice for the 1975 Austrian Grand Prix, an accident in which a Marshal was also killed. Donohue did not initially seem severely injured, was conscious when they put his stretcher in the ambulance, as was waving to the cameras. He was initially evaluated and deemed non critical, having only a slight headache, later, it worsened significantly in short period of time, and he was taken to Graz hospital, where he slipped in to coma soon after admission, and died from a brain injury. This accident was one of the catalysts for Jackie Stewarts safety campaign to improve F1, his friend and protege Francois Cevert's death was the beginning of his campaign, but Donohue's was the cause for Stewart's camp to insist in much improved trackside medical facilities so serious internal injuries, especially cranial ones.
@@Apis4 extremely sad and you are of course correct. It really was the accident that caused the drivers to say enough is enough and insist on changes. There was some rumblings before that but this tragedy did seem like the tipping point. Mark Donahue was such a great racer in different disciplines. He really does deserve to be remembered as one of the best the United States has produced.
@@Jcnbusiness It was q process, Stewart took point, on driver safety improvements after Cevert died, at first with actual track layout and run off areas, then after Peter Revson died on the unfaced barriers at Kyalami and then Hemuth Keoniggs horror decapitation, at Watkins Glen , both in 1974, the barriers were on the list, and then, when Donoghue, and a fella I'm struggling to recall, both died after their accidents, the bloke I'm thinking off died en route to hospital...at Imola...I think, due being airlifted in an unpresdurosec helicopter, causing some kind of worsening to what was initially deemed a severe but treatable head injury....then inadequate trackside medical facilities were also highlighted and added to the cause. Stewart knew them all, had been deeply hurt and permanently traumatized by Joachim Rindts death at Monza in ...1970? He and Rindt were close friends, more, his wife, and Linda, Rindts wife, we're best friends. He chalked it up to the risk of the game, initially irrc, but then he lost Cevert, followed by half a dozen more friemds and colleagues in the next 5 years. He became determined after Cevert to see changes, and learnt from each following tragedy, intent to not let them be pointless, and each one improve the safety in each area. So the sport went 20 years without a fatality after Ratzenberger and Senna in 94, and has gone a decade now without even a career ending injury. That was paid for by Donohue et al, the least they could have done is remember his legacy properly!
@@Apis4 The sports ambivalence over driver safety was mad compared to today, Stewart was always aware and I think Jim Clarks death brought it home as well as an accident Stewart himself had where he was trapped in a car covered in fuel at Spa in 66 for BRM, he was lucky as a sudden shower not only saw him go off but a couple of other drivers as well and they managed to get him out of the car. I'm pretty sure the ambulance that eventually picked him got lost on the way to hospital as well.
@@gs8494 Yup, he smashed THHROUGH A FARM at the infamous Masta Kink back in the Glorious Triangle days of Spa. Got stuck hanging through the ceiling upside down fueling spilling out. Clark, a fellow Scott, was the accident which opened his eyes, Rindt was what made him begin pushing, and Cevert lit a fire under him. But his own accident really made him understand just how bad it was. Then watching people like Donohue, Revson, Koenig et al, die just continued being revelation, after revelation as to just how many levels of insanely unsafe the sport was. Just what areas needed addressing, everything from track design and layout, to barriers, to pit and practice procedures, to fire safety and indeed, trackside medical help. All of it had been inadequate for years, and drivers were dying in accidents that should NOT have killed them.
@@Apis4 You are of course correct. Jackie Stewart has been a driving force behind the continued rise in the safety of motor racing which has led to all forms of the sport being much safer. I think the real moment for him was his own accident which occurred at Spa. From Memory he went off and crashed through some sort of shed and came to rest against a tree. He was stuck in the car because he couldn’t remove the steering wheel and only with the help of a spectator who happened to have a spanner with him was he able to get out. No event officials or what passed for an ambulance arrived at the accident scene for quite some time as well. Jackie talked about the incident in a podcast at some point and it sounded pretty horrible and a real turning point for him. Although Jackie thankfully survived so many of his close friends did not. Jochen Rindt died on the way to hospital in Italy. I think the other driver you may have been referring to was Piers Courage who died in 1970 at Zandvoort. The car he was driving had a magnesium body. When the car went off it caught fire and magnesium unfortunately burns well. Piers had no chance and I seem to recall Jackie talking about it as he was in close proximity at the time and of course the race wasn’t stopped so the drivers were continuing to race past the crash site and could see the wreckage. I could be wrong though because Jo Schlesser died in a very similar situation a few years earlier. I think that was in France. You are correct in saying that the current day drivers and in fact all participants at any level of Motorsport have the people who sadly lost their lives to thank for the safety we now enjoy. Each and every one of them should be remembered. And along with people like Sir Jackie Stewart as well as many others who have pushed for continued safety improvements, should be treated with great respect. As a quick aside Sir Jackie was also a champion shooter who only just missed out on Olympic selection. A remarkable man and a legend as well as being a genuinely nice guy to boot.
If anyone is interested in more weird interpretations of the rules search up the Brabham BT46 otherwise known as the "fan car".. wasn't considered cheating but was banned in the same season it was introduced
@@joshualamp2438 in motor racing they are kind of like a rough guideline. I mean until you get caught then it’s probably not in the rules or if it is then they have to figure out how you have done it to catch you. Right?
Lotus is far and away my favorite F1 team and the cars are some of my all time favorites, but if you want great laugh out loud funny cheating stories, F1 has nothing on Nascar. Smokey Yunick was a genius at cheating snd he had a sense of humor while doing it.
It wasn't a cheat tho. The rules were applied according to the race director, who has total control. He may have applied them incorrectly or flexed the rules abit, but no rules were broken
--History of cheating in F1, ---" Some of the stories ive heard are so good....some of the cheats ive heard about are just so brilliant....Theres amazing stories of just amazing cheats''' proceeds to tell absolutely none of them. GFYrself
6:49 nascar is even more ingenious, they would and still do I bet set distractions so when they have a major cheat in the engine or body they purposefully do something very obv on inspection that isn’t a big deal but will be seen very obviously in hopes they don’t check the other stuff.
Cheating isn't the right word here. Flavio style crashgate is cheating and nothing ingenious about it. What we love to see is engineers who outsmart the rule book. Things like flexible wings, double diffusers, J dampers, F ducts, etc.
The fact that he's talking about cheating in F1 and motorsport in general and Flavio Briatore's name hasn't cropped up is an outrage lmao
@@AilinOGriobhtha Flavio has truly been reborn. I mean he has come back to the sport after receiving a lifetime ban. To be fair to him though it didn’t say in the rules that it was not allowed so technically he didn’t break any rule that was in place at the time. Lol
Well he got caught… so maybe that’s why? The fact that we all believe Alonso was unaware though 😂😂😂😂😂
well that's a different kind of cheating where a crash was forced to give a win to a different driver, in this instance he meant engineering "cheating".
@@cessactdm I do realise that it was engineering type cheating that was being discussed but the particular comment I was responding to mentioned Flavio Briatore. He is of course known for the incident in Malaysia but I could of also brought up the very strange options available to Micheal Schumacher in 1994. The traction control option that they accidentally left in the system of only one of their cars and could only be accessed via a certain sequence of button presses. Of course they never used it or the traction control system that wasn’t traction control. They did manage to win a world championship despite Micheal making a “mistake “ in Adelaide and not finishing. All in a team led by Flavio, who we can’t really blame for the engineering “mistakes”, I mean he is just a T Shirt salesman after all.
@@sloppynyuszi Yeah it’s funny about that. Honestly looking at the situation and the racing IQ of Fernando I would not be surprised at all if the origin of the idea came from him whilst driving the car. A gentle message to the team along the lines of “Gee guys if we get lucky and catch a safety car in the next few laps we will be in a great position for the win here”. Fernando is that good at thinking about the situation of the race which we have seen time and again. Of course he is pretty good with the whole sergeant Shultz routine as well lol
My favourite “rule bend” was in 1999 when 3 F1 teams found out that the sensor in the grid to detect false starts was activated exactly 1 second before the lights went out. So they intercepted the signal from the sensor and set up a system that would beep in the driver’s ear 0.99 seconds after the activation so they would start the moment the lights went out.
They were caught at a race in Germany when the start lights malfunctioned amd stayed on but these 6 cars moved at the exact moment they should have turned off.
From the next race, the sensors were turned on at a random time before the lights went out.
Is this true??? I've never heard this before. But do remember that start. The one where Frentzen and Hakkinenn both went even though the lights were still on red
@@Phoenix1664it was the 1999 European GP. I believe you are thinking of the right incident. It is true, though there is some speculation that the lights didn’t malfunction, but purposely kept on to catch the cheaters. There is no evidence that this is true, though.
Well someone else's predictability isn't you're cheating if simply using information thats access was obtainable to you
@@n.w.owhoknowstheshadowknow58 that is not always true. Look at the 2007 spy gate scandal. The way information is obtained can sometimes definitely be cheating.
That being said, the 3 teams weren’t punished. The means of this way of cheating was just removed
I thought the FIA found them out and changed the timing
Quote from Ross Brawn: "its not cheating, its a competitive interpretation of the regulations."
Ferrari era in the 2000s best ever F1 time
That is the spirit
Ross brawn BASED
Flavio Briatore: "It's only cheating if you mess up and get caught."
As far as I can tell, Formula 1 is the most multi-dimensional sport in the world… two simultaneous championships encompassed by a design and engineering competition where teammates are often rivals.
@@Spankster. Yes it’s quiet a dichotomy. You have maybe 1000 people including two drivers who all work together to make the fastest car. Then the only guy that you really need to beat home and make sure you’re faster than on a Sunday is that same guy who you worked with to make the car better.
One of the few sports where you can lose a title by having the 2 best drivers on your team
@@wasdrankings1518 Yes indeed and also probably the only one where someone is going to be upset about helping the team win a championship
I've been an F1 fan for over 20 years and that summarizes the sport better than I ever could.
Kind of. It's always about 1 team coming up with avoiding regulations or finding loopholes and other teams pointing to the loophole so the FIA ban it or just trying to compete with a winning team. And there is also Ferrari fucking up in a Ferrari way
The true geniuses don't find ways to break the rules.....
They find ways to figure out what the rule book DOESN"T say.....
The great Smokey Yunick once told of the NASCAR rule that the gas tank had to hold 26 gallons....
But nowhere did it mention the fuel line....
So Smokey made a fuel line that held 6 gallons.....
The best way to gain an advantage in sports is to find a way to take advantage of existing rules that allow you to have an edge within the confines of the game’s existing rules. Using my favorite sport of hockey for example, so back in the day when there were no penalties for hitting someone in the head and a player by the name of Scott Stevens realized as long as he didn’t commit any other penalties while hitting an opponent in the head like elbowing, interference, or charging to name a few, he could intentionally injure and take out the other teams star players with a headshot without breaking any existing rules at that time. To Scott Stevens credit, it worked and he wasn’t penalized for giving at least a dozen opponents star players a concussion throughout his career.
@@BobbyBoucher228 thats a really bad example in my opinion, he literally just found a way to intentionally harm people without penalty
you shouldnt really give credut to something like that...
like wow, so smart of people to just cut off heads 2000 years ago, because they didnt have a rule against it, credit to them for figuring that out
it's all can be called in one simple word: " Exploits ".
i believe he made a car that was like 7/8th scale to the rest and would avoid being parked anywhere near another car as well
Loved Mclarens extra brake pedal for brake steer and the fact it was only the media taking pics of the car after an event that it was detected and outlawed.
Was really surprised that he didn't mention this one! That was quite a scandal in the mid-90s. Then we had allegations of traction control as well in the mid to late 90s.
There’s also a video of the Maclaren 3rd brake triggered by a button on the steering wheel when the 3rd pedal was outlawed.
That was cheating. They changed the rules to ban it.
It wasn’t cheating. It wasn’t illegal till they banned it 😂
The best part about the 2nd brake pedal for me was that it was constructed with spare parts & cost maybe £80 in total !
Murray Walker was and always the Greatest Commentator EVER!
Could not agree more especially when he had James hunt along side. He will always be the voice of formula 1 for me
@@Jcnbusiness 100% Martin is getting there for me too, but Murray was the OG.
@@Brendan77able I do enjoy Martin as well and a whole generation now will see him as the voice of formula 1
I hear Pual di Resta is pretty fantastic too.
Please dont say that... he was an icon yes but a terrible commentator. I have watched F1 since 1992 and he is by far the worst of them and on top of that his voice was pain to listen to.
How does this guy not bring up Spygate? Best cheating scandal ever in F1.
A team got another teams car data? That's the dullest cheating scandal ever. All the clever technical tricks are the interesting bit.
There's been a lot of cheating!!! 😁
Well he surmise the F1 series in a whole Stating that F1 is about cheating..and it can be said in the last 3 decades for sure there was always the engineers of these teams coming up with all types of shenanigans to circumvent the rules and personally I think they did a damn good job of it..
@@edbr2379that's the stupidest yet effettive cheating scandal that has ever been, as always mclaren being in it
@@edbr2379There is so much more to spygate. Like how they nearly got away it until Alonso threatened Ron Dennis that he would tell the FIA all about it after an argument they had which led Ron to run to the FIA first and essentially say that if Alonso tells you we have been spying on Ferrari he's lying which only got them resulted in them investigating the matter further. Ferrari were also first made aware of this when they received a random email from the guy who was asked to print copies of Ferrari documents. The guy who also leaked the information from Ferrari was doing so out of spite after he failed to get a promotion and a few years after spygate all came out he unfortunately committed suicide.
Not fair the British get to call the 2000s the naughties.
It’s not naughties lol. It’s the noughties. As in nought. Which means zero.
ought, like 2 zeros. Thirty ought six as opposed to thirty naught six .30-06
@@jimijames6449yes we as Brits are well aware of the spelling difference. We're also aware of homophones, puns and wordplay. Sometimes we like being "naughty" with words.
@@jimijames6449 We say naughties as a throwback to naughty times and a play on words with noughties.
Chris was the only worthy replacement for Clarkson, Hammond and May. It too bad that the BBC couldn’t find better co-hosts for him.
True, Harris is great for TV
Cheating in Motorsport is amazing to hear about. Darrell Waltrip told stories on Dale Earnhardt Jr’s podcast about shedding weight on the fly and using nitrous to qualify faster and they’d hide the nitrous bottle in the pipes of the roll cage inside the car. Absolutely genius stuff. It’s so creative and innovative. Is it dirty? Absolutely, but it’s simultaneously brilliant stuff.
My favorite cheat was when Ferrari was apparently adding extra fuel into their engines around 2019. They found out at what rate the FIA fuel measurement system was reading the fuel, and managed to create a fuel system that pulsed extra fuel through in the milliseconds between when the device was measuring. I can’t even begin to imagine the engineering and coding that went into that, but they pulled it off. Until they were caught they had a very fast car
1.They were never caught 2. That was not a cheating pu as the fia never claimed it as such (not even in one of their usual statements) 3. All the so-called "secret agreement" between Ferrari and Fia had stood because Ferrari's bosses literally sh*t in their pants for having made something in a grey zone, as a matter of fact we don't even know if it was them controlling in some way the flow meter sensor, that was just a huge speculation (the fia doesn't know as of today what they even did with the pu in the first place). Not to mention Ferrari used that PU for like 2 or 3 races whereas Mercedes used Das (illegal system) for the whole year or Redbull using asymmetric braking for 1 year and a half (or mclaren using exceptionally illegal wings for 3/4 of the season), ludicrous and disgusting double standards towards teams based in britain
@@francescotrombetta8548 they literally shit in their pants?.Do you know what literally means?
"someone must have had a button", yeah, his name is Bernie Ecclestone.
Fair play to Chris for saying this on a large platform. Too many people just gloss over it and even some fans deny it because it bursts their bubble.
Real fans know that this is going on now and been happening since F1 conception.
The casual Drive to Survive watchers will have no clue.
No! This is the best part of the sport! This basically is the sport. I'm a fan of shenanigans.
@@TheFoggyjonesloopholes are great. Cheating isn’t. Mercedes’ DAS blew my mind. Perfectly legal bit of trickery and a phenomenal piece of engineering. Ferrari coming from nowhere to win in monza. Lewis Coming from nowhere to win in silverstone. Max coming from nowhere to win in Holland. Not so cool.
Ok casual, stick to drive to survive
Get Kimi on the Podcast, he won Austin and drove Nascar, very talkative for a podcast
😂😂😂
Bwoah.
Yeah. I'm sure he would love to do a podcast. Lmao
The Toyota incident was actually by Team Toyota Europe based in Germany. Whether Toyota corporate knew is another question
Unlikely, the racing team is ran completely separate from the commercial part of the business.
@@EleventhMonkeytbf i think rep damage will only be to the team who cheated not the manufacturer as the teams mostly operate as standalone company and parent company only really gets involed when they are struggling. Take what renault did in 2008 as a example. How often do you hear people blame renault for it. I very rarely hear it as its allways big flavio who gets the blame.
The cooperate side of toyota would only of known what the ceo of TTE told them. You really think the heads of toyota really got involed in the engineering/design/r&d etc of all the cars they manufacture for sports or commercial or industrial use.
Came here to say this. TTE engineered and designed the system and implemented without Toyota Japan's knowledge.
And the driver of the car was called Carlos Sainz, who son is currently driving F1 for Ferrari
Smokey Yunick. Americas greatest exponent of the “Unfair Advantage “
He wrote the book on cheating in motorsports.
@@brianshorey I wish he had written a book lol. He was a master that is for sure
@@Jcnbusiness He did - Best Damn Garage in Town - The World According to Smokey. They tend to sell for hundreds or thousands of dollars.
@@brianshorey I’m in Australia so it’s probably impossible to find here but thanks for letting me know. I would love to read it. Even at that price it is probably worth it
The reason F1 cars have wings is because Colin Chapman was at Indianapolis in 1963 when Smokey ran a huge wing on his car. The Lotus GP cars had wings shortly afterwards.
If I remember correctly F1 cars were 14 seconds a lap faster than IndyCar's at COTA.
And they dont massivly track extend like indycar do.
Indycar much better racing though…
😂😂😂😂😂@@martinmurtagh3221
I would hope so considering the cost of an F1 car is 400 million more than an indycar.
@@ohiopower f1 car budget is 150 million they restricted the teams from overspending.
The US are generally fans of sports that are in stadiums and it’s a great marketing thing really. Everyone gets a great view… they took motocross, put it in a stadium and called it supercross for example.
control the environment, control the outcome.
The most popular sport in the world is played in a stadium. “Stadiums” existed in Europe long before the US had a stadium
Drive to survive has made MANY MANY people in the US fans of F1, even outside of the show.
I now watch all the races and follow the teams before the show drops after the season.
Yeah, because soccer is only played in the f'n wilderness around the world. Gimmeabreak.
i know here in australia we haven't invented seats we just play our pro sports in random paddocks, no one knows when or where. we should look into these things called "stadiums"
There is a saying in motor racing. You read the rules twice, once to learn the rules, twice to beat them.
Cheating = Innovation in racing. Doesn't matter if Nascar, F1 or BMX. If you ain't cheating you ain't trying.
Indeed. Cheating just means you're taking it seriously xD
In a weird way, its a sign of respect and love for the sport lol
Why do Nascar fans always come out when f1 is mentioned? Stay in your lane😂😂😂
LOL! left-left-left...repeat
@@RemiKJV1611more to it than that
@@larryplummer9154 I know 😉. Just kidding...I love Nascar, been to many races and garages, but I love F1 more.
they mentioned nascar…
@@RemiKJV1611and motogp
I'm a very big F1 fan but I gotta give my biggest props to Smokey Yunick. Greaterst cheat of all time.
Best Damn Garage In Town.
Lancia took cheating to the next level when they were in rallying. Absolute pirates. Pretending to have issues with their seatbelts on the start line so that they could let the dust settle before setting out. Sending team members out onto the course to put road salt on icy patches to help since they didn't have AWD. Constantly skirting and sometimes transgressing the rules. Great story.
Go to the Indy 500 and tell me "it's just driving in circles"
I went there in 2019 and "it's just driving in circles" , there , I said it !
But not only that , the first 170 or so laps is just fuel saving , only after the last pitstop they actually show their speed and it's a sprint to the finish .
When the soort routinely has to hold hearings wherein teams argue about what counts as a hole versus an edge (this was Brawn's double-diffuser), you know the teams are trying absolutely everything.
Williams's mass-dampener. McLaren's f-duct. Mercedes's double-DRS.
All of those were in the last 20 years, and those are the ones we know about.
Joe should have a old stock car guy on just to talk about this. Fuel in chassis and acid dipped bodies, all the realms of Motorsport too
Cheating in F1 has two names:
Flavio Briatore and Michael Schumacher. :)
and fia in 2021 :)
adrian newey christan horner
@@kabirsharma2858move on kiddo
@@kabirsharma2858boohoo
@@kabirsharma2858 didnt watch till then. I dont know...
The problem here in comparing F1 to NASCAR is that Chris knows very little about NASCAR, and Joe doesn't know anything about racing at all. The cheating in NASCAR is every bit as clever and technologically advanced as in F1. Look at the twisted sister cars and tell me they weren't playing in the same gray areas as the 2017 T-wings.
You aint got a clue mate
F1 engineering is closer to space travel than it is to NASCAR
@@DJP946 There's more engineering talent here than a lot of European fans want to credit. An American put wings on his cars years before Colin Chapman, and sucker fans years before Gordon Murray.
How do you cheat in Nascar? My understanding is that the brick they use to hold down the accelerator pedal and the string they tie to the steering wheel to keep it turning left have to be standardised?
@@trev3971Engineering talent in the US? Absolutely.
But engineering in NASCAR is nowhere near F1. To quote Clint Bowyer:
“These Damn Europeans And Their Spaceship Cars”
I would so buy that book. Loved Murray Walker so much. He made so many errors but they were all endearing and was so part of his charm. Nobody was a bigger cheerleader for British drivers, especially his beloved Nigel Mansell. Chris, please write that book.
@@enniol8043 Don’t worry Murray has you covered. He did his own book and I’m pretty sure you can find it on UA-cam as an audio book with Murray narrating it. The man could make watching grass grow sound bloody exciting and worth continuing to watch lol
@@Jcnbusiness I bought the audio book and listened to it. He narrated it and hearing his voice again brought back my childhood. If Murray was speaking about a driver, you could bet it was his teammate that was having an issue.
I thought ya'll didn't like british bias?
Yep. Yes, the man from the Isle of Man!
the Lotus 78 was the first 'wing-car.' But it was a compromise so didn't work on all circuits. The Lotus 77 was the 'adjustable' car that Peterson hated so left after one GP (in 1976). The first proper 'wing-car' was the aching beautiful Lotus 79.
I loved the pass through cockpit hole where a sriver would have to put his hand over the hole on the striaght.
Theres a fuckload of mind games and tricks involved in motorsports its just part of the culture and it always has been.
Remember this guy in nascar who would run a long fuel pipe around the car to give himself extra fuel
A friend of mine was convinced most people cheated, especially in karting. He said about having 2 identical helmets, one filled with lead. So, when you pulled into the weighing area, you would pass the normal one to your mechanic who would go off to the van. Then, you would suddenly turn around and shout, "Hey, bring my helmet back, I need it for weighing in!" Of course, he would bring the lead-lined helmet!
Motorsports cheating stories are the best.
indeed schumacher turned up to the formerly annual FIA driver weigh in... with a helmet where the padding was removed and was replaced with lead shot. ferrari then could race with 20kg less weight in the car. because of that, we now weigh the driver at every race.
When Chris said that formula one is more complex than nascar, he wasn't lying or trying to take a dig at NASCAR in any way. Formula 1 is technically more complex than NASCAR because of all of the different electronics in telemetry and different technology formula 1 uses compared to NASCAR. Mechanically NASCAR engineers are probably better than formula 1 engineers.
IMHO Toyota cheating in the WRC with the Celica was a stroke of pure engineering genius.
I love the videos of NASCAR pit crews act out a trip and fall into cars to dent the bodywork and gain an aerodynamic advantage
He just described almost all pro sport
Sometimes I think there’s a fine line between cheating and ingenuity, like your allowed find loop holes
The history of cheating in F1 ... covered in under 8 minutes. That's quite an achievement.
The rally car cheating was brilliant because the illegal bypass was spring loaded so it would disappear when the components were taken apart for inspection.
If you ain't cheating you ain't trying.
When you do not get caught, its not cheating in F1. Nerds, businessesman, drivers, engineers being creative. So cool
2:34 formula one they don’t cheat. But also in F1 there is no spirit of the rule…..
Flavio Briatore. Singapore. Crashgate. It cost Felipe Massa the F1 World Championship.
"Oval racing is boring" says someone that has never watched oval racing. These cars are doing 190 mph for hours on end, WOT 90% of the race.
That takes more concentration than anything else
It's really boring.
That sounds incredibly boring
Watching the onboard camera is great, only then you see really good what's goning on.
To be fair, it is so so boring
Been around Racing and watching for a long time. If you ain’t Cheating you ain’t trying and you’re probably not gonna win. Racing 101.
My favorite cheating story is a car that had a DRS rear wing but no one could prove it because they didnt have high speed cameras yet and the officals could not find the mechanism that caused it everytime they inspected the car.
Imo its trying to find loop holes that leads to constent advances in the cars.
That 1995 celica GT-Four was a terrible car even with the illegal turbocharger. I remember Kankkunen talking about it with his co-driver Nicky Grist on a podcast a while back.
In go karting in the UK, the drivers used to hide a tennis ball in their race overalls to wedge into the exhaust down the straights to provide more back pressure and performance from the engine ha
F1 in the 90’s we saw soooo many crooked deviants in all positions in the sport: a driver, person(s) within teams (Flavio for example), FIA, Bernie..
These days it’s about reading the regulations, and trying to find a grey area and exploit that until other teams suspect something which will lead FIA to investigate and either consider it okay or not allow it and you have to remove it from the car. If so then they’ll tighten up the regs so that it can’t be explored anymore.
There’s not cheating in F1. They push the boundaries until the rules change then they find new boundaries to push.
No there definitely is cheating if there is a rule that an engine can only take a certain amount of fuel at max volume and you don't obey by those rules and get caught. The only reason Ferrari cheating a couple of years ago was swept under the rug by the FIA is because Ferrari makes them a shit load of money with their regignition and prestige within motorsports
I've heard that on Nascar, in the 70s, people were running fuel inside the roll cage, to have an extra large tank.
Don't know true that is .. but..
There's one true story about them having lead shot (bb's or whatever), and it was put inside the rails/frame. After the race would start, they'd pull the release and it would empty out. Suddenly the car was hundreds of pounds lighter. The inspectors wouldn't find the release hole because it was located at the spot where the jack was put to raise the car up.The jack was plugging/covering the hole.
Nascar takes a lot of skill. Pack drafting isn't a formula uno thing. It's a lot more than "just turn left".
Chris Harris is the best car guru guest .. period!
Wasn't the saying in NASCAR, "if you ain't cheating you ain't trying"? Been a fan of F1 since i was a kid and you only saw it in USA on Wide World of Sports, and I still watch it and respect it hugely, but there is a difference in the racing styles between F1 and NASCAR (which I haven't watched in 25 yrs) in that open wheel racing things get stretched out a lot and there's not as much overtaking or even side by side racing, which is the major draw in NASCAR so on merit of viewing it depends on what you want to see. But both sports have had MASSIVE cheating scandals over the decades and always will have, it's racing
This makes total sense especially when he was talking about the Toyota car when it was in a drag race the Toyota just disapreaed into the distance .every one knew they were cheating .Read Dwain Chambers book and ask me how Usain Bolt can beat the worlds best sprinters while they were on drugs and not just one person at least 5 drug takers he beat then look at Ben Johnson win on drugs and dont laugh when you find out Usians trainer was a fully qualified chemist
NASCAR is more entertaining cause of the frequent contact and crashes
Richard Petty back in the day he said if you ain’t cheating, you don’t wanna win
They are not cheating, they found grey areas in technical directive, and they beng the rules as much as positive.
People call themselves fans n don't understand the difference between cheating and innovation :P
NASCAR races at COTA. Jaimie pull that up
NASCAR races at COTA too Joe.
exactly
Read Total Competition by Adam Parr & Ross. Crazy good book and speaks on these things in detail.
NASCAR having shot or ball Barings in the side panels that dropped all the shot out to make the car lighter after the initial weight check before but not after the races in the 80s.
Loved everything about this video, Dave! This is a video worth rewatching multiple times.
Most of the "cheating" in F1 isn't cheating but finding loopholes or grey areas that aren''t explicitly ruled out. Then the are serious, explicit cheating which results in bans or fines unless you're Ferrari then it'll probably be a slap on the wrist at most.
'Mark Donohue did some Formula One racing too'.... "Dark' mark Donohue DIED in a Formula One crash, during practice for the 1975 Austrian Grand Prix, an accident in which a Marshal was also killed. Donohue did not initially seem severely injured, was conscious when they put his stretcher in the ambulance, as was waving to the cameras. He was initially evaluated and deemed non critical, having only a slight headache, later, it worsened significantly in short period of time, and he was taken to Graz hospital, where he slipped in to coma soon after admission, and died from a brain injury. This accident was one of the catalysts for Jackie Stewarts safety campaign to improve F1, his friend and protege Francois Cevert's death was the beginning of his campaign, but Donohue's was the cause for Stewart's camp to insist in much improved trackside medical facilities so serious internal injuries, especially cranial ones.
@@Apis4 extremely sad and you are of course correct. It really was the accident that caused the drivers to say enough is enough and insist on changes. There was some rumblings before that but this tragedy did seem like the tipping point. Mark Donahue was such a great racer in different disciplines. He really does deserve to be remembered as one of the best the United States has produced.
@@Jcnbusiness It was q process, Stewart took point, on driver safety improvements after Cevert died, at first with actual track layout and run off areas, then after Peter Revson died on the unfaced barriers at Kyalami and then Hemuth Keoniggs horror decapitation, at Watkins Glen , both in 1974, the barriers were on the list, and then, when Donoghue, and a fella I'm struggling to recall, both died after their accidents, the bloke I'm thinking off died en route to hospital...at Imola...I think, due being airlifted in an unpresdurosec helicopter, causing some kind of worsening to what was initially deemed a severe but treatable head injury....then inadequate trackside medical facilities were also highlighted and added to the cause.
Stewart knew them all, had been deeply hurt and permanently traumatized by Joachim Rindts death at Monza in ...1970? He and Rindt were close friends, more, his wife, and Linda, Rindts wife, we're best friends. He chalked it up to the risk of the game, initially irrc, but then he lost Cevert, followed by half a dozen more friemds and colleagues in the next 5 years. He became determined after Cevert to see changes, and learnt from each following tragedy, intent to not let them be pointless, and each one improve the safety in each area.
So the sport went 20 years without a fatality after Ratzenberger and Senna in 94, and has gone a decade now without even a career ending injury. That was paid for by Donohue et al, the least they could have done is remember his legacy properly!
@@Apis4 The sports ambivalence over driver safety was mad compared to today, Stewart was always aware and I think Jim Clarks death brought it home as well as an accident Stewart himself had where he was trapped in a car covered in fuel at Spa in 66 for BRM, he was lucky as a sudden shower not only saw him go off but a couple of other drivers as well and they managed to get him out of the car. I'm pretty sure the ambulance that eventually picked him got lost on the way to hospital as well.
@@gs8494 Yup, he smashed THHROUGH A FARM at the infamous Masta Kink back in the Glorious Triangle days of Spa. Got stuck hanging through the ceiling upside down fueling spilling out.
Clark, a fellow Scott, was the accident which opened his eyes, Rindt was what made him begin pushing, and Cevert lit a fire under him. But his own accident really made him understand just how bad it was. Then watching people like Donohue, Revson, Koenig et al, die just continued being revelation, after revelation as to just how many levels of insanely unsafe the sport was. Just what areas needed addressing, everything from track design and layout, to barriers, to pit and practice procedures, to fire safety and indeed, trackside medical help.
All of it had been inadequate for years, and drivers were dying in accidents that should NOT have killed them.
@@Apis4 You are of course correct. Jackie Stewart has been a driving force behind the continued rise in the safety of motor racing which has led to all forms of the sport being much safer. I think the real moment for him was his own accident which occurred at Spa. From Memory he went off and crashed through some sort of shed and came to rest against a tree. He was stuck in the car because he couldn’t remove the steering wheel and only with the help of a spectator who happened to have a spanner with him was he able to get out. No event officials or what passed for an ambulance arrived at the accident scene for quite some time as well. Jackie talked about the incident in a podcast at some point and it sounded pretty horrible and a real turning point for him. Although Jackie thankfully survived so many of his close friends did not. Jochen Rindt died on the way to hospital in Italy. I think the other driver you may have been referring to was Piers Courage who died in 1970 at Zandvoort. The car he was driving had a magnesium body. When the car went off it caught fire and magnesium unfortunately burns well. Piers had no chance and I seem to recall Jackie talking about it as he was in close proximity at the time and of course the race wasn’t stopped so the drivers were continuing to race past the crash site and could see the wreckage. I could be wrong though because Jo Schlesser died in a very similar situation a few years earlier. I think that was in France. You are correct in saying that the current day drivers and in fact all participants at any level of Motorsport have the people who sadly lost their lives to thank for the safety we now enjoy. Each and every one of them should be remembered. And along with people like Sir Jackie Stewart as well as many others who have pushed for continued safety improvements, should be treated with great respect. As a quick aside Sir Jackie was also a champion shooter who only just missed out on Olympic selection. A remarkable man and a legend as well as being a genuinely nice guy to boot.
The best innovator of motorsport rules was Smokey Yunick
2020 Mercedes DAS system , 2020 Racing Point car allegedly "copied" 2019 mercedes car
How was DAS cheating please?
It wasn’t cheating, but I do get your point.
If anyone is interested in more weird interpretations of the rules search up the Brabham BT46 otherwise known as the "fan car".. wasn't considered cheating but was banned in the same season it was introduced
Rules are for the guidance of wisemen, and the obedience of fools.
@@joshualamp2438 in motor racing they are kind of like a rough guideline. I mean until you get caught then it’s probably not in the rules or if it is then they have to figure out how you have done it to catch you. Right?
First time I’m hearing someone refer to a formula 1 car as a “vehicle” 😅 4:38
4:42 nascar has road courses, but they don’t know how to stay on the pavement, it’s a shit show.
Mercedes steering wheel where they could camber the wheels.
Now McLaren has that mini drs effect going
2008 crashgate, 2019 Ferrari fuel pump, 2020 Mercedes DAS, 2024 RB asymmetric breaking are some recent ones
The FIA confirmed no teams were using the braking system, neither redbull or anyone else used it
How is the DAC is cheat
In no way was DAS cheating. It was a loophole
@danielbrazil4683 it depends on how you look at loopholes, it was banned the following year. Im not saying Merc was wrong for using it
Nice to hear him talk as a real person rather than the character on Top Gear he portrays.
Lotus is far and away my favorite F1 team and the cars are some of my all time favorites, but if you want great laugh out loud funny cheating stories, F1 has nothing on Nascar. Smokey Yunick was a genius at cheating snd he had a sense of humor while doing it.
FINALLY! Joe talking about my other love... F1! Everyone cheats, its just whether you get busted.
Here I was thinking he'd mention how the 2021 season ended.
That wasn't cheating, that was just a bad call from the FIA.
There was some very obvious cheating such as Tyrrell's lead filled water (with 2 holes under the car visible when Brundle crashed)!
First thing strikes me is 2021
It wasn't a cheat tho.
The rules were applied according to the race director, who has total control.
He may have applied them incorrectly or flexed the rules abit, but no rules were broken
Nascar literally races at COTA
Greatest rule bend of all time was DAS, still sad this got taken out
If you look at how much it costs to go to a F1 race with even a horrible view, it's easy to see why F1 won't ever gain too much traction in the U.S.A.
But thats socialism
--History of cheating in F1, ---" Some of the stories ive heard are so good....some of the cheats ive heard about are just so brilliant....Theres amazing stories of just amazing cheats''' proceeds to tell absolutely none of them. GFYrself
6:49 nascar is even more ingenious, they would and still do I bet set distractions so when they have a major cheat in the engine or body they purposefully do something very obv on inspection that isn’t a big deal but will be seen very obviously in hopes they don’t check the other stuff.
Cheating isn't the right word here. Flavio style crashgate is cheating and nothing ingenious about it. What we love to see is engineers who outsmart the rule book. Things like flexible wings, double diffusers, J dampers, F ducts, etc.
My favourite F1 cheat is the rules changing to to make British teams and drivers win.
You'll see people that are most ingenious when they're cheating, Not when they're abiding by the rules...The Ubiquitous Unfair Advantage...
Did they just say COTA is one of the best races of the season... in my opinion the track is largley forgettable when compared to most of the calendar
How did they not talk about meclaren trying to steal ferrari documents
F1 for all the brilliant guys don't hold a candle to the stuff the NASCAR guys came up with.
If you want a really great "unfair advantage" story, read up on the whittington brothers racing in le mans in the 70s. Mind boggling stuff :D
Junior Johnson. Nuff said.
He should’ve talked about crashgate