Propane Supercharged 439cc ~ Fail
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- Опубліковано 5 вер 2024
- Today we try to supercharge a Duromax 440cc dual fuel engine. We disassemble the engine, make a bracket in CAD, mount up all the parts and tig weld a custom charge pipe. We fail in the end and learn some good knowledge for the future. Don't ever get down on yourself for failing. Failing is how we learn and grow as fabricators, mechanics, friends, and people.
Parts Used On This Build
AMR300 Supercharger - amzn.to/3WKle7f
Duromax 439cc Dual Fuel - bit.ly/3BQVKuR
Performance Jet & Air Filter - bit.ly/3O12rQ0
Mikuni Adapter (used on supercharger) - bit.ly/38VQ3Li
Mikuni Adapter - bit.ly/3BMRNYv
Build Your Own Header Kit - bit.ly/2NDPdM9
Billet Flywheel - bit.ly/2VR3lEw
Billet Rod - bit.ly/2IOKQue
Merch & Events - bit.ly/33YbmtO
Check Out Go Power Sports for all your Go kart needs! bit.ly/2viX9vP
Parts & Tools used on the channel - amazon.com/shop/redbeardsgarage
Quantum Machinery- Siegmund Welding Table - bit.ly/36PHm6G
- Nargesa CC60 Bender - bit.ly/2xWDVxj
Prime Weld Tig 225x - amzn.to/3L4U3MG
Prime Weld MIG180- amzn.to/3KVUPvn
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Doesn't matter if it's propane or gasoline, you're right, the boost will "push" the fuel source in the wrong direction, instead of pulling it through the venturi. There needs to be a boost reference circuit, basically a line from the boost side of the supercharger to the bowl side of the carburetor. Had you put the carburetor on the inlet side of the supercharger it would have fired right up.That's how they do it for automotive supercharger applications.
Spot on! Well said. And correct too. If you are carbed and you are running a blow through setup it has to be a blow trough specific carb or it just won't work.. now with the carb on the inlet side of the blower it should work as if it was stock(but with more power of course)
@@drgibs347 It wouldn't hurt to get a larger carb to handle the increased airflow. Let's dial this thing up!
Yeah you could just run a boost line to the fuel tank or something. Or make a new hole to the bowl and put the boost line there. Greg i hope you see this!
@@tilen3266 you really need a rising rate fuel reg boost in the tank would help but not the most accurate way to go about it
Here's an idea for you you could use that same carburetor on the intake side of the supercharger for your and your vacuum control for your propane they do make a kit that's a universal for generators that go right behind the carburetor I would hook it up like the modern-style fuel injection system to where the carburetor is your throttle body and have the injector at the base of the boost tube going into the motor like the injectors on an automotive were there after the supercharger I would try that if you want to try it with I do know some vehicles that use propane do have a supercharger or turbo on it and that's how they set it up
I raced IMCA modifieds
cars for 30+ years an if you dont fail , you're not getting ahead ! Keep on experimenting bro.👍🇺🇸
I have done this and it works well if you understand what is going on. atmospheric pressure is lower than boost pressure, therefor the carb must be in an enclosed pressure box and fuel pressure to the carb needs to rise with boost. 1-2 psi of fuel pressure base and maintain 1-2 psi above boost pressure. It's actually very simple if you understand what is going on.
Propane regulators for cars like the impco 425 have a port to atmosphere where you can hook up a boost sensing line from the manifold. One option for running the gas carburetor is to build a can that completely surrounds the carburetor that way the boost pressure rises inside and outside balancing the pressure and then it will run my normal
You need a boost referenced fuel system. One that adjusts fuel pressure based on boost pressure as to not overcome the needle and seat.
Welp sometimes you just have to look stupid in the name of science. Maybe I will try the propane on the intake side of the supercharger and leave the carb where its at? Think it will work?
The suzuki samurai propane turbo setups work that way, so I bet that will work.
What if you pressurize the carb like this person did? ua-cam.com/video/lj0wWF6nhxU/v-deo.html&ab_channel=RAC1955
In Australia we run LPG turbo blow through setups all the time. you just need a boost reference to the atmosphere reference side of the regulator diaphram.
An easy fix to make the propane work is just connect the propane tank to a 3/8 inch valve and direct the propane directly into the supercharger. Works pretty well….
It’s a shame that it failed, you made look clean and tight ! Nicely done. Knowledge is power, I look forward to seeing that 5 speed hooked up and going fast.
So glad ur finally making a video with the d window duramax can’t wait to see what performance parts fit
Doing that next!
Hey Red, I'm an LPG Fuel Systems Engineer for a small company out of NC that uses 1000cc and below engines for all of our products. Good to see some love for the propane setup, hope you get it figured out!
to make a standard blow through work, fuel bowl will have to pressurized via a venturi inline after the supercharger. from my research a 3/8 venturi will be correct. also you will need a boost referenced 1-15 psi regulator 1:1, hooked to fuel with a 15 psi fuel pump. low psi set all the way down to 1 psi. u can use an atmosphere vent on a flatslide for the boost going to bowl. install a check valve so fuel doesnt travel back. get a stronger spring in the flatslide to help on sticking. install a 38mm throttle body before the supercharger that syncs with the flatslide. install a intercooler between supercharger and carburetor :)
super interesting, im running the same ratio for my 206cc supercharged project that also failed lol. That supercharger mount is legit, looks way better than mine made with scrape straight bars XD
To try and it not work right,is better than to not have tried.'Pretty' doesn't matter when it come to power.Happy Trails.
It will only work 2 ways:
1 if the carb and propane are before (at the intake side) of the supercharger/turbo.
2 if fuel injection is used you can put it everywhere but i advise to put it between supercharger/turbo and engine. The boostairtemperature goes up and might ,,selfignite,, the fuel.
Older carb cars on lpg had a converter where it was made gas. The lpg came as fluid to this converter and that had a hot cooland supply to convert the fluid to gas.
A multi hole ring would supply this gas in the airflow right behind the carb.
Now we go to what we call a G3 unit. Multi point efi uses gas(not liquid) that is injected in the inletmanifold. Electric valves(each cylinder has its own) regulate the supply. So it has the same,,environmental friendlyness,, (regulated) as gas.
If its direct injection there will be no converter but than the fuel/lpg is direct injected as liquid.
Liquified peteroleum gas (lpg) are fumes in de rafination proces from crude oil to variuos fuels, plastics and tarmac.
They are liquified and can be used as fuel. Where propane/butane are parts of the fuel taken out, lpg was burnt off.
Please have a follow up. Its possible to run it this way.
Good point sir,~
Only one way to know for sure. Failure is always an option.
Lots of young folks can learn a whole lot watching this video.
Thats one heck of a propane accessory
Love the videos. You guys are awesome.
Old school car guys would build a box for the carb to sit in that would hold pressure. You pressurize the box and solves you problem!
If you mount the carb before the supercharger that'll fix your pressure issue that's how they were mounted on old school v8s it was intake manifold supercharger then carb on top
Run the vacuum to the intake side of the supercharger. May not pulse with the intake valve but maybe a pcv valve in line could help. Just an idea.
A gocart or lawnmower would be awesome with that engine. Awesome video
Trial and error is fun 😂
Best most easy bike carb ive used for blow through ive found is a cv carby like on some gy6 motors and of course riseing rate fuel reg and and pitot tube etc plus you have no plenem volume that will make it suck to tune.dont give up its easy when you know how.if you have an email i could do a sketch of the layout
I learn something from everyone of your videos. Thank you for sharing.
I like when you a word from the Bible.
I j bought a 440 yesterday looking it up and seen like nothing but you on duromax 440 side of mini bikes yt ts crazy but keep up the good content it’s been great. ❤
We need to do an EFI turbo setup
I love your positive attitude!
Build a Trophy Truck to mount that engine and Harley transmission on. Something you could launch off jumps without bottoming out…..too badly. 😂 Cool videos and content man!
I’m sure someone has developed and electronic propane regulator or electronic metering system, that would work since it wouldn’t have to rely on fluctuation mechanical motions to operate outside of its parameters
I bought a Duro Max dual fuel generator and two weeks later they brought out the tri-fuel version so you can run that natty gas.
Thank you.Those weren't 2 bad choices.They were 2 ways we know won't work.I needed that lesson as I was about to do similar.Shhhh. /How about a Hyme-joint mounted trailing arm suspension on Graden's lil'red cart?Get that cart ripping down the track?LoL.I jest,of course.Don't you have an "Odessey' style buggy out there that carries 2?
I'd like to see you build a mini bike with that motor and HD trans that would be really sick!!!
I know what's wrong with it! Ain't got no gas innit!
I have a propane swapped 670 that runs amazing but its a whole different animal for sure
Please do an efi, e85 supercharged predator with a billet high flow head and an intercooler sometime in the future 🙏 would be a total riot and a good excuse to get some more dyno content!!
I’d try a carb meant for a VW engine. They’re virtually unbreakable and should be small enough you can jet it down to the Hp range of your supercharged single cylinder.
There is such a thing as blow through carb setups but not for anything like this . What I would love to see is a pulling lawn tractor build, I think that would be a refreshing change of pace.
Try a Edelbrock carb for a Harley or quad good adjustability and they have a accelerator pump
good to know you being funny , propane accessories !!!!!
Can’t you run the defense line for the propane to the intake of the supercharger?
If you can create a little vacuum there that should work in theory 😊
When using a propane carburetor with turo or supercharger the carburetor should be mounted to intake side of device.
Just set it up as a pull through. Sure you’ll be compressing aspirated fuel but it’s cheaper than a boost regulated fuel circuit
Get your propane pulse not from the carb but behind the air filter. Should work it fine. Yes I work in propane accessories lol in Tennessee no less lol
How about a four wheeler build? With independent suspension front and rear.
Could just make a T fitting between the engine side and carburetor to make a venturi so that the engine still pulls vacuum
The benefits of propane is that it burns really clean and the internals aren't covered in soot like a gas engine is.
Using liquid propane in fuel injection kit with an LNG nozzle controlled by a wide-band O2 sensor might work great. The early McCulloch/Studebaker/Ford/Paxton blowers put the carb inside an aluminum air box and a higher-pressure fuel pump & regulator to keep fuel pressure above the manifold pressure. A modern turbo motor would be similar and fuel pressure is easily controlled electrically. Vaporizing liquid propane inside the engine would also lower the charge temperature. Of course, with FI & a blower E85 or methanol would be way better than propane.
The mechanical fuel pump on the Studebaker/Paxton setup was boost referenced.
Keep going with the supercharger
How about a before and after on the Dyno ?
Ok, you were goofin' & 'speermintin' , thats fine. Now we await Anew Propane (LPG) Redemption video & put that 105 octane HD5 LPG to the test. Propane burns lazier than gasoline so more Ign. timing is needed to get the most out of it. Do the engines automatically adjust timing when switched to LPG? Thanks Greg! Paul from S. Central Tx.
The only people that don't make mistakes aren't doing anything.
If I'm not mistaken you going to enclose the whole card in a metal box and pressurized the whole box which then in turn would make the carburetor work underboost
Yeah I have always heard that but was hoping propane was different. Then I looked into it lol.
Off the propane subject of this video, but where do you pull your vacuum from for the chug-chug fuel pump to work properly?
Hey brother another awesome video the information and how you explain things is always on point great stuff can't wait for the next video!
Supercharged 196cc diesel engine ❤
I was just thinking of that lol.
Red beard would you consider selling a kit for supercharging this engine? Pretty please
Any thoughts as to what engine can I upgrade to and how in a Kawasaki Mule 1000 from the late 80s.
Model AF 450
Thank you
Thank you
If you put the carb in front of the super... bolt that charge pipe to the block cause it may not want to stay there with just rubber...
How long since the huge fire, now they wanted A-BOOMB😀
Would've been kool had it worked for sure ☮️
It will definitely work in the next video.
Mr Red Beard, strange question not content related. Ive recently decided to joined the Shaved head club at 45yr. I really like the feel and closeness of a razor cut but not the red bumps on the back of my neck. What do you use?? Thanks in advance...
You need to put the mixer in front of the blower, and you need to keep the butterfly at the manifold. My buggy is propane powered. #gotpropane
Mount carb to blower intake
Can you give any info on the supercharger i couldnt find any?
I will add it to the description.
Most of what I have learned is from experience. Keep it up. When is the 500cc due for release.
Waiting for that yzf 450 kart video to drop
Try using a VW bug carb. They are butterfly type.
Keep grinding red we learning together bro 🤟🏾🤛🏾
Go cart would be awesome or mini bike
Every time I would ride someone 3 wheeler or 4 wheelers my best friend would always say watch out, he’s gonna wreck it,lol. Ya kno, he was always rite too,lol. When we would get it out the ditch, the owner said, what you doing? Well I’m learning what not to do on this 3 wheeler you shore won’t you pansies!! I was that type that would push beyond extreme just to do something fun. Started riding 2-strokes at 8 y old,by 14, I was had an 84’cr125r with a 53 t sidewinder sprocket. It was an animal, and I only weighed 135 lbs. now I’m so old when I fart, the dust fly’s,hahahaha. But I still ride a 2-stroke bicycle china doll bottom with adapter plate’s and a stage6 sport pro mk2 Yamaha prebug top end. Capable of 13-19 hp.on a 26” felt faker tank frame bike. The neighbors come out to watch when I do a flyby,lol. Turns lil over 14,000 rpm’s and now has a 11t-36t gearing on 26” tire’s. Pretty darn fast for a bicycle and I have osteoporosis lol.
Put it on a golf kart!
Put the carburator before the supercharger.
Sometimes iTs gonna be like that,,You gotta paY to PlaY all part of iT. YuP~ Sincerely ~°H°∆°R°D™
Yeah sometimes you win and sometimes you lose.
Put propane carburetor before supercharger
Put a check valve on line
Hey Red Beard, how much more power do you get with a supercharge on 212, 439, or a 700 engine?
14 PSI boost is 1 atmosphere, and makes the engine seem double the original size.
Hey put it on a wicked cool bicycle
What I have been wanting to put a 300 on a decked out 224 with a draw through set up and my concern being that small I figured use a slightly smaller pulley on the engine or slightly larger on the charger 1 to decrease the load the on the engine with mechanical advantage and 2 reduce the amount of boost slightly from the lower rmp ratio and my other worry was wouldn't you need to advance the ignition timing to compensate for the boost and how would you do that? How would I clock the fly wheel a few degrees with it keyed? Maybe a bracket to locate the coil pickup a few degrees sooner so retard the coil or advance the flywheel I guess? Would that work?
Hi Greg do you think you might build a Fat Cat Bike some day.
At least it looks cool.
Looks like pull trough won't work because the supercharger will cause a constant vacuum instead of a pulse.
A supercharger is mechanically driven. It adjusts to the engine speed. The port stays the same diameter so only airspeed can change the amount of air. This speed is the one responsible for the vacuum.
If y'all need some ARC billet parts for your builds, call ARC directly and ask for Jody Powell, he can hook you up.
The Psalmist had MIghty Men to take care of business.
Mini bike
you will need a bypass valve too
Draw thru propane
Propane also makes less hp
Use yamaha efi on it.
My buddy has one and that’s exactly what I want to do.
@@RedBeardsGarage I got a injector that come off of a UMax it's a bigger injector.
I have converted more engines to propane then I can count dm me I will definitely help you with all your questions I work for a propane company as a service technician
Greg , you only fail when you quit trying
#Saint appreciate the video. Good info. We can learn from your sharing. 👏 👏 Just adding to your sharing - God's grace is not justification for a continued life of practicing sin. Wash away the old fallen self with a renewed mind of victory that pursues righteous living, loving. #HeavenBound 💫 - 📖🙏🦁👑🔥🗡️🛡️
First? How often do you catch your beard on fire?😂😂😂
The most I burn it is on the lathe. Hot chips fly off and I smell a perm lol.
Now just run a carburetor and use injected liquid oxygen,like a nitrous setup just not nitrous. An uncle running midgets use to do this illegally in the race’s. They knew something was up when he would pass them on a wheelie,hahahaha
Lol
I'm gonna challenge you red beard go to my page and watch my blow through video ask any questions you may have I'll be glad to clarify anything in another vid aswell. This is too simple to be what ppl are hung up on with boost also for the love of God let's be more realistic with these runners the length matters and a plenum in a boosted single is not optional if power is the goal. I'll even take a guess at you need about 1800cc of plenum and from the valve to the end of the carb in the plenum given your rev range 14-18in. This isnt exact but it's close enough for this and worlds better than what you have. I show a very simple easy fuel system with out the pumps and regulators and complexity of other systems normally seen. Also put this on the dyno please and let's see those boost numbers go up small engines really like it alot more than big ones. My 155cc compound turbo bike has been over 100whp and 90psi of boost blow through. Given the set up in the vids has changed completely but the principles are still the same. And when it was single turbo it didnt wake up until 18psi. Small as these bores are I'd start at 20psi and go from there.
First view!
I like your Bible verse pop up. I would suggest using the KJV Bible as it is the true Bible, all other Bibles have added or deleted and are corrupt.