Guys, PLEASE READ: GOAT = an acronym for “Greatest Of All Time” Goat = not an acronym, but instead a player who very likely won’t win Write this 100 times tonight for homework and I’ll see you in the morning.
Whenever Phillip gets brought up, I always laugh when I remember the first time I realized they put a question mark at the end of "Former Federal Agent". Shows that even the people working on Survivor had their doubts.
Troyzan from game changers is one of the biggest imo as well. Especially considering no one on the jury wanted to ask him any questions and he even acknowledged at FTC that he wasn't going to win. Also called it with Sugar being on the list. ;)
I think there are scenario's where Troyzan can win that season though since he didn't offend anyone and made some moves (fair enough, always together with Brad) but didn't get much credit for them. If he's sitting next to Tai and Brad instead of Sarah, I see him getting a vote or two.
I disagree. I think Troyzan was one of if not the strongest goat in history. He has potential to get votes in plenty of other seasons. The fact he acknowledged his being a loser showes he was self-aware and that’s more than around twenty other goats of survivor's history. He had respect of the jury. Just way less of it than Brad and Sarah. So many people before him had no respect of the jury or were hated and disdained by them.
I wouldn't say he was the biggest goat, because the only real way I could've seen him losing Game Changers was if Sarah was at the final four with him. Against a final three of Brad and Tai, I can see him having a good chance to win
I have a lot of respect for Sugar and her gameplay. I think she stood up to Randy and Corinne, even though it cost her votes. She played with her heart and often called the shots.
I have no respect for Sugar after what she did to Matty at Final 4. She can go fuck herself, and I wish she had succeeded in killing herself at Heroes vs Villians.
(Sarcasm)I mean He did start a fight about Racism over white rice, That was a pretty good move, or do u remember when he found his pink underwear. i think he was the "Greatest" of all time
Yeah, I don't think Sugar was trying to win. Or rather, she would have liked to won, but she wasn't going to compromise who she was to even gain the slightest advantage. This is a game where lying and deceit are some of the most effective tools. So she wanted to win a million, but she wasn't willing to play smart to do it, and I think she knew what the smart strategy was. So, that's just the long way of saying she wasn't really trying to win.
My controversial Gabon hot take is that Sugar (entirely by accident and without realizing it whatsoever) played the best game of the season - and if she wasn't such an unstable force and so terrible at FTC, she probably could've come in second or maybe even first. But her lack of awareness of how well she (again, accidentally) played as well as her emotions and rudeness definitely tanked it for her. I actually think Phillip played decently in Caramoan! He did more by coming in tenth place than John did, and John won unanimously because all three of the final three that season were goats just John was more likeable than the other two.
@@the_fd_180 I think Marcus and Charlie will give it to her if she just knew how to answer questions at the FTC which she should know because she truly played the best game out of the three, suzie at second and Bob was just meh.
My top 5 would be close to this but not exactly the same. 1.Natalie T- moved up 2. Phillip 3. Troyzan 4. Sugar 5. Russell Heroes vs Villians- moved down
I think "biggest goats" would be a better title. I was under the impression the list was gonna be about the goats who played the greatest games etc. Awesome list regardless, I love you channel \o
I agree. I'm very familiar with the goat term as it's used in survivor but I didnt even realise that's what he was referring to until I watched the video
Good video. I think your top 3 perfectly encapsulates the 3 ultimate goat games; be the rudest, most annoying person possible (Phillip), go scorched earth, grinding people underneath your foot as you vote them out (Russell) and be the biggest do-nothing imaginable who can make no decisions of her own (Natalie). They'd be my top 3 as well.
Wow I was honestly so surprised when Hantz was at #2 but it makes sense when you explained it. Every fan loves that guy though, he is definitely a top 3 villain of all time
Not really. To me he was mediocre - a great villain will backstab, but do it in a way that still makes them likable/gives them chance to win. Russell was mediocre at best - he was allowed to do it, cause everyone realized if they took him to the final 3, no one would vote for him. A good villain learns from mistakes, improves and Russell was incapable of both those things. His narcissistic persona made him incapable of learning, since he believed he could do no wrong :) He is one of those stereotypical one-dimensional villains you see in mediocre action movies :)
No idea how anybody can love this dude. Complete asshole and one of the worst players ever. The man doesn't understand the rules of the game, that the game ends with the jury voting so calling them "dumbasses" will loose you votes and in the same time you gain absolutely nothing out of it. And he never figured it out. He played 4 times and did the exact same thing each time. Even after his first 2 seasons aired and everybody knew who he was, he repeated his mistakes over and over. Results were as everybody expected. In Redemption island his tribe threw the first challenge to get him out. In Australia, he was sent home first round with an idol on his neck by people who were just figuring out how to play the game. As Rob said about Phillip "not everything is up there for Russel"
@@bozgy People love him because of his game in Samoa and him becoming the first person to find idols without clues and him causing a unintentional matsing by sabotaging his tribe and building plenty of trust with them while Galu loyalties went untested and the Foa Foa 4 overcoming a 4-8 disadvantage which was probably why they brought him back in HvV he's a great strategist but bad social game if he was good socially he would win his first two seasons.
@@cdawg4021 not questioning what he did with idols and getting to the end twice. But love? That's a bit too much Regarding his strategy, in HvV he had Jerri & Danielle 2 perfect goats to take to the end but chose Parvati & Sandra, 2 of the best players ever. Not smart at all. Maybe he is convinced he is the only smart player and thinks everybody else is an idiot, can't see how smart those 2 ladies were. Also, Sandra was the only one who fought him so she had a great point to make in the final tribal. No matter what the question was, she always replied with "I tried to get Russel out from day 1" and that was enough to win. Taking Sandra to the end instead of Jerri is one of the biggest blunders ever. He played so bad that he still doesn't win, Parvati wins if Sandra is not there. Even with Jerri & Danielle I still don't think Russel wins, that's how bad he played. It's not bad social game. Lots of players that tried to have a good social game but failed. Russel said in the reunion "he doesn't care about social game". And I think he really doesn't. The man just doesn't understand the game. Has no clue the jury has power. Thinks just getting to the end with a great strategic game will automatically get him the win. I can't find another player in the history who openly insulted everybody on the jury and still expected to get their votes. Maybe Sugar, but I think she knew she can't win so she messed up everybody's game just for fun. Russel was sure he will win Also, the "burning ground" strategy can only work if nobody knows about it. After his first 2 seasons, he repeated the same strategy 2 more times in Redemption Island and Australian Survivor which got him voted out first both times. Never learned from his mistakes. No idea how somebody so smart sometimes can be so dumb.
@@bozgy I could argue his best game was in Samoa but in HvV he crashed and burned alot of people speculated that this was a result of playing back-to-back seasons. He actually did very good in the pre merge with the blind side of Tyson, Rob and Coach but at the merge is where he falls apart as he takes control of the game he does things like blindsiding Danielle in a brutal way and calling Rupert a dumbass straight to his face and calling him the coming of Christ this is a big example of how not to win the game that's why everyone on his alliance listened to him because they realized if they take him to the end they could win against him that's how poor his game was in this season the reason he didn't make it far his 3rd time was because everyone else was aware of how he plays now and he is always a automatic first boot from his tribe because no one could trust him I think he if he ever comes back he has to play Tony's winning game in WaW laying low until the time is right for him to make a move that's what he should've done in Redemption Island because he had the shortest gap between getting brought back again with only having a one season break until playing again.
Russell Hantz played the same type of game in Samoa which is the reason he didn't win. He has horrible jury management skills. These were on much fuller display on H v. V but it was essentially the same game. All Russell had to do was show some humility and respect for the other players and he might've won.
It's easy to forget that in Samoa he started off being liked by a lot of people. While he was always himself in confessionals, he was telling fake stories about being a firefighter during hurricane Katrina and garnering sympathy early on. He became more of an arrogant jerk as the game progressed. Had he continued lying and garnering sympathy in people's faces while only trashing them in confessionals, he might've won Samoa. The difference with HvV is that he pretty much started the game already acting like a jerk and never stopped. He never showed us even a glimpse of a winning social game there.
Idk why, but I have a soft spot for Phillip, and found him super entertaining. I do agree with everything you said about him though, and that he never had a chance.
When I clicked on this video, the first person who came to mind was Russel Hantz. I was hoping to see him at #1, but I understand why he was only #2. I guess I thought of him though, because he's a goat that plays really hard to get himself to the end.
Yeah, I think the only reason he’s not is because he could have probably won had he came prepared with explaining his moves and complimenting the jury.
You can make a drinking game out of Phillip Shepherds overall persona, alone....every time he says “I’m a formal federal agent...” take a drink 🥃 #Cheers
@@jaxandfriends3471 Except when it came to knowing how to get votes, because the thought that being an asshole to the jury was the easiest way to lose clearly never crossed his mind
@@DarthVader964 He was, just not as bad as in HvV. The jury votes he got were from the Galus he betrayed so no one was bitter against him for betrayals, they just disliked him because he just came off as slimey, sneaky, and arrogant.
if she wanted to win first off she should have broughten Matt and not Bob. Even if she didn't bag her FTC performance she had no chance once she took Bob who was sure all the Onion votes except maybe Randy, and Matt was never voting Sugar after she betrayed him unlike Bob who would have still voted her.
Ninja he had a great backstory to win, but he also betrayed his main alliance for Earl's alliance. Which made him lose 3(?) votes. So yeah I'd call him a goat
Sherri from Caramoan! She flipped at the merge and conceded all pf her strategic autonomy until day 39. She was the only person I thought of before Phillip
I think that Troyzan in Game Changers deserves at least an honorable mention in this. Hell he is barely even visible at all in that season. At least Philip and Russel made were relevant in one way or another in their goat season.
@Peridiam You are totally in a different world with regards to your 'TOP' survivor videos! I just happen to love watching 'survivor' on youtube and your channel pops up, and I gave it a try! And boy... all your videos I've watched are all out of touch! I am totally not on the same page on what you are reading on survivor!
Michael Angelo Soltis Perhaps it’s you who’s out of touch? 😜 We can disagree. I don’t expect everyone to agree with me. We can both be in touch. I’d like to think I’m doing okay given the audience I’ve garnered.
Do Top Chokers in Survivor. Those who are favorite to win it all, but didn't win important challenges Those who come to mind: Aubry (lost final immunity challenge and advantage to remove jury), Malcolm and Ozzy (lost final immunity)
At first I thought Becky (Cook Islands) should go on this list because she was so clearly brought to the end and her and Sundra fought hard in the challenges but ultimately were carried by Ozzy's athleticism and Yul's strategic prowess. They didn't care if Becky or Sundra made it to the end because they knew they could beat either of them. And the hour long fire making challenge fail was such a clear representation of their ineptitude. Still a big Aitu 4 fan though!
One thing about Cook Islands, though, is there was a twist in which it was the first season with a final 3 instead of a final 2. Sundra nearly beat Ozzy in the final four immunity challenge. It's possible that Becky and Sundra's plan was to flip on Yul and Ozzy at the end to get to the supposed final 2, but the editing didn't do them any favors. Idk, just a thought
@@richardross4677 Adam was Parvati's Goat. I think Adam and Russell sort of prove that Parvati isn't a man hater or anything she'll drag you to the finals if she doesn't think anyone will vote for you. The problem with James and Ozzy is they were way too big of threats to even think about teaming up with Parvati.
Thanks for your videos and GOAT assessments. While I agree with the criteria you use as measurements, several of them added immeasurably to the viewer's interest and in my case are noteworthy. Hantz for drama, Phillip for humour, Sugar for her missteps. You can call them goats - I call them interesting...my HO.
I've been waiting for a Survivor channel like this. I love your work and I hope one day you do like a live stream during Survivor and we can all discuss it live with you or something. You're the shit.
Gervese is a really underrated goats he was arrogant, rude, ignorant and had no self awareness and the jury knew that the entire time as during tribals Caleb, Aras and vytas would laugh their asses off whenever gervese claimed to be behind tysons moves
Also he probably loses in a Final 2 to Monica 8-0. And Monica herself was a goat who probably has no winning F3 out of the whole cast, and she probably sweeps Gervase. So yes Gervase is underrated as a goat, he probably should be on the list.
@@tumicduguar2583 amen to that, had it been a final two im 100 percent sure Laura, Tina, ciera, Caleb, vytas, aras, and Hayden would’ve voted for Monica and gervese might’ve only gotten Tyson had Monica been the one to vote him out (which would’ve been the only possibility since Monica was a challenge beast)
@@tumicduguar2583 I think Monica has a chance if it's her, Gervase, and if Vytas is the 3rd finalist. Probably an even better chance if it's Laura as the 3rd finalist.
One big GOAT that I just forgot about: Will from Worlds Apart. Once he had that altercation with Shirin and aligned completely with Rodney....a complete GOAT, he did get one vote tho.
People talk about Russell getting a bitter jury....talk about Sugar's. Yeah, she did things in a fairly unlikable manor, but she was responsible for most of them being there and was head and shoulders above any one else that season in terms of strategy. Bob, while I love him, wasn't that much of a strategic threat, and I still don't know how Susie made it to the end.
bitter jury fallacy, they didn't like HER, and that's enough to not want to give someone a win. They didn't care about the moves she made, they didn't like HER. It's a social game, which she was HORRID at.
oh yeah I like her and Russell, they are kind of players I want to watch in Survivor not 10 people like Bob in the game if Survivor decide to take the way off
Jury management is part of the game. It is a part of why Survivor is so luck-based. If you look at your field of players post merge, it is near impossible to determine what kind of people they really are and how they would vote in a jury. So you play the game to the best of your ability and try not to ruffle feathers if it isn't necessary (Russel and Sugar couldn't help themselves with this). That is what separates ruthless players like Ben and Tony from Russel, they are good people at their core, and at the end of the day Ben got incredibly lucky and had a beautiful story to tell and Tony owned his game.
I mean it's been a hot minute since I've seen the season, so I don't really remember what she did to people like Charlie and Marcus. I know she hurt Kenny's feelings and also Corrine and Randy where never going to vote for her, but I don't remember what exactly she did to piss people off. We've seen people play sarcastic and sneaky and very openly antagonistic (Sandra, Tony, Ben), so I'm not sure why Sugar gets the bad end here. I think her gameplay would be perfect for the current model of survivor, where people seem to overlook a lot of the personal stuff that happens in favor of strategic play.
Thank you for putting Russell on this list. Not enough people appreciate that he is incapable of winning the game of Survivor with the strategy he put forward. He was never robbed, he didn't fall victim to a bitter jury, he just played 2/3rds of a survivor game rather than a full one.
More like he played 1/3 of a game. He only had a strategic game, and even his strategic game is overrated, since he doesnt even make decent choices on such simple strategic choices as who to bring to the end and what a goat is and what isnt which any nincompoop can usually do but not Russell. Mediocre to poor physical game, only 3 challenge wins in 3 seasons, 2 he lasted the whole 39 days, 2 of 3 which occured when only 4 people were left in the game (2 of his only 3 ever immunity wins were Final 4s), and a bigtime losing record in pre merge team challenges over his 3 seasons which he was a big part of. Awful social game obviously.
Brett S. He was Robbed in Samoa, sorry that's definitely the case. HvV he played well the 1st 26 days but his last 13 days he was horrible. Getting upset at Jerri for not taking him on a challenge and making a alliance with Rupert and Colby dumb and his jury speech of how he was so good and that's why he got there was awful. Jerri had even said until he made that speech she thinks a few people would have voted for him (including J.T.) we know he originally had her vote because she said that in the exit interview. Where are the real goats? Monica Culpepper,? Woo? Becky (Cooks Island) those were goats.
Russell jury management skills being terrible really makes no sense to me. 3 of the 4 people that he took to the finals from the outside looking in really didn't do much. Natalie and Mick litterly just followed orders. In HvV I think he should of taken Jerri or Danielle over Parvati as they didn't do much either but at the end it's irrelevant because Sandra won because she wasn't in Russell's alliance. Also this shows how hypocritical Survivor is. One of the big reasons for the Heros to hate Russell was because he swore on his kids. Tony swore on his kids and his deceased father. Another example of hypocriacy is on Game Changers. Flippers never win and then Sarah who flipped on everybody somehow beats the guy that led one of the alliances and won 5 immunities. Her original season Kass was seen as a terrible player because she flipped on her alliance. Sarah is seen as a master player because she was wishy-washy and flipped on everybody. That makes tons of sense.
Peridiam, you underrank Natalie T. She is clearly the #1 goat, not #3. Philip atleast got a vote and the cast say maybe he beats Rob if he had said it was all an act to get to the end as his brilliant plan at FTC. Not likely he does that but still a chance. Russell probably beats Danielle and Candice, or maybe if he doesn't betray Danielle which is the top thing that really made the jury hate him, he even has a shot vs Danielle and Parvati since a lot of the jury hated or had personal grudges with Parvati. There is no way those 2 are biggest goats than Natalie T.
Diane Ross Getting 1 vote doesn’t change anything to me. Phillip couldn’t win and seeing him twice play cemented the status. He doesn’t adapt socially at all. I give Nat the benefit of the doubt as a young girl who had yet to find a voice. And Russell loses to everyone in HvV.
@@Peridiam It seems you are ranking Natalie lower since she was young and has more future potential to be a non goat. I can see that and I agree she has more future potential to be a non goat than Russell or Philip (doubt she plays again to ever find out) but I think biggest goats should be ranked on their goat level from their own seasons. We can say Russell and Philip with 95% certainty could not win in any Final 3 those season. The 5% being that Philip unveils his unlikely jury speech to win against Natalie and Rob, and that Russell wins in a Candice-Daniele F3 (you have to atleast give him 5% in that, Candice can't win for sure so it is between him and Daniele). We can say with 100% certainty Natalie T could not win in any Final 3 of her season. 100% > 95% Also considering she has said she wins a Final 3 vs Grant and Philip on RI in interviews years later it seems giving her benefit for youth is faulty as she is just as dumb today as she was at the time of her season, and she is now a woman. So there you go.
@@dianeross4361 I feel absolutely certain Phillip wins none of the F3's regardless of what he says in confessionals. I honestly don't believe there's even a chance he pulls a rabbit out of a hat. I believe his social skills were far poorer than Natalie, even if he managed to get a vote. That said I believe Natalie loses 100% of them too, without a doubt. I can't say for certain that Candice wins or loses, but I'd sooner believe either her or Danielle win over Russell given how little respect that jury had for him (and understandably so). I've gleaned enough from the jury's perspectives (post-season interviews, podcasts, long-form analysis of the season, etc) to believe he stood even an iota of a chance -- it's more likely he stood no chance. I can create fan-fiction all I want to give him 5% but ultimately it's meaningless because what I did get told me enough.
@@Peridiam Fair enough. Thanks for your responses. I am pretty sure Danielle wins a F3 with Candice and Russell anyway. I would guarantee Candice not winning though and I am pretty sure it is an even bigger guarantee than Russell not winning. Everyone hated her to start with, and then when she flipped her fellow heroes were all super bitter. She was literally scared to enter Ponderosa since she knew they all literally wanted to punch her in the face, especialy Amanda. And the villians all hated her besides her real life friend Sandra, which is why they voted her right after she flipped even though she was the biggest fucking goat on the island pretty much. Add to all that she utterly sucks ass at the game too, as her stupid ass flip which made NO sense proves yet again. She makes the end, even in an goat F3 with Danielle and Russel, she gets 1 vote probably from her real life friend Sandra, and that is it. It seems you are unaware how hated Candice was, but since there was no F2 that season and Danielle is pretty much certain to win that F3 it doesn't matter I guess. I base Philip having a shot at winning a F3 with Natalie and Rob on the jury videos. You can watch some for yourself if you don't believe me as they are still up online. Mike, Matt, Grant, Andrea, Ralph of course, and amazingly David and Julie all said they were willing to vote Philip in that F3 if he admitted he was playing the goat to make the end and it was his plan all along and owned it. Now I know that Philip ever doing this is super unlikely, almost unimaginable, however keep in mind his making F3 at all seemed unbelievable most of the way, despite what a goat he was. I question David given his Rob loving jury speech, and I question Juile too. The other 5 are all quite believable though, and if all 5 of those voted Philip he wins. Grant hated Rob so much after he booted him they never spoke again. Matt admits to being super bitter at Rob and wanting to not vote him. Mike was just not a fan. Andrea actualy was pretty friendly with Philip, and was also somewhat bitter. So yes I do think in the unlikely event Philip gives the speech he spoke of he has atleast a 50% shot of winning that exact F3 (no others probably) he was in. Which is still very unlikely to win as he is very unlikely to give that speech. Still I am not basing that on Philip confessionals, I am basing that on jury videos and juror comments. Natalie T loses points to me for being so stupid to have done an interview that claims she wins a F3 over Philip and Grant. She has some sheer nerve saying that. I am not a Grant fan, but I would bet $10, 000 atleast he not only wins that F3 if we invent a time machine, but that he wins it 9-0-0. I can't even imagine Rob or Ashley voting her over Grant, and those are the only two I would even consider. This is as a grown ass adult woman, not the little girl she was there, so it makes me doubt she really has gained the maturity or intelligence to be a non goat. Even if she is socially ok, even there she isn't that, atleast not based on her RI game. She was super cliqish and formed no bonds on the whole island with anyone outside of Rob and Ashley, and maybe Grant and Andrea to a very minor degree. And had a bit of a mean girl vibe, and adding to that how annoyingly stupid she is/was, and her prone-ness to creepy crushes like her obsession with Rob, and she isn't overall that likeable at all despite in some ways being pretty nice I guess.
I actually think Phillip was playing a good game the 2nd time. He had complete control until Malcom blindsided everyone with the 2 idols and Reynolds immunity.
I agree with Russell being number 2 because he didnt learn in his first game and had and undeserved sense of entitlement and did the same thing in his second game and expected a different result
Philip and Natalie - Ashley missed out on immunity and a Rob vote off Sugar - She betrayed a lot of people in Gabon and her personality was hated by the jury Lillian - I still liked how she made it to the final Kass - She would loose to almost anyone in Cagayan becuase they saw her moves as bad ones
Nobody has said this except Kass herself. And she is fucking delusional, and said at the actual time of Cagayan she knows she loses to even Woo. It is revionist history she is now saying long after the shows filming she beats Woo, but she is wrong and must have forgotten just how hated she was by that cast.
Even though I agree that Philip is a goat I love him so I think he is polarizingJeff even said during the reunions episode that he's the most polarizing player since Russell
Not really. Anyone with a brain would have done the same thing. If I were on a season with Phillip and Natalie I would take them to the end with me too. They would stand out like a sore thumb to me, and I wouldnt need hindsight of seeing a season of them to ever know that. And sitting at FTC with those two cunts I could literally take a giant dump right in front of the jury just before FTC started and still win the million.
Very true S Bam, and no one wants to talk about how Rob's tribe was physically much weaker than the other and were down in the numbers. They worked well as a team, however, to win some close immunity challenges to come out ahead at the merge. If Russell didn't play the same game he did the first two times, the other tribe wouldn't have had to thrown a challenge and the end result could have been a different story. But people want to stick to the, "Oh, the producers fixed it for Rob to win!" mentality. It's sad how many people are short sighted and refuse to look at the big picture. Rob did a great job making everyone in his alliance think he would take them to the end because of how strong his relationships were on an individual and personal level. In Grant, Andrea, and Ashley's mind, they all thought they would beat him in final tribal so they had no problems voting the way he wanted. Only Ashley suspected Rob's motives at final four but by then it was too late.
@@thatsawrap5235 It made sense for Grant, Ashley, and Andrea to think they had a shot to beat Rob in a jury vote, but why on earth would Phillip and Natalie think that way? If nothing else they should not have wanted to be with Rob at the end, so what was their logic in keeping him.
Grant, Ashley, Andrea didn't just think they beat Rob at FTC. All 3 in fact do best him, especially Grant and Ashley. Which speaks to a major flaw in robs game play in comparison to dome of the best winners like Kim, Tony, Earl, Tom, who were just as dominant but unlike Rob loved by their juries and beat everyone.
This might be a dumb topic, but to me it is interesting to think about the non-contestants, such as loved ones or jury members, who had the biggest impact on the game. Possible people are Johnny Fairplay's "buddy" Dan, who went along with his dead grandmother lie and Erik Cardona from Survivor: Samoa, who, in his speech as a jury member, may have convinced the jury to choose Natalie over Russell.
You nailed it buddy! I'm so grateful you threw Russell out there! So many people love him and don't get why he lost every time he played! He has zero jury management and doesn't get that it's almost the most important piece of the game!
I agree but ranking him over even someone like Natalie T, who is probably even more incapable of ever winning a juryvote against anyone in an entire cast, but unlike Russell does nothing and has to be dragged to the end even as a mega goat is too harsh. Above Sugar who is basically just an even messier and less active version of Russell is harsh too.
Plus maybe the 2 biggest goats in history at FTC is pretty funny in itself. A seagull as the 3rd finalist even wins the game in a Final 3 with Nat T and Phil, but that is part of the amusement and humor of it all. I love trainwreck seasons like Gabon and Nicaragua. Redemption Island was not a total trainwreck style season but the people who make FTC was a trainwreck kind of thing.
Without Natalie, I think that's a fair assessment. But she deserved to win her season, which I don't think you dispute. But yes, Shambo and Jason would actually maybe be the only combination that I'd vote for Russell over...even saying that hurts me.
He was the only entertainment of that godawful season. Even Rob was alternatively boring and insufferable this season, while playing a great game to win. Well Matt's bible metamorphis sessions were kind of funny I guess. And Natalie's clueless non realization she was a giant ass goat was pretty hilarious (Phillip atleast knew it, and didn't really care).
Gervase was bad, but I'm not sure Top 5. Still bad though. I figured throwing in Russell would annoy some people, but I truly believe he played one of the greatest "goat" games ever. Considering he was also a new player to the cast, none of them knew him except for those 39 days, and he still managed to lose all their respect... it doesn't get much worse than that.
Call me crazy, but having watched that season not very long ago, I really do think Philip had a really good chance to grab that game by the balls and win the whole thing. If he got rid of Rob and suddenly turned back into a sensible human being and told the jury how he put on an act to annoy everyone and have himself be perceived as no threat and then turn it all around to get the eventual winner out of the game, he might have very well won. I really though he was going for it and the interviews with him during the last few days, he was saying how he had it all planned out, I really did believe the fella. It just turned out he was truly a goat with stockholm syndrome or something. Kind of a shame.
If he got rid of Rob he definitely could not win. The only F3 there is a small chance his plan works is the one he was actually in with Rob and Natalie T.
If Philip gets rid of Rob he does not even make F3 in the first place I am pretty sure. Unless you mean late, but that would be too late for him. The only time from F4 to F6 Rob could have been taken out was the first F5 (not the 2nd he played his idol). If that happens you have Grant, Ashley, Andrea/Rob back from RI, Natalie, Philip. Assuming Andrea comes back the 3 girls probably make an alliance to get rid of Grant and Philip now anyway. Or Grant wins immunities at F5 and F4 and takes either Philip or Natalie, or Ashley and Natalie to the F3 and wins easily in both cases. Philip's only chance would be to argue it was "his move" to take out Rob but Grant and/or Ashley would just talk over him, take credit for it instead, and since they are seen as stronger players Philip would just wind up blowing up since he couldn't convince anyone. He would have to take rob out earlier but again he doesnt even make the end now almost for sure.
Phillip would have needed a Final 2 with Natalie T to stand any chance at winning. His best chance was the Final 3 he was in against Rob and Natalie, both who would have lost to all 9 others who made the merge, and he still got only 1 vote.
@@grantgoffin4774 damn this post is from a while ago. I really think whoever gets rob out of the game would win over the jury, especially when they're as weird as philip was
Love the videos. idea for new video: movies or events that doomed a tribe. For example medical evacs, blindsiding strong members early, Gretchen not forming alliance first season, etc.
I feel like there was a reason Russel got taken to the end (due to his abusive/rude behaviour), however I feel like Russel knows how to play the game and strategically the only player with a better strategic game was Parvarti. Russell’s problem was he had a terrible social and game and even worse jury management. 🤷♀️ Love you Vids, and I respect were you are coming from 🙂👍
@@burnout713 He didn't have anyone he could beat on Heroes vs Villians. Maybe a Final 2 with Candice, but that is it. On Samoa he might have out of Mick, Jaison, Shambo, some combination of those.
FANTASTIC VIDEO! Before watching this I said, "PLEASE include Sugar somewhere, that's all I care about." So thanks for that. The one thing I would disagree about is Lillian being on the list above Dreamz from Fiji because of that whole thing with the car, I don't think he stood a chance even against Cassandra which is saying a whole lot. Good stuff! Can't wait for next week's video!
Thanks! Lill was a fringe pick that I think could be replaced with the right argument. Dreamz was on my short list and I was very ready to include him.
Peridiam who do you think would have won a Final 2 between Philip Sheppard and Natalie Tenerelli? It is just funny to see 2 from the same season make the list. I think the jury would have commited mass suicide and there would be no winner.
Phillip vs Natalie: Phillip locked votes- Matt, Mike, Ralph Natalie locked votes- Ashley, maybe Steve Rob, Grant, Andrea, Julie (hated both) all uncertain. Probably depends if Phillip still tanks FTC. If he tries he wins.
#1 for me will always be Dreamz not only was he unlikable, but he screwed over almost every person. Then for good measure he screws over the guy who gave him a car in front of the jury the night before the final vote. Even Phillip could have beaten him. #2 Phillip. I mean not only is this guy never gonna win, but he called Rob the mastermind in front of the entire jury and told them how grateful he was that Rob kept him around. #3 Will was already known for not doing much of anything. He flipped on his original alliance for no real reason other than he liked Rodney. Then he berated Shriin and made her cry without showing any remorse. #4 Russell Hantz in HvV. There was no final 3 combination for him to win. Not even a final 2. He was awful. #5 Sharri she wasn't going to beat anyone. She allienated half her tribe from the beginning. Once she made the merge instead of working to overthrow the favorites she decided to obey Cochran and go to the end with him. Her final tribal was awful as she yelled at Erik for explaining why people didn't want to vote for her.
Alright list but I strongly disagree with Will being there. He should be a goat but on this cast he wasn't that big a goat. Tyler, Rodney, Dan were all planning to vote him going into FTC, and if they did he would have taken 2nd over Carolyn and lost to Mike by just 1 vote. He also did have a valid reason to flip. He was clearly 4th beneath Joe, Hali, Jenn in the No Collar alliance, and they were adding Shirin so he was now 5th, and Shirin disliked him since before the merge, even before the tirade. He never makes the end staying with that group so he flipped, made the end, and even stood a shot at jury votes. Also how on earth can you not have Natalie T on your list. You seriously don't consider he a top 5 goat of all time, LOL! She wins no Final 3 out of the whole cast on the worst season ever, not even one against Russell and Phillip. She also gets 0 votes in nearly every Final 3, the one with Rob as we saw and any Final 3 with Grant, Andrea, Ashley, Matt, Mike, she again is getting 0 votes. In fact most or all of those would have won if they replaced her against Rob and Phillip, since the jury were anti Rob by the end, and she got 0 votes, less than Phillip in even that Final 3. And I honestly think she might (not sure but might) lose a Final 2 against Phillip even. Plus in addition to standing no prayer in a jury vote she did nothing and was unlikeable to boot.
@@grantgoffin4774 so why did Will only get 1 vote? Where's your source on this? It clearly didn't take much for Mike to change Dan's mind. I have a hard time believing Tyler was ever seriously gonna vote for Will. He simply stood no chance at all against anyone in a cast in which in normal seasons half of them would be considered goats. Will was a goat to goats! That's why I consider him top 5. I got no problem with Natalie T. Being listed in a top 5. I think she beats Phillip in a final 2, but not in a blowout which speaks to what a goat she is. Ralph just respected his hard work and had no issues with Phillip. Nearly everyone else got into arguments with him constantly. Natalie was lazy, but most the cast said she was nice enough to be around. I guess I just didn't put her in my top 5 cuz she was actually liked by some people. She just wasn't respected. The top 5 I listed weren't liked or respected.
@@ajl9772 Will probably wins a Final 3 over Shirin and Dan, which already means he wasn't a complete goat. Plus that he could have gotten 2nd over a strong player like Carolyn in the Final 3 he was. He probably should have been a goat I agree, but this a weird cast of weird people. You have to go by how the cast views them, not how you view them, as that is the true meaning of a goat. That also makes someone like Natalie T who had ZERO percent chance to win any Final 3 out of the entire merge/entire cast, you can debate a Final 2 with Phillip, but there is absolutely no Final 3 she stands a chance in, a much bigger goat than Will. Atleast by the true definition of what a goat is. She could never win the game in any scenario as there was never going to be a Final 2 that season. She claimed years ago I think somewhere she wins a Final 3 over Grant and Phillip, and she got some barraged on social media with ridicule she stopped doing any Survivor interviews ever again and even shut down her social media briefly, LOL! That is how ridiculous people viewed the idea of her winning any Final 3 or beating anyone but Phillip was.
@@grantgoffin4774 The issue with these hypothetical scenarios is alot has to change. Will getting to the end next to Shrinn and Dan means an entirely different game was played. Perception is completely different. All that said, I think Dan and Shriin were actually more well liked by the hypothetical jury. Will burned a bridge with Joe, Hali and Jenn. Mike, Sierra and Carolyn lost respect for him after the way he berated her. Rodney was the only vote Will realistically was ever gonna get and it's worth mentioning He was sitting next to 2 of the most disliked people in the game. As you said we have to go by how the cast felt. Most didnt really respect Mike or like mama C. Wait you say that we need to go by the way players view them and not the way we view them. So why bring up how fans reacted to her on social media as evidence of her never going to win? Haha I do wonder if she sits next to Matt how it plays out. He was more likable, but I do wonder if that cast could vote for someone voted out twice, especially with Rob on the jury likely campaigning for Natalie. Murphy also likely makes an argument for her. She may even beat out Andrea depending on how people felt about RI and Boston Rob's opinion.
@@grantgoffin4774 you're writing a lot for someone I said is acceptable to be top 5 lmao. As for Will he was never gonna get into the top 3 with anyone he could beat. He had zero chance to win against anyone and it was a cast of much worst jury threats. If you disagree I guess we disagree 🤷
While Tai from Worlds Apart and Game Changers is likeable enough to POTENTIALLY win in the final 3 if the people sitting next to him are really hated, I think he is an honorable mention. He is such a sweetheart but his speech can often be hard to understand because English isn't his first language, and when the climax of a season requires you to plead a case of why you should win to a jury of your peers and speak under pressure, a timid and humble man who has trouble with speech is going to have a tough time ever winning. Also my definition of a Goat is someone that is specifically dragged to the end, lead to the slaughter, and has less than 1% chance of winning ANY given season based solely on their character. Chaos Kass, Tai (although he is great at endurance comps), Phillip, Natalie. I think because of Russel's Samoa game, you actually cannot label him a goat regardless of his gameplay in HvV. Sure he has no self-awareness when it comes to final tribals, but based solely on his ferocious game play of finding idols, winning clutch challenges, and manipulating weaker players simply by fear, I could actually see him winning 20-40% of any final tribal he makes it too. He needs to avoid a salty jury (Samoa) and a stronger final 3 (HvV), but he isn't a goat by nature imo.
I wasn't saying a player was 100% a goat every time they play--like you said, Russell wasn't a goat in Samoa, but he was in HvV. Same thing as Nat Ten being a goat in RI, but I bet if she played again she wouldn't be such a goat. I don't think any player is entirely a goat forever, just in that specific season. Russell's Samoa game is separate from his HvV game, two distinct entities, two wildly different performances despite appearing the same on paper. One he had a chance to win, the other no chance. Of course you have to define what a "goat" means to you. To me it's just a player with no chance to win.
She was originally going to be a villain. But Robbed complained the tribes were unfair so they swapped her and Parvati. This got Russell’s guy fired thus being the reason Russell targeted Rob all game.
Tastyquicksand - #DailyNFLVideos what I heard was Candice was originally a villain and Parv was a hero and they swapped. Idk they did cast the season before they chose the theme so we can't really know
I honestly think Sugar could’ve won if she didn’t have the SINGLE WORST final tribal performance of anyone ever. And that’s including Amanda Kimmel and Russell Hantz.
Christopher Herrera Phillip? All he did was yell at people, say “to hell with you,” and talk about how he wouldn’t be there if it wasn’t for Boston Rob.
Bob was always winning. The 4 Onions were always voting him. Unless Matty was there, then Randy probably switches his vote since he didnt like Bob really, but since he hated Sugar and Susie too he was always going to vote with his Onion alliance in that one. Susie is the one who had an outside shot to win if she really pandered well for Randy's vote against Bob. Sugar probably only ever had a shot at Kenny or Cyrstal's vote, which if she got both could give her 2nd over Susie, but even that is a long shot at best. Matty was no way in hell voting Sugar after she fucked him over at Final 4 for creepy old Bob. And no way in hell freezing over Corinne, Randy, Marcus, Charlie were ever voting her no matter what she did at FTC.
Kenneth Reichelt you are not wrong 😂 but yul was an absolute strategic beast, a social player and he was not weak. ozzy was súper likeable, made some moves and was a challenge god, but yul played the game from every angle
@@valbecerra9744 I just rewatched his season and Yul is completely over hyped. His strategic moves were not game changing at all, kept with his tribe alliance. Yul didn't win a single immunity challenge when Ozzy won 5/6. But in Winners at War you could really get a better insight into Yuls strategic play. WaW really increased his stock value.
The final 3 system was designed to almost the 95% of the time allow a goat in the final 3. This is why I liked more the final 2 system but Jeff explained a few seasons ago that they use the final 3 system because they are hoping for a tied at one point during the final vote count. In this case the third person is the one that break the tied voting for one of the other 2 players. I don't think that this is ever going to happen but in season 35 they changed the way the final 3 is decided and now you have to earn the spot through a challenge (in that case it was a fire making challenge and Ben won it).
I prefer the final 3 because in some cases, the 3rd placer are the deserving ones to win, Kathy from Marquesas, Terry from Panama, Cirie from Micronesia, maybe even Rob from Amazon.
I know you posted this a few years ago, but I would love to see you do "honorable mentions" to gauge who else would've made your top 10 or top 5. Obviously, no need for a deep dive, but just a quick understanding of who else you considered.
Guys, PLEASE READ:
GOAT = an acronym for “Greatest Of All Time”
Goat = not an acronym, but instead a player who very likely won’t win
Write this 100 times tonight for homework and I’ll see you in the morning.
What about krass?
No, the word you’re looking for is “lamb”.
Used the word GOAT. %100. Wrong. Just like a sheep or a lemming would do
I expected a GOAT video when I clicked. would rather see a GOAT video
Whenever Phillip gets brought up, I always laugh when I remember the first time I realized they put a question mark at the end of "Former Federal Agent". Shows that even the people working on Survivor had their doubts.
Ikr
😂😆
I died when I saw that 😂😂😂
Yea but it turned out he was actually a Former Federal Agent which is crazy😂
Or was he
I would've included Will from World's Apart, the classic "Dead Fish"
Troyzan from game changers is one of the biggest imo as well. Especially considering no one on the jury wanted to ask him any questions and he even acknowledged at FTC that he wasn't going to win. Also called it with Sugar being on the list. ;)
I think there are scenario's where Troyzan can win that season though since he didn't offend anyone and made some moves (fair enough, always together with Brad) but didn't get much credit for them. If he's sitting next to Tai and Brad instead of Sarah, I see him getting a vote or two.
I disagree. I think Troyzan was one of if not the strongest goat in history. He has potential to get votes in plenty of other seasons. The fact he acknowledged his being a loser showes he was self-aware and that’s more than around twenty other goats of survivor's history. He had respect of the jury. Just way less of it than Brad and Sarah. So many people before him had no respect of the jury or were hated and disdained by them.
Agree
I wouldn't say he was the biggest goat, because the only real way I could've seen him losing Game Changers was if Sarah was at the final four with him. Against a final three of Brad and Tai, I can see him having a good chance to win
Brad deserved the win that season. Sarah was a bystander
Jeff can I vote for none of the above?
I have a lot of respect for Sugar and her gameplay. I think she stood up to Randy and Corinne, even though it cost her votes. She played with her heart and often called the shots.
I have no respect for Sugar after what she did to Matty at Final 4. She can go fuck herself, and I wish she had succeeded in killing herself at Heroes vs Villians.
@@richardross4677 she had a really good relationship with Bob.
I agree Phillip is the Greatest Of All Time
... at being the worst contestant in competitive reality television history.
(Sarcasm)I mean He did start a fight about Racism over white rice, That was a pretty good move, or do u remember when he found his pink underwear. i think he was the "Greatest" of all time
George Jackson Russell is the goat
He easily cracks my Top 10 greatest survivor contestants ever.
He's a top 5 most entertaining player ever
Sugar; "I don't think you necessarily have to vote for me"
Some people; "I think she was trying to win"
uhhh
Yeah, I don't think Sugar was trying to win. Or rather, she would have liked to won, but she wasn't going to compromise who she was to even gain the slightest advantage. This is a game where lying and deceit are some of the most effective tools. So she wanted to win a million, but she wasn't willing to play smart to do it, and I think she knew what the smart strategy was. So, that's just the long way of saying she wasn't really trying to win.
My controversial Gabon hot take is that Sugar (entirely by accident and without realizing it whatsoever) played the best game of the season - and if she wasn't such an unstable force and so terrible at FTC, she probably could've come in second or maybe even first. But her lack of awareness of how well she (again, accidentally) played as well as her emotions and rudeness definitely tanked it for her.
I actually think Phillip played decently in Caramoan! He did more by coming in tenth place than John did, and John won unanimously because all three of the final three that season were goats just John was more likeable than the other two.
Sugar should have won that season hands down she was the best. One of the most underrated players.
That jury was so tight though. With the Onion alliance. No way in hell she gets votes even if she defense herself.
@@the_fd_180 I think Marcus and Charlie will give it to her if she just knew how to answer questions at the FTC which she should know because she truly played the best game out of the three, suzie at second and Bob was just meh.
My top 5 would be close to this but not exactly the same.
1.Natalie T- moved up
2. Phillip
3. Troyzan
4. Sugar
5. Russell Heroes vs Villians- moved down
you putting Russell at second again is SENDING me
Matt in Amazon, Twila in Vanuatu, Katie in Palau, Becky in CI, Cassandra and Dreamz in Fiji, Sherri in Caramoan, Gervase in BvW, Will in WA
hey
Survivor Fan i think that's a bit harsh on gervase to put him in that list.
Gervase actually played a pretty good game. Everyone just thought it was Tyson calling the shots, gervase called the shots in the background
You are talking about goats that were in the background. The list is mainly about goats with power.
Gervase did have control
I think "biggest goats" would be a better title. I was under the impression the list was gonna be about the goats who played the greatest games etc. Awesome list regardless, I love you channel \o
I agree. I'm very familiar with the goat term as it's used in survivor but I didnt even realise that's what he was referring to until I watched the video
I love that the top three were all in Redemption Island
Good video. I think your top 3 perfectly encapsulates the 3 ultimate goat games; be the rudest, most annoying person possible (Phillip), go scorched earth, grinding people underneath your foot as you vote them out (Russell) and be the biggest do-nothing imaginable who can make no decisions of her own (Natalie). They'd be my top 3 as well.
Yes the quintessential Final 3 in all senses of goat.
8:02 Ruffle, ruffle feathers. You said rustle feathers.
Russell is a first name.
I mean like how you can rustle leaves... its the same word
It's called a pun, sweetie.
Danny Lopez Dude... do you not watch Survivor? The guy who made this comment (along with Peridiam) were referencing a moment from BvW...
Rustle, ruffle whatever....
Wow I was honestly so surprised when Hantz was at #2 but it makes sense when you explained it. Every fan loves that guy though, he is definitely a top 3 villain of all time
Not really. To me he was mediocre - a great villain will backstab, but do it in a way that still makes them likable/gives them chance to win. Russell was mediocre at best - he was allowed to do it, cause everyone realized if they took him to the final 3, no one would vote for him. A good villain learns from mistakes, improves and Russell was incapable of both those things. His narcissistic persona made him incapable of learning, since he believed he could do no wrong :)
He is one of those stereotypical one-dimensional villains you see in mediocre action movies :)
No idea how anybody can love this dude. Complete asshole and one of the worst players ever.
The man doesn't understand the rules of the game, that the game ends with the jury voting so calling them "dumbasses" will loose you votes and in the same time you gain absolutely nothing out of it. And he never figured it out. He played 4 times and did the exact same thing each time. Even after his first 2 seasons aired and everybody knew who he was, he repeated his mistakes over and over. Results were as everybody expected. In Redemption island his tribe threw the first challenge to get him out. In Australia, he was sent home first round with an idol on his neck by people who were just figuring out how to play the game.
As Rob said about Phillip "not everything is up there for Russel"
@@bozgy People love him because of his game in Samoa and him becoming the first person to find idols without clues and him causing a unintentional matsing by sabotaging his tribe and building plenty of trust with them while Galu loyalties went untested and the Foa Foa 4 overcoming a 4-8 disadvantage which was probably why they brought him back in HvV he's a great strategist but bad social game if he was good socially he would win his first two seasons.
@@cdawg4021 not questioning what he did with idols and getting to the end twice. But love? That's a bit too much
Regarding his strategy, in HvV he had Jerri & Danielle 2 perfect goats to take to the end but chose Parvati & Sandra, 2 of the best players ever. Not smart at all. Maybe he is convinced he is the only smart player and thinks everybody else is an idiot, can't see how smart those 2 ladies were. Also, Sandra was the only one who fought him so she had a great point to make in the final tribal. No matter what the question was, she always replied with "I tried to get Russel out from day 1" and that was enough to win. Taking Sandra to the end instead of Jerri is one of the biggest blunders ever. He played so bad that he still doesn't win, Parvati wins if Sandra is not there. Even with Jerri & Danielle I still don't think Russel wins, that's how bad he played.
It's not bad social game. Lots of players that tried to have a good social game but failed. Russel said in the reunion "he doesn't care about social game". And I think he really doesn't. The man just doesn't understand the game. Has no clue the jury has power. Thinks just getting to the end with a great strategic game will automatically get him the win. I can't find another player in the history who openly insulted everybody on the jury and still expected to get their votes. Maybe Sugar, but I think she knew she can't win so she messed up everybody's game just for fun. Russel was sure he will win
Also, the "burning ground" strategy can only work if nobody knows about it. After his first 2 seasons, he repeated the same strategy 2 more times in Redemption Island and Australian Survivor which got him voted out first both times. Never learned from his mistakes.
No idea how somebody so smart sometimes can be so dumb.
@@bozgy I could argue his best game was in Samoa but in HvV he crashed and burned alot of people speculated that this was a result of playing back-to-back seasons. He actually did very good in the pre merge with the blind side of Tyson, Rob and Coach but at the merge is where he falls apart as he takes control of the game he does things like blindsiding Danielle in a brutal way and calling Rupert a dumbass straight to his face and calling him the coming of Christ this is a big example of how not to win the game that's why everyone on his alliance listened to him because they realized if they take him to the end they could win against him that's how poor his game was in this season the reason he didn't make it far his 3rd time was because everyone else was aware of how he plays now and he is always a automatic first boot from his tribe because no one could trust him I think he if he ever comes back he has to play Tony's winning game in WaW laying low until the time is right for him to make a move that's what he should've done in Redemption Island because he had the shortest gap between getting brought back again with only having a one season break until playing again.
Russell Hantz played the same type of game in Samoa which is the reason he didn't win. He has horrible jury management skills. These were on much fuller display on H v. V but it was essentially the same game. All Russell had to do was show some humility and respect for the other players and he might've won.
It's easy to forget that in Samoa he started off being liked by a lot of people. While he was always himself in confessionals, he was telling fake stories about being a firefighter during hurricane Katrina and garnering sympathy early on. He became more of an arrogant jerk as the game progressed.
Had he continued lying and garnering sympathy in people's faces while only trashing them in confessionals, he might've won Samoa.
The difference with HvV is that he pretty much started the game already acting like a jerk and never stopped. He never showed us even a glimpse of a winning social game there.
Russel is probably the worst social player in history of Survivor
Keep up the great work! Best Survivor/ Big Brother videos on UA-cam!
Appreciate it Ryan!
I think that will from red collar vs white collar vs blue collar
shhhh... we dont talk about that season
I honestly forgot he got to the end... He was a great goat
Crazy thing is he actually stood a better chance at winning than Mama C.
Peridiam really I always tohught that he wouldn't win and mama c had a better chance
I mean Will has. Dan’s, Rodney’s, Tyler’s at least
Idk why, but I have a soft spot for Phillip, and found him super entertaining. I do agree with everything you said about him though, and that he never had a chance.
Can you do Top 5 Final Jurors
Yes.
David - Millennials vs Generation X
Kelley - Second Chance
Terry - Exile Island
Jerri - Heroes Vs Villains
Maybe Rick in EOE? I dunno
Zincate [TS/QL] possibly Malcom and Cirie
K C and also Cydney from Kaoh Rong
@@khensiapco3336 Cesternino - Amazon
Fairplay - Pearl Islands
Andrea's "ok...it's fine" is hilarious
She was just so done lmao
You have to admit, Lillian, beating Johnny Fairplay in the final immunity challenge was extremely satisfying.
Too bad kass doesn’t count for this video because I was waiting for that “ the next goat, or should I say llama,”
Gervase (BvW)
Tasha (Cambodia)
Troyzan (GC)
As much as I love Survivor, I think i get more excited for a new video on your channel than i do an episode of Survivor.
When I clicked on this video, the first person who came to mind was Russel Hantz. I was hoping to see him at #1, but I understand why he was only #2. I guess I thought of him though, because he's a goat that plays really hard to get himself to the end.
Yeah, I think the only reason he’s not is because he could have probably won had he came prepared with explaining his moves and complimenting the jury.
I was so worried you weren’t going to release a video today. I kept refreshing and BLESSSS 🙌🏽
I was stuck in a snowstorm!!
Peridiam Well that’s a fair excuse 🙈
i love these videos, favorite youtube channel!!
You can make a drinking game out of Phillip Shepherds overall persona, alone....every time he says “I’m a formal federal agent...” take a drink 🥃 #Cheers
Do you know how many deaths were caused by this comment?
...probably a lot 😅
"Russell a lot of feathers" amazing
I’d like to add an honorable mention: Troyzan in Game Changers. Only because he truly believed he had a chance of winning against Sarah and Brad 😂😂😂
He didnt stand a shot vs anyone. Maybe in a Final 2 with Michaela.
He literally conceded in the final tribal though lol
Russell got 2 jury votes in two final 3 appearances. Bruh that’s pathetic.
Russel dominated Somoa
@@jaxandfriends3471 Except when it came to knowing how to get votes, because the thought that being an asshole to the jury was the easiest way to lose clearly never crossed his mind
@@NYChica23 he literally wasn't an asshole in samoa
@@DarthVader964 He was, just not as bad as in HvV. The jury votes he got were from the Galus he betrayed so no one was bitter against him for betrayals, they just disliked him because he just came off as slimey, sneaky, and arrogant.
I still stand by my opinion that Sugar should have/could of won. She got in her own way.
if she wanted to win first off she should have broughten Matt and not Bob. Even if she didn't bag her FTC performance she had no chance once she took Bob who was sure all the Onion votes except maybe Randy, and Matt was never voting Sugar after she betrayed him unlike Bob who would have still voted her.
@@richardross4677 Matty would win in a landslide against Sugar and Susie.
Sugar had one hell of an awful social game.
runner up Goats are Katie (Palau) and Dreamz (Fiji)
Great list. I'd maybe put dreamz on there, because I can't imagine any scenario where he wins the game
My first thought was Dreams, but he really wasnt a goat until the car-thing.. I think.
Ninja he had a great backstory to win, but he also betrayed his main alliance for Earl's alliance. Which made him lose 3(?) votes. So yeah I'd call him a goat
No, he was a goat already. He had backstabbed the 3 horsemen, so none of them were ever voting him, and those were his only possible votes.
Love it !!! Please do episode recaps , even just picking up from today's episode . Would love to see that
I'd like to, but I fear CBS will terrorize me for using the latest episode footage. 😅 They did it with the Jacob video!
Peridiam what if you use casting photos and do a voiceover or this season logo as a background as you talk about the episode.
I would love a second chance season with all the perceived “goats”
This video may be pretty divisive with some of my choices! Who do you think could also fit into the Top 5 Greatest Goats (with or without power)?
Sherri from Caramoan! She flipped at the merge and conceded all pf her strategic autonomy until day 39. She was the only person I thought of before Phillip
Peridiam The two that immediately come to mind are Dreamz from Survivor Fiji and Sherri from Survivor Caramoan
I think that Troyzan in Game Changers deserves at least an honorable mention in this. Hell he is barely even visible at all in that season. At least Philip and Russel made were relevant in one way or another in their goat season.
You also missed Lisa Whelchel, Missy Payne, Will Sims, Tai (32), Hannah, Fishbach, among others
Fishbach? Are you delusional?
@Peridiam You are totally in a different world with regards to your 'TOP' survivor videos! I just happen to love watching 'survivor' on youtube and your channel pops up, and I gave it a try! And boy... all your videos I've watched are all out of touch! I am totally not on the same page on what you are reading on survivor!
Michael Angelo Soltis Perhaps it’s you who’s out of touch? 😜 We can disagree. I don’t expect everyone to agree with me. We can both be in touch. I’d like to think I’m doing okay given the audience I’ve garnered.
Never clicked so fast to a video. I’m in love you with you, Peridiam! Lol
❤
Do Top Chokers in Survivor.
Those who are favorite to win it all, but didn't win important challenges
Those who come to mind: Aubry (lost final immunity challenge and advantage to remove jury), Malcolm and Ozzy (lost final immunity)
And kelley wentworth!
Kathy from Marquesas, Terry from Panama, Yau-man in Fiji, Brett in Samoa, Tina in BvW, Keith in SJDS, Wentworth in Second Chance, David in MvG
At first I thought Becky (Cook Islands) should go on this list because she was so clearly brought to the end and her and Sundra fought hard in the challenges but ultimately were carried by Ozzy's athleticism and Yul's strategic prowess.
They didn't care if Becky or Sundra made it to the end because they knew they could beat either of them. And the hour long fire making challenge fail was such a clear representation of their ineptitude. Still a big Aitu 4 fan though!
One thing about Cook Islands, though, is there was a twist in which it was the first season with a final 3 instead of a final 2. Sundra nearly beat Ozzy in the final four immunity challenge. It's possible that Becky and Sundra's plan was to flip on Yul and Ozzy at the end to get to the supposed final 2, but the editing didn't do them any favors. Idk, just a thought
@@TheEsotericism1 If that was their plan they should have kept Adam.
@@richardross4677 Adam was Parvati's Goat. I think Adam and Russell sort of prove that Parvati isn't a man hater or anything she'll drag you to the finals if she doesn't think anyone will vote for you. The problem with James and Ozzy is they were way too big of threats to even think about teaming up with Parvati.
Some honorable mentions : gervase (BvW), missy(San juan del sur), sherri (caramoan), Troysan (GC)
I've always liked Phillip Shepard. He strikes me as an eccentric billionaire who joined Survivor because he was bored in his mansion one day
I seriously listen to these videos on my Bluetooth radio for 30 minutes on my way to work and the 30 on my way back home 😂 love love love these 😍
Thanks for your videos and GOAT assessments. While I agree with the criteria you use as measurements, several of them added immeasurably to the viewer's interest and in my case are noteworthy. Hantz for drama, Phillip for humour, Sugar for her missteps. You can call them goats - I call them interesting...my HO.
I've been waiting for a Survivor channel like this. I love your work and I hope one day you do like a live stream during Survivor and we can all discuss it live with you or something. You're the shit.
Gervese is a really underrated goats he was arrogant, rude, ignorant and had no self awareness and the jury knew that the entire time as during tribals Caleb, Aras and vytas would laugh their asses off whenever gervese claimed to be behind tysons moves
Also he probably loses in a Final 2 to Monica 8-0. And Monica herself was a goat who probably has no winning F3 out of the whole cast, and she probably sweeps Gervase. So yes Gervase is underrated as a goat, he probably should be on the list.
@@tumicduguar2583 amen to that, had it been a final two im 100 percent sure Laura, Tina, ciera, Caleb, vytas, aras, and Hayden would’ve voted for Monica and gervese might’ve only gotten Tyson had Monica been the one to vote him out (which would’ve been the only possibility since Monica was a challenge beast)
@@tumicduguar2583 I think Monica has a chance if it's her, Gervase, and if Vytas is the 3rd finalist. Probably an even better chance if it's Laura as the 3rd finalist.
Russel Hans is Smart but played the game the wrong way. If he was more social he honestly would have won it because of hes intelligence.
Clay Jordan(season 5) is the original goat
Definitely.
I remember at one point he refused to answer a question and I thought "Wow he's the perfect person to have at the end". Twila was the same way.
One big GOAT that I just forgot about: Will from Worlds Apart. Once he had that altercation with Shirin and aligned completely with Rodney....a complete GOAT, he did get one vote tho.
The only vote he got was from Rodney, which should not count
People talk about Russell getting a bitter jury....talk about Sugar's. Yeah, she did things in a fairly unlikable manor, but she was responsible for most of them being there and was head and shoulders above any one else that season in terms of strategy. Bob, while I love him, wasn't that much of a strategic threat, and I still don't know how Susie made it to the end.
Susie never voted in the minority, she was over looked the entire game
bitter jury fallacy, they didn't like HER, and that's enough to not want to give someone a win. They didn't care about the moves she made, they didn't like HER. It's a social game, which she was HORRID at.
oh yeah I like her and Russell, they are kind of players I want to watch in Survivor not 10 people like Bob in the game if Survivor decide to take the way off
Jury management is part of the game. It is a part of why Survivor is so luck-based. If you look at your field of players post merge, it is near impossible to determine what kind of people they really are and how they would vote in a jury. So you play the game to the best of your ability and try not to ruffle feathers if it isn't necessary (Russel and Sugar couldn't help themselves with this).
That is what separates ruthless players like Ben and Tony from Russel, they are good people at their core, and at the end of the day Ben got incredibly lucky and had a beautiful story to tell and Tony owned his game.
I mean it's been a hot minute since I've seen the season, so I don't really remember what she did to people like Charlie and Marcus. I know she hurt Kenny's feelings and also Corrine and Randy where never going to vote for her, but I don't remember what exactly she did to piss people off. We've seen people play sarcastic and sneaky and very openly antagonistic (Sandra, Tony, Ben), so I'm not sure why Sugar gets the bad end here. I think her gameplay would be perfect for the current model of survivor, where people seem to overlook a lot of the personal stuff that happens in favor of strategic play.
Thank you for putting Russell on this list. Not enough people appreciate that he is incapable of winning the game of Survivor with the strategy he put forward. He was never robbed, he didn't fall victim to a bitter jury, he just played 2/3rds of a survivor game rather than a full one.
Yup! He played to Day 39, but failed to win along the way.
to be honest though what makes me think he shouldnt be on here is because he was in control of his fate unlike other goats who just follow the leader
More like he played 1/3 of a game. He only had a strategic game, and even his strategic game is overrated, since he doesnt even make decent choices on such simple strategic choices as who to bring to the end and what a goat is and what isnt which any nincompoop can usually do but not Russell. Mediocre to poor physical game, only 3 challenge wins in 3 seasons, 2 he lasted the whole 39 days, 2 of 3 which occured when only 4 people were left in the game (2 of his only 3 ever immunity wins were Final 4s), and a bigtime losing record in pre merge team challenges over his 3 seasons which he was a big part of. Awful social game obviously.
Brett S. He was Robbed in Samoa, sorry that's definitely the case. HvV he played well the 1st 26 days but his last 13 days he was horrible. Getting upset at Jerri for not taking him on a challenge and making a alliance with Rupert and Colby dumb and his jury speech of how he was so good and that's why he got there was awful. Jerri had even said until he made that speech she thinks a few people would have voted for him (including J.T.) we know he originally had her vote because she said that in the exit interview. Where are the real goats? Monica Culpepper,? Woo? Becky (Cooks Island) those were goats.
Russell jury management skills being terrible really makes no sense to me. 3 of the 4 people that he took to the finals from the outside looking in really didn't do much. Natalie and Mick litterly just followed orders. In HvV I think he should of taken Jerri or Danielle over Parvati as they didn't do much either but at the end it's irrelevant because Sandra won because she wasn't in Russell's alliance. Also this shows how hypocritical Survivor is. One of the big reasons for the Heros to hate Russell was because he swore on his kids. Tony swore on his kids and his deceased father. Another example of hypocriacy is on Game Changers. Flippers never win and then Sarah who flipped on everybody somehow beats the guy that led one of the alliances and won 5 immunities. Her original season Kass was seen as a terrible player because she flipped on her alliance. Sarah is seen as a master player because she was wishy-washy and flipped on everybody. That makes tons of sense.
Peridiam, you underrank Natalie T. She is clearly the #1 goat, not #3. Philip atleast got a vote and the cast say maybe he beats Rob if he had said it was all an act to get to the end as his brilliant plan at FTC. Not likely he does that but still a chance. Russell probably beats Danielle and Candice, or maybe if he doesn't betray Danielle which is the top thing that really made the jury hate him, he even has a shot vs Danielle and Parvati since a lot of the jury hated or had personal grudges with Parvati. There is no way those 2 are biggest goats than Natalie T.
Diane Ross Getting 1 vote doesn’t change anything to me. Phillip couldn’t win and seeing him twice play cemented the status. He doesn’t adapt socially at all. I give Nat the benefit of the doubt as a young girl who had yet to find a voice. And Russell loses to everyone in HvV.
@@Peridiam It seems you are ranking Natalie lower since she was young and has more future potential to be a non goat. I can see that and I agree she has more future potential to be a non goat than Russell or Philip (doubt she plays again to ever find out) but I think biggest goats should be ranked on their goat level from their own seasons. We can say Russell and Philip with 95% certainty could not win in any Final 3 those season. The 5% being that Philip unveils his unlikely jury speech to win against Natalie and Rob, and that Russell wins in a Candice-Daniele F3 (you have to atleast give him 5% in that, Candice can't win for sure so it is between him and Daniele). We can say with 100% certainty Natalie T could not win in any Final 3 of her season. 100% > 95%
Also considering she has said she wins a Final 3 vs Grant and Philip on RI in interviews years later it seems giving her benefit for youth is faulty as she is just as dumb today as she was at the time of her season, and she is now a woman. So there you go.
@@dianeross4361 I feel absolutely certain Phillip wins none of the F3's regardless of what he says in confessionals. I honestly don't believe there's even a chance he pulls a rabbit out of a hat. I believe his social skills were far poorer than Natalie, even if he managed to get a vote. That said I believe Natalie loses 100% of them too, without a doubt. I can't say for certain that Candice wins or loses, but I'd sooner believe either her or Danielle win over Russell given how little respect that jury had for him (and understandably so). I've gleaned enough from the jury's perspectives (post-season interviews, podcasts, long-form analysis of the season, etc) to believe he stood even an iota of a chance -- it's more likely he stood no chance. I can create fan-fiction all I want to give him 5% but ultimately it's meaningless because what I did get told me enough.
@@Peridiam Fair enough. Thanks for your responses. I am pretty sure Danielle wins a F3 with Candice and Russell anyway. I would guarantee Candice not winning though and I am pretty sure it is an even bigger guarantee than Russell not winning. Everyone hated her to start with, and then when she flipped her fellow heroes were all super bitter. She was literally scared to enter Ponderosa since she knew they all literally wanted to punch her in the face, especialy Amanda. And the villians all hated her besides her real life friend Sandra, which is why they voted her right after she flipped even though she was the biggest fucking goat on the island pretty much. Add to all that she utterly sucks ass at the game too, as her stupid ass flip which made NO sense proves yet again. She makes the end, even in an goat F3 with Danielle and Russel, she gets 1 vote probably from her real life friend Sandra, and that is it. It seems you are unaware how hated Candice was, but since there was no F2 that season and Danielle is pretty much certain to win that F3 it doesn't matter I guess.
I base Philip having a shot at winning a F3 with Natalie and Rob on the jury videos. You can watch some for yourself if you don't believe me as they are still up online. Mike, Matt, Grant, Andrea, Ralph of course, and amazingly David and Julie all said they were willing to vote Philip in that F3 if he admitted he was playing the goat to make the end and it was his plan all along and owned it. Now I know that Philip ever doing this is super unlikely, almost unimaginable, however keep in mind his making F3 at all seemed unbelievable most of the way, despite what a goat he was. I question David given his Rob loving jury speech, and I question Juile too. The other 5 are all quite believable though, and if all 5 of those voted Philip he wins. Grant hated Rob so much after he booted him they never spoke again. Matt admits to being super bitter at Rob and wanting to not vote him. Mike was just not a fan. Andrea actualy was pretty friendly with Philip, and was also somewhat bitter. So yes I do think in the unlikely event Philip gives the speech he spoke of he has atleast a 50% shot of winning that exact F3 (no others probably) he was in. Which is still very unlikely to win as he is very unlikely to give that speech. Still I am not basing that on Philip confessionals, I am basing that on jury videos and juror comments.
Natalie T loses points to me for being so stupid to have done an interview that claims she wins a F3 over Philip and Grant. She has some sheer nerve saying that. I am not a Grant fan, but I would bet $10, 000 atleast he not only wins that F3 if we invent a time machine, but that he wins it 9-0-0. I can't even imagine Rob or Ashley voting her over Grant, and those are the only two I would even consider. This is as a grown ass adult woman, not the little girl she was there, so it makes me doubt she really has gained the maturity or intelligence to be a non goat. Even if she is socially ok, even there she isn't that, atleast not based on her RI game. She was super cliqish and formed no bonds on the whole island with anyone outside of Rob and Ashley, and maybe Grant and Andrea to a very minor degree. And had a bit of a mean girl vibe, and adding to that how annoyingly stupid she is/was, and her prone-ness to creepy crushes like her obsession with Rob, and she isn't overall that likeable at all despite in some ways being pretty nice I guess.
I thought GOAT was Greatest Of All Time
I loved her, but honorable mention has to go to Angelina from David v. Goliath. 😅
Me: *sees phillip on the thumbnail*
Also me: Wait, that's illegal.
Sugar! My favorite goat in this list.
You really need an award for these awesome videos!! You back up ur points so well! I wish my videos were as good as urs!!
I actually think Phillip was playing a good game the 2nd time. He had complete control until Malcom blindsided everyone with the 2 idols and Reynolds immunity.
I agree with Russell being number 2 because he didnt learn in his first game and had and undeserved sense of entitlement and did the same thing in his second game and expected a different result
Philip and Natalie - Ashley missed out on immunity and a Rob vote off
Sugar - She betrayed a lot of people in Gabon and her personality was hated by the jury
Lillian - I still liked how she made it to the final
Kass - She would loose to almost anyone in Cagayan becuase they saw her moves as bad ones
Actually it’s been said that Kass would’ve beat Woo
Asdf Gadsg No Kass had said she would be woo
Nobody has said this except Kass herself. And she is fucking delusional, and said at the actual time of Cagayan she knows she loses to even Woo. It is revionist history she is now saying long after the shows filming she beats Woo, but she is wrong and must have forgotten just how hated she was by that cast.
Just look at how they treated Her at ponderosa. Probably it's the same that Russell would have received un HvV
Kass might have beaten Woo. Probably not but maybe.
Even though I agree that Philip is a goat I love him so I think he is polarizingJeff even said during the reunions episode that he's the most polarizing player since Russell
Good list. Also, are people sure Sugar wasn't the villain of gabon?
JMShowProductions oh no that was Corinne
I don't know how Sugar was put on the heroes tribe on HvV.
Nah, she wasnt neither a héroe nor Villain. She was crazy what it's different
Opposite lol came back as a hero.
Rob had that money spent before he even got back home lmao
Well Boston Rob took 2 (TWO) of your top five Goats right to the final _in the same season._ That's some skill right there.
Not really. Anyone with a brain would have done the same thing. If I were on a season with Phillip and Natalie I would take them to the end with me too. They would stand out like a sore thumb to me, and I wouldnt need hindsight of seeing a season of them to ever know that. And sitting at FTC with those two cunts I could literally take a giant dump right in front of the jury just before FTC started and still win the million.
Very true S Bam, and no one wants to talk about how Rob's tribe was physically much weaker than the other and were down in the numbers. They worked well as a team, however, to win some close immunity challenges to come out ahead at the merge. If Russell didn't play the same game he did the first two times, the other tribe wouldn't have had to thrown a challenge and the end result could have been a different story. But people want to stick to the, "Oh, the producers fixed it for Rob to win!" mentality. It's sad how many people are short sighted and refuse to look at the big picture.
Rob did a great job making everyone in his alliance think he would take them to the end because of how strong his relationships were on an individual and personal level. In Grant, Andrea, and Ashley's mind, they all thought they would beat him in final tribal so they had no problems voting the way he wanted. Only Ashley suspected Rob's motives at final four but by then it was too late.
@@thatsawrap5235 It made sense for Grant, Ashley, and Andrea to think they had a shot to beat Rob in a jury vote, but why on earth would Phillip and Natalie think that way? If nothing else they should not have wanted to be with Rob at the end, so what was their logic in keeping him.
Grant, Ashley, Andrea didn't just think they beat Rob at FTC. All 3 in fact do best him, especially Grant and Ashley. Which speaks to a major flaw in robs game play in comparison to dome of the best winners like Kim, Tony, Earl, Tom, who were just as dominant but unlike Rob loved by their juries and beat everyone.
This might be a dumb topic, but to me it is interesting to think about the non-contestants, such as loved ones or jury members, who had the biggest impact on the game. Possible people are Johnny Fairplay's "buddy" Dan, who went along with his dead grandmother lie and Erik Cardona from Survivor: Samoa, who, in his speech as a jury member, may have convinced the jury to choose Natalie over Russell.
That would be sooo interesting, how jurors are swayed
8:02 - don't you mean ruffle feathers? (wink wink, nudge nudge).
You nailed it buddy! I'm so grateful you threw Russell out there! So many people love him and don't get why he lost every time he played! He has zero jury management and doesn't get that it's almost the most important piece of the game!
I agree but ranking him over even someone like Natalie T, who is probably even more incapable of ever winning a juryvote against anyone in an entire cast, but unlike Russell does nothing and has to be dragged to the end even as a mega goat is too harsh. Above Sugar who is basically just an even messier and less active version of Russell is harsh too.
Sugar 100% deserves her spot but to her credit they bullied her first
The Specialist man😂😂 such comedy gold. Redemption Island may be my favorite season for many reasons, Phil being one of em. So entertaining
Plus maybe the 2 biggest goats in history at FTC is pretty funny in itself. A seagull as the 3rd finalist even wins the game in a Final 3 with Nat T and Phil, but that is part of the amusement and humor of it all. I love trainwreck seasons like Gabon and Nicaragua. Redemption Island was not a total trainwreck style season but the people who make FTC was a trainwreck kind of thing.
@@dougierichardson484 hahaha literally it was bad. Rob didn't even have to say a word at FTC it was already over
@@TylerAlan24 He could have gone over to the jury and taken a giant dump and he still wins in that Final 3.
I hated him so much. Honestly ruined both seasons he was in for me
Nice list! Love your vids!
Thank you!
Also, props to you for including Russell, because he was honestly a goat in both seasons.
Do you think he could've won against Shambo/Jaison? At the reunion the jury said they'd give him the win in that case.
Without Natalie, I think that's a fair assessment. But she deserved to win her season, which I don't think you dispute. But yes, Shambo and Jason would actually maybe be the only combination that I'd vote for Russell over...even saying that hurts me.
Where's Sherri of Caramoan here? LoL
love phillip. the guy's totally clueless, but so much fun to watch.
He was the only entertainment of that godawful season. Even Rob was alternatively boring and insufferable this season, while playing a great game to win. Well Matt's bible metamorphis sessions were kind of funny I guess. And Natalie's clueless non realization she was a giant ass goat was pretty hilarious (Phillip atleast knew it, and didn't really care).
Where was Gervase’s game from BvW? Great list though, surprised you threw Russell in.
Gervase was bad, but I'm not sure Top 5. Still bad though. I figured throwing in Russell would annoy some people, but I truly believe he played one of the greatest "goat" games ever. Considering he was also a new player to the cast, none of them knew him except for those 39 days, and he still managed to lose all their respect... it doesn't get much worse than that.
@@Peridiam do you forget the move on tyson?
That was hilarious. Completely agree. And Boston rob is a beast.
Call me crazy, but having watched that season not very long ago, I really do think Philip had a really good chance to grab that game by the balls and win the whole thing. If he got rid of Rob and suddenly turned back into a sensible human being and told the jury how he put on an act to annoy everyone and have himself be perceived as no threat and then turn it all around to get the eventual winner out of the game, he might have very well won. I really though he was going for it and the interviews with him during the last few days, he was saying how he had it all planned out, I really did believe the fella. It just turned out he was truly a goat with stockholm syndrome or something. Kind of a shame.
If he got rid of Rob he definitely could not win. The only F3 there is a small chance his plan works is the one he was actually in with Rob and Natalie T.
If Philip gets rid of Rob he does not even make F3 in the first place I am pretty sure. Unless you mean late, but that would be too late for him. The only time from F4 to F6 Rob could have been taken out was the first F5 (not the 2nd he played his idol). If that happens you have Grant, Ashley, Andrea/Rob back from RI, Natalie, Philip. Assuming Andrea comes back the 3 girls probably make an alliance to get rid of Grant and Philip now anyway. Or Grant wins immunities at F5 and F4 and takes either Philip or Natalie, or Ashley and Natalie to the F3 and wins easily in both cases. Philip's only chance would be to argue it was "his move" to take out Rob but Grant and/or Ashley would just talk over him, take credit for it instead, and since they are seen as stronger players Philip would just wind up blowing up since he couldn't convince anyone.
He would have to take rob out earlier but again he doesnt even make the end now almost for sure.
Phillip's only possible way to win was to go to the end with Rob and Natalie T like he did, and then make the jury speech he promised.
Phillip would have needed a Final 2 with Natalie T to stand any chance at winning. His best chance was the Final 3 he was in against Rob and Natalie, both who would have lost to all 9 others who made the merge, and he still got only 1 vote.
@@grantgoffin4774 damn this post is from a while ago. I really think whoever gets rob out of the game would win over the jury, especially when they're as weird as philip was
Love the videos. idea for new video: movies or events that doomed a tribe. For example medical evacs, blindsiding strong members early, Gretchen not forming alliance first season, etc.
I feel like there was a reason Russel got taken to the end (due to his abusive/rude behaviour), however I feel like Russel knows how to play the game and strategically the only player with a better strategic game was Parvarti. Russell’s problem was he had a terrible social and game and even worse jury management. 🤷♀️ Love you Vids, and I respect were you are coming from 🙂👍
Thank you! 🤗 I think Russell knows how to play to Day 39, but he doesn't know how to do well on Day 39.
Russell didn't get taken to the end. He was in complete control. He just chose to bring the wrong people both times.
To say that Russell was taken to the end shows bias or maybe just plain stupidity.
@@burnout713 He didn't have anyone he could beat on Heroes vs Villians. Maybe a Final 2 with Candice, but that is it. On Samoa he might have out of Mick, Jaison, Shambo, some combination of those.
FANTASTIC VIDEO! Before watching this I said, "PLEASE include Sugar somewhere, that's all I care about." So thanks for that. The one thing I would disagree about is Lillian being on the list above Dreamz from Fiji because of that whole thing with the car, I don't think he stood a chance even against Cassandra which is saying a whole lot.
Good stuff! Can't wait for next week's video!
Thanks! Lill was a fringe pick that I think could be replaced with the right argument. Dreamz was on my short list and I was very ready to include him.
You are a legend peridiam 🙌🏾
Chesley from One World was goatified the time Kim started existing
Peridiam who do you think would have won a Final 2 between Philip Sheppard and Natalie Tenerelli? It is just funny to see 2 from the same season make the list. I think the jury would have commited mass suicide and there would be no winner.
Phillip vs Natalie:
Phillip locked votes- Matt, Mike, Ralph
Natalie locked votes- Ashley, maybe Steve
Rob, Grant, Andrea, Julie (hated both) all uncertain. Probably depends if Phillip still tanks FTC. If he tries he wins.
If only this was made after David v Golaith. I would love to see Angelina on this list
#1 for me will always be Dreamz not only was he unlikable, but he screwed over almost every person. Then for good measure he screws over the guy who gave him a car in front of the jury the night before the final vote. Even Phillip could have beaten him.
#2 Phillip. I mean not only is this guy never gonna win, but he called Rob the mastermind in front of the entire jury and told them how grateful he was that Rob kept him around.
#3 Will was already known for not doing much of anything. He flipped on his original alliance for no real reason other than he liked Rodney. Then he berated Shriin and made her cry without showing any remorse.
#4 Russell Hantz in HvV. There was no final 3 combination for him to win. Not even a final 2. He was awful.
#5 Sharri she wasn't going to beat anyone. She allienated half her tribe from the beginning. Once she made the merge instead of working to overthrow the favorites she decided to obey Cochran and go to the end with him. Her final tribal was awful as she yelled at Erik for explaining why people didn't want to vote for her.
Alright list but I strongly disagree with Will being there. He should be a goat but on this cast he wasn't that big a goat. Tyler, Rodney, Dan were all planning to vote him going into FTC, and if they did he would have taken 2nd over Carolyn and lost to Mike by just 1 vote. He also did have a valid reason to flip. He was clearly 4th beneath Joe, Hali, Jenn in the No Collar alliance, and they were adding Shirin so he was now 5th, and Shirin disliked him since before the merge, even before the tirade. He never makes the end staying with that group so he flipped, made the end, and even stood a shot at jury votes.
Also how on earth can you not have Natalie T on your list. You seriously don't consider he a top 5 goat of all time, LOL! She wins no Final 3 out of the whole cast on the worst season ever, not even one against Russell and Phillip. She also gets 0 votes in nearly every Final 3, the one with Rob as we saw and any Final 3 with Grant, Andrea, Ashley, Matt, Mike, she again is getting 0 votes. In fact most or all of those would have won if they replaced her against Rob and Phillip, since the jury were anti Rob by the end, and she got 0 votes, less than Phillip in even that Final 3. And I honestly think she might (not sure but might) lose a Final 2 against Phillip even. Plus in addition to standing no prayer in a jury vote she did nothing and was unlikeable to boot.
@@grantgoffin4774 so why did Will only get 1 vote? Where's your source on this? It clearly didn't take much for Mike to change Dan's mind. I have a hard time believing Tyler was ever seriously gonna vote for Will. He simply stood no chance at all against anyone in a cast in which in normal seasons half of them would be considered goats. Will was a goat to goats! That's why I consider him top 5.
I got no problem with Natalie T. Being listed in a top 5. I think she beats Phillip in a final 2, but not in a blowout which speaks to what a goat she is. Ralph just respected his hard work and had no issues with Phillip. Nearly everyone else got into arguments with him constantly. Natalie was lazy, but most the cast said she was nice enough to be around. I guess I just didn't put her in my top 5 cuz she was actually liked by some people. She just wasn't respected. The top 5 I listed weren't liked or respected.
@@ajl9772 Will probably wins a Final 3 over Shirin and Dan, which already means he wasn't a complete goat. Plus that he could have gotten 2nd over a strong player like Carolyn in the Final 3 he was. He probably should have been a goat I agree, but this a weird cast of weird people. You have to go by how the cast views them, not how you view them, as that is the true meaning of a goat.
That also makes someone like Natalie T who had ZERO percent chance to win any Final 3 out of the entire merge/entire cast, you can debate a Final 2 with Phillip, but there is absolutely no Final 3 she stands a chance in, a much bigger goat than Will. Atleast by the true definition of what a goat is. She could never win the game in any scenario as there was never going to be a Final 2 that season. She claimed years ago I think somewhere she wins a Final 3 over Grant and Phillip, and she got some barraged on social media with ridicule she stopped doing any Survivor interviews ever again and even shut down her social media briefly, LOL! That is how ridiculous people viewed the idea of her winning any Final 3 or beating anyone but Phillip was.
@@grantgoffin4774 The issue with these hypothetical scenarios is alot has to change. Will getting to the end next to Shrinn and Dan means an entirely different game was played. Perception is completely different. All that said, I think Dan and Shriin were actually more well liked by the hypothetical jury. Will burned a bridge with Joe, Hali and Jenn. Mike, Sierra and Carolyn lost respect for him after the way he berated her. Rodney was the only vote Will realistically was ever gonna get and it's worth mentioning He was sitting next to 2 of the most disliked people in the game. As you said we have to go by how the cast felt. Most didnt really respect Mike or like mama C.
Wait you say that we need to go by the way players view them and not the way we view them. So why bring up how fans reacted to her on social media as evidence of her never going to win? Haha I do wonder if she sits next to Matt how it plays out. He was more likable, but I do wonder if that cast could vote for someone voted out twice, especially with Rob on the jury likely campaigning for Natalie. Murphy also likely makes an argument for her. She may even beat out Andrea depending on how people felt about RI and Boston Rob's opinion.
@@grantgoffin4774 you're writing a lot for someone I said is acceptable to be top 5 lmao. As for Will he was never gonna get into the top 3 with anyone he could beat. He had zero chance to win against anyone and it was a cast of much worst jury threats. If you disagree I guess we disagree 🤷
While Tai from Worlds Apart and Game Changers is likeable enough to POTENTIALLY win in the final 3 if the people sitting next to him are really hated, I think he is an honorable mention. He is such a sweetheart but his speech can often be hard to understand because English isn't his first language, and when the climax of a season requires you to plead a case of why you should win to a jury of your peers and speak under pressure, a timid and humble man who has trouble with speech is going to have a tough time ever winning.
Also my definition of a Goat is someone that is specifically dragged to the end, lead to the slaughter, and has less than 1% chance of winning ANY given season based solely on their character. Chaos Kass, Tai (although he is great at endurance comps), Phillip, Natalie.
I think because of Russel's Samoa game, you actually cannot label him a goat regardless of his gameplay in HvV. Sure he has no self-awareness when it comes to final tribals, but based solely on his ferocious game play of finding idols, winning clutch challenges, and manipulating weaker players simply by fear, I could actually see him winning 20-40% of any final tribal he makes it too. He needs to avoid a salty jury (Samoa) and a stronger final 3 (HvV), but he isn't a goat by nature imo.
I wasn't saying a player was 100% a goat every time they play--like you said, Russell wasn't a goat in Samoa, but he was in HvV. Same thing as Nat Ten being a goat in RI, but I bet if she played again she wouldn't be such a goat. I don't think any player is entirely a goat forever, just in that specific season. Russell's Samoa game is separate from his HvV game, two distinct entities, two wildly different performances despite appearing the same on paper. One he had a chance to win, the other no chance.
Of course you have to define what a "goat" means to you. To me it's just a player with no chance to win.
Also, in GC they did eat the goat, they just didn't eat the baby goat. Sandra and JT both confirmed it.
Jun Y Li are you sure
Yes I'm pretty sure
That breaks my heart, the baby had no Mom then
No they let the baby goat and mom goat go. They caught a different goat that was alone and ate that one
It’s so weird that Sugar came back a few seasons later as a “hero”
She was originally going to be a villain. But Robbed complained the tribes were unfair so they swapped her and Parvati. This got Russell’s guy fired thus being the reason Russell targeted Rob all game.
Tastyquicksand - #DailyNFLVideos what I heard was Candice was originally a villain and Parv was a hero and they swapped. Idk they did cast the season before they chose the theme so we can't really know
I honestly think Sugar could’ve won if she didn’t have the SINGLE WORST final tribal performance of anyone ever. And that’s including Amanda Kimmel and Russell Hantz.
Christopher Herrera Phillip? All he did was yell at people, say “to hell with you,” and talk about how he wouldn’t be there if it wasn’t for Boston Rob.
Skyler Lindquist I don’t know her
Bob was always winning. The 4 Onions were always voting him. Unless Matty was there, then Randy probably switches his vote since he didnt like Bob really, but since he hated Sugar and Susie too he was always going to vote with his Onion alliance in that one. Susie is the one who had an outside shot to win if she really pandered well for Randy's vote against Bob.
Sugar probably only ever had a shot at Kenny or Cyrstal's vote, which if she got both could give her 2nd over Susie, but even that is a long shot at best. Matty was no way in hell voting Sugar after she fucked him over at Final 4 for creepy old Bob. And no way in hell freezing over Corinne, Randy, Marcus, Charlie were ever voting her no matter what she did at FTC.
RUSSEL some feathers!? IM DYING
excuse me where’s becky who rode along with yul and actually thought she had a chance 😂
Hahahaha
And Yul rode the coattails of Ozzy.
Kenneth Reichelt you are not wrong 😂 but yul was an absolute strategic beast, a social player and he was not weak. ozzy was súper likeable, made some moves and was a challenge god, but yul played the game from every angle
@@valbecerra9744 I just rewatched his season and Yul is completely over hyped. His strategic moves were not game changing at all, kept with his tribe alliance. Yul didn't win a single immunity challenge when Ozzy won 5/6. But in Winners at War you could really get a better insight into Yuls strategic play. WaW really increased his stock value.
He literally won because he made a deal with Adam about penner vote which his alliance all agree with voting penner.
Love these videos, lists are very well put together and interesting
I clicked on this video expecting “greatest of all time’ players lol
When he said “rustle” some feathers I knew😂😂
The final 3 system was designed to almost the 95% of the time allow a goat in the final 3. This is why I liked more the final 2 system but Jeff explained a few seasons ago that they use the final 3 system because they are hoping for a tied at one point during the final vote count. In this case the third person is the one that break the tied voting for one of the other 2 players. I don't think that this is ever going to happen but in season 35 they changed the way the final 3 is decided and now you have to earn the spot through a challenge (in that case it was a fire making challenge and Ben won it).
NeoKurow this aged badly
I prefer the final 3 because in some cases, the 3rd placer are the deserving ones to win, Kathy from Marquesas, Terry from Panama, Cirie from Micronesia, maybe even Rob from Amazon.
I know you posted this a few years ago, but I would love to see you do "honorable mentions" to gauge who else would've made your top 10 or top 5. Obviously, no need for a deep dive, but just a quick understanding of who else you considered.