About the screenshot part. The environment setting is no big deal. I recall DA1-3, the first thing in my mind is Hawke from DA2 then the "broken sky" in DA3. A strong character gives more Impressions
Its pretty good. Especially since your main focus is talking about the lessons and memories and not the game itself as much compared to the other parts.
Loved this!! Out of curiosity, what is the score playing in the background? SOunds like something by Alan Silvestri who did Predator and Back to the Future.
Fantasy games of DAO's era were trapped, somewhat, by the overwhelming success of the LotR movies. Everything looked like Peter Jackson's Rivendell. Since popular culture didn't have a big obvious dwarf art style, which is why (I think) DAO's depiction of Orzammar is so distinctively "Dragon Age".
Your point about symmetrical combat was fascinating. As someone who has long thought that RPGs should be rules-based simulations, symmetrical rulesets are mandatory. The game's mechanical rules describe the physical rules of the in-game reality. I very much enjoyed how obviously absurd DA2's asymmetrical mechanics were in comparison, because I felt they made my argument for me. Because DA2 had wildly different damage and hitpoint rules for PCs vs. NPCs, the in-game reality effectively prevented war, because two NPCs were uncapable of hurting each other. For me, the game world needs to feel like it exists for its own sake, and isn't there merely so I can explore it, and the game world's physical reality is part of that. I'm still solidly on the symmetrical mechanics side of the argument, though, perhaps because I think of all of these games like they're simulations.
Origins really was something special and a golden example of what the quintessential wrpg was in the 2000s. This was the game that made me a bioware fan
I think the Origin stories, apart from being a tutorial, were also meant to convey to the player their characters' standing in the world. It complements the lore and the world building.
That section at the end on communication, listening, and understanding and how people can entrench is so very true, and not just in game design. That's good advice for anything intrapersonal!
Thanks for this! It's super interesting to see insight on the game from the lens of someone who saw through so much of it, and I truly appreciate your thoughts on DA as a saga and DA4 in particular. I hope you don't feel somehow coerced or compelled to do these because of your connection to the series, even if so many know and like you because of it! All best for you and the channel, Mark
I'm just starting my career as a Producer in the games industry (actually at EA 😱) and the series that set me on this path was Dragon Age. I'm so grateful to hear you discuss what production was like on the titles and the insight from a production standpoint feels invaluable. Definitely got yourself a new subscriber!!!
While I loved the origins stories for the races and various classes in Origins, I can understand why this would be difficult to translate into DA2, DAI, and DA4 and so on. Even in DAI with the quest Here Lies the Abyss there were so many options and quantum characters that could potentially be the warden.
Very educational video! It's very interesting how you guys considered having the Avvar as one of the Origin stories. Also, your analysis on High vs Low / Dark vs Epic fantasy is thought-provoking. I've always admired the dark underbelly of DAO and DA2. Especially DA2 with the Blood magic, discrimination via Templars vs Mages and all that jazz. DAI defiantly felt more like high fantasy. DA4 would be interesting if the blended aspects of the classic Darker Fantasy aspects with the higher fantasy mix of magic
I wish I had even an ounce of the optimism and faith you have in DA4. At this point, my enthusiasm has definitely waned--a thing that I didn't think was actually possible, but here we are. Thanks for your take on events, though. This was a great, informative vid.
Mark, please allow me to convey my sincere appreciation for your videos. I’m a big fan of the Dragon Age and Mass Effect series, and your perspective allows a peek behind the curtain for those of us so eager to learn more. Keep ‘‘em coming! -Dr. Rob Adelman
This is great insight, and great video. Thank you for taking the time to really give us your thoughts and lessons. I’m one of the people that miss the darker fantasy that Origins had, and hope to see it come back again. But it also makes sense that they’ve wanted to move further away from that. It would be nice to see remasters or remakes, although it isn’t very likely. I really think the story and lore of Dragon Age is something that could really grab people again, with a lot of people I know more open to fantasy after Game of Thrones and Witcher. But it’s hard to get my casual friends to give it a go, since they play primarily on PlayStation. They can’t play the older games at all. I’d love to hear some of the lessons learned from the smaller DLC’s for Origins, because they were so wildly different from each other. As well as DA2, and DAI. And I’d also like to see your thoughts and hopes for Dragon Age 4, and the future of Dragon Age after that.
Fwiw, i remember being sold on this wold on the premise of ' what if fantasy characters didn't have european accents by default?'. That hit so hard. I had my wallet out of the holster. Varric is amazing.
This is really interesting! Makes sense that origins are hard to implement as multiple tutorials. I suppose the ideal solution would be a tutorial prologue, where you play as Duncan or something, which then would end and you as the player make your character creation choice, but then the origin isn't the first experience of the game so it loses some weight as the first impression.
@@MarkDarrah I do love the origins, and enjoyed that DA:I gave your character a background history, even if its not as defined as origins. I hope future Dragon Age games keep that element, even if it is difficult to implement!
You could do what spellforce 1 does. In spellforce 1 you have the main game. You build your character and then hit play. There is a checkbook at the bottom corner to skip the prologue. The prologue is the tutorial section. In that section you play as a different character. A burned out warrior who despite being immortal is spent. With the tutorial quest being to find a special rune. This rune is used to summon the character you designed, tieing it into the main story. This would allow for a set tutorial section that ties into the story, but doesn't really matter to the player, afterall the area you play in, what you do, and even what you accomplish isn't overly important. It is ultimately a fetch quest, with almost no lore on why any of this is happening, but comes after the opening cinematic explaining how the world was broken. For the player it doesn't add to their characters story (as the object is immediately given to the player to free them from their magical enslavement and then promptly forgotten), or their power (your playing as someone else and nothing is transfered), and what you learn in the tutorial in terms of lore, and world building is just the basic elements that are repeated across the main game (the rune-warrior were a race of immortal magic slaves and are disliked by all the other races for the sheer power they can posses literally summoning entire armies out of nowhere and stomping enemies into the dust) all other lore is there for you to find. This allows for a single tutorial to be built, and then partitioned such that players can just press skip on a rerun of the game.
A lot to digest in this one! I did inadvertently guess your coda to the video 10 minutes in: "Oh, this sound very similar to what's happening now..." So brownie points for me? The chart of the series' trajectory was very interesting, because we ended up only getting into Dragon Age once it hit that upper right quadrant. I wonder how much the audience shifted between Origins/2 and Inquisition. Or maybe the audience just matured alongside it?
You played a role in creating one of the most formative works of creative expression. Dragon Age Origins is my favorite game of all time. I played through every origin, every ending and spent countless hours enjoying the world. Thank you to you and everyone that worked on that game.
Warden's Quest was primarily a marketing event. The two biggest boosts to quality improvement in DA:O were: 1) The ability to file bugs in-game in seconds with just a key press and a line of text. Screenshots, map, location, build version, and a pile of other data were automatically filled without having to pause the game and Alt+Tab to ExtraView. 2) Telemetry. Thanks to a talented Tech Designer, DA:O was the first BioWare game to incorporate and operate a telemetry system long before ship that enabled problem detection and decision-making based on data collected during development.
This is super insightful and interesting! Love Dragon Age Origins so this is super cool for fans to learn about. Thank you for sharing this info with us!!
This is very interesting! @Old Game Dev Advice One thing I wondered was this Gordian knot you referred to in your lessons learned, I appreciate the development difficulty it caused but dont you think perhaps that lead to creating a much more dynamic and organic world/story experience? Witcher 3 feels like it also had a similar Gordian knot where story paths crossed with others and the feeling that the world wasn't "siloed" into segregated buckets made for a marvelous RPG experience.
This video was really enlightening to watch! Thank you so much for it! The Dragon Age saga is, as a whole, probably my favorite saga ever, and while i see some flaws here and there, i adore every single of those games for different reasons. Regardless it's very interesting to have a developer's input on it. As it is this video makes me inch to replay DAO now which i shouldn't because i just finished replaying all of it like, one week ago on the specific goal to replay da2 with it.... DAO has an interesting gameplay, to me. I prefer aspect of the next two games but they're all here because DAO started them, and everyday i miss the specific type of tactic and skill menu of DAO. There's really the impression you can build in your own character in very specific way outside of the plot itself, which i really love. The areas are all so interesting to me and have their own personality, so i'm really glad that none of what ended up in the final game ended cut. I can complain forever about the Deep Roads but it'd just feel wrong if it wasn't there! (Especially in that case with how much it indicate the scale of the Dwarven Kingdom that was lost... The dread and the melancholy over all of this really makes it efficient to me). That said i do find the "origins make this game replayability" kind of funny because i personally want to replay with the different origins but always end up playing the same things ahah. For the same reason, i don't think the game is linear since if you want to mess around a bit you can do it in any order, but i've set myself up on a path of what area i think is best played first that i replay always in the same order. Still though it's always very fun for me, it never lost its charm. But my favorite thing to do is to reread the codex. I love the lore of this game a lot and i don't know how much was planned from the start, but it's so fascinating to see crumbs in DAO's codex that suddenly took a bigger meaning with the additional games of the franchise. I'm never bored and always excited about this saga. A remaster may be fun, i do have so many mods installed if only for lore consistancy that i understand the appeal, but also i find the games as they are really charming and immersive in their own way, fitting also a lot of the ambiance of the plot of the games imo, and the actual breathlessness i felt when i was back to Haven in DAI for the first time was only that great because of the way the two previous games were. Still today i sometimes log into DAI, in Haven, just to take in the whole thing. As it is i personally trust DA4 a lot. I've read the books and i like the plot directions, i've been trying to pay attention to some of the major developers who are still working on it and it gives me a lot of faith in it. The leaving of major devs, while concerning if only because i hope all of them are okay, seems to really echo what you brought up earlier in this video about the developments issues with DAO. and it gave us a really good game regardless so, i have faith. If you intend to do more videos on the others games of the saga, i would love them and gladly tune in! I just wish that it wouldn't come from you feeling pressured to do it. Take your time if you do intend to do them, if not, it's okay all the same! I've ended up rambling but this video really made me feel a lot of things about this saga and the internal outlook was so good. I always found dev stories fascinating. Thank you for sharing them!! I hope you have a nice day!
@@MarkDarrah That's kind of true, at least for the plot form. Still despite what i said i replayed this game soo many time and i did tweak a few things playthrough after playthrough on stuff i may have changed my mind on or influenced by future games (Alistair's fate in dao impacting dai's comes to mind). That said, and i can't believe i forgot that in my first post, the romances and the companions is eventually what makes this replayability. While i rarely change my main choices i will often swift around and pick new romances, and while i prefer playing as Mage which lock me into one origin, i did play 4 out of the 6 just to have an idea of the plots. But the romances really makes the replay worthwhile, and while i have my favorites i did manage sometimes to play other routes. The fact replay ability can be found on different levels does make it interesting imo, and none of my first playthrough are the ones i'm content with in term of little things. I can just never change the plot drastically despite the fact it's incredible it's a possible thing to do. For exemple in da2 i refuse to support the Templars even if i'm curious to see how it changes the game. It may be an illusion but it's a fun one to indulge in, and if it's not to replay it, i love to read about the different routes on the wiki, just to have an idea. So it's still nice that the possibility is there
The interesting thing about DAO to me is how many things are new events for me when I've replayed. Even if I'm playing the same type of character, a small change can bring new happenings. For instance, it wasn't until a play through a couple of years ago that I found out the entire Landsmeet can go sideways and turn into a huge brawl where everyone is down on the floor fighting each other. Also, if you play it right, you *can* beat Ser Cauthrien and her goons and never do the jail sequence. To this day, I've never triggered the famous cat army of Denerim.
@@julilla1 completely agreed with the whole post! I really love replaying because of that, just a few tweaks in an otherwise identical playthrough can change so many things! That said, I'm sorry, the Cat Army of Denerim??? What is it and how did i never hear of this wonderful thing until now omg (thank you for bringing it to my attention!)
Great video, nice to hear about practical game development like "avoid to make 6 tutorials" :D You bring me faith for DA4, cannot wait for its release!
Thanks for the video. I have very much enjoyed playing the Dragon Age series, and have subscribed to your channel so that I don't miss an opportunity to learn more about that series, and game making in general. While I like them all, I really like the cinematic feel of DA:O and DA:I, and like that they, in many cases, parallel the tried and true plot beats used in feature films. (they are tried and true for a reason: they work) It gives you the best of the enjoyment of a good film, but makes it even better by giving you, as the player, agency on how the story unfolds. The 'action' is always secondary to me. My only requirement is that it works, and does not become grindy or repetative. For fans like me who consume every bit of 'behind the scenes' material we can get our greedy eyes on, thank you for sharing your memories, insight & advice. It is much appreciated.
Appreciate your mentioning of the "darkness" in the themes of Origins vs the later games. I've struggled to put my own thoughts on it into words and I appreciate your thoughts and words on it!
The dark fantasy themes are actually something that I personally really miss but I can see how working on a similar project for a long time can have an impact on your mental health... I hope they can find a reasonable balance between dark themes and the overused "save the world from the big bad guy"
The dark fantasy themes are actually something that I personally really miss but I can see how working on a similar project for a long time can have an impact on your mental health... I hope they can find a reasonable balance between dark themes and the overused "save the world from the big bad guy" trope.
Thank you for posting this content :) been a dragon age fan since origins when a friend bought me it purely because it had "dragon" in the title and i like dragons. So fascinating to hear about how it was developed and the game making process in general :)
as a player and fan of the game i can say it all mixed perfectly and worked in the end The name is very simplistic, yet epic sounding The origin stories were all emersive and played a role in the world building instead of being "just out there" And while i personally thing there were some "hikups" like the extremely slow combat animations, and the longivety of "The Fade" i think it was overall very balanced between story and combat
Dragon Age: Origins is one of the few games that I call the best ever. And I kind of share your optimism on DA4, I'm hopeful it's going to be the comeback the franchise deserves.
Great video Mark! It's hard not to worry about the games creation when leaders leave the business as in the past its not been an indicator for success.
Thank you!! Listening to you saying>>: wasnt fully thought tru.. i think: what do you mean? We are talking about one of the greatest games I ever played. If this was the result of not fully thought tru, i am not worried about Dragon Ages Future :))
There isn't much to say here other than this is an extremely enjoyable video with great insight. Thanks for making the video I have always loved you videos and this one hits it right out the park. I especially agree with Dragon Age being with a more distinct art style. Also if you don't mind could I share this video around. I think it would be great to do so.
I know DAO always gets regarded as the darker dragon age, but honestly DA2 has some pretty dark stuff in there as well. I think it just gets overshadowed by the repeated areas and sarcastic Hawke.
Wow, this was super insightful and it was really great learning so much about the thought process behind Origins. And honestly I think my favorite part was the least none game dev part; 39:06 Hear and Understand. Communication is so important when working with others and just the slightest misunderstanding can start a gulf that was totally unintended. I think it doesn't help that alot of us are tech geeks who don't always pick up on the subtle interpersonal cues. Its definitely something I learned to be more aware of and be sensitive to in my own field. Great stuff man! Looking forward to checking out the rest.
Look i get it. There are lists upon buckets upon mountains of reasons devs don't talk shop online. But videos like this and what your channel is doing. Its invaluable for up and coming devs like myself. As well as an excellent source to dispel misinformation for gamers. Would just be nice if more devs could share, that's all. Have a good one.
@@MarkDarrah "nods" The best tutorials I've found are from seasoned devs. And I sub to channels like yours when I find them. Thanks for taking the time.
Thank you, both for this video and for making a game I love. I was never a fan of the ultra dark aspects of the series and never followed those routes anyway. I would like to sort of see a more “origins” like game, but that is mostly related to the characters (including the former player character having a bigger role). Yes I know the Warden cannot come back in a mainstream game, but a man can dream.
That was so interesting, I'm playing thorugh all the games again after finishing DAI for the first time, which I hope you're making a video like this about that game, too. Originally I was put off by the initital impression of Inquisition when it was released (Hinterlands "is that the game??", user reviews) , but especially at the end of Trespasser it turned into my favorite out of the three. I've read the book about the development by Jason Shreier and it's incredible how you all managed to put this game together as great as it is (despite the issues with the technology) and how well most of the changes to the general vibe worked. In a lot of ways it feels way more mature than DAO even though most would argue against that.
Very interesting to hear this for me as a laymen in game development knowledge. I am just a big consumer of games and love this kind of video when you get to know how things work in the industry. Thank you very much for your video and hard work 😊
This was really awesome! Everyone below has made all the comments I wanted to give, but I did want to talk about how special I think reactivity is. I love have npc's react to your character and how they present. Some of my most cherished memories of BW games is in being able to show a sexist character how wrong they are. I'm looking at you, Murdoch! 😆
Do you have any thoughts on voiced main characters v non voiced? I kind of miss having silent protagonists in RPGs nowadays that communicate through text and I feel like it helps a player immerse themselves into a character more than having a voice actor speak for the player character. A good example for this would be how much people (including myself) really see themselves as the Warden stepping up to take on the blight, being able to pick exactly what you want to say compared to picking a icon with a small bit of text and just hope the option is the response you actually wanted, kind of what we got with the Inquisitor and Hawke.
The general (though far from universal) case seems to be that the cinematic improvement allowed by a voiced protagonist outweighs the impact. But as you say, this isn't true for everyone.
Interesting perspectives! Even back in the day, I thought the developers made too much of art style for DAO. With some exceptions, players don't really notice or care. We want to play a fun game. DAO is still much loved.
@@MarkDarrah Yea. Less insanity than ME, more design opportunity space (and cpu) than Jade and swtor, well in retrospect In I’m not sure I would want to put anyone through that :-/
Great video! Special thx for adding the ending. I think the game will be fine too, but it is a bit concerning having people leave, especially one who took your spot. Also was it ever in the plans to play as the same character? I don't mind playing a new character, but coming to dragon age from mass effect I enjoyed having to play as the same person in the next game. 👍
@@MarkDarrah true, hopefully at some point. I remember the writer of the walking dead said he regretted having ricks arm cut off when he wrote the comics, that's why he never lost his arm in the TV series lol and btw you do know that in one of the endings in DAI the protagonist has a crossbow for an arm? Lol
There was recent departure, however, something about that particular departure was unusual and has me believe it had to do with the "attitude" (putting it politely) of said person rather than the actual creative-side. Which meant, they HAD to go.
Capcom did their own sort of project 10 dollar a few years back for games like Resident Evil 2 Remake and Devil May Cry V, but the framing was much better. They gave the DLC for free but it came out about 6 weeks in, so they just attempted to limit the amount of trade-ins during the crucial first month period by dangling the promise of additional content to early adopters who might otherwise finish and trade it in. The way it was framed was "oh free extra content" but it seems like it was meant to attack the same problem from another direction.
Yeah that is better. Both in that it likely keeps the disc in the tray better (that phrase is aging...) because of the delay but ALSO because it seems less like things were removed and MORE like things were added.
@@MarkDarrah It's so much about the framing of things, not that that really could have worked on Dragon Age, the way the game's structured is probably too fundamentally different for that strategy, a player wants Shale on day 1 or it's more of a headache, but it was interesting to see another stab at the idea.
for me personally dragon age was always a mix between high fantasy and dark fantasy and i kinda missed the dark fantasy part in inquisition. so vibe wise more adult with more explicit content and sometimes darker atmosphere similar to the witcher series but more high fantasy with big swords, badass armors and much magic.
Thank you for the great video. Having just finished Dragon Age origins and all its extra content the other week (Inquisition being my first experience with the franchise) this is a blessing. I absolutely loved the game and from my personal experience with games i think it has the best basis for roleplaying and player decisions input ever. while having enjoyed inquisition i am a bit sad because in my view a lot of aspects that made Origins so great are not in the forefront of inquisition. Ive also recently started DA2 and while a slow start im enjoying it more than i thought i would (i heard a lot of negative stuff about it). All in all im a bit concerned over the next title but your conviction does put me at ease and i hope that they make a great game. So once again thank you for making this type of content its enlightening and thank you specifically for doing this video on one of my favorite games of all time. P.S.: one small issue i have is that the romance options got less and less attractive from game to game
This video is fantastic. You've gained a sub. I think a lot of people are confusing tone with content when it comes to Dark Fantasy. All great fantasy keeps their supernatural workings behind the screens of mystery, one way or another. In Game of Thrones, the supernatural is associated with fire, and ice and they draw on the superstitions surrounding these things. Who cares if they had dragons? The game quests often dealt with extremism, sacrifice, revenge, rape, slavery, racism, mental illnesses, good intentions gone wrong, etc. Sure, some of these had 'Magic' in them, but they had this sense of immediate horror that made you go, "oh shit, that's just wrong!" When these elements are made mundane and the supernatural is being used the same way science fiction uses technology, the magic is robbed. Origins had many of these features from LoTR, from GoT, all combined in this Epic medieval setting. Indeed, the games after Origins aren't what you could call lighthearted, but they definitely changed in tone a lot.
I've heard stories of the chaos of DAO development before including from ppl like Trent Oster who would make regular appearances at various gamedev events around Edmonton when I was still living there. I realize there was a lot problems with the game, including mad crunch, but I still can't help but be in awe at how the game turned out. It's easily the best game of its type imo - that is, medieval fantasy rpg. The way the various strands of the story come together and are interconnected is really quite something I haven't seen in any other game. There's a real feeling like choices matter in a way that other games cannot match. I really wish someone would do a game like that again - where you can pick a character, have a different entry into the story based on those character creation options, and then have quests and storylines intertwined with major decisions as inflection points. I would be ok with such a game being much shorter or even more action-y so long as it gives you that feeling that you really are affecting the story and world as a player.
Hi Mark, love your videos. Thanks so much for doing these. I know this is an old video and you may not see this comment, but I have always wondering about the graphics situation with Dragon Age Origins. Origins has graphics that are closer to SWKOTOR than to Mass Effect 1, despite coming out at least a full year after Mass Effect. Was this a product of starting off with "lesser' graphics, such that by the time it was release date, there was no practical way of going back to "up" them? Thanks!
I was waiting for the next Memories and Lessons! I really appreciate that Dragon Age: Origins was next in the line. It took 7 years to make this ip, and release its first game! I see a lot of people say on anonymous forums and discord obnoxious stuff like: it took them 'x' years to make game 'y' and it still turned out so bad, yadda yadda, as if there is some magical button that automatically makes games and new franchises out of thin air. DA:O was my first Bioware game, and I was still a kid when I first played it. It was an exhilarating experience: not my favorite gameplay, but the music can only be described as ethereal and the story was beautiful! I have a few questions: What is Bioware's real stance on multiplayer games? It always seems to me like they want to make multiplayer or co-op games, but end up making them single player. Is this usually a studio decision or the publishers? Also what do you think about a voiced Hero of Ferelden if there is a DA:O remake?
I live in the hope of a Dragon Age: Origins remaster, because my current system will no longer RUN the game! I've seen several troubleshooting pages, and I usually try like one thing, it doesn't work, I look at the next one and think "that seems hard" and give up. :(
Super cool video as usual :) It's unfortunate that some fans will always be expecting a return to DAO's kind of "dark fantasy" (which to me was mostly juvenile to be honest), since you've mentioned in this and other videos already that due to the competition it's unlikely to happen. I can definitely appreciate DA as a series trying to set itself apart by exploring new domains. I think some of the concept art for DA4 already shows a bigger leap into "higher"-fantasy and more distinct concepts.
Very interesting. A question that popped at my mind while watching is: What's the usual knowledge level among game developers about software engineering's development process models?
@@MarkDarrah is it common for these models to be applied in game development? I ask that because sometimes stories of development crunches appear on the media and I wonder how that could happen when process models designed to avoid that exist.
@@SirCrusher they are used for sure. Agile in particular. However, agile doesn’t deal with either highly differentiated teams or dependencies very well. Kamban is gaining a foothold as well
I'd really like to hear more about the details for the Avvar origin for DAO. Is it true that the Urn of Sacred Ashes took place in it? How would that have differed between the Avvar version and the version we got in the final game with the Andraste cultists?
@@MarkDarrah Anything would be great Mark. You mentioned that the Commoner and Avvar were one and the same, but I heard that they were actually 2 different origins elsewhere?
Yeah, the thing with the fantasy sub-genres is that a lot of the time Epic Fantasy is also High Fantasy, or Dark Fantasy is also High fantasy. I find that the sub-genres tend to intertwine, and that's great for making a story compelling, but not great for trying to identify the sub-genre from a more narrow lens. Was Sebastian in DA2 another project $10?
What a great video. Definitely a little hard to pay attention on a day of ... significant world events ... but managed to get through it all the same. So my armchair noodling on this is that with such a long development cycle between DAI and DA4 and the success of ME:LE, if (when!) DA4 knocks it out of the park, EA would be mad not to consider a reissue of DAO/A and DA2 and maybe an HD version of DAI: as I understand it part of a publisher's metrics are not just retention of existing fans but also the recruitment of new/younger fans. An epic story like DA really requires that younger fans who pop in for DA4 have some ability to play through the full story if they attach midway through all those incredible storylines. The Aurora games aren't supported on newer consoles, and even on PC DA:O doesn't work on newer PCs without at least the unofficial 4GB patch, so there would have to be some consideration of "we need to make a reissue of these earlier games in order to capitalize on newer fans' interest in the series." You could probably get away with a content warning at the beginning of those games because even if you did try to figure out how to re-configure the games around some of the less mature dark themes (broodmothers, city elf origin), you'll just have to deal with a s---storm from the established fans who um.... really, _really_ liked that stuff for totally healthy reasons. :p
I had is scheduled already... then stuff. I'm not sure what you do in the case of a remaster. We have a DVD of some early Sesame Street and it has a warning upfront that essentially says "this is a product of its time"...
@@MarkDarrah Yeah, I heard about that! "Children, don't just go into stranger's houses if they invite you inside we don't really do that anymore and probably shouldn't have done it back then, either."
I sat here for a good bit wondering how the hell they managed to market Dragon Age with Charles Manson until I realized I was thinking of the wrong person.
What would you think of DLC origin stories? As in the game releases with one or two and then other origins are sold? Would that not provide the extra time and "peelage" I think you called it for the game?
… maybe. But as DLC you run the risk of, say, elf players not buying due to no Elf origin and then not even being around when it comes out. But if you are willing to market…
In terms of a remaster of DAO: I've seen a lot of people say it basically isn't possible because of the old engine. How accurate is that? I realize that it's probably more challenging than a newer piece of technology, but it doesn't strike me as something insurmountable. If one was to remaster DAO, do you just do it in the old engine or do you bring all the existing assets into some new/different engine?
It isn't impossible. Compared to say Unreal of Frostbite, the DAO engine is pretty simple. For a Remaster, you get the codebase compiling, update to 64 bit, update the Direct X version and then hit all the art. For a remake, you burn the thing down and start again.
@@MarkDarrah Thanks! Last question, because I'm curious: regarding technical difficulty and potential skills required (or skills lost over time). Would a Dragon Age remaster be significantly more challenging than the recent remaster of ME1, or would it be about on par with that effort?
Out of rampant curiosity, why is it that there are more bugs on the PC version compared to the Xbox? I get that some of it may have been handled in the port, and the consoles lack of precision actually made interacting with traps and bodies easier (due to what I believe to be a larger "interact" box) but it always seemed a little odd just how many there were.
You said that when the Revolver team moved on to Origins in 08, they were actually working on DA2. I was expecting you to elaborate on that later, but you never did. What did you mean by that?
@@MarkDarrah Oh ok that makes sense. For some reason I interpreted that as meaning Origins was going to be more in line with 2 and Inquisition plot-wise, and then pivoted to what we got after Revolver was canned.
One thing I'm not sure about is DA4's actual development time. DA4 has been in development basically since the end of Trespasser, but the game's direction was also rebooted once or twice after that. So when did development on the current version begin? And is that development time similar to that of DA:O?
The Fade was my least favorite part of the game, in part because of the lack of the party as you mentioned. This is a really interesting commentary on a beloved game.
maybe the city elf origin? while i think it's really good story i can see why people might be uncomfortable with the "you have to rescue your cousin who was being raped" angle. also, not a dark theme, but a companion like oghren would be made differently today. it certainly didn't help that dragon age awakening threw his character development to the garbage.
@@blazypika2 I forgot about Oghren lmao I watched a few playthroughs recently and man was he insufferable. He doesn't stop creeping on the girls even when they specifically say they're uncomfortable with it
@@blazypika2 I'm not sure if they threw his character into the garage. I thought he was used really well in fact. Other than that David Gaider did like him that much.
Wow, I did always think it was weird that the archdemon was a dragon. Would have been a different game with demons that looked like demons (Ciiphrang from bakker's PON).
Honestly.. I would like to get a remake for DAO.. But EA.. Yeah.. The only thing they can do it's kinda remaster.. I still remember that frustration after the Kingdom of Amalure remaster, I hoped that maybe they changed maybe not only textures, but.. yeah.. So better live without remaster of DAO, than live with frustration of how things are fucked up... Even in 2022 DAO is still great game, it do not have those graphich which will tear off your eyes, still joyable... Unlike of Inquisition, Origin really has that feel of a scale, when you to the Orzammar and see this giant dwarven city, even if u cannot explore it all u can see how big is, same for Denerim.. Sometimes it feels empty because of NPC's lack, but anyway u can feel the scale of the world... Same for Kirkwall. when you see a big city. What about Val Royeaux? U see only a small market place... I would say even tiny.. It's not what you expect to see when you arrive to the capital city of Orlais... Inquisition gives a lot of locations and u can feel the scale of the world, but sometimes sth just ruins it.. Val Royeaux it's just one example, `cause it's my biggest disappointment in the game (after removing blood magic ofcourse!)
One thing I don't like about Dragon Age is licensed music, because it tends to get you content id claims and you have to turn it off comletely if you're going to upload your gameplay to UA-cam or other platforms.
the mentioned marketing event in london back then - was this the event where quite attractive british bikini models "played" and modeled for the game? if yes, i honestly not only wonder why this was never done in more current times but also why this was done like that in the first place. i mean my 18 year old me really thought i might find women like these in the future to play such games. but i never found such girls till now who looked like that and also were more introvert nerds like most of us are here (i think?) was quite irritating/confusing for me back then but damn it just reminds me how time flies by... still i think the best dragon age would be a dragon age with a mix between origins and inquisition but i wonder if this will ever happen.
very interesting insights! i personally always liked the titel DRAGON AGE for my 18 year old me that was THE game for me with blood and dragons (and sexy witches :P) honestly surprised that dragons weren't even planned originally (but i think the dragons in inquisitions were much better looking in my personal opinion)
Regarding the Fade section, what is you feeling that the Skip the Fade mod for PC is one of the most downloaded mods for DA:O Nexus? With the benefit of hindsight would you rework the fade section in any way or possibly remove it? I know a few friends who played this game on my recommendation and once they hit the fade section absolutely hated it and one of them just quit the game. Is that a lesson you would use to teach newer game devs? Allot of games have sections where you lose party members/equipment/skills halfway through and I have to say nearly everyone HATES those sections with a passion. Also, regarding remaster/remake of DA:O I think it has allot to do with how successful the KOTOR remake. If it does really well I can see EA maybe giving Dragon Age a similar treatment.
@@MarkDarrah I personally love it, mostly for the fade shape-shifting as I primarily play Origins on Nightmare so having the ability to run around (giggling like a loon) throwing fireballs left and right with no harm to myself is great fun. I feel that it would have been better moved to the end, at the top of the tower, having the demon trap you in the cells with Cullen and working to free yourself and the other mages. The acts there would then allow for more nuance as you might see mages succumb to the demons in the fade, and now not know if you got them all rather than the talk before the boss battle.
I look at things with common sense, I say if you have problems with topics in games, ponder that not everyone has that problem, if you are offended by media, then don’t watch that media. I like DA:O and if they’re going to change the game to appease the angry Twitter mob, I’d rather they left it alone. I may be the minority or the pendulum may be swinging back from all this woke shit and getting back to focus on story. Sorry Mark, I’ve watched these videos in reverse, I only found your channel when you Dread Wolf video showed up my feed
Totally agree on the "dark themes". I find DAI darker, actually but it´s a different dark (as you said), more mature dark, desperate. For me personally, origins don´t work in the linear game. If the gameplay is not free, like in open-world games, the game has low replayability for me. In the open world, I can do things differently, go through quests in a new order, have different decisions, visit new areas, find new stuff, etc. Also, great insights on how early multiplayer were involved in DA because many fans think it's something recent that pushed by current trends. Also, I have no doubt that DA4 will be great (looking at the latest games).
I'm with you, I find the darker materials in DAO to be less mature (more Frank Miller Comic Book versions of "dark" that appealed to younger male audiences) but still most missions allowed for some sort of golden ending, whereas DA2 and then DAI dealt with much more mature dark subject matter surrounding systems of oppression and situations where there really was no "golden ending" and you had to actually make hard choices, or have no choice at all, they just don't have as much casual female nudity and sexual violence.
@@MPonygirl I think the Broodmother is fantastic, but it is dark in a horrific way that needed a processing within the group. What I think wasn't considered was how a female warden would feel when confronted with all of that. I seem to remember David Gaider saying after it came out that he hadn't thought of that. So I think that for a female warden, or any warden now concerned for their female companions and the darkspawn, we probably needed some sort of discussion about that revelation. As it was, I had to headcanon that we were all wearing poison vials or something to immediately nope out if overcome. I don't necessarily mind dark, but I do want a way to assimilate that knowledge within the game. Don't just throw it at me and leave me with it and nobody says anything about it.
14:30 I don't really agree that DAO is "low fantasy". Based on how I think of the term, I don't think that any game where you can play as a mage can be considered low fantasy (although these terms are super vague, so it doesn't really matter).
Personally I'm sad DA is moving away from the darker origins, my favorite section of the game was the broodmother and the city elf (though I always played the female city elf and had to save myself ha ha). Though my favorite out of the 3 will have to be DA2 (unpopular opinion I know), I'm a sucker for tragic stories so I just love how Hawk isn't really successful and terrible things keep happening to her. Also in my opinion it really had the best companions, there was non of them I outright disliked or found boring. You might call these subjects "childish" and maybe it's a non American - western European thing, but I find that these subjects make the game feel more grounded, which is why I tend to like the witcher better. For example, I find it difficult to believe that soldiers in a war don't take advantage of the situation and rape civilians, it just happens more often then not in my section of the world. Inquisition is my least favorite, both because of what I felt was a lack of realism and the side quests. Also for some reason I found it very shallow, as if it didn't have enough time to explore any of it's subjects to the fullest, like it didn't make much sense to me the mage/templar war would be over as quickly as it did. My greatest wish for the series is that solas succeeds and have sort of an empire strikes back moment where the bad guy wins - though I'm aware most people probably won't like it : (
DAO has been my favorite game for like 15 years. I still play it because I find the gameplay tremendously fun. Like DA2 and DAI don't even come close in my opinion. Wish they just kept making games like DAO instead of trying to change the identity of the series. The Narrator says it looks like other games and you can't tell it's DAO just from a random screenshot but I'd highly disagree
I'd take a look at other games from 2008-2010. There is definitely differences, to be sure but there is a very common "brown/ tudor" esthetic in the time
@MarkDarrah almost like how every "popular" game now looks like a kids cartoon. Just look at the graphical difference between Fable the lost Chapters and Fable anniversary
Dragon Age Origins the last great AAA CRPG until we get BG3. Truely sad how the franchise went downhill. I don't want an ARPG or a MMO, give me that tactical party-based D&D experience. I don't care about the story or graphics, I need to see some actual gameplay for Dread Wolf.
In my opinion, the game should be always about Grey Warden and The Blights, because DA:O is about that, marketed as that. I was disappointed when DA2 is a complete different thing and then DA:I is something else. Me as a player don't feel connected because the whole trilogy is disjointed. DA don't have a strong theme. The players will question "is this Dragon Age?" no matter if starting with any of the series. Let's compare with Dark Souls, the theme is always the same but the stories are different. It is something the player expected and get used to. When they play the next game or the previous one, they know what the game is about, they only don't know how things turned out this time. Other From Software games like Demon's Souls, Sekiro, Bloodborne and no Elden Ring are similar with Dark Souls, but in different universe. The player know, "this is not Dark Souls" while playing those games.
DA absolutely has unified themes. It just doesn't gave a unified protagonist and faction. And you don't have to like that, for sure. It is definitely jarring for some
I felt sad when you said that in a remake, you have an obligation to change things. If it were mechanically, I would agree, but most people who loved an original would want the spirit of the original to live on and not be overwritten by neo-ideologies. It makes me sad because it shows how much far-left ideology has corrupted and seeped into just about any form of entertainment. So much so that mere depiction now is considered to be all kinds of ists and phobias. There is a reason why many many gravitate towards this over-a-decade old, dated and broken game over its latest sequel. And we're going by release dates here, not even by production timelines which would be far older. That's the reality. And just to add, as far as my expectations go; I'm holding out no hope for DA4 to even come with a hint of the essence of DA:O. DA:I was such a hard left turn that it cemented my concerns for the series. It would be nice to have a DA:O remaster however but l highly doubt it.
There is no reason to butcher the story because of "modern sensibilities." Modern sensibilities turn everything to shit. Look at any game released in the last decade that try to be woke. All of them are shallow, vapid experiences, and it's the reason why the fanbase around DA has become so repulsive and degenerate. If people are incapable of not bastardizing everything because it triggers their mental illness then it's best to leave everything alone. Tl;dr - Cope-a-Cabana.
We made it to Dragon Age!
What do you think of the gameplay a B-roll?
It's good. But the background should fit what you are talking. Especially fade part.
About the screenshot part. The environment setting is no big deal. I recall DA1-3, the first thing in my mind is Hawke from DA2 then the "broken sky" in DA3. A strong character gives more Impressions
Its pretty good. Especially since your main focus is talking about the lessons and memories and not the game itself as much compared to the other parts.
Loved this!! Out of curiosity, what is the score playing in the background? SOunds like something by Alan Silvestri who did Predator and Back to the Future.
Fantasy games of DAO's era were trapped, somewhat, by the overwhelming success of the LotR movies. Everything looked like Peter Jackson's Rivendell. Since popular culture didn't have a big obvious dwarf art style, which is why (I think) DAO's depiction of Orzammar is so distinctively "Dragon Age".
Your point about symmetrical combat was fascinating. As someone who has long thought that RPGs should be rules-based simulations, symmetrical rulesets are mandatory. The game's mechanical rules describe the physical rules of the in-game reality.
I very much enjoyed how obviously absurd DA2's asymmetrical mechanics were in comparison, because I felt they made my argument for me. Because DA2 had wildly different damage and hitpoint rules for PCs vs. NPCs, the in-game reality effectively prevented war, because two NPCs were uncapable of hurting each other.
For me, the game world needs to feel like it exists for its own sake, and isn't there merely so I can explore it, and the game world's physical reality is part of that.
I'm still solidly on the symmetrical mechanics side of the argument, though, perhaps because I think of all of these games like they're simulations.
indeed
Origins really was something special and a golden example of what the quintessential wrpg was in the 2000s. This was the game that made me a bioware fan
Remaster someday?
Who knows. Maybe that’s the rumoured one from EA.. but probably not
I think the Origin stories, apart from being a tutorial, were also meant to convey to the player their characters' standing in the world. It complements the lore and the world building.
Indeed.
That section at the end on communication, listening, and understanding and how people can entrench is so very true, and not just in game design. That's good advice for anything intrapersonal!
I think so
Dao is still one of my favorite games. I love even now I can go back to it. I also love how much modded content there is for it now too.
It has a nice community
Thanks for this! It's super interesting to see insight on the game from the lens of someone who saw through so much of it, and I truly appreciate your thoughts on DA as a saga and DA4 in particular. I hope you don't feel somehow coerced or compelled to do these because of your connection to the series, even if so many know and like you because of it! All best for you and the channel, Mark
Thank you.
No coercion for me.
I'm just starting my career as a Producer in the games industry (actually at EA 😱) and the series that set me on this path was Dragon Age. I'm so grateful to hear you discuss what production was like on the titles and the insight from a production standpoint feels invaluable. Definitely got yourself a new subscriber!!!
Welcome!
While I loved the origins stories for the races and various classes in Origins, I can understand why this would be difficult to translate into DA2, DAI, and DA4 and so on. Even in DAI with the quest Here Lies the Abyss there were so many options and quantum characters that could potentially be the warden.
Oh yes
Very educational video!
It's very interesting how you guys considered having the Avvar as one of the Origin stories.
Also, your analysis on High vs Low / Dark vs Epic fantasy is thought-provoking. I've always admired the dark underbelly of DAO and DA2. Especially DA2 with the Blood magic, discrimination via Templars vs Mages and all that jazz. DAI defiantly felt more like high fantasy. DA4 would be interesting if the blended aspects of the classic Darker Fantasy aspects with the higher fantasy mix of magic
Glad you liked it!
I wish I had even an ounce of the optimism and faith you have in DA4. At this point, my enthusiasm has definitely waned--a thing that I didn't think was actually possible, but here we are. Thanks for your take on events, though. This was a great, informative vid.
Hopefully they will win you back
Mark, please allow me to convey my sincere appreciation for your videos. I’m a big fan of the Dragon Age and Mass Effect series, and your perspective allows a peek behind the curtain for those of us so eager to learn more. Keep ‘‘em coming!
-Dr. Rob Adelman
Thank you!
This is great insight, and great video. Thank you for taking the time to really give us your thoughts and lessons.
I’m one of the people that miss the darker fantasy that Origins had, and hope to see it come back again. But it also makes sense that they’ve wanted to move further away from that.
It would be nice to see remasters or remakes, although it isn’t very likely. I really think the story and lore of Dragon Age is something that could really grab people again, with a lot of people I know more open to fantasy after Game of Thrones and Witcher. But it’s hard to get my casual friends to give it a go, since they play primarily on PlayStation. They can’t play the older games at all.
I’d love to hear some of the lessons learned from the smaller DLC’s for Origins, because they were so wildly different from each other. As well as DA2, and DAI. And I’d also like to see your thoughts and hopes for Dragon Age 4, and the future of Dragon Age after that.
The DAO dlc is interesting for sure
Fwiw, i remember being sold on this wold on the premise of ' what if fantasy characters didn't have european accents by default?'. That hit so hard. I had my wallet out of the holster. Varric is amazing.
Interesting
Love this,
Love origins,
Thank you for all the great insights.
Glad you like them!
This is really interesting! Makes sense that origins are hard to implement as multiple tutorials.
I suppose the ideal solution would be a tutorial prologue, where you play as Duncan or something, which then would end and you as the player make your character creation choice, but then the origin isn't the first experience of the game so it loses some weight as the first impression.
yes. Or a parallel tutorial (but then people don't DO it)
@@MarkDarrah I do love the origins, and enjoyed that DA:I gave your character a background history, even if its not as defined as origins. I hope future Dragon Age games keep that element, even if it is difficult to implement!
You could do what spellforce 1 does. In spellforce 1 you have the main game. You build your character and then hit play. There is a checkbook at the bottom corner to skip the prologue. The prologue is the tutorial section. In that section you play as a different character. A burned out warrior who despite being immortal is spent. With the tutorial quest being to find a special rune. This rune is used to summon the character you designed, tieing it into the main story.
This would allow for a set tutorial section that ties into the story, but doesn't really matter to the player, afterall the area you play in, what you do, and even what you accomplish isn't overly important.
It is ultimately a fetch quest, with almost no lore on why any of this is happening, but comes after the opening cinematic explaining how the world was broken.
For the player it doesn't add to their characters story (as the object is immediately given to the player to free them from their magical enslavement and then promptly forgotten), or their power (your playing as someone else and nothing is transfered), and what you learn in the tutorial in terms of lore, and world building is just the basic elements that are repeated across the main game (the rune-warrior were a race of immortal magic slaves and are disliked by all the other races for the sheer power they can posses literally summoning entire armies out of nowhere and stomping enemies into the dust) all other lore is there for you to find.
This allows for a single tutorial to be built, and then partitioned such that players can just press skip on a rerun of the game.
A lot to digest in this one! I did inadvertently guess your coda to the video 10 minutes in: "Oh, this sound very similar to what's happening now..." So brownie points for me?
The chart of the series' trajectory was very interesting, because we ended up only getting into Dragon Age once it hit that upper right quadrant. I wonder how much the audience shifted between Origins/2 and Inquisition. Or maybe the audience just matured alongside it?
Hard to say what happened.
DAI out sold both DAO and DA2 so brought in so much new audience that it pretty much defines expectations now
Before settling on "Dragon Age: Origins" as the title for ship, the working title was actually "Chronicles".
I had forgotten. There are still legacy drives with that name...
You played a role in creating one of the most formative works of creative expression. Dragon Age Origins is my favorite game of all time. I played through every origin, every ending and spent countless hours enjoying the world.
Thank you to you and everyone that worked on that game.
Thank you for the kind words
Warden's Quest was primarily a marketing event. The two biggest boosts to quality improvement in DA:O were: 1) The ability to file bugs in-game in seconds with just a key press and a line of text. Screenshots, map, location, build version, and a pile of other data were automatically filled without having to pause the game and Alt+Tab to ExtraView. 2) Telemetry. Thanks to a talented Tech Designer, DA:O was the first BioWare game to incorporate and operate a telemetry system long before ship that enabled problem detection and decision-making based on data collected during development.
Warden's quest was 100% a marketing event
This is super insightful and interesting! Love Dragon Age Origins so this is super cool for fans to learn about. Thank you for sharing this info with us!!
Glad you enjoyed it!
Thank you so much for this video -- always love learning about the behind the scenes & context for Dragon Age. Very well paced and well spoken.
Thank you!
Thank you for watching!
Thanks for watching
This is very interesting!
@Old Game Dev Advice One thing I wondered was this Gordian knot you referred to in your lessons learned, I appreciate the development difficulty it caused but dont you think perhaps that lead to creating a much more dynamic and organic world/story experience? Witcher 3 feels like it also had a similar Gordian knot where story paths crossed with others and the feeling that the world wasn't "siloed" into segregated buckets made for a marvelous RPG experience.
Sometimes hard thing are worth it.
In this case?
This video was really enlightening to watch! Thank you so much for it!
The Dragon Age saga is, as a whole, probably my favorite saga ever, and while i see some flaws here and there, i adore every single of those games for different reasons. Regardless it's very interesting to have a developer's input on it.
As it is this video makes me inch to replay DAO now which i shouldn't because i just finished replaying all of it like, one week ago on the specific goal to replay da2 with it....
DAO has an interesting gameplay, to me. I prefer aspect of the next two games but they're all here because DAO started them, and everyday i miss the specific type of tactic and skill menu of DAO. There's really the impression you can build in your own character in very specific way outside of the plot itself, which i really love.
The areas are all so interesting to me and have their own personality, so i'm really glad that none of what ended up in the final game ended cut. I can complain forever about the Deep Roads but it'd just feel wrong if it wasn't there! (Especially in that case with how much it indicate the scale of the Dwarven Kingdom that was lost... The dread and the melancholy over all of this really makes it efficient to me).
That said i do find the "origins make this game replayability" kind of funny because i personally want to replay with the different origins but always end up playing the same things ahah. For the same reason, i don't think the game is linear since if you want to mess around a bit you can do it in any order, but i've set myself up on a path of what area i think is best played first that i replay always in the same order. Still though it's always very fun for me, it never lost its charm.
But my favorite thing to do is to reread the codex. I love the lore of this game a lot and i don't know how much was planned from the start, but it's so fascinating to see crumbs in DAO's codex that suddenly took a bigger meaning with the additional games of the franchise. I'm never bored and always excited about this saga.
A remaster may be fun, i do have so many mods installed if only for lore consistancy that i understand the appeal, but also i find the games as they are really charming and immersive in their own way, fitting also a lot of the ambiance of the plot of the games imo, and the actual breathlessness i felt when i was back to Haven in DAI for the first time was only that great because of the way the two previous games were. Still today i sometimes log into DAI, in Haven, just to take in the whole thing.
As it is i personally trust DA4 a lot. I've read the books and i like the plot directions, i've been trying to pay attention to some of the major developers who are still working on it and it gives me a lot of faith in it. The leaving of major devs, while concerning if only because i hope all of them are okay, seems to really echo what you brought up earlier in this video about the developments issues with DAO. and it gave us a really good game regardless so, i have faith.
If you intend to do more videos on the others games of the saga, i would love them and gladly tune in! I just wish that it wouldn't come from you feeling pressured to do it. Take your time if you do intend to do them, if not, it's okay all the same!
I've ended up rambling but this video really made me feel a lot of things about this saga and the internal outlook was so good. I always found dev stories fascinating.
Thank you for sharing them!!
I hope you have a nice day!
Honestly, I partially feel that story replay ability is an illusion for the reasons you say. People often make the same choices
@@MarkDarrah That's kind of true, at least for the plot form. Still despite what i said i replayed this game soo many time and i did tweak a few things playthrough after playthrough on stuff i may have changed my mind on or influenced by future games (Alistair's fate in dao impacting dai's comes to mind).
That said, and i can't believe i forgot that in my first post, the romances and the companions is eventually what makes this replayability. While i rarely change my main choices i will often swift around and pick new romances, and while i prefer playing as Mage which lock me into one origin, i did play 4 out of the 6 just to have an idea of the plots. But the romances really makes the replay worthwhile, and while i have my favorites i did manage sometimes to play other routes.
The fact replay ability can be found on different levels does make it interesting imo, and none of my first playthrough are the ones i'm content with in term of little things. I can just never change the plot drastically despite the fact it's incredible it's a possible thing to do. For exemple in da2 i refuse to support the Templars even if i'm curious to see how it changes the game.
It may be an illusion but it's a fun one to indulge in, and if it's not to replay it, i love to read about the different routes on the wiki, just to have an idea. So it's still nice that the possibility is there
The interesting thing about DAO to me is how many things are new events for me when I've replayed. Even if I'm playing the same type of character, a small change can bring new happenings. For instance, it wasn't until a play through a couple of years ago that I found out the entire Landsmeet can go sideways and turn into a huge brawl where everyone is down on the floor fighting each other. Also, if you play it right, you *can* beat Ser Cauthrien and her goons and never do the jail sequence. To this day, I've never triggered the famous cat army of Denerim.
@@julilla1 completely agreed with the whole post! I really love replaying because of that, just a few tweaks in an otherwise identical playthrough can change so many things!
That said, I'm sorry, the Cat Army of Denerim??? What is it and how did i never hear of this wonderful thing until now omg (thank you for bringing it to my attention!)
Great video, nice to hear about practical game development like "avoid to make 6 tutorials" :D
You bring me faith for DA4, cannot wait for its release!
Getting close now!
thanks so much for putting this together
You are welcome
Thanks for the video. I have very much enjoyed playing the Dragon Age series, and have subscribed to your channel so that I don't miss an opportunity to learn more about that series, and game making in general.
While I like them all, I really like the cinematic feel of DA:O and DA:I, and like that they, in many cases, parallel the tried and true plot beats used in feature films. (they are tried and true for a reason: they work) It gives you the best of the enjoyment of a good film, but makes it even better by giving you, as the player, agency on how the story unfolds. The 'action' is always secondary to me. My only requirement is that it works, and does not become grindy or repetative.
For fans like me who consume every bit of 'behind the scenes' material we can get our greedy eyes on, thank you for sharing your memories, insight & advice. It is much appreciated.
Glad you enjoyed ot
@@MarkDarrah I did, thank you.
Very likely; one of my all-time favorite games.
Great to hear
Appreciate your mentioning of the "darkness" in the themes of Origins vs the later games. I've struggled to put my own thoughts on it into words and I appreciate your thoughts and words on it!
Glad it helped
The dark fantasy themes are actually something that I personally really miss but I can see how working on a similar project for a long time can have an impact on your mental health...
I hope they can find a reasonable balance between dark themes and the overused "save the world from the big bad guy"
The dark fantasy themes are actually something that I personally really miss but I can see how working on a similar project for a long time can have an impact on your mental health...
I hope they can find a reasonable balance between dark themes and the overused "save the world from the big bad guy" trope.
Thank you for posting this content :) been a dragon age fan since origins when a friend bought me it purely because it had "dragon" in the title and i like dragons. So fascinating to hear about how it was developed and the game making process in general :)
Glad you liked it!
as a player and fan of the game i can say it all mixed perfectly and worked in the end
The name is very simplistic, yet epic sounding
The origin stories were all emersive and played a role in the world building instead of being "just out there"
And while i personally thing there were some "hikups" like the extremely slow combat animations, and the longivety of "The Fade" i think it was overall very balanced between story and combat
Origins are great for works building.
Less great for scope of budget
Dragon Age: Origins is one of the few games that I call the best ever. And I kind of share your optimism on DA4, I'm hopeful it's going to be the comeback the franchise deserves.
Me too
Great video Mark! It's hard not to worry about the games creation when leaders leave the business as in the past its not been an indicator for success.
Fair
Thank you!! Listening to you saying>>: wasnt fully thought tru.. i think: what do you mean? We are talking about one of the greatest games I ever played. If this was the result of not fully thought tru, i am not worried about Dragon Ages Future :))
Lol
There isn't much to say here other than this is an extremely enjoyable video with great insight. Thanks for making the video I have always loved you videos and this one hits it right out the park. I especially agree with Dragon Age being with a more distinct art style.
Also if you don't mind could I share this video around. I think it would be great to do so.
Go ahead
@@MarkDarrah thanks!
I know DAO always gets regarded as the darker dragon age, but honestly DA2 has some pretty dark stuff in there as well. I think it just gets overshadowed by the repeated areas and sarcastic Hawke.
I think DAO is more the cartoon version of dark
Wow, this was super insightful and it was really great learning so much about the thought process behind Origins. And honestly I think my favorite part was the least none game dev part; 39:06 Hear and Understand. Communication is so important when working with others and just the slightest misunderstanding can start a gulf that was totally unintended. I think it doesn't help that alot of us are tech geeks who don't always pick up on the subtle interpersonal cues. Its definitely something I learned to be more aware of and be sensitive to in my own field.
Great stuff man! Looking forward to checking out the rest.
Yeah, at least acknowledge someone’s concern
Thanks for the look from the inside at this the most Dragon Age of Dragon Ages ;)
You are most welcome
Look i get it. There are lists upon buckets upon mountains of reasons devs don't talk shop online. But videos like this and what your channel is doing. Its invaluable for up and coming devs like myself. As well as an excellent source to dispel misinformation for gamers. Would just be nice if more devs could share, that's all.
Have a good one.
I don't expect to see a TON following the lead...
But we are starting to see a BIT more behind the curtain.
@@MarkDarrah "nods" The best tutorials I've found are from seasoned devs. And I sub to channels like yours when I find them. Thanks for taking the time.
Thank you, both for this video and for making a game I love. I was never a fan of the ultra dark aspects of the series and never followed those routes anyway. I would like to sort of see a more “origins” like game, but that is mostly related to the characters (including the former player character having a bigger role). Yes I know the Warden cannot come back in a mainstream game, but a man can dream.
Glad you enjoyed it.
You can hold out hope for a remaster...
@@MarkDarrah …..🤔
@@MarkDarrah oh and thank you for replying. Especially to a comment made so long after the original video.
The hear and understand section is great advice for romantic or other social relationships as well as work ones too. Great reflection and assessment
Thank you
That was so interesting, I'm playing thorugh all the games again after finishing DAI for the first time, which I hope you're making a video like this about that game, too. Originally I was put off by the initital impression of Inquisition when it was released (Hinterlands "is that the game??", user reviews) , but especially at the end of Trespasser it turned into my favorite out of the three. I've read the book about the development by Jason Shreier and it's incredible how you all managed to put this game together as great as it is (despite the issues with the technology) and how well most of the changes to the general vibe worked. In a lot of ways it feels way more mature than DAO even though most would argue against that.
We will get to DAI soon
I agree about DAI being more mature. I may talk about that separately
@@MarkDarrah Thank you, I'm really looking forward to it!
Very interesting to hear this for me as a laymen in game development knowledge.
I am just a big consumer of games and love this kind of video when you get to know how things work in the industry.
Thank you very much for your video and hard work 😊
Thanks for watching!
This was really awesome! Everyone below has made all the comments I wanted to give, but I did want to talk about how special I think reactivity is. I love have npc's react to your character and how they present. Some of my most cherished memories of BW games is in being able to show a sexist character how wrong they are. I'm looking at you, Murdoch! 😆
For sure
Do you have any thoughts on voiced main characters v non voiced? I kind of miss having silent protagonists in RPGs nowadays that communicate through text and I feel like it helps a player immerse themselves into a character more than having a voice actor speak for the player character.
A good example for this would be how much people (including myself) really see themselves as the Warden stepping up to take on the blight, being able to pick exactly what you want to say compared to picking a icon with a small bit of text and just hope the option is the response you actually wanted, kind of what we got with the Inquisitor and Hawke.
The general (though far from universal) case seems to be that the cinematic improvement allowed by a voiced protagonist outweighs the impact.
But as you say, this isn't true for everyone.
Thank you for the video. It cleared up some things for me.
The B-Roll was honestly okay, but nothing amazing. Good.
I'll take fine.
The 30STM song in the credits of DA:O was my introduction to contemporary music. And 30STM
I really like it too
Interesting perspectives! Even back in the day, I thought the developers made too much of art style for DAO. With some exceptions, players don't really notice or care. We want to play a fun game. DAO is still much loved.
It is still useful to at least be recognizable.
With all the pain this was the most fun project for me
Really?
@@MarkDarrah Yea. Less insanity than ME, more design opportunity space (and cpu) than Jade and swtor, well in retrospect In I’m not sure I would want to put anyone through that :-/
Great video! Special thx for adding the ending. I think the game will be fine too, but it is a bit concerning having people leave, especially one who took your spot. Also was it ever in the plans to play as the same character? I don't mind playing a new character, but coming to dragon age from mass effect I enjoyed having to play as the same person in the next game. 👍
Dragon Age has always switched protagonist
DAI's protag doesn't have an ARM at the end. So that COULD be done but is an issue
@@MarkDarrah true, hopefully at some point. I remember the writer of the walking dead said he regretted having ricks arm cut off when he wrote the comics, that's why he never lost his arm in the TV series lol and btw you do know that in one of the endings in DAI the protagonist has a crossbow for an arm? Lol
There was recent departure, however, something about that particular departure was unusual and has me believe it had to do with the "attitude" (putting it politely) of said person rather than the actual creative-side. Which meant, they HAD to go.
Capcom did their own sort of project 10 dollar a few years back for games like Resident Evil 2 Remake and Devil May Cry V, but the framing was much better. They gave the DLC for free but it came out about 6 weeks in, so they just attempted to limit the amount of trade-ins during the crucial first month period by dangling the promise of additional content to early adopters who might otherwise finish and trade it in. The way it was framed was "oh free extra content" but it seems like it was meant to attack the same problem from another direction.
Yeah that is better.
Both in that it likely keeps the disc in the tray better (that phrase is aging...) because of the delay but ALSO because it seems less like things were removed and MORE like things were added.
@@MarkDarrah It's so much about the framing of things, not that that really could have worked on Dragon Age, the way the game's structured is probably too fundamentally different for that strategy, a player wants Shale on day 1 or it's more of a headache, but it was interesting to see another stab at the idea.
for me personally dragon age was always a mix between high fantasy and dark fantasy and i kinda missed the dark fantasy part in inquisition. so vibe wise more adult with more explicit content and sometimes darker atmosphere similar to the witcher series but more high fantasy with big swords, badass armors and much magic.
DAO has a lot of dark fantasy as defined by a 12 year old in ADDITION to the true dark fantasy themes. I don't think you will see the 1st again.
Thank you for the great video. Having just finished Dragon Age origins and all its extra content the other week (Inquisition being my first experience with the franchise) this is a blessing. I absolutely loved the game and from my personal experience with games i think it has the best basis for roleplaying and player decisions input ever. while having enjoyed inquisition i am a bit sad because in my view a lot of aspects that made Origins so great are not in the forefront of inquisition. Ive also recently started DA2 and while a slow start im enjoying it more than i thought i would (i heard a lot of negative stuff about it). All in all im a bit concerned over the next title but your conviction does put me at ease and i hope that they make a great game. So once again thank you for making this type of content its enlightening and thank you specifically for doing this video on one of my favorite games of all time.
P.S.: one small issue i have is that the romance options got less and less attractive from game to game
Hopefully you will enjoy DA4
This video is fantastic. You've gained a sub.
I think a lot of people are confusing tone with content when it comes to Dark Fantasy. All great fantasy keeps their supernatural workings behind the screens of mystery, one way or another. In Game of Thrones, the supernatural is associated with fire, and ice and they draw on the superstitions surrounding these things. Who cares if they had dragons?
The game quests often dealt with extremism, sacrifice, revenge, rape, slavery, racism, mental illnesses, good intentions gone wrong, etc. Sure, some of these had 'Magic' in them, but they had this sense of immediate horror that made you go, "oh shit, that's just wrong!"
When these elements are made mundane and the supernatural is being used the same way science fiction uses technology, the magic is robbed. Origins had many of these features from LoTR, from GoT, all combined in this Epic medieval setting.
Indeed, the games after Origins aren't what you could call lighthearted, but they definitely changed in tone a lot.
Welcome!
Certainly DA2 and DAI are different in tone.
I really enjoyed listening to your insights!
Glad you enjoyed it!
I've heard stories of the chaos of DAO development before including from ppl like Trent Oster who would make regular appearances at various gamedev events around Edmonton when I was still living there. I realize there was a lot problems with the game, including mad crunch, but I still can't help but be in awe at how the game turned out. It's easily the best game of its type imo - that is, medieval fantasy rpg. The way the various strands of the story come together and are interconnected is really quite something I haven't seen in any other game. There's a real feeling like choices matter in a way that other games cannot match. I really wish someone would do a game like that again - where you can pick a character, have a different entry into the story based on those character creation options, and then have quests and storylines intertwined with major decisions as inflection points. I would be ok with such a game being much shorter or even more action-y so long as it gives you that feeling that you really are affecting the story and world as a player.
These days I think that would have to come from the growing top tier of the indie devs
I imagine you picked up a copy of BG3 @luciliusduiliuscaelinus1512
(:
Hi Mark, love your videos. Thanks so much for doing these.
I know this is an old video and you may not see this comment, but I have always wondering about the graphics situation with Dragon Age Origins. Origins has graphics that are closer to SWKOTOR than to Mass Effect 1, despite coming out at least a full year after Mass Effect. Was this a product of starting off with "lesser' graphics, such that by the time it was release date, there was no practical way of going back to "up" them? Thanks!
Mainly its the engine difference.
ME1 is UE4
DAO is Aurora.
@@MarkDarrahAhh interesting, thank you!
Great video, would be really interested in a similar analysis of Dragon Age II if you decide to make one soon
Oh we will.
I was waiting for the next Memories and Lessons! I really appreciate that Dragon Age: Origins was next in the line.
It took 7 years to make this ip, and release its first game!
I see a lot of people say on anonymous forums and discord obnoxious stuff like: it took them 'x' years to make game 'y' and it still turned out so bad, yadda yadda, as if there is some magical button that automatically makes games and new franchises out of thin air.
DA:O was my first Bioware game, and I was still a kid when I first played it. It was an exhilarating experience: not my favorite gameplay, but the music can only be described as ethereal and the story was beautiful!
I have a few questions:
What is Bioware's real stance on multiplayer games? It always seems to me like they want to make multiplayer or co-op games, but end up making them single player. Is this usually a studio decision or the publishers?
Also what do you think about a voiced Hero of Ferelden if there is a DA:O remake?
I don’t think there is a unified stance.
I would love to see campaign co-op but there are implications in that
I live in the hope of a Dragon Age: Origins remaster, because my current system will no longer RUN the game! I've seen several troubleshooting pages, and I usually try like one thing, it doesn't work, I look at the next one and think "that seems hard" and give up. :(
Maybe some day…
Super cool video as usual :)
It's unfortunate that some fans will always be expecting a return to DAO's kind of "dark fantasy" (which to me was mostly juvenile to be honest), since you've mentioned in this and other videos already that due to the competition it's unlikely to happen. I can definitely appreciate DA as a series trying to set itself apart by exploring new domains. I think some of the concept art for DA4 already shows a bigger leap into "higher"-fantasy and more distinct concepts.
Indeed.
Very interesting. A question that popped at my mind while watching is: What's the usual knowledge level among game developers about software engineering's development process models?
Most devs aren't from software.
So the programmers have some
The DDs and PMs have lots
The artists generally have none
@@MarkDarrah is it common for these models to be applied in game development? I ask that because sometimes stories of development crunches appear on the media and I wonder how that could happen when process models designed to avoid that exist.
@@SirCrusher they are used for sure.
Agile in particular.
However, agile doesn’t deal with either highly differentiated teams or dependencies very well.
Kamban is gaining a foothold as well
Hot damn, you gonna be at MIGS anytime soon? There's so much juice in this I'm going to need paper towels
no plans atm
I'd really like to hear more about the details for the Avvar origin for DAO. Is it true that the Urn of Sacred Ashes took place in it? How would that have differed between the Avvar version and the version we got in the final game with the Andraste cultists?
I honestly remember very little
@@MarkDarrah Anything would be great Mark. You mentioned that the Commoner and Avvar were one and the same, but I heard that they were actually 2 different origins elsewhere?
@@matthewmcdaid5835 that might be true…
It wouldn’t fit the symmetry, but it’s possible we wanted an extra human one
Yeah, the thing with the fantasy sub-genres is that a lot of the time Epic Fantasy is also High Fantasy, or Dark Fantasy is also High fantasy. I find that the sub-genres tend to intertwine, and that's great for making a story compelling, but not great for trying to identify the sub-genre from a more narrow lens.
Was Sebastian in DA2 another project $10?
Indeed.
Sebastian wasn’t project 10$ I don’t think.
EA had already dropped it by then
@@MarkDarrah Cool! I look forward to the next analysis. It's very insightful.
Great video!
Thanks!
What a great video. Definitely a little hard to pay attention on a day of ... significant world events ... but managed to get through it all the same.
So my armchair noodling on this is that with such a long development cycle between DAI and DA4 and the success of ME:LE, if (when!) DA4 knocks it out of the park, EA would be mad not to consider a reissue of DAO/A and DA2 and maybe an HD version of DAI: as I understand it part of a publisher's metrics are not just retention of existing fans but also the recruitment of new/younger fans. An epic story like DA really requires that younger fans who pop in for DA4 have some ability to play through the full story if they attach midway through all those incredible storylines. The Aurora games aren't supported on newer consoles, and even on PC DA:O doesn't work on newer PCs without at least the unofficial 4GB patch, so there would have to be some consideration of "we need to make a reissue of these earlier games in order to capitalize on newer fans' interest in the series." You could probably get away with a content warning at the beginning of those games because even if you did try to figure out how to re-configure the games around some of the less mature dark themes (broodmothers, city elf origin), you'll just have to deal with a s---storm from the established fans who um.... really, _really_ liked that stuff for totally healthy reasons. :p
I had is scheduled already... then stuff.
I'm not sure what you do in the case of a remaster.
We have a DVD of some early Sesame Street and it has a warning upfront that essentially says "this is a product of its time"...
@@MarkDarrah Yeah, I heard about that! "Children, don't just go into stranger's houses if they invite you inside we don't really do that anymore and probably shouldn't have done it back then, either."
I sat here for a good bit wondering how the hell they managed to market Dragon Age with Charles Manson until I realized I was thinking of the wrong person.
... though ...
I've just realized that I enjoy low fantasy much more than high fantasy.
I used to.
High fantasy just seems more upbeat.
What would you think of DLC origin stories? As in the game releases with one or two and then other origins are sold?
Would that not provide the extra time and "peelage" I think you called it for the game?
… maybe. But as DLC you run the risk of, say, elf players not buying due to no Elf origin and then not even being around when it comes out.
But if you are willing to market…
In terms of a remaster of DAO: I've seen a lot of people say it basically isn't possible because of the old engine. How accurate is that? I realize that it's probably more challenging than a newer piece of technology, but it doesn't strike me as something insurmountable. If one was to remaster DAO, do you just do it in the old engine or do you bring all the existing assets into some new/different engine?
It isn't impossible.
Compared to say Unreal of Frostbite, the DAO engine is pretty simple.
For a Remaster, you get the codebase compiling, update to 64 bit, update the Direct X version and then hit all the art.
For a remake, you burn the thing down and start again.
@@MarkDarrah You wouldn't migrate to a new engine for a remaster?
@@richofarrell I think once you cross that line you are into remake territory and then you've opened the box
@@MarkDarrah Thanks! Last question, because I'm curious: regarding technical difficulty and potential skills required (or skills lost over time). Would a Dragon Age remaster be significantly more challenging than the recent remaster of ME1, or would it be about on par with that effort?
@@richofarrell I think it's harder for a couple of reasons.
1. 2 separate code bases
2. One of those code bases is effectively lost knowledge.
Out of rampant curiosity, why is it that there are more bugs on the PC version compared to the Xbox?
I get that some of it may have been handled in the port, and the consoles lack of precision actually made interacting with traps and bodies easier (due to what I believe to be a larger "interact" box) but it always seemed a little odd just how many there were.
PC is the lead on DAO.
PC is tricky because of hardware differences.
I just finished a PC playthrough and didn't notice much buggginess
You said that when the Revolver team moved on to Origins in 08, they were actually working on DA2. I was expecting you to elaborate on that later, but you never did. What did you mean by that?
The leadership of Revolver was working on the sequel to DAO (planning etc…)
But then the leadership of DAO left
@@MarkDarrah Oh ok that makes sense. For some reason I interpreted that as meaning Origins was going to be more in line with 2 and Inquisition plot-wise, and then pivoted to what we got after Revolver was canned.
I totally built myself a completely support mage in Dragon Age origins...
yup
One thing I'm not sure about is DA4's actual development time. DA4 has been in development basically since the end of Trespasser, but the game's direction was also rebooted once or twice after that. So when did development on the current version begin? And is that development time similar to that of DA:O?
DAO also had major direction shifts.
Stuff survived the shifts in both cases so the comparison is tough
I'm really curious to know what happened to the Architect from Awakening. I wonder if we'll ever get to see the consequences of that, plot wise.
Not sure if there are plans or not…
Hm… here's hoping DA4 will at least have a codex entry about the guy haha
The Fade was my least favorite part of the game, in part because of the lack of the party as you mentioned. This is a really interesting commentary on a beloved game.
Thank you
Regarding the dark themes in DAO that wouldn't fly today, all I could think of are the origin of the broodmothers. Are there more?
maybe the city elf origin? while i think it's really good story i can see why people might be uncomfortable with the "you have to rescue your cousin who was being raped" angle.
also, not a dark theme, but a companion like oghren would be made differently today. it certainly didn't help that dragon age awakening threw his character development to the garbage.
indeed.
@@blazypika2 I forgot about Oghren lmao I watched a few playthroughs recently and man was he insufferable. He doesn't stop creeping on the girls even when they specifically say they're uncomfortable with it
@@blazypika2 I'm not sure if they threw his character into the garage. I thought he was used really well in fact. Other than that David Gaider did like him that much.
Those arms on the female dwarves......!
Wow, I did always think it was weird that the archdemon was a dragon. Would have been a different game with demons that looked like demons (Ciiphrang from bakker's PON).
That was he plan.
But Dragon Age...
@@MarkDarrah Still love the game of course! thank you so much for the video and the unexpected reply!
I do want to ask what you think of the recent news of Christian Dailey leaving DA4's development. Especially with your end topic being about DA4.
It caught me by surprise.
DA should be in good hands
@@MarkDarrah that's good to know. I think Dailey is a great dev and I hope the best for him wherever he goes.
Honestly.. I would like to get a remake for DAO.. But EA.. Yeah.. The only thing they can do it's kinda remaster..
I still remember that frustration after the Kingdom of Amalure remaster, I hoped that maybe they changed maybe not only textures, but.. yeah.. So better live without remaster of DAO, than live with frustration of how things are fucked up... Even in 2022 DAO is still great game, it do not have those graphich which will tear off your eyes, still joyable...
Unlike of Inquisition, Origin really has that feel of a scale, when you to the Orzammar and see this giant dwarven city, even if u cannot explore it all u can see how big is, same for Denerim.. Sometimes it feels empty because of NPC's lack, but anyway u can feel the scale of the world... Same for Kirkwall. when you see a big city. What about Val Royeaux? U see only a small market place... I would say even tiny.. It's not what you expect to see when you arrive to the capital city of Orlais... Inquisition gives a lot of locations and u can feel the scale of the world, but sometimes sth just ruins it.. Val Royeaux it's just one example, `cause it's my biggest disappointment in the game (after removing blood magic ofcourse!)
Val royeaux needed some backgrounds and establishing shots to show that this is just a tiny bit of the city
One thing I don't like about Dragon Age is licensed music, because it tends to get you content id claims and you have to turn it off comletely if you're going to upload your gameplay to UA-cam or other platforms.
Hmm. Where is there licensed music?
DAO had a composer… I guess the credits.
Anywhere else?
the mentioned marketing event in london back then - was this the event where quite attractive british bikini models "played" and modeled for the game? if yes, i honestly not only wonder why this was never done in more current times but also why this was done like that in the first place. i mean my 18 year old me really thought i might find women like these in the future to play such games. but i never found such girls till now who looked like that and also were more introvert nerds like most of us are here (i think?) was quite irritating/confusing for me back then but damn it just reminds me how time flies by... still i think the best dragon age would be a dragon age with a mix between origins and inquisition but i wonder if this will ever happen.
I don't remember THAT at all...
This was an event with different teams from different countries.
very interesting insights! i personally always liked the titel DRAGON AGE for my 18 year old me that was THE game for me with blood and dragons (and sexy witches :P) honestly surprised that dragons weren't even planned originally (but i think the dragons in inquisitions were much better looking in my personal opinion)
DAI has the best dragons
Regarding the Fade section, what is you feeling that the Skip the Fade mod for PC is one of the most downloaded mods for DA:O Nexus? With the benefit of hindsight would you rework the fade section in any way or possibly remove it? I know a few friends who played this game on my recommendation and once they hit the fade section absolutely hated it and one of them just quit the game.
Is that a lesson you would use to teach newer game devs? Allot of games have sections where you lose party members/equipment/skills halfway through and I have to say nearly everyone HATES those sections with a passion.
Also, regarding remaster/remake of DA:O I think it has allot to do with how successful the KOTOR remake. If it does really well I can see EA maybe giving Dragon Age a similar treatment.
I would keep the fade but compress it dramatically.
It is good from a lore perspective but the gameplay isn't great
@@MarkDarrah I personally love it, mostly for the fade shape-shifting as I primarily play Origins on Nightmare so having the ability to run around (giggling like a loon) throwing fireballs left and right with no harm to myself is great fun.
I feel that it would have been better moved to the end, at the top of the tower, having the demon trap you in the cells with Cullen and working to free yourself and the other mages. The acts there would then allow for more nuance as you might see mages succumb to the demons in the fade, and now not know if you got them all rather than the talk before the boss battle.
I look at things with common sense, I say if you have problems with topics in games, ponder that not everyone has that problem, if you are offended by media, then don’t watch that media. I like DA:O and if they’re going to change the game to appease the angry Twitter mob, I’d rather they left it alone. I may be the minority or the pendulum may be swinging back from all this woke shit and getting back to focus on story. Sorry Mark, I’ve watched these videos in reverse, I only found your channel when you Dread Wolf video showed up my feed
Thanks for watching
On a Q/A stream you said Bioware most likely to make DAO remake than remasters and now you're saying opposite.
Honestly neither is likely.
If I was doing it it would be a remake.
A remaster would be easier but comes with that baggage
Totally agree on the "dark themes". I find DAI darker, actually but it´s a different dark (as you said), more mature dark, desperate. For me personally, origins don´t work in the linear game. If the gameplay is not free, like in open-world games, the game has low replayability for me. In the open world, I can do things differently, go through quests in a new order, have different decisions, visit new areas, find new stuff, etc. Also, great insights on how early multiplayer were involved in DA because many fans think it's something recent that pushed by current trends. Also, I have no doubt that DA4 will be great (looking at the latest games).
Multiplayer entered the conversation SEVERAL times in DAO
I'm with you, I find the darker materials in DAO to be less mature (more Frank Miller Comic Book versions of "dark" that appealed to younger male audiences) but still most missions allowed for some sort of golden ending, whereas DA2 and then DAI dealt with much more mature dark subject matter surrounding systems of oppression and situations where there really was no "golden ending" and you had to actually make hard choices, or have no choice at all, they just don't have as much casual female nudity and sexual violence.
@@MPonygirl I think the Broodmother is fantastic, but it is dark in a horrific way that needed a processing within the group. What I think wasn't considered was how a female warden would feel when confronted with all of that. I seem to remember David Gaider saying after it came out that he hadn't thought of that. So I think that for a female warden, or any warden now concerned for their female companions and the darkspawn, we probably needed some sort of discussion about that revelation. As it was, I had to headcanon that we were all wearing poison vials or something to immediately nope out if overcome. I don't necessarily mind dark, but I do want a way to assimilate that knowledge within the game. Don't just throw it at me and leave me with it and nobody says anything about it.
@@MPonygirlNah 2 and Inquisition weren't really much darker a lot of that stuff was still in Origins and there's no real outcome for those choices.
Inquisition was bloated as all hell
Why does the Marylin Manson trailer deserve to be mocked? o_O
Fair question.
Maybe more correctly, it HAS been mocked
@@MarkDarrah I find it kinda badass even today
Why do so many people, including the devs apparently! mislabel the expansion as "Awakening*s*"? 🙄
excellent question
14:30 I don't really agree that DAO is "low fantasy". Based on how I think of the term, I don't think that any game where you can play as a mage can be considered low fantasy (although these terms are super vague, so it doesn't really matter).
It IS super vague.
Personally I'm sad DA is moving away from the darker origins, my favorite section of the game was the broodmother and the city elf (though I always played the female city elf and had to save myself ha ha). Though my favorite out of the 3 will have to be DA2 (unpopular opinion I know), I'm a sucker for tragic stories so I just love how Hawk isn't really successful and terrible things keep happening to her. Also in my opinion it really had the best companions, there was non of them I outright disliked or found boring.
You might call these subjects "childish" and maybe it's a non American - western European thing, but I find that these subjects make the game feel more grounded, which is why I tend to like the witcher better. For example, I find it difficult to believe that soldiers in a war don't take advantage of the situation and rape civilians, it just happens more often then not in my section of the world.
Inquisition is my least favorite, both because of what I felt was a lack of realism and the side quests. Also for some reason I found it very shallow, as if it didn't have enough time to explore any of it's subjects to the fullest, like it didn't make much sense to me the mage/templar war would be over as quickly as it did.
My greatest wish for the series is that solas succeeds and have sort of an empire strikes back moment where the bad guy wins - though I'm aware most people probably won't like it : (
DA2 love is very fashionable
Ermahgerd=Thermaykur
lol
DAO has been my favorite game for like 15 years. I still play it because I find the gameplay tremendously fun. Like DA2 and DAI don't even come close in my opinion. Wish they just kept making games like DAO instead of trying to change the identity of the series. The Narrator says it looks like other games and you can't tell it's DAO just from a random screenshot but I'd highly disagree
I'd take a look at other games from 2008-2010.
There is definitely differences, to be sure but there is a very common "brown/ tudor" esthetic in the time
@MarkDarrah almost like how every "popular" game now looks like a kids cartoon. Just look at the graphical difference between Fable the lost Chapters and Fable anniversary
30:10 the defensiveness, the framing it as a positive.... sir darrah, were YOU the one behind the new shit?
No.
Negative press never FEELS good. But sometimes it still works
Dragon Age Origins the last great AAA CRPG until we get BG3. Truely sad how the franchise went downhill. I don't want an ARPG or a MMO, give me that tactical party-based D&D experience. I don't care about the story or graphics, I need to see some actual gameplay for Dread Wolf.
I doubt you are getting a CRPG as you imagine them to be
Origins is arguably closer to an ARPG than a CRPG especially on consoles.
the only actually good DA game.
alright
In my opinion, the game should be always about Grey Warden and The Blights, because DA:O is about that, marketed as that. I was disappointed when DA2 is a complete different thing and then DA:I is something else. Me as a player don't feel connected because the whole trilogy is disjointed. DA don't have a strong theme. The players will question "is this Dragon Age?" no matter if starting with any of the series.
Let's compare with Dark Souls, the theme is always the same but the stories are different. It is something the player expected and get used to. When they play the next game or the previous one, they know what the game is about, they only don't know how things turned out this time. Other From Software games like Demon's Souls, Sekiro, Bloodborne and no Elden Ring are similar with Dark Souls, but in different universe. The player know, "this is not Dark Souls" while playing those games.
DA absolutely has unified themes.
It just doesn't gave a unified protagonist and faction.
And you don't have to like that, for sure.
It is definitely jarring for some
I felt sad when you said that in a remake, you have an obligation to change things. If it were mechanically, I would agree, but most people who loved an original would want the spirit of the original to live on and not be overwritten by neo-ideologies. It makes me sad because it shows how much far-left ideology has corrupted and seeped into just about any form of entertainment. So much so that mere depiction now is considered to be all kinds of ists and phobias. There is a reason why many many gravitate towards this over-a-decade old, dated and broken game over its latest sequel. And we're going by release dates here, not even by production timelines which would be far older. That's the reality.
And just to add, as far as my expectations go; I'm holding out no hope for DA4 to even come with a hint of the essence of DA:O. DA:I was such a hard left turn that it cemented my concerns for the series. It would be nice to have a DA:O remaster however but l highly doubt it.
A remake needs to reflect current values.
A remaster can be a product of the original moment
There is no reason to butcher the story because of "modern sensibilities." Modern sensibilities turn everything to shit. Look at any game released in the last decade that try to be woke. All of them are shallow, vapid experiences, and it's the reason why the fanbase around DA has become so repulsive and degenerate. If people are incapable of not bastardizing everything because it triggers their mental illness then it's best to leave everything alone. Tl;dr - Cope-a-Cabana.
wow.
Keep blowing that dog whistle.
go cry into your Morrigan body pillow