I own a Cake OR, a 72v SurRon and the Escape version of this trials bike. (and I have gas dirtbike) The EM Escape is my Favorite! Its so fun on a tight tricky trail with obstacles. You will seek out that kind of riding. I use my electrics in my neighborhood to practice and have fun. Its quiet, so no one cares. Plus on the trail, dirt biking is more social on electrics. You can hear your buddy shout when he's having fun, you talk more. Ahhhh.... I want to go ride now. stupid snow.
EXCELLENT REVIEW...Love to get this for backyard training with little to no noise; the ONLY problem I foresee is the price tag that comes with a limited warranty 🏁
I like premix too much to own one until I have to. I have 4 buddies with these new EM's. They like them. I have videos of them at trials events. One guys battery just totally died on him at an event. It had plenty of juice, but it just died.
You mention that maybe in the future a clutch wont be needed but my thought is that they could create a "clutch" that would simply be a potentiometer on a physical clutch lever that would act as semi reverse throttle based on throttle input. In other works you throttle position determine the power ready to be applied and the speed the lever is released determines the % of throttle input and speed of the lever release determines ramp up of that power. It would also work as a fail safe like a regular clutch. Another benefit is it could also be programable. I think once someone figures out the logic for this system an actual clutch would no longer be needed. They can also program a simulated flywheel by slower removal of power to the motor rather than most with current on off feel is already doable but no way to have it shut off when wanted which is where the clutch comes in to disengage flywheel programing. Just my thoughts as someone who has an electric dirtbike(surron) and get where a clutch is needed but think that its one extra maint part that could be eliminated.
Finally someone with skills on one of these. I've lost interest shortly after they were released because youtube was littered with old guy putting around on hiking trails. They talk up the clutch but don't do anything that requires one. Thanks for the review!
As a cross-training bike for balance control and riding obstacles I would absolutely ride one of these! It would make it easier on the bystanders, and probably me, too, noise-wise, when you are doing exercises at very low speed. Thanks A LOT Rich for this awesome review - very detailed and highlighting what I think will matter to potential riders. Cheers :)
Rich, thank you for a great review. Your riding skills are also great fun to watch! Recently I was able to take a short demo ride on a Zero motorcycle and the whole experience was amazing, and one of its maps was customizable. Your review of the ElectricMotion EM trials bike clearly demonstrates what a great future motorcyclists are headed for. On a minor point, engineers today use the word 'motor' to refer to the electrical rotating machine that powers an electric bicycle, an electric motorcycle and all other electric vehicles. Back in the 1880's when the early bicycles were first fitted with cumbersome steam engines and later with electric motors and the first dry batteries, the term 'motorcycle' was adopted. After internal combustion engine, gasoline and oil the became widely popular for all vehicles, the word motorcycle just stuck. Today with the popularity of STEM careers worldwide, and now the modern push toward electric vehicles, the technical usage of the word 'motor' refers to an electric motor of some type while the term 'engine' refers to some sort of internal combustion machine.
Have just recently gotten into trials as a skill builder for "hardish" enduro with a Beta 300. Picked up a gasgas txt 125 and could not agree more about this type of riding being pure joy, it takes you back to riding as a kid just for fun. Thank you for the well laid out and informative interview, putting the descriptions into things we can relate to is one of the reasons you are probably the best riding couch on youtube. Please keep up the great work!
In our Trials Club several EM are used and they are good - just as you reported. It makes more sense to go electric in Trials than MX, as the CO2-Footprint from manufacturing is lower due to smaller battery and motor. Electric is not greener per se on vehicles with low mileage Footprint comes mostly from production and not the relative small amount of Gas burned in operation. Plus electricity too often is made from fossile burning with no benefit to CO2 footprint for E-bikes as they are then fossile powered too. Just my comment for those, taking care of greenhouse gas consideration. For the others - Electric is silent and therefore has less problems for finding riding spots plus motor maintainance (plugs, filters, pistons do not apply) is zero. Best regards, Hacht
Love this review Rich. I have a 22 Epure race and I completely agree, I use it more often than I ever did my gas bikes. It’s just easier and I ride around my yard a lot in the evenings after work. I am glad you are keeping one in your fleet and I look forward to watching some skills videos with your Epure race !
Great aerial shots!! It was so fun to watch you on the rocks! If you get to keep this one, you gotta add the progressive rear brake lever. (way better than the button) Also, if you take it on a long trail ride, don't trust the battery meter below 25%. It exaggerates how much you have left once you get that low. I think I agreed with everything you had to say about this machine. Curious if you think its beginner friendly? (I think mine is) ... and I have to add, as an owner of several different electric dirtbikes, and gas dirtbikes... You want the clutch if you do tricky stuff. And since doing a whisky throttle is so much easier (and consequential) on a electric, the clutch is super handy as an extra off switch for your throttle hand. Great Review Rich!
I believe it’s perfect for a beginner rider! It really hones in your ability with the clutch! I appreciate your support Mitch!! Thanks for everything! Glad you enjoyed the new drone shots more to come!! 😁
"Not a trials rider".... Wish I was half that good as "not a trials rider". Great review and photography! My 1985 TY350 would be great at that weight :) Would love to try one. Thanks for posting.
Neat, I agree the characteristics of an electric bike are well suited to trials as long as you uave that clutch. I had always kind of written them off due to not having a clutch, which is probably your most important input, especially when it's about enhancing your dirt bike game, so this kind of changes things, makes me wish I had a spare 11k
This is awesome! Going to pick up in the spring -I have to replace my driveway retaining wall in a few other areas on the side of the house, going to turn it into a trials, friendly course!
Excellent review. Means a lot to me as an ex trials rider approaching 70. Like you I always felt they needed a clutch. I tried the electric KTM Freeride around an indoor MX track and it was great fun. Once I got used to both brakes on the bars, no clutch, no gears, no foot brake - it was a blast. Less to think about. PS the correct term would be smiles per Wh. 😏
Thank you so much for this review! I am thoroughly intrigued with electic bikes and this seems like the most ideal usage of current electric motors and technology
MX rider here, I would be all about it as a training tool, something I can practice bike skills on in the yard or neighborhood where a gas power bike would be too loud. The price makes it infeasible though.
Surprised you did not mention how incredible EM did at RedBull TKO this year. Not only did it win the electric class but it placed 3rd against the 326 gas bikes. I don’t think anybody expected the electrics to do so well at TKO.
Super great review and really like your knowledge in the two wheel Arena!! Although, not just you but many other reviewer's in the electric vs fuel powered vehicles are getting their terminology incorrect. "Motors" are electric & "combustion" or "fuel powered" are engine's. A lot of time's when I and others watch review's on the new stuff coming out and they get it wrong, I immediately turn them off. You are a very smart and good teacher/informer and have a lot of respect for you, so I painfully watched the whole review on this bike with a motor. Respectfully, a review well done. Take care.
Great content. BTW when you demonstrated the very slow drop in engine RPM(?), you had the clutch in. Does the RPM drop rapidly when there is a slight or significant load. I gourds I'm asking how much "flywheel inertia" does it carry at zero throttle?
Another great video Rich and good to hear your thoughts. I got mine for the same reason, I can ride it anywhere (even the local playing field/park) and nobody complains when they see me. Also the weight is a good thing in my eyes as it help when I jump back on the husky 350 👍
And... it's not the bike, is the rider. And the rider is / you're good! 🤙 Always wondered how could someone who is used to use the clutch would perform on a cluthcless electric bike. The French company is on the right track here.
You should check out the Mecatecno Dragonfly. Another serious Electric trials bike. The major problem with these bikes is the novelty factor, that makes them very expensive in comparison to ICE powered bikes. They are in the price range of a Montesa, where in reality they are nowhere close to that bike. They need to come closer to parity in price to a Sherco, TRS, GAS GAS.
Great review and feedback on the clutch, there's a purpose built hard enduro E Bike being released in Australia next year, it'll feature in the Australian Hard Enduro Championship.
Interesting, I'm on my second ebike build with two very different motors on the same bike. The first motor had monster torque from zero rpm but quickly ran out of power. It would pull hard as long as you could feed it more gearing. It only rev'd to 800 rpm as I recall. the second motor rev'd to 6000 rpm and its power built as the revs increased. I needed lower gearing to run at lower speeds to keep it from stalling out on a steep climbs but it would pull more speed from the same gear. Both motors would pull the same top speed (40mph) with the same battery, but gearing was very important with the higher reving motor. I later felt that the first motor would give a higher top speed if I added more gearing but top speed was not what I was after. I wanted the compactness for ground clearance on my mid drive downhill bike and after I figured out the gearing I'm sold on the higher reving motor. It sounds like your test bike is a low reving one which is what you would expect from a trails bike. Grunt! 👍👍
Excellent review with an open mind. I believe you're right that it's good for the majority of us. I would ride it. The dog looked concerned when you had it in the house. 😆
If there are no issues with the individual cells groups(usually around 200 cells with batteries the size of these) then you should get 500 charge cycles and still have ~70% of original capacity. Same tech in a phone and people can usually get 2-3yrs out of a phone battery(1-2 charges per day so over 1000cycles) before major degradation of 50%. According to his review thats still 2hrs of riding trials. The most likely issue would just be age or some other failure such as electrical connection/bms or a few of the many cells having an issue which are hard to repair. As far as cost I havent seen the actual pricing but typically batteries of the EM side are $2-3k and if aftermarket ones come out they may be more but could add alot of range(similar to the surron market where double the range is easily possible)
I'm considering buying one of these bikes. I got a kick out of disciplined Rich has been at calling the thing that powers a motorcycle an engine. But in this case, it really is a motor.
Thanks for watching. This is very close. Much like the two stroke versus four stroke debate everyone has their preferences now there’s another form of propulsion that comes into play. ⚡️
I love anything that brings trials more into the mainstream, I’ve ridden an electric motion and will say they’re not for me yet, I still like my beta evo 250 a little more. I also like that you said that almost no one needs a 300 trials bike.
The fly wheel is present it feels like a regular bike other than the rate of RPM decline. When you are holding traction or loading before an obstacle it feels very similar. This is my initial review. I found out you can adjust and change the size and I’ll be doing a separate episode totally on that.
I wonder why they didn't mimic the rpm acceleration characteristics of a 2T exactly? I really wonder if they even thought about it at all, or if they did think about it, why they weren't able to execute to the point of humanly imperceiveible differences. Would love to talk to their controls engineers! with electric motor technology that's available these days, i have to think it's completely possible to exactly minic the exactly characteristics of the gas 2t with an electric motor. It must come down to the dollar, as usual :(
its just the physics of a rotor with electric currents vs a engine that limited by friction and throttle opening. Its possible they could put an rpm limiter per throttle position but the reason for the clutch it to be able to use the flywheel effect and more rpms means more affect so I think it would be counterproductive for just the case where you sit like he did for that long, typically you wouldnt do that, maybe 5sec as you analyze your next move
@mrskywalker115 yes its physics to a point. But to limit the responsibility of the characteristics to only physics means they did not completely program the motor controller. Depending on the motor controller in the bike, they should have the ability to control the motor exactly how they choose. In fact, with a powerful enough motor, they may likely be able to mimic the exact feel and performance of the wet clutch, through the use of good software programming and eliminating the wet clutch hardware, and all the additional weight associated with it minus the lever.
Those Denzel GB200 motors with the 4 speed have been around in the DIY world for a few years. They are not very robust, every single one I’ve seen has not lasted very long, and most guys that I’ve seen building their own bikes lack considerably in the riding skills department compared to someone with the skills of Rich, or even your local fast/skilled A and B class guys.
Thanks for a great, complete review! I owned & attempted to ride trials on a 2016 EM Escape. It looked like a trials bike, but I could never master its throttle-only power control in competition. It needed a real clutch. Was a great plonker on local hiking trails though. ;-) The new 2023 EM Pure Race seems like they have progressed to the point of maybe luring me back for another try. :-)
The clutch is a game changer! They are continuing their development, I think I’ll keep one in my stable! Glad you enjoyed the video, thanks for watching!
Much more sophisticated take on this bike than other reviews on YT. The electric fan boys go on and on about Surron this and Surron that, but no matter how much power they have, how is that power actually used. I see them constantly spinning their rear wheel. In hard enduro or trials situations, you need a clutch to apply the traction, plain and simple.
Appreciate your comment! I agree it’s all about the application of power and the ability to hold traction. This bike does all of that well! 👍thanks for watching!
All the weird powertrain behavior stuff is because they programmed it to act naturally like an electric motor, rather than artificially more like a gas engine: gas engines have A LOT of internal friction, electric motors have almost 0 until you get to really high speeds. When you throttle on, you're requesting torque, not a specific RPM. 1/4 throttle isn't enough torque to overcome the high RPM friction of a gas engine so it only revs a little, but for the electric motor that's enough torque to spin it up really fast, just takes a while because of momentum. Same reason for RPM going down slowly, lots of motor momentum, not very much internal friction.
The Rpm decrease speed is just a matter of different programming. If you turn off the tko the Rpm decreased as fast as a two stroke. I like that Rpm decrease better, as that's what I'm used to. But the Tko really helps with keeping ballance and carrying momentum over obstacles, so i try to adapt. I still prefer my old TRS 250, but I just get so much more ridetime with the EM.
@@IRCTireUSAMoto I think its a combination of programing and if irc the EM has a flywheel that you can change weights which would affect this as the electric motor doesnt have the same friction to slow down the mass of the rotating assembly like a piston. If it had less mass it would rev up and down faster but its the opposite problem from the climbing from steady input, a heavier flywheel would slow the rpm climb but unlike gas its not limited by a true throttle, its simply a power input so as long as you apply power, it slowly accelerates the mass until external forces counteract further acceleration. Just some engineering explanations for what you've seen
What’s your thoughts on Electric Moto?? Would you ever own one??
I own a Cake OR, a 72v SurRon and the Escape version of this trials bike. (and I have gas dirtbike) The EM Escape is my Favorite! Its so fun on a tight tricky trail with obstacles. You will seek out that kind of riding. I use my electrics in my neighborhood to practice and have fun. Its quiet, so no one cares. Plus on the trail, dirt biking is more social on electrics. You can hear your buddy shout when he's having fun, you talk more. Ahhhh.... I want to go ride now. stupid snow.
EXCELLENT REVIEW...Love to get this for backyard training with little to no noise; the ONLY problem I foresee is the price tag that comes with a limited warranty 🏁
Clear that Garage out Mitch!!! 🤘 thanks for your input!
Thanks for your thoughts!!
I like premix too much to own one until I have to. I have 4 buddies with these new EM's. They like them. I have videos of them at trials events. One guys battery just totally died on him at an event. It had plenty of juice, but it just died.
You mention that maybe in the future a clutch wont be needed but my thought is that they could create a "clutch" that would simply be a potentiometer on a physical clutch lever that would act as semi reverse throttle based on throttle input. In other works you throttle position determine the power ready to be applied and the speed the lever is released determines the % of throttle input and speed of the lever release determines ramp up of that power. It would also work as a fail safe like a regular clutch. Another benefit is it could also be programable. I think once someone figures out the logic for this system an actual clutch would no longer be needed. They can also program a simulated flywheel by slower removal of power to the motor rather than most with current on off feel is already doable but no way to have it shut off when wanted which is where the clutch comes in to disengage flywheel programing. Just my thoughts as someone who has an electric dirtbike(surron) and get where a clutch is needed but think that its one extra maint part that could be eliminated.
Completely agree, I can definitely see an electronic clutch option coming. Programmable and adjustable on the fly. Thanks for watching!!
Finally someone with skills on one of these. I've lost interest shortly after they were released because youtube was littered with old guy putting around on hiking trails. They talk up the clutch but don't do anything that requires one. Thanks for the review!
Thanks for watching! Glad you enjoyed it!!
As a cross-training bike for balance control and riding obstacles I would absolutely ride one of these! It would make it easier on the bystanders, and probably me, too, noise-wise, when you are doing exercises at very low speed. Thanks A LOT Rich for this awesome review - very detailed and highlighting what I think will matter to potential riders. Cheers :)
Rich, thank you for a great review. Your riding skills are also great fun to watch! Recently I was able to take a short demo ride on a Zero motorcycle and the whole experience was amazing, and one of its maps was customizable. Your review of the ElectricMotion EM trials bike clearly demonstrates what a great future motorcyclists are headed for.
On a minor point, engineers today use the word 'motor' to refer to the electrical rotating machine that powers an electric bicycle, an electric motorcycle and all other electric vehicles. Back in the 1880's when the early bicycles were first fitted with cumbersome steam engines and later with electric motors and the first dry batteries, the term 'motorcycle' was adopted. After internal combustion engine, gasoline and oil the became widely popular for all vehicles, the word motorcycle just stuck. Today with the popularity of STEM careers worldwide, and now the modern push toward electric vehicles, the technical usage of the word 'motor' refers to an electric motor of some type while the term 'engine' refers to some sort of internal combustion machine.
Have just recently gotten into trials as a skill builder for "hardish" enduro with a Beta 300. Picked up a gasgas txt 125 and could not agree more about this type of riding being pure joy, it takes you back to riding as a kid just for fun. Thank you for the well laid out and informative interview, putting the descriptions into things we can relate to is one of the reasons you are probably the best riding couch on youtube. Please keep up the great work!
Thanks so much that means a lot!
You just explained the bike better than the manufacturer, great stuff
In our Trials Club several EM are used and they are good - just as you reported.
It makes more sense to go electric in Trials than MX, as the CO2-Footprint from manufacturing is lower due to smaller battery and motor. Electric is not greener per se on vehicles with low mileage Footprint comes mostly from production and not the relative small amount of Gas burned in operation. Plus electricity too often is made from fossile burning with no benefit to CO2 footprint for E-bikes as they are then fossile powered too.
Just my comment for those, taking care of greenhouse gas consideration. For the others - Electric is silent and therefore has less problems for finding riding spots plus motor maintainance (plugs, filters, pistons do not apply) is zero.
Best regards, Hacht
You should try the brand new Mecatecno Dragonfly! ♻🔋👏💪🔝❤
This is the most encouraging e-bike review I've ever seen!
Thanks for watching!!
Love this review Rich. I have a 22 Epure race and I completely agree, I use it more often than I ever did my gas bikes. It’s just easier and I ride around my yard a lot in the evenings after work.
I am glad you are keeping one in your fleet and I look forward to watching some skills videos with your Epure race !
Glad you enjoy it! I’ve literally been riding in my garage! It’s killer!! Thanks for watching!
Great review Rich. Just picked up a 22 EM race. Been enjoying it so far.
Great aerial shots!! It was so fun to watch you on the rocks! If you get to keep this one, you gotta add the progressive rear brake lever. (way better than the button) Also, if you take it on a long trail ride, don't trust the battery meter below 25%. It exaggerates how much you have left once you get that low. I think I agreed with everything you had to say about this machine. Curious if you think its beginner friendly? (I think mine is) ... and I have to add, as an owner of several different electric dirtbikes, and gas dirtbikes... You want the clutch if you do tricky stuff. And since doing a whisky throttle is so much easier (and consequential) on a electric, the clutch is super handy as an extra off switch for your throttle hand. Great Review Rich!
I believe it’s perfect for a beginner rider! It really hones in your ability with the clutch! I appreciate your support Mitch!! Thanks for everything! Glad you enjoyed the new drone shots more to come!! 😁
"Not a trials rider".... Wish I was half that good as "not a trials rider". Great review and photography! My 1985 TY350 would be great at that weight :) Would love to try one. Thanks for posting.
I appreciate that! Thanks for watching!!
Neat, I agree the characteristics of an electric bike are well suited to trials as long as you uave that clutch. I had always kind of written them off due to not having a clutch, which is probably your most important input, especially when it's about enhancing your dirt bike game, so this kind of changes things, makes me wish I had a spare 11k
Thanks for watching!
Thanks for sticking to performance. Always great info.
This is awesome! Going to pick up in the spring -I have to replace my driveway retaining wall in a few other areas on the side of the house, going to turn it into a trials, friendly course!
Excellent review. Means a lot to me as an ex trials rider approaching 70. Like you I always felt they needed a clutch.
I tried the electric KTM Freeride around an indoor MX track and it was great fun. Once I got used to both brakes on the bars, no clutch, no gears, no foot brake - it was a blast. Less to think about.
PS the correct term would be smiles per Wh. 😏
Thank you so much for this review! I am thoroughly intrigued with electic bikes and this seems like the most ideal usage of current electric motors and technology
MX rider here, I would be all about it as a training tool, something I can practice bike skills on in the yard or neighborhood where a gas power bike would be too loud. The price makes it infeasible though.
Surprised you did not mention how incredible EM did at RedBull TKO this year. Not only did it win the electric class but it placed 3rd against the 326 gas bikes. I don’t think anybody expected the electrics to do so well at TKO.
What division?
Super great review and really like your knowledge in the two wheel Arena!! Although, not just you but many other reviewer's in the electric vs fuel powered vehicles are getting their terminology incorrect. "Motors" are electric & "combustion" or "fuel powered" are engine's. A lot of time's when I and others watch review's on the new stuff coming out and they get it wrong, I immediately turn them off. You are a very smart and good teacher/informer and have a lot of respect for you, so I painfully watched the whole review on this bike with a motor.
Respectfully, a review well done.
Take care.
Haha! Thanks for watching even though it was painful! 😂 I’ll call it a motor next time 😁
Great content. BTW when you demonstrated the very slow drop in engine RPM(?), you had the clutch in. Does the RPM drop rapidly when there is a slight or significant load. I gourds I'm asking how much "flywheel inertia" does it carry at zero throttle?
Another great video Rich and good to hear your thoughts. I got mine for the same reason, I can ride it anywhere (even the local playing field/park) and nobody complains when they see me. Also the weight is a good thing in my eyes as it help when I jump back on the husky 350 👍
🙌🙌 thanks for watching! Completely agree!
Loved the detail on this. Very cool look at this machine.
And... it's not the bike, is the rider. And the rider is / you're good! 🤙 Always wondered how could someone who is used to use the clutch would perform on a cluthcless electric bike. The French company is on the right track here.
You should check out the Mecatecno Dragonfly. Another serious Electric trials bike. The major problem with these bikes is the novelty factor, that makes them very expensive in comparison to ICE powered bikes. They are in the price range of a Montesa, where in reality they are nowhere close to that bike. They need to come closer to parity in price to a Sherco, TRS, GAS GAS.
I’m interested in owning a trials bike, this one is certainly worth looking at
This one is perfect for me!
Looks like a super fun bike🤙 I’d totally get one to ride in my yard.
Definitely an awesome tool!!
Electric bikes open up so many more opportunities to ride and practice! I love mine!
Great review and feedback on the clutch, there's a purpose built hard enduro E Bike being released in Australia next year, it'll feature in the Australian Hard Enduro Championship.
That’s awesome! I’d love to try it! Thanks for watching!!
Interesting, I'm on my second ebike build with two very different motors on the same bike. The first motor had monster torque from zero rpm but quickly ran out of power. It would pull hard as long as you could feed it more gearing. It only rev'd to 800 rpm as I recall. the second motor rev'd to 6000 rpm and its power built as the revs increased. I needed lower gearing to run at lower speeds to keep it from stalling out on a steep climbs but it would pull more speed from the same gear. Both motors would pull the same top speed (40mph) with the same battery, but gearing was very important with the higher reving motor. I later felt that the first motor would give a higher top speed if I added more gearing but top speed was not what I was after. I wanted the compactness for ground clearance on my mid drive downhill bike and after I figured out the gearing I'm sold on the higher reving motor. It sounds like your test bike is a low reving one which is what you would expect from a trails bike. Grunt! 👍👍
Excellent review with an open mind. I believe you're right that it's good for the majority of us. I would ride it. The dog looked concerned when you had it in the house. 😆
He’s always concerned 😂 it’s a great bike thanks for watching!!
I'm convinced. I'm getting one.
Very well done review.
I am looking forward to a comparison to the Yamaha TY-E (once it's available).
11:10 U counter with the clutch. Or u adjust fly wheel weight.
Thats right, I forgot you can change the flywheel weights. You can go up or down from stock. I think you can take them out entirely if you wish.
Interesting!?! I didn’t know that Mitch!?
@@IRCTireUSAMoto Add or retract. NP.
Hey dude... Check that Euro vid with the guy with the clutch on his EB... Launch factor 2000👍
Thank you.
Best review I’ve seen yet! Nice!
Do you think you’ll get to try the 23 Escape R as well? Would really like to hear what you think about that!
Appreciate it! I rode one briefly they’re very similar. Maybe a full review one day!!
You're a really good rider
Have a try at testing the brand new Mecatecno Dragonfly! it would be great to get an honest review from you! ♻🔋👏💪🔝❤
I definitely think this is bloody awesome, keep up the good work rich
Much appreciated! 🙌
👍👍👍 sharp and clear explanation
You got the point perfectly right!!!
Thanks for watching!
Looks very fun! God bless you and everyone watching in Jesus’ Name. Hallelu Yah!
Awesome video Rich! Thanks for that, I'm looking at getting a trials bike soon
This is a killer option!
Is that a stunt double riding in the video, lol?
Pricey but the battery part is like investing in years of fuel because it's so cheap to recharge.
Very nice review!! Very tempting bike 👍
You riding in the West desert of Utah?
It’s northern utah little ways south of slc
Awesome review, Rich! Hopefully more OEMs offer an eMoto with clutch in the future.
I believe it is coming
I definitely I am interested in an EM bike when I reach end of life of my current Beta Evo 200 especially now with a clutch.
I think it’s a killer option!
I ride the future too! I love this bike ❤
It’s an absolute blast! Personally, I’ll ride anything, but this gives me high hopes for electric!
Great Review! I have an Escape R and love it. Would you consider reviewing a built out Sur Ron for kicks?
Man I’m not sure, no clutch scares me
Is there any data on how many charges the battery is good for, or how much a replacement battery costs?
I definitely plan on doing a long-term review and finding that out!
pretty sure replacement battery is 5k
If there are no issues with the individual cells groups(usually around 200 cells with batteries the size of these) then you should get 500 charge cycles and still have ~70% of original capacity. Same tech in a phone and people can usually get 2-3yrs out of a phone battery(1-2 charges per day so over 1000cycles) before major degradation of 50%. According to his review thats still 2hrs of riding trials. The most likely issue would just be age or some other failure such as electrical connection/bms or a few of the many cells having an issue which are hard to repair. As far as cost I havent seen the actual pricing but typically batteries of the EM side are $2-3k and if aftermarket ones come out they may be more but could add alot of range(similar to the surron market where double the range is easily possible)
What is the range and how hard is it to swap the battery?
Momentum, the clutch dump, rewind and another clutch dump, for now looks like a thing. Maybe I’m old school.
Sweet bike. Really like the features especially that wet clutch. There's a few things the company needs to address itl get there
Completely agree! They are on their way!
Это очень круто, такое чувство что парень вообще с мотика слезает только для того чтобы видос снять или переодеться и сесть на другой... Красава
I'm considering buying one of these bikes. I got a kick out of disciplined Rich has been at calling the thing that powers a motorcycle an engine. But in this case, it really is a motor.
Yeah yeah yeah motor, engine, what makes it go 🤷♂️ that’s all I care about.
Pretty darn cool, I would have one, only if I had money!
All I want out of an electric bike is one that rides just like a gas bike, then I'd make the switch in a heartbeat 😂
Great review 🤘
Thanks for watching. This is very close. Much like the two stroke versus four stroke debate everyone has their preferences now there’s another form of propulsion that comes into play. ⚡️
Check out the new Escape XR.
I'd love an electric trials. I could practice in my yard without disturbing my neighbors.
I love anything that brings trials more into the mainstream, I’ve ridden an electric motion and will say they’re not for me yet, I still like my beta evo 250 a little more. I also like that you said that almost no one needs a 300 trials bike.
I hope more people get into trials!
Rich how can we get a hold of you to talk about a possible training day?
Richlarsen511@gmail.com
I've ridden one - great bike
🤘🤘
Excellent review! Tires?
These are the IRC TR11 trials tire
You didn't say anything about the flywheel effect or feel. That's the soul of a gas bike in my book, along with the clutch feel.
The fly wheel is present it feels like a regular bike other than the rate of RPM decline. When you are holding traction or loading before an obstacle it feels very similar. This is my initial review. I found out you can adjust and change the size and I’ll be doing a separate episode totally on that.
Brilliant thank you.
no clutch no deal - simple as that. Other then that EV are fine too, can ride in my living room. Clutch is not only control but safety feature.
The clutch is a must! Thanks for watching!
I wonder why they didn't mimic the rpm acceleration characteristics of a 2T exactly? I really wonder if they even thought about it at all, or if they did think about it, why they weren't able to execute to the point of humanly imperceiveible differences. Would love to talk to their controls engineers!
with electric motor technology that's available these days, i have to think it's completely possible to exactly minic the exactly characteristics of the gas 2t with an electric motor. It must come down to the dollar, as usual :(
its just the physics of a rotor with electric currents vs a engine that limited by friction and throttle opening. Its possible they could put an rpm limiter per throttle position but the reason for the clutch it to be able to use the flywheel effect and more rpms means more affect so I think it would be counterproductive for just the case where you sit like he did for that long, typically you wouldnt do that, maybe 5sec as you analyze your next move
@mrskywalker115 yes its physics to a point. But to limit the responsibility of the characteristics to only physics means they did not completely program the motor controller. Depending on the motor controller in the bike, they should have the ability to control the motor exactly how they choose. In fact, with a powerful enough motor, they may likely be able to mimic the exact feel and performance of the wet clutch, through the use of good software programming and eliminating the wet clutch hardware, and all the additional weight associated with it minus the lever.
How do plates at a buffet affect the battery life? 😉
Definitely have a an effect over 6 😂 you’re in trouble!!
@@IRCTireUSAMoto plus dessert? Might make you splat in a different way...😂
Smiles per Wh ;-)
Interesting review 👍
Thanks for watching!
The nicot has a clutch with 4 gears to shift
Very interesting I’d love to test!
Those Denzel GB200 motors with the 4 speed have been around in the DIY world for a few years. They are not very robust, every single one I’ve seen has not lasted very long, and most guys that I’ve seen building their own bikes lack considerably in the riding skills department compared to someone with the skills of Rich, or even your local fast/skilled A and B class guys.
Thanks for a great, complete review!
I owned & attempted to ride trials on a 2016 EM Escape. It looked like a trials bike, but I could never master its throttle-only power control in competition. It needed a real clutch. Was a great plonker on local hiking trails though. ;-)
The new 2023 EM Pure Race seems like they have progressed to the point of maybe luring me back for another try. :-)
The clutch is a game changer! They are continuing their development, I think I’ll keep one in my stable! Glad you enjoyed the video, thanks for watching!
Great review! Sadly, WAY beyond my budget.
Much more sophisticated take on this bike than other reviews on YT. The electric fan boys go on and on about Surron this and Surron that, but no matter how much power they have, how is that power actually used. I see them constantly spinning their rear wheel. In hard enduro or trials situations, you need a clutch to apply the traction, plain and simple.
Appreciate your comment! I agree it’s all about the application of power and the ability to hold traction. This bike does all of that well! 👍thanks for watching!
Thanks for sharing
Thanks for watching!
For the most part, the people that dislike electric have not ridden electric dirt bikes.
I can’t agree more! I’m enjoying this one!!
IMO the Only legit complaint about electrics is range.
All the weird powertrain behavior stuff is because they programmed it to act naturally like an electric motor, rather than artificially more like a gas engine: gas engines have A LOT of internal friction, electric motors have almost 0 until you get to really high speeds. When you throttle on, you're requesting torque, not a specific RPM. 1/4 throttle isn't enough torque to overcome the high RPM friction of a gas engine so it only revs a little, but for the electric motor that's enough torque to spin it up really fast, just takes a while because of momentum. Same reason for RPM going down slowly, lots of motor momentum, not very much internal friction.
Does it have a fly wheel or any fly wheel effect?
Yes, both!
And you can increase or decrease the weights on the flywheel.
Tell Stark to put a clutch on the Varg. Junk without it.
Once again.. EV motorcycles are an answer to a nonexistent question…..
Why does he keep saying “electric engine”
Amazing .... but the price :D
Rpm decreasing speed is a major factor,I would say
That only makes me think that's still a long way to go for the electric bikes
I’m not sure if it’s a major problem. I’m pretty sure a little program and could fix it almost immediately. Thanks for watching!
Why does THIS make you think there's still a long way to go?
The Rpm decrease speed is just a matter of different programming.
If you turn off the tko the Rpm decreased as fast as a two stroke.
I like that Rpm decrease better, as that's what I'm used to. But the Tko really helps with keeping ballance and carrying momentum over obstacles, so i try to adapt. I still prefer my old TRS 250, but I just get so much more ridetime with the EM.
Great points! Loving the ride time on the Em!!
@@IRCTireUSAMoto I think its a combination of programing and if irc the EM has a flywheel that you can change weights which would affect this as the electric motor doesnt have the same friction to slow down the mass of the rotating assembly like a piston. If it had less mass it would rev up and down faster but its the opposite problem from the climbing from steady input, a heavier flywheel would slow the rpm climb but unlike gas its not limited by a true throttle, its simply a power input so as long as you apply power, it slowly accelerates the mass until external forces counteract further acceleration. Just some engineering explanations for what you've seen
E-Waste powerwheel