Thank you very much for your kind assertion! Never thought about it that way before, but I can see where the juxtaposition of functional tradesman meets scientific theory in practice is very applicable. Glad you enjoyed it!
I rarely if every comment on videos, but this was the absolute best explanation on wiring the Tesla connector as well as explaining the generals between ground bars, neutral and the legs of power. Thank you.
For those watching today - you cannot use 6 gauge 6/3 NMB Romex with a 60A breaker - THIS IS NOT TO CODE. However, 6/3 NMB Romex with a 50A breaker = to code (just set the Tesla V3 wall charger to 40A charging when commissioning and that is a safe setup that meets code). Unfortunately for me, 7 months ago I watched this video, ran out and bought a long (75ft) run of 6/3 NMB Romex and a 60A breaker thinking I could use the Tesla V3 Wall Charger's full 48A capability and learned AFTER my install that this combination was NOT to code. All was not lost - after learning this, I swapped the 60A breaker for a 50A breaker and set the V3 Tesla wall charger to 40A charge rate which is safe, to code and works really well. If you want to get the V3 Wall Charger's max charge rate (48A), you will need a 60A breaker - paired with conduit and THHN 6 gauge or MC 6 gauge or 4 gauge Romex. This is a GREAT video and it helped me a LOT but the suggested use of 6/3 Romex and a 60A breaker is not to code unfortunately. I found this out after I purchased the materials and ran the cable.
This is so correct. I almost bought 6/3 nm wire and swapped for THHN 6 gauge for conductors and a 10 gauge for ground. It’s cheaper + I don’t have to run that neutral wire. This is good because it saves room in the 3/4 in conduit. I believe code is no more that 53% of space can be filed by wire. I also believe the THHN wire can handle 75 amps @ 90 degrees
Wow, this is far and away the BEST video I've seen on this topic. I've seen much longer videos that ramble on and on without saying much. This one is spot on: concise and well-organized, with all the info we need. Thanks!
Thank you for the compliment, Ron. That was precisely why I made it that way: give the most usable information in the shortest possible time. I’m glad you found it valuable!
I HAVE NO DAMN IDEA WHAT HE WAS TALKING ABOUT MOST OF THE VIDEO BUT THE FACT THAT I AM GOING TO PURCHASE A TESLA AND GET A TESLA CHARGER AS WELL MADE ME LEARN ALOT CAN WE GIVE THIS MAN A HELL YEAHHH!!!!
I had a short run, only 12 foot, I ran the individual 4 AWG wires, Red, Black, Green in 1" non-metallic conduit, did not have to wrestle with the wire, more relaxed. Since the Gen 3 already comes with a 24' lead the length was sufficient for both our cars. Great video.
Thanks for the comment! Glad you found it useful. Since this video was uploaded, 3 key takeaways to heed have emerged: 1) #6 Wire in conduit is allowed for 60A installs, but NM-B is down-rated to 60C category (despite mine was rated for 75C at the time), which puts it at 55A rating, so either choose a different #6 wire + conduit or use #4 wire.; 2) There was never a reason for my having used 6/3 at the time other than availability (lack of 6/2 the day I decided to do the install, I didn’t need the white common for anything in the circuit) ; 6/2 (or 4/2, depending on your situation) is the way to go); 3:). Using the White wire as a ground and then tagging it with Green electrical tape to signify its use as Ground has proven to be unnecessary and debate for far too much confusion than it has been worth. Just use the bare copper that the 6/2 (or 4/2) comes with, or in a conduit run with separate conductor pulls, use the green cladding, as is standard, to avoid any confusion. The two most often issues people have run into have been not being mindful of the length of wire required from their load center/breaker panel to the HPWC and that the longer the run, the more resistance, and therefore more robust wiring required, and spend the money on a proper torque wrench for securing the wires down to the terminal block on the HPWC end and the other end to the breaker lugs on the other end, to the proper spec in-lbs. Enjoy many years of great service. Mine is still working flawlessly 2.5 years later. Cheers.
@@TeslaTechChannel Thanks for this again. I'm planning on wiring the charger from my electrical panel, which is outside my garage, through to the direct opposite side of the wall. So i'll just be using Romex 6/2. Not sure if i'll be needing conduit as the wiring will be in between the wall and I believe conduit is not needed (locally at least). Would you suggest running conduit anyways? Since it will be a 60A install but ofc not using 60A as the Tesla will only be drawing a maximum of 48A.
If you're using ROMEX you HAVE to get a size larger to account for the thermal increase from the extra insulation of the wire jacketing. You should change out your wiring to ROMEX 4g or THHN 6ga for a 60amp circuit. Overloading the ampacity could cause a fire.
Truth is, 1.5 years later my install still works perfectly....and I have tested it in the peak heat of the summer under sustained 48A load and checked all parts from end to end with my FLIR camera and it isn't even coming close to 60C. NOW, putting on my 1-size-fits-all hat for safety since I cannot account for all factors involved, much like the NEC has to account for, then absolutely -- 4/2 all the way! That, correcting the UMC firmware limit of 32A load, and the not showing phase taping green of the repurposed neutral as ground (or just using the conventional bare copper instead) have been the two biggest corrections I would make if I had to redo this video again. I have been fortunate to get some great feedback from the video, yours included, over the last 1.5 years on the video. Thanks for watching and taking the time to comment!
@@orestracki6617 and number 6 romex is only rated for 55 amps not 60 hence the reason he needs to upsize his wire to be code compliant. You have to rate the wire and breaker at 125% of the 48 amps which is why you have to use a bigger wire or run it in pipe and use thhn .
@@orestracki6617 You never wire a house based on a specific load device. 100 years from now, someone could install something else on that circuit and cause a fire since the wire could melt before it trips the breaker.
@@orestracki6617 What Tesla says and does, does not supersede NEC's requirements. When the wire is only rated at 55 amps and the breaker is 60 amps, the wire becomes the fuse. An inspector will fail it.
Hey Steve, thanks for the very kind comment!! Neither had I until my Model Y. Word of warning in advance: the instant acceleration/torque, it should almost be called "thrust", is VERY addicting and feels like a tubular roller coaster or a smaller engined private jet taking off; because of the low center of gravity it handles very well, not quite Porsche well, but well nonetheless; the electricity cost in most parts of the US are much cheaper than gas (costs me roughly $8 to "fill-up" compared to low $30s for my other cars. You rarely need to use (and therefore replace) brakes if you select to use full regen capabilities to take advantage of one-pedal driving (which only takes about a week to get used to, and then you will wonder why all cars don't have this). The Tesla-branded Brembo brakes on the Performance stop on a dime and give you back a nickel should you need to use them during more spirited driving. It has also been an unanticipated relief to have a nearly "full tank" every morning. I say nearly because you shouldn't charge Li-Ion batteries over 90% for battery-pack longevity/health unless you are going to immediately drive the vehicle or going on a long trip in a few hours/next morning and need the added range to get to the next charger. Superchargers are $0.25 a kW but charge your car at 7x-10x faster than even the 48A home charger. Takes only 30 mins to "fill-up" and the car has some decent games to play or you can watch Netflix, Hulu, or UA-cam while waiting. I thought it would suck to wait for supercharging, but it doesn't seem as long as it sounds. For my other gas-powered vehicles sometimes I am waiting in a line at Costco or Sams for 10 minutes to get to the pump and another 5 to fill, so it really isn't as bad as I expected. Of course just plugging it in at home is the most convenient of all. Also, sometimes I use the J1772 adapter the car came with and get free "gas" while at a shopping center or restaurant on those Volta chargers that have TV ads running on them, abeit it charges at a slower 7kW (32Amp/208v) vs the 11.5kW you get from the Tesla HPWC v3 at home (48A/240v), but its free and you are there anyways. I have been following Tesla since they had the original roadster (Lotus Elise conversion) and announced Model S. I test drove the first year Model S (P75D, I think) and was amazed, but couldn't reconcile the $120k price tag back then. Now that Teslas have stood the test of time and I know they are not going under, and now that one can be purchased in the 50s and 60s (and even less for a Model 3) . When the Model 3 came out I was interested, but at a husky 6'5" it was still too tight for me to get in and out of daily. Once the Model Y launch happened and I finally sat in one of the first ones off the assembly line, to me it was a no brainer at that point and finally came time to make it happen. I sold my Stage 1 Cobb-tuned Subi WRX and my Stage 1 Porsche Macan GTS earlier this summer and bought this in their place. After my initially having to reject 2 early Y's with defects, 3rd time was a charm and now after just over a month of ownership, I don't regret it one bit. Yeah, it's all that and a bag of chips...and in full disclosure, I don't think of myself as a save-the-planet eco-activist Tesla fanboi type. Sure if I can reduce pollution along the way, great. I just appreciate innovative engineering, quality craftsmanship (the paintjobs all suck BTW. Blue and Black seem to be the least problematic. Hence why I rejected the first 2 orders that were white, and ended up going with blue). No more oil changes, transmission issues, ignition tune-ups, valve jobs. I digress, I friggin' love it so far!! I know you will too. Enjoy the flight ....err, drive. Comment back and lemmie know what you think. Also, if there are other video topics you would like to see, leave a suggestion for a new video and I'll see what I can do to accommodate. Thanks again!
@@TeslaTechChannel Well buddy...The wife and I LOVED the model Y and ordered one when we got home last Saturday!! I have a 2016 Challenger 392 scat pack shaker that I have had for about a year and a half. It was the fastest car off the line I ever drove......until Saturday! hahaha WOW That model Y was absolutely AMAZING. What was even more amazing is the trade in that Tesla gave me for that car! I have always heard that they are crazy cheap on trades so I wasn't even going to get rid of the Dodge. With what they offered me PLUS adding the savings in sales tax it was a no brainer. It was only 1500K less than what I paid for the car 1 year and a half ago. BTW I am 6-1 350lbs so I wasn't expecting a comfortable ride and ease of getting in and out....I was WRONG. Its no different than getting in my F150! The wife and I are making a youtube journey series from "Well we are going to drive a Tesla but we are not sure if we will even like it" to the first drive on the way home however long that may be. I cant think of ever being this pumped about getting a new car EVER! We got the Long range with FSD since I got the deal on the dodge. I will send you an informal link from another youtube account ( unedited just to send to friends on our test drive) My wife was PETRIFIED on the FSD! HAHAHA
Thanks for the follow-up, Steve! I enjoyed watching your and Angie's first drive. I am in the same boat as you being a big guy at 6'5" 320 and I too was amazed at how well I fit. Extra truck: Tundra instead of an F150, but same idea. You can't really blame Angie for being reluctant about autopilot. I too, despite being prepared for using it, still having to learn to trust it happens in increments. I did the Performance, but without the FSD. I thought about getting it, but at $8000 when I ordered it, now $10,000, I didn't see the value for the way I normally like to drive. I hope you used someones Tesla referral code (mine (ts.la/jon30517) or a friend or family member) when you ordered so you, and whomever's code you used, both get 1000 miles of supercharging credited to your Tesla account. If not, call Tesla and they should be able to add it to your order. Congrats on the great deal! I'm looking forward to seeing your future vids.
Yep, this video covered a lot of material that other videos failed to mention. My Tesla Sales Advisor stated the WC could support 80 amps. I now know that he was referring to the Ver 2 WC. And I liked your explanation of using the white wire on ground bus bar. I'm probably going to get some 6/3 romex. I was thinking of getting 3/2 but the wires are white and black, which would have made the install confusing to an electrician in the future and potentially unsafe. 6/3 also allows me the freedom of removing my WC and adding a 14-50 plug in the future if I move and take my WC with me. And there is plenty of space inside the WC to coil up the extra unused white wire.
@@TeslaTechChannel I reread my comment and I meant to say I was thinking of using 6/2 wire and just using the white wire as a powered second leg. But I'll use the 6/3 and just tuck in the white wire in the box. The potential safety risk isn't worth the minor savings on the wire. My total run is 25 feet of wire.
I know this is late (2 years), but 6 AWG romex is only rated at 55 amps @60C, and therefore should not be used on a 60 amp breaker. Tesla specifies 90C rated wire. Save your self the risk and use MC cable, 6/2 MC is rated for 75 amps @90C because the individual conductors are THHN.
This is a great video! there is some miss information at 4:57 in regards to Allowable Ampacities of Insulated Conductors. In the NEC 310.16 for 6 AWG Wire there are three columns. 55 amps for the 60° column 65 A for the 75° and 75 A for the 90° column. So the actual wire itself is capable of handling 75 Amps. The problem lies within what degree rating the equipment That is feeding the wire is rated at. The breaker in this instance which is rated at 75° determines what column to use. So in this scenario # 6 AWG is good for 65 A. If all the equipment including the wire was rated at 90° that would change the game. Not all parts are created equal..;-)
Just did a WC install today. Used 25' of TTHN #4 and TTHN #8 ground (90c rated). Cost difference between #6 and #4 was .25 per foot. Not worth the $25 to have an upgrade path and lower fire risk; plus the #4 can be retrofitted w/ a sub-panel at some point and two wall connectors can be used at 30-38a each. The #4 90c rated wire can handle up to 95a; or 76a on a continuous load like EV charging.
@@TeslaTechChannel I am currently setting up to wire and using #6/2 w/ground because I have. Do you think this is ok with leaving the ground bare on on the bus bar?
@@briansteege5303 Absolutely! The Wall Connector only requires 2 hots and a ground. The only reason I did 6/3 was because I couldn't readily find 4/2, 4/3 or 6/2. Because I had the extra 6AWG white wire left over unused, and because white normally = neutral AND neutrals and grounds are tied together in the main load center, there was no risk in using the tihicker 6AWG white wire for the ground instead of the bare 10 AWG. Ideally, you would want to use 4/2 (+ bare ground) for the install. I have looked for 4/2 from both Cerrowire and Southwire. Neither of them manufacture it. I would to either have to buy 4/3 online or buy a 100 foot spool of it locally, which was cost prohibitive. Because of the short run and ambient temps where I live + the fact that the NEC allows for 100% of sustained load when using current-regulated devices (both the Wall COnnector and the Tesla's Charging module regulate 48A charging) so therefore the 55 amp rating of 6AWG NM-B meets that requirement. That said, if your run is long (mine was only 10 cable feet) and/or you live in a hot climate, use the 4 AWG instead. But otherwise, YES you will be fine with 6/2 wire. Just remember that the bare ground on 6/2 is only 10 AWG and therefore will fit differently in the Wall Connector's terminal blocks. Best of luck!
@@briansteege5303 I assume you are saying that, based on still using the 6/2 wire. That said, only if you also provision the Wall Connector as being connected to a 50A breaker, which will provide max 40A charging. That would be ok. Frankly, there is nothing wrong with choosing to install it that way permanently either. It will just take a little longer to charge. Some people need to do that because of not having sufficient power to their load center to handle the combined load in the rest of the circuits in the house PLUS the additional 48A constant load , and have to throttle it back to stay within the capabilities of the service feeder to their house.. What I would NOT do is to provision the WC as 60A in an attempt to hack charging at 48A and connect it to a 50A breaker. It would be unsafe, and could possibly ruin your WC, and would most likely trip the breaker upon trying to charge at 48A anyways.
Very clear video - concise and most understandable, especially for the person trying to understand the charging options, and benefits of each. I'm in research mode for possible Model 3 purchase, and this is very helpful. I agree with your choice to go with the Gen 3 wall connector - for $165 more, get the better solution.
I suppose you are right. I assumed people attempting this would know at least basic things such as screwing down terminals to wires. I can see how it would have been more thorough, but the video is already quite long as it is. That is why I focused on the less obvious things. Thanks for the comment!
your rational for using 6-2 on a 60 is interesting. I am not judging or criticizing. I just find it interesting how we all make our decisions. I have been doing elec for 40 years. And my justification is this. 55 amp breaker is not considered standard in the NEC hence you can go to the next standard which is 60. Hope i am not wrong. Otherwise I have been wrong for a hella long time. Anyway great video.
Very true, and sure you normally just go off the ampacity chart, so you certainly aren’t wrong. Even if you were, it wouldn’t be my place to judge. I was merely trying to provide some additional rationale and spark some thinking from the viewer behind the process and basic understanding of the modifying variables which can mitigate the standard ampacity chart. In hindsight, a year on, I would redo this video to using 4/2 and conventional copper ground rather than phasing the neutral as ground to have avoided people getting confused behind dogmatic conventions, rather than offer some understanding of electricity. Would have saved TONS of questions. I suppose,however, that it is also a good sign that people are asking questions, rather than going off half-cocked. Thankful I didn’t decide to demonstrate doing a THHN run.. People would be asking me how to do saddle bends :)
@@TeslaTechChannel being that I am going to be 72 and have 2 metal hips I try to avoid saddle bends now. unless its 1/2". And installing 4-2 in that charger. makes me tired just thinking about it. :)
Great job, thank you! I especially liked the color-coded wiring diagram at 6:22 that shows how to properly ground and / or bond a main and / or secondary panel. I did a screen grab of that and saved it - very helpful!
I did my install like this but I installed the wire and breaker in the panel last instead of first like you did. I didn't bother shutting off the main breaker either, really no need to just make sure the 60 amp breaker is off, push it on the buss bars and turn on the breaker as the very last step of the install. Not saying your way is wrong but just seems like its better to do the other end before installing the breaker or messing with the panel in anyway since its not needed until everything else is installed properly anyway. I bought my Tesla wall charger off of a guy on CL for $375 brand new in the box. I stumbled onto the add looking for something else, just got lucky. Also got a Tesla M3 indoor car cover for an extra $125 from him I didn't even know existed until I got there to look at the wall charger, walked out with both for $450.
As I'm sure you've heard by now, that cheap, plastic 14-50 you showed near the end of the video is a well-known fire starter. A real 14-50 costs nearly 10 times as much but is much less likely to burn down the house. I, personally, will limit the amperage in the app. No point in maxing out the heat load in my house wiring.
Agreed. Since wiring a NEMA 14-50 was not the subject of the video, and therefore not as important to go into depth on, it has been left in there. However, you are correct. If someone opts to wire-up a 14-50 they should get the commercial series 14-50p from Hubbell meant to handle such a duty-cycle. Thanks for noticing and for your comment!
7:55 According to the Tesla Gen3 Connector manual, you should not put it on a GFCI circuit because it already has one that checks for ground and retries 4 times on fault after 10 seconds.
Correct. I said as much. My comment at 7:55 was for if you have an SR+, which can’t handle more than 32A charging, to forego the HPWC and just install a 14-50 on a GFCI and buy the adapter for the UMC instead. The GFCI was not suggested for theHPWC. In fact, if you go back and watch 1:22 thru 1:47, I articulate about the exact matter you mention. Thanks for watching!
Caution on the standard 14-50R, do not cheap on the HD one and make sure to get an “Industrial” 14-50 such as the one from Hubbell as Tesla recommends.
Agreed 100% - I didn't go over that, as this video was specifically for the HPWC v3 and not a 14-50 plug. But I completely concur on the selection of a commercial higher duty-cycle 14-50R, not the cheapie at HD.
The NM sheathed cable conductors are only rated for 55 amps. NEC article 625 requires 125% of the rated load of the charger which is 48 amps so 48 x 125% is 60 amps. So right out of the gate you're looking at conductors that will be overloaded and certainly don't meed the NEC requirements. The EVC is a continuous load, thus the reason for the 125% increase.
Hi Vivek, Many SF houses built within the last 20 years have the load center like you in the basement. I would suggest considering running a 100-watt subpanel into your garage, and then running the 60Amp circuit from that subpanel to the Wall Connector. The pros for doing that are that you will still have other breaker slots and available remaining power to run circuits later for things like a welder, air compressor, etc. If you are not into professional tools which pull a lot of watts, those additional available amps could instead be used for additional outlets on dedicated circuits for things like a refrigerator or freezer, a workbench powerstrip, or a myriad of other power-consuming devices. Considering the normal garage is now constructed with a single, or even worse shared, GFCI circuit leaving you very little available power for other things in your garage. If none of those reasons, strike your fancy, you can always just have expansion room for future circuits which may become desirable later. Another benefit is the shorter run for the Wall Connector from the subpanel, which means you can run the thinner 6 or 4 gauge wire, vs thicker for longer runs homeran to the basement main load center. Finally, having the subpanel close to the HPWC, you can be safer knowing that you could always use the 60A breaker as an emergency disconnect switch. Also, something else to think about is that, depending on the state you live in, if its has adopted NEC version 2020, you may be required to have a physical disconnect switch near the wall connector within X number of cable-feet to meet code requirements. HTH
@@TeslaTechChannel wow, that is very insightful and thank you so much. I live in suburban Chicago. First think I am going to do is to get a guy who can speak this language. I wish you worked in IL. Lol. Thank you once again.
Tesla Tech, thank you for the detailed responses and excellent video. My electrician is planning to install a 100 amp subpanel just behind the wall of main panel. To create the 60 amp circuit that you described in your response, is a 60 amp breaker mandatory in the subpanel or can a 100 amp breaker be added instead for Tesla wall connector? Electrician said he will be adding a 100 amp subpanel and not a 100 watt subpanel that you mentioned in your response. What is the difference? (Website states Amps multiplied by Volts equals Watts.) Thank you.
I agree that a GFCI is not needed for permanent installations- the code as I read it is only for RECEPTACLES: 625.54 Ground-Fault Circuit-Interrupter Protection for Personnel. All single-phase receptacles installed for the connection of electric vehicle charging that are rated 150 volts to ground or less, and 50 amperes or less shall have ground-fault circuit-interrupter protection for personnel.
So well done! There are too many “instructional videos” out there that don’t explain adequately the project one is attempting but this was excellent. This is my first time ever commenting on a UA-cam video. Make more videos, please.
This is the most ridiculously helpful video on the Tesla wall charger on UA-cam. Unreal, how good this video is. How far can the main panel be from the wall charger?
Thanks for the compliment. Glad you found it helpful! I tried to add the most usable value in the shortest video possible. As for your question: there is not really a limit to length for the distance you can do, per se. It is more of a question of, what gauge wiring do you need to use to accomodate 60 amps of current at X number of cable feet. That said, you would just have to up the thickness of the wiring gauge (thicker = lower number) to account for additional resistance per foot of wire, which translates to heat. There is a wiring thickness chart at 10:17 in the video that shows you what gauge it should be based on how many feet in the run. To run the 60Amp breaker service, just follow the rightmost column. HTH.
@@TeslaTechChannel sorry: It's not so easy, your electrical code may require additional protection on longer cables. This unit has a PEN-fault device unlike the GEN2-charger? Talk with your electrician! Zappy or another charger might be a better or cheaper soulution in your case (PEN-fault, power sharing in you subpanal, .... ,no need to upgrade your house connection) but the tesla charger may be fine in special cases. ua-cam.com/video/ztc7-q2n53w/v-deo.html The longer the cable the more diffential you may get in ground potential and this might be lethal. Sorry! This is a 48A unit and you need 1/2 of you 100A panel reserved for this at all times. Other chargers may use only what is left from your 100A panal. The care stops charging if you want to example shower (the tesla charger stops charging too as you whole main breaker flips) and restart afterwards.
Why use the 60 deg C column? Gen 3 Installation manual specifically notes: "If installing for maximum power, use minimum 6 AWG, 90° C-rated copper wire for conductors." 6/3 is perfect for this application as long as the individual conductors are THHN or better (and they should be!). I would even use 6/2 if only 3 wires are required.
6/2 is all that is needed. As for conductor type, while the HPWCv3 and breaker being rated higher, as well as the NM-B used in my video was rated at 90c, the NEC states despite that they say it needs to be downrated to the 60c column. 6/2 THHN in conduit would be the best way to go. 4/2 even better.
. NEC 240.4 (B)(2) conductors dose not correspond with STANDARD AMPERE RATING of a fuse or breaker can go to next breaker size (not over 800 amp). 55 amp is not standard breaker size , so 60 amp breaker is totally legit for 55amp rated wire for Tesla.
Minor correction: the second generation wall connector can deliver up to 80A off a 100A circuit. But only Roadsters and certain older Model S and X cars can benefit from that.
I understand your logic, but I don’t agree with using the 60amp breaker on that 6awg romex. If you didnt want to wait for an online order, then you should have used MC cable or THHN wire in a conduit. Both could be 6awg and 8awg for the ground and fully rated for a 60amp breaker. Or stick with romex but commision your charger for a 50amp breaker. Also, if you use white for ground then you should get a label maker or green tape and mark it as ground.
My electrician installed the Wall Connector for me, but only used 50 amp breakers. He said that since the charge is limited to 48 amps, a 50 amp breaker was fine. Was he correct?
Great question! -- Nope. The configurator web interface for the HPWCv3 adheres to NEC convention where it will allow max charging rate at 80% of the rating on the circuit (actually, the NEC states circuit must be rated for 125% of the load -- same result, calculated in the inverse). Therefore, a 60 will do 48; a 50 will do 40, 40will be 32, etc.
You are correct!....or bare copper. Adding green electrical tape to both ends of the alternate wire being used in the video will make is code compliant.
I love this very informative video. Would you be able to explain how to route six gauge cable from basement to garage we have a basement panel right below the entrance from garage to laundry room very short distance.
If it is a long run, like from a basement to a garage I would recommend going with 4 AWG. As was pointed out in the video, I only used 6 AWG because the run from the breaker box to the HPWC was a foot away. Logic is that the longer distance cable the more resistance there is and in order to properly run a contant load at higher amperage you need to up-size to the next larger.
Nicely done video. However it has been well established that the use of the cheap Nema 14-50 receptacles made by Leviton etc, available at Home Depot, are not safe or suitable for EV charging due to the heavy load cycling requirements. Suitable receptacles like Hubbell, which cost in the $80-$100 range, are made with bakelite instead of plastic, and have brass connectors rather than steel, and have more secure screw terminal connections. There are YT videos showing cases of the cheaper receptacles overheating and melting under EV charging requirements. Secondly, while the logic for using a 60amp breaker seems sensible due to the current limiting done by the car's charging circuit, I believe it is technically still against code.
I agree completely. The Heavy Duty Hubbell is the right tool for the job. The cheap 14-50 at Home Depot isn’t up to the continuous load or duty cycle requirements. I appreciate the feedback.
I'd like to add that running 6/3 Romex instead of 6/2 romex was not only kinda silly but also costs quite a bit more per foot. Might not matter in your install because of proximity to panel but sometimes you may have a few hundred dollar difference in wire price for that extra conductor on a longer run
it was smart to use 6/3 for the video & for non electricians. It gets confusing when you use the white wire as an energized conductor, you have to permanently mark the white conductor as a “hot” conductor, apparently electrical inspectors don’t count black electrical tape as “permanently marked” 😂😂 great video!
6/3 Romex is not properly rated for 60A breakers since the charger is classified as a continuous load. It has to be on #6 THHN. 6/3 Romex is only good for 55A, therefore, it maxes out at on a 50A breaker in regards to continuous load
To my understanding, breaker current (size) limits are determined to protect the wiring from excess loading. There are also numerous chapters and sections needed to be cross-referenced in the NEC to determine the "correct" pairing. Moreover, there are changes from version to version of the NEC. Perhaps you want to elaborate more to your point and cite some references that everyone reading the comments can benefit from. I too would love to learn something new. TIA.
@@TeslaTechChannel the purpose of a breaker is first and foremost to keep the current within the ampacity of the conductor. The ampacity of a conductor can be impacted by ambient temperature, voltage drop length, conduit fill, and terminal ratings. If you have 75C terminals on both sides of the run you can size the wire to the 75c column of 310.
@@TeslaTechChannel the load will be running for more than 3 hours so it's a continuous load. So you need 1.25*max load = 60. The breaker should be 60 and since both sides of the connection are 75C a 6-2 copper run would work. Permitting you don't have a temp, length, or conduit fill correction.
Feel free to leave and questions you might have. Also, I suggest looking through the comments as some people have posed some good questions, for things that I either didn't think to mention in the video or simply could not cover every variable for every possible scenario. Thanks for the feedback. I am hoping to have our Model Y Performance soon too. I had to reject the first one and the second one is now here a month later with issues that need to be sorted. Hopefully, I won't have to reject that too.
I appreciate your detailed answer on the wire size and ambient temp. I have a Gen 3 wall charger that will be 150 ft from my main load panel and the wire will be in the attic in Texas temperatures. I was planning on running 4/3 but with the ambient adjustment not sure that is even enough. Suggestions?
That is quite a long run. You will want to research the wire gauge and the conductor standard to use for your application. NM doesn't sound fit for your particular case.
Despite my particular NM-B and the HPWC and breaker all being rated higher, apparently regardless of mfg test rating, the NEC downrates all NM-B to 60C, in which case 55A is max.
BEST case scenerio - considering he has emoty/ready space in his "bus bars" ... un-fortunntly: some people's breaker boxes r FULL w/no space / not eniugh incoming amperage rated wires 2 accomodate a NEW 60 amp draw. MAJOR obsticle that situation. Older houses have limited grid supply wires ... "Aaaaaaaa. ."
Going with the 4-3 wire for mine with a 60 amp breaker. Going to try and run the wire in an insulated wall. I’m going to come out of the side of the panel, through a stud and over one stud bay and mount the charger. Wish me luck!
Everything was great except your math at 8:28. Will only get 32A on NEMA 14-50 using the mobile adapter. Therefore it is 7.8 hrs of charging vs 5.2hrs with wall connector.
Indeed, and good catch. Found that out after I made the video and have stated so in a few earlier comments when people have asked. I did the install July 2020 and my delivery happened in Sept 2020, so I didn’t have firsthand experience at that point, was just going off technical specs of the capability of a 14-50 @ 80%. Didn’t know the UMC controller board rate limited to 32 at the time. Thanks!
Informative video. Does the corded mobile connector charge at the same amps as the mobile connector with the 1450 plug? I saw somewhere else that it charges faster.
Thanks, and great question! The CMC can charge at up to the full 80% of the 240VAC 50Amp Circuit, which is 40 Amps. The UMC v2 (Mobile Connector) is limited to 32A by a regulator in the circuitry of the UMC's box. So technically speaking, the CMC does charge faster by 8 Amps. There is a charging chart at the end of the video you might want to check out which gives all the charging times based on charging rate. Let us know if you have any more questions about this, or feel free to suggest topics for future videos by replying to this comment. Hope that helps!
Great DYI thanks! at 7:51 you say something about "if you have the 50 watt hour pack..." how can I tell ? I have a model Y arriving next month and need to make decisions ASAP... thanks again!
Thanks for the comment and pardon the delay. 50 kWh packs were only part of the Std Range lineup for a very, very short time back in mid-2020 and were quickly taken out of production. If you are getting a new Model Y, chances are it is either being assembled in Fremont or Austin. The Fremont cars (to the best of my knowledge) have all been installed with the same tried-and-true 2170 cells (named 2170 for the 21mm X 70mm outer dimensions of each cell in the pack). Only recently have a handful of Model Y’s built in GigaTexas (a.k.a. Austin) been fitted with the new 4680 cells. In either case, the packs each approximate 80 kWh capacity.
Hi, electrical idiot here that just subscribed. Firstly, this was the best video I found on how I can install the wall connector at my home. Also showing the alternative methods and explaining the reasons behind really helps me understand better. I think I understood the video well and I'm ready to try it out but did have some questions outside of the video and wanted to make sure I had a clear understanding. 1. I'd assume most homes would have only have 1 main panel and no subpanels as shown at 6:27. I am not able to find other panels other than the one in my garage. I don't live in a castle and I'd assume the subpanel or the main panel would be hidden somewhere inaccessible or not visible. With that in mind, if I am installing the wall connector about 10~15' away from the panel, am I correct in thinking that I need the 4 gauge wires. However, if I am not able to find the 4 gauge as you have mentioned in the video, I'd assume I can use a 6 gauge and either sacrifice some amp or shorten the distance from the panel to the wall connector. I noticed the excel chart at the end the distance starts from 15' and doesn't show 10'. Is this an indication that I am not able to install the wall connector or the nema 14-50 adapter within 15' of the panel per NEC or other applicable codes? 2. Do you need to be a licensed electrician to perform the work? 3. Is there any application that would need to be filled out with the City or the County? Would I need to contact my HOA if it exists? - I assume this is more of a question for them, but wanted to see what you did or it was different for you. 4. What chapters/sections of the NEC do I need to refer to before getting to work? Much respect.
Hi Frank. Thanks for the comment/questions. Sorry for the delayed response, as I have been quite busy lately. 4/2 wire from a local electrical supply house should be readily available. You may have a difficult go of finding it at Home Depot, Lowes, etc. Make sure it is copper, not aluminum. The chart was merely shown to demonstrate different interval distances for the associated ratings. You certainly can install closer than 15’ away. Remember the cable feet, not the physical distance, is what the loss/resistance calculations are based on. Typically you do not need to be a licensed Electrician to perform the work. You can normally do what’s called “pulling a homeowner electrical permit” whereby your local authority will allow you to do your own work upon submitting plans (varies by local authority, check with them on the requirements), but still have it inspected and approved by the local electrical inspector when done. HOAs do not have oversight to getting electrical work done on your house, by your or a licensed Electrician. That is left up to the local authority /county inspector, etc. The NEC is an interesting code book with many different references for various scenarios. Often one code reference will cite another. Also, depending on which state / county you are in, you will need to check which version of the NEC code book is currently in force. My state for example is still on the 2017 version, while many others have adopted the 2020 version, which requires additional things for this install. Ask your local Electrical Inspector at the county. They are there to help you and to make sure it is done correctly. HTH
Either I am confused or missing something. You decided to keep the white wire as ground instead of neutral because is thicker. However instead of installing it to the ground bar (white wire) you installed it to the neutral bar. Am I missing something here? As far as I am concerned Neutral and Ground are not the same. Please help!
Thanks for the comment/question, Hector! You are correct on all points. Now let me explain.... The white wire (conventionally "neutral" in a 120v install) was used instead of the bare ground for 2 reasons: it was also 6 AWG conductor, rather than the bare ground wire which was 10 AWG; it was an insulated conductor. Since it is a plastic body and no box grounding for the housing, that was not needed. As for the load center bus bars, refer to 6:15 until 6:51 where I explain that since this install was for the only load center to the house, the NEUTRAL and GROUND bus bars are bonded together, effectively making no difference between neutral and ground, as they are bonded/tied together. If this were to a subpanel, then the NEUTRAL and GROUND bus bars would have been separated, with a neutral running back to the main load center, whereas the ground bus bar would have been grounded locally just outside that panel. In which case, as I explained in the video, I would not have used the white wire as the ground. Hope that cleared things up. Following convention to the letter, using the bare 10AWG ground terminated to the ground bus bar would have been the technically "correct" thing to do. The end result is the same: you have (2) 120VAC hot legs running to a tandem 60A breaker and a sufficient ground of sufficient gauge terminated to the ground of the house.
To bad you didn't have an Electrician correct your work. For maximum power the Tesla installation manual specifies to use as a MINIMUM "6 AWG, 90° C-rated copper wire" which in your table at the 5:00 mark is rated for 75 amps, not the 55 amp wire you used. Did you forget the 80% downgrade required for continuous load circuits? It is also too bad you didn't show using some GREEN TAPE, which I'm sure Home Depot carries, to mark both ends of your WHITE wire so the next person will know you are using it as ground. The next owner might convert your main panel into a sub-panel. How will they know your WHITE wire is not a neutral?
I was going to use the white as a ground also but my neighbor who is an AC installer said not to and to just use the bare ground wire as that is how the wires are designed and like you said someone may get confused to the white wire so I did it his way even through I would have done it like you did had he not talked me out of it.
The wire is actually THHN or if Trenched in ground it should be THWN so #6 wire is rated at 65 for thwn and 75 for thhn 5:05 in video certified sparky here
I have a sub panel and I’ll leave the white on the common bar and also run the ground to the ground bar. The red and black to the breaker. Or should I cap the white and simple run the red and black with the ground wire?
If you are on a sub panel please go and get 4/2 wire, don’t do 6/3. You don’t need a neutral for installing the HPWC, just the two hot legs for the 240v and the bare ground (or green).
Follow the simple instructions on connecting you mobile to your Wall Connector wifi SSID, then use the URL they give you in the instructions to go to the device’s webpage to set the rest of the settings up, join your home wifi network, set the circuit breaker rating, etc.
This video is very is very helpful for installing the Tesla Gen 3 wall connector. I do have a question for you though... my electrician used a 60 amp breaker and installed the connector just like your video instruction. However, I’m receiving the 3 flashing red lights which indicate it’s running hot. Have you seen this issue or no how to problem solve this? Based on this being installed correctly I’m thinking it might just be a defected connector. Thoughts? Thanks so much!!
Uh oh! Not good. There is an ampacity vs cable foot chart at the last few seconds of the video. Check it out. On your wall connector, does it go to 3 reds only after a few hours of charging or right away? If after a couple/few hours of 48Amp charging, then it is most certain too small of wire for your particular run length (cable-feet) and is creating too much resistance and thus heat. You can test this theory/troublesoot in one of 2 ways: -- reprovisioning your Wall Connector in the SETUP stage from "60 AMP Breaker" down to "50 AMP Breaker", thus ensuring it only allows the vehicle to draw 40 amps at 240v instead of 48 amps (remember: charge rate = @80% of breaker amp rating). If your cable run is REALLY long, you may want to reduce it down even further to "40 AMP Breaker", which will draw 32 amps. - The other, and easier, way you can temporarily test this theory is to just lower your charging rate on the Tesla charging screen down from 48 to either 40 or 32 and see if it corrects the issue. If it does, it is a cable gauge problem and you need thicker wiring for your particular run. If it goes into 3 reds immediately, It could either of the following 3 things, or a combination of them: 1) If you have a long cable run, rather than the short one I did, you likely need thicker wire than 6 AWG, such as 4 AWG or 2 AWG (lower number=thicker conductor) to carry the load. Remember that copper cable has resistance and the longer the cable-feet from your electrical breaker panel (aka load center) to the Wall Connector, the thicker wire you need to carry the same load.; 2) Check the terminal posts for proper connection and torque. Improper connection surface (wire touching the terminals) or improper torque can cause some anomalous things like that to occur, such as being too loose or too tight creating a less-than-optimal connection from wire to terminal block.; 3) Perhaps the Wall Connector is indeed defective.
morning!... TESLA recommends a #6AWG wire-90 degrees-75amps, ROMEX #6 Is rated for 55amps, 60 degrees, so i think we should use a #3 romex to MATCH the minimum requirements of the 75amps of the #6 awg 90 degrees.... idk..... i got confused too, i'm buying a DIESEL CAR instead!
Where people are going wrong on this is the temperature rating of the wire. Romex is generally rated as NM-B which is rated at 55 deg C. To use #6 on a continuous load you need 90 deg C wire such as THH. Also, it has been pointed out in other clips that the individual wires in some NM-B cables are rated at 90 deg, but when wrapped in sheathing the bundle is rated at 55 and does not meet NEC. I am running No 6 THH in conduit to meet the NEC.
The wire is supposed to be rated for 60 amps. Charger is 48 amps, but NEC says for a continuous load you must rate the circuit at 125%, hence the 60 amps. So your install is not correct you should have run 6-2 or 6-3 mc cable, which will give you the full 60 amp rating. Just an FYI. Also a good licensed electrician will check the connections at your mains breaker and the connections in the meter pan to make sure nothing is loose and potentially cause a fire down the road, always a good idea to hire a professional!!!
Depending on the install conditions, MC cable may be appropriate. The video would take forever if it dove into every cable type in every residential scenario. In my case Romex was fine, as I was going 1 joist over with under 10 cable-feet. As for the 6/3: yes I could have/should have gone with 6/2, but it wasn't readily available that day. Secondly, my use of the neutral white, should have shown me wrapping green electrical tape on both ends to mark the wire as repurposed as Ground. Alternatively, I could have used the bare 10 AWG ground, as designed and simply not used the neutral. #6 Romex at 60c is rated for 55 VAC. According to NEC 240.4 (B)(2), where no equally rated breaker exist to match the conductor rating (55A) you can go up to the next one (60A). As stated in the video, if the run were longer I would recommend going with a higher rated conductor like 4 AWG, due to the increased resistance inherent in additional cable-feet, or alternatively THHN in conduit if the run wasn't staying in-wall. As a broad-stroke axiom, It is always a good idea to hire your work to a professional specialist in anything in life, iIF you don't know what you are doing and have sufficient means. Alternatively, some folks choose to take it on themselves. While I am happy to have so many professional electricians watch and opine on the video, this video was certainly catered to a non-Electrician DIY homeowner audience, whom had possibly run a circuit or two before. Unfortunately, it has become commonplace to hear stories of some electricians trying to cash in on the EV gold-rush by charging 2-3x what it should be to run a 240V/60A hardwire, just because the customer said the keyword "Tesla". So who can really blame those homeowners who are technically/electrically inclined to give it a go? Thanks for watching & for the comment, Robert.
@@TeslaTechChannel I totally get saving a buck here and there, I ran my own Tesla charger and saved a lot of money. Granted I’m an electrician and did the job with permits, it was still nice to not have to pay the premium. I just wanted to clear up the misconception of people using 6awg romex for chargers, when technically it’s not allowed. Will it be a problem, more then likely not… but still not allowed (per NEC). I just did a service call that another licensed electrician ran a charger in the wrong size wire, luckily it was caught in time.
Great Video! How would you wire/connect a second Gen 3 Wall Charger and utilize the Power Sharing capability enabled through WiFi??? This approach utilizes your first Gen 3 as the "Leader" unit and the second Gen 3 as the "Follower" unit.
Great question. I frankly, don’t know the answer. When I installed this last year the sharing wasn’t functional at that time. Since I only have one charger, I haven’t had the need to research it.
Great video! Is there any reason why you can't use 2 conductor wire instead of 3? I realize you preferred the thicker gauge for your ground, but could you have used 6/2 for your job instead of 6/3? Thanks!
Thanks! You certainly can use 6/2. Ideally, if I could have found 4/2 when I did the install I would have used that. Unfortunately, I haven't found anyone to make a 4/2 Romex, and wasn't interested in making conduit unnecessarily and pulling 4AWG or 6AWG THHN. 6/2 would have been the next best option, but wasn't readily available at HD or Lowes on the weekend I decided to do this install. Since the run was in-wall and didn't require wet-rated or other cable spec or conduit creation, and couldn't do aluminium since the terminal lugs on the HPWC aren't rated for that, only copper, so I opted to go with readily available 6/3 copper Romex. But by all means, if you can find and run 4/2, great. Otherwise 6/2 is your next best option.
@@TeslaTechChannel #6 romex is simply not rated for this install in any circumstance. It really makes my blood boil that you present this install "ok" when it is not. EV charging is a CONTINUOUS USE load which means your 48A charger MUST have circuit wiring at NO LESS than 60A. As you acknowledge in your video #6 romex is only rated 55A. So you are publicly endorsing a non-compliant install.
@@lfantasy5040 Personaly, I would use flexible metal conduit with 2 x #6 THHN + #10 ground in this situation. That assembly is rated @ 65A. If romex is to be used it should be #4, but you won't find 4/2 romex anywhere and 4/3 is a pain in the butt to install and expensive.
I have a question about Daisy chaining. I am planning to add an additional GEN three wall connector. Is it necessary to hardwire the communication or can they communicate wirelessly?
So many posts and videos I've given myself a headache going over my electricians work. He ran Romex 6/2 to the charger with a 60 amp breaker. I charge at 48 amps. I think the consensus is you have to use #6 THHN not Romex if you want to run at 48 amps and if not you need to limit yourself to a 50 amp breaker because there is no breaker or setting for 55amps(44 at the car). Currently I've just bumped it down to 44amps until I decide if I want to rewire it with THHN. Do you really think Romex is safe? If not you should probably revise this video I see so many posts online with people running Romex or electricians installing Romex 6 for Tesla chargers.
I noticed you mentioned installing the NEMA outlet on a GFCI breaker? I’ve read a lot of forum posts about breakers tripping constantly since the UMC has a built in GFCI, have you heard of this?
I am assuming you are talking about wiring a 14-50 plug for use with a UMC + 14-50 plug adapter option. This video didn't dive into that option. If you are in the US, each state has their own adoption of the NEC version. Some are on 2017 while others are on 2020. any 14-50 plug would have to follow your state and local code requirements.
Good video. I would not recommend using those coarse drywall screws for this install at 2:44 . Find a stud and use plain wood screws, or worst comes to worst, use toggle bolts or butterfly anchors directly into the drywall. Great video otherwise.
Thanks for the comment. I know that what you are suggesting is the conventional way of doing things. However, I personally am not a fan of the weaker bite provided by conventional wood screws. I would much rather pre-drill pilot holes and have the coarser threads provide greater surface area, thus providing additional (bite) fastening strength. Since my particular install was to a hardwood backer-board your suggestion of toggle-bolts or butterfly anchors doesn't really fit the scenario. But, that said, I would not recommend installing this heavy of a device (given cable weight, draping over the unit whist unplugged from the vehicle) or with the possibility of the cable being errantly pulled acting as force-multiplied leverage on unbacked drywall under any circumstances due to the shearing danger of putting such a heavy, repetitive-use, and especially high-current device secured only to a piece of sheetrock without a stud or backer board. Just too flimsy a mounting solution.
Thanks for the question, Justin. Being 5 months ago, I don't recall where I grabbed that portion from. According to the NEC, there are correction factors to account for ambient max temps and cable feet. In looking into it more in depth and going through it, you will be good to run 4AWG from 45 feet away. With that distance you will only have a voltage drop of 1.3 VAC. Hope that helps. (source: www.electrician2.com/calculators/vd_calculator_initial.html)
Geeking out alert - followed by a TL/DR version NEC table 310.15(B)(16) lists ampacities for various gauges of wire. You will note it’s split among copper and aluminum wire and each has 3 columns for different temperatures. Romex is limited to no more than the 60 degree column as mentioned in the video (see NEC 334.80). However, if you use MC or metal clad (armored) cable, you’re working with the 90 degree column. However, NEC 110.14(C)(1) forces you to consider the rating of the terminals of both the circuit breaker and equipment when deciding which temperature column to use. Typically, terminals are rated (and marked) for 75 degrees. TLDR- use 6/2 MC cable. The chart (310.15(B)(16) lists different ampacities for various wire. Length isn’t charted.
Anyone know if there is an adapter to make the wall charger we already have for our Leaf work with the Tesla? I don't want to pay for another EV charger installation if I don't have to.
This was an amazing explanation. You’re like Bob Villa and Bill Nye the science guy put together
Thank you very much for your kind assertion! Never thought about it that way before, but I can see where the juxtaposition of functional tradesman meets scientific theory in practice is very applicable. Glad you enjoyed it!
Yeah was like hypnotizing wth did I just watch
We’ll done review, deep knowledge, quality electrical information, really really good explanation and review
Exactly right! Thorough and efficient.
WRONG...IT WAS A Terrible USELESS VIDEO
I rarely if every comment on videos, but this was the absolute best explanation on wiring the Tesla connector as well as explaining the generals between ground bars, neutral and the legs of power. Thank you.
Glad you liked it! Let us know if you have any questions on it or any other topics you would like to see covered in new videos.
For those watching today - you cannot use 6 gauge 6/3 NMB Romex with a 60A breaker - THIS IS NOT TO CODE. However, 6/3 NMB Romex with a 50A breaker = to code (just set the Tesla V3 wall charger to 40A charging when commissioning and that is a safe setup that meets code).
Unfortunately for me, 7 months ago I watched this video, ran out and bought a long (75ft) run of 6/3 NMB Romex and a 60A breaker thinking I could use the Tesla V3 Wall Charger's full 48A capability and learned AFTER my install that this combination was NOT to code. All was not lost - after learning this, I swapped the 60A breaker for a 50A breaker and set the V3 Tesla wall charger to 40A charge rate which is safe, to code and works really well. If you want to get the V3 Wall Charger's max charge rate (48A), you will need a 60A breaker - paired with conduit and THHN 6 gauge or MC 6 gauge or 4 gauge Romex.
This is a GREAT video and it helped me a LOT but the suggested use of 6/3 Romex and a 60A breaker is not to code unfortunately. I found this out after I purchased the materials and ran the cable.
This is so correct. I almost bought 6/3 nm wire and swapped for THHN 6 gauge for conductors and a 10 gauge for ground. It’s cheaper + I don’t have to run that neutral wire. This is good because it saves room in the 3/4 in conduit. I believe code is no more that 53% of space can be filed by wire. I also believe the THHN wire can handle 75 amps @ 90 degrees
Yes. Also, 6/2 MC is rated for 75A at 90deg. Metal clad sheds heat better and thus rates a higher ampacity than NM.
If elected, I will pass a law that ALL instruction videos be like this one.
Great job! Thanks for posting.
Thanks for the kind words! Glad it was helpful.
Wow, this is far and away the BEST video I've seen on this topic. I've seen much longer videos that ramble on and on without saying much. This one is spot on: concise and well-organized, with all the info we need. Thanks!
Thank you for the compliment, Ron. That was precisely why I made it that way: give the most usable information in the shortest possible time. I’m glad you found it valuable!
I HAVE NO DAMN IDEA WHAT HE WAS TALKING ABOUT MOST OF THE VIDEO
BUT THE FACT THAT I AM GOING TO PURCHASE A TESLA AND GET A TESLA CHARGER AS WELL MADE ME LEARN ALOT
CAN WE GIVE THIS MAN A HELL YEAHHH!!!!
Thanks for watching. Hope you got something useful from it!
I had a short run, only 12 foot, I ran the individual 4 AWG wires, Red, Black, Green in 1" non-metallic conduit, did not have to wrestle with the wire, more relaxed. Since the Gen 3 already comes with a 24' lead the length was sufficient for both our cars. Great video.
I wish more people see this! This was well explained.
After hours and dozens of vids looking for info that I need, this was the most informative. Thanks.
Thanks for the comment! Glad you found it useful.
Since this video was uploaded, 3 key takeaways to heed have emerged: 1) #6 Wire in conduit is allowed for 60A installs, but NM-B is down-rated to 60C category (despite mine was rated for 75C at the time), which puts it at 55A rating, so either choose a different #6 wire + conduit or use #4 wire.; 2) There was never a reason for my having used 6/3 at the time other than availability (lack of 6/2 the day I decided to do the install, I didn’t need the white common for anything in the circuit) ; 6/2 (or 4/2, depending on your situation) is the way to go); 3:). Using the White wire as a ground and then tagging it with Green electrical tape to signify its use as Ground has proven to be unnecessary and debate for far too much confusion than it has been worth. Just use the bare copper that the 6/2 (or 4/2) comes with, or in a conduit run with separate conductor pulls, use the green cladding, as is standard, to avoid any confusion. The two most often issues people have run into have been not being mindful of the length of wire required from their load center/breaker panel to the HPWC and that the longer the run, the more resistance, and therefore more robust wiring required, and spend the money on a proper torque wrench for securing the wires down to the terminal block on the HPWC end and the other end to the breaker lugs on the other end, to the proper spec in-lbs. Enjoy many years of great service. Mine is still working flawlessly 2.5 years later. Cheers.
@@TeslaTechChannel Thanks for this again. I'm planning on wiring the charger from my electrical panel, which is outside my garage, through to the direct opposite side of the wall. So i'll just be using Romex 6/2. Not sure if i'll be needing conduit as the wiring will be in between the wall and I believe conduit is not needed (locally at least). Would you suggest running conduit anyways? Since it will be a 60A install but ofc not using 60A as the Tesla will only be drawing a maximum of 48A.
If you're using ROMEX you HAVE to get a size larger to account for the thermal increase from the extra insulation of the wire jacketing. You should change out your wiring to ROMEX 4g or THHN 6ga for a 60amp circuit. Overloading the ampacity could cause a fire.
Truth is, 1.5 years later my install still works perfectly....and I have tested it in the peak heat of the summer under sustained 48A load and checked all parts from end to end with my FLIR camera and it isn't even coming close to 60C. NOW, putting on my 1-size-fits-all hat for safety since I cannot account for all factors involved, much like the NEC has to account for, then absolutely -- 4/2 all the way! That, correcting the UMC firmware limit of 32A load, and the not showing phase taping green of the repurposed neutral as ground (or just using the conventional bare copper instead) have been the two biggest corrections I would make if I had to redo this video again. I have been fortunate to get some great feedback from the video, yours included, over the last 1.5 years on the video. Thanks for watching and taking the time to comment!
Not really because tesla regulates it so it doesn't go passed 48 Amps
@@orestracki6617 and number 6 romex is only rated for 55 amps not 60 hence the reason he needs to upsize his wire to be code compliant. You have to rate the wire and breaker at 125% of the 48 amps which is why you have to use a bigger wire or run it in pipe and use thhn .
@@orestracki6617 You never wire a house based on a specific load device. 100 years from now, someone could install something else on that circuit and cause a fire since the wire could melt before it trips the breaker.
@@orestracki6617 What Tesla says and does, does not supersede NEC's requirements. When the wire is only rated at 55 amps and the breaker is 60 amps, the wire becomes the fuse. An inspector will fail it.
This answered all of my questions. Thank you. Every other video shows it already installed leaving you with why or how, and still no answers
I too RARELY comment on videos but dude! VERY well done!!! Wife and I are going to test drive a model Y this weekend. Never had electric car before.
Hey Steve, thanks for the very kind comment!! Neither had I until my Model Y. Word of warning in advance: the instant acceleration/torque, it should almost be called "thrust", is VERY addicting and feels like a tubular roller coaster or a smaller engined private jet taking off; because of the low center of gravity it handles very well, not quite Porsche well, but well nonetheless; the electricity cost in most parts of the US are much cheaper than gas (costs me roughly $8 to "fill-up" compared to low $30s for my other cars. You rarely need to use (and therefore replace) brakes if you select to use full regen capabilities to take advantage of one-pedal driving (which only takes about a week to get used to, and then you will wonder why all cars don't have this). The Tesla-branded Brembo brakes on the Performance stop on a dime and give you back a nickel should you need to use them during more spirited driving. It has also been an unanticipated relief to have a nearly "full tank" every morning. I say nearly because you shouldn't charge Li-Ion batteries over 90% for battery-pack longevity/health unless you are going to immediately drive the vehicle or going on a long trip in a few hours/next morning and need the added range to get to the next charger. Superchargers are $0.25 a kW but charge your car at 7x-10x faster than even the 48A home charger. Takes only 30 mins to "fill-up" and the car has some decent games to play or you can watch Netflix, Hulu, or UA-cam while waiting. I thought it would suck to wait for supercharging, but it doesn't seem as long as it sounds. For my other gas-powered vehicles sometimes I am waiting in a line at Costco or Sams for 10 minutes to get to the pump and another 5 to fill, so it really isn't as bad as I expected. Of course just plugging it in at home is the most convenient of all. Also, sometimes I use the J1772 adapter the car came with and get free "gas" while at a shopping center or restaurant on those Volta chargers that have TV ads running on them, abeit it charges at a slower 7kW (32Amp/208v) vs the 11.5kW you get from the Tesla HPWC v3 at home (48A/240v), but its free and you are there anyways.
I have been following Tesla since they had the original roadster (Lotus Elise conversion) and announced Model S. I test drove the first year Model S (P75D, I think) and was amazed, but couldn't reconcile the $120k price tag back then. Now that Teslas have stood the test of time and I know they are not going under, and now that one can be purchased in the 50s and 60s (and even less for a Model 3) . When the Model 3 came out I was interested, but at a husky 6'5" it was still too tight for me to get in and out of daily. Once the Model Y launch happened and I finally sat in one of the first ones off the assembly line, to me it was a no brainer at that point and finally came time to make it happen. I sold my Stage 1 Cobb-tuned Subi WRX and my Stage 1 Porsche Macan GTS earlier this summer and bought this in their place. After my initially having to reject 2 early Y's with defects, 3rd time was a charm and now after just over a month of ownership, I don't regret it one bit. Yeah, it's all that and a bag of chips...and in full disclosure, I don't think of myself as a save-the-planet eco-activist Tesla fanboi type. Sure if I can reduce pollution along the way, great. I just appreciate innovative engineering, quality craftsmanship (the paintjobs all suck BTW. Blue and Black seem to be the least problematic. Hence why I rejected the first 2 orders that were white, and ended up going with blue). No more oil changes, transmission issues, ignition tune-ups, valve jobs. I digress,
I friggin' love it so far!! I know you will too. Enjoy the flight ....err, drive. Comment back and lemmie know what you think. Also, if there are other video topics you would like to see, leave a suggestion for a new video and I'll see what I can do to accommodate. Thanks again!
@@TeslaTechChannel Well buddy...The wife and I LOVED the model Y and ordered one when we got home last Saturday!! I have a 2016 Challenger 392 scat pack shaker that I have had for about a year and a half. It was the fastest car off the line I ever drove......until Saturday! hahaha WOW That model Y was absolutely AMAZING. What was even more amazing is the trade in that Tesla gave me for that car! I have always heard that they are crazy cheap on trades so I wasn't even going to get rid of the Dodge. With what they offered me PLUS adding the savings in sales tax it was a no brainer. It was only 1500K less than what I paid for the car 1 year and a half ago. BTW I am 6-1 350lbs so I wasn't expecting a comfortable ride and ease of getting in and out....I was WRONG. Its no different than getting in my F150! The wife and I are making a youtube journey series from "Well we are going to drive a Tesla but we are not sure if we will even like it" to the first drive on the way home however long that may be. I cant think of ever being this pumped about getting a new car EVER! We got the Long range with FSD since I got the deal on the dodge. I will send you an informal link from another youtube account ( unedited just to send to friends on our test drive) My wife was PETRIFIED on the FSD! HAHAHA
@@TeslaTechChannel ua-cam.com/video/UQyiCKDFpGU/v-deo.html
@@TeslaTechChannel ua-cam.com/video/2cRC9O7NNGg/v-deo.html
Thanks for the follow-up, Steve! I enjoyed watching your and Angie's first drive. I am in the same boat as you being a big guy at 6'5" 320 and I too was amazed at how well I fit. Extra truck: Tundra instead of an F150, but same idea.
You can't really blame Angie for being reluctant about autopilot. I too, despite being prepared for using it, still having to learn to trust it happens in increments.
I did the Performance, but without the FSD. I thought about getting it, but at $8000 when I ordered it, now $10,000, I didn't see the value for the way I normally like to drive.
I hope you used someones Tesla referral code (mine (ts.la/jon30517) or a friend or family member) when you ordered so you, and whomever's code you used, both get 1000 miles of supercharging credited to your Tesla account. If not, call Tesla and they should be able to add it to your order. Congrats on the great deal! I'm looking forward to seeing your future vids.
Best Installation video. Precise and to the point.
Glad it helped
Yep, this video covered a lot of material that other videos failed to mention. My Tesla Sales Advisor stated the WC could support 80 amps. I now know that he was referring to the Ver 2 WC. And I liked your explanation of using the white wire on ground bus bar.
I'm probably going to get some 6/3 romex. I was thinking of getting 3/2 but the wires are white and black, which would have made the install confusing to an electrician in the future and potentially unsafe. 6/3 also allows me the freedom of removing my WC and adding a 14-50 plug in the future if I move and take my WC with me. And there is plenty of space inside the WC to coil up the extra unused white wire.
You can do the 6/3 if it is a short run. If it is long I would suggest 4/3. Thanks for the compliment!
@@TeslaTechChannel I reread my comment and I meant to say I was thinking of using 6/2 wire and just using the white wire as a powered second leg. But I'll use the 6/3 and just tuck in the white wire in the box. The potential safety risk isn't worth the minor savings on the wire. My total run is 25 feet of wire.
Romex 6/3? What’s the max amp?
@@familyyyle7643 48 amps at 240 volts
I know this is late (2 years), but 6 AWG romex is only rated at 55 amps @60C, and therefore should not be used on a 60 amp breaker. Tesla specifies 90C rated wire. Save your self the risk and use MC cable, 6/2 MC is rated for 75 amps @90C because the individual conductors are THHN.
This is a great video!
there is some miss information at 4:57 in regards to Allowable Ampacities of Insulated Conductors. In the NEC 310.16 for 6 AWG Wire there are three columns. 55 amps for the 60° column 65 A for the 75° and 75 A for the 90° column. So the actual wire itself is capable of handling 75 Amps. The problem lies within what degree rating the equipment That is feeding the wire is rated at. The breaker in this instance which is rated at 75° determines what column to use. So in this scenario # 6 AWG is good for 65 A. If all the equipment including the wire was rated at 90° that would change the game. Not all parts are created equal..;-)
6 gauge Romex is rated at 55 amps. It is not the same rating as 6 gauge thhn which is rated at 65 amps.
Just did a WC install today. Used 25' of TTHN #4 and TTHN #8 ground (90c rated). Cost difference between #6 and #4 was .25 per foot. Not worth the $25 to have an upgrade path and lower fire risk; plus the #4 can be retrofitted w/ a sub-panel at some point and two wall connectors can be used at 30-38a each. The #4 90c rated wire can handle up to 95a; or 76a on a continuous load like EV charging.
You gave me "Home Improvement" vibes. Specifically, The neighbor Mr. Wilson lol. Great video btw
Hahaha. Thanks!
Easily the best video describing in detail what needs to be done. Thanks!
Thanks for the comment. You are quite welcome, Brian!
@@TeslaTechChannel I am currently setting up to wire and using #6/2 w/ground because I have. Do you think this is ok with leaving the ground bare on on the bus bar?
@@briansteege5303 Absolutely! The Wall Connector only requires 2 hots and a ground. The only reason I did 6/3 was because I couldn't readily find 4/2, 4/3 or 6/2. Because I had the extra 6AWG white wire left over unused, and because white normally = neutral AND neutrals and grounds are tied together in the main load center, there was no risk in using the tihicker 6AWG white wire for the ground instead of the bare 10 AWG. Ideally, you would want to use 4/2 (+ bare ground) for the install. I have looked for 4/2 from both Cerrowire and Southwire. Neither of them manufacture it. I would to either have to buy 4/3 online or buy a 100 foot spool of it locally, which was cost prohibitive. Because of the short run and ambient temps where I live + the fact that the NEC allows for 100% of sustained load when using current-regulated devices (both the Wall COnnector and the Tesla's Charging module regulate 48A charging) so therefore the 55 amp rating of 6AWG NM-B meets that requirement. That said, if your run is long (mine was only 10 cable feet) and/or you live in a hot climate, use the 4 AWG instead. But otherwise, YES you will be fine with 6/2 wire. Just remember that the bare ground on 6/2 is only 10 AWG and therefore will fit differently in the Wall Connector's terminal blocks. Best of luck!
Do you think a 50 AMP Breaker could work temporarily?
@@briansteege5303 I assume you are saying that, based on still using the 6/2 wire. That said, only if you also provision the Wall Connector as being connected to a 50A breaker, which will provide max 40A charging. That would be ok. Frankly, there is nothing wrong with choosing to install it that way permanently either. It will just take a little longer to charge. Some people need to do that because of not having sufficient power to their load center to handle the combined load in the rest of the circuits in the house PLUS the additional 48A constant load , and have to throttle it back to stay within the capabilities of the service feeder to their house..
What I would NOT do is to provision the WC as 60A in an attempt to hack charging at 48A and connect it to a 50A breaker. It would be unsafe, and could possibly ruin your WC, and would most likely trip the breaker upon trying to charge at 48A anyways.
I just found your video to install my Tesla charger.. very good explanation of ground wire & neutral wire on seperate sub panel. Thank you!!
Best video for electric knowledge
Thank you. Followed all your steps and I was able to install my wall connector successfully first attempt.
Glad it helped
Very clear video - concise and most understandable, especially for the person trying to understand the charging options, and benefits of each. I'm in research mode for possible Model 3 purchase, and this is very helpful. I agree with your choice to go with the Gen 3 wall connector - for $165 more, get the better solution.
Thanks. I’m glad it was of value to you.
before you buy do research how much will battery change cost you.
Great job I learn a lot from your video thank you
You are welcome! If you want to see any specific topics covered in a future video let us know.
I love how you showed absolutely everything from load charts to how to wire the panel up... But not actually how you connected the charger itself.
I suppose you are right. I assumed people attempting this would know at least basic things such as screwing down terminals to wires. I can see how it would have been more thorough, but the video is already quite long as it is. That is why I focused on the less obvious things. Thanks for the comment!
Excellent video with references to best practices and code standards as well as electrical theory. Thank you. 👍
Glad it was helpful!
your rational for using 6-2 on a 60 is interesting. I am not judging or criticizing. I just find it interesting how we all make our decisions. I have been doing elec for 40 years. And my justification is this. 55 amp breaker is not considered standard in the NEC hence you can go to the next standard which is 60. Hope i am not wrong. Otherwise I have been wrong for a hella long time. Anyway great video.
Very true, and sure you normally just go off the ampacity chart, so you certainly aren’t wrong. Even if you were, it wouldn’t be my place to judge. I was merely trying to provide some additional rationale and spark some thinking from the viewer behind the process and basic understanding of the modifying variables which can mitigate the standard ampacity chart. In hindsight, a year on, I would redo this video to using 4/2 and conventional copper ground rather than phasing the neutral as ground to have avoided people getting confused behind dogmatic conventions, rather than offer some understanding of electricity. Would have saved TONS of questions. I suppose,however, that it is also a good sign that people are asking questions, rather than going off half-cocked. Thankful I didn’t decide to demonstrate doing a THHN run.. People would be asking me how to do saddle bends :)
@@TeslaTechChannel being that I am going to be 72 and have 2 metal hips I try to avoid saddle bends now. unless its 1/2". And installing 4-2 in that charger. makes me tired just thinking about it. :)
Thank you for sharing your experience- it helped with my install!
Glad it helped!! Congrats.
Great video with clear explanations!!
Glad you enjoyed it!
This is the best wall charger installation video I’ve seen. Thank you for this! -Trav (2021 Model S ordered) :)
You are quite welcome! Glad you found it helpful.
Great job, thank you! I especially liked the color-coded wiring diagram at 6:22 that shows how to properly ground and / or bond a main and / or secondary panel. I did a screen grab of that and saved it - very helpful!
Glad you enjoyed it!
I did my install like this but I installed the wire and breaker in the panel last instead of first like you did. I didn't bother shutting off the main breaker either, really no need to just make sure the 60 amp breaker is off, push it on the buss bars and turn on the breaker as the very last step of the install. Not saying your way is wrong but just seems like its better to do the other end before installing the breaker or messing with the panel in anyway since its not needed until everything else is installed properly anyway.
I bought my Tesla wall charger off of a guy on CL for $375 brand new in the box. I stumbled onto the add looking for something else, just got lucky.
Also got a Tesla M3 indoor car cover for an extra $125 from him I didn't even know existed until I got there to look at the wall charger, walked out with both for $450.
As I'm sure you've heard by now, that cheap, plastic 14-50 you showed near the end of the video is a well-known fire starter. A real 14-50 costs nearly 10 times as much but is much less likely to burn down the house. I, personally, will limit the amperage in the app. No point in maxing out the heat load in my house wiring.
Agreed. Since wiring a NEMA 14-50 was not the subject of the video, and therefore not as important to go into depth on, it has been left in there. However, you are correct. If someone opts to wire-up a 14-50 they should get the commercial series 14-50p from Hubbell meant to handle such a duty-cycle.
Thanks for noticing and for your comment!
Game changer! Thank you for taking the time break this down, so we can make an informed decision.
7:55 According to the Tesla Gen3 Connector manual, you should not put it on a GFCI circuit because it already has one that checks for ground and retries 4 times on fault after 10 seconds.
Correct. I said as much. My comment at 7:55 was for if you have an SR+, which can’t handle more than 32A charging, to forego the HPWC and just install a 14-50 on a GFCI and buy the adapter for the UMC instead. The GFCI was not suggested for theHPWC. In fact, if you go back and watch 1:22 thru 1:47, I articulate about the exact matter you mention. Thanks for watching!
PERFECT PERFECT PERFECT consolidation of all necessary knowledge for this in one place. Thanks so much !!!
Great video !! Clear concise explanation and reasonings behind each choices
Caution on the standard 14-50R, do not cheap on the HD one and make sure to get an “Industrial” 14-50 such as the one from Hubbell as Tesla recommends.
Agreed 100% - I didn't go over that, as this video was specifically for the HPWC v3 and not a 14-50 plug. But I completely concur on the selection of a commercial higher duty-cycle 14-50R, not the cheapie at HD.
The NM sheathed cable conductors are only rated for 55 amps. NEC article 625 requires 125% of the rated load of the charger which is 48 amps so 48 x 125% is 60 amps. So right out of the gate you're looking at conductors that will be overloaded and certainly don't meed the NEC requirements. The EVC is a continuous load, thus the reason for the 125% increase.
Its cool that many people have the main panel in the garage. Ours is in the basement and will need to run 90 feet to the garage. Ugghh
Hi Vivek, Many SF houses built within the last 20 years have the load center like you in the basement. I would suggest considering running a 100-watt subpanel into your garage, and then running the 60Amp circuit from that subpanel to the Wall Connector. The pros for doing that are that you will still have other breaker slots and available remaining power to run circuits later for things like a welder, air compressor, etc. If you are not into professional tools which pull a lot of watts, those additional available amps could instead be used for additional outlets on dedicated circuits for things like a refrigerator or freezer, a workbench powerstrip, or a myriad of other power-consuming devices. Considering the normal garage is now constructed with a single, or even worse shared, GFCI circuit leaving you very little available power for other things in your garage. If none of those reasons, strike your fancy, you can always just have expansion room for future circuits which may become desirable later. Another benefit is the shorter run for the Wall Connector from the subpanel, which means you can run the thinner 6 or 4 gauge wire, vs thicker for longer runs homeran to the basement main load center. Finally, having the subpanel close to the HPWC, you can be safer knowing that you could always use the 60A breaker as an emergency disconnect switch. Also, something else to think about is that, depending on the state you live in, if its has adopted NEC version 2020, you may be required to have a physical disconnect switch near the wall connector within X number of cable-feet to meet code requirements.
HTH
@@TeslaTechChannel wow, that is very insightful and thank you so much. I live in suburban Chicago. First think I am going to do is to get a guy who can speak this language. I wish you worked in IL. Lol. Thank you once again.
@@TeslaTechChannel Thank you so much once again. This in depth note is very helpful.
Tesla Tech, thank you for the detailed responses and excellent video. My electrician is planning to install a 100 amp subpanel just behind the wall of main panel. To create the 60 amp circuit that you described in your response, is a 60 amp breaker mandatory in the subpanel or can a 100 amp breaker be added instead for Tesla wall connector? Electrician said he will be adding a 100 amp subpanel and not a 100 watt subpanel that you mentioned in your response. What is the difference? (Website states Amps multiplied by Volts equals Watts.) Thank you.
I agree that a GFCI is not needed for permanent installations- the code as I read it is only for RECEPTACLES:
625.54 Ground-Fault Circuit-Interrupter Protection for Personnel. All single-phase
receptacles installed for the connection of electric vehicle charging that are rated 150 volts to ground or less, and 50 amperes or less shall have ground-fault circuit-interrupter protection for personnel.
Best video, straight to the point .
So well done! There are too many “instructional videos” out there that don’t explain adequately the project one is attempting but this was excellent. This is my first time ever commenting on a UA-cam video. Make more videos, please.
The Internet desperately needs more quality content like yours to be promoted over all the garbage people post.
Thank you for your kind words. I’m glad you found it useful.
This is the most ridiculously helpful video on the Tesla wall charger on UA-cam. Unreal, how good this video is.
How far can the main panel be from the wall charger?
Thanks for the compliment. Glad you found it helpful! I tried to add the most usable value in the shortest video possible.
As for your question: there is not really a limit to length for the distance you can do, per se. It is more of a question of, what gauge wiring do you need to use to accomodate 60 amps of current at X number of cable feet. That said, you would just have to up the thickness of the wiring gauge (thicker = lower number) to account for additional resistance per foot of wire, which translates to heat. There is a wiring thickness chart at 10:17 in the video that shows you what gauge it should be based on how many feet in the run. To run the 60Amp breaker service, just follow the rightmost column. HTH.
@@TeslaTechChannel
sorry: It's not so easy, your electrical code may require additional protection on longer cables.
This unit has a PEN-fault device unlike the GEN2-charger?
Talk with your
electrician! Zappy or another charger might be a better or cheaper soulution in your case
(PEN-fault, power sharing in you subpanal, .... ,no need to upgrade your house connection) but the tesla charger may be fine in special cases.
ua-cam.com/video/ztc7-q2n53w/v-deo.html
The longer the cable the more diffential you may get in ground potential and this might be lethal. Sorry!
This is a 48A unit and you need 1/2 of you 100A panel reserved for this at all times. Other chargers may use only what is left from your 100A panal. The care stops charging if you want to example shower (the tesla charger stops charging too as you whole main breaker flips) and restart afterwards.
Absolutely first rate! Thanks for the detailed explanation and rationale behind the decisions you made in this installation.
Thanks for the compliment! Glad you enjoyed it and were able to benefit from it.
Why use the 60 deg C column? Gen 3 Installation manual specifically notes: "If installing for maximum power, use minimum 6 AWG, 90° C-rated copper wire for conductors." 6/3 is perfect for this application as long as the individual conductors are THHN or better (and they should be!). I would even use 6/2 if only 3 wires are required.
6/2 is all that is needed. As for conductor type, while the HPWCv3 and breaker being rated higher, as well as the NM-B used in my video was rated at 90c, the NEC states despite that they say it needs to be downrated to the 60c column. 6/2 THHN in conduit would be the best way to go. 4/2 even better.
One of the best explanations of any topic ever covered on UA-cam. Thank you!
Wow, thanks! Glad you found it helpful.
. NEC 240.4 (B)(2) conductors dose not correspond with STANDARD AMPERE RATING of a fuse or breaker can go to next breaker size (not over 800 amp). 55 amp is not standard breaker size , so 60 amp breaker is totally legit for 55amp rated wire for Tesla.
Man this video was great. Well done
Appreciate it!
Minor correction: the second generation wall connector can deliver up to 80A off a 100A circuit. But only Roadsters and certain older Model S and X cars can benefit from that.
Thanks
I understand your logic, but I don’t agree with using the 60amp breaker on that 6awg romex. If you didnt want to wait for an online order, then you should have used MC cable or THHN wire in a conduit. Both could be 6awg and 8awg for the ground and fully rated for a 60amp breaker. Or stick with romex but commision your charger for a 50amp breaker. Also, if you use white for ground then you should get a label maker or green tape and mark it as ground.
My electrician installed the Wall Connector for me, but only used 50 amp breakers. He said that since the charge is limited to 48 amps, a 50 amp breaker was fine. Was he correct?
Great question! -- Nope. The configurator web interface for the HPWCv3 adheres to NEC convention where it will allow max charging rate at 80% of the rating on the circuit (actually, the NEC states circuit must be rated for 125% of the load -- same result, calculated in the inverse). Therefore, a 60 will do 48; a 50 will do 40, 40will be 32, etc.
Great video but I think the National Electric code requires the ground wire to be Green or marked green.
You are correct!....or bare copper. Adding green electrical tape to both ends of the alternate wire being used in the video will make is code compliant.
I love this very informative video. Would you be able to explain how to route six gauge cable from basement to garage we have a basement panel right below the entrance from garage to laundry room very short distance.
If it is a long run, like from a basement to a garage I would recommend going with 4 AWG. As was pointed out in the video, I only used 6 AWG because the run from the breaker box to the HPWC was a foot away. Logic is that the longer distance cable the more resistance there is and in order to properly run a contant load at higher amperage you need to up-size to the next larger.
Nicely done video. However it has been well established that the use of the cheap Nema 14-50 receptacles made by Leviton etc, available at Home Depot, are not safe or suitable for EV charging due to the heavy load cycling requirements. Suitable receptacles like Hubbell, which cost in the $80-$100 range, are made with bakelite instead of plastic, and have brass connectors rather than steel, and have more secure screw terminal connections. There are YT videos showing cases of the cheaper receptacles overheating and melting under EV charging requirements. Secondly, while the logic for using a 60amp breaker seems sensible due to the current limiting done by the car's charging circuit, I believe it is technically still against code.
I agree completely. The Heavy Duty Hubbell is the right tool for the job. The cheap 14-50 at Home Depot isn’t up to the continuous load or duty cycle requirements. I appreciate the feedback.
Great video. Very helpful
Thanks Paul
Thank you so much for this video, Sir! This is probably THE BEST explanation video i've ever seen for the Tesla Wall Connector.
Glad you got some value from it.
The ampacity of #6 cable NB is 55 amps, for a continuous load it will be 80% or 44 amps. The correct breaker after derating this circuit is 50 amps.
Thank you...Very good informative video
Glad it was helpful!
Great video! Thanks a lot.
You are welcome! Glad you liked it.
I'd like to add that running 6/3 Romex instead of 6/2 romex was not only kinda silly but also costs quite a bit more per foot. Might not matter in your install because of proximity to panel but sometimes you may have a few hundred dollar difference in wire price for that extra conductor on a longer run
Agreed.
it was smart to use 6/3 for the video & for non electricians. It gets confusing when you use the white wire as an energized conductor, you have to permanently mark the white conductor as a “hot” conductor, apparently electrical inspectors don’t count black electrical tape as “permanently marked” 😂😂 great video!
6/3 Romex is not properly rated for 60A breakers since the charger is classified as a continuous load. It has to be on #6 THHN. 6/3 Romex is only good for 55A, therefore, it maxes out at on a 50A breaker in regards to continuous load
Excellent video. Thank you
Thank you for the kind comment!
Breaker size is not determined by the attached load. A fault can still apply a current greater than what the car will pull.
To my understanding, breaker current (size) limits are determined to protect the wiring from excess loading. There are also numerous chapters and sections needed to be cross-referenced in the NEC to determine the "correct" pairing. Moreover, there are changes from version to version of the NEC. Perhaps you want to elaborate more to your point and cite some references that everyone reading the comments can benefit from. I too would love to learn something new. TIA.
@@TeslaTechChannel the purpose of a breaker is first and foremost to keep the current within the ampacity of the conductor. The ampacity of a conductor can be impacted by ambient temperature, voltage drop length, conduit fill, and terminal ratings.
If you have 75C terminals on both sides of the run you can size the wire to the 75c column of 310.
@@TeslaTechChannel the load will be running for more than 3 hours so it's a continuous load. So you need 1.25*max load = 60. The breaker should be 60 and since both sides of the connection are 75C a 6-2 copper run would work. Permitting you don't have a temp, length, or conduit fill correction.
Seems you have this down pat but I will have to watch more than once to get it down like you. Looking forward to my first Tesla soon.
Feel free to leave and questions you might have. Also, I suggest looking through the comments as some people have posed some good questions, for things that I either didn't think to mention in the video or simply could not cover every variable for every possible scenario.
Thanks for the feedback. I am hoping to have our Model Y Performance soon too. I had to reject the first one and the second one is now here a month later with issues that need to be sorted. Hopefully, I won't have to reject that too.
Nice video!
Can I just use single 4 AWG wires separately ( black, red and green) instead? Might come out easier to find and cheaper.
Yes, THHN wire is better, but more work because you have to run it through a conduit. The ground wire green only needs to be 8awg.
Tape that white wire with green tape if it's ground and not neutral
I appreciate your detailed answer on the wire size and ambient temp. I have a Gen 3 wall charger that will be 150 ft from my main load panel and the wire will be in the attic in Texas temperatures. I was planning on running 4/3 but with the ambient adjustment not sure that is even enough. Suggestions?
That is quite a long run. You will want to research the wire gauge and the conductor standard to use for your application. NM doesn't sound fit for your particular case.
Only issue is #6Awg NM-B is not code compliant on a 60 amp breaker.
Despite my particular NM-B and the HPWC and breaker all being rated higher, apparently regardless of mfg test rating, the NEC downrates all NM-B to 60C, in which case 55A is max.
BEST case scenerio - considering he has emoty/ready space in his "bus bars" ... un-fortunntly: some people's breaker boxes r FULL w/no space / not eniugh incoming amperage rated wires 2 accomodate a NEW 60 amp draw.
MAJOR obsticle that situation.
Older houses have limited grid supply wires ... "Aaaaaaaa. ."
Going with the 4-3 wire for mine with a 60 amp breaker. Going to try and run the wire in an insulated wall. I’m going to come out of the side of the panel, through a stud and over one stud bay and mount the charger. Wish me luck!
Pardon the delayed response. If you have yet to do the install, I recommend going with 4/2. HTH
Thank you!!!
Amazing Explanation 👏
Thank you 🙂
Awesome video!
Thanks!
"The bends cause resistance" yes bc the electrons all slam on their brakes for the corners..
Gotta apex those off-camber turns :)
Thank you
Welcome
Everything was great except your math at 8:28. Will only get 32A on NEMA 14-50 using the mobile adapter. Therefore it is 7.8 hrs of charging vs 5.2hrs with wall connector.
Indeed, and good catch. Found that out after I made the video and have stated so in a few earlier comments when people have asked. I did the install July 2020 and my delivery happened in Sept 2020, so I didn’t have firsthand experience at that point, was just going off technical specs of the capability of a 14-50 @ 80%. Didn’t know the UMC controller board rate limited to 32 at the time. Thanks!
Thanks
Informative video. Does the corded mobile connector charge at the same amps as the mobile connector with the 1450 plug? I saw somewhere else that it charges faster.
Thanks, and great question! The CMC can charge at up to the full 80% of the 240VAC 50Amp Circuit, which is 40 Amps. The UMC v2 (Mobile Connector) is limited to 32A by a regulator in the circuitry of the UMC's box. So technically speaking, the CMC does charge faster by 8 Amps. There is a charging chart at the end of the video you might want to check out which gives all the charging times based on charging rate. Let us know if you have any more questions about this, or feel free to suggest topics for future videos by replying to this comment. Hope that helps!
Great DYI thanks! at 7:51 you say something about "if you have the 50 watt hour pack..." how can I tell ? I have a model Y arriving next month and need to make decisions ASAP... thanks again!
Thanks for the comment and pardon the delay. 50 kWh packs were only part of the Std Range lineup for a very, very short time back in mid-2020 and were quickly taken out of production. If you are getting a new Model Y, chances are it is either being assembled in Fremont or Austin. The Fremont cars (to the best of my knowledge) have all been installed with the same tried-and-true 2170 cells (named 2170 for the 21mm X 70mm outer dimensions of each cell in the pack). Only recently have a handful of Model Y’s built in GigaTexas (a.k.a. Austin) been fitted with the new 4680 cells. In either case, the packs each approximate 80 kWh capacity.
Hi, electrical idiot here that just subscribed.
Firstly, this was the best video I found on how I can install the wall connector at my home. Also showing the alternative methods and explaining the reasons behind really helps me understand better.
I think I understood the video well and I'm ready to try it out but did have some questions outside of the video and wanted to make sure I had a clear understanding.
1. I'd assume most homes would have only have 1 main panel and no subpanels as shown at 6:27. I am not able to find other panels other than the one in my garage. I don't live in a castle and I'd assume the subpanel or the main panel would be hidden somewhere inaccessible or not visible.
With that in mind, if I am installing the wall connector about 10~15' away from the panel, am I correct in thinking that I need the 4 gauge wires. However, if I am not able to find the 4 gauge as you have mentioned in the video, I'd assume I can use a 6 gauge and either sacrifice some amp or shorten the distance from the panel to the wall connector.
I noticed the excel chart at the end the distance starts from 15' and doesn't show 10'. Is this an indication that I am not able to install the wall connector or the nema 14-50 adapter within 15' of the panel per NEC or other applicable codes?
2. Do you need to be a licensed electrician to perform the work?
3. Is there any application that would need to be filled out with the City or the County? Would I need to contact my HOA if it exists?
- I assume this is more of a question for them, but wanted to see what you did or it was different for you.
4. What chapters/sections of the NEC do I need to refer to before getting to work?
Much respect.
Hi Frank. Thanks for the comment/questions. Sorry for the delayed response, as I have been quite busy lately.
4/2 wire from a local electrical supply house should be readily available. You may have a difficult go of finding it at Home Depot, Lowes, etc. Make sure it is copper, not aluminum. The chart was merely shown to demonstrate different interval distances for the associated ratings. You certainly can install closer than 15’ away. Remember the cable feet, not the physical distance, is what the loss/resistance calculations are based on.
Typically you do not need to be a licensed Electrician to perform the work. You can normally do what’s called “pulling a homeowner electrical permit” whereby your local authority will allow you to do your own work upon submitting plans (varies by local authority, check with them on the requirements), but still have it inspected and approved by the local electrical inspector when done. HOAs do not have oversight to getting electrical work done on your house, by your or a licensed Electrician. That is left up to the local authority /county inspector, etc.
The NEC is an interesting code book with many different references for various scenarios. Often one code reference will cite another. Also, depending on which state / county you are in, you will need to check which version of the NEC code book is currently in force. My state for example is still on the 2017 version, while many others have adopted the 2020 version, which requires additional things for this install. Ask your local Electrical Inspector at the county. They are there to help you and to make sure it is done correctly. HTH
@@TeslaTechChannel Thank you. I’m going to try this when I move to a new place!
Either I am confused or missing something. You decided to keep the white wire as ground instead of neutral because is thicker. However instead of installing it to the ground bar (white wire) you installed it to the neutral bar. Am I missing something here? As far as I am concerned Neutral and Ground are not the same. Please help!
Thanks for the comment/question, Hector! You are correct on all points. Now let me explain....
The white wire (conventionally "neutral" in a 120v install) was used instead of the bare ground for 2 reasons: it was also 6 AWG conductor, rather than the bare ground wire which was 10 AWG; it was an insulated conductor. Since it is a plastic body and no box grounding for the housing, that was not needed. As for the load center bus bars, refer to 6:15 until 6:51 where I explain that since this install was for the only load center to the house, the NEUTRAL and GROUND bus bars are bonded together, effectively making no difference between neutral and ground, as they are bonded/tied together. If this were to a subpanel, then the NEUTRAL and GROUND bus bars would have been separated, with a neutral running back to the main load center, whereas the ground bus bar would have been grounded locally just outside that panel. In which case, as I explained in the video, I would not have used the white wire as the ground. Hope that cleared things up. Following convention to the letter, using the bare 10AWG ground terminated to the ground bus bar would have been the technically "correct" thing to do. The end result is the same: you have (2) 120VAC hot legs running to a tandem 60A breaker and a sufficient ground of sufficient gauge terminated to the ground of the house.
To bad you didn't have an Electrician correct your work. For maximum power the Tesla installation manual specifies to use as a MINIMUM "6 AWG, 90° C-rated copper wire" which in your table at the 5:00 mark is rated for 75 amps, not the 55 amp wire you used. Did you forget the 80% downgrade required for continuous load circuits? It is also too bad you didn't show using some GREEN TAPE, which I'm sure Home Depot carries, to mark both ends of your WHITE wire so the next person will know you are using it as ground. The next owner might convert your main panel into a sub-panel. How will they know your WHITE wire is not a neutral?
All excellent points, and succinctly outlines the flaws in the video. Thank you for your feedback and knowledgeable critique, Bill.
Can you cross the red and black wires?
The red and black are both hot legs of the 240v circuit and are interchangeable.
I was going to use the white as a ground also but my neighbor who is an AC installer said not to and to just use the bare ground wire as that is how the wires are designed and like you said someone may get confused to the white wire so I did it his way even through I would have done it like you did had he not talked me out of it.
The wire is actually THHN or if Trenched in ground it should be THWN so #6 wire is rated at 65 for thwn and 75 for thhn 5:05 in video certified sparky here
Great video though just wanted to let you know
I have a sub panel and I’ll leave the white on the common bar and also run the ground to the ground bar. The red and black to the breaker. Or should I cap the white and simple run the red and black with the ground wire?
If you are on a sub panel please go and get 4/2 wire, don’t do 6/3. You don’t need a neutral for installing the HPWC, just the two hot legs for the 240v and the bare ground (or green).
@@TeslaTechChannel awesome thanks
I’m looking for what to do to set up after physical install
Follow the simple instructions on connecting you mobile to your Wall Connector wifi SSID, then use the URL they give you in the instructions to go to the device’s webpage to set the rest of the settings up, join your home wifi network, set the circuit breaker rating, etc.
This video is very is very helpful for installing the Tesla Gen 3 wall connector. I do have a question for you though... my electrician used a 60 amp breaker and installed the connector just like your video instruction. However, I’m receiving the 3 flashing red lights which indicate it’s running hot. Have you seen this issue or no how to problem solve this? Based on this being installed correctly I’m thinking it might just be a defected connector. Thoughts? Thanks so much!!
Uh oh! Not good. There is an ampacity vs cable foot chart at the last few seconds of the video. Check it out.
On your wall connector, does it go to 3 reds only after a few hours of charging or right away?
If after a couple/few hours of 48Amp charging, then it is most certain too small of wire for your particular run length (cable-feet) and is creating too much resistance and thus heat.
You can test this theory/troublesoot in one of 2 ways:
-- reprovisioning your Wall Connector in the SETUP stage from "60 AMP Breaker" down to "50 AMP Breaker", thus ensuring it only allows the vehicle to draw 40 amps at 240v instead of 48 amps (remember: charge rate = @80% of breaker amp rating). If your cable run is REALLY long, you may want to reduce it down even further to "40 AMP Breaker", which will draw 32 amps.
- The other, and easier, way you can temporarily test this theory is to just lower your charging rate on the Tesla charging screen down from 48 to either 40 or 32 and see if it corrects the issue. If it does, it is a cable gauge problem and you need thicker wiring for your particular run.
If it goes into 3 reds immediately, It could either of the following 3 things, or a combination of them:
1) If you have a long cable run, rather than the short one I did, you likely need thicker wire than 6 AWG, such as 4 AWG or 2 AWG (lower number=thicker conductor) to carry the load. Remember that copper cable has resistance and the longer the cable-feet from your electrical breaker panel (aka load center) to the Wall Connector, the thicker wire you need to carry the same load.;
2) Check the terminal posts for proper connection and torque. Improper connection surface (wire touching the terminals) or improper torque can cause some anomalous things like that to occur, such as being too loose or too tight creating a less-than-optimal connection from wire to terminal block.;
3) Perhaps the Wall Connector is indeed defective.
morning!... TESLA recommends a #6AWG wire-90 degrees-75amps, ROMEX #6 Is rated for 55amps, 60 degrees, so i think we should use a #3 romex to MATCH the minimum requirements of the 75amps of the #6 awg 90 degrees.... idk..... i got confused too, i'm buying a DIESEL CAR instead!
Where people are going wrong on this is the temperature rating of the wire. Romex is generally rated as NM-B which is rated at 55 deg C. To use #6 on a continuous load you need 90 deg C wire such as THH. Also, it has been pointed out in other clips that the individual wires in some NM-B cables are rated at 90 deg, but when wrapped in sheathing the bundle is rated at 55 and does not meet NEC. I am running No 6 THH in conduit to meet the NEC.
The wire is supposed to be rated for 60 amps. Charger is 48 amps, but NEC says for a continuous load you must rate the circuit at 125%, hence the 60 amps. So your install is not correct you should have run 6-2 or 6-3 mc cable, which will give you the full 60 amp rating. Just an FYI. Also a good licensed electrician will check the connections at your mains breaker and the connections in the meter pan to make sure nothing is loose and potentially cause a fire down the road, always a good idea to hire a professional!!!
Depending on the install conditions, MC cable may be appropriate. The video would take forever if it dove into every cable type in every residential scenario. In my case Romex was fine, as I was going 1 joist over with under 10 cable-feet.
As for the 6/3: yes I could have/should have gone with 6/2, but it wasn't readily available that day. Secondly, my use of the neutral white, should have shown me wrapping green electrical tape on both ends to mark the wire as repurposed as Ground. Alternatively, I could have used the bare 10 AWG ground, as designed and simply not used the neutral. #6 Romex at 60c is rated for 55 VAC. According to NEC 240.4 (B)(2), where no equally rated breaker exist to match the conductor rating (55A) you can go up to the next one (60A). As stated in the video, if the run were longer I would recommend going with a higher rated conductor like 4 AWG, due to the increased resistance inherent in additional cable-feet, or alternatively THHN in conduit if the run wasn't staying in-wall.
As a broad-stroke axiom, It is always a good idea to hire your work to a professional specialist in anything in life, iIF you don't know what you are doing and have sufficient means. Alternatively, some folks choose to take it on themselves. While I am happy to have so many professional electricians watch and opine on the video, this video was certainly catered to a non-Electrician DIY homeowner audience, whom had possibly run a circuit or two before. Unfortunately, it has become commonplace to hear stories of some electricians trying to cash in on the EV gold-rush by charging 2-3x what it should be to run a 240V/60A hardwire, just because the customer said the keyword "Tesla". So who can really blame those homeowners who are technically/electrically inclined to give it a go?
Thanks for watching & for the comment, Robert.
@@TeslaTechChannel I totally get saving a buck here and there, I ran my own Tesla charger and saved a lot of money. Granted I’m an electrician and did the job with permits, it was still nice to not have to pay the premium. I just wanted to clear up the misconception of people using 6awg romex for chargers, when technically it’s not allowed. Will it be a problem, more then likely not… but still not allowed (per NEC). I just did a service call that another licensed electrician ran a charger in the wrong size wire, luckily it was caught in time.
Great Video! How would you wire/connect a second Gen 3 Wall Charger and utilize the Power Sharing capability enabled through WiFi??? This approach utilizes your first Gen 3 as the "Leader" unit and the second Gen 3 as the "Follower" unit.
Great question. I frankly, don’t know the answer. When I installed this last year the sharing wasn’t functional at that time. Since I only have one charger, I haven’t had the need to research it.
Great video! Is there any reason why you can't use 2 conductor wire instead of 3? I realize you preferred the thicker gauge for your ground, but could you have used 6/2 for your job instead of 6/3? Thanks!
Thanks! You certainly can use 6/2.
Ideally, if I could have found 4/2 when I did the install I would have used that. Unfortunately, I haven't found anyone to make a 4/2 Romex, and wasn't interested in making conduit unnecessarily and pulling 4AWG or 6AWG THHN. 6/2 would have been the next best option, but wasn't readily available at HD or Lowes on the weekend I decided to do this install. Since the run was in-wall and didn't require wet-rated or other cable spec or conduit creation, and couldn't do aluminium since the terminal lugs on the HPWC aren't rated for that, only copper, so I opted to go with readily available 6/3 copper Romex.
But by all means, if you can find and run 4/2, great. Otherwise 6/2 is your next best option.
@@TeslaTechChannel #6 romex is simply not rated for this install in any circumstance. It really makes my blood boil that you present this install "ok" when it is not. EV charging is a CONTINUOUS USE load which means your 48A charger MUST have circuit wiring at NO LESS than 60A. As you acknowledge in your video #6 romex is only rated 55A. So you are publicly endorsing a non-compliant install.
FFS just use flex conduit with 2x #6 THHN and a #10 ground and call it a day! Arguably cheaper at today's cable costs anyway.
@@cali-electro-dad so 4/2 would be the recommended? Thanks,
@@lfantasy5040 Personaly, I would use flexible metal conduit with 2 x #6 THHN + #10 ground in this situation. That assembly is rated @ 65A. If romex is to be used it should be #4, but you won't find 4/2 romex anywhere and 4/3 is a pain in the butt to install and expensive.
I have a question about Daisy chaining. I am planning to add an additional GEN three wall connector. Is it necessary to hardwire the communication or can they communicate wirelessly?
So many posts and videos I've given myself a headache going over my electricians work. He ran Romex 6/2 to the charger with a 60 amp breaker. I charge at 48 amps. I think the consensus is you have to use #6 THHN not Romex if you want to run at 48 amps and if not you need to limit yourself to a 50 amp breaker because there is no breaker or setting for 55amps(44 at the car). Currently I've just bumped it down to 44amps until I decide if I want to rewire it with THHN. Do you really think Romex is safe? If not you should probably revise this video I see so many posts online with people running Romex or electricians installing Romex 6 for Tesla chargers.
I noticed you mentioned installing the NEMA outlet on a GFCI breaker? I’ve read a lot of forum posts about breakers tripping constantly since the UMC has a built in GFCI, have you heard of this?
I am assuming you are talking about wiring a 14-50 plug for use with a UMC + 14-50 plug adapter option. This video didn't dive into that option. If you are in the US, each state has their own adoption of the NEC version. Some are on 2017 while others are on 2020. any 14-50 plug would have to follow your state and local code requirements.
Tesla Tech thank you
You could have just marked the white wire with green tape. Done.
You are absolutely correct! Should have done that. Thanks.
Good video. I would not recommend using those coarse drywall screws for this install at 2:44 . Find a stud and use plain wood screws, or worst comes to worst, use toggle bolts or butterfly anchors directly into the drywall. Great video otherwise.
Thanks for the comment. I know that what you are suggesting is the conventional way of doing things. However, I personally am not a fan of the weaker bite provided by conventional wood screws. I would much rather pre-drill pilot holes and have the coarser threads provide greater surface area, thus providing additional (bite) fastening strength. Since my particular install was to a hardwood backer-board your suggestion of toggle-bolts or butterfly anchors doesn't really fit the scenario. But, that said, I would not recommend installing this heavy of a device (given cable weight, draping over the unit whist unplugged from the vehicle) or with the possibility of the cable being errantly pulled acting as force-multiplied leverage on unbacked drywall under any circumstances due to the shearing danger of putting such a heavy, repetitive-use, and especially high-current device secured only to a piece of sheetrock without a stud or backer board. Just too flimsy a mounting solution.
Thanks for the video. Does your chart at the end imply that if I want to install this 45’ away from the panel, I need 1 gauge wire?
Thanks for the question, Justin. Being 5 months ago, I don't recall where I grabbed that portion from. According to the NEC, there are correction factors to account for ambient max temps and cable feet. In looking into it more in depth and going through it, you will be good to run 4AWG from 45 feet away. With that distance you will only have a voltage drop of 1.3 VAC. Hope that helps.
(source: www.electrician2.com/calculators/vd_calculator_initial.html)
Geeking out alert - followed by a TL/DR version
NEC table 310.15(B)(16) lists ampacities for various gauges of wire. You will note it’s split among copper and aluminum wire and each has 3 columns for different temperatures. Romex is limited to no more than the 60 degree column as mentioned in the video (see NEC 334.80). However, if you use MC or metal clad (armored) cable, you’re working with the 90 degree column. However, NEC 110.14(C)(1) forces you to consider the rating of the terminals of both the circuit breaker and equipment when deciding which temperature column to use. Typically, terminals are rated (and marked) for 75 degrees.
TLDR- use 6/2 MC cable. The chart (310.15(B)(16) lists different ampacities for various wire. Length isn’t charted.
@@nathanmiller9711 thanks for the detailed response. I went with 6/3 copper wire
Anyone know if there is an adapter to make the wall charger we already have for our Leaf work with the Tesla? I don't want to pay for another EV charger installation if I don't have to.
I am not familiar with what the Leaf uses. If it is a J1772, new Teslas come with a female J1772 to Tesla male adapter in the UMC cord kit.