Do Dice Towers ACTUALLY Improve Your Rolls?
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- Опубліковано 29 лип 2020
- Have you ever rolled an extremely unlucky number in a board game and wondered - are these dice TRULY random? Maybe you've bought a dice tower hoping it will even out your games. This video experiments with how easily dice can become randomized on a hard surface, and discovers that you don't really need a dice tower at all! We use basic elements of probability and statistics to study the dice, and finish it off by building a robot to roll the dice for us - in the most consistent way possible! Can the robot actually be programmed to roll the same number every time? Watch on to find out!
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PSA! The more statistically astute of you may come to the important realization that a simple average calculation is not a TRUE indicator of a random distribution. Let's say the dice was biased towards 1 and 6. The average would stay the same, but the bias would still exist. An important test to follow up with after your average calculation is a histogram (or, a tabulation of all the rolls) to ensure that the probability of rolling any one number is roughly 1/6. Prior to the average calculation, I ran the data through this histogram test and found no glaring biases towards any single number or pairs of numbers. Since I reasoned that the likelyhood of getting a dice that is perfectly biased towards two numbers equidistant from the mean is fairly low, especially after it passed the histogram test, I used averages to give a simpler explanation for the viewer for dice comparisons. I touched on this point in the video, but in retrospect I don't think it was as clear as it should have been - frequency distributions are critical for assessing an unbiased system!
Do you think the result would change if we tried it on carpet? Let me know what other experiments may be interesting in the comments below!
Great video. We use dice towers because we have players who have dice flying everywhere.
Exactly. Besides just being fun I personally prefer dice towers because they help me keep my dice nearby XD
@@DaleyKreations not to mention they (often) look cool ;-)
I love my dice towers because I don't have dice mowing over minis and falling off the table. Very cool video.
Thank you for making this video. Gave me a good insight on how truly random my dice rolls are!
Thanks for doing this!! I'm a "it looks cool" dice tower fan :) I would love to see something about the d4 because it doesn't bounce as well.
I hate d4, we just used an 8 sided die and doubled the 1-4
Very very great video!!! That's what I was looking for
The science is interesting. But all I needed to know is that dice towers really DO create random rolls. I don't care if it is just as random to roll myself -- my hands get tired of all that rolling and I get tired of running after dice that fell on the floor.
That's very interesting and good to know! Thank you for doing these tests and sharing! That makes them less of a much have for me, however I would still find it useful for not having instances where the dice gets rolled off the table or not rolled enough, more so not rolling off the table. Maybe I just have bad dice, but the square ones that I have don't roll much at all and are easy to get the same number.
Nice quality video keep up the good work.
I'm not surprised. The dice are basically very hard springs as are the surfaces they are dropped on to. So it's the result of two springs colliding. At least with a tower you don't have to go under the table looking for dice.
I love this so freaking much!
I just built the Lego self loading dice thrower ♥ (Version 2 worked/Version 1 & 1 improved version not so much). Because LEGO! I was getting a lot of 3 numbers out of 4 in a row. Which seemed weird! Not sure how many times out of 100 I would send dice flying across the room or the dice hitting the table before the catch box makes down in time to catch them. :)
As always, you're the best!
I use towers purely for rolling in a small confined space we have on the table, without it my dice usually end up on the floor lol
I just got a nice little dice tower myself, and can't wait to actually try it out! I kinda got tired of having my dice accidentally rolling off the table lol. Is a tower necessary? Probably not, but I like having one anyway! I say it ultimately comes down to personal preference
Well done!
Love that intro... no idea what it had to do with anything, but it was amazing
I do wonder a few things:
1) I personally don't throw dice like this, mine go all over the table (more roll than bounce action): would that influence the result?
2) Many games ask you to throw 2-5 dice at once (look at e.g. Qwixx). Would that influence the outcome of the individual dice?
3) What about the material of the dice? You have wood, plastic, metal. I suspect wood and plastic will be similar, but metal has a very high density; will the beginning position have more influence?
4) What about other dice types? Most commonly used are d4, d6, d8, d10, d12, and d20. Are the others, especially d4 and d20 dice also random?
5) Does a dice tower actually produce a random result? Is there a difference between dice tower design?
The first time she said "a dice" I thought she was joking ...but she kept saying it? I never realised that was a real thing people did...but it was driving me crazy!
Dice Towers are useful for rolling a d4, they don't like to roll much at all.
Maybe I missed it, but the AVERAGE value of a d6 is 3.5 (1+2+3+4+5+6=21. 21/6=3.5). Thats a "static" value, not a result of rolling a die
Very interesting video.
Tbh I just want a dice tower to not need to shake my hands when I roll, and to have the dice land in a controlled place. Because I just have my hands and a table to work with that my dice rolls off the table and unto the floor
Honestly that's super valid haha
Dice towers are good for just making everyone's rolls more similar. Thanks for making this video!
Came for stupid dice tower stayed for cool science!!!
id imagine the good thing about dice towers is that they r more standardized
some ppl r prone to cheating and then just do some fake ass throw where they setup the dice in their hand and just drop them from like 2 cm without much force
some may dont even actually do it intentionally, but its certainly easier to get a desired number/avoid one if u setup the dice correcly in ur hand
I have completely misunderstood dice towers! This whole time I thought they were marketed for rolling your dice within a confined space so that they don't hit things or mess up your game. I think keeping dice so contained takes all the fun out of them, so I was very excited to spread the news of the dice tower lie to my friends who have them.
I never realized they were marketed for randomness and was hoping that the results would show dice towers are NOT random, so I could use that as an argument AGAINST them. Darn.
Enjoyed the journey though.
And here I thought dice towers were for DMs who don't trust their players to roll truly randomly. A tower won't eliminate loaded dice (the DM will have to supply all the dice for that), but it can stop people using the various tricks gamblers have figured out over the years to make a random roll not so random.
I use a dice tower to prevent the dice from shooting everywhere. I'm one of those jerks that uses metal dice so to keep from damaging people's tables I like to use a tower and tray.
pretty interesting but I should point out that die=singular and dice=plural. A lot of people don't call them correctly
Maybe try it on felt? A lot of dice trays are made with a felt lining.
My argument for using dice towers would be for someone who doesn’t have a lot of room to roll dice. It keeps everything clean and contained 😋👍
Another great video from the incomparable 💖
Thank you for sharing your wisdom with the world.
Thank you sweetie! I love you!! 💖
nice video
So, if I held the d4 the same way 20 times and just dropped it into the tower from a standard height, I would get the same or a different output number, or a bias toward a number.
I see Dice Towers mainly as an interesting way to roll the dice and it controls the landing zone
Something to considering with your dice throwing machine.
Your machine is doing exact same throw every time right?
Well a human trying to manipulate the dice is trying to throw it in a way to make it stop in a specific way. Basically exploiting physics to get a specific result. Like not shaking the dice and just dropping them casually. Basically trying to make it so the dice does as little rolling as possible.
This would mean the Dice Tower is more like your throwing machine, having it be a consistent way of rolling the dice every time.
I bet they save time and force players to roll faster. All these people that think they are rolling craps at vegas- when I just need a FREAKING NUMBER PLEASE!!!
I would suggest using precision dice. Like those used in Backgammon tournaments and Casino craps tables. With the pips drilled out. The sides of the dice have slightly different weights. Where with precision dice. The pips are drilled and filled to make all sides flush. With equally weighted sides.
I'm waiting for all of these silicon mold folks to work out a method of casting a die with recessed numbers, and either filling the numbers with a contrast color, or painting and subsequently "glazing" the die with a clear resin, so the numbers are filled with the same material to maintain balance.
@@soylencer that is what you call precision dice. The holes are drilled and filled with the same weight of material but different colors. Precision dice are smooth on all 6 sides.
@@chriswalker810 no I meant I want customs like that from crafty dice folks. It's difficult to find polyhedral sets like that, but I also want fun colors.
@@soylencer you can always use a blank mold and drill out the holes and refill using contrast colors of same material used for the dice blank.
So for comparison purposes it would have been nice for your calculations if you use an actual Dice Tower to run the numbers against.
Very interesting! I would love to see this done on different surfaces and maybe even compared to a dice tower :) Would also be very interesting to see how much an unbalanced die would affect the result! Thanks for a fun video.
I use my towers more to keep the dice from flying all over the place than for any randomness they may add.
Cool experiment. I still prefer dice towers (or at least trays) just to keep the dice from flying everywhere. Those things are out of control.
Also, my experience with dice makes it hard to believe that some dice roll even. My luck with rolls has always been awful to the point that it became an ongoing joke, and any time I would get a high roll with a D20 everyone would freak out. I can't count how many times when I've played games and we all roll to decide who goes first with a high roll using a D20 and the highest roll is under 10 between the four of us, and I say " watch me get a 1, and I get a 1. It's uncanny how often I roll poorly and at the worst times! There was one game that I was constantly getting high rolls all game that we were all shocked, especially myself! I couldn't believe it! For a little bit I tasted what it was like to have a stroke of good luck. There's also almost always that one person when playing that keeps getting 6s with a D6. I haven't noticed if It's with specific dice or games, but it doesn't seem to me that It's truly even in my experience. And my experience with square dice is that they don't work because they don't roll or bounce well because of not having the cut corners.
Honestly I just got my tower for college to show off and get people into D&D
When your partner is a pesky minx who gets ten times the amount of doubles than you in Backgammon,.....it's time for a dice tower, I ended up paying more attention to the shaking of the dice than the game grrrrr, that's what their really for.
i use a tower to stop my kids cheating rolls lol
For me, a dice tower has nothing to do with improved randomness. I only use it so that I'm not at risk of hitting a piece on the table (or dice going off the table). I like the act of throwing dice and I originally felt like the dice tower kinda killed that joy. But it's been a welcome trade to not have to worry about where the dice may go and I've even grown to enjoy the drop.
You cite the common argument about rounded dice rolling better; I want to add the original claim of Science Dice and their sharp edge dice. This was basically, "molded dice are more evenly weighted compared to tumbled dice," and are thus less prone to favoring a side.
Maybe the modality of the roll strengthens one of these claims over the other. Time to build a throwing machine!
Not all dice are weighted the same you would have to use several different brands to complete this experiment the manufacturing could change the outcome of your results
Very interesting!
Would love to see the chart or numbers of how many times each number on the dice came up per how many rolls. As you are doing averages. With out any majour spikes. Its posible to always come around the same numbers
I think you're going wrong at an important point here: the avarage is pretty pointless. Imagine, you rolled a series of numbers with no 2s and no 5s: the avarage would still be close to 3.5, and you had no clue from it that no 2s and no 5s were rolled.
The numbers on the faces of the dice do not stand for an ordering, because the faces are not ordered. You could do the same experiement with a die the faces of which are marked with "A", "x", "pi", "e", a laughing smiley and a crying smiley. No way here to compute an avarage.
All that counts are the frequencies of the outcomes. If outcome of throwing the die is truely random, the frequencies should be about the same for all possible outcomes and converge to 1/6 as you continue.
That is true! I may have mis explained this point. I had checked a histogram of the data as well, and found no glaring discrepancies in one number over another number. I didnt include the plot because I didn't want to oversaturate the video with graphs.
The histogram and frequency is an important check for true numerical consistency, beyond the simple average. I reasoned that, the likelihood that a dice would be biased towards two different faces equally distant from the mean (e.g. 1 and 6, 2 and 5, ect) in exactly the same level as to keep the resulting average the same was so low given my initial histograms that I omitted a detailed explanation in the video. Though, I may include a brief explanation of this point in the description for curious viewers. Thanks!
I've been thinking about this in terms of shuffling since playing MtG arena
True! Building a card shuffler would be super cool, but honestly I've never looked up how they work haha
Lady this is kinda schitzo on several levels.
1. Dice rolls mean nothing without context. A roll of 1 is death in warhammer but great in Conquest
2. A tower is just as random as your hand since there is basically no practical way your rolling can pick a face to land on besides just dropping jt
hi dream girl, I still adore you
Dice towers are fun! That’s it. That’s all.
marketing: here's a dice tower. you need it for true randomness.
michaela: hold my beer.
science: here's a proof you're wrong. checkmate marketing!
Chess do not use dice though, but towers.
Cool Video - Guess I never new people marketed dice towers as "true random generators" lol. I always just thought it was a fun way to make dice rolls more interesting and keep them from going all over the table and onto the floor.
Yeah! They're so pretty and honestly I like them more than rolling by hand. I have seen many marketed as getting a "better roll" than hands tho, which was kinda the inspiration for this study haha
I like a dice tray for that purpose
great video. you are gorgeous
You're supposed to roll dice not drop them
Hahahahaha!!! Dude! You took role playing to the next level. Do you cross dress on a daily basis?
I could of saved you alot of time. A dice tower makes the game more fun....
Shhhhhhhh... i build dice towers
pshhhh even if it makes no difference in randomness dice towers are beautiful and everyone should still use them haha