I use air tools maybe 1-2 times a year. I have no idea how or why I found this channel. I have no plans to use air tools more then I already don’t...but I binge watch the hell out of y’all’s videos like I’m an avid user 😂😂 great info! 10/10
I have never even used air-tool and still find this interesting, tho I'm probalby never going to use them - too expensive here, and my old, old compressor wouldn't make it :D
Ronnie... knowledge is NEVER wasted... if yer anything like me, you will file the info away in the back of your biological hard drive & some day, maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow , when you find yerself in a "situation" it will pop back out ... This has happened to me many times & whats MORE interesting is I sometimes find I'm applying the knowledge in a lateral way... yesterday my farmer neighbour asked me to make a "speed knob" for his forklift steering wheel... first thing that instantly popped in my mind was using a golf ball... an idea I picked up probably 10 years ago... stuck it in the lathe 3 jaw, drilled a 10 mm hole then counterbored for the nut & there it was... he just smiled, he's used to my creative problem-solving.. 🙄😂
Oh yeah 😎. Very interesting. Just bought at a good discount👍 a Harbor Freight 1/2" Composite Earthquake XT, EQ12YXT (Yellow) Need to break loose nuts on the CVT (Continuously Variable Transmission) on scooters and to unscrew the clutches on the same vehicle. 4 years ago bought the 18v Milwaukee 1000 ft- lbs On and 1200 ft-lbs Off. When I want & Need to remove it, I'm going to "Get it Off". But do Not want over torque the CVT, or clutch. Twist and Scoot, Vespa and Kymco dealer about 100 ft-lbs is about to re-install CVT's and clutches. The Harbor Freight earthquake claims 1200 ft-lbs Off on the box 📦.
From a mechanical engineer who designs, builds, and maintains large industrial compressed air systems; you guys a doing a good job. Without going into the detail, friction or line losses from diameter, length, and incorrect component sizing it the #1 cause of poor system and tool performance. This is also the most overlooked cause of compressed air problems, too. So if you used 5ft test hoses, you probably can't see enough difference in your test to matter; but at 100ft, the performance gaps will be huge. An easy way to tell if you have too much line losses is comparing static pressure to dynamic or running pressure. My design thumb rule is a max 5psi difference from the compressor to the tool. What that generally means to a home shop setup is that 1/4" is good for blowing dust off and inflating bicycle tires, and not much else. 3/8" at less than 50ft will work Ok for most things, and 1/2" is best and necessary if you want the best performance out of 1/2" or larger impact drivers. Again, the length of the hose (and hard pipe) matter. Higher flow and pressure compressors can't improve system performance if the pipe size is too small start with.
@@dazaspc It would be interesting to see, but how many people purchase the extended anvil model? Milwaukee, for instance, only offers it on their 1/2-inch model high torque, and soon on their 1-inch. Buying these is complete personal preference, but like many, I'd rather have the normal anvil to be more versatile when trying to fit the impact in tight spaces. If someone is willing to loan the channel an extended anvil impact, I'm sure they'd add it to the list.
After 50 years using impacts some thing i might add, Any flexibility in air supply will interfere with impact performance. Use short hose as possible, And use iron or copper pipe to hose. Each time gun impacts it cause a pressure surge which is absorbed by hose. 1/2 gun needs 3/8 hose with 3/8 fittings. 3/4 gun needs 1/2 hose with 1/2 fittings. And try to never exceed 50 ft of hose. Gun will have lot more power on 25ft hose. At wall use no fittings . Do not worry about thread size going into gun. It is rated as a air orifice and even 1/4 will flow over 80 cfm which is more than any gun can use. My old CP 3/4 gun 1/4 inch thread My newer IR gun has 3/8 threads. And they both use same amount of air. The larger threads on newer guns are just a sales gimmick. I got three compressors one is 60 gallon single stage this does 90 per cent of my work. With 1/2 impact. I got 5hp two stage 60 gallon at 175 psi. Seldom ever used. With the 3/4 or 1 inch impact or sand blaster i got a 160cfm diesel compressor which is tied into the shop air lines.
I’ve been a Matco guy for years. Always keep my 1/2” impact in the best condition possible. At our plant, safety keeps the air throttled down to 60 psi and we use 3/8” air hoses with the smallest possible quick connects. Makes my 1/2” impact about the power of my 3/8” stubby Mac air impact.
Good stuff. I'm glad you guys are picking up so many subscribers. Eric O. is very popular and earned every sub he's got and he likes to tip the hat to others that contribute to the mechanical community knowledge base. You guys are testing and proving what works without any BS or shilling. You are the Project Farm of impact tools. Nice!
A way to assist the gun without replacing all of the air lines in the shop is to connect a tank close to the point of use and use a larger hose from the tank to the gun. A few seconds pause allows the tank to refill. Even a tank as small as one gallon makes a big difference.
I sell and service pneumatic tools at my work. We find if people are losing power at the tool, it quite often stems from what the inner diameter of their air hose is and how much it's restricting volume, lots of people forget about volume and just focus on pressure, easiest way we've found to see the reality of this is to have an in line gauge plugged in right before the tool that'll show you. You may have 110psi when not using the tool (as recommended) but then drop to 55-65psi when actually in use. Just my 2 cents.
Another pressure drop is the coiled hoses! On airseeders, all of the main runs have to be about the same length. Every time you loop a hose around the tower you ADD 6’ to 8’ to the hose length to get the effective length. Pull a pressure drop test on a 3/8” rubber/plastic hose vs 3/8” I nylon spiral hose. Use no air couplers, just a 3/8” ball valve, test hose, tee to restriction gauge, air wrench! A lot of people are going to only use 1/4” or 3/8” nylon spiral hoses for their blow nozzles. Another huge restriction is the hose reel!!! Hello from north east Montana. 10 miles from the Canadian border.
I have a old (from the 80's) 30 gallon Compressor on 220v and run it at 90psi with a 50ft 3/8" hose, it never really feels starved but i do get a small kick when the compressor comes on after a few seconds. I've used my impact gun on small tanks at a friends house, seem to struggle for air after the first 2 seconds of use. At that point i start to use it in 2 second bursts to let the compressor keep up.
I like the guy that comes in and says he is using a 1/2 air line but the coupler is stepped down to 1/4 inch and doesn't understand why he has low power
That would make little noticeable difference if any, but good try, trying to come up with a scenario that you hypothesized would resonate with people who know what they're talking about... 🙄
As a heavy Duty field Mechanic I can definitely attest to these tests! We run VMAC under hood air compressors set to 150 psi and use “p” style fittings. If were doing a big engine overhaul ( like 9390 cubic inches big!), we usually tie two trucks air tanks together and run a 1” air hose to feed a shorter 1/2” line for the 3/4” Impact guns. Time is money and when you have 16 cylinder heads to remove with 10 1” head studs torqued to 660 lb/Ft each you can’t be pissing around with weak ass air tools!!
Oh man, I'd love to see a test comparing different coupler types! Used to work at a shop where a guy swore up and down that Lincoln (L style) fittings were superior in every way - lasted longer, didn't leak, etc... so I bought all L style couplers for all my tools just to play nice with the delusional fantasy created at that shop... turns out they're the exact opposite he claimed. They're fragile and leak like a sieve, and the female couplers are *chonkers*. When I quit I quickly binned all those couplers and went back to M style.
I run 3/8's, used 1/2" before. It is noticable, that being said. The bulky 1/2" in a factory where you have 20-30' and you are 15 ft up, that extra weight does cause some issues. The 3/8" rubber hose is really a good compromise.
My friend complained about his impact power years ago. He took my advice and got a 1/2 air hose. That solved his problem with stubborn bolts. More volume over pressure.
A suggestion to improve your source impedance or performance for the air supply: you can improve the performance of the pressure delivered to the tool by placing a small tank and the connection of the hose ( this would act as a capacitor if that makes sense to keep a constant pressure at the supply connection ). So at the end of the pipe where you connect your hose, place a small tank ( the size of a 1 pound propane tank ) to act as a transient supply ( capacitor ) for the pulsing guns. If you need better description please let me know. This would in essence give you better tool performance and data removing the air supply as a parameter. In electronics, this is called source impedance. The lower the source impedance, the less voltage droop. Power supplies compensate with a capacitor ( local storage for charge close to the load ). FYI, this is getting picky but just in case you were looking for content ideas! Also, tool designers should entertain this idea as well! Love the channel! Keep up the good work!
Please do test air fittings and such... as a DIY, I get to make one purchase, good or bad I have to stick to it for years before I can get the "should have bought that one" correction. great channel, great content.
This is a test I've been waiting for. I knew the higher volume of air would obviously see higher torque, surprised at how little difference there was at the end of the test. Well done as always and I'm very much looking forward to the 1250k as I've been eyeing it for a while now. Thanks bud, keep crushing!
I figured the exact opposite.. Like if you have a 25 foot 1/4 vs a 1/2, you have twice the volume to pressurize. I figured that release and build up every time the impact rotates its hammer would rob some power..
Joe Homeowner here. Just stumbled across your channel and hit play because I have a big box bought Milwaukee 6 gal compressor (C2002) with whatever hoses/adapters I got with it. Used it with a Brad nailer (pre battery everything) and now mostly as a car tire filler and general blower. The thing has always leaked and the noisey-arse compressor is always going on. Always bothered me but wasn’t sure of next steps plus I hardly use it. Your channel has great info and your presentation software is first rate. Happy to subscribe and spread the word!
you should definitely do the different types of fittings, my business needs new air ends bad and i would like to see what the best bang for my bucks would be as to what style to overhaul it with!
Start by using a drill bit to measure the ID of the male quick couplers. I don’t care what brand name it is a 5/32” hole will flow less air than a 3/16” hole or a 7/32”! There is a brand of quick couplers out there that only has a 5/32” hole, they are long, with pretty red, white & blue packaging, with a huge, huge name!
Im using the milton v style hi flo Quick connect i have noticed a difference even with 3/8 hose. I bought these not for my impact ( also use it hor that) but for my TD 58 Plasma cutter. I was getting a significant drop in pressure on long cuts this was with milton Quick connect M style connectors. The high Flo has mast a significant improvement with 50ft hose
If you really want to wake one up you run a half inch line from a dedicated port on the tank straight to the gun and make every fitting as big as you can. If you work in an engine shop that ports heads you tend to port everything when it's slow. It will make that grandpa gun run like the matco if you port the ex side of the old one. It will be stupid loud and still just as heavy but powerful enough to break sockets every week,
SMA brought me here mentioning how cool your guys videos were long before you got his impact and love seeing all the technical stuff on this. you are doing a great job, keep it up
The smallest port ID will be the greatest restriction and that is usually the coupler. The ID of the hose & coupler should be the same to get the most from any one combination.
It wouldn't matter in this setup. The air source is limited by the filter and regulator they are initially connected to. Anything after that is just minor restrictions from resistance in line size but the volume of flow is already a fixed value before the line sized come into play. This is why the 3/8 line and the 1/2 inch lines peak similarly but follow a very similar power curve. The initial burst on the 1/2 inch line is from the extra volume of the line storing compressed air volume. Once that reserve is depleted and replenished from the source (regulator), the air flow is restricted by the source more than anything. In contrast, the 1/4 inch line is actually smaller than any upstream restrictions so it has a dramatic affect on the flow rate. If they had a 1 inch setup from the air tank (supply) out to the difference in line size, your fitting argument would have a much more noticeable impact on the results. That is unless I misunderstood your statement and used 5 times the words to say the same thing.
@@sumduma55 Yeah almost any time you're going through a pressure regulator, THAT is your smallest restriction... unless you're expecting unrealistic things from 1/4" fittings.
Well done video, all true what you say, As been working with standard air tools and air torque tools, i can tell that the minimal difference between 3/8" and 1/2" hoses is that your tool does not consume more flow than can be provided by the 3/8" hose at that length. It will be a major difference if you tested for example an Atlas LMP 51 or similar. The difference would be in shorter time to reach desired torque.
I put a 3/8 coupler on my 3/8 hose and it brought my 1/4" angle drill to life. No more struggling when using the 2.5" grinder discs/3M scotch pads. Same for my 3" cutter. I thus concluded volume into the tool was as important if not more so than pressure.
I've got a IR 231 too but was lacking power. There are huge limitations of air flow if you use a hose reel (for instance, at the brass elbow fitting, off the reel where you connect to the compressor), there are passages that restrict air. So, I purchased a separate 3/8 rubber goodyear 50 ft hose and put it on a wall hook near my compressor. I now use high flow fittings. The seperate line is used when I need to move alot of air. This is what I run my impact on. Made a huge difference. The impact is extremely powerful and does not struggle. The only thing I use of the other line (the reel) is filling tires, blowing air, or low volume tools.
At our shop, we use 1” air lines and 3/8” fittings for 1/2” impacts, 1/2” fittings for 3/4” impacts. We also run 175 psi out of a 250 gallon compressor with a reserve tank of 250 gallons. The Thor is able to do semi truck lug nuts just as well as my 3/4” IR and my boss’ napa 772L 3/4”. Really speaks to how far 1/2” impacts have come.
I did NOT expect that. I expected it to be a bit of a difference but that's just insane. I really need to reevaluate my system because all my tools are old air hungry tools and in some cases I thought they were just getting too old, might have been the new smaller hoses. Awesome work, thank you for this, subscribed and upvoted.
You know, you made a great decision to create this channel. It's a niche channel, but extremely useful. Congratulations, this channel helps me a lot to understand my impact wrenches, pneumatic and electric and choose the best option for my money.
I know this is an older video so more than likely this would benefit someone just watching this. There is zero doubt that the Milton V type of air fitting is the best. What most people don't realize is that to get the best price go straight to their website. Nobody beats their price. Now if you only buy a handful of them then get them wherever it's convenient. When I discovered these about 10 years ago. I found out that the more I needed was a lot more expensive. I am basically a DIY mechanic like that since the 80s. I have a big addiction to buying tools. So I have basically a boatload of air tools. And I want new fittings for all of them and the chuck that goes on the end of your air hose that you plug into. They have it where you buy more the better value you get. I bought my feelings by the full box which at the time was 10 in each box. The air chuck is sold by the piece. I picked up two of them just to keep one on hand. The good thing about theirs is that all air fittings fit inside the air chuck.
6:48 Pneumatic nail and staple guns don't mind a small diameter line like 1/4" at longer lengths. They run just fine on a 1/4" line and they're far lighter which construction guys like. When you're throwing around a big framing nailer the last thing you wanna do is pull around a heavy air hose too.
Good test. I use 3/8 lines at my bays as due to good air supply routing I only need 15ft hose and the short length mixed with quality 3/8 hose makes it a treat work with all day long , 1/2 reserved for longer hose and more air hungry tools .
The lines inside an impact wrench through the handle to the rotor and veins in the motor section are going to be your weakness when using 1/2" air line!
I plumbed my whole shop with 1/2" copper tubing and shark bite connectors. My 60gal compressor does 155psi, but is rated for 4.6cfm at 90. The main bottlenecks are the end of the hosing going into a reel on my ceiling that's 3/8" flexzilla hose with 1/4" npt industrial style ends. It's my home garage so I don't need anything crazy, but I set it up for 1/2" so if in the future I needed to upgrade I had the ability to.
I have a booster tank with 1/4, 3/8 and 1/2 couplings that I use with when I'm dealing with stubborn bolts or if I need to use a 100 foot hose to reach. It makes a massive difference on large bolts and nuts found on semi-trucks. Ofcourse you need to put short hoses on your guns to get the benefits but that's actually something you should do anyway to prevent coupling wear.
Nice channel. A couple observations and how they would affect things in the real world: One is that the extra torque in the 1-2 second range provided from the 1/2 hose is really going to improve productivity. The percentage difference seems to have peaked at around the 2 second mark. The other is that it probably improves tool life because you aren't hammering for nearly as long. I'm just a DIY'er, but the next time it comes to replace air hoses, it will be 1/2 from now on. Another observation I found interesting, and it was hard to see on the graph, was when the 3/8 hose had emptied it's line pressure. It was more subtle than the 1/4 line, but the difference in raw numbers with the 1/2 was about 80 ft lbs.
I strapped a 1/2" x 100' Flexzilla hose on my hose reel and never looked back vs two 3/8" x 50' hoses. I ditched two couplings as well. Very noticable increase in torque. Not to mention I really like the Flexzilla hose. I wish I could get away with 50' but I need the extra length the way my shop is arranged.
I've used air wrenches on hobby projects for 50 years. I have several from air ratchets through butter fly wrenches to 3/8" and 1/2" pistol grip wrenches. I like them but my two Milwaukee cordless wrenches are rapidly spoiling me. I can't say how much I like not dragging the hose around. But for more torque, Air wrenches are much more affordable than cordless because of the battery cost. For that reason I'd like to see you test some 3/4" and 1" air wrenches, especially those from HF which are quite affordable even if they require bigger air hose and high flow couplers. I have an older than dirt Sears compressor that delivers 7cfm @ 90 psi. It has a big enough tank that if I let it pump up after breaking loose a nut with a big 11cfm wrench, in three or four minutes I can do another. It works great with 1/2" air wrenches.
this makes sense to me..... for my garage I had setup a 100lb propane tank as a reserve and originally put a bunch of M fittings(everything disconnected, as to keep it modular) and used 1/4 line, was finding it wasn't really cutting it for using pneumatic tools so I decided to use PEX(regular water grade) in the place of the main run that ran to a 1/4 reel, noticed an improvement but it still had room for improvement....... shopped around and got a 3/8 auto retracting 100ft hose and it's was near perfect!:)......same reserve tank, skipped most the M fitting(less modular but found it was part of the limiting); it's all 1/2 to the reel or m fittings(multiple drops to plug into; may upgrade to V-Style at some point)
I'd like to see one of those small protable air tanks turned into a inline auxiliary air tank and about a 6 foot 1/2" line. I would think a setup like that would give the best results.
Would have thought the 1/2" line would of given more. I guess you need a 3/4" impact to take advantage of it. I'd like to see milton G style thrown in to the mix of couplers. To save on the price of a 1/2" air line, I've even contemplated having a 3/8" line to an airpig, and then a 1/2" - 6 foot whip to the gun, but don't want to get too bojangly at work. Keep up the great work, looking forward to seeing this channel grow. cheers
You want the big hose on the long run. A short 3/8 hose won’t reduce it as much as a long 3/8 hose. Ideally you’d have a long 1/2 hose then the short 3/8 whip hose on the tool.
See the results of the 3/8 hose. Its a "weakest link" equation. The difference would be in the de-expansion of fully swollen hose, probably a bit longer high slope before leveling off to pure air flow, were it would join to identical to the 3/8 line.
@@joshuacoomes6388 The relaxing of the hose will take longer yes, after that,the pressure will be the same, that of the source, factored in with the length (still the same) and smallest restriction (still the same). No I'm not "sure" its just what I think. I could be proven wrong.
@@snap-off5383 I thought the same way until I had some physics training. The diameter of the hose has a different effect if smaller/larger when things are moving. Yes the pressures will be the same, but when air is moving through the hose there is a pressure drop. I think its Bernulli's equation that explains it. Yes, the small whip will cause a huge restriction, and my point may be so minimal that it can't be noticed. I dont know either, but I do believe that the 1/2 hose with a whip, or 3/8 nipple will still outperform the 3/8 hose of same length. It may be easier to see if you compare a 90 degree street elbow versus a 90 degree with a 6 inch centerline radius. The gradual bend will obviously flow more and have less of a pressure drop. The restriction the bend creates to flow can be compared the restriction and the end of a hose.
I used to love my 1/2 Aircat impact. Now it sits abandoned in the bottom drawer of the most unused box in my ragtag fleet of fugitive toolboxes, along with it's brothers: 3/8 IR ratchet, 1/4 Snap On ratchet and many others. Unused , yet still loved. Milwaukee came to town . 'Nuff said .
WHAT DOES 840 POUNDS PER SQUARE INCH FEEL LIKE... AND WHAT IS THE MOST POWERFUL CORDLESS HALF INCH IMPACT GUN ON THE MARKET PLEASE CAN YOU TELL ME . YOUR CHANNEL IS THE GREATEST CAN'T WAIT FOR MORE VIDEOS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I had to switch to my sprinkler blow out tap and 5/8" garden hose to break loose a harmonic balancer bolt. It was sketchy for sure but definitely provided more beans than my 3/8" hose with 1/4" fittings.
I used to use air tools for everything because the foundry I worked at was rigged up for air everywhere. I bought a bunch of Milwaukee battery tools now and it's a lot easier for facilities that don't have air all over.
Great video! Would love to see the video on the testing of the fittings. I must say, I'm very confused by the selection and sizes of all the different fittings. A recommended basic setup (lines and fittings) that would work well for the average user would be very helpful.
We have an 1" Air impact. We usually use the 1/4" for it because the hammer is very heavy and usually it looses everything in our car workshop at the lowest setting. Looks like we need an upgrade if we really need more power. My idea was to get an little tank with a short 1/2" air hose so we dont need to buy an 20m 1/2" hose for it.
Randomly found this channel and its pretty dope. I worked in nascar as a tire changer and we used Oetiker flow through fittings on everything and were the standard for the guns and also 1/2" hoses were used alot but at the lower levels where I was at we were typically used 3/8" and there was definitely a difference when hooked up to a nitrogen bottle.
I always run 13mm ID hose, awkward as hell to route in to places, but I know that the 3/4” Bahco or UT 498 is gonna hit hard from the off. Great videos, keep up the testing!!
I would be very interested to see you test the different couplers. I am just about to switch couplers in my shop going from Milton A style couplers to Milton V style couplers. A friend made a similar switch and says it is a big difference but doesn't have a way to quantify the change.
This comment goes to the creator of this video... as I need serious help. I've been delaying my introduction into air tools as there have been SO many variables to take into account. I bought a nice compressor a couple of years ago however I haven't really used it due to my hesitations over hose selection, coupler selection, etc... 1) FANTASTIC video. I'm not sure how I ended up here... but I did... and I seriously appreciate the quality of this video. My questions concerning hoses has now been answered. 3/8" hoses are the best fit for me. 2) Now the couplers. Should the coupler diameter match the hose diameter in order to get the most out of your tool? My compressor came fitted with a 1/4" coupler and the handful of tools I have so far (impact wrench, air chisel, tire inflator/gauge) also came fitted with 1/4" couplers. I've understood that the air getting to your tool is limited by the smallest diameter between your compressor and your tool. So even though I would be using a 3/8" hose... the fact is... all of my couplers are 1/4" - so would I be seeing any benefit in using the 3/8" hose? Or am I supposed to change all of my couplers to 3/8"? Similarly, the airline coming out of the compressor is 1/4" to the coupler on the compressor... and the tool itself is obviously fitted with 1/4"... Can you PLEASE help? Thank you SO much in advance.
A common misconception is 1/4" fittings mean anything on it measure 1/4". The fitting size is based on threads, which are 1/4 NPT, and npt threads have nominal names that have nothing to do with a measurement. 1/4" npt measures around 3/8" on the htreads. That said, the inside diameter of a 1/4" air fitting is also small, varying by type of fitting. Couplers will always bee the bottle neck. We cant test that for you, but generally we feel milton type V 1/4" is plenty on 3/8" line.
Excellent channel. I'm very interested in the couplings. I did some of my own experiments and the couplings had a much, much larger impact on pressure drop than 50ft of air line did. Also can you plot air pressure along with torque in your charts? Torque is nice to have but it only tells half the story. Thanks.
Awesome video, would love to see testing done with various extensions, adapters like 1/2 to 3/8, universal joints, impact socket vs standard sockets. I have always been curious how this affects some of the impacts that I have like the m12 stubby or the mid torque gen 2.
In my case with a normal compressor for like home use and stuff we had a small diameter hose(I cant remember what size but I thonk it was a 5mm one) and the impact couldnt even bust a bolt from a carwheel loose. Than we bought a 10mm inner diameter hose and now it really works. We have a quite good air compressor but no industrial one and we also got a 40 bucks Impact Kit, so the tool and a Socket set and an extention(which I did not use).
I know you’re addressing impact wrenches, but my dad has been building things all his life. With large wood buildings, he doesn’t want to move his compressor all day or waste money on hundreds of feet of 1/2” hoses. When you really get moving with a framing nailer, you can run short on pressure in the lines. He would keep an old, bare compressor tank around to use as a capacitor and splitter so multiple nailers stood a better chance of not loosing pressure while sheeting a building.
I know a lot of people today especially younger people are getting away from air compressor. I feel that there's a place for both of them. If you are out working on your vehicle and you're not doing major work than the battery operated tool should do well. If you were really getting in there deeply I feel an air tool is perfect for that type of situation. You don't need to worry about running out of power and yes I know you can buy a second battery for what he's batteries are selling for you could practically get a smaller air compressor and never worry about a dying battery. For anybody who is looking for the Milton fittings you should go to their website in order correctly from them. When I first switched over to them if I was to order from Amazon or ebay going to cost a great bit of money. I went to the company's website and was able to buy everything I wanted plus extra and never even came close to what Amazon and eBay for selling them for. I buy them by the box I cannot remember off the top of my head how many fittings that is. I also use their coupler since it's bigger inside. And let me tell you what if you buy these settings no matter where you get them from hold it up to your old one. A complete night and day difference. It almost looks like the old fitting could fit inside my new one. That is how big of a difference it is. I use their V versions. That's the biggest opening that they have and the threaded end is quarter inch so that way you don't need to buy adapters. As always I enjoyed your video and always looking forward to watching more.
A couple more ideas for you. If you do a video on the fitting types, I'd love to see what different swivel fittings do to performance, if anything. The hinge type and the ball swivel type. I use the the hinge type from HF on some tools and the Flexzilla ball swivels on other tools. Also, I once saw something about how to hold an impact for maximum performance. They were saying that if you just hold it loosely on the fastener that it would perform better than pushing up against the impact like you might a drill. Makes sense to me, but how much difference, if any, would there be?
I'd be interested in seeing tests on the different couplers, especially T-style automotive 1/4 NPT with 3/8 ID hose. Thanks for all the great info you provide!
It is refreshing to see someone that gets this. Try working with someone who uses a 1” impact and 1/4” quick connect fittings. He thinks I’m the idiot who doesn’t understand.
Not even joking btw. 1/2” air hose with some reducers for his quick connect. Then his 1” (all air tools really) impact has a couple bushings to get it down to the 1/4” air fitting. Every time I see it I scream on the inside-might as well use a smaller impact!
Thank you for the great videos you put out. This has become my go to channel for these types of products. Would love to see a video on how air hose length affects air line working pressure, ie, 25' vs 50' vs 100' hose. Again, thanks for sharing.
I have a CP 721? 1/2” that I bought in 1990 when I was working at the John Deere, Steiger dealership. No, it is not the Central Pneumatic! It is a Chicago Pneumatic with the numbers stamped in to a metal tag, riveted to the wrench. The reason that I am not sure of the model number is dings from years of use, a lot of abuse, and torquing out of my grip. Every year to 2 years I put in a rebuild kit from CP. This 1/2” air wrench will take off 50% of the Budd or piloted rims on semis that have not been put on by a 1” wrench and someone who loves to pull the trigger. What I do is unscrew the whip hose, screw the 3/8” by 50’ hose to the wrench. So now it comes out of the compressor though a 1/2” ball valve, to my 3/8” x 50’ air hose, to my wrench. It is amazing how much the old air wrenches preform without the restriction of the quick coupler! A lot of guys use to use the long Lincoln quick couplers, I took each of their male tips, put a drill bit down it to measure the ID of the tip. Some common quick couplers are not even 3/16”! Just like the 3/8” vs 1/4” air hose! Another good tip on an impact wrench is to put on a 3/8” by 6’ whip hose, it has nothing to do with stopping the vibration from the quick couplers, it is a reserve of unrestricted air next to your impact wrench. I think that is why your 3/8” test climbs faster than your 1/4” test. Then they tend to flatline because of the restrictions of the 2 quick couplers. When I was at the JD-Steiger dealership, they had an old 5/8” air wrench that would out do some new 3/4” pistol grip air wrenches. But it used A LOT of air, shop law was you had to have leather gloves on to use the 5/8” wrench! It would twist right out of your hands, if you did not know how to hold it. The shop foreman went down and bought my same 1/2”, and 3/4” Chicago Pneumatic air wrenches for his service van after using mine. Check out the ID of your male air quick couplers, remove the quick couplers from the compressor, get rid of the hose reels, install a 6 foot whip hose on your impact wrench. You will probably be surprised by how much power that your impact wrench has!!! Hello from north east Montana. 10 miles from the Canadian border.
I would love to see the findings on air line fittings. I have searched and haven't found a video that puts out the data your videos do. I have started my own testing swapping over several of my air tools over to hi Flo fittings
I just switched to 3/4" bore red hose to connect my compressors and receiver tank, and Chicago couplings are easily adapted to thinner hose "whips" at the working end if desired.
The smallest restriction in an air circuit will determine its power transfer. Longer supply hose is like a long skinny storage tank, no effect on power plus or minus. Ideally the tool would be the smallest restriction in the circuit.
Old video I know but another consideration that should help someone decide is not only line length but how that length affects pressure loss. Do your tools need volume or pressure?
If I understood correctly (and I may not have) you adjusted the regulator for each individual hose tested to supply the same running pressure at the tool. Can you explain your rationale for that? It seems to me that setting the regulator pressure higher at the upstream end of the smaller hoses tends to offset the restriction of the smaller hoses, and makes that test less of an apples-to-apples comparison. Also, I'm curious, which has a higher air flow? The wrench spinning up freely with no load or the wrench working under load? Just off the top of my head, I'd guess that the free spinning wrench would flow more air, but these things aren't always what they seem.
How about showing some love for Chicago Pneumatic CP7755? That thing looks like a beast. It has the stubbier and wider profile that will fit in tight spaces.
its one thing testing for how much power you use/lose but not everyone has a massive air compressor. how about doing a test on how much air gets used between the hose sizes ?
We used to use 3/4 inch line when I was in the army. That’s because we had an 1” impact for the larger trucks but we used 1/2” drive most of the time. We just didn’t want to switch out lines. We found 3/4” line works better than 1/2”. But just by observation no scientific stuff done. Be nice to see you try 3/4” line.
To answer the question Why do 1/4" x 100' hoses exist I think it's for paint shops as I don't think they need the larger volume that the larger ID hoses can provide. That or (jokingly) so you can park 80' away and still fill up your car tires.
I've always removed the quick connects and threaded the hoses straight into the tool if I needed an absolute max effort ugga dugga. I'd like to see how that compares.
This channel is seriously underrated for the quality it delivers
Yep, this channel is great.
Agree completely
Agreed, but it seems to be growing quickly as of late.
Very entertaining!!!
Seriously though, this is some shenanigans I’ve never even thought made much of a difference. I feel stupid every time I learn something here😂😂
Yes, please do the coupler test.
yes!!!!!!
Yes, definitely 👍👍
I agree not all fittings are created equal. Still waiting for the test to commence
Yes lets put the age old question of PSI VS CFM to the test.
I use air tools maybe 1-2 times a year. I have no idea how or why I found this channel. I have no plans to use air tools more then I already don’t...but I binge watch the hell out of y’all’s videos like I’m an avid user 😂😂 great info! 10/10
And we love ya for it!
I have never even used air-tool and still find this interesting, tho I'm probalby never going to use them - too expensive here, and my old, old compressor wouldn't make it :D
Ronnie... knowledge is NEVER wasted... if yer anything like me, you will file the info away in the back of your biological hard drive & some day, maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow , when you find yerself in a "situation" it will pop back out ...
This has happened to me many times & whats MORE interesting is I sometimes find I'm applying the knowledge in a lateral way... yesterday my farmer neighbour asked me to make a "speed knob" for his forklift steering wheel... first thing that instantly popped in my mind was using a golf ball... an idea I picked up probably 10 years ago... stuck it in the lathe 3 jaw, drilled a 10 mm hole then counterbored for the nut & there it was... he just smiled, he's used to my creative problem-solving.. 🙄😂
@@peterfitzpatrick7032 tell that to college students with liberal arts degrees.
Oh yeah 😎. Very interesting. Just bought at a good discount👍 a Harbor Freight 1/2" Composite Earthquake XT, EQ12YXT (Yellow) Need to break loose nuts on the CVT (Continuously Variable Transmission) on scooters and to unscrew the clutches on the same vehicle. 4 years ago bought the 18v Milwaukee 1000 ft- lbs On and 1200 ft-lbs Off. When I want & Need to remove it, I'm going to "Get it Off".
But do Not want over torque the CVT, or clutch. Twist and Scoot, Vespa and Kymco dealer about 100 ft-lbs is about to re-install CVT's and clutches. The Harbor Freight earthquake claims 1200 ft-lbs Off on the box 📦.
From a mechanical engineer who designs, builds, and maintains large industrial compressed air systems; you guys a doing a good job. Without going into the detail, friction or line losses from diameter, length, and incorrect component sizing it the #1 cause of poor system and tool performance. This is also the most overlooked cause of compressed air problems, too. So if you used 5ft test hoses, you probably can't see enough difference in your test to matter; but at 100ft, the performance gaps will be huge. An easy way to tell if you have too much line losses is comparing static pressure to dynamic or running pressure. My design thumb rule is a max 5psi difference from the compressor to the tool. What that generally means to a home shop setup is that 1/4" is good for blowing dust off and inflating bicycle tires, and not much else. 3/8" at less than 50ft will work Ok for most things, and 1/2" is best and necessary if you want the best performance out of 1/2" or larger impact drivers. Again, the length of the hose (and hard pipe) matter. Higher flow and pressure compressors can't improve system performance if the pipe size is too small start with.
The way you present the charts with POV movement during animation is fantastic! Extremely easy to follow. Keep up the great work!
Could you test the effect of using socket extensions? (3 inch, 6 inch, 10 inch)
Maybe test the effect of a swivel/universal joint too?
You got it
@@ShainAndrews I completely agree that they reduce power, but it would be nice to have an idea how much power is lost.
@@TorqueTestChannel Also add conversion adapters both bigger and smaller.. (1/2 to 3/8 and vice versa)
The ideal test would be an extended anvil impact gun VS a impact gun with an extension.
@@dazaspc It would be interesting to see, but how many people purchase the extended anvil model? Milwaukee, for instance, only offers it on their 1/2-inch model high torque, and soon on their 1-inch.
Buying these is complete personal preference, but like many, I'd rather have the normal anvil to be more versatile when trying to fit the impact in tight spaces.
If someone is willing to loan the channel an extended anvil impact, I'm sure they'd add it to the list.
Super interesting video!
PS: I really like the live moving graphs too. 📈
After 50 years using impacts some thing i might add, Any flexibility in air supply will interfere with impact performance. Use short hose as possible, And use iron or copper pipe to hose. Each time gun impacts it cause a pressure surge which is absorbed by hose. 1/2 gun needs 3/8 hose with 3/8 fittings. 3/4 gun needs 1/2 hose with 1/2 fittings. And try to never exceed 50 ft of hose. Gun will have lot more power on 25ft hose. At wall use no fittings . Do not worry about thread size going into gun. It is rated as a air orifice and even 1/4 will flow over 80 cfm which is more than any gun can use. My old CP 3/4 gun 1/4 inch thread My newer IR gun has 3/8 threads. And they both use same amount of air. The larger threads on newer guns are just a sales gimmick. I got three compressors one is 60 gallon single stage this does 90 per cent of my work. With 1/2 impact. I got 5hp two stage 60 gallon at 175 psi. Seldom ever used. With the 3/4 or 1 inch impact or sand blaster i got a 160cfm diesel compressor which is tied into the shop air lines.
I’ve been a Matco guy for years. Always keep my 1/2” impact in the best condition possible. At our plant, safety keeps the air throttled down to 60 psi and we use 3/8” air hoses with the smallest possible quick connects. Makes my 1/2” impact about the power of my 3/8” stubby Mac air impact.
60 psi LOL
Good stuff. I'm glad you guys are picking up so many subscribers. Eric O. is very popular and earned every sub he's got and he likes to tip the hat to others that contribute to the mechanical community knowledge base. You guys are testing and proving what works without any BS or shilling. You are the Project Farm of impact tools. Nice!
A way to assist the gun without replacing all of the air lines in the shop is to connect a tank close to the point of use and use a larger hose from the tank to the gun. A few seconds pause allows the tank to refill. Even a tank as small as one gallon makes a big difference.
We do that for framing houses wt a 25 gal tank from an air compressor
I sell and service pneumatic tools at my work. We find if people are losing power at the tool, it quite often stems from what the inner diameter of their air hose is and how much it's restricting volume, lots of people forget about volume and just focus on pressure, easiest way we've found to see the reality of this is to have an in line gauge plugged in right before the tool that'll show you. You may have 110psi when not using the tool (as recommended) but then drop to 55-65psi when actually in use.
Just my 2 cents.
Another pressure drop is the coiled hoses!
On airseeders, all of the main runs have to be about the same length. Every time you loop a hose around the tower you ADD 6’ to 8’ to the hose length to get the effective length.
Pull a pressure drop test on a 3/8” rubber/plastic hose vs 3/8” I nylon spiral hose.
Use no air couplers, just a 3/8” ball valve, test hose, tee to restriction gauge, air wrench! A lot of people are going to only use 1/4” or 3/8” nylon spiral hoses for their blow nozzles.
Another huge restriction is the hose reel!!!
Hello from north east Montana.
10 miles from the Canadian border.
I have a old (from the 80's) 30 gallon Compressor on 220v and run it at 90psi with a 50ft 3/8" hose, it never really feels starved but i do get a small kick when the compressor comes on after a few seconds. I've used my impact gun on small tanks at a friends house, seem to struggle for air after the first 2 seconds of use. At that point i start to use it in 2 second bursts to let the compressor keep up.
I like the guy that comes in and says he is using a 1/2 air line but the coupler is stepped down to 1/4 inch and doesn't understand why he has low power
That would make little noticeable difference if any, but good try, trying to come up with a scenario that you hypothesized would resonate with people who know what they're talking about... 🙄
@@OGRHit’s funny what’s your problem
lol @@OGRH
@@looking_33he's right though. That wouldn't produce much of a bottleneck
3/8" is the best compromise IMO not too bulky and not too restrictive.
As a heavy Duty field Mechanic I can definitely attest to these tests! We run VMAC under hood air compressors set to 150 psi and use “p” style fittings. If were doing a big engine overhaul ( like 9390 cubic inches big!), we usually tie two trucks air tanks together and run a 1” air hose to feed a shorter 1/2” line for the 3/4” Impact guns. Time is money and when you have 16 cylinder heads to remove with 10 1” head studs torqued to 660 lb/Ft each you can’t be pissing around with weak ass air tools!!
Oh man, I'd love to see a test comparing different coupler types! Used to work at a shop where a guy swore up and down that Lincoln (L style) fittings were superior in every way - lasted longer, didn't leak, etc... so I bought all L style couplers for all my tools just to play nice with the delusional fantasy created at that shop... turns out they're the exact opposite he claimed. They're fragile and leak like a sieve, and the female couplers are *chonkers*. When I quit I quickly binned all those couplers and went back to M style.
I run 3/8's, used 1/2" before. It is noticable, that being said. The bulky 1/2" in a factory where you have 20-30' and you are 15 ft up, that extra weight does cause some issues. The 3/8" rubber hose is really a good compromise.
We have miles of 3/8. Our foreman tried to order 1/4 and that was a mistake. 3/8 seems to be all we ever need in wood process and Manufacturing
As someone that identifies as toolsexual, I'm really digging the trend of videos comparing different brands and sizes of tools!
My friend complained about his impact power years ago. He took my advice and got a 1/2 air hose. That solved his problem with stubborn bolts. More volume over pressure.
A suggestion to improve your source impedance or performance for the air supply: you can improve the performance of the pressure delivered to the tool by placing a small tank and the connection of the hose ( this would act as a capacitor if that makes sense to keep a constant pressure at the supply connection ). So at the end of the pipe where you connect your hose, place a small tank ( the size of a 1 pound propane tank ) to act as a transient supply ( capacitor ) for the pulsing guns.
If you need better description please let me know. This would in essence give you better tool performance and data removing the air supply as a parameter.
In electronics, this is called source impedance. The lower the source impedance, the less voltage droop. Power supplies compensate with a capacitor ( local storage for charge close to the load ).
FYI, this is getting picky but just in case you were looking for content ideas! Also, tool designers should entertain this idea as well!
Love the channel! Keep up the good work!
“Slumming it with a 1/4”” that killed me 😂
everyone at my shop uses 1/4 😭
@@hunterXhamster hope the airlines are for blowing off benches lol
Please do test air fittings and such... as a DIY, I get to make one purchase, good or bad I have to stick to it for years before I can get the "should have bought that one" correction. great channel, great content.
I LOVE IT!! This helps folks decide if spending the extra for 1/2" lines is really necessary for their usage of air tools.
This is a test I've been waiting for. I knew the higher volume of air would obviously see higher torque, surprised at how little difference there was at the end of the test. Well done as always and I'm very much looking forward to the 1250k as I've been eyeing it for a while now. Thanks bud, keep crushing!
I figured the exact opposite.. Like if you have a 25 foot 1/4 vs a 1/2, you have twice the volume to pressurize. I figured that release and build up every time the impact rotates its hammer would rob some power..
Joe Homeowner here. Just stumbled across your channel and hit play because I have a big box bought Milwaukee 6 gal compressor (C2002) with whatever hoses/adapters I got with it. Used it with a Brad nailer (pre battery everything) and now mostly as a car tire filler and general blower. The thing has always leaked and the noisey-arse compressor is always going on. Always bothered me but wasn’t sure of next steps plus I hardly use it.
Your channel has great info and your presentation software is first rate. Happy to subscribe and spread the word!
you should definitely do the different types of fittings, my business needs new air ends bad and i would like to see what the best bang for my bucks would be as to what style to overhaul it with!
Milton P
Start by using a drill bit to measure the ID of the male quick couplers. I don’t care what brand name it is a 5/32” hole will flow less air than a 3/16” hole or a 7/32”!
There is a brand of quick couplers out there that only has a 5/32” hole, they are long, with pretty red, white & blue packaging, with a huge, huge name!
Im using the milton v style hi flo Quick connect i have noticed a difference even with 3/8 hose. I bought these not for my impact ( also use it hor that) but for my TD 58 Plasma cutter. I was getting a significant drop in pressure on long cuts this was with milton Quick connect M style connectors. The high Flo has mast a significant improvement with 50ft hose
Milton G
If you really want to wake one up you run a half inch line from a dedicated port on the tank straight to the gun and make every fitting as big as you can. If you work in an engine shop that ports heads you tend to port everything when it's slow.
It will make that grandpa gun run like the matco if you port the ex side of the old one.
It will be stupid loud and still just as heavy but powerful enough to break sockets every week,
SMA brought me here mentioning how cool your guys videos were long before you got his impact and love seeing all the technical stuff on this. you are doing a great job, keep it up
The smallest port ID will be the greatest restriction and that is usually the coupler. The ID of the hose & coupler should be the same to get the most from any one combination.
It wouldn't matter in this setup. The air source is limited by the filter and regulator they are initially connected to. Anything after that is just minor restrictions from resistance in line size but the volume of flow is already a fixed value before the line sized come into play. This is why the 3/8 line and the 1/2 inch lines peak similarly but follow a very similar power curve. The initial burst on the 1/2 inch line is from the extra volume of the line storing compressed air volume. Once that reserve is depleted and replenished from the source (regulator), the air flow is restricted by the source more than anything.
In contrast, the 1/4 inch line is actually smaller than any upstream restrictions so it has a dramatic affect on the flow rate.
If they had a 1 inch setup from the air tank (supply) out to the difference in line size, your fitting argument would have a much more noticeable impact on the results.
That is unless I misunderstood your statement and used 5 times the words to say the same thing.
@@sumduma55 Yeah almost any time you're going through a pressure regulator, THAT is your smallest restriction... unless you're expecting unrealistic things from 1/4" fittings.
Well done video, all true what you say, As been working with standard air tools and air torque tools, i can tell that the minimal difference between 3/8" and 1/2" hoses is that your tool does not consume more flow than can be provided by the 3/8" hose at that length. It will be a major difference if you tested for example an Atlas LMP 51 or similar. The difference would be in shorter time to reach desired torque.
I put a 3/8 coupler on my 3/8 hose and it brought my 1/4" angle drill to life. No more struggling when using the 2.5" grinder discs/3M scotch pads. Same for my 3" cutter. I thus concluded volume into the tool was as important if not more so than pressure.
I've got a IR 231 too but was lacking power. There are huge limitations of air flow if you use a hose reel (for instance, at the brass elbow fitting, off the reel where you connect to the compressor), there are passages that restrict air. So, I purchased a separate 3/8 rubber goodyear 50 ft hose and put it on a wall hook near my compressor. I now use high flow fittings. The seperate line is used when I need to move alot of air. This is what I run my impact on. Made a huge difference. The impact is extremely powerful and does not struggle. The only thing I use of the other line (the reel) is filling tires, blowing air, or low volume tools.
At our shop, we use 1” air lines and 3/8” fittings for 1/2” impacts, 1/2” fittings for 3/4” impacts. We also run 175 psi out of a 250 gallon compressor with a reserve tank of 250 gallons. The Thor is able to do semi truck lug nuts just as well as my 3/4” IR and my boss’ napa 772L 3/4”. Really speaks to how far 1/2” impacts have come.
I did NOT expect that. I expected it to be a bit of a difference but that's just insane.
I really need to reevaluate my system because all my tools are old air hungry tools and in some cases I thought they were just getting too old, might have been the new smaller hoses.
Awesome work, thank you for this, subscribed and upvoted.
You know, you made a great decision to create this channel. It's a niche channel, but extremely useful. Congratulations, this channel helps me a lot to understand my impact wrenches, pneumatic and electric and choose the best option for my money.
I know this is an older video so more than likely this would benefit someone just watching this.
There is zero doubt that the Milton V type of air fitting is the best. What most people don't realize is that to get the best price go straight to their website. Nobody beats their price. Now if you only buy a handful of them then get them wherever it's convenient.
When I discovered these about 10 years ago. I found out that the more I needed was a lot more expensive.
I am basically a DIY mechanic like that since the 80s. I have a big addiction to buying tools. So I have basically a boatload of air tools. And I want new fittings for all of them and the chuck that goes on the end of your air hose that you plug into. They have it where you buy more the better value you get. I bought my feelings by the full box which at the time was 10 in each box. The air chuck is sold by the piece. I picked up two of them just to keep one on hand. The good thing about theirs is that all air fittings fit inside the air chuck.
6:48 Pneumatic nail and staple guns don't mind a small diameter line like 1/4" at longer lengths. They run just fine on a 1/4" line and they're far lighter which construction guys like. When you're throwing around a big framing nailer the last thing you wanna do is pull around a heavy air hose too.
Larger lines only increase flow...as long as the psi is level.
Good test.
I use 3/8 lines at my bays as due to good air supply routing I only need 15ft hose and the short length mixed with quality 3/8 hose makes it a treat work with all day long , 1/2 reserved for longer hose and more air hungry tools .
The lines inside an impact wrench through the handle to the rotor and veins in the motor section are going to be your weakness when using 1/2" air line!
Excellent, the 3/8s did well. Carrying a 1/2" vs 3/8" around is noticeable. Very well done, relevant, thorough, ect ect
Take a look at the effective orifice size in your regulator. Also, compare the orifice size and length in the quick couplings.
I'm glad you put in the IR with 3/8 vs SMA with 1/4. That really drives home the point on improvement over the years.
I plumbed my whole shop with 1/2" copper tubing and shark bite connectors. My 60gal compressor does 155psi, but is rated for 4.6cfm at 90. The main bottlenecks are the end of the hosing going into a reel on my ceiling that's 3/8" flexzilla hose with 1/4" npt industrial style ends. It's my home garage so I don't need anything crazy, but I set it up for 1/2" so if in the future I needed to upgrade I had the ability to.
Flexzilla has 1/2" reels now
I have a booster tank with 1/4, 3/8 and 1/2 couplings that I use with when I'm dealing with stubborn bolts or if I need to use a 100 foot hose to reach. It makes a massive difference on large bolts and nuts found on semi-trucks. Ofcourse you need to put short hoses on your guns to get the benefits but that's actually something you should do anyway to prevent coupling wear.
Being that I only run a 6 gallon setup I'm relieved I have a 3/8" middle of the road. Thanks for your test results and sharing.
Nice channel.
A couple observations and how they would affect things in the real world:
One is that the extra torque in the 1-2 second range provided from the 1/2 hose is really going to improve productivity. The percentage difference seems to have peaked at around the 2 second mark. The other is that it probably improves tool life because you aren't hammering for nearly as long. I'm just a DIY'er, but the next time it comes to replace air hoses, it will be 1/2 from now on.
Another observation I found interesting, and it was hard to see on the graph, was when the 3/8 hose had emptied it's line pressure. It was more subtle than the 1/4 line, but the difference in raw numbers with the 1/2 was about 80 ft lbs.
I strapped a 1/2" x 100' Flexzilla hose on my hose reel and never looked back vs two 3/8" x 50' hoses. I ditched two couplings as well. Very noticable increase in torque. Not to mention I really like the Flexzilla hose. I wish I could get away with 50' but I need the extra length the way my shop is arranged.
I've used air wrenches on hobby projects for 50 years. I have several from air ratchets through butter fly wrenches to 3/8" and 1/2" pistol grip wrenches. I like them but my two Milwaukee cordless wrenches are rapidly spoiling me. I can't say how much I like not dragging the hose around. But for more torque, Air wrenches are much more affordable than cordless because of the battery cost. For that reason I'd like to see you test some 3/4" and 1" air wrenches, especially those from HF which are quite affordable even if they require bigger air hose and high flow couplers. I have an older than dirt Sears compressor that delivers 7cfm @ 90 psi. It has a big enough tank that if I let it pump up after breaking loose a nut with a big 11cfm wrench, in three or four minutes I can do another. It works great with 1/2" air wrenches.
this makes sense to me..... for my garage I had setup a 100lb propane tank as a reserve and originally put a bunch of M fittings(everything disconnected, as to keep it modular) and used 1/4 line, was finding it wasn't really cutting it for using pneumatic tools so I decided to use PEX(regular water grade) in the place of the main run that ran to a 1/4 reel, noticed an improvement but it still had room for improvement....... shopped around and got a 3/8 auto retracting 100ft hose and it's was near perfect!:)......same reserve tank, skipped most the M fitting(less modular but found it was part of the limiting); it's all 1/2 to the reel or m fittings(multiple drops to plug into; may upgrade to V-Style at some point)
I'd like to see one of those small protable air tanks turned into a inline auxiliary air tank and about a 6 foot 1/2" line. I would think a setup like that would give the best results.
I am adding two 11 gal portable air tank tanks to my 6 gallon air compressor.
Would have thought the 1/2" line would of given more. I guess you need a 3/4" impact to take advantage of it. I'd like to see milton G style thrown in to the mix of couplers. To save on the price of a 1/2" air line, I've even contemplated having a 3/8" line to an airpig, and then a 1/2" - 6 foot whip to the gun, but don't want to get too bojangly at work. Keep up the great work, looking forward to seeing this channel grow. cheers
You want the big hose on the long run. A short 3/8 hose won’t reduce it as much as a long 3/8 hose. Ideally you’d have a long 1/2 hose then the short 3/8 whip hose on the tool.
Let’s see it again on 50’ hoses. Also let’s see the connector comparison!
Would have loved to see the 1/2" air line used with a short 3/8" hose whip. This would be a more real world example.
See the results of the 3/8 hose. Its a "weakest link" equation. The difference would be in the de-expansion of fully swollen hose, probably a bit longer high slope before leveling off to pure air flow, were it would join to identical to the 3/8 line.
@@snap-off5383 are you sure? The 1/2" will have less of a pressure drop than the 3/8 when flowing.
@@joshuacoomes6388 The relaxing of the hose will take longer yes, after that,the pressure will be the same, that of the source, factored in with the length (still the same) and smallest restriction (still the same). No I'm not "sure" its just what I think. I could be proven wrong.
@@snap-off5383 I thought the same way until I had some physics training. The diameter of the hose has a different effect if smaller/larger when things are moving. Yes the pressures will be the same, but when air is moving through the hose there is a pressure drop. I think its Bernulli's equation that explains it. Yes, the small whip will cause a huge restriction, and my point may be so minimal that it can't be noticed. I dont know either, but I do believe that the 1/2 hose with a whip, or 3/8 nipple will still outperform the 3/8 hose of same length. It may be easier to see if you compare a 90 degree street elbow versus a 90 degree with a 6 inch centerline radius. The gradual bend will obviously flow more and have less of a pressure drop. The restriction the bend creates to flow can be compared the restriction and the end of a hose.
@@snap-off5383 you make me wanna snap-on
I used to love my 1/2 Aircat impact. Now it sits abandoned in the bottom drawer of the most unused box in my ragtag fleet of fugitive toolboxes, along with it's brothers: 3/8 IR ratchet, 1/4 Snap On ratchet and many others. Unused , yet still loved.
Milwaukee came to town .
'Nuff said .
I use the Lincoln style fittings. Makes connecting and disconnecting much easier. I know they are not super high flow though. Need an oversized type.
Awesome content. What I gather from this is 1/4 hoses are for pool floats and if you do any real work a 3/8 at the minimum should be used.
Good summary!
WHAT DOES 840 POUNDS PER SQUARE INCH FEEL LIKE... AND WHAT IS THE MOST POWERFUL CORDLESS HALF INCH IMPACT GUN ON THE MARKET PLEASE CAN YOU TELL ME . YOUR CHANNEL IS THE GREATEST CAN'T WAIT FOR MORE VIDEOS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Good video, proves Flow makes it GO!!!
I had to switch to my sprinkler blow out tap and 5/8" garden hose to break loose a harmonic balancer bolt. It was sketchy for sure but definitely provided more beans than my 3/8" hose with 1/4" fittings.
I used to use air tools for everything because the foundry I worked at was rigged up for air everywhere. I bought a bunch of Milwaukee battery tools now and it's a lot easier for facilities that don't have air all over.
Waiting for this channel to blow up soon. Quality content dude! Awesome work
Great video! Would love to see the video on the testing of the fittings. I must say, I'm very confused by the selection and sizes of all the different fittings. A recommended basic setup (lines and fittings) that would work well for the average user would be very helpful.
We have an 1" Air impact. We usually use the 1/4" for it because the hammer is very heavy and usually it looses everything in our car workshop at the lowest setting. Looks like we need an upgrade if we really need more power. My idea was to get an little tank with a short 1/2" air hose so we dont need to buy an 20m 1/2" hose for it.
Randomly found this channel and its pretty dope. I worked in nascar as a tire changer and we used Oetiker flow through fittings on everything and were the standard for the guns and also 1/2" hoses were used alot but at the lower levels where I was at we were typically used 3/8" and there was definitely a difference when hooked up to a nitrogen bottle.
I always run 13mm ID hose, awkward as hell to route in to places, but I know that the 3/4” Bahco or UT 498 is gonna hit hard from the off. Great videos, keep up the testing!!
Or just pull it out when necessary
Coupler teeest! My current shop uses Lincoln fittings, but all my tools were aro so I run an adapter whip to my tools
I would be very interested to see you test the different couplers. I am just about to switch couplers in my shop going from Milton A style couplers to Milton V style couplers. A friend made a similar switch and says it is a big difference but doesn't have a way to quantify the change.
It's noticable, also try the prevost high flow with push buttons, they are fantastic.
Skip all that junk and go straight to milton P style, the V dont flow anywhere near advertised
@@5002strokeforever the milton v style or prevost s1 (German) is high flow.
Excellent test! Thanks for this information. The graphs are a nice touch.
This was an excellent video. Thank you for your detail and graphic display to show the differences. Well Done!
This comment goes to the creator of this video... as I need serious help. I've been delaying my introduction into air tools as there have been SO many variables to take into account. I bought a nice compressor a couple of years ago however I haven't really used it due to my hesitations over hose selection, coupler selection, etc...
1) FANTASTIC video. I'm not sure how I ended up here... but I did... and I seriously appreciate the quality of this video. My questions concerning hoses has now been answered. 3/8" hoses are the best fit for me.
2) Now the couplers. Should the coupler diameter match the hose diameter in order to get the most out of your tool? My compressor came fitted with a 1/4" coupler and the handful of tools I have so far (impact wrench, air chisel, tire inflator/gauge) also came fitted with 1/4" couplers. I've understood that the air getting to your tool is limited by the smallest diameter between your compressor and your tool. So even though I would be using a 3/8" hose... the fact is... all of my couplers are 1/4" - so would I be seeing any benefit in using the 3/8" hose? Or am I supposed to change all of my couplers to 3/8"?
Similarly, the airline coming out of the compressor is 1/4" to the coupler on the compressor... and the tool itself is obviously fitted with 1/4"... Can you PLEASE help?
Thank you SO much in advance.
A common misconception is 1/4" fittings mean anything on it measure 1/4". The fitting size is based on threads, which are 1/4 NPT, and npt threads have nominal names that have nothing to do with a measurement. 1/4" npt measures around 3/8" on the htreads. That said, the inside diameter of a 1/4" air fitting is also small, varying by type of fitting. Couplers will always bee the bottle neck. We cant test that for you, but generally we feel milton type V 1/4" is plenty on 3/8" line.
Excellent channel. I'm very interested in the couplings. I did some of my own experiments and the couplings had a much, much larger impact on pressure drop than 50ft of air line did.
Also can you plot air pressure along with torque in your charts? Torque is nice to have but it only tells half the story. Thanks.
perhaps an oddity, what of 3/8 hose with 1/4 fittings (e.g. on a 'home / diy') tool? A big impact or negligable please?
Awesome video, would love to see testing done with various extensions, adapters like 1/2 to 3/8, universal joints, impact socket vs standard sockets.
I have always been curious how this affects some of the impacts that I have like the m12 stubby or the mid torque gen 2.
In my case with a normal compressor for like home use and stuff we had a small diameter hose(I cant remember what size but I thonk it was a 5mm one) and the impact couldnt even bust a bolt from a carwheel loose. Than we bought a 10mm inner diameter hose and now it really works. We have a quite good air compressor but no industrial one and we also got a 40 bucks Impact Kit, so the tool and a Socket set and an extention(which I did not use).
Milton P style is by far the best flowing fittings ever
I know you’re addressing impact wrenches, but my dad has been building things all his life. With large wood buildings, he doesn’t want to move his compressor all day or waste money on hundreds of feet of 1/2” hoses. When you really get moving with a framing nailer, you can run short on pressure in the lines. He would keep an old, bare compressor tank around to use as a capacitor and splitter so multiple nailers stood a better chance of not loosing pressure while sheeting a building.
The best static pressure for air driven Tools like this air gun is 174 psi or 12 bar, for smaller tools it's between 7.5 to 10 bar
I know a lot of people today especially younger people are getting away from air compressor. I feel that there's a place for both of them. If you are out working on your vehicle and you're not doing major work than the battery operated tool should do well. If you were really getting in there deeply I feel an air tool is perfect for that type of situation. You don't need to worry about running out of power and yes I know you can buy a second battery for what he's batteries are selling for you could practically get a smaller air compressor and never worry about a dying battery.
For anybody who is looking for the Milton fittings you should go to their website in order correctly from them. When I first switched over to them if I was to order from Amazon or ebay going to cost a great bit of money. I went to the company's website and was able to buy everything I wanted plus extra and never even came close to what Amazon and eBay for selling them for. I buy them by the box I cannot remember off the top of my head how many fittings that is. I also use their coupler since it's bigger inside. And let me tell you what if you buy these settings no matter where you get them from hold it up to your old one. A complete night and day difference. It almost looks like the old fitting could fit inside my new one. That is how big of a difference it is. I use their V versions. That's the biggest opening that they have and the threaded end is quarter inch so that way you don't need to buy adapters.
As always I enjoyed your video and always looking forward to watching more.
A couple more ideas for you. If you do a video on the fitting types, I'd love to see what different swivel fittings do to performance, if anything. The hinge type and the ball swivel type. I use the the hinge type from HF on some tools and the Flexzilla ball swivels on other tools.
Also, I once saw something about how to hold an impact for maximum performance. They were saying that if you just hold it loosely on the fastener that it would perform better than pushing up against the impact like you might a drill. Makes sense to me, but how much difference, if any, would there be?
Half inch hose and V style couplers, it also keeps people from borrowing your air tools.
Actually go with Milton G style. They are rated at 99 cfm vs Milton V at 74 com but they are big and heavy like the 1/2" hose vs 3/8" hose
I will give them a try
I'd be interested in seeing tests on the different couplers, especially T-style automotive 1/4 NPT with 3/8 ID hose. Thanks for all the great info you provide!
It is refreshing to see someone that gets this. Try working with someone who uses a 1” impact and 1/4” quick connect fittings. He thinks I’m the idiot who doesn’t understand.
Not even joking btw. 1/2” air hose with some reducers for his quick connect. Then his 1” (all air tools really) impact has a couple bushings to get it down to the 1/4” air fitting. Every time I see it I scream on the inside-might as well use a smaller impact!
Just found this channel, great content guys. Keep up the good work.
Thank you for the great videos you put out. This has become my go to channel for these types of products. Would love to see a video on how air hose length affects air line working pressure, ie, 25' vs 50' vs 100' hose. Again, thanks for sharing.
I have a CP 721? 1/2” that I bought in 1990 when I was working at the John Deere, Steiger dealership. No, it is not the Central Pneumatic!
It is a Chicago Pneumatic with the numbers stamped in to a metal tag, riveted to the wrench. The reason that I am not sure of the model number is dings from years of use, a lot of abuse, and torquing out of my grip. Every year to 2 years I put in a rebuild kit from CP. This 1/2” air wrench will take off 50% of the Budd or piloted rims on semis that have not been put on by a 1” wrench and someone who loves to pull the trigger.
What I do is unscrew the whip hose, screw the 3/8” by 50’ hose to the wrench. So now it comes out of the compressor though a 1/2” ball valve, to my 3/8” x 50’ air hose, to my wrench.
It is amazing how much the old air wrenches preform without the restriction of the quick coupler!
A lot of guys use to use the long Lincoln quick couplers, I took each of their male tips, put a drill bit down it to measure the ID of the tip. Some common quick couplers are not even 3/16”!
Just like the 3/8” vs 1/4” air hose!
Another good tip on an impact wrench is to put on a 3/8” by 6’ whip hose, it has nothing to do with stopping the vibration from the quick couplers, it is a reserve of unrestricted air next to your impact wrench.
I think that is why your 3/8” test climbs faster than your 1/4” test. Then they tend to flatline because of the restrictions of the 2 quick couplers.
When I was at the JD-Steiger dealership, they had an old 5/8” air wrench that would out do some new 3/4” pistol grip air wrenches. But it used A LOT of air, shop law was you had to have leather gloves on to use the 5/8” wrench! It would twist right out of your hands, if you did not know how to hold it.
The shop foreman went down and bought my same 1/2”, and 3/4” Chicago Pneumatic air wrenches for his service van after using mine.
Check out the ID of your male air quick couplers, remove the quick couplers from the compressor, get rid of the hose reels, install a 6 foot whip hose on your impact wrench. You will probably be surprised by how much power that your impact wrench has!!!
Hello from north east Montana.
10 miles from the Canadian border.
I would love to see the findings on air line fittings. I have searched and haven't found a video that puts out the data your videos do. I have started my own testing swapping over several of my air tools over to hi Flo fittings
I just switched to 3/4" bore red hose to connect my compressors and receiver tank, and Chicago couplings are easily adapted to thinner hose "whips" at the working end if desired.
Yes please test the different types of fittings! That would be really helpful.
Prevost is the best air hose I have ever used.
The smallest restriction in an air circuit will determine its power transfer. Longer supply hose is like a long skinny storage tank, no effect on power plus or minus. Ideally the tool would be the smallest restriction in the circuit.
Old video I know but another consideration that should help someone decide is not only line length but how that length affects pressure loss. Do your tools need volume or pressure?
I would love a video on all the air fittings! I never knew until recently they had different styles like the automotive fittings.
How about changing to 3/8 fitting ? I switched my 1/2 impact wrench from 1/4 to 3/8 fitting and noticed a big power gain
That's what I actually wanted to see
I was looking at 3/8 fitting before I went with Milton V, Milton V have the same ID as 3/8. I have since upgraded to Milton G.
@@WarWolfX1 I google image Milton v fitting and looks very similar to 3/8 fitting I use on my air tools.. good choice!!
G fittings all the way
If I understood correctly (and I may not have) you adjusted the regulator for each individual hose tested to supply the same running pressure at the tool. Can you explain your rationale for that? It seems to me that setting the regulator pressure higher at the upstream end of the smaller hoses tends to offset the restriction of the smaller hoses, and makes that test less of an apples-to-apples comparison. Also, I'm curious, which has a higher air flow? The wrench spinning up freely with no load or the wrench working under load? Just off the top of my head, I'd guess that the free spinning wrench would flow more air, but these things aren't always what they seem.
I myself would love to see the effect of the several style fittings
How about showing some love for Chicago Pneumatic CP7755? That thing looks like a beast. It has the stubbier and wider profile that will fit in tight spaces.
Great video, I'm also interested in the torque tester you use. Is there a video how you build it?
Yessir! ua-cam.com/video/yWBpWRZtCbw/v-deo.html
@@TorqueTestChannel You channel is great. I know you will reach 1 million subs globally. 👍
its one thing testing for how much power you use/lose but not everyone has a massive air compressor. how about doing a test on how much air gets used between the hose sizes ?
We used to use 3/4 inch line when I was in the army. That’s because we had an 1” impact for the larger trucks but we used 1/2” drive most of the time. We just didn’t want to switch out lines. We found 3/4” line works better than 1/2”. But just by observation no scientific stuff done. Be nice to see you try 3/4” line.
To answer the question Why do 1/4" x 100' hoses exist I think it's for paint shops as I don't think they need the larger volume that the larger ID hoses can provide.
That or (jokingly) so you can park 80' away and still fill up your car tires.
I've always removed the quick connects and threaded the hoses straight into the tool if I needed an absolute max effort ugga dugga. I'd like to see how that compares.