When I took astronomy in high school, my teacher would classify the constellations by how many cups of wine the ancients must have drunk before the group of stars actually looked like the thing they were supposed to represent. IIRC Cancer was a five cupper.
@@chertfoot1500 that is why those ancient sky maps had a man painted there, in case you missed it. Personality since I read the Maya's saw Orion's Belt as three stones on the back of a turtle I see it as a turtle.
Neil might not know this, but the ancient Celts had a Lunar Zodiac which was divided into THIRTEEN sections and each section had a specific tree or important plant associated with it as follows: Birch, BETH, 24/12-20/01 Rowan, LUIS, 21/01-17/02 Ash, NION, 18/02-17/03 Alder, FEARN, 18/03-14/04 Willow, SAILLE, 15/04-12/05 Hawthorn, UATH, 13/05--09/06 Oak, DUIR, 10/06-07/07 Holly, TINNE, 08/07-04/08 Hazel, COLL, 05/08-01/09 Vine, MUIN, 02/09-29/09 Ivy, GORT, 30/09-27/10 Reed, NGETAL, 28/10-24/11 Elder, RUIS, 25/11-23/12 Each section also had its own archetypal character/god and symbol. I hope you found this interesting.
That knowledge is very ancient, same as mine in BIAFRA we have thirteen months and there are plants to know this changes without looking at the sky daily
Nature will plan the eventual funeral, depending on Polaris’ birth and life. Pluto still lives and evolves. It just does it on a smaller scale than we led ourselves to expect size-wise. Think of it as a kind of dwarf or elf but, otherwise, like other planets in its continuing existence.
@@roycarlson0517 no dont cry astrology is so much more, go calculate your navamsa chart online, truly that is the fruit of your tree (zodiac) never say you are One thing, astrology is so much more ❤️🔆🤗 godnight yall
I'll just throw it out there that Zodiacs do have validity, within the bounds of social psychology, and self fulfilling prophecy. The stars don't make a person a Leo, society does.
true but i wouldn’t call that as validity, we can see how our made up culture and beliefs have forced us to not take responsibility for our actions and instead shift the blame on cosmic beings or stars in the sky. validity isn’t the right word, but do we see the consequences of peoples delusions and therefore creating false theories of life and it’s meanings? yes all the time, it’s why the world is stuck in its current funk and not able to actually progress forward because people are scared or not knowing that something is in control, when that’s the answer, it’s all chaos. people just don’t like that thought
@@josephstater200 As far as the stars making a person a Leo, there is no validity. As far as Leos becoming such through social pressures, there is validity in that. It's basic social psychology, and only involves the stars as far as people say they do.
@@josephstater200 Our “culture and beliefs” happen to be directly related to a whole chain of events starting with the very beginning of everything. They’re not just “made up” by a few people that decide. We happen to live in a time that places materialism above all else, and that stems from collective trauma. You do realize that people can use any means to avoid looking honestly at themselves? Astrology may be one of those many, but it’s also something that actually can help people take responsibility for their lives. Our current situation is way more complicated than what you perceive to be other people’s delusions. Everyone is afraid of the very same thing when it comes down to it, and a compassionate and curious approach is always more conducive to the “progress” you seek, rather than placing yourself above those who you consider to be less intelligent or aware. You know what happens with that approach, right? Astrology has lasted as long as it has precisely due its validity, and it grows and evolves just as we do. People can always misuse it and misunderstand it like they do anything else.
Astrology belongs to the occult which is a belief system and not science. If you believe in magic you might make something out of astrology in that respect.
@Matthew Young The information you received is false and actually doesn't debunk anything. The arrogance of you people is through the roof I hope whoever you try and reach knows exactly what I do and shows you why it's never a good idea to repeat information that you know nothing of.
@7:02 this explaner would be more helpful if it also explained the difference between the sidereal year - the basis for the zodiac, and the tropical year - represented by the Georgian calendar which was adopted so that christians could celebrate Easter in the same month and also have their holiday match up with the equinox. So, 440 years ago 'we' adopted the Gregorian calendar and we added some 10 days to account for the previous 1257 years of shift since the first council of Nicaea, when Easter was codified for Christianity. Because our switch to match our calendar with the tropical year was back dated to the year 325 we essentially started to count our years in tropical years 1697 years ago. We're currently off from the Julian calendar by about 13 days. You nailed it again, Dr Tyson. Hopefully this adds to it in order to help your viewers understand why there is a drift in the first place. Without the shift and adjustments by the adoption of the Gregorian calendar we might still be on the Julian calendar and would plant our gardens about 13 days earlier than we do, according to the calendar. You might think that a half a month is no big deal. My dad tried to convince his mom that she didn't need to follow the schedule in the Farmer's Almanac so rigidly and to prove his point he shifted his planting by about a half a month. She had an excellent yield and he had all but a crop failure. He learned. Our choice was to either have our calendar match up with the position of the stars with respect to the sun or to have it match with the seasons we experience. We chose to have a religious holiday match up with the equinox, and ended up with a calendar that stays consistent to our sessions.
Man I can’t believe the star talks I was searching about zodiac sign hour before, then hour later Neil explain about this what a great moment ❤️❤️❤️ this why I’m here!!
If you were searching for "your zodiac sign", you aren't practicing astrology, you're taking part in a massive pop-culture delusion that bears no resemblance to actual astrology.
I’ve been using this explanation for years when people try to talk to me about astrology. I’m like, you don’t even know your own Sign and you’re trying to tell me about how accurate your charts are? Please 🙄
Dear Dr. Tyson and Chuck I really enjoy your videos and very often I have learned things. The other night as I returned from walking the dog I told my wife that the collar untreated from the buckle. My wife was convinced it was something I done. I tried to convince her otherwise. Finally she said "that doesn't make sense to me." I hit her with "dog collars are not obligated to make sense to you." That ended the discussion.
Vedic astrology accounts for the precession and is SUPPOSE to have your accurate chart. So yes Aries are Pisces, Leo’s are cancers, Capricorn’s are Sagittarius, etc.
Just a follow on....i was on a panel for a discussion of Astrology vs science 30 years ago. I represented Science and another person who believed in astrology, and actually was well known in the astrology circle as he did the astrology signs for folks. He responded to my point that the constellations from 2000 years ago are not in the same position today. He said that is correct, but modern Astrologists does the precession conversion to account for precession. So whether you believe in Astrology not, at least your astrology reading if done by their "professionals" has the stars and planets in the correct location.
"yes, it tells me you participate in the mass cultural delusion that the sun's apparent position relative to arbitrarily defined constellations and the time of your birth somehow affects your personality." - Sheldon Cooper, 2007
It's not about the sun. (In fact, the sun is arguably the least relevant factor in a natal chart.) Anyone who tells you it is has no idea what they're talking about.
Sidereal astrology takes precession into account with ayanamsas. There's a lot more to astrology than tropical and sun sign astrology, which is all that most people are aware of.
This reminds me of a brilliant episode of the Orville where an entire civilisation was run based on assumed attributes linked to zodiac constellations.
Thanks for the video. I was actually going to ask you to address the wobble and pole star issue after watching the previous video on the north star. It felt incomplete without addressing the shift. I grew up a true and total science nerd with aspirations that i didnt follow through on. Your videos are great at reminding me/refreshing my ever graying matter of things i have forgotten and learning me on things i never totally grasped or knew. Ευχαριστώ πολύ
I also wish I'd followed through on science and math. I'm currently teaching myself pre-calc and trig-not sure why but I'm enjoying it so much more than when I was in high school. I taught myself to read Greek (phonetically only) and learned some phrases, so it was fun to see your words there. I forgot about "poli"! Does that mean "very" or "very much"?
I came across a book in the library that contains different information from what you are saying. The information I read is that there are 5 stars in 5 constellations that are considered “ Pole Stars. The first one is in Camelopardis, ( this was during the time that Abraham sent his servant to a certain place to fetch a bride for his son, Isaac. When they returned, Ruth was riding on a Camel.); the second Pole Star was in Thuban ( which is located above a mountain region in South America and part of it is also located above Great Britain. This was during the time that people believed in and told stories about Dragons.) this is in the constellation Draco; the next Pole Star is Vega in the constellation Lyre ( the Harp) which is located above Sacramento, California; our present day Pole Star is Polaris located in the constellation Ursa Minor . Our next Pole Star is supposed to be in the constellation Opheucous ( has a few meanings: “ My Fathers House”, “ The House”, “ Wolf” or “ the Shepherd “) , it resembles a house . The Pole Star is supposed to be located as a cornerstone of the house. To me, it appears as though there is a missing mail box near it. The location above Earth was not given .
Dear Dr. Neil deGrasse Tyson, I understand and appreciate your critical perspective on astrology, but I’d like to present a nuance regarding its origins, particularly through the lens of Vedic astrology. While I am a Scorpio according to Western astrology, Vedic astrology identifies me as a Libra. This discrepancy arises because Vedic astrology uses the sidereal zodiac, which aligns with the observable constellations rather than the tropical zodiac used in Western astrology. Furthermore, ancient Indian texts explicitly show that astronomy was the precursor to Vedic astrology. For instance, texts like the Vedanga Jyotisha highlight precise astronomical calculations that served both calendrical and observational purposes. Indian astronomical knowledge dates back to the Palaeolithic age, showcasing an advanced understanding of celestial patterns long before their adaptation for astrological interpretations. Although I acknowledge that astrology lacks empirical evidence as a predictive science, its roots in astronomy and its historical role in understanding the cosmos deserve a nuanced consideration.
Finally someone says it. I found this while looking in Stellarium a few years ago, that the stars aren't aligned where astrology states that they are. Two thousand years ago they indeed were, but now they're not. Basically the signs have shifted, but astrology didn't keep up. There's another thing though: what you see in the sky, isn't what's actually there. E.g., when you see Jupiter, what you're seeing is the light that's arriving here 45 minutes after it left there, so Jupiter's position is actually 45 minutes ahead of where you're seeing it. I doubt astrologers even know about this, let alone account for it in their readings. And -- I'm not too sure about this, but -- I suspect that when you apply that to all the planets to figure out their real positions, the differences in distances will result in a different alignment from what the astrologer is counting on. As in, if we see the planets in a straight line, their real positions won't make a straight line, making astrologers wrong even more.
I think the stars positions are so far away that their movement in the galaxy along with our own movement might be insignificant as far as astrology goes. Neil? Care to jump in?
Where the planets actually were when you were born is different from where they would have appeared to be looking at them from Earth. Astrology takes into account where they actually "were", not where you would have seen them. Just like an ephemeris that plots the position of the moon tells you where the moon was at a certain time, not where it appeared to be looking at it from Earth. I hope that makes sense.
I wish this video had been around 5 years ago when I was trying to explain this to my dad. He kept insisting that the earth wobbled back and forth every year and that’s what caused the seasons to change. I argued with him about it for at least 30 minutes and even drew up diagrams to show him why the seasons changed and told him that the earth’s wobble wasn’t enough to make the seasons change but he still didn’t believe me because he thought he knew better. Maybe he would have believed Neil.
Actually some years ago some branches of Astrology tried to update their constellations chart and added Ophiuchus and moved the dates to match the current sky, but nobody followed them so they shrugged it off and went back to the old system.
I recently learned about the Sidereal zodiac, and I think it accounts for the shift of the earth and the way the constellations have shifted since the zodiac signs were created. I don't know much about it though, so idk how it differs from what's mentioned here.
One thing that i really enjoyed as a teenager, was that i always had the best view of Orion and Sirius (brightest star). Absolutely the best view, as it rose above a local mountain. Imagine that back at that time, Stargate the movie was out... :D
Guys I really love this channel and I have learned so much from NDT and CHUCK. my only problem now is that I am looking at our schools teaching our kids all the wrong facts about many subjects Neil discussed on this channel. I think Principals, teachers, school board systems should be watching that channel and make appropriate changes to what our kids are learning. I honestly thought the North Star was the brightest of them all and learned from Neil that this thing is barely the 40th brightest star up there.
So apparently I’m freaking tf out!! I found out that my zodiac sign really changed! I googled it and my old to new sign is Cancer ♋️ (old) too Gemini ♊️ (new) this makes so much sense!! I haven’t felt the same at all!! My emotions and shyness have completely changed. And I notice I love to joke waaay more and act like a child in heart!! My home use to be my #1 comfort, now it isn’t anymore, I wanna be with people and places all the time! Oh my god oh my god!!!!
Fun fact: Astrology actually takes the tilt of the earth into account. The difference between tropical western astrology and vedic astrology is about 23.5 degrees.
Fun fact, if like me you're a Libra, the scales haven't always been a part of the zodiac, and depending on when and where you were when it was widely used, your constellation could be absorbed by either Virgo or Scorpio entirely
Which probably explains Libra's special status as the only Zodiac sign that's an inanimate object. All the others are, like, animals or people. But, yeah, being a later addition, that's why it doesn't quite match up with the others.
The "scales" of Libra are also the claws of the Scorpion. I believe the shift since the "signs" were conceived is roughly 14 degrees, so about half of the average 30 degrees allotted for each sign. Anyone who is in the latter half of their sign is probably now in the next sign, (such as he stated), a post Oct 8/9 Libra would now be more accurately a Scorpio, so it's a quick way to ballpark figure out your present day location, (astrologically).
@@TweetsIsBoss Happy belated birthday Rebekah, - Oct. 8, that would put you on the front cusp of Scorpio, just past Libra. (maybe, - I'm ballparking here) Because the actual span of elliptic that Scorpio occupies is only around 7 degrees, (out of the 30 degrees each sign is allotted, to make them all seem equal) My b-day would probably land me in Sagittarius (Oct.22), [although, under the system in use now, I'm on the Libra/Scorpio cusp].
As with the planets, the constellations were named after pieces of Greek mythology, and the Greeks needed to be a bit creative with their identifications. The stars and constellations helped many sailors navigate through unfamiliar waters long before radar was conceived. Other cultures also had their own conventions for naming the stars and constellations such as Vega (zhinü) the “weaver girl” prevalent in the Chinese Qixi myth
I’ve heard of this but I thought it was a result of the calendar shift like the Julian vs Gregorian calendars. They are now fourteen days apart but in another thousand years it will be one month off thus putting the sun in a different constellation in that month. I didn’t know wobble had anything to do it 🤔
Wait... this is news to people? I read a book 20 years ago that literally explained the shift of the night sky and that it's different locations of the zodiac constellations by about a full zodiac sign. I believe it was Sun Signs, by Linda Goodman... good book. Honest. And had some Astronomy accuracy in it as well. Cool.
That was my first book on Astrology. It was created by her and her husband. Lots of great information that, if read by these "debunkers" and "debunker believers", they might not shoot of their uneducated mouths so quickly.
Except, modern astrologers don’t use the same planetary positioning as 22000 years ago, nor have they used a 13month lunar calendar since sometime around the time that Rome created an annual solar calendar to track tax collections. Simple software tracks shifting star/planetary positions that even accounts for the shift in Aries some time I think in the 80s. The 13th sign, Ophiucus, the healer, was blended into Sagittarius because The centaur representing Sagittarius was dedicated to Chiron who the gods immortalized, mentored Ophiucus who was a legendary healer in Ancient Greece. The sign for Ophiucus is the twin serpents climbing a staff… the symbol used for modern physicians.
I love his analogy and thoughts and logic and smart and conversation of everything Neil deGrasse is my hero thank you for teaching and enlighten me in life sir
Brazilian amateur astronomer here, Chuck, my name is pronounced Alo(like in aloha)+Pex(like in tex with an open 'e'). Don't know if this will be commented on but this video got me thinking about the Crux Constelation, Since polaris is the closest star to the cardinal north it makes sense as a point of reference, here in the south hemisphere we can't see polaris but Crux is said to point to the south, if you get the long arm of the cross and extend 4,5x below the stars is said to be the south sky pole, the question if it is to be answered) is, there are other space objects that can be used in this kind of easy way to locate cardinal directions at night in the south other than Crux?
@@mavfan1 there are two Astrology Systems one is fixed and the other constantly changes they both describe Space and Time and this is the essence of Science...
Additionally, though I've no time for zodiac sign being a personality; I have always wondered if the time you were born effects a person. For example, a child born in the dark/cold of fall/winter and not going outside much for that time, socializing*... Versus a child born in spring that will take in the sights and sounds until winter occurs again.... Hmm
I’m an Ophiuchus, was a Sagittarius, and according to sidereal I’m a Scorpio, I decided that I embody all three zodiacs, now I just need to make a good depiction of a chimera to represent them combined.
Vedic Astrology or Jyotish (sidereal) has always maintained that Western/ Tropical Astrology is off by a whole sign (approx 30 degrees). Jyotish considers 27 Nakshatras or Fixed stars. Btw, Chuck would have his Sun in Gemini as per jyotish calculations.
If you consider this one scientific aspect for your astrology, then why is planet retrograde considered in the astrology if it is just simply an illusion and it is not really the planet moving backwards . ?
@@Gekko08, astrology has been reduced to mediocrity by and large and the way one interprets the phenomenon is paramount. I prefer addressing it as Jyotish (the study of light) because it seems to be the best description of the subject. Retrogrades are not to be interpreted as a stand alone phenomenon, rather depending upon its placement it denotes an aspect that requires retrospection and internal reflection. Jyotish also calculates nodes, Rahu and ketu which are non physical points in space that cause eclipses. Why are non physical objects included? Well, I can’t really answer that since I didn’t invent the subject but I believe it might have been because of observational cause and effect. The Vedas specifically say ‘Sarvam khalvidam brahma. Everything is a result of imagination”. “Brahma satyam, Jagam mithya. Imagination is real, Reality is an illusion”. Everything is an interpretation of something and it is up to the interpreter to choose what focus on to convey their perspective. Astrology is after all perspective.
So, my question would be, did the constellations create the signs (such as, us seeing a bull in the stars, making those people Taurus), or did the zodiac signs affect what we were looking for in the sky (such as Taurus-like people being born around this section, so we found star formation similar to a bull)? Because, the latter would mean the signs never changed. Zodiacs are supposed to be the sun, moon, and planets in regards to heavenly bodies, and us wobbling wouldn't necessarily mean the sun wobbles with us. I'll research it some more, but I sorta feel like this is just fodder for those who wanna implicate zodiacs signs to be undeniably wrong. I could care less about whether or not they are wrong...but I feel like maybe people like Neil are implying things about zodiac signs that 'astrologers' wouldn't agree with. Before dismissing it all, carefully read everything I said there. I'd love to know why the zodiac signs are what they are. History that far back can be.. shaky to say the least.
And...it's already 2:30 in the morning. I've spent way too long only figuring out we should be 2 sets to the west, not 1. Either science is wrong, and we are all repeating what we heard because we are too lazy to do the actual math, or I'm too tired and shouldn't be spending the wee hours trying to solve something that honestly won't matter. 🤣
Here is a fun fact for you to think about, Napoleon went into Egypt and removed a ceiling that contained the zodiac constellations it's now in France. So how did they know and name all the constellations if they didn't keep track thousands of years ago. Same with the Mayan calendar which ended just recently, I think it was accurate for over two thousand years. We are now in the Age of Aquarius so they knew a constellation change would take place. People are superstitious and in need of protectors and those who can bring us good fortune, and we tend to embellish the things that will help us through life. But the Truth of the matter is that we've been Studying Astrology and there's two types of Astrology one fixed and the other is progressive for thousands of years. One cycle is 25,000 years. So how many years before that did we know that these cycles existed..?
There are three zodiacs. Tropical (that astrology in the west uses), Sidereal (that Indian astrology uses, and accounts for precessional slippage), and the Galactic zodiac (the one that NASA uses) Ptolemy intentionally froze the SIGNS in helenistic astrology and reset Aries by 10° around the year 100 ad, proving that he knew about precessional slippage but that it was irrelevant to the hellenistic astrology system. Signs are named after constellations but they are not the same, and they're not supposed to be. Hellenistic tropical astrology uses planets but not really constellations, signs are more of a marker of seasonal times. Neil isn't quite getting it (and no I don't believe in astrology) Because the Babylonians in the Mul Apin chose constellations as SIGNS of seasonal markers everyone is confused now. Signs are not constellations they're just name after them in their old position when the Babylonians made the Mul Apin Cancer and Capricorn have liminal symbolism, they're both half water/half land creatures
I suspect that also means that via precession, the seasons will flip flop over the 26000 year cycle. For example, in the northern hemisphere, it changing from hot to clld (fall), but in 13000 years this time frame would be turning from cold to hot (spring).
Not to mention obliquity and Eleccentrcity that make up the milankovitch cycles. Together these cycles actually are a big reason why Earth’s climate goes through glacial-interglacial cycles during an overall ice age. Although the milankovitch forcings alone aren’t enough to cause earth to transition from glacial to interglacial or vise versia so it’s amplified by changes in atmospheric carbon dioxide, a greenhouse gas. Thought that was pretty interesting as well. Because of this also because obilquity making the tilt more extreme (typically going from around 22 degrees to 24 degrees every 40ish thousand years) in the near future, northern hemisphere summers could become far hotter and winters far colder due to a more extreme precession and obliquity phase.
Indian brahmin here. Vedic or not, astrology is not true. I wish more people in my country pick up science. Because astrology is not just a harmless thing here. Your zodiac sign (and other terms in Rashi system) is a factor of marriage in many traditional families. This often invokes scrutiny, prohibition to marriage, or settling for some partner only because your sign matches theirs. This is a very backward system that has become a tool of oppression arisen from something that actually used to be about science. The Indian brahmins were the first pioneers of mathematics. All our ideas were carried to Europe through the Arabs. That being said, I have no attachment nor belief to my caste or in my religion. I just used it assert that despite growing in a religious environment, reading all the holy books, praying, it's possible to learn reasoning at the end of the day.
Here's the the. Tyson might be correct. And even I defended his assertion having invested the time into studying the ancient arts. I'm not a physicist. Without such spiritual knowledge and only relying on science, life gets bland if you're not a physicist. Continuing such spiritual study and practice : If it's not real, it won't hurt anybody and we all waste our time. If it is real, and Darth Vader isn't your diety, perhaps we can help humanity. I don't know about everyone else, but I prefer a more colorful life than a bland ones and zeros.
It is the reason zodiacs on eastern culture are actually Moon signs, rather than the sun signs. The precession was known millennias ago!! And the correct astrology was built over it.
@@puneet2487 There is zero evidence that any of it is correct. It blows my mind that people still believe in astrology. It's even more ridiculous than believing in a flat earth.
Okay, but I think you guys missed the mark just a bit, because when finding out your zodiac, you usually go to some website or book or whatever that tells you what the zodiac position was at the time of your birth. Of course it’ll move over time but that doesn’t mean that it wasn’t where it was at that point in time.
@@scotth5114 the Mayan calendar ended in the Age of Aquarius how did they know that a constellation change would take place. It takes over twenty five thousand years to complete a cycle. Something to think about...
@@steve-o6413 Well, from what I have been reading about the calendar, the cycle was supposed to end 2012(thus all the doomsday talk). Also that cycle is kinda like how we use 'centuries' to indicate a passage of time. And I see it just like how we might get a new calendar each year (end of the calendar) they were doing the same with theirs, it just had different stopping points.
@@steve-o6413 Yup, I sure did miss that point. You went from saying they figured things out with observation, to they "experienced" it. I never would have guessed that the mayan civilization was around 25,000 years ago. You need to bring your data that demonstrates this forward to archaeologists and earn a noble prize.
So they based their zodiac on what would be 2500 years in the future? LOL It amazes me how people will lie to themselves to justify the nonsense they believe in.
@@davidlondon9242 by „current zodiac“ i meant the actual zodiac- the signs, the symbols, the houses. Learn to read properly before you come at people, goof.
@@tritone11 that's a point so obvious that it doesn't need to be made. That's like saying the amazing thing about Roman numerals is that our roman numeral are the same as the ones from back then. The goof is always in your reflection.
'The North 🌟 Star is a concept' - Neil deGrasse Tyson. I truly love that and I encourage you to do or review on this topic. I mean on the rotten basis of Astrology in an extended version easy-to-grasp for beginners or _legos_ in these matters (Astrology and Astronomy as well). Thank You Tyson. 🙏
I love Dr. Tyson. He could explain scientific things so well. Easy to understand. What if the earth was perfect sphere before and got hit as a result lost its perfect shape and the time it takes to go around the sun has changed because of the impact? So every 26 thousand years the brightest star changes? That’s one of the coolest things I’ve heard about the North Star! I love you Dr. Tyson!
No, every 26.000 years the whole cicle is completed. It started with Vega around 12.000 B.C. as the North Star. -Around 4500 B.C. Thuban was the North Star. - Around 1000 B.C. Polaris became the North Star. - Around 4500 A.D. Cephei becomes the new North Star - And Around 14.000 A.D. Vega is the North Star again and the circle starts over. During these 26.000 years we have different stars in the Northern Sky. It is an optical illusion that we have the same North Star that shines forever in the North.
First, Earth never was a perfect sphere. Nothing natural is perfect, and even nothing man-made is perfect, but our stuff usually gets much closer to perfection than natural one. Second, the Earth did get hit (probably), and that's how we got Moon. Third, how does the Earth orbiting around Sun matters here? Eath makes a more or less full ellipse in roughly 1 year, 26k years takes to rotate its tilted axle 1 full circle. Those two numbers are basically unrelated, as far as I understand. Fourth, Earth's shape too has pretty much nothing to do with orbiting around the Sun. Tidal forses do create some distortion, but they didn't appear suddenly, there wasn't any perfect shape before. Fifth, the britest non-Sun star in the sky is not Polaris (ahaha, just like ATV brand). Pilaris just happens to be near the center of stars's apparent rotation in the sky.
The Earth tilts 23.5 degrees from "vertical" (23.5 degrees from perpendicular to the plane of the Earth's orbit around the Sun). So where the poles point in the sky varies 57 degrees from one precession extreme to the next, 13,000 years apart. This is a pretty radical tilt.
I’m not defending astrology as a accurate predictive methodology. I do, however, want to point out that astrologers have been aware of zodiacal precession for a very long time. This is the difference between the sidereal and tropical zodiacs. So, in that sense, this isn’t something new to astrologers.
At about 4m mark that is very true. There is a chamber in the Pyramid of Giza that modern archeologists think was used to study the night sky. it doesn't point to anything now (because time and the movement of stars has changed), but 2200 years ago when it was constructed it pointed at various stars (Orion's Belt and Sirius to name 2).
I’ve been thinking about this since I watched this earlier. The logic of this helps me in my line of work in the tech business. I would enjoy seeing a scaled model of the earth rotating on its axis, in this precession that I didn’t know about. In the diameter of this precession, how much space is this covering? Is the sun in its’ own precession? I guess I could look it up, but ultimately, I’d love to see a scale model of this.
I love the idea. And the scale model should be sped up by a couple of thousand times so we could have a visible change in relation to the position of the stars. But i think some observatory might already have that in a fancy way. Scale model is still cooler i think.
I was dog sitting for my sister at her house the other day and looked on her UA-cam playlist and there were about 55,000 things on astrology. Now All need to do is send her one UA-cam video to really send her in a tizzy.
Precession of the Equinoxes is not a new thing to astrologers. In western astrology, Aries begins at vernal equinox, regardless of where the sun is on the zodiac band of constellations due to said precession. In other words, if a baby is born on the day of vernal equinox, then his sun is in the sign of Aries, even if the sun is in the constellation of Pisces.
That was wild! I stopped believing in the Zodiac a long time ago (although I did, to some extent, when I was young) but hearing this makes believing in it hilarious. 🤣 I know people who live by it.. It's actually not funny when I think about it, especially because it makes you make decisions based on it...
Stopped believing in the zodiac? 😂 the zodiac is real, astrology is not. There are three zodiacs. Tropical (that astrology in the west uses), Sidereal (that Indian astrology uses, and accounts for precessional slippage), and the Galactic zodiac (the one that NASA uses)
@@whatabouttheearth Hmm, didn't know that. I thought the zodiac was an invention of astrology. What would the zodiacal signs be if not precisely what astrology makes them out to be. Also the other zodiacs you mentioned, aren't they the same thing but by dufferent cultures? In any way, I'd have to read a bit more. ✌
@@whatabouttheearth Yep. "Zodiac is an element of astrology." It may be a mapping of the sky, which by itself is an actual thing, but as Neil said the constellations move, so the predictions based on that map are nonsense. Zodiac, horoscopes, etc. are based on the same principle.
@@dzzzzzt What? Western astrology, aka the tropical hellinistic does not actually use constellations!!!!! The signs are named after the constellations but they're not the same thing, they are seasonal markers. Ptolemy and the majority of western astrology froze and reset the zodiac locking it into place to account for and offset the need to account for precessional slippage.
@@whatabouttheearth Hmmm. So you are saying that what NDT said was wrong? I knew astrology/horoscope/zodiac from a friend and from ... well, using it, reading, even believing, but I'm not knowledgable about its origins, logic, etc. So I cannot go in further than that. For now I'm willing to believe him and maybe some day I'll read more just to understand it better.
When I took astronomy in high school, my teacher would classify the constellations by how many cups of wine the ancients must have drunk before the group of stars actually looked like the thing they were supposed to represent. IIRC Cancer was a five cupper.
Triangulum being a tee totaller
@@jorgepeterbarton Orion too. You can't not see a man
I'm stealing that
😄
@@chertfoot1500 that is why those ancient sky maps had a man painted there, in case you missed it.
Personality since I read the Maya's saw Orion's Belt as three stones on the back of a turtle I see it as a turtle.
Neil might not know this, but the ancient Celts had a Lunar Zodiac which was divided into THIRTEEN sections and each section had a specific tree or important plant associated with it as follows:
Birch, BETH, 24/12-20/01
Rowan, LUIS, 21/01-17/02
Ash, NION, 18/02-17/03
Alder, FEARN, 18/03-14/04
Willow, SAILLE, 15/04-12/05
Hawthorn, UATH, 13/05--09/06
Oak, DUIR, 10/06-07/07
Holly, TINNE, 08/07-04/08
Hazel, COLL, 05/08-01/09
Vine, MUIN, 02/09-29/09
Ivy, GORT, 30/09-27/10
Reed, NGETAL, 28/10-24/11
Elder, RUIS, 25/11-23/12
Each section also had its own archetypal character/god and symbol.
I hope you found this interesting.
That knowledge is very ancient, same as mine in BIAFRA we have thirteen months and there are plants to know this changes without looking at the sky daily
First he killed Pluto. Now he's gunning for Polaris. Neil: cosmic assassin.
He reflects the truth.
Neil Vader
No he’s butchering the zodiac believers
Nature will plan the eventual funeral, depending on Polaris’ birth and life. Pluto still lives and evolves. It just does it on a smaller scale than we led ourselves to expect size-wise. Think of it as a kind of dwarf or elf but, otherwise, like other planets in its continuing existence.
@@suzannebrown2505 "There is no spoon."
I like how Chuck makes Neil laugh , while Neil helps us understand that we NEVER, stop learning 😀
My wife is going to be upset about her Aries tattoo when I tell her she’s a modern day Pisces.
🤣👍🏼🔆
Im pieces now?!😭😭😭
@@roycarlson0517 no dont cry astrology is so much more, go calculate your navamsa chart online, truly that is the fruit of your tree (zodiac) never say you are One thing, astrology is so much more ❤️🔆🤗 godnight yall
@@Kani_Modaressi Astrology is nothing more than a silly pseudoscience attempt at understanding human behavior.
@@bastmode882 oh okey 👌🏽
This was such a minblown to me. Not the astronomy, I just can't stop thinking of Neil deGrasse Tyson listening Menudo.
It wouldn’t surprise me. He is Puerto Rican from his mother side. 😂😂😂 so I am pretty sure she might had some cassette of menudo 😂
Same here haha
Astrology not astronomy
@@keepgoing1973 he's talking about both...
@@beargillium2369 yeah.
I just got excited to get an argument about the difference.
I've never believed in silly things like astrology. Probably because I'm an Aquarius.
That’s a good bit
"I don’t believe in astrology; I’m a Sagittarius and we’re skeptical." - Arthur C. Clarke
You mean you as Auarius 2000 or so years ago
me too lol hhahahaha but i didn't have any scientific explanation for my friend
and now hhahahah I will show no mercy on the
Me too! 🤣
Thanks
"The North Star is a fraud!"
"Now, lemme say a few words about zodiacs..."
r/Constellations
🤣🤣🤣
I'll just throw it out there that Zodiacs do have validity, within the bounds of social psychology, and self fulfilling prophecy. The stars don't make a person a Leo, society does.
That's absolutely true. It's people's desire to avoid being responsible and adults, and shifting blame on their actions to the divine/cosmic.
true but i wouldn’t call that as validity, we can see how our made up culture and beliefs have forced us to not take responsibility for our actions and instead shift the blame on cosmic beings or stars in the sky. validity isn’t the right word, but do we see the consequences of peoples delusions and therefore creating false theories of life and it’s meanings? yes all the time, it’s why the world is stuck in its current funk and not able to actually progress forward because people are scared or not knowing that something is in control, when that’s the answer, it’s all chaos. people just don’t like that thought
@@josephstater200 As far as the stars making a person a Leo, there is no validity. As far as Leos becoming such through social pressures, there is validity in that. It's basic social psychology, and only involves the stars as far as people say they do.
@@josephstater200 Our “culture and beliefs” happen to be directly related to a whole chain of events starting with the very beginning of everything. They’re not just “made up” by a few people that decide. We happen to live in a time that places materialism above all else, and that stems from collective trauma. You do realize that people can use any means to avoid looking honestly at themselves? Astrology may be one of those many, but it’s also something that actually can help people take responsibility for their lives. Our current situation is way more complicated than what you perceive to be other people’s delusions. Everyone is afraid of the very same thing when it comes down to it, and a compassionate and curious approach is always more conducive to the “progress” you seek, rather than placing yourself above those who you consider to be less intelligent or aware. You know what happens with that approach, right? Astrology has lasted as long as it has precisely due its validity, and it grows and evolves just as we do. People can always misuse it and misunderstand it like they do anything else.
Astrology belongs to the occult which is a belief system and not science. If you believe in magic you might make something out of astrology in that respect.
Having a zodiac sign is not a personality, and Neil just gave me information ammo 🤣
Yessir dumb chicks gonna rethink life
It's amazing how far some people have to reach to find their personality... sometimes all the way to the stars.
"They'll pay to know what they REALLY believe in" - J.R. "Bob" Dobbs
@Matthew Young
The information you received is false and actually doesn't debunk anything. The arrogance of you people is through the roof I hope whoever you try and reach knows exactly what I do and shows you why it's never a good idea to repeat information that you know nothing of.
@@vssss9018 I'll bite.... how is the information wrong?
If every teacher made science this funny, we would all be scientists. Great lesson, teacher.
Fun + Knowledge = what else could we ask for!? Thank you so much !!
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Olga Q: Fun and Knowledge! What else does one want?
@7:02 this explaner would be more helpful if it also explained the difference between the sidereal year - the basis for the zodiac, and the tropical year - represented by the Georgian calendar which was adopted so that christians could celebrate Easter in the same month and also have their holiday match up with the equinox. So, 440 years ago 'we' adopted the Gregorian calendar and we added some 10 days to account for the previous 1257 years of shift since the first council of Nicaea, when Easter was codified for Christianity. Because our switch to match our calendar with the tropical year was back dated to the year 325 we essentially started to count our years in tropical years 1697 years ago. We're currently off from the Julian calendar by about 13 days.
You nailed it again, Dr Tyson.
Hopefully this adds to it in order to help your viewers understand why there is a drift in the first place. Without the shift and adjustments by the adoption of the Gregorian calendar we might still be on the Julian calendar and would plant our gardens about 13 days earlier than we do, according to the calendar. You might think that a half a month is no big deal. My dad tried to convince his mom that she didn't need to follow the schedule in the Farmer's Almanac so rigidly and to prove his point he shifted his planting by about a half a month. She had an excellent yield and he had all but a crop failure. He learned.
Our choice was to either have our calendar match up with the position of the stars with respect to the sun or to have it match with the seasons we experience. We chose to have a religious holiday match up with the equinox, and ended up with a calendar that stays consistent to our sessions.
Love this channel! Learn so much from NDT and Chuck is just pure brilliant.
Agreee! I love Chuck and neil 💖
He’s so interested in learning and having a real education session with NDT and I love it
you think this is a good one, you should check neil on the joe rogan podcast....that was really something!!!
NDT sounds like a drug
Lee: Agree!
This is what I seek in UA-cam content. These guys are pure gold 🤗
Man I can’t believe the star talks
I was searching about zodiac sign hour before, then hour later Neil explain about this what a great moment ❤️❤️❤️ this why I’m here!!
UA-cam?
UA-cam?
If you were searching for "your zodiac sign", you aren't practicing astrology, you're taking part in a massive pop-culture delusion that bears no resemblance to actual astrology.
I wish Neil would explain the Q'non movement
I’ve been using this explanation for years when people try to talk to me about astrology. I’m like, you don’t even know your own Sign and you’re trying to tell me about how accurate your charts are? Please 🙄
If someone asks me what my sign I ask them if they deduce what it is based on what they know about me.
With different calenders,its hard to be accurate.
Vedic astrology
My sign is STOP.
Well you can actually calculate which constellation the sun was in when you were born.
Dear Dr. Tyson and Chuck I really enjoy your videos and very often I have learned things. The other night as I returned from walking the dog I told my wife that the collar untreated from the buckle. My wife was convinced it was something I done. I tried to convince her otherwise. Finally she said "that doesn't make sense to me." I hit her with "dog collars are not obligated to make sense to you." That ended the discussion.
Vedic astrology accounts for the precession and is SUPPOSE to have your accurate chart. So yes Aries are Pisces, Leo’s are cancers, Capricorn’s are Sagittarius, etc.
Just a follow on....i was on a panel for a discussion of Astrology vs science 30 years ago. I represented Science and another person who believed in astrology, and actually was well known in the astrology circle as he did the astrology signs for folks. He responded to my point that the constellations from 2000 years ago are not in the same position today. He said that is correct, but modern Astrologists does the precession conversion to account for precession. So whether you believe in Astrology not, at least your astrology reading if done by their "professionals" has the stars and planets in the correct location.
Two of the most intelligent and articulate gents on UA-cam.
Your math is off by one ☝️
@@lionman8523 agreed.
@@lionman8523 don't do my boy like that. he's learning
@@Redoer the fbi even got chuck's back 🤯🤯🤯
@@Redoer Um, I know this is a joke account, but you're subscribed to the most random same channels as me. The Kyogre channel. O.o
"yes, it tells me you participate in the mass cultural delusion that the sun's apparent position relative to arbitrarily defined constellations and the time of your birth somehow affects your personality." - Sheldon Cooper, 2007
TBBT reference! YAY!!!
lets go brandon!!!
It's not about the sun. (In fact, the sun is arguably the least relevant factor in a natal chart.) Anyone who tells you it is has no idea what they're talking about.
@@SilverSentinel you missed the point
This.
My sign is Do Not Disturb. And it's never wrong...
You gave me an idea for a t-shirt! 😀
@@MrLawskinner sounds like a astronomically great idea. As an Aries, I'm interested how your tee turns out. Let me know. Cheers!
I feel this.
Ok boomer
Still laughed tho
Sidereal astrology takes precession into account with ayanamsas. There's a lot more to astrology than tropical and sun sign astrology, which is all that most people are aware of.
Shh they hate talking about sidereal. 😅 people are attached to their tropical signs in a unhealthy way.
Exactly
Do you think that allowing for procession somehow validates astrology or any kind?
I hope thats not what you're suggesting...
@@AussieNaturalist that is illogical.
@@singlesideman
I’m glad you agree, so what are you trying to say when you said that there’s more to astrology than most people are aware of... etc?
In the fashion of the stars in Hollywood someday we will be calling Polaris " The Star Formerly Known As The North Star".
Another star bites the dust due to cancel culture BWA!
I agree with you 100% I’ve studied this before. The night skies definitely change over thousands of years.
This reminds me of a brilliant episode of the Orville where an entire civilisation was run based on assumed attributes linked to zodiac constellations.
This was such a fun episode! Sometimes Chuck will stretch a joke a little too long but everything landed perfectly this time
Man I love what they do.. I wanna be another guest when Neil does his talks.
I wanna do what chuck does... I'd love to just talk to Neil.. forever
Foreva eva?
I love the dynamic between these two so much.
Thanks for the video. I was actually going to ask you to address the wobble and pole star issue after watching the previous video on the north star. It felt incomplete without addressing the shift. I grew up a true and total science nerd with aspirations that i didnt follow through on. Your videos are great at reminding me/refreshing my ever graying matter of things i have forgotten and learning me on things i never totally grasped or knew. Ευχαριστώ πολύ
I also wish I'd followed through on science and math. I'm currently teaching myself pre-calc and trig-not sure why but I'm enjoying it so much more than when I was in high school. I taught myself to read Greek (phonetically only) and learned some phrases, so it was fun to see your words there. I forgot about "poli"! Does that mean "very" or "very much"?
I came across a book in the library that contains different information from what you are saying. The information I read is that there are 5 stars in 5 constellations that are considered “ Pole Stars. The first one is in Camelopardis, ( this was during the time that Abraham sent his servant to a certain place to fetch a bride for his son, Isaac. When they returned, Ruth was riding on a Camel.); the second Pole Star was in Thuban ( which is located above a mountain region in South America and part of it is also located above Great Britain. This was during the time that people believed in and told stories about Dragons.) this is in the constellation Draco; the next Pole Star is Vega in the constellation Lyre ( the Harp) which is located above Sacramento, California; our present day Pole Star is Polaris located in the constellation Ursa Minor . Our next Pole Star is supposed to be in the constellation Opheucous ( has a few meanings: “ My Fathers House”, “ The House”, “ Wolf” or “ the Shepherd “) , it resembles a house . The Pole Star is supposed to be located as a cornerstone of the house. To me, it appears as though there is a missing mail box near it. The location above Earth was not given .
"I didn't know you were fluent in this" 😂😂😂😂
Fun fact: Polestar, the offshoot performance brand of Volvo Cars, is named after the pole star. It’s emblem is also that of the pole star
Signs, signs, everywhere a Sign, do this, don't do that, can't you read the Sign...
‘What we’re you smoking to call that constellation a crab?!’ Couldn’t have laughed harder with this!!! 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Dear Dr. Neil deGrasse Tyson,
I understand and appreciate your critical perspective on astrology, but I’d like to present a nuance regarding its origins, particularly through the lens of Vedic astrology.
While I am a Scorpio according to Western astrology, Vedic astrology identifies me as a Libra. This discrepancy arises because Vedic astrology uses the sidereal zodiac, which aligns with the observable constellations rather than the tropical zodiac used in Western astrology.
Furthermore, ancient Indian texts explicitly show that astronomy was the precursor to Vedic astrology. For instance, texts like the Vedanga Jyotisha highlight precise astronomical calculations that served both calendrical and observational purposes. Indian astronomical knowledge dates back to the Palaeolithic age, showcasing an advanced understanding of celestial patterns long before their adaptation for astrological interpretations.
Although I acknowledge that astrology lacks empirical evidence as a predictive science, its roots in astronomy and its historical role in understanding the cosmos deserve a nuanced consideration.
Finally someone says it. I found this while looking in Stellarium a few years ago, that the stars aren't aligned where astrology states that they are. Two thousand years ago they indeed were, but now they're not. Basically the signs have shifted, but astrology didn't keep up.
There's another thing though: what you see in the sky, isn't what's actually there. E.g., when you see Jupiter, what you're seeing is the light that's arriving here 45 minutes after it left there, so Jupiter's position is actually 45 minutes ahead of where you're seeing it. I doubt astrologers even know about this, let alone account for it in their readings.
And -- I'm not too sure about this, but -- I suspect that when you apply that to all the planets to figure out their real positions, the differences in distances will result in a different alignment from what the astrologer is counting on. As in, if we see the planets in a straight line, their real positions won't make a straight line, making astrologers wrong even more.
Nah wrong try again tho
@@misterbaker477 WHAT?
I think the stars positions are so far away that their movement in the galaxy along with our own movement might be insignificant as far as astrology goes. Neil? Care to jump in?
Which is why you're probably a Capricorn, Virgo or a Scorpio...loll..nah jk...are you though ? loll
Where the planets actually were when you were born is different from where they would have appeared to be looking at them from Earth. Astrology takes into account where they actually "were", not where you would have seen them. Just like an ephemeris that plots the position of the moon tells you where the moon was at a certain time, not where it appeared to be looking at it from Earth. I hope that makes sense.
I wish this video had been around 5 years ago when I was trying to explain this to my dad. He kept insisting that the earth wobbled back and forth every year and that’s what caused the seasons to change. I argued with him about it for at least 30 minutes and even drew up diagrams to show him why the seasons changed and told him that the earth’s wobble wasn’t enough to make the seasons change but he still didn’t believe me because he thought he knew better. Maybe he would have believed Neil.
Actually some years ago some branches of Astrology tried to update their constellations chart and added Ophiuchus and moved the dates to match the current sky, but nobody followed them so they shrugged it off and went back to the old system.
I remember that.
Vedic astrology has always included precession
@@KusanagiMotoko100 please see my comments in this thread for why Ophiuchus should not be included in the Zodiac.
@@ChaosTheoryAstrology do you really think I'm going to look around for your comments...?
@ they are recent.
I recently learned about the Sidereal zodiac, and I think it accounts for the shift of the earth and the way the constellations have shifted since the zodiac signs were created. I don't know much about it though, so idk how it differs from what's mentioned here.
One thing that i really enjoyed as a teenager, was that i always had the best view of Orion and Sirius (brightest star). Absolutely the best view, as it rose above a local mountain. Imagine that back at that time, Stargate the movie was out... :D
Neil’s not getting an invitation to the astrologers conference any time soon! LOL
Guys I really love this channel and I have learned so much from NDT and CHUCK. my only problem now is that I am looking at our schools teaching our kids all the wrong facts about many subjects Neil discussed on this channel. I think Principals, teachers, school board systems should be watching that channel and make appropriate changes to what our kids are learning. I honestly thought the North Star was the brightest of them all and learned from Neil that this thing is barely the 40th brightest star up there.
So apparently I’m freaking tf out!! I found out that my zodiac sign really changed! I googled it and my old to new sign is Cancer ♋️ (old) too Gemini ♊️ (new) this makes so much sense!! I haven’t felt the same at all!! My emotions and shyness have completely changed. And I notice I love to joke waaay more and act like a child in heart!! My home use to be my #1 comfort, now it isn’t anymore, I wanna be with people and places all the time! Oh my god oh my god!!!!
Placebo
I always learn something new watching your show. Thank you Sir!
Fun fact: Astrology actually takes the tilt of the earth into account. The difference between tropical western astrology and vedic astrology is about 23.5 degrees.
Fun fact, if like me you're a Libra, the scales haven't always been a part of the zodiac, and depending on when and where you were when it was widely used, your constellation could be absorbed by either Virgo or Scorpio entirely
Which probably explains Libra's special status as the only Zodiac sign that's an inanimate object. All the others are, like, animals or people.
But, yeah, being a later addition, that's why it doesn't quite match up with the others.
not to mention that Virgo is like 3 times larger than libra, if you look at how much time the sun spends there
The "scales" of Libra are also the claws of the Scorpion.
I believe the shift since the "signs" were conceived is roughly 14 degrees, so about half of the average 30 degrees allotted for each sign.
Anyone who is in the latter half of their sign is probably now in the next sign, (such as he stated), a post Oct 8/9 Libra would now be more accurately a Scorpio, so it's a quick way to ballpark figure out your present day location, (astrologically).
@@barrykaine6526 my birthday is oct 8!
@@TweetsIsBoss Happy belated birthday Rebekah, - Oct. 8, that would put you on the front cusp of Scorpio, just past Libra. (maybe, - I'm ballparking here) Because the actual span of elliptic that Scorpio occupies is only around 7 degrees, (out of the 30 degrees each sign is allotted, to make them all seem equal)
My b-day would probably land me in Sagittarius (Oct.22), [although, under the system in use now, I'm on the Libra/Scorpio cusp].
Chuck just makes StarTalk even better
Now I think Chuck should go for exams he can be an astrophysicist too 😀. NDT always brings something new to the table. Thanks!
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As with the planets, the constellations were named after pieces of Greek mythology, and the Greeks needed to be a bit creative with their identifications. The stars and constellations helped many sailors navigate through unfamiliar waters long before radar was conceived. Other cultures also had their own conventions for naming the stars and constellations such as Vega (zhinü) the “weaver girl” prevalent in the Chinese Qixi myth
I’ve heard of this but I thought it was a result of the calendar shift like the Julian vs Gregorian calendars. They are now fourteen days apart but in another thousand years it will be one month off thus putting the sun in a different constellation in that month. I didn’t know wobble had anything to do it 🤔
you got me at Menudo. Mom loved that band back in the 80s-90s
3:02
Wouldn't the diameter of the circle traced by the Earth's axis in the sky be 47 degrees and not 23.5 degrees?
No
It is (Tan 23.5 * earth radius )
Because, Tan theta = opposite/adjacent
Neil definitely had a glass of wine and jumped on startalk🤦🏾♂️🤘🏾 Genius
Wait... this is news to people? I read a book 20 years ago that literally explained the shift of the night sky and that it's different locations of the zodiac constellations by about a full zodiac sign. I believe it was Sun Signs, by Linda Goodman... good book. Honest. And had some Astronomy accuracy in it as well. Cool.
Yes Linda Goodman mentioned it
The problem is that ppl don't read anymore!🤷♂️
That was my first book on Astrology. It was created by her and her husband. Lots of great information that, if read by these "debunkers" and "debunker believers", they might not shoot of their uneducated mouths so quickly.
Thanks u for the name of book ❤️
Except, modern astrologers don’t use the same planetary positioning as 22000 years ago, nor have they used a 13month lunar calendar since sometime around the time that Rome created an annual solar calendar to track tax collections. Simple software tracks shifting star/planetary positions that even accounts for the shift in Aries some time I think in the 80s.
The 13th sign, Ophiucus, the healer, was blended into Sagittarius because The centaur representing Sagittarius was dedicated to Chiron who the gods immortalized, mentored Ophiucus who was a legendary healer in Ancient Greece. The sign for Ophiucus is the twin serpents climbing a staff… the symbol used for modern physicians.
damn this time ndt made the best joke lol "what were they smoking to see a crab and claws in 5 stars" lol
I only clicked to see if I was still a Gemini. Now I'm arguing with myself
I love his analogy and thoughts and logic and smart and conversation of everything Neil deGrasse is my hero thank you for teaching and enlighten me in life sir
Brazilian amateur astronomer here,
Chuck, my name is pronounced Alo(like in aloha)+Pex(like in tex with an open 'e').
Don't know if this will be commented on but this video got me thinking about the Crux Constelation, Since polaris is the closest star to the cardinal north it makes sense as a point of reference, here in the south hemisphere we can't see polaris but Crux is said to point to the south, if you get the long arm of the cross and extend 4,5x below the stars is said to be the south sky pole, the question if it is to be answered) is, there are other space objects that can be used in this kind of easy way to locate cardinal directions at night in the south other than Crux?
Latinamerican fans got your Menudo reference Chuck, and I'm in my thirties :D
I'm 24 and I still got it! XD
heck yeah, 32 here. I got that Chuck.
Vedic astrology with sideral north takes that into account..
11 astrologist disliked this video. But how did they not see this coming. 😂
You are great guys... Both educating and entertaining.
You guys should look at Vedic astrology. It’s based on the moon instead of the sun. Pretty interesting
And also complete nonsense.
@@mavfan1 there are two Astrology Systems one is fixed and the other constantly changes they both describe Space and Time and this is the essence of Science...
@@mavfan1 I didn’t say it was accurate, just interesting.
Love from morocco mr niel ❤️❤️❤️
Additionally, though I've no time for zodiac sign being a personality; I have always wondered if the time you were born effects a person. For example, a child born in the dark/cold of fall/winter and not going outside much for that time, socializing*... Versus a child born in spring that will take in the sights and sounds until winter occurs again.... Hmm
I was born in the summer and I hate leaving the house.
The being born in a period is probably too short a period to affect you in any way that other periods of seasons wouldn't.
I’m an Ophiuchus, was a Sagittarius, and according to sidereal I’m a Scorpio, I decided that I embody all three zodiacs, now I just need to make a good depiction of a chimera to represent them combined.
Vedic Astrology or Jyotish (sidereal) has always maintained that Western/ Tropical Astrology is off by a whole sign (approx 30 degrees). Jyotish considers 27 Nakshatras or Fixed stars. Btw, Chuck would have his Sun in Gemini as per jyotish calculations.
Represent.
Bruh astrology is PSEUDOSCIENCE
If you consider this one scientific aspect for your astrology, then why is planet retrograde considered in the astrology if it is just simply an illusion and it is not really the planet moving backwards . ?
@@Gekko08, astrology has been reduced to mediocrity by and large and the way one interprets the phenomenon is paramount. I prefer addressing it as Jyotish (the study of light) because it seems to be the best description of the subject. Retrogrades are not to be interpreted as a stand alone phenomenon, rather depending upon its placement it denotes an aspect that requires retrospection and internal reflection. Jyotish also calculates nodes, Rahu and ketu which are non physical points in space that cause eclipses. Why are non physical objects included? Well, I can’t really answer that since I didn’t invent the subject but I believe it might have been because of observational cause and effect. The Vedas specifically say ‘Sarvam khalvidam brahma. Everything is a result of imagination”. “Brahma satyam, Jagam mithya. Imagination is real, Reality is an illusion”. Everything is an interpretation of something and it is up to the interpreter to choose what focus on to convey their perspective. Astrology is after all perspective.
I got the ref. about the Menudos haha. TKS for all the info!! Always AMAZING!
It’s a great time to be alive right now! Thank you gentlemen for all the enlightenment you share!
Love the Menudo comparison 😄
"This is the Dawning of the Age of Ophiuchus" doesn't have the same ring.
😂😂😂😂
I'm proud of myself because I understood the Menudo reference right away, and I was born in the 90s! :P
So, my question would be, did the constellations create the signs (such as, us seeing a bull in the stars, making those people Taurus), or did the zodiac signs affect what we were looking for in the sky (such as Taurus-like people being born around this section, so we found star formation similar to a bull)?
Because, the latter would mean the signs never changed. Zodiacs are supposed to be the sun, moon, and planets in regards to heavenly bodies, and us wobbling wouldn't necessarily mean the sun wobbles with us.
I'll research it some more, but I sorta feel like this is just fodder for those who wanna implicate zodiacs signs to be undeniably wrong.
I could care less about whether or not they are wrong...but I feel like maybe people like Neil are implying things about zodiac signs that 'astrologers' wouldn't agree with.
Before dismissing it all, carefully read everything I said there. I'd love to know why the zodiac signs are what they are. History that far back can be.. shaky to say the least.
Here's what I have so far:
A UA-cam video with the precession of earth shown graphically.
ua-cam.com/video/qlVgEoZDjok/v-deo.html
And...it's already 2:30 in the morning. I've spent way too long only figuring out we should be 2 sets to the west, not 1. Either science is wrong, and we are all repeating what we heard because we are too lazy to do the actual math, or I'm too tired and shouldn't be spending the wee hours trying to solve something that honestly won't matter.
🤣
Oh, wow...UA-cam doesn't let you post comments with links??
Unless, ofc, it's a UA-cam link 🙄
Here is a fun fact for you to think about, Napoleon went into Egypt and removed a ceiling that contained the zodiac constellations it's now in France. So how did they know and name all the constellations if they didn't keep track thousands of years ago.
Same with the Mayan calendar which ended just recently, I think it was accurate for over two thousand years. We are now in the Age of Aquarius so they knew a constellation change would take place.
People are superstitious and in need of protectors and those who can bring us good fortune, and we tend to embellish the things that will help us through life.
But the Truth of the matter is that we've been Studying Astrology and there's two types of Astrology one fixed and the other is progressive for thousands of years. One cycle is 25,000 years.
So how many years before that did we know that these cycles existed..?
There are three zodiacs.
Tropical (that astrology in the west uses),
Sidereal (that Indian astrology uses, and accounts for precessional slippage),
and the Galactic zodiac (the one that NASA uses)
Ptolemy intentionally froze the SIGNS in helenistic astrology and reset Aries by 10° around the year 100 ad, proving that he knew about precessional slippage but that it was irrelevant to the hellenistic astrology system. Signs are named after constellations but they are not the same, and they're not supposed to be. Hellenistic tropical astrology uses planets but not really constellations, signs are more of a marker of seasonal times. Neil isn't quite getting it (and no I don't believe in astrology)
Because the Babylonians in the Mul Apin chose constellations as SIGNS of seasonal markers everyone is confused now. Signs are not constellations they're just name after them in their old position when the Babylonians made the Mul Apin
Cancer and Capricorn have liminal symbolism, they're both half water/half land creatures
I suspect that also means that via precession, the seasons will flip flop over the 26000 year cycle. For example, in the northern hemisphere, it changing from hot to clld (fall), but in 13000 years this time frame would be turning from cold to hot (spring).
Not to mention obliquity and Eleccentrcity that make up the milankovitch cycles. Together these cycles actually are a big reason why Earth’s climate goes through glacial-interglacial cycles during an overall ice age. Although the milankovitch forcings alone aren’t enough to cause earth to transition from glacial to interglacial or vise versia so it’s amplified by changes in atmospheric carbon dioxide, a greenhouse gas.
Thought that was pretty interesting as well.
Because of this also because obilquity making the tilt more extreme (typically going from around 22 degrees to 24 degrees every 40ish thousand years) in the near future, northern hemisphere summers could become far hotter and winters far colder due to a more extreme precession and obliquity phase.
Vedic astrology takes everything he says into consideration with establishing a birth chart.
The birth chart will be entirely wrong if what he says establishes that the Ephermeris is wrong.
That's how I've heard it too, Gwen.
It can't take it into account. There was no stationary starting point.
If it's wrong today, it was wrong then as well.
Indian brahmin here. Vedic or not, astrology is not true.
I wish more people in my country pick up science.
Because astrology is not just a harmless thing here. Your zodiac sign (and other terms in Rashi system) is a factor of marriage in many traditional families. This often invokes scrutiny, prohibition to marriage, or settling for some partner only because your sign matches theirs.
This is a very backward system that has become a tool of oppression arisen from something that actually used to be about science.
The Indian brahmins were the first pioneers of mathematics. All our ideas were carried to Europe through the Arabs.
That being said, I have no attachment nor belief to my caste or in my religion. I just used it assert that despite growing in a religious environment, reading all the holy books, praying, it's possible to learn reasoning at the end of the day.
Here's the the. Tyson might be correct. And even I defended his assertion having invested the time into studying the ancient arts.
I'm not a physicist. Without such spiritual knowledge and only relying on science, life gets bland if you're not a physicist.
Continuing such spiritual study and practice : If it's not real, it won't hurt anybody and we all waste our time.
If it is real, and Darth Vader isn't your diety, perhaps we can help humanity.
I don't know about everyone else, but I prefer a more colorful life than a bland ones and zeros.
Blowin minds all over the place! Love and appreciation!
It is the reason zodiacs on eastern culture are actually Moon signs, rather than the sun signs.
The precession was known millennias ago!! And the correct astrology was built over it.
CORRECT ASTROLOGY 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
@@MGA19a haha... Lol... Yeaaaah.... I can understand what u must be feeling... How can astrology be correct... But it is brother...!!
@@puneet2487 There is zero evidence that any of it is correct. It blows my mind that people still believe in astrology. It's even more ridiculous than believing in a flat earth.
So Chuck gonna just sit there like he doesn't have a KNOT on his head...I love these guys!
😆
Okay, but I think you guys missed the mark just a bit, because when finding out your zodiac, you usually go to some website or book or whatever that tells you what the zodiac position was at the time of your birth. Of course it’ll move over time but that doesn’t mean that it wasn’t where it was at that point in time.
Unless you know any 2 thousand year old people.....Then no one born today has the same sign as the model that was presented in the past.
@@scotth5114 the Mayan calendar ended in the Age of Aquarius how did they know that a constellation change would take place. It takes over twenty five thousand years to complete a cycle.
Something to think about...
@@steve-o6413 Well, from what I have been reading about the calendar, the cycle was supposed to end 2012(thus all the doomsday talk). Also that cycle is kinda like how we use 'centuries' to indicate a passage of time. And I see it just like how we might get a new calendar each year (end of the calendar) they were doing the same with theirs, it just had different stopping points.
@@scotth5114 I guess you didn't my point about how did they know that these things took place 25,000 years ago if they didn't experience them...
@@steve-o6413 Yup, I sure did miss that point. You went from saying they figured things out with observation, to they "experienced" it. I never would have guessed that the mayan civilization was around 25,000 years ago. You need to bring your data that demonstrates this forward to archaeologists and earn a noble prize.
It always start with 'Chuck!'. I like it XD
Ancient egypt was aware of the precession and they already had our current zodiac back then.
So they based their zodiac on what would be 2500 years in the future? LOL It amazes me how people will lie to themselves to justify the nonsense they believe in.
@@davidlondon9242 by „current zodiac“ i meant the actual zodiac- the signs, the symbols, the houses. Learn to read properly before you come at people, goof.
@@tritone11 that's a point so obvious that it doesn't need to be made. That's like saying the amazing thing about Roman numerals is that our roman numeral are the same as the ones from back then. The goof is always in your reflection.
'The North 🌟 Star is a concept' - Neil deGrasse Tyson. I truly love that and I encourage you to do or review on this topic. I mean on the rotten basis of Astrology in an extended version easy-to-grasp for beginners or _legos_ in these matters (Astrology and Astronomy as well). Thank You Tyson. 🙏
I remember a medium was trying to explain to me that I wasn't a Virgo, I laughed her out of the room.
I think this means that our seasons no longer match our calendars; they seem to be out by a month.
I love Dr. Tyson. He could explain scientific things so well. Easy to understand. What if the earth was perfect sphere before and got hit as a result lost its perfect shape and the time it takes to go around the sun has changed because of the impact? So every 26 thousand years the brightest star changes? That’s one of the coolest things I’ve heard about the North Star! I love you Dr. Tyson!
No, every 26.000 years the whole cicle is completed.
It started with Vega around 12.000 B.C. as the North Star.
-Around 4500 B.C. Thuban was the North Star.
- Around 1000 B.C. Polaris became the North Star.
- Around 4500 A.D. Cephei becomes the new North Star
- And Around 14.000 A.D. Vega is the North Star again and the circle starts over. During these 26.000 years we have different stars in the Northern Sky. It is an optical illusion that we have the same North Star that shines forever in the North.
First, Earth never was a perfect sphere. Nothing natural is perfect, and even nothing man-made is perfect, but our stuff usually gets much closer to perfection than natural one.
Second, the Earth did get hit (probably), and that's how we got Moon.
Third, how does the Earth orbiting around Sun matters here? Eath makes a more or less full ellipse in roughly 1 year, 26k years takes to rotate its tilted axle 1 full circle. Those two numbers are basically unrelated, as far as I understand.
Fourth, Earth's shape too has pretty much nothing to do with orbiting around the Sun. Tidal forses do create some distortion, but they didn't appear suddenly, there wasn't any perfect shape before.
Fifth, the britest non-Sun star in the sky is not Polaris (ahaha, just like ATV brand). Pilaris just happens to be near the center of stars's apparent rotation in the sky.
The Earth tilts 23.5 degrees from "vertical" (23.5 degrees from perpendicular to the plane of the Earth's orbit around the Sun). So where the poles point in the sky varies 57 degrees from one precession extreme to the next, 13,000 years apart. This is a pretty radical tilt.
47.
Love these guys
Chuck has such bright eyes! That was so fascinating! Thx guys👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽. Btw, I LOVED Menudo when I was 15😆😆.
I’m not defending astrology as a accurate predictive methodology. I do, however, want to point out that astrologers have been aware of zodiacal precession for a very long time. This is the difference between the sidereal and tropical zodiacs. So, in that sense, this isn’t something new to astrologers.
Thank you for pointing this out
At about 4m mark that is very true. There is a chamber in the Pyramid of Giza that modern archeologists think was used to study the night sky. it doesn't point to anything now (because time and the movement of stars has changed), but 2200 years ago when it was constructed it pointed at various stars (Orion's Belt and Sirius to name 2).
I’ve been thinking about this since I watched this earlier. The logic of this helps me in my line of work in the tech business. I would enjoy seeing a scaled model of the earth rotating on its axis, in this precession that I didn’t know about. In the diameter of this precession, how much space is this covering? Is the sun in its’ own precession? I guess I could look it up, but ultimately, I’d love to see a scale model of this.
I love the idea. And the scale model should be sped up by a couple of thousand times so we could have a visible change in relation to the position of the stars.
But i think some observatory might already have that in a fancy way. Scale model is still cooler i think.
I always wondered why Cancer was visible (albeit dimly) on the evenings of my birthday.
I was dog sitting for my sister at her house the other day and looked on her UA-cam playlist and there were about 55,000 things on astrology. Now All need to do is send her one UA-cam video to really send her in a tizzy.
Precession of the Equinoxes is not a new thing to astrologers. In western astrology, Aries begins at vernal equinox, regardless of where the sun is on the zodiac band of constellations due to said precession. In other words, if a baby is born on the day of vernal equinox, then his sun is in the sign of Aries, even if the sun is in the constellation of Pisces.
That makes sense. It's like a seasonal sign
That was wild! I stopped believing in the Zodiac a long time ago (although I did, to some extent, when I was young) but hearing this makes believing in it hilarious. 🤣 I know people who live by it.. It's actually not funny when I think about it, especially because it makes you make decisions based on it...
Stopped believing in the zodiac? 😂 the zodiac is real, astrology is not. There are three zodiacs. Tropical (that astrology in the west uses), Sidereal (that Indian astrology uses, and accounts for precessional slippage), and the Galactic zodiac (the one that NASA uses)
@@whatabouttheearth Hmm, didn't know that. I thought the zodiac was an invention of astrology. What would the zodiacal signs be if not precisely what astrology makes them out to be. Also the other zodiacs you mentioned, aren't they the same thing but by dufferent cultures? In any way, I'd have to read a bit more. ✌
@@whatabouttheearth Yep. "Zodiac is an element of astrology." It may be a mapping of the sky, which by itself is an actual thing, but as Neil said the constellations move, so the predictions based on that map are nonsense. Zodiac, horoscopes, etc. are based on the same principle.
@@dzzzzzt
What? Western astrology, aka the tropical hellinistic does not actually use constellations!!!!! The signs are named after the constellations but they're not the same thing, they are seasonal markers.
Ptolemy and the majority of western astrology froze and reset the zodiac locking it into place to account for and offset the need to account for precessional slippage.
@@whatabouttheearth Hmmm. So you are saying that what NDT said was wrong? I knew astrology/horoscope/zodiac from a friend and from ... well, using it, reading, even believing, but I'm not knowledgable about its origins, logic, etc. So I cannot go in further than that. For now I'm willing to believe him and maybe some day I'll read more just to understand it better.
Chuck knowing about menudo took this video to a whole new level!
What about Vedic astrology ? It takes precision into account
If everyone had teacher's like Neil no one would hate school.