Hey everyone! I wanted to issue a quick correction: All HDR is delivered in a rec.2020 container, so streaming can have rec.2020 (aka BT.2020) color just as well as disc. I do notice a significant difference between the two, and I suspect it’s actually down to bit depth rather than the presence of color information. Apologies for the error.
.. Kaleidoscope streaming service has better quality than your physical 4K media. I hear this kind of called what you will from people who clearly do not collect and have large collections of DVD or Blu-ray media. Try finding your favorite movie or downloading it to your phone or tablet or whatever when you have thousands of movies you own. The space alone takes up a large room floor to ceiling two or three cases deep. No, what you said is when people have a handful of movies and have a Walmart or Target DVD purchased player or simply are trolling try to make some point.
I love that you shared this kind of content, Caleb. A lot of people seem to have forgotten that physical media is still a thing and is without a doubt the highest grade for movie watching, especially in a well-equipped 4K disc.
@@zZiL341yRj736 I don't care if it's compressed as long as I don't notice. My family nor I have ever complained about "compressed 4k or 1080p streaming". If it's a problem you, why only spend $3,000 on a Blu-ray player, get e professional one for $45k.
The problem with the Kaleidescape is its in the 10 grand range when i checked a year ago. Not sure if the price has gone down. And let's face it. You don't actually 'own' the movie. If your system breaks or the hard disc drive fries you will lose it especially if Kaleidescape were to go out of business down the line for any reason. The difference between a well mastered 100 GB 4k disc and the Kaleidescape file is actually NOT a big difference. This has been confirmed on the Spare Change Channel. So you can still still make the claim the 4k discs are virtually the highest quality of physical media around.@@PSYCHOV3N0M
Wrong dude, even there're quite a lot of Blu-ray media with bad transfer (almost DVD quality). Same with some of the 4k transfers as well. Bluray does not by default mean great PQ unless the restoration is of highest quality. Having a king of TV, a 3 grand worth of a bluray player and best upscaling won't necessarily guarantee best picture.
Blu-ray is can excellent format, and the bitrates achieved by 4K UHD Blu-rays is far superior to streaming. Not only is the quality much better, I don't have to worry about the titles I want to watch being removed from streaming platforms. It's also worth noting the 4K UHD Blu-ray format is thriving among collectors, will lots of remasters being announced every week.
Yes, I love collecting 4k uhd Blu-Rays. The quality is always superior to streaming. All the new 4k remasters from old films are so awesome to have and watch. I collect because i love to watch movies and i want to won my favorites as time goes on and not have to worry about it being removed from one platform or another (even ones i own it on). Its very dissapointing that blu ray is starting to dissapear from store shelves. At this point people are consenting to owning nothing.
The market isn't even slowing down, either. Regularly getting 100+ new releases in one week. Sometimes even more. Even with slow weeks, there are tons of new remasters/releases coming out with new 4K restorations, 2K restorations, etc. Over twice as many Blu-ray releases come out each year now compared to a few years ago. The market is thriving with the fanbase of movie collectors and those looking for a specific title (or titles).
While overall sales might be down for the disc market, we can take solace in the fact that there is a very passionate group of physical media collectors keeping the boutique disc market alive. Not only do these releases often come with quality video transfers, but they usually also provide great supplemental materials like interviews, commentaries, video essays, written booklets, beautiful art, and great packaging, etc. I really recommend people look into this if you want quality physical media.
Physical media forever. Streaming cannot match the quality or the selection. Boutique labels are having their best years ever. I encourage everyone to continue to buy discs.
With all due respect, physical mediums can't die fast enough. This reeks of the spoiled child not wanting their candy taken away. There are folks dying because of the e-waste some countries produce. It also causes needless environmental damage, raw materials do not grow on trees. All so pretentious jerks can pretend to notice the minute differences in 4k, BT.2020, and insert the latest cash grab slogan.🤨 Bandwidth will increase enough in the coming decade to where they will be no discernible difference between streaming and physical media. You can't kill progress.
I hope real media never dies . I have an Oppo bluray player and a $2000 Panasonic 4k player and both blow away any streaming content that I've seen and especially heard... Streaming really lacks in sound. Vudu is about the best but still doesn't compare to media played through a good player. Amazon will make out nicely when all of these local retailers stop selling media. I think most buy theirs from Amazon anyway but now they may get the rest.
for a machine that perhaps only sells 3000 units a year there are many positive reviews, just got mine and it ‘s build quality is so good it will probably outlast me.
You should've opened it up if it was possible to see how beautiful the inside is. I did it with my Panasonic UB-9000 and the components inside are so freaking beautiful, a real work of art
Going by the sales of the 4k of Oppenheimer since it dropped yesterday on Amazon(10,000 copies sold since yesterday), I’d say the problem isn’t the lack of interest in physical media, rather that most movies coming out generally are no longer worth the hard copy purchase for most people.
Just buying the old stuff, really. Much cheaper in the long run. I must have paid $12 streaming Rocketeer. Should’ve bought the BluRay in the first place.
I think the internet makes fast initial sales almost inevitable, due to the ease of purchase, including pre-orders. They may also include overseas sales, and possibly even some stores buying them for resale. There's obviously still money in it, but it can't be anywhere near how many VHS tapes & DVDs were sold & rented in the past. For comparison, when Titanic was made available on VHS, 24,000,000 were sent to stores in the US in time for release day. While sales were apparently "slower" (perhaps partly as some were waiting for the DVD) than expected, there were still single stores selling 100 by midday(from 1200 in stock). Likewise 700,000 Terminator 2 VHS tapes were sent to rental stores in the US, which aside from the income made tape/dvd production even more worthwhile. Even the niche laserdiscs had some movies that sold over 100,000 copies. Apparently the highest selling bluray ever(Frozen) in the US was 8 million, and that was in 2014. The highest selling in 2022 was 1.3 million, with this year seeming much lower again. People also aren't buying classic movies on bluray in anywhere near the numbers they did on DVD & VHS.
When the streaming services/studios decide to Censor / Edit / Shorten your favorite movies, You will be really glad you have the Original or Director's Cut on Blu-Ray. Thank you Caleb.
More info on blu-ray players please. I love when Criterion or Arrow releases restoration films at 4k hdr and they get the director or cinematographer involved to approve it
This is the reason why I love your videos. Content like this are so rare to find, and yes I am one those people who loves and owns physical media. Very hard to find reviewers who knows and appreciate finer details. Thanks a lot Caleb.
Losing access to a bunch of digital movies I had “purchased” due to some sort of licensing change was enough to convince me to stick with physical discs. If I want I can rip them to a lossless digital format, but if I’m buying something I’d like to actually own it, until I choose to sell.
Since your are an audiophile, I must tell you that I've had both the 820 (2 actually) and several UB9000's. The audio over HDMI is quite weak on the 820. The UB9000 offers a huge upgrade in SQ you will no doubt appreciate. And it certainly is a bargain compared to this Magnetar!
I have absolutely no interest in a 4k player this expensive, but I appreciate your review on it. Loved how you broke things down and gave us all the info we needed on this device. Your review just reinforced that it just makes no sense for most people to have. I would love to find out who actually DOES need this for their setup rather than just wants the most expensive player for bragging rights.
If u want an affordable 4k blu ray player that will knock your socks off u should get a Sony ubp-x700 that’s what I have around $200 maybe less if it’s on sale and it’s really top notch for 99% of people.
@@Johnedwardpeterson I actually bought one of those and it has a freezing issues with most blu rays about 75% I. Always during a great part so totally ruined the experience. I found a lot of people had that issue. I had to get a Panasonic player because the Sony was out of warranty and I could never fix it.
Sorry that happened to u but I’ve never heard such a thing and mine doesn’t do that 🤯 well overall I still recommend it but definitely if you get a lemon return it
@@Johnedwardpetersoncyclone is correct many 4k players have this problem. It's not all the fault of the players though. Disc quality has been a downhill slide for a while. Read some of the forums, the studios are having discs pressed by the lowest bidders with little thought about quality. If you havent had any problems you've been lucky.
I bought a Panasonic DP-UB154 and play the same exact disks with no freezing. Put them in my Sony UBP- X700 and most disk will freeze about 90 minutes in roughly.
Perfect example of diminising return. No way this player is worth six times more than a good $500 4k player. Most people don't have TV that would do it justice and even fewer could tell the difference. I fully support physical media and always will, I even still have a 3d TV with over 200 3d movies but this is just like audiophile sound equipment. Most (not all) of it is made to separate audio snobs from their money.
I don't think a single person could tell the difference between this and a basic UHD player hooked up to a receiver and tv because the bits it puts out are the same. The receiver does the audio processing and the TV doing the video processing. Really don't need the player to do anything other than be fast and pass the data to the other devices.
@@curtisbme Agreed. All that's ever needed is the disc and laser to read the data and the stuff that sends it down the HDMI cable. Remove all outputs from the back except for the two HDMI outputs.
@@curtisbmethis isn't actually the case, it's a common myth about digital signals - without going into detail, the player has to do a lot of processing at the source before outputting and some players do a much better job than others. I think a lot of people would notice a difference in quality between, say, a PS5 and an Oppo on a decent AV System. Having said that, there's no defending the obscene prices some of these systems sell for. It certainly is diminishing returns. I can't help but think that the high prices of even the cheapest UHD players, not to mention the discs themselves, played a huge role in the low adoption of the format.
@@asparagustrevorpart of it is economy of scale too, when you only have a few thousand customers buying you have to charge a lot to make up for it. This is common in the audiophile world. A company like magnatar will never sit on a Walmart or Best Buy shelf.
I purchased a Reavon UBR-X100 a few months ago and absolutely love it. There’s nothing like watching a 4k on a high quality player on a high quality tv with a high quality sound system. It’s just works.
We are heading to a future, where a great deal of amazing films will simply disappear or be impossible to find... I think a great disk collection is a beautiful thing, to connect us to a time when films were good enough to watch more than once. Netflix and our other streaming addictions, simply don't offer the catalogue of old films that it should.
@@Kmaitland89Well I'm not so sure.. not so long ago it was explained that high quality films which weren't a hit at the box-office were sustained due to further adoption via physical media.. mostly mid budget films. Now that Discs no longer sell the required volume those films and studios are slowly but surely dissappearing.
Disc media has a lifespan of about 25 years if it is taken care of. Expansion and contraction rates of polycarbonate to the aluminum are different and will fail inevitably
@@AutismusPrime69 and there's the semi-famous resin rotting issue, some discs are dead after 5-10 years. I lost a lot of money with these... and the distributors mainly ignored the issue. So now, even if I prefer 300% discs, I buy a very few of them. And I don't stream. Industry killed my motivation...
4K disc publishing is thriving at its modest scale. You can now acquire titles like Friedkin's 'To Live and Die in LA' or Schrader's 'Cat People'. That's pretty culty stuff. Criterion, Kino, Vinegar Syndrome and more are all in. Nothing looks like my 4K copy of 'Close Encounters of the Third Kind'. The image is vital and faithful, and the sound rich and encompassing. It's a miracle digital format for the archivist set, and disc playback is reliable into the future. I still treasure old DVD's that have disappeared from home video. I did not check out 'The Godfather' 4K edition yet, but I'm told it transforms the experience of that movie.
@@GamezGuru1Literally the main thing that is changing is where you buy your physical media. Is shifting to all online. The only aspect I can see going away is games on physical media. But video and audio? Not even close. I know it’s a relatively small market, but you only had the see the U.K sales of the Rolling Stones new album. I think it was 45% vinyl, 40% CD, and the rest made up of digital downloads and streaming.
I'd love to see you do a comparison between this, the Panasonic ub9000, and any other high-end players out there, kind of like how you do a TV comparison.
I can’t wait for your full review and as an owner of a couple of Oppo players myself, I hope you will include your thoughts on comparing the Magnetar to the 4K Oppos. Thanks!!
Is Blu-ray dead? Not in my estimation! I am enthusiastically looking forward to your in-depth review of the Magnetar UDP-900. I will probably opt for the UDP-800 and save myself $1400 by purchasing Magnetar's second-tier 4K player, but I am certainly eager to hear about the top-tier UDP-900 even if I can only dream about owning it. By the way, I almost never buy Blu-ray titles from Best Buy, Walmart, or Target, so even if those retailers are phasing out the format it would scarcely make a difference to me. (The availability is still plentiful on Amazon & eBay).
Them being available doesn't mean it isn't dying. Also, it's 4K blu-ray that's dying. You can still buy players and physical media, but the way it's currently going... they might not be making them anymore in 5 or so years.
If you can afford it, it seems like a good purchase. Even if Blu-ray goes away, you will still have your physical media collection. Why not have a player at the best quality you can get? It is definitely worth it if you are a collector or enthusiast.
I agree. Depends on your setup, though, obviously. If you already run most everything through a fairly high-end computer of some kind (mini PC's can be great for the living room space), I'm not sure you "need" to pay this much for a Blu-Ray player. I've got an external Blu-Ray player that I paid less than $200 for, which, thanks in part to some modified firmware, plays anything you can throw at it. Will it last as long as this Magnetar? Maybe not, but otherwise....
@@wojtek-33It's not even about PC Blu-ray players not being the quietest. Windows for the most part (starting with Intel 11th gen processors) doesn't allow playing 4K Blu-ray discs through a 4K Blu-ray drive on your PC. You have to rip the file to bypass the DRM.
@@wojtek-33 Maybe. However, first off, I can't hear my drive over a movie, so that is a non-issue for me personally; and also, an awful lot of bluray movies are, let us just say, not quite the quality they're advertised to be. Plus, I can burn 4K UHD on my player, if anyone cares about that. But sure, if you already have a good collection of them, and expect to be able to get more for at least a few more years, and you have an extra $3000 to blow on something you can't think of a better use for, then I'm all for it. I'm not trying to rain on anyone's parade. ;)
Thank you for this excellent video!No, Blu-ray is not dead, nor are CDs or vinyl. I also enjoy streaming, but in many ways it can’t replace physical media. I have never actually heard SACDs or DVD Audio but am sure they must be superior if Caleb collects them. I certainly do not enjoy stature in the upper echelons of Audiophiledom, but I do the best I can with the lo-to-midfi system I scraped together the funds to buy and with which I am finding a renewed love of my favorite passion in life, which is, and always has been the pure joy and love of, music.
I've been into 4k Blu-ray for a while now, it's really worth it in my opinion. I only have mid to lower tier components so im thinking in a few years I will slowly start to upgrade. I hope even if it loses some support that it will still be around for a long time. Maybe it will gain popularity in the future like vinyl.
It's only worth it if you have a high-end TV and high-end sound setup to begin with (also counting high-end soundbars from recent years since they've become pretty damn good now). And 4K blu-ray versions of movies for some stupid reason also often do not have Dolby Vision and sometimes not even Dolby Atmos, despite the streaming version of that same movie having both (often also included as a code when you buy the physical version).
Good morning, Caleb. I applaud your support for physical media. Most Internet Service Providers brag about streaming and have little concern about the people who live in areas where you pay close to $200/month for a highly limited Internet access to an ever-narrowing resolution. Don't believe anything about high-speed Internet access coming soon because that's over a score of years away. I will stick to my LG 4K player, thank you very much. Equal Internet Access is a joke if you live in the rural areas of the country.
The Panasonic UB-9000 is also built like a tank and has high end audio/video components, but for roghly a third of the price of this player. I thought for sure you'd mention it as an obvious competitor in the same "Oppo replacement" sphere.
I have one of these region free new in the box and a region 800MK2 as a backup - awaiting my Z9K next year just got a new 5000ES receiver yesterday, collecting the fiber HDMI 8K cables next week - I have about 3500 disks so I want to get this right
Physical media always for quality content at home (for me) - the 12cm disc (in all its variants, video or audio) is king. I still stream - especially for mediocre content (of which there is much on netflix etc..) and especially when on my phone - but streaming merely compliments (and will never replace) physical media for me. Long live the 12cm disc.
physical media is always the way to go if you can afford it. It's amazing to see what you can find used online or even at your local thrift shops for Blu-ray Discs. They are usually like a dollar. And the picture and sound is still better than most streaming. Streaming is all about convenience, never about quality. I'm going to always buy movies that I love on Disc. Can't wait for Oppenheimer, for example.
Yeah, all those reasons is why they're killing physical media, so they can foist high price low quality content on people and leave them no options. 4K Blu-ray is literally "the final format" quality-wise. It's reached the point where the capabilities of the human eye or the human ear has become the limiting factor. So why would someone who bought a Blu-ray of their favorite movie ever upgrade again - ever? So yeah, pushing streaming and convenience is very intentional.
I am pleased to see that "quality" still exists and look forward to the full review. All things considered, it is inexpensive when you do consider the cost of many, many A-V products. Very interesting segment!
I lost my beloved Oppo BDP105-D in a fire and have been waiting for something current to replace it. As Caleb said, this is as close as you can get today. You lose balanced analog 7-channel output, but gain support for the latest audio and video standards. The reason they dropped the balanced multi-channel analog is probably because with today's formats, it's common to see 11 channels of audio and up. You'd need a bigger box to support the space for all of the connectors. I'll be going HDMI or coax to my home theater processor along with the balanced analog Left/Right outputs. The legacy audio format support (like SACD/DSD) was essential for me. Ditto Caleb again that you can see and hear the difference with physical media over streaming. And if you watch a lot of movies, using physical media also means you don't have to worry about your broadband provider's bandwidth caps. Thanks so much for this great review!
Blu-ray 3D is my favourite format and I hope it never dies, with the support of the 3D film archive, Disney, and Turbine it should continue long into the future I hope!
@@RobertK1993 Not really. Lacks balanced outputs for starters. There are many more differences. Specs don't tell the story anyway, rather quality of circuit board components matters, especially for audio.
I love physical media. While collecting physical media is a slow process and does not allow you to have many movies all at once from streaming sites, managing physical media is a sure way of accessing your favorite content for many years to come.
Not too sure about the blu ray going away, thing. The biggest thing that’s changing is where you buy it, which is moving to mainly online. I’d suggest as far as releases go, with are almost in a golden age as far as the amount of stuff coming out. Unless I’m pushed and don’t have a choice, I avoid streaming like the plague.
Agreed, it's the golden age of physical media and Blu-ray/4K. The only thing is almost everyone is buying online and having titles shipped to their home - stores don't move as many units as they used to brick-and-mortar. This arguably makes some people (mistakenly) believe the market doesn't exist in the same way anymore when in fact it is thriving - it is just more of a niche collectors market for home theater A/V film enthusiasts/collectors.
@@neillumbard7419 But you won’t hear that said out loud often. To fit the (their) narrative, they’d rather say, physical media is dead/dying. The only real sector of physical media that is disappearing is gaming. Come the next gen consoles, 2027, I doubt there will be very many physical games released.
I think Caleb hit the nail on the head. The high end audio/video club has a very small membership, and if you have to ask such a question, the answer will,not likely ever make sense financially . If you think $3000 is expensive, check,out the full zoom Kaleidoscape gear and subscription costs. Wouldn’t be too hard to find UA-cam video describing over the top home theatre installations at well over $500,000, with individual seating component costing more than this piece.
Kaleidascape does not have a subscription cost. Part of the reason for it's major expense is thier direct license relationship with the studios. The only thing you have to pay for post purchase is the movies themselves which are priced at and often lower then thier disc counterpart. However I will say, since I bit the bullet and purchased one it is by far the best video/audio experience source I have ever seen including disc. Is it dramatically different 4k Disc? No, but it is the best.
Do I stream? Yes. Do I prefer to watch something on one of my many physical copies? Also yes. If all else fails, I'll get what I can through Arrow, Diabolik, Shout, etc. Not like I haven't already ordered UHD Blu-rays from foreign markets because the studio in question didn't think it was worth releasing them in NA.
It must have been fun to be an engineer on this design and build. Management basically said "yes" to every upgrade, quality component, and improvement you requested. Very rare. Very annoying to be an engineer that is ignored and have management focus on the lowest build and design cost and highest profitability instead.
Not enough of the old movies I like are available on 4K for me to get a 4K machine. I mean The Adventures of Robin Hood, Double Indemnity, The Sea Hawk, Ben Hur, The Searchers etc. I see that Lawrence of Arabia, Vertigo, The Ten Commandments and My Fair Lady are on 4K disc though. I saw Lawrence of Arabia several times on the big screen 70mm, both on original release and since the restoration by Harris--very impressive. You need big Altecs for proper sound playback--VOTs, 604s or Model 19s preferably.
I love physical media and i'd to have a player that just deals with any format, not a t this price but it makes perfect sense to me. Actually a couole of months ago my internet failes for like a week and i was so glad to have my movies and music as discs
I still have my Pioneer Elite BDP-88FD Blu Ray Player I purchased around 8 years ago. That thing was around $1800 at the time and it is still a tank to this day. Plays with no issues, and I played the crap out of it. You pay for the quality and durability of these machines because they will last a long time.
Of course you're not impressed by it because you're NOT the target audience for this product. Move on and leave the intended target audience to enjoy this product. 🤣🤣🤣
You're lost in the sauce buddy! Streaming is where it's at - as VVC become the standard, more quality can be stuffed into the internet streaming pipe suddenly it's Bravia Core for everybody. I understand the argument for ownership but that ship has sailed - Spotify anybody?
There is still people out there that cannot distinguish between an oled and led and we are fighting about the difference about the blue ray disc and Netflix bitrate
I have invested way too much on 3D/4k BDs. I have a Sony UHD player from Amazon back in 2019 Black Friday $150.00 for the Sony UBP-X800. Side note; I am glad that the some of Short Throw laser tvs support 3D/4K. Also I also have a sizeable SACD/ DVD Audio collection, and very few except Sony and Magnetar offer SACD compatibility. If I had unlimited funds I would definitely buy one of these Magnetar players, it is a beaut.
Streaming quality still sucks so I'm gonna stick with 4K blu rays until every streaming service is offering 50Mbps+ bitrates for H265 or AV1. I'll just rip them with my $130 external blu ray drive though.
Honestly… a lot of streaming service are constantly deleting content and then even if you bought a movie or tv series on their platform, they can still revoke access or delete that content anyway, so having a hardcopy of your fave tv show or movie in your bookcase might not be such a bad idea for future proofing your home theatre library. This especially applies to older content. Also, I never liked renting, not irl or online, I want to own a physical copy so I can watch it anytime I want.
WE can buy hundreds of 4k discs for the price of this..Streaming is ok, but when a 4k projector fills a massive screen, you want the best..that is a disc,,
I have been wanted to get a dedicated 4K player but it’s so hard to make the jump when the convenience of putting a plex server with all my discs helps reduce the clutter and provides a comparable result. I want to upgrade one day when I can move into a bigger space. Those pioneer ones look so solid for the price.
I definitely want Blu-ray to survive and continue but what we really need are better displays that are tailored for motion resolution. We need to have an option other than sample and hold based screens. What use is paying three grand for a Blu-ray Drive if it doesn't actually improve meaningfully the ability to display the content
exactly omg what the ef is wrong with people and not recognizing motion is poor on everything today and motion interpolation is not a proper solution. lg cx and c1 had 120 hz bfi but it wasn't viable because of the low brightness, 2nd gen qd oleds are much better now and can easily make for a good hdr experience while providing more motion resolution (which it really needs), people just have to ask for it since the experiment on woleds is considered a fail when reality is it was the wrong time
@@StevoHDAcan you explain mor ewhat motion resolution is and how it improves the viewing experience. Is this why whenever a shot pans across the screen its almost painful to watch because it doesnt look smooth?
120 Hz displays do exist. But as long as movie "enthusiasts" trick themselves into thinking that 24p looks "cinematic" fast moving scenes and horizontal pans will always look like crap.
@@0dylan That's because of the 24p (24 frames per second) crowd. F.e. when a huge army of elve bowman on horseback appear on the horizon in a scene in one of the Lord of the Ring movies, the panning shot from left to right stutters like arse in cinema. Same reason no one would watch sport casts in 24p. But the "movie enthusiasts" don't get it and that is why until that crowd dies out we won't have movies produced in 60p or higher for a while. So, it is the source material. The screen or player are not to blame.
I feel the 4K Bluray market is thriving right now and getting stronger, it's a small market for sure but its full of diehard loyal enthusiasts! I have over 1000 4K Blurays myself and I have no plans on slowing down anytime soon 🤓
Movie theaters, even IMAX, only goes 4k. Digital Fx in Disney productions (Marvel, SW, …) are done in 2k (less expensive) and then upscaled professionally to 4k… IMHO 8K will take a while because it makes special FX crazy expensive Edit: unless IA makes digital Fx inexpensive ;-)
@@wojtek-33 In the EU they are talking about banning 8K TVs for climate change/power consumption reasons deaming 8K as wasteful technology. There's barely HD content available on TV and streaming, never mind 4K support which is lacklustre. 8K content increases ALL costs for everyone involved, from the cameras and production, the storage and transmission through the internet etc. 8K is totally unnecessary and will not see wide adoption. So I'd forget about 16K being a thing.
I just bought the Magnetar UDP-900 after owning every single flagship OPPO up until they discontinued selling Blu Ray 4K players. That said, I never once saw OPPO make anything even close in every aspect as nice as the Magnetar UDP900. Now, you do mention it’s 37lb weight, but you move it and handle it like it weighs have that much, so kudos to your strength! I can’t pick it up nearly as easily as you can. But you’re right, it is a niche market and will make a wonderful addition to my new Denon AVR-A1H. Love this review! Thank you for being so thorough!
Caleb! Love your vids man. Dont wanna be “that guy” fact checking, but Target still sells DVD’s, blu-ray, and 4k. They downsized a bit, but they have a big isle dedicated to it, and and endcap. I work there and we have it even after our big reset!
As an A/V nut i have a massive Laserdisc collection that still gives me a lot of pleasure. And i still buy the discs and players when i can find a good working one. As for the future on the spinning disc clearly the big retailers are loosing interest at an alarming rate. Here in the UK availability on the High Street is now very low with only a few left that also sell CD's Just how long the mail order companies will continue for is very uncertain, once the likes of Disney pull out you can ber certain more will follow. Enjoy your new player Caleb, the price will soon be forgotten when you become immersed in a 4K movie. Just pray that Magnetar don't do what Oppo did and pull the plug overnight.
I’m glad I’m not the only one still rocking and loving Laserdisc. It’s a big nostalgia hit for me. I used to record Laserdiscs to S-VHS, and while that may seem like a backward move, those tapes looked and sounded better than the VHs tapes of the same movies you could purchase.
Laserdisc never died, they just stopped making them due to the undue haste of pushing DVD's as the next must have format. The early DVD's and players were poor with blocky video and compressed audio. Laserdiscs should have continued until Blu-Ray was fully developed. Re VHS, S-VHS was sadly too late to the market, it was vastly superior to standard VHS, how anyone could watch the prerecorded movies i don't know, yet they sold. 4K Blu-Rays will still be available for a while, and as more people start streaming then hopefully we will be able to buy them at more sensible prices.@@Caleb_Denison
You can walk in HMV and there's a huge selection of movies available. There's also NO issue ordering any movie currently available from online retailers. It's a niche market, but while that market exists (and is profitable) there will be hardware and vendors producing discs. Just like Vinyl and CDs, the physical movie isn't going anywhere. But the mainstream consumer that walks in a supermarket is lost to streaming (currently) and that's why specialists such as HMV will likely be the main highstreet retailer. But they are doing a great job in that regard.
This is NOT the case with the HMV store in Chester, it moved from it's once excellent two floor store with the entire lower floor full of all the current titles to a much smaller narrow unit inside a shopping precinct and the selection available now is a fraction of what it was a lot of them are old titles in shelf worn cases that i refuse to buy. For now mail order is the only viable option for me, as for the future of both DVD's and Blu-Ray new titles will only become available as long as the movie studio's continue to release them, Disney is the first to pull out of the market and more will follow.@@ApolloT-vp5dn
I notice you have an Integra AVR in your video, are you doing a review of the Integra 8.4? I hope you will review it, I notice there’s no information on that unit. Love your videos, keep them coming.
As with CDs, the price of Blu-Ray/4K movies has dramatically fallen. You can often purchase new and used discs for not much more than it costs to rent or buy the digital copy. You also get extra features that aren’t available if you rent the movie.
On top of that, most Bluray/4K have a digital code so you can go half with a friend/family member where you keep the disc and they get the digital movie.
While as you know Caleb I'm a physical media collector.. but a $3,000 player no way 😂 I'll stick with my Panasonic ub820 player! But I appreciate your review..
Based on personal experience I can confirm that 4K BD discs are likely to frequently glitch if played on consumer grade players costing less than $300 - $400. However, they do not require a $3,000 player. My Panasonic DP-UB9000 has played every 4K disk without a hitch. The video is projected in 4K on a 92" diag. screen. In my opinion the difference between 2K and 4K isn't the resolution, it is the superior color dynamic range of the latter (HDR).
Looking forward to the review even tho I won't buy one since I have both an Oppo UDP-203 and Panasonic UB9000 lol. Physical media is not dying, there are far more releases every month than I can afford. Forget about the stores not wanting it on their shelves, people are buying it online.
I've been rocking my Panasonic UB9000 for years. Its rock solid and you save 2k compared to this one. If you don't have sacd/dvd audio go with the Panny
Yes and no. I would have the Blu-ray only so that I could rip the files out and store it in that digital manner and serve it however, I like while maintaining all the sound specs to be used with the sound system. The media itself is a relic of the past.
2 billion in physical media sales last year. That isn’t insignificant and as streaming services like Peacock are posting losses to the tune of hundreds of millions of dollars, streaming isn’t the panacea they thought it was going to be. Collectors are still here. The 900 is my next player.
Image and sound quality aside, the most significant reason for supporting physical media is the availability of you favorite movies and series. Look what the Disney is doing (and other streaming services too) - some of the content is gone before you have even a change to watch it. For example, Disney released The Willow series just last year and now it's already gone. Another one - my son just asked to see the Paw Patrol movie (2021). It just was available in Netflix and again, it cannot be found from any major streaming service. I live in Finland.
I love my UHD Blu-rays. This is interesting, but it’s a whole other world that I’m not a part of. I have the high end 77” OLED, and I thought I had a pretty high end UHD Blu-ray player. I thought I was pretty deep, but I can’t afford to go this deep.
Caleb. I'm with you on still rockin SACDs. I played my Union Station Live SACD to friends all the time through my oppo 103 and they're always speechless. These "dead" formats are simply superior to the modern streaming offerings in terms of quality.
@@ApolloT-vp5dnwere did you read that? If true thats good news. My last trip to Walmart didn't seem to support that. A year ago the Walmarts in my area had two full aisles of discs. Now they have maybe a half aisle.
Still love my oppo blu ray player. Physical media just makes more sense for me on regards to availability. I’ve lost so much music in iTunes due to licensing.
This is an impressive unit no doubt. I'm glad to see Magnetar launch this. But I'll be sticking to my world class Panasonic UB-9000 which is also built like a tank and has the highest quality.
You do realize that this is a 2 in 1 device right? It's a 4K Blu-ray player AND an A/V receiver in one device. That's why the price is $3,000+. You're mostly paying for the Audiophile hardware. Regardless, I'm sure this 4K Blu-ray player will offer SLIGHTLY better picture quality vs a PS5. Nothing you'd notice.
Dang. You bring up a good point and actually, may have pointed out an error I made in my video. If this can’t play HD-DVD, then I overstated its ability To play all disc-based media. I’ll check into this. Meanwhile, anyone got some HD-DVDs they wanna send me?
I like being a member of this small club...as a lurker, lol. I've invested in my tech hobbies but I'm still at upper mid tier soundbar level. Samsung QSymphony has been great with gaming and movies. I love physical media and like the concerts on disc and video collections. I'll graduate to this level of indulgence eventually
And why would you want a 2 in 1? The disc tray is much more likely to fail than anything in an AVR. It's much safer to have them seperate so you can replace the more likely failure point.
@@Ineedtotakeabreak The streaming model is unprofitable. But there won't be a huge exodus of streaming vendors, it'll remain similar to what we have. What will change is the cost to consumers and those will only increase.
This is an awesome player . I have the Oppo 205 and Panasonic 820 ,so I've no need for it. Regardless, I'm thrilled you did this video and there's still a market for physical top end players. Not every 1 has bailed on us "videophile /audiophile . Looking very forward to the full review .
My best friends (a married couple) share similar taste with me in movies & TV. I am 20+ years older than them. If I drop dead, I’ve already told them to scoop up my DVDs and Blu-rays (several hundred), and take them home. If those movies or shows were digital, my “ownership” dies when I die. I can’t transfer ownership to my friends. Physical media is better. MUCH BETTER. I can pass on my discs to whomever I please. Not so with digital.
The best way to watch movies and music is only on discs and local files hereafter. Wait and watch Blurays are going to be in massive demand in a span of months or a year. No streaming service is good these days as they do nothing but copyright claims. All good movies are missing. No server space at all and massive lossy quality in streaming. Blurays are the future without questions.
Nah, physical media will never be in massive demand lol.. most people don’t care enough about the quality of their streaming services. Also if they cant find a movie you can usually just rent it from something like prime. Not saying that streaming>physical but saying discs are going to be in massive demand is just not true.
Also, why I have a bluray player is because the changing availability. If you want to watch specific shows streaming actually sucks. For instance I was subscribed to DC universe which had batman beyond in HD. When they closed DC universe it took over a year before you got HD batman beyond. In that time I owned batman beyond and the wire for less money so...yeah. I still stream anime because anime blurays are quite expensive still. Also, netflix even if you have the 4k tier they may not send you atmos if they don't see 7.1.
Hey everyone! I wanted to issue a quick correction: All HDR is delivered in a rec.2020 container, so streaming can have rec.2020 (aka BT.2020) color just as well as disc. I do notice a significant difference between the two, and I suspect it’s actually down to bit depth rather than the presence of color information. Apologies for the error.
Hey Caleb. I’m just wondering do the materials used affect the sound quality. Is the gold plating for style or help with the sound. Great video
@@rem9882silver and gold have higher conductive properties and therefore lower attenuation than copper. Gold plating though...mmm
Audio is definitely a step up on physical from streaming, no doubt
Caleb could sell sand to the Arabs 😂
99% of people can't.
There’s no comparison between streaming and physical media. Hands down physical media is the way to go.
Disney+ other streaming services will go away bar Netflix and Amazon
Sony's Bravia Core is about the only one that's a legit competitor to physical.
@@RobertK1993lmao youre a boomer arent you lol 😂
I agree. Obvious artifacts like severe color banding are baked into the extreme compression of (current) video streaming.
.. Kaleidoscope streaming service has better quality than your physical 4K media. I hear this kind of called what you will from people who clearly do not collect and have large collections of DVD or Blu-ray media. Try finding your favorite movie or downloading it to your phone or tablet or whatever when you have thousands of movies you own. The space alone takes up a large room floor to ceiling two or three cases deep. No, what you said is when people have a handful of movies and have a Walmart or Target DVD purchased player or simply are trolling try to make some point.
I love that you shared this kind of content, Caleb. A lot of people seem to have forgotten that physical media is still a thing and is without a doubt the highest grade for movie watching, especially in a well-equipped 4K disc.
Exactly, if you buy an expensive 4K OLED and you're watching some compressed ass videos on streaming, why bother?
Highest grade?
Nope. That would be the severely overpriced Kaleidescape.
@@zZiL341yRj736 I don't care if it's compressed as long as I don't notice. My family nor I have ever complained about "compressed 4k or 1080p streaming". If it's a problem you, why only spend $3,000 on a Blu-ray player, get e professional one for $45k.
The problem with the Kaleidescape is its in the 10 grand range when i checked a year ago. Not sure if the price has gone down. And let's face it. You don't actually 'own' the movie. If your system breaks or the hard disc drive fries you will lose it especially if Kaleidescape were to go out of business down the line for any reason. The difference between a well mastered 100 GB 4k disc and the Kaleidescape file is actually NOT a big difference. This has been confirmed on the Spare Change Channel. So you can still still make the claim the 4k discs are virtually the highest quality of physical media around.@@PSYCHOV3N0M
Wrong dude, even there're quite a lot of Blu-ray media with bad transfer (almost DVD quality). Same with some of the 4k transfers as well. Bluray does not by default mean great PQ unless the restoration is of highest quality. Having a king of TV, a 3 grand worth of a bluray player and best upscaling won't necessarily guarantee best picture.
Blu-ray is can excellent format, and the bitrates achieved by 4K UHD Blu-rays is far superior to streaming. Not only is the quality much better, I don't have to worry about the titles I want to watch being removed from streaming platforms. It's also worth noting the 4K UHD Blu-ray format is thriving among collectors, will lots of remasters being announced every week.
Yes, I love collecting 4k uhd Blu-Rays. The quality is always superior to streaming. All the new 4k remasters from old films are so awesome to have and watch. I collect because i love to watch movies and i want to won my favorites as time goes on and not have to worry about it being removed from one platform or another (even ones i own it on). Its very dissapointing that blu ray is starting to dissapear from store shelves. At this point people are consenting to owning nothing.
One exception is Bravia Core...a streaming service only available on select hardware. It's on par with 4K Bluray.
Been buying bluray disc and 4k uhd disc second hand. $3, $4, and $5 dollars a pop.
@@noncustody nice!
The market isn't even slowing down, either. Regularly getting 100+ new releases in one week. Sometimes even more. Even with slow weeks, there are tons of new remasters/releases coming out with new 4K restorations, 2K restorations, etc. Over twice as many Blu-ray releases come out each year now compared to a few years ago. The market is thriving with the fanbase of movie collectors and those looking for a specific title (or titles).
While overall sales might be down for the disc market, we can take solace in the fact that there is a very passionate group of physical media collectors keeping the boutique disc market alive. Not only do these releases often come with quality video transfers, but they usually also provide great supplemental materials like interviews, commentaries, video essays, written booklets, beautiful art, and great packaging, etc. I really recommend people look into this if you want quality physical media.
Physical media forever. Streaming cannot match the quality or the selection. Boutique labels are having their best years ever. I encourage everyone to continue to buy discs.
Amen brother preach
Torrent
With all due respect, physical mediums can't die fast enough. This reeks of the spoiled child not wanting their candy taken away. There are folks dying because of the e-waste some countries produce. It also causes needless environmental damage, raw materials do not grow on trees. All so pretentious jerks can pretend to notice the minute differences in 4k, BT.2020, and insert the latest cash grab slogan.🤨 Bandwidth will increase enough in the coming decade to where they will be no discernible difference between streaming and physical media. You can't kill progress.
@@AldiAldiFPen No more pretentious than this tripe. You shouldn't preach when you are high.
@@AldiAldiFPenThe worst ecological disaster ever was giving 90% of humanity a smart phone to air their opinions
Great video! My current DVD/blu-ray/4K disc library is currently well over 2000. Long Live physical media! 👊
Damn! I"m at 50 and I thought I had a lot! Challenge Not Accepted!!!
I hope real media never dies . I have an Oppo bluray player and a $2000 Panasonic 4k player and both blow away any streaming content that I've seen and especially heard... Streaming really lacks in sound. Vudu is about the best but still doesn't compare to media played through a good player. Amazon will make out nicely when all of these local retailers stop selling media. I think most buy theirs from Amazon anyway but now they may get the rest.
Audio absolutely is a huge difference.
for a machine that perhaps only sells 3000 units a year there are many positive reviews, just got mine and it ‘s build quality is so good it will probably outlast me.
You should've opened it up if it was possible to see how beautiful the inside is. I did it with my Panasonic UB-9000 and the components inside are so freaking beautiful, a real work of art
Going by the sales of the 4k of Oppenheimer since it dropped yesterday on Amazon(10,000 copies sold since yesterday), I’d say the problem isn’t the lack of interest in physical media, rather that most movies coming out generally are no longer worth the hard copy purchase for most people.
Oppenheimer wasn't that great so it's really not worth buying.
@@Beltfedshootersto each their own
@@Beltfedshooters Agreed. Snoozenheimer.
Just buying the old stuff, really. Much cheaper in the long run. I must have paid $12 streaming Rocketeer. Should’ve bought the BluRay in the first place.
I think the internet makes fast initial sales almost inevitable, due to the ease of purchase, including pre-orders. They may also include overseas sales, and possibly even some stores buying them for resale. There's obviously still money in it, but it can't be anywhere near how many VHS tapes & DVDs were sold & rented in the past.
For comparison, when Titanic was made available on VHS, 24,000,000 were sent to stores in the US in time for release day. While sales were apparently "slower" (perhaps partly as some were waiting for the DVD) than expected, there were still single stores selling 100 by midday(from 1200 in stock).
Likewise 700,000 Terminator 2 VHS tapes were sent to rental stores in the US, which aside from the income made tape/dvd production even more worthwhile.
Even the niche laserdiscs had some movies that sold over 100,000 copies.
Apparently the highest selling bluray ever(Frozen) in the US was 8 million, and that was in 2014. The highest selling in 2022 was 1.3 million, with this year seeming much lower again.
People also aren't buying classic movies on bluray in anywhere near the numbers they did on DVD & VHS.
When the streaming services/studios decide to Censor / Edit / Shorten your favorite movies, You will be really glad you have the Original or Director's Cut on Blu-Ray. Thank you Caleb.
French Connection...
A Christmas Toy
Star Wars theatrical edition without those god awful CGI add ins.
More info on blu-ray players please. I love when Criterion or Arrow releases restoration films at 4k hdr and they get the director or cinematographer involved to approve it
This is the reason why I love your videos. Content like this are so rare to find, and yes I am one those people who loves and owns physical media. Very hard to find reviewers who knows and appreciate finer details. Thanks a lot Caleb.
Losing access to a bunch of digital movies I had “purchased” due to some sort of licensing change was enough to convince me to stick with physical discs. If I want I can rip them to a lossless digital format, but if I’m buying something I’d like to actually own it, until I choose to sell.
This!
Wow, this makes the $400 Panasonic UB 820 seem like an amazing deal! I personally would not purchase this player, but I understand why one would.
Since your are an audiophile, I must tell you that I've had both the 820 (2 actually) and several UB9000's. The audio over HDMI is quite weak on the 820. The UB9000 offers a huge upgrade in SQ you will no doubt appreciate. And it certainly is a bargain compared to this Magnetar!
exactly
Yup, 90% performance 15% price. Audiophiles love to spend.
Can you clarify what you mean by " audio ovver HDMI is quite weak on the 820 ". @@bearclaw5115
So the audio via hdmi on the 9000 Panasonic exeds the 820 panasonic?...I have the 820 / thinking of an upgrade!
I have absolutely no interest in a 4k player this expensive, but I appreciate your review on it. Loved how you broke things down and gave us all the info we needed on this device. Your review just reinforced that it just makes no sense for most people to have. I would love to find out who actually DOES need this for their setup rather than just wants the most expensive player for bragging rights.
If u want an affordable 4k blu ray player that will knock your socks off u should get a Sony ubp-x700 that’s what I have around $200 maybe less if it’s on sale and it’s really top notch for 99% of people.
@@Johnedwardpeterson I actually bought one of those and it has a freezing issues with most blu rays about 75% I. Always during a great part so totally ruined the experience. I found a lot of people had that issue. I had to get a Panasonic player because the Sony was out of warranty and I could never fix it.
Sorry that happened to u but I’ve never heard such a thing and mine doesn’t do that 🤯 well overall I still recommend it but definitely if you get a lemon return it
@@Johnedwardpetersoncyclone is correct many 4k players have this problem. It's not all the fault of the players though. Disc quality has been a downhill slide for a while. Read some of the forums, the studios are having discs pressed by the lowest bidders with little thought about quality. If you havent had any problems you've been lucky.
I bought a Panasonic DP-UB154 and play the same exact disks with no freezing. Put them in my Sony UBP- X700 and most disk will freeze about 90 minutes in roughly.
Perfect example of diminising return. No way this player is worth six times more than a good $500 4k player. Most people don't have TV that would do it justice and even fewer could tell the difference. I fully support physical media and always will, I even still have a 3d TV with over 200 3d movies but this is just like audiophile sound equipment. Most (not all) of it is made to separate audio snobs from their money.
I don't think a single person could tell the difference between this and a basic UHD player hooked up to a receiver and tv because the bits it puts out are the same. The receiver does the audio processing and the TV doing the video processing. Really don't need the player to do anything other than be fast and pass the data to the other devices.
Worth is relative.
@@curtisbme Agreed. All that's ever needed is the disc and laser to read the data and the stuff that sends it down the HDMI cable. Remove all outputs from the back except for the two HDMI outputs.
@@curtisbmethis isn't actually the case, it's a common myth about digital signals - without going into detail, the player has to do a lot of processing at the source before outputting and some players do a much better job than others. I think a lot of people would notice a difference in quality between, say, a PS5 and an Oppo on a decent AV System.
Having said that, there's no defending the obscene prices some of these systems sell for. It certainly is diminishing returns. I can't help but think that the high prices of even the cheapest UHD players, not to mention the discs themselves, played a huge role in the low adoption of the format.
@@asparagustrevorpart of it is economy of scale too, when you only have a few thousand customers buying you have to charge a lot to make up for it. This is common in the audiophile world. A company like magnatar will never sit on a Walmart or Best Buy shelf.
I purchased a Reavon UBR-X100 a few months ago and absolutely love it. There’s nothing like watching a 4k on a high quality player on a high quality tv with a high quality sound system. It’s just works.
We are heading to a future, where a great deal of amazing films will simply disappear or be impossible to find... I think a great disk collection is a beautiful thing, to connect us to a time when films were good enough to watch more than once. Netflix and our other streaming addictions, simply don't offer the catalogue of old films that it should.
There are plenty of films that come out that are “good enough to watch more than once” and always will be.
@@Kmaitland89Well I'm not so sure.. not so long ago it was explained that high quality films which weren't a hit at the box-office were sustained due to further adoption via physical media.. mostly mid budget films.
Now that Discs no longer sell the required volume those films and studios are slowly but surely dissappearing.
Disc media has a lifespan of about 25 years if it is taken care of. Expansion and contraction rates of polycarbonate to the aluminum are different and will fail inevitably
@@AutismusPrime69 and there's the semi-famous resin rotting issue, some discs are dead after 5-10 years. I lost a lot of money with these... and the distributors mainly ignored the issue. So now, even if I prefer 300% discs, I buy a very few of them. And I don't stream. Industry killed my motivation...
4K disc publishing is thriving at its modest scale.
You can now acquire titles like Friedkin's 'To Live and Die in LA' or Schrader's 'Cat People'. That's pretty culty stuff. Criterion, Kino, Vinegar Syndrome and more are all in.
Nothing looks like my 4K copy of 'Close Encounters of the Third Kind'. The image is vital and faithful, and the sound rich and encompassing.
It's a miracle digital format for the archivist set, and disc playback is reliable into the future. I still treasure old DVD's that have disappeared from home video.
I did not check out 'The Godfather' 4K edition yet, but I'm told it transforms the experience of that movie.
Amen. Tho the popular narrative is that is blu ray is dead because a store like Target don’t carry it 😂
@@garrypeak4277 yup, was very dissapointed to hear Caleb regurgitate that nonsense on a channel like this...
@@GamezGuru1Literally the main thing that is changing is where you buy your physical media. Is shifting to all online. The only aspect I can see going away is games on physical media.
But video and audio? Not even close. I know it’s a relatively small market, but you only had the see the U.K sales of the Rolling Stones new album. I think it was 45% vinyl, 40% CD, and the rest made up of digital downloads and streaming.
@@garrypeak4277Target itself is going the way of the dodo.
@@mikeg2491they are targeting kids
I'd love to see you do a comparison between this, the Panasonic ub9000, and any other high-end players out there, kind of like how you do a TV comparison.
Oh the final part got me hyped!!! I do wanna see how this fares against the Panasonic DP-U9000 and the UB820! I love "fights" :D
I can’t wait for your full review and as an owner of a couple of Oppo players myself, I hope you will include your thoughts on comparing the Magnetar to the 4K Oppos. Thanks!!
Is Blu-ray dead? Not in my estimation! I am enthusiastically looking forward to your in-depth review of the Magnetar UDP-900. I will probably opt for the UDP-800 and save myself $1400 by purchasing Magnetar's second-tier 4K player, but I am certainly eager to hear about the top-tier UDP-900 even if I can only dream about owning it. By the way, I almost never buy Blu-ray titles from Best Buy, Walmart, or Target, so even if those retailers are phasing out the format it would scarcely make a difference to me. (The availability is still plentiful on Amazon & eBay).
Sony UBP-X800M2 is best value 4K Ultra HD Blu ray disc player Panasonic UB 820 is close second.
Them being available doesn't mean it isn't dying. Also, it's 4K blu-ray that's dying. You can still buy players and physical media, but the way it's currently going... they might not be making them anymore in 5 or so years.
If you can afford it, it seems like a good purchase.
Even if Blu-ray goes away, you will still have your physical media collection.
Why not have a player at the best quality you can get?
It is definitely worth it if you are a collector or enthusiast.
I agree. Depends on your setup, though, obviously. If you already run most everything through a fairly high-end computer of some kind (mini PC's can be great for the living room space), I'm not sure you "need" to pay this much for a Blu-Ray player. I've got an external Blu-Ray player that I paid less than $200 for, which, thanks in part to some modified firmware, plays anything you can throw at it. Will it last as long as this Magnetar? Maybe not, but otherwise....
Looks like kaleidoscope is your only option if Blu-ray ceases to exist
@@MrViper7121It's spelled Kaleidescape.
@@wojtek-33It's not even about PC Blu-ray players not being the quietest.
Windows for the most part (starting with Intel 11th gen processors) doesn't allow playing 4K Blu-ray discs through a 4K Blu-ray drive on your PC.
You have to rip the file to bypass the DRM.
@@wojtek-33 Maybe. However, first off, I can't hear my drive over a movie, so that is a non-issue for me personally; and also, an awful lot of bluray movies are, let us just say, not quite the quality they're advertised to be. Plus, I can burn 4K UHD on my player, if anyone cares about that. But sure, if you already have a good collection of them, and expect to be able to get more for at least a few more years, and you have an extra $3000 to blow on something you can't think of a better use for, then I'm all for it. I'm not trying to rain on anyone's parade. ;)
Thank you for this excellent video!No, Blu-ray is not dead, nor are CDs or vinyl. I also enjoy streaming, but in many ways it can’t replace physical media. I have never actually heard SACDs or DVD Audio but am sure they must be superior if Caleb collects them. I certainly do not enjoy stature in the upper echelons of Audiophiledom, but I do the best I can with the lo-to-midfi system I scraped together the funds to buy and with which I am finding a renewed love of my favorite passion in life, which is, and always has been the pure joy and love of, music.
I've been into 4k Blu-ray for a while now, it's really worth it in my opinion. I only have mid to lower tier components so im thinking in a few years I will slowly start to upgrade. I hope even if it loses some support that it will still be around for a long time. Maybe it will gain popularity in the future like vinyl.
It's only worth it if you have a high-end TV and high-end sound setup to begin with (also counting high-end soundbars from recent years since they've become pretty damn good now). And 4K blu-ray versions of movies for some stupid reason also often do not have Dolby Vision and sometimes not even Dolby Atmos, despite the streaming version of that same movie having both (often also included as a code when you buy the physical version).
Blu-ray and dvd is still the only way to truly own the copy of the movie.
Good morning, Caleb. I applaud your support for physical media. Most Internet Service Providers brag about streaming and have little concern about the people who live in areas where you pay close to $200/month for a highly limited Internet access to an ever-narrowing resolution. Don't believe anything about high-speed Internet access coming soon because that's over a score of years away. I will stick to my LG 4K player, thank you very much. Equal Internet Access is a joke if you live in the rural areas of the country.
The Panasonic UB-9000 is also built like a tank and has high end audio/video components, but for roghly a third of the price of this player. I thought for sure you'd mention it as an obvious competitor in the same "Oppo replacement" sphere.
I have one of these region free new in the box and a region 800MK2 as a backup - awaiting my Z9K next year just got a new 5000ES receiver yesterday, collecting the fiber HDMI 8K cables next week - I have about 3500 disks so I want to get this right
@@johnhender You're definitely doing it right. How did you manage to get region-free versions?
@@johnhenderfuture proofing is a bitch. Dont think it can ultimately be done.
Physical media always for quality content at home (for me) - the 12cm disc (in all its variants, video or audio) is king.
I still stream - especially for mediocre content (of which there is much on netflix etc..) and especially when on my phone - but streaming merely compliments (and will never replace) physical media for me.
Long live the 12cm disc.
It would be really unfortunate if they stop making 4K BluRay movies in physical media! Glad I bought an OPPO BDP-205 and it is still running!
Man, I kick myself often for not getting that player!!!😂
Studios are releasing a bunch of 4k discs at an awesome rate right now. I’d love to have this player but I’m happy with my UDP-203 for the time being
physical media is always the way to go if you can afford it. It's amazing to see what you can find used online or even at your local thrift shops for Blu-ray Discs. They are usually like a dollar. And the picture and sound is still better than most streaming. Streaming is all about convenience, never about quality. I'm going to always buy movies that I love on Disc. Can't wait for Oppenheimer, for example.
Yeah, all those reasons is why they're killing physical media, so they can foist high price low quality content on people and leave them no options. 4K Blu-ray is literally "the final format" quality-wise. It's reached the point where the capabilities of the human eye or the human ear has become the limiting factor. So why would someone who bought a Blu-ray of their favorite movie ever upgrade again - ever? So yeah, pushing streaming and convenience is very intentional.
Yah. And then you actually own and possess the movie. Steaming is transitory.
I am pleased to see that "quality" still exists and look forward to the full review. All things considered, it is inexpensive when you do consider the cost of many, many A-V products. Very interesting segment!
Caleb taken them to school. Well said my friend. It's a must buy for me. I'm all about the physical media.
I lost my beloved Oppo BDP105-D in a fire and have been waiting for something current to replace it. As Caleb said, this is as close as you can get today. You lose balanced analog 7-channel output, but gain support for the latest audio and video standards. The reason they dropped the balanced multi-channel analog is probably because with today's formats, it's common to see 11 channels of audio and up. You'd need a bigger box to support the space for all of the connectors. I'll be going HDMI or coax to my home theater processor along with the balanced analog Left/Right outputs. The legacy audio format support (like SACD/DSD) was essential for me.
Ditto Caleb again that you can see and hear the difference with physical media over streaming. And if you watch a lot of movies, using physical media also means you don't have to worry about your broadband provider's bandwidth caps.
Thanks so much for this great review!
Blu-ray 3D is my favourite format and I hope it never dies, with the support of the 3D film archive, Disney, and Turbine it should continue long into the future I hope!
Getting 4k for only 3k? That's a deal!
😂😂😂
Sony UBP-X800M2 better value is much same specs😊
@@RobertK1993 Not really. Lacks balanced outputs for starters. There are many more differences. Specs don't tell the story anyway, rather quality of circuit board components matters, especially for audio.
I love physical media. While collecting physical media is a slow process and does not allow you to have many movies all at once from streaming sites, managing physical media is a sure way of accessing your favorite content for many years to come.
Not too sure about the blu ray going away, thing. The biggest thing that’s changing is where you buy it, which is moving to mainly online.
I’d suggest as far as releases go, with are almost in a golden age as far as the amount of stuff coming out.
Unless I’m pushed and don’t have a choice, I avoid streaming like the plague.
Agreed, it's the golden age of physical media and Blu-ray/4K. The only thing is almost everyone is buying online and having titles shipped to their home - stores don't move as many units as they used to brick-and-mortar. This arguably makes some people (mistakenly) believe the market doesn't exist in the same way anymore when in fact it is thriving - it is just more of a niche collectors market for home theater A/V film enthusiasts/collectors.
@@neillumbard7419 But you won’t hear that said out loud often. To fit the (their) narrative, they’d rather say, physical media is dead/dying.
The only real sector of physical media that is disappearing is gaming. Come the next gen consoles, 2027, I doubt there will be very many physical games released.
@@garrypeak4277who is their?
I think Caleb hit the nail on the head. The high end audio/video club has a very small membership, and if you have to ask such a question, the answer will,not likely ever make sense financially . If you think $3000 is expensive, check,out the full zoom Kaleidoscape gear and subscription costs.
Wouldn’t be too hard to find UA-cam video describing over the top home theatre installations at well over $500,000, with individual seating component costing more than this piece.
Kaleidascape does not have a subscription cost. Part of the reason for it's major expense is thier direct license relationship with the studios. The only thing you have to pay for post purchase is the movies themselves which are priced at and often lower then thier disc counterpart. However I will say, since I bit the bullet and purchased one it is by far the best video/audio experience source I have ever seen including disc. Is it dramatically different 4k Disc? No, but it is the best.
@@sandy737All positive Kscape comments on UA-cam are paid shills or bots.
How does this compare to the Panasonic UB900 or the Sony ES 4k Players ?
Do I stream? Yes. Do I prefer to watch something on one of my many physical copies? Also yes. If all else fails, I'll get what I can through Arrow, Diabolik, Shout, etc. Not like I haven't already ordered UHD Blu-rays from foreign markets because the studio in question didn't think it was worth releasing them in NA.
It must have been fun to be an engineer on this design and build. Management basically said "yes" to every upgrade, quality component, and improvement you requested. Very rare. Very annoying to be an engineer that is ignored and have management focus on the lowest build and design cost and highest profitability instead.
Not enough of the old movies I like are available on 4K for me to get a 4K machine. I mean The Adventures of Robin Hood, Double Indemnity, The Sea Hawk, Ben Hur, The Searchers etc. I see that Lawrence of Arabia, Vertigo, The Ten Commandments and My Fair Lady are on 4K disc though. I saw Lawrence of Arabia several times on the big screen 70mm, both on original release and since the restoration by Harris--very impressive. You need big Altecs for proper sound playback--VOTs, 604s or Model 19s preferably.
I love physical media and i'd to have a player that just deals with any format, not a t this price but it makes perfect sense to me. Actually a couole of months ago my internet failes for like a week and i was so glad to have my movies and music as discs
I still have my Pioneer Elite BDP-88FD Blu Ray Player I purchased around 8 years ago.
That thing was around $1800 at the time and it is still a tank to this day. Plays with no issues, and I played the crap out of it.
You pay for the quality and durability of these machines because they will last a long time.
I’m not impressed by it.
I’m happy with my Panasonic 4K player and I only paid $500.
Yah I just bought Panasonic UB820K player $424😍
Of course you're not impressed by it because you're NOT the target audience for this product.
Move on and leave the intended target audience to enjoy this product.
🤣🤣🤣
Love my Ub820
@@PSYCHOV3N0MSony UBP-X800M2 better than both of those players
You're lost in the sauce buddy! Streaming is where it's at - as VVC become the standard, more quality can be stuffed into the internet streaming pipe suddenly it's Bravia Core for everybody. I understand the argument for ownership but that ship has sailed - Spotify anybody?
There is still people out there that cannot distinguish between an oled and led and we are fighting about the difference about the blue ray disc and Netflix bitrate
Yes, because if you cannot tell the difference between 4K BluRay and Netflix 4K.... you probably should have gone to Specsavers.
I have invested way too much on 3D/4k BDs. I have a Sony UHD player from Amazon back in 2019 Black Friday $150.00 for the Sony UBP-X800. Side note; I am glad that the some of Short Throw laser tvs support 3D/4K. Also I also have a sizeable SACD/ DVD Audio collection, and very few except Sony and Magnetar offer SACD compatibility. If I had unlimited funds I would definitely buy one of these Magnetar players, it is a beaut.
Streaming quality still sucks so I'm gonna stick with 4K blu rays until every streaming service is offering 50Mbps+ bitrates for H265 or AV1. I'll just rip them with my $130 external blu ray drive though.
Honestly… a lot of streaming service are constantly deleting content and then even if you bought a movie or tv series on their platform, they can still revoke access or delete that content anyway, so having a hardcopy of your fave tv show or movie in your bookcase might not be such a bad idea for future proofing your home theatre library.
This especially applies to older content.
Also, I never liked renting, not irl or online, I want to own a physical copy so I can watch it anytime I want.
WE can buy hundreds of 4k discs for the price of this..Streaming is ok, but when a 4k projector fills a massive screen, you want the best..that is a disc,,
I have been wanted to get a dedicated 4K player but it’s so hard to make the jump when the convenience of putting a plex server with all my discs helps reduce the clutter and provides a comparable result. I want to upgrade one day when I can move into a bigger space. Those pioneer ones look so solid for the price.
I definitely want Blu-ray to survive and continue but what we really need are better displays that are tailored for motion resolution.
We need to have an option other than sample and hold based screens.
What use is paying three grand for a Blu-ray Drive if it doesn't actually improve meaningfully the ability to display the content
exactly omg what the ef is wrong with people and not recognizing motion is poor on everything today and motion interpolation is not a proper solution. lg cx and c1 had 120 hz bfi but it wasn't viable because of the low brightness, 2nd gen qd oleds are much better now and can easily make for a good hdr experience while providing more motion resolution (which it really needs), people just have to ask for it since the experiment on woleds is considered a fail when reality is it was the wrong time
@@StevoHDAcan you explain mor ewhat motion resolution is and how it improves the viewing experience. Is this why whenever a shot pans across the screen its almost painful to watch because it doesnt look smooth?
@@0dylan just look up what bfi does
120 Hz displays do exist.
But as long as movie "enthusiasts" trick themselves into thinking that 24p looks "cinematic" fast moving scenes and horizontal pans will always look like crap.
@@0dylan
That's because of the 24p (24 frames per second) crowd.
F.e. when a huge army of elve bowman on horseback appear on the horizon in a scene in one of the Lord of the Ring movies, the panning shot from left to right stutters like arse in cinema.
Same reason no one would watch sport casts in 24p.
But the "movie enthusiasts" don't get it and that is why until that crowd dies out we won't have movies produced in 60p or higher for a while.
So, it is the source material.
The screen or player are not to blame.
I clicked on the video just to see another audio video gadgets that i cant afford anytime soon
I feel the 4K Bluray market is thriving right now and getting stronger, it's a small market for sure but its full of diehard loyal enthusiasts! I have over 1000 4K Blurays myself and I have no plans on slowing down anytime soon 🤓
@@wojtek-33 Nahhh, 8K TVs are only needed with giant TVs like 85" or bigger, it'll be a long time before TVs that big are the norm :)
@@wojtek-33 Why do we need 8K TVs at all?
@@paskelrey TVs that big will never be the norm.
Movie theaters, even IMAX, only goes 4k.
Digital Fx in Disney productions (Marvel, SW, …) are done in 2k (less expensive) and then upscaled professionally to 4k…
IMHO 8K will take a while because it makes special FX crazy expensive
Edit: unless IA makes digital Fx inexpensive ;-)
@@wojtek-33 In the EU they are talking about banning 8K TVs for climate change/power consumption reasons deaming 8K as wasteful technology.
There's barely HD content available on TV and streaming, never mind 4K support which is lacklustre.
8K content increases ALL costs for everyone involved, from the cameras and production, the storage and transmission through the internet etc.
8K is totally unnecessary and will not see wide adoption. So I'd forget about 16K being a thing.
I just bought the Magnetar UDP-900 after owning every single flagship OPPO up until they discontinued selling Blu Ray 4K players. That said, I never once saw OPPO make anything even close in every aspect as nice as the Magnetar UDP900. Now, you do mention it’s 37lb weight, but you move it and handle it like it weighs have that much, so kudos to your strength! I can’t pick it up nearly as easily as you can. But you’re right, it is a niche market and will make a wonderful addition to my new Denon AVR-A1H. Love this review! Thank you for being so thorough!
Caleb! Love your vids man. Dont wanna be “that guy” fact checking, but Target still sells DVD’s, blu-ray, and 4k. They downsized a bit, but they have a big isle dedicated to it, and and endcap. I work there and we have it even after our big reset!
I definitely collect blu rays of movies or shows I really enjoy or if the price is super low for a specific genre I know I’ll enjoy
As an A/V nut i have a massive Laserdisc collection that still gives me a lot of pleasure.
And i still buy the discs and players when i can find a good working one.
As for the future on the spinning disc clearly the big retailers are loosing interest at an alarming rate.
Here in the UK availability on the High Street is now very low with only a few left that also sell CD's
Just how long the mail order companies will continue for is very uncertain, once the likes of Disney
pull out you can ber certain more will follow.
Enjoy your new player Caleb, the price will soon be forgotten when you become immersed in a 4K movie.
Just pray that Magnetar don't do what Oppo did and pull the plug overnight.
I’m glad I’m not the only one still rocking and loving Laserdisc. It’s a big nostalgia hit for me. I used to record Laserdiscs to S-VHS, and while that may seem like a backward move, those tapes looked and sounded better than the VHs tapes of the same movies you could purchase.
Laserdisc never died, they just stopped making them due to the undue haste of pushing DVD's as the next must have
format.
The early DVD's and players were poor with blocky video and compressed audio.
Laserdiscs should have continued until Blu-Ray was fully developed.
Re VHS, S-VHS was sadly too late to the market, it was vastly superior to standard VHS,
how anyone could watch the prerecorded movies i don't know, yet they sold.
4K Blu-Rays will still be available for a while, and as more people start streaming then hopefully
we will be able to buy them at more sensible prices.@@Caleb_Denison
Oppo quit making 4K Blu-ray players only because their profit margins are WAY HIGHER from selling smartphones.
That's all.
You can walk in HMV and there's a huge selection of movies available. There's also NO issue ordering any movie currently available from online retailers.
It's a niche market, but while that market exists (and is profitable) there will be hardware and vendors producing discs. Just like Vinyl and CDs, the physical movie isn't going anywhere.
But the mainstream consumer that walks in a supermarket is lost to streaming (currently) and that's why specialists such as HMV will likely be the main highstreet retailer. But they are doing a great job in that regard.
This is NOT the case with the HMV store in Chester, it moved from it's once excellent two floor
store with the entire lower floor full of all the current titles to a much smaller narrow unit
inside a shopping precinct and the selection available now is a fraction of what it was
a lot of them are old titles in shelf worn cases that i refuse to buy.
For now mail order is the only viable option for me, as for the future of both DVD's and Blu-Ray
new titles will only become available as long as the movie studio's continue to release
them, Disney is the first to pull out of the market and more will follow.@@ApolloT-vp5dn
Would love to see a review on the UDP-800 as well.
Looking forward to the full review. I struggle with FOMO all the time so if this thing is that much better than my ub820, Im going to be tempted lol
I notice you have an Integra AVR in your video, are you doing a review of the Integra 8.4? I hope you will review it, I notice there’s no information on that unit. Love your videos, keep them coming.
As with CDs, the price of Blu-Ray/4K movies has dramatically fallen. You can often purchase new and used discs for not much more than it costs to rent or buy the digital copy. You also get extra features that aren’t available if you rent the movie.
On top of that, most Bluray/4K have a digital code so you can go half with a friend/family member where you keep the disc and they get the digital movie.
While as you know Caleb I'm a physical media collector.. but a $3,000 player no way 😂 I'll stick with my Panasonic ub820 player! But I appreciate your review..
Would be cool to do a comparison with the UB-820 and UB9000
Based on personal experience I can confirm that 4K BD discs are likely to frequently glitch if played on consumer grade players costing less than $300 - $400. However, they do not require a $3,000 player. My Panasonic DP-UB9000 has played every 4K disk without a hitch. The video is projected in 4K on a 92" diag. screen. In my opinion the difference between 2K and 4K isn't the resolution, it is the superior color dynamic range of the latter (HDR).
I still continue to use physical discs and high-quality 4K Blu-ray players to get the ultimate visual experience.
Looking forward to the review even tho I won't buy one since I have both an Oppo UDP-203 and Panasonic UB9000 lol. Physical media is not dying, there are far more releases every month than I can afford. Forget about the stores not wanting it on their shelves, people are buying it online.
I wouldn't go that far by saying Disney+ is "doing really really well".
I've been rocking my Panasonic UB9000 for years. Its rock solid and you save 2k compared to this one. If you don't have sacd/dvd audio go with the Panny
Heck, I'm still excited by my $300 UHD Blu-ray player.
Yes and no. I would have the Blu-ray only so that I could rip the files out and store it in that digital manner and serve it however, I like while maintaining all the sound specs to be used with the sound system. The media itself is a relic of the past.
2 billion in physical media sales last year. That isn’t insignificant and as streaming services like Peacock are posting losses to the tune of hundreds of millions of dollars, streaming isn’t the panacea they thought it was going to be. Collectors are still here. The 900 is my next player.
Image and sound quality aside, the most significant reason for supporting physical media is the availability of you favorite movies and series. Look what the Disney is doing (and other streaming services too) - some of the content is gone before you have even a change to watch it. For example, Disney released The Willow series just last year and now it's already gone. Another one - my son just asked to see the Paw Patrol movie (2021). It just was available in Netflix and again, it cannot be found from any major streaming service. I live in Finland.
I love my UHD Blu-rays. This is interesting, but it’s a whole other world that I’m not a part of.
I have the high end 77” OLED, and I thought I had a pretty high end UHD Blu-ray player.
I thought I was pretty deep, but I can’t afford to go this deep.
Caleb. I'm with you on still rockin SACDs. I played my Union Station Live SACD to friends all the time through my oppo 103 and they're always speechless. These "dead" formats are simply superior to the modern streaming offerings in terms of quality.
Target isn't the only one dropping physical media, Best Buy and Walmart are heading in that direction.
Yup
Hope does companies get punished
You're wrong about Walmart. They're in negotiations to take a bigger share.
@@ApolloT-vp5dnwere did you read that? If true thats good news. My last trip to Walmart didn't seem to support that. A year ago the Walmarts in my area had two full aisles of discs. Now they have maybe a half aisle.
Still love my oppo blu ray player. Physical media just makes more sense for me on regards to availability. I’ve lost so much music in iTunes due to licensing.
This is an impressive unit no doubt. I'm glad to see Magnetar launch this. But I'll be sticking to my world class Panasonic UB-9000 which is also built like a tank and has the highest quality.
The Panasonic model is DP-UB9000. Mine plays 4K BD without a hitch, which was not the case with a $400 4K BD player.
Is it really worth it? How's the picture quality compare to the pics from PS5 console?
You do realize that this is a 2 in 1 device right?
It's a 4K Blu-ray player AND an A/V receiver in one device. That's why the price is $3,000+. You're mostly paying for the Audiophile hardware.
Regardless, I'm sure this 4K Blu-ray player will offer SLIGHTLY better picture quality vs a PS5.
Nothing you'd notice.
You don't need anything more than Panasonic UB820
I won't be trading up from my UB820, but I don't begrudge anyone who does. Sometimes you just gotta treat yo self 😉
Yah I just bought the UB820K to go with my Sony TV A95L 😍
Agreed. Even that is over-specced :). All that's needed is something to read the data of a disc and send the digital data down a cable.
I have no interest in getting a dedicated blu ray player anytime soon, but I loved this hybrid story time/history lesson/unboxing video! Great stuff!
It would be weird if that also played HD-DVD’s as well.
Dang. You bring up a good point and actually, may have pointed out an error I made in my video. If this can’t play HD-DVD, then I overstated its ability
To play all disc-based media. I’ll check into this. Meanwhile, anyone got some HD-DVDs they wanna send me?
@@Caleb_DenisonHD DVD what is that?😂
I like being a member of this small club...as a lurker, lol. I've invested in my tech hobbies but I'm still at upper mid tier soundbar level. Samsung QSymphony has been great with gaming and movies. I love physical media and like the concerts on disc and video collections. I'll graduate to this level of indulgence eventually
These type of players are for people who have expensive sound systems but somehow don’t have a receiver… which is basically no one.
And why would you want a 2 in 1? The disc tray is much more likely to fail than anything in an AVR. It's much safer to have them seperate so you can replace the more likely failure point.
@@DrakonRI have to agree.
I'd rather have just the 4K Blu-ray player portion.
I am in that physical media club too. I don't buy things that extravagant but I do save up to buy the things I can in terms of video & audio.
People who buy 4K HDR OLED TV to watch compressed streaming videos is the equivalent of buying a Hypercar to go pick up your kids at school.
Disc is still king. Streaming is like mp3. It fills a need but is subpar.
They should definitely do away the dvd as it’s almost 30 years old and the quality is really bad especially on todays huge TVs.
I always laugh at the idiots with 4K TV's who keep buying DVD movies.
They have no idea how backwards their mentality is.
Blu ray disc 3D Blu ray in limited quantity and 4K Ultra HD Blu ray are only formats should be available.
Sometimes it’s just fun to browse gear I can’t justify, thanks for the vid 😊
If streaming is the future to these companies then why did Peacock lose so much money 😐.
And Disney+
Because there are currently too many services, but that will change. I don’t know anyone who still buys disks.
@@IneedtotakeabreakDiscs.
NOT disks.
@@Ineedtotakeabreak The streaming model is unprofitable. But there won't be a huge exodus of streaming vendors, it'll remain similar to what we have. What will change is the cost to consumers and those will only increase.
@@PSYCHOV3N0Mwho cares ?
This is an awesome player . I have the Oppo 205 and Panasonic 820 ,so I've no need for it.
Regardless, I'm thrilled you did this video and there's still a market for physical top end players. Not every 1 has bailed on us "videophile /audiophile .
Looking very forward to the full review .
I see no reason to get this gigantic brick over a regular 4k blu ray player.
They charge $99.00 for a update
@@roachman1412 That firmware "update" is to allow region free.
@@jjchmiel78Software updates are supposed to be free.
Sony UBP-X800M2 more features then Panasonic UB 820 and most features of this.
My best friends (a married couple) share similar taste with me in movies & TV. I am 20+ years older than them. If I drop dead, I’ve already told them to scoop up my DVDs and Blu-rays (several hundred), and take them home. If those movies or shows were digital, my “ownership” dies when I die. I can’t transfer ownership to my friends. Physical media is better. MUCH BETTER. I can pass on my discs to whomever I please. Not so with digital.
The best way to watch movies and music is only on discs and local files hereafter. Wait and watch Blurays are going to be in massive demand in a span of months or a year.
No streaming service is good these days as they do nothing but copyright claims. All good movies are missing. No server space at all and massive lossy quality in streaming. Blurays are the future without questions.
Nah, physical media will never be in massive demand lol.. most people don’t care enough about the quality of their streaming services. Also if they cant find a movie you can usually just rent it from something like prime.
Not saying that streaming>physical but saying discs are going to be in massive demand is just not true.
Also, why I have a bluray player is because the changing availability. If you want to watch specific shows streaming actually sucks. For instance I was subscribed to DC universe which had batman beyond in HD. When they closed DC universe it took over a year before you got HD batman beyond. In that time I owned batman beyond and the wire for less money so...yeah. I still stream anime because anime blurays are quite expensive still. Also, netflix even if you have the 4k tier they may not send you atmos if they don't see 7.1.