Universal History: The Greatest Work of Western Literature - with Richard Rohlin
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- Опубліковано 27 тра 2024
- In this week’s episode of Universal History, Richard Rohlin and I give an introduction to Dante’s Divine Comedy, discussing its historical and political context, Dante’s motivations and his point of view, and why the Comedia is the greatest work of Western Literature.
Join us for the first course on the Divine Comedy, starting May 8th. Dante’s Inferno: www.thesymbolicworld.com/cour...
Timestamps:
00:00 - Coming up
01:09 - Intro music
01:34 - Introduction
05:33 - Dante's personal story
05:54 - Who is Dante?
09:12 - Dante and Italian
11:08 - The politics at the time
13:44 - The Investiture Controversy
15:49 - The Protestant Reformation
16:39 - The spiritual and the temporal
18:38 - Dante's position
22:09 - Dante's exile and crisis
23:08 - The Divine Comedy
24:32 - 3 Sources
25:01 - Beatrice
26:52 - Aeneid
27:42 - Greek and Roman myth in Christianity
29:25 - The Judeo-Christian apocalyptic tradition
31:05 - A hierarchy of guides
34:49 - Paradiso
36:10 - The Inferno
39:11 - Apocalyptic texts
42:39 - The image of descent
44:25 - Limbo
47:20 - Dante's POV
51:35 - Viewing sin
53:35 - Sin in Purgatorio
57:19 - Paradiso
57:55 - Final remarks
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My intro was arranged and recorded by Matthew Wilkinson.
Join me and Richard for the first course on the Divine Comedy. The live course starts May 8th but you can follow at your own pace. Dante’s Inferno: www.thesymbolicworld.com/courses-pages/dantes-inferno
As incredible as all of Jonathan's other work is, his collaborations with Richard Rohlin have to be my favorite. There is something that always seems to awaken feelings of home inside me when I listen to them talk.
The Commedia changed my life. Extraordinary work.
Same. It took me 6mo to read it on my own using a free online Columbia course. Absolutely rocked by world.
I was blown away by the sophistication of the Divine Comedy. Truly a work of literary genius.
“Every one of those words rang true, and glowed like burning coals. Pouring off of every page, like it was written in my soul, from me to you…Tangled up in Blue!” -Bob Dylan
35:22 People are too afraid of hierarchy nowadays. But hierarchy in principle is natural. There is hierarchy of saints in Heaven just as there is hierarchy of angels. Even many Christians don't think of that nowadays.
Fun fact: Dante Alighieri wrote another treatise, De Monarchia, where he explains his support of the emperor over the pope.
whaaaaaat. Anti-popery noooooo. It was so fashionable at the time....Free Masonry grew. the end.
The pope that sided with his political enemies and exiled him, and the emperor he hoped would overthrow his enemies and let him go home.
Shahnameh - The Epic Book of Kings is a Persian poem. It is the longest poem ever written.
Thank You for the discussion about Dante & the Divine Comedy! ❤ ❤ ❤
I’m going to say this every video: Universal History Elementary through High School Homeschool Curriculum please! Give me anything. Just show them these videos? Create a series of illustrated history/literature readers? 😁. K thanks!
Excellent idea! K-12 level education for homeschooling. I think I'd pay for that.
This past winter I attended a Salvador Dali exhibit of his Divine Comedy paintings. It was remarkable and very emotional. I recommend people look into it.
If you guys do an episode on Mexico you should check out the flower world prophecy and Guadalupe.
The podcast I Might Believe in Faeries did a really good episode on this called Flower World and True Myth with the authors of the book Guadalupe and the Flower World Prophecy: How God Prepared the Americas for Conversion Before the Lady Appeared.
Thank you so very much for this! I am always very interested in hearing perspectives on the Comedy. I had hoped that the wonderful Jonathan Pageau would speak on it. Even better with Richard Rohlin! Thank you both, gentlemen!
He has two other (older) published talks on Dante, I’d highly recommend checking out
Love this series boys. I remember in Enoch he also sees like these giant cavern like things and Abel is there crying out to God for vengeance against Cain so he sees where righteous people are held in like a purgatory as well, and it’s definitely not heaven, along with where the fallen angels are in Tartarus and I think maybe the Nephilim the Rephaim are there, can’t remember. Enoch’s journey to the different realms is similar to Dante’s and he has guides as well, I think Rafael and Uriel maybe a 3rd, never thought about that before.
I soooo wish i could afford the course, this talk was so curiosity stirring!
Just read the Comedy yourself man. Why give these internet grifters money? There's a wealth of scholarship you can read to help you along if reading it directly is challenging.
@@alwynraynott7303Jonathan is not a grifter. This is just an orthodox man giving lectures to orthodox people.
@@warmuptheleftovers Probably. But they're creating content and presenting themselves as experts. A lot of youtube creators rely on the audience believing in their authority. This is where I object. Jonathan might be better than the other guy, but it would be better if they framed these videos in a more humble wrapping e.g. Some thoughts on Dante's Comedy.
I'm excited to see this. Loved Richard on Andrea with the bangs.
I read all 3 books recently and I wish I had this context.
Great video guys, thank you!
If there's ever an opportunity on your end, please do a series on "The Five Books of the Lives and Deeds of Gargantua and Pantagruel" by François Rabelais! It's such a rich work of literature and it's charged with so much symbolism.
Oh, I'd love to hear Richard speak on italian history! That'd be so interesting, and maybe helpful🙏
Best of luck with it, and no bitterness intended but I thought I’d share my impression. I’m already a subscriber to the symbolic world, and I’m sure you’ve done the cost/profit analysis on this but $190 for what amounts to 5 UA-cam video discussion seems like a lot to me given there’s no back and forth in real life with you guys in a seminar type way. Maybe if I was 20 years older and didn’t have a mortgage to pay… currently, I would pay in $40-70 range. Just as a single point of data for you! As I say, best of luck with it!
In Inferno the sinner tells the Boatman(Charon, another classical figure!) where in hell they belong; in Heaven everyone goes to where they belong, as far as they can, and everyone knows where they belong in Heaven, too. You're right, this is the greatest book in the West.
And so the journey begins..
Just ordered the course! Can’t wait
Great video 🎉
Thanks for this.
Paradiso is also less read because the Italian is so immensely difficult! The language Dante uses in the Commedia changes through the poem. The Inferno is relatively straightforward, Purgatorio a bit more convoluted - but Paradiso! The ideas and the imagery and the language itself are something else. Some things are so beautiful you force yourself to struggle through them, but it's very difficult - especially if you don't have the training. I've read it several times; if I confess all, Inferno many times, Purgatorio several times - and Paradiso maybe twice. Looking forward to your class; I think you're going to help me.
Can’t wait! 🌚☄️❤️💫
Is Richard some kind of Dante savant? Such a great talk. Looking forward with gratitude to more from both of you.
Yes. He's gone through the Comedy multiple times with different groups of people. Usually around a campfire in his backyard. I'm blessed to have gone through it with him this past year. Amazing time and learned a lot. Definitely worth the money to join the class if you're able to.
This great! I wish you were partnered more with dailywire because I loved your end of the World Series on there!
What is your guy's thoughts on Parzival by Wolfram Eschenbach. In my own medieval readings that is the one that made most impact
“There are going to be butt trumpets” sign me up! 😂
Thanks
You had me at butt trumpets 23:41.
Universal history going up in trends 🎶
Symbols left and right, bright blue and red 🎵
Tra-di-tions, and literature, 🎶
Ali-ghi-eri, pull my Devil Trigger 🎵🔥
Will you guys do a universal history video of Armenia and it’s ancient symbolisms? From their identity with Noah and the ark etc?
🙏
Hey, what do you think of Gene Wolfe's Book the New Sun? People need to know.
In the center is where sincronización happens
Dante: the greatest poet since Homer.
“Butt trumpets” I like how the inferno is basically Monty Python
It doesn't integrate everything, what had been before. There is only one little reference to Lancelot and Guinevere, but nothing else about the celtic Matter of Britain. And there isn't the slightest hint to Snorri Sturluson and the Edda, which has been written nearly a hundred years before.
Is there a recommended translation/edition for the Comedy?
Richard reccomends the John Ciardi translation. There is a 3-in-1 edition and another with all individual books separated.
"all the trains ran on time" is crazy
The Divine Comedy was good, but there also other works, such as Erasmus' "In Praise of Folly" that are just as genius.
🌹
I would like to see geographic pricing for this, I live in Brazil and don't have a lot of money to spare with literature courses 😅
Hey, another Brazillian!
"The Donation of Constantine" "Someone forged the thing" Que Patrick Craig Truglia "The Iberians made the thing to stop kings from messing with Bishops but then the Carolingians found out about that useful argument and set Athanasius the Librarian up to go bananas with it to use the Pope as a political tool but the Papacy got too big and that backfired big time."
😂😂 much love.
I wonder what you think about the famous book by Padre Miguel Asín Palacios "La escatología musulmana en la divina comedia" (1919). (Islamic escathology in the Divine Comedy). I think the influence is more indirect than Palacios thinks, but the parallels are indeed striking.
Guénon, after reading this book, dismissed the direct influence as well, if I recall correctly, since Dante had added the "exoteric" muslim philosophers in the Limbo but he did not seem to be aware of the "esoteric" ones.
Speaking from Spain, I wonder if you are aware that Dante's wishes DID come true by the time of Emperor Charles V - He basically sacked Rome and, according to some Spanish traditionalist Catholic priest who is on UA-cam at least, the counter-reformation was basically done because of that. The Emperor did, after all , "clean house" (although more in the sense of the time of the Reformation, and the Renaissance).
It was already impossible to return to the Medieval Ages in the West by that time, and maybe it was not perfect, but the excesses of the Renaissance were really done away with.
But this is something very interesting to analyze, as Charles V was very Catholic himself, and always submitted to the Pope in terms of spiritual authority.
Pius Aeneas - Dutiful Aeneas. Obligatory (Obligation fulfilling) Aeneas.
The peak of "troubadour love" tradition happens to coinside with the rise of the Albigensian heresy, the cathars in Provence. This idea/ tradition is highly gnostic.
We definetly shouldn't equate the troubadur poetry with Catharism. The poetry was actually too life affirming for the gnostics. They were in some sense a repsonse to the lavishness of the courts in Languedoc with their rejection of the material world.
@@TheGeneralGrievous19 I agree. But the second was undoubtedly influenced by the first. And it's not surprising that the crusade came to the same area that was most famous for its amour courtois poetry.
Which translation of Dante's Comedy should I read?
John Ciardi
I would like to know what their favorites are too. There are so many!
I'm constantly amazed by reading the comments on these videos, especially those by Christians on Christian topics. We (Christians) should be ashamed. We rage at each other over fine points of theology, as important as they are, while routinely failing utterly to practice Christ's fundamental commandments to love each other and our enemies. We are so puffed up and certain in our tribe's positions.
The good news (pun intended) is that Jesus is infinitely patient and quite used to our comical hubris. The bad news is that from the outside looking in, we're too often just another interest group, shrieking that we're right about our rights. Honestly, if we agreed to all stop talking, publically at least, and instead performed a single Christian action each day, without credit, we could transform the world...i.e. He would transform it through us, as has always been His plan.
Right?
Im talking to myself as much as anyone, of course...but I don't think Im alone on this.
C.S. Lewis also believed he'll (hell) was locked from the inside. Spoiler alert--Universal history transfigures into universal salvation; a restoration of all in the All.
"We'll see you all in hell." What an invitation! 😅
Wehsee 🌚☄️❤️💫
Do an episode on the mabinogion or Taliesin
I just found the Mabinogion at a thrift store earlier this week.
There is way more to the “Donation of Constantine” (e.g. even people in the east used it, because everyone thought it was authentic). Putting in a plug against the Papacy made this groaning.
Vipassana
is for clowns
So if the man cursed Jupiter, why would that make him end up in Hell? I could think of many reasons why he would be in Hell, but cursing Jupiter, a demon, I don't understand why that would be one of them..unless it is his motive behind it..Because for all he knew, Jupiter was a true God, not a demon, and the very fact that he cursed who he thought was God, his motive, was enough to put him in Hell..not the fact that he was, or is, an actual demon..thats the only reason i can think of.. Because cursing a demon in and of itself, correct me if im wrong, would be a good thing..God bless Mary protect +++
You realize the greatness of this poem when woke critics find fault in the author for being " "judgemental " or "authoritarian"
There hasn't been "epic" poerty since "woke" or "critical theory emerged"
You need a grand vision to create great poetry
Its not quite epic poetry, but Ezra Pound's Cantos were influenced by many historical and cultural works for millennia. I think you probably need a Master's in multiple fields to fully understand it.
💝☦👑🇷🇸🇷🇺💯✅
Easy to sit and criticise the Pope centuries later with hindsight. The arrogance of ortho bros is astounding. Pride goeth before destruction.
Lol why would anyone buy a course from amateurs. Also the state of Italy is younger than the United States not the nation. There's a fine distinction there. Just as the state of Germany is younger also.
You forgot to mention that the Divine Comedy draws heavily on the Muslim Arabic Miraj traditions.
They did not need to mention everything and I think there is no evidence that he was inspired by the Miraj tradition apart from some similarities. S story about a descent into the underworld or ascent into the heavens are universal.
Jonathan is like Usher and Richard is his Justin Bieber
Whose P. Diddy
Given recent news stories, this analogy seems to me to be very awkward, not really helpful.
The inferno is the only work that has actively scared me as I read it. Nothing comes close to the imagery.
"But this story [the Christian story] is supreme; and it is true. Art has been verified. God is the Lord, of angels, and of men-and of elves. Legend and History have met and fused." ~ J.R.R. Tolkien
too bad the class is not affordable for many people....
Tried to order Snow White for my daughter, but got no response. ?!?
Castillan Spanish is the best latin dialect. And the lingua franca soon too.
Why's he always call it Paradisio? Isn't it Paradiso?
I think talking about the changes in the West compered to East as all about the pope and bishops having land is limited. I believe the Church became to dependednt and controlled by the state both in the East & in the West. There was this whole idea of the local rulers apointing bishops, ans emperors apointing patriarchs. The development of papal supremacy & the libertas ecclesiae movement allowed the Church in the West to become independent again - how it was in the early Church. It also was a source of inspirations for other groupa striving for their rights, and ultimetly the idea of natural/human rights that firts apeared in the medieval canon law of the Western Church in 12th century. I personally don't think the East had a right way of looking at things - without having a center & top of the hierarchy in pope, the local states often gained a lot of inlfuence & control over the clergy. We see how it works in Russia & Ukraine nowadays. The patriarchs of Constantinople were subservient to the will of Roman Emperors. I've seen some Orthodox geniuenly supporting caesaropapism.
10:39 and "Valley Girls" [1983] destroyed the English language.
Richard, please learn how to focus your talking and get to the point. I'm half an hour in, and you've not even started yet, just lots of haphazard random facts that weren't necessary or could've been said in about 5 minutes at the most. Americans have this habit of just talking endlessly.
All this does is reinforce how hard people work not to be Roman Catholic. It’s so funny and also cowardly to constantly talk about the middle ages as if that has anything to do with Eastern orthodoxy and then talk about Dante and just skip over the Catholic Church.
“I love hierarchy. The universe is a hierarchy. Your body is a hierarchy”
“Except the church we don’t have a head. Just first among equals. Popes aren’t real”
That's a stretch to just paint Orthodox like Protestants and say that we don't like hierarchy or that we reject the Pope solely because of that. First among equals was a title your Popes accepted for a thousand years before the schism. Your own church admits this.
The Primacy of Rome isn't disputed. Its the extraordinary powers he has accumulated to himself is the problem. The church has a head, its Christ. He is still here, ruling in the midst of his enemies.
@@Christopher-ow6lr Catholics very much believe that Christ is the Head of the Church. But we also understand that the pope is the main Vicar of Christ being his main representative. It flows from right interpretation of Matthew 16 & the paralles to it's prefigurement in Isaiah 22 as the Asher Al Habayit that represented the king in Israel. We believe that the Catholic understanding of the papal primacy is natural development of the doctrine since the Apostolic Age, analogical to how the doctrine of the Trinity developed until the Christological councils like Nicea or Chalcedon. From our perspective the Orthodox understaning is underdeveloped. It is also important to distinguish between actual Catholic teaching on the Papacy from the hyperpapalism that some Catholics wrongly ascribe to.
@@Christopher-ow6lrChris this is a mischaracterization. I would just consider questioning all the misconceptions around Catholicism. I don’t blame anyone for questioning the papacy. Once you see that the Catholic Church is the universal punching bag you also start to wonder if maybe it’s convenient to misrepresent it by darker forces. It’s a hard pill to swallow believe me
@BryanKirch... you are dead on the money! Great comment!
The Ramblings ofa Schizophrenic Lunatic.
When you start with an education series with I don’t know. All credibility is lost. Sorry.
I would never call this 14th century reductionist propaganda as the greatest work of western canon, It is obviously important and beautiful poem, but Dante and his worldview could be role-model for fascists not for Christians
Can you elaborate? Divine Comedy wasn't even written in 16th century but in early 14th century. Wdym by reductionist or being inspiration fascism?
@@TheGeneralGrievous19 You are right of course it was 14th century. To be clear I do not say that Dante was a fascist, because it would be anachronistic, but I believe that "Divine Comedy" was written in vain, in contra to his political opponents and philosophers he disliked. It shows a worlview of a egocentric person, who hates a lot of people and see himself as better then them. He judges them and imagine them in hell among biblical and mythological sinners, later puts himself on a pedestaI among saints, angels and heroes he gloryfies, in my opinion only reductionist person would think like that. I see it as a kind of manifesto, of a brilliant but very sad and angry human, but thats of course only my interpretation. Saying all that, I still agree with all my heart, that it is a masterpiece and undoubtly very important part of western canon, my comment above was just expression of my concern, because Im not sure it should be treated as some revelation of truth and morals, or at least people should be careful with doing that.
@@arturhashmi6281That has nothing to do with fascism.
@@ElonMuskrat-my8jy I do not say that Dante was fascist or racist, cause like I said before, it would be anchronistic, but he believed that Christendom (and all humanity) should be controled by a heavy hand of centralized authority and He clearly divided people as good, valuable - like himself and bad, unpure - different then himself, eg. Muslims or Ghibellines. So it's not surprising that he became "the bard" of Mussolini, his supporters and now their descendants. I do not think that we should agree with italian fascists and treat his work as their own because they claim it, just like we do not treat Nietzshes work as nazi, all I say is that worship of Dante's art among fascists is not coincidental and that it has a lot of potential for reductionist interpretation and there is no perspective of the world more beneficial for any totalitarian system then scape-goating reductionism, which is basically what Alighieri did through the whole of his magnum opus. Sorry if my english is chaotic, Im not native, but I try to be understandable. Cheers.
@@arturhashmi6281 Centralized authority i.e. monarchy is the only form of government approved of by God. All else is self-rule.
Jonathan Pageau, You're awesome! Let's be friends, okay?