Vinland Saga 2x9 REACTION!! "Oath"
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- Опубліковано 9 чер 2024
- Eric, Rick, Calvin and Aaron react to and discuss season 2 episode 9 of Vinland Saga - Oath - #vinlandsaga #vinlandsaga2
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00:00 - Intro
00:43 - Discussion Start: Eric's Folly
01:06 - Becoming a True Warrior
02:33 - Askeladd's Return
04:14 - Thorfinn's Dream
05:16 - Moral Support
05:28 - No More Fighting?
06:24 - You Have No Enemies
08:04 - The Cover Up
08:45 - Berserk-esque
09:05 - Season 1 vs Season 2
15:53 - Will Canute Be Relevant?
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Wont lie...You guys shoulda probably watched a recap video or something for Season. I understand you guys watch TONS of shows so you're bound to forget stuff but it seems ya'll completely forget very key points and concepts.
Great reaction but that discussion was tough, really hope someone can get the needed info to you guys.
Im sorry but saying "Do i need season 1 to enjoy this?" might be stupidest thing Aaron has ever said. The entirety of this season builds on what happened in season 1. You literally dont give a shit about Askellad in hell if he isnt introduced in the first season. I just don't understand.
Oh come on, don't be so rude or arrogant. We have all listen to or watched a show at one point without the full context saying that you have to see season 1 to enjoy season 2 is not true, yes you gain a lot more from the show watching the first season, but you would still get emotional reactions from watching season 2 without watching season 1 so they're not stupid for saying that. As somebody who watched Two Towers before Fellowship of the ring, I enjoyed it without having to know about and understand everything going on. 😂
@@DrDEATH0013 If you don't watch season 1, you would not know who Thorfinn is, who the guy showing up in his dreams is (his father), that he's dead or why he died, why Thorfinn killed so many people, who Askellad is and his relationship with Thorfinn, who Canute is and his evolution as a character, and many more.
@@DrDEATH0013 The entire point of season 2 is to see Thorfinn's growth as a character, how he becomes more human, and how he interacts / tackles certain events in season 2. All of that emotional trauma and guilt that you see in Season 2. Is brought over from Season 1, now sure you could still watch Season 2 without Season 1, but without the context of Season 1... You have no emotional weight or consequences in the 2nd Season. So, yeah... Saying that Season 1 was not needed is completely stupid, and goes to show how the entirety of Season 1 slipped over Blind Waves heads.
It's Aaron
@@DrDEATH0013 No
I hope one day, they do themselves a favor and rewatch Season 1 on their own time and actually pay attention to the themes and nuances. It wasn't just about fighting and being a great warrior. Season 2 is a masterpiece but it hits so hard because we have been through the journey in Season 1.
Ya like they don't even bring up Canute which half the season went to developing his character. I think they just need a rewatch cause I really disagree with their takes on season 1.
Tbh, it isn't really hitting like season 1.
exactly ...
season 2 is no masterpiece to me because i hated arnheid and i dont understand why i should sympathize with her. all she did was making bad decisions and being responsible for people dying
@@xerol333 Nah, bad take
Are these guys really watched the same season 1 like every one else???
Canute talking about love,
Askeladd talking about artorius and slavery (his mom is a slave),
Thorfinn talking about vinland with the slave girl in ep 8
All the depth that went way above their heads..
Also it's so obvious by this ep alone.. the reason why thorfinn didnt have any character progression because to make s2 work... Like cmon guys put it into together.. it's not that hard
It's like they are ignoring every single aspect of season 1....except thorfinn, the one character that was flat by design.
Because 1st part of season 1 was spent on pointless fights, Thorfinn (yeah-yeah, one note by design, doesn't make it more interesting to watch, guys) and Thorkell.
Glimpses of depth with 2 slaves scenes felt like foreign body among the sea of silliness. I was pretty close to dropping the show due to the same reasons.
It's pretty bad storytelling when first interesting conversation between focus characters happens at episode 10! And it had interesting setting as a backdrop, world building, character introspection and a bit of philosophy.
No wonder that so many people that liked season 1 hated season 2. Because people who would love season 2 were lost somewhere between first 10 episodes.
Why so many of you can't see that?
Me reading the comments before the video 😳
Lmao same
Lmao same
seeing the dislikes and just going to comments
Man this is so frustrating, you guys watch dub versions so you can understand the show better and remember informations better and take notes for the same reasons, but you forget all about previous seasons 💀
People who watched these two shows in Japanese and took no notes remember 100 times better the events of Season 1, how is that possible ?
What is the point of watching dub and taking notes then ?
I’m saying this because your opinion on season 1 doesn’t make any sense because you don’t remember anything.
Have you seen there JJK reactions they're somehow ever worse
Must be a them issue. Watched it in dub and understood the show really well. But the thing is, even within sub watchers a decent amount had issues with this season because it didn't have as much fighting. A lot of people fail to understand the siutation.
I watch dub vinland saga and I understand the themes/messages and plus it’s one of my favourite shows ever
Watching dub has nothing to do with it
I actively lost brain cells listening to the "Season 1 vs Season 2" part of the video, what on earth was that? Lmao Might be top 5 silliest Blind Wave convos.
Like first of all they suggest that they may not need season 1 to enjoy season 2? What? You absolutely do. Even things like Askeladd and Bjorn being in hell wouldn't mean anything to you if you didn't watch season 1, and those were just simple things like reappearances (in Bjorn's case, more of a cameo lol).
Then they suggest that Season 1 was just fighting and that's it. Yes it has a lot of fighting, but it has a lot of depth to it as well. Depth that went way WAY above their heads. I remember many people telling them as such as the reactions came out. You can't fail to take in some of the depth of season 1 and then go "well, it was just fighting really", this is like me skim reading Berserk and going "eh, it's just a big dude with sword fighting demons" like yeah, it is that, but it's also more. And this doesn't mean you have to LIKE season 1, don't get me wrong, but they didn't even try and look beyond the surface imo. You can dislike it still, but it's disingenuous to pretend it was only an action series and that's it.
Then they said Thorfinn is a boring character and basically implied he was the main character and because he was boring to follow, then season 1 was also boring. Now, Thorfinn being boring during season 1 is something i often see (i don't agree), so that's fine whatever, but the big misunderstanding here is thinking he's the main character or season 1. He was not. Askeladd was. He is the one with the most focus. He is the one with the most development. He is the one who drives the plot forward. He is the one who the plot revolves around most. Nearly everything that happens in S1 is due to him - either it's something directly done by him, or something someone else does because of him. Once again this circles round to not looking beyond the surface of Season 1 - Thorfinn seems to be the MC on the surface, so to them, he must be. I bet it didn't even cross their minds that Askeladd was the main character of season 1.
And lastly they said the series was spinning it's wheels and going nowhere in season 1. How can you say that when literally everyone who's introduced near the start of the series is in a completely and vastly different place by the time season 1 ends? And are completely different people? And why would you think something with SAGA in it's name would be a one and done season, that they'd get to Vinland in one season (and they also say Vinland wasn't really talked about in S1 which is not true either)?
Sorry for the long ass rant, but this whole section of the discussion just....baffled me beyond belief. Like i said earlier, you can NOT like season 1, that's fine, this isn't about liking or not liking it. This is about how they approached season 1 and decided to treat it like cookie cutter action war series and didn't really try and look any deeper into it, instead taking everything at face value and running with it. You can dislike it, yes, but it has depth in S1, depth that went way over their heads. And if i'm honest, i'm a little disappointed - BW is usually pretty good at dissecting stuff and looking beyond the obvious, but they really really missed the mark with Vinland S1, it's like they watched it on autopilot (thankfully it seems they've got the right dissecting tools for S2 so far, i'm very much enjoying the reactions and the discussions, except for this part lol).
Thank you for this.
theres no way you just typed all of that about some randos on the internet disliking a season of your favorite cartoon, goddamn
@@inmyhead00 Yeah, you didn't read it if that's what you thought my comment was about, but ok man lol
@@inmyhead00 "All of that"? That was like half a dozen sentences. Is that what counts as a lot these days?
I felt every word you typed, and i couldn't agree more; i was excited to see if S2 was gonna change their opinion on S1 (i did not enjoy their S1 reactions), and i'm just baffled that they seem to dislike S1 more now.
The crew missed most of the depth in season 1 and is now criticizing it for lacking depth, lol. I'm glad they like season 2 though
Exactly. Even if they found Thorfinn boring in season 1, he wasn't the main focus anyway. Askeladd was effectively the main character with the most depth and nuance out of everyone, and he was leading the plot.
@@rikudou947 It all just feeds back into them not caring enough about Season 1 to look beyond the surface. "Thorfinn was in it from episode 1? He's in the OPs? Thors was the first person we see and now his son is being focused on, so he SEEMS like the main character? Well then! He MUST be the main character. It cannot be anyone else." And they never bothered thinking any deeper than that.
They probably didn't realise or think for a single second that Askeladd was the actual main character of season 1, because he was initially not presented as such, and that's that. Despite him being the one the entire show revolves around for the entirety of season 1 bar like the first episode. Literally nearly EVERYTHING in season 1 is done by him, because of him or related to him in some way, shape or form.
@@rikudou947 when you understand that S1 was more about Askeladd than Thorfinn it's when you start to truly appreciate it, that's why the opinion that S1 was bad cause the MC was flat felt always... well, flat for me. Thorfinn is barely the MC in the second half of S1, he takes a back step and story cleverly explores more Askeladd, Canute and Thorkell to prepare the ground for Thorfinn's character arc later on in the series while also exploring the themes of the story (episode 18 of Season 1 is still my favourite episode of the show, and it has barely anything to do with Thorfinn at that point, because it explores important themes that are brought back later in S2 but involving Thorfinn this time; this whole story is masterfully crafted from beginning to hopefully end)
The crew really misread S1 if they think you can skip it
to be fair tho... the VA they were watching in season 1 is not up to par vs the JP. The performance carries season 1
@@iamnibee That's their fault. Their argument of wanting to pay attention doesn't even work because they still forget important details
Something you guys need to remember is season 1 is literally the prologue to this story. Season 1 isn't meant to explain everything its basically setup for the entire story going foward. I think Rick would understand this more than anyone being a Berserk fan, id be like saying "do i need the golden age arc to fully appreciate berserk?" Yes you do need it just like you need prologue arc of Vinland saga.
We’re gonna tell you exactly what we told you with Jujutsu Kaisen S2, go rewatch S1 because you guys forgot so much stuff from S1…
Thorfinn wasn’t the MC in S1, he hadn’t had the depth he has now because that was THE POINT and he also had layers in S1, you just have to analyze and focus to get those glimpses of layers.
S1 had so much to offer, so much character development from Thors, Askelaad, Björn, Canute..
I just don’t understand how you can hate it
It really hurts hearing them talk about it.
I hope they check out these comments a bit and come to a decision to rewatch S1
It's there opinions man, they are under no obligation to further explore a story if they don't want/have the time for.
Does this make it frustrating as a viewer, yeah sure absolutely I get it 100%, but you gotta understand that not every story is gonna hit (or in this case connect) with people.
Would a rewatch be for the best yeah I do believe so, and with a more open mind, yup definitely. But again they are under no obligation to do that, even if it'll help improve their opinion of the show (which is already rising)
Did they say they hate it?
It seems like their anime reactions of the newer shows just aren't as good as older ones anymore
This conversation about season one is mind numbing. They are mad because a show with the word Saga in the name didnt resolve everything in the first season???
like a certain franchise that had next to nothing to do with stars even though the title implies they are the main point of the wars (please get what I'm trying to say here)
Getting Hung up on the title rather than the subtext and quality of a story is PEAK brainrot.
It's pretty weird especially from Rick considering he LOVES Berserk and most Berserk fans seem to love both Vinland Saga and Vagabond (it seems that you can't be a fan of one without the others)..
Ok that discussion was full of bad takes an all, but I don't think this was a serious complaint. They were mainly like "thorfinn was flat, so the entire season must have been mindless fighting"
It's like they are letting thorfinn's character be the entire show, even though he was arguably the least important character in s1.
@@APolygons2 I disagree
Thorfinn dropped his dagger at the end of s1 after Askeladd was killed.
I think the idea that Thorfinn had no depth in season 1 is kind of a big generalization. Yes, he was very much always in revenge mode but there were parts where glimmers of something else shined through. When he tells the slave girl about Vinland or when he walks away from the battle saying what's so fun about war. There's hints there that lay the groundwork and I think it's silly to think he had no depth
Thorfinn's story in season 2 hits so hard only thanks to getting such a detailed view of his single-minded revenge mode in season 1.
I think saying thorfinn had no depth is kind of fair. because he actively pushed away any moment were he should have felt regret, or changed direction. It's like he was actively going out of his way to not change.
Which you could see as depth, but out of every complaint, I think saying s1 thorfinn on his own was that interesting is more than fair. The issue is that they are letting a character that was mostly flat by design to set up for s2, be the only factor, when I would argue thorfinn despite being the MC was one of the least important characters.
@@APolygons2 I don't think it's wrong to say Thorfinn didn't have depth per se. I think it is wrong to say that as if it was an unintentional mistake the story made, when it was very much the point.
@@reno9821 I do agree that it's not a point of criticism. But I think saying "no he was super complex" also goes against the point of the story.
I think the accurate way to say it is, yes he was simple, and that was the point. He had to be simple or static for his character arc in s2 to work.
I don't see saying that as an insult. simplicity is not inherently a bad thing. The same way complexity isn't inherently good.
@@APolygons2 I agree with you. I suppose it depends how someone quantifies depth though.
I'm really sorry to say this (not try to be rude here) but man... you guys need to rewatch season 1 like you forgot so many things. I kinda agree with the comments here about the whole "Season 1 vs Season 2" discussion especially Aaron's thoughts were kinda "crazy" to listen. lol
I hope by the end of this season they can appreciate the journey more than focusing so much on the destination of Vinland. Eric to trying to find the deeper themes but Aaron is just simplifying everything.
I’ve always thought Vinland was more of an idea rather than an actual location.
@@MelancholicRobot42 It's both.
@@MelancholicRobot42 The idea of a new land and a fresh start.
@@MelancholicRobot42 It's a real place, but within the narrative, it is as much an ideal to strive towards.
A peaceful place with no war and slavery.
I just became a patreon to watch this episode and lmfao I couldn't be more disappointed
Thats so incredibly rough buddy
they enjoy s2 a lot though. s1 commentary should be set aside
At this point I'm not sure you guys even watched season 1
i’m sorry but this episode hits so much harder in japanese. askeladd sounds like he’s 20 years old and they changed the lines of his speech. the voice actors did not deliver with this season. (i watch dub and sub anime by the way)
Edit: The english voice for einar fucking SUCKS OH MY GOD
I have been following this channel for like 9 years since their daily dbza reactions; i can confidently say i have never EVER being more in a disagreement to their opinion than here.
I really don't want to come across as an asshole (i enjoy their reactions and discussions most of the time) but Aaron's hatred for S1 is ruining this reactions (Thorfinn didn't have layers? It was pure violence without any depth? YOU CAN FUCKING SKIP IT? i almost feel like he is gaslighting Calvin into thinking S1 was terrible)
I'm glad they are liking this season, but i'm getting the same vibe from their Dark reactions where they wanted to look like they understood the story when they clearly didn't (at the very least Aaron doesn't, why is he even here if hated S1 so much even after rewatching it?)
Yeah I don’t usually look to Aaron for insightful commentary.
Such a great episode. I definitely shed a tear or two... or twenty 😭
8:45
Erick: I don't know why the visual of Thorfin crying into the face of the crying corpse moves me so much.
Me: Maybe it is because its a very telling image of regret in the face of your past mistakes and those you wronged. Something we all can empathise with to some degree.
Rick: It's because it reminds you of berserk bro
LMAO.
Even though this whole discussion was a shitshow, it was worth seeing just for that moment.
I love Berserk too, but I do find it super annoying how much some people overhype it. It's amazing, and it might even be the best seinen manga. But it's no the only great seinen, like so many seem to think.
The ATLA fandom has a similar issue, with many convincing each other that it's the best western cartoon to the point that they start believing it's the only great one, and then compare everything else to it.
I hope they check out these comments a bit because they’re pretty oblivious about season 1
They won't. They live in a bubble
They pretty much ignored everyone telling them to atleast watch a recap of JJK season 1.
Anybody know if there was a big difference between the subbed and dubbed versions of season 1? Because I honestly can’t believe we watched the same show.
I think the translation of the dialogue might be different, but it's been awhile since I watched Season 1.
Just to clear things up. Thorfinn didnt actually "see" Valhalla. This was all entirely in his mind, the whole "Valhalla" thing is Thorfinn contextualizing his trauma.
Season 1 no depth is crazy take
Thorfinn IS NOT the main character in season 1 which is WHY these kinda topic is stupid.
Askeladd is literally the main character in season 1. He is the main reasons Thorfinn all about revenge.
Thorfinn redemption arc in season 2 can't happen if Askeladd not there.
AND THAT IS WHY Season 2 is so good.
ICANT LMAO
2:25 Rick nailed it with the Alcoholism analogy. Last episode Thorfinn slipped back into justifying his violence with anger towards another. That can very quickly turn into killing someone for someone like Thorfinn. That's why I think its important to understand that the punch he threw last episode wasn't just to save Einar from doing it, it was more Thorfinn just getting angry at how the Farmhands were treating him and Einar. I think y'all get it, but I remember that being a big revelation for me after reading that chapter.
Great point. I know most reactors get hyped up by Thorfinn's punch (and I can totally see why), but it's also tragic to watch, like seeing an addict relapse.
@@MrChefBoyardee If you haven't already you might wanna check out lmreactions on vinland saga. They were the only reactors I've seen that weren't excited about the punch and immediately recognized the implications of it.
@@mrlikerdh Yes 100%, they are my favorite vinland reactors. Their reactions really effected how i viewed this scene with the punch
Seriously not trying to be mean or anything but watching a version of the first season with bad rewritten dialogue, ignoring all of the philosophy, character building and set-ups and then saying the character deaths were pointless is just so wrong (especially when most of the important deaths were either for Thorfinn's development or for Askeladds plan, the two main plot points for that season).
I personally never agreed with the idea that Thorfinn has no depth (being angry is not a sign of lack of depth, neither is willingly choosing not to change, that's even more of a sign of character in my opinion), but extending it to the entire season and the characters just tells me you guys weren't even paying attention at all. In the entire season, not a single one of the 24 episodes is wasted. Thorfinn, Askellad and Canute all change and evolve in such interesting ways (some more noticeably than others), while the world around them also changes with most of the side characters adding unique perspectives to the story (anne, the priest, ragnar, leif, bjorn, floki, even king sweyn just to name a few).
I feel like you guys were watching it treating it like attack on titan season 1 when vinland was literally never like that, right from the first episode. The first season sets up the character motivations, the state of the changing world, the many philosophies born from war and even paints a perfect picture of the horrors of violence, the world where "everyone is your enemy". Thorfinn denying violence in this episode is Thorfinn denying everything that season one seemed to be about, and devoting himself to what the story was always about, right from season one episode one, when his father decided to trade 8 sheep for a dying slave just to set him free.
So yes, you NEED season one before this, and you NEED it to be that long, but only if you actually give a shit about what the characters are saying, otherwise you might as well just watch the show on mute.
(I really believe you guys should rewatch season 1 in sub in your own time because that dub specifically was terrible, as most dubs tend to be with their dumb limitation of matching syllabes with the animation that always creates either nonsensical or janky sentences like Thorfinn's "everyone is enemy here?" In this very episode. Even though that line wasn't very important, when it happens to a line that is, it's like a shot in the heart for anyone who's read the official translation of the manga or watched the sub)
I agree except about your take on dub. I watched season 1 and 2 of this in the Netflix dub and I love it🤷♂️
@@killcount6ix323 Many enjoy the dub, and all power to them.
But the sub is still superior in every aspect, because it was directed with those voices, and that dialogue in mind.
Western voice acting agencies can't replicate that due to a cultural barrier, and cost limitations to scout the right talents, and the end result is a show that seems more like a parody.
It takes away much of the actual experience and intent behind the show, whether you enjoy the dub or not.
My personal take, is that if you have no impairment or disability that makes watching sub very hard for you, then you have no excuse.
Might as well watch the show how it was intended and envisioned.
@@Celeborn93 not knowing the language and rather WATCH the show than READ the show are valid excuses
@@killcount6ix323 That's why i said people who are impaired.
I am not impaired in that regard, and i can perfectly watch the show, while reading subs at the same time.
Practicing makes it easier, but shying away from it, and shying away from the culture is just doing yourself, and the show a disservice.
@@Celeborn93 having a preference is not an “impairment” what in the heck are you talking about. Some people just want to watch shows without subtitles, which has nothing to do with impairments. It’s only a minority of them who actually have impairments
I'd have to debate the utility of violence when it comes to defending yourself or others, but it makes sense why punching that guy set off Thorfinn's internal crisis. It was a flash of blind anger that took him by surprise just as much as anyone else. After all that time of passivity, it must have been heartbreaking to find that he still had "it" in him.
Wow, that Season 1 vs Season 2 discussion has to be Top 10 worst discussions in Blind Wave history, and it ain't 10-2.
Askelad never want to kill people for fun, for his honor. He always kill for reason can't make more sense, like food, money, political stuff
I like the Karmic nature of Thorfinn finally getting his Dad's message and in return he's not being punished for the Farmhand incident. It's like the universe rewarding him or something.
LOL Thorfinn was MEANT to cone across as an unlikeable asshole in season 1. He had to mess up and forget what his father taught him for his turnaround in season 2 to mean something.
s1 was one of my favourite seasons of tv and not for the fights so it's surprising to me that that was the only thing they enjoyed about s1
This season only works because of season 1... . Also I'm pretty sure most of the things you disliked about season 1 are mostly intentional. Very excited for the rest of the season because after this episode the pace starts to pick up...
Just so you know, this is adapted from a manga just like most other anime meaning that in manga form last season and this season are not seperated in any way so the writing quality did not suddenly jump up, I think you guys just forgot the first season or just maybe didn't pay a lot of attention.
I think Thorfinn is a very well written charcter even in S1, he isn't neccesarily the main character, IMO it's a very intentional decision on the authors part, Thorfinn is stagnant from episode 6 to the climax of S1(some people are put off by it). He has some moments of reflection and change but he's still only concerned with Obligatory vengeance, he will do anything for that duel with Askellad. S2 is better but wouldn't be possible without all the setup in S1. (I also think S1 is definitely better in the manga barring voice acting and music).
I think you guys need to rewatch your own reactions to season 1. Sure you guys were not happy with Thorfinn 's character development by the end of the season (honestly I am there with you) but you were enjoying the themes, philosophy, characters and the story. I regularly rewatch your discussions when I want to hear somet philosophical discussion. But that's maybe just me. I didn't know why people hate on you guys for vinland (aside from ranking it C tier) but after hearing this season 1 vs 2 debate, i kinda get it.
Seeing Thorfinn crying so openly after such a long time made me tear up too especially how sincerely sorry he is for all the lives he has taken.
Thors also didn’t view himself as a True Warrior, he even says that a true warrior needs no sword and he still needed his because he was still incomplete. He would’ve definitely seen Thorfinn’s vow of renouncing violence as truly being a true warrior
Yes you needed Season 1 to happen for Season 2 to hit you in the feels harder lol
Welcome to peakland saga. How do you watch this and not feel Makoto Yukimuras blood and beliefs seep into his character(s) and story.
Also still dont get their slander on S1. Rewatch pls Aaron.
If I were to make a list with my favourite episodes of all series I’ve ever seen, this episode would definitely be there.
I don't think they are wrong about thorfinn not having layers in season 1, his character was flat, and narrow minded by design. But I think they are letting thorfinn's character be the reflection of the entire season, which is just not the case. The themes were still there, and while not for thorfinn, the character writing and depth was also there.
And I think they would agree with that if they rewatched it, they are letting a singular character that was 1 dimensional on purpose, be the defining factor of a an incredible show that does so many things extremely well.
S2 wouldn’t be as good as it is without S1.
It is also pretty obvious that you guys forgot pretty much everything about S1 because your argument doesn’t make any sense.
I also blame the dub which was garbage in S1.
It is not the show’s fault if you decide to watch the inferior version of a show.
For real, saying they "understand better" watching in dub just does not make sense when they choose to watch a dub that is ass. The added step of reading the subtitles maybe would have helped them not miss literally everything season one stood for
Read it years ago and watched it multiple times and I still get goosebumps every time
I like how there are little details proving that his dream was just a dream and not some spiritual plain (not that that makes it less important or real to Thorfinn). The ravine he falls down looks like where his Dad was ambushed and killed, the roman pillars are similar to the ones he was near in S1 Ep10 (when he was talking to Askellad). Even Askellad is less the Askellad from S1 and more of how Thorfinn saw Askellad. There's a ton more details.
I don't agree with S1vs S2 either, but at least they enjoy season 2 more :)
I think Thorfinn is a very realistic and complex character in season 1. Yes he didn't had much development and a lot of people didn't care about him because of that, but when you really think about the fact that he was a little child that spend more time on his revenge and with these bad people, instead with his family, it makes more sense that with no good influence you won't change that quickly. It's very realistic that he forgot about Vinland most of the time and that he even fogot his family. He was stuck with them, since he couldn't turn back anymore, so revenge was really the only thing he has, because he was never really a viking or warrior, by heart. I think the bond with Askellad in a father/son way and that Thorfinn stopped hating him by the end, is the heart of Thorfinns character in S1. He already changed from where he started, just not for the better, with all the messed up things he saw and did.
In the end I think S1 and S2 are two sides of the same coin. They can't exsist without one another. S1 told us the story from the warriors perspective (Askellad), the violence, the hate and anger and the moral conflict, while S2 is now showing us the perspective of farmers, villagers, normal people that got enslaved and where Thorfinn finally sees the other side. With better influence he finally can change for the better and find his real purpose!
Love this Anime soo much and love that the mangaka takes his time to tell us Thorfinns story and everyone that has a big influence in his life. Good or Bad he really cares for his characters!
Man... It wasn't until this episode that I realize I miss the English dub VA of Askeladd from when you guys watched S1. No hate on the VA here. Just that the old one sounded like a badass. Like the "Me? I'm just a goddamn Viking," moment in S1 was so good. The person we couldn't help but like even though he's done a lot of terrible things, Lucius Artorius Castus.
I can see why the comment section got heated. And whether or not you guys liked S1, I'm on the side that S2 wouldn't have much weight without S1. Right from the get-go, we were introduced to Thors who sold quite a bit of fortune to buy a slave who was already in his deathbed. He could have taken on all those bad guys with his bare hands but he didn't. He chose to pay for the slave just so he can pass on in peace. Ylva and Throfinn were confused by it, but we immediately understood what kind of person Thors is.
It might have had a different focus, but S1 is still very much the same Vinland Saga as S2. I'm glad you guys like S2 though. There's even heavier stuff to come.
I love you guys, but I really think you're not giving Vinland S1 a fair shot. I think disliking S1 is completely fair, Thorfinn is quite static, a lot of the depth is quite distanced from the action, that while connecting well the the main theme, doesn't really tell us a lot about each character, which sometimes devalues the stakes. S1 can be very 'not fun' at points, and it depends A LOT on you finding Canute and Askellad amusing.
With all that said, S1 is definetly not skip worthy, that makes no sense. I get that you're not being literal when you say that, but S1 was incredibly important to the foundations of this season, nothing here would really matter without it.
How could you possibly fairly think about Thorfinn without seeing all the lives he's taken? Sure, we can be told he's a killer, but SEEING how much pain, suffering and death he caused is necessary for us to WANT him to become a better man.
I disagree with that commets that say you guys need to re-watch S1, because while you may find some new appreciation for it, its likely that you won't like it still, but I do think you're simplifying what S1 was and what is was trying to do. Well, anyway, like I said, love you guys, its just a show, ain't that deep.
This is where everything changes
Peak
this is brutal
Wow...... I hope one day they will do themselves a favor and rewatch Season 1 on their own time, paying attention to the themes and nuances because they seriously need to rewatch season 1 like they forgot so many things. Criticizing the Season 1 for lacking depth is crazy to me
I think they take notes to avoid having to do that but it doesn’t seem to help beyond very basic information.
@@MelancholicRobot42 Yes, it's pretty obvious that they forgot almost everything about S1 except maybe the basic like you said. Now they think season 1 was just fighting and that's it.... I hope they check out these comments a bit and come to a decision to rewatch S1
@@MelancholicRobot42 It barely helps with basic information aswell xd. In jjk they couldn't even remember the names of main characters.
I love you guys but man that season 1 vs season 2 discussion is the worst one in the entire channels history. Did they even watch season 1? Its a really disappointing reaction/discussion to what is one of the greatest stories of the 21th century.
Criticism on s1 aside, their observation n discussion for this ep is on point. Different reasons than the crew but i do prefer s2 so much better
Nahh comments are mad asf
god i see why the comments are eating y'all alive, y'all really missed the point of season 1 and it's themes, i would def rank season 2 higher but not bc season one was empty, but because this is the fruit's of season 1, season 1 planted the seeds, regardless i really hope y'all rewatch season 1 at your own pace and really take it all in
crazy disappointing discussion regarding season 1, it’s like they didn’t watch it
Yeah, I can tell these guys don’t enjoy this show. They are very surface level with their understanding. Y’all should just stop before you get to the end
Its like they don't try to watch this show fr 😥. Its definitely a dub issue as well. I don't think I would've enjoyed it as much as I did with the original sub. No weird dialogue to fit in their animations and just pure intention with their words.
@@LittleViddssaying its a dub issue is just an argument made by those who dont like dub. The issue is clearly them just not being able to see the greater themes. There are plenty of people who watched dub and understood the messages just fine
@@starkillahx its how its conveyed. there are plenty of shows I love in dub (Mob Pyscho, FMAB) that doesn't lose the feeling. Not to mention the change in dialogue to fit the characters animation (which can affect the voice actor as well to be forced in a weird unnatural tone and pattern) doesn't help.
@@starkillahx True, clearly it isn't JUST a dub issue in this case.
But tbh, the dub also doesn't do a good job at helping the viewer understand why the story is so good.
There are so many things that makes the original better; from the culture, direction, voice acting direction, and the fact that everything was created in cohesion with all of that in mind. Western VA agencies can't replicate that, and it shows.
A lot of the nuance is lost when filtered through the dub, and nothing has the same weight or gravitas. In the original, you can just tell when the show is trying to tell you something important just from the voice acting alone.
First it was Jujutsu Kaisen and now it's Vinland Saga.
For guys who actively look for more information and nuance in characters and story you gus sure missed a lot most of the time since you guys are more focused on writing down stuff instead of experiencing and understanding the show completely.
Aarons inability to understand that a likable character and well written character on not mutually exclusive is so incredibly frustrating.
woosh
Not trying to be that guy but this is what happens when watching dubbed versions of a show. You risk it having bad dialogue/voice acting and not carrying the same emotional depth like with subbed versions. You can disagree and hate as much as you want but I've seen this happen with a bunch of anime across many reaction channels. Obviously some dubbed versions are great like FMAB and Cowboy Bebop but those are few and far between.
Your comment doesnt make sense when eric literally said he got goosebumps during the dream sequence. Their discussion for this ep majorly been positive. Rick n Aaron even said this season have been so much better than s1. They only have complaints to say about season 1
@@mnstarwars Yes I was reffering to season 1 which had terrible dialogue in the dub
As someone who generally likes dubs more... you're absolutely right vinland saga is way better in sub. I will say though, the dub for sentai askeladd is peak. (the dub of him in the version they watched in s1)
I wish the community voted for shows with great dubs more often. They would love the shit out of love is war.
I understand why people didn't enjoy season 1, i didn't neither(I mean enjoyed the action, but didn't care much for the story) but now after watching season 2,which is arguably my favourite season ever in anime, I appreciate season 1 so muchhh more.
I agree with eric and I think at the end of season 2, you will be way more appreciative of season 1 aswell.
I really hope that's how they gonna feel about after the last episode of season 2.
Ironically the opinion they have is the opposite of some of the internet. They love season one and hate season 2 and thorfinn now and dropped the show. I don't understand. Like.. do you hate story and character growth and just wanna see pretty colors and fight scenes? What are they 13?? No it's grown men. Idk it baffles me.
And then there’s people like me that enjoy both
@@leecochrane5172 same, idk why it's been so divisive
Who's "they" ? Never seen a single reactor complain about season 2. Seems like a strawman made by some fans to justify why season 2 isn't as popular as it should be.
@rikudou947 not reactors, they are trying to entertain. So they pay attention and try to like it. I'm talking about the general reception on comment sections and stuff. I've had allot of people argue with me thorfin is boring now and they ruined it
@@rikudou947no it’s been a general consensus by a lot of the anime audience calling Vinland s2 boring and a stepdown. It’s not a straw man it was one of the most contentious arguments when S2 was airing.
My god are there s1 takes awfull, Thorfinn was annoying in s1 therefor it wasn't good or necessary? Makes no sense when s2 only hits so deep because of how long his revenge quest was in s1. I feels like they feel the need to justify why it was so long on there rankings and yet cant come up with any conclusion as to why besides finding Thorfinn uninteresting during the prologue in which he's barely the focus at all, complete media illiteracy if I'm being honest.
I don't get what the comment section is going on about, Sea 1 had its theme of intro, whos what, whys what. Sea 2 is just continuing this theme, whys what and whats the answer. Sea 1 had more action which people like, Sea 2 has more internal self reflection. With some action.
goodness,these comments man. whats more important is them enjoying this season n they do. thats it. them not liking s1 is their own personal view. people enjoy different things. it is what it is
And by that same token, other people have every right to express their own personal view and point out that they disagree with the crew (especially when these reaction videos are filmed for public view)
People aren't upset that they dislike season 1. People are upset because they pretty much forgot everything that happened in season 1, didn't bother to rewatch or refresh their memory and then complain about things that they clearly missed or forgot about.
Nice reaction and discussion
The season 1 vs 2 discussion doesn't really bother me cause season 1 was just alright to me lol
Bad take lol
Ya'll in the comment section need to stop being such asshats. Why would you pay them money just to hate? If they don't like something then they don't, just implore them to rewatch instead of insulting them.
No see that is not how this works, thankfully I am not a paying patron but I would definitely be more upset if I were. The issue here is that Blind Wave (and other reaction channels similar to their own) market themselves as people who are going to dissect and break down the fictions they digest. You can not sell an audience on the idea that you are applying critical thinking and objective measures (story boarding, literary technique and the like in this case) to your analysis and then completely ignore ALL of that and then try to pawn your opinion off as the objective reality of the situation. Is Vinland Saga S1 a flawless masterpiece? No, nothing we humans have ever created is flawless, however if we objectively analyze the literary technique applied for the first season then by all objective measures the Crew here is extremely wrong and just needs to accept that the themes and messaging of S1 just went over their over inflated heads.
@@projectomnia1997 The themes in S1 really isnt that deep and based on the amount of shows they have watched this is probably the worst version of it
@@projectomnia1997 What was so good about first 9 episodes of season 1?
It was a chore to get to the good parts and 2 interesting characters. First Askeladd, then Canute. Two very different kind of shepherds mind you, then Thorfinn, presumably going to be.
Season 2 was absolute GARBAGE...💯
...at least compared to season 1....which was one of the best anime seasons of any anime....ever
Did you live from an alternate universe because this is the opposite and wrong opinion.
@@internetgoat4831 opinions, common as assholes, everyone's got one...💯 that wasn't intending to be insulting...i respect your point of view
Nah
@@ZenRyoku Nah, you had a bad take. We are allowed to have opinions as well
@@JohnJohnson27-cs6ix that was precisely my point