380 Auto for self defense?
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- Опубліковано 7 гру 2023
- (links below) Is the 380 Auto suitable for self-defense? Many think not, but are they under estimating it for "Self-Defense"? Not service, duty, or military use but CC and SD? Big difference between them. Only one way to find out, let's look at speeds, energy, and ballistics.
Ruger LCP MAX 380 Review - • LCP MAX 380 auto - REVIEW
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Drew - Розваги
I did a similar test with my Bodyguard 380 (10-11 yrs ago) using Lehigh XP and XD; and with ARX rounds. Real world terminal performance on several ham blocks was impressive and sometimes explosive. Don’t underestimate the 380, it’ll get the job done.
I carry the bersa thunder 380 for my edc. Paired with underwood extreme defender ammunition. Accurate, reliable, 3.5 inch barrel higher muzzle velocity than most pocket pistols, hits harder penetrates farther. Complete faith in it's defensive capabilities.
That's what I carry too. Accurate, reliable, safe, comfortable, inexpensive... it's the perfect carry pistol. And it's nice and simple, so if you do have to use it, you're not going to get scrutinized like you're a gun "enthusiast". It's just good basic protection. And yes, .380 is plenty for self-defense.
Count me in guys. I have a Bursa Thunder 380 as well. I've had it for many years now. I feel now as I did when I got it that it is an exalent choice for edc. I have the old Exstream Shock as it was called back in the day. I have never had a misfire with it an love the safety features like the built in lock. A gun lock is useless if you don't have it handy. Keep the kids safe.
I've carried a 380 as my EDC for the past 24 years. Knowing its strengths and limitations, I know what I can and cannot do in a self-defense situation. So many believe in preparing for a gun fight. I, on the other hand, prepare for saving my ass. Philosophy makes a difference!
Exactly, well said brother. We all love to "think" about the zombie appocolyps, etc. but thats just not reality based. A "gun fight" is about as likely as winning the lottery. Protecting yourself, much more likely, still, statistically very low. I don't need my 10mm unless in bear country.
Well said and seemingly convincing, but words no matter how presented do not always convey the truth. In defence of the under powered .380, many say they have carried one for many years. How is that convincing. No handgun will answer all self defense scenarios. The .380, least of all. Imagined scenarios we have to justify our carry gun are simply not realistic. When confronted with an actual need to fire on another human, no one ever said they were glad they had a .380 and not something with more energy. We carry the puniest of self defense weapons for one reason: convenience. And having made that choice we strive to justify it with words. I often carry a little .380 for the convenience, but when circumstances require shooting, you know but won't admit you will have wanted a more powerful weapon. We fool ourselves to actually believe such a weak cartridge is sufficient. It may be for the particular trouble you encounter, but it probably won't be. The unexpected need to shoot a person will NOT be the scenario you earlier played in your mind. I say all that in hopes that your choice of weapon/cartridge for the unlikely chance you will be confronted with the real chance that you will die, is not the weakest weapon choice you might have made. Stay safe, all you good men who carry.
If someone is shooting at you from a car which is maybe the most common type of attempted murder/murder shooting to take place in the US, it is definitely self defense to shoot them inside their car. Of course some jurisdictions do not see legal self defense in any scenario.
As far as expansion with the 380, you do not want it to expand anymore than those 2 bullets. Hornady has it perfect. If they expand anymore than that they will not penetrate far enough. That said, those rounds are excellent and the one shot stopping percentage of a 380 is not that far below a 9mm believe it or not. And a good 380 round like those 2 will probably work ok through a car door or windshield if need be...there is tons of this data on youtube...
Excellent video, this was very good data as well, and much appreciated. Thanks!
I agree, XTP is the perfect hollowpoint design in 380
I know of one SD incident in which 2 rounds of .380 from a P3AT saved the day. The bad guy with the knife got to go to the hospital and the good guy got to go home to his family (shook up but not physically harmed).
Holy smoke! The .380 is much more effective than I thought it would be, on both the gel and the ham. I admit to being kinda snobbish about the round, but you opened my eyes. Thank you!
I have a ruger security 380 and love it 😀
I have one as well & it’s my edc and it shoots great I carry Speer gold dots in it
100% right on. Great pocket pistol. Effective for what is designed for. If I am looking for tight groups at long ranges I will grab something else out of the safe.
My LCP max is my daily carry. Not worried at all about .380
I've never carried a 380 but I know that it will be good for any defensive situation someone might find themselves in. People like to come up with all sorts of scenarios but the reality of the situation is we don't live in Mogadishu or any other place that is hostile where people are gunning each other down with fully automatic rifles. Even in a really bad situation where someone might want to kill you for your atm withdrawal, the .380 will definitely make the criminal think about what they're doing.
I don't carry a .380, but I would not feel undergunned if I did. There is no doubt it can be highly deadly. Plus, there are quite a few affordable choices for firearms chambered in it.
Those who poo poo the 380 as a defensive round need to stand on the receiving end of it and THEN give their review lol. I live in South Texas and multiple layers of clothing is rare. I daily carry 380 in an LCP with the FTX and I'm confident based on my current environment. Nicely done!
Now I'm not going to pretend that I know north from south Texas anymore than I know RuPaul from basketball. That said, didn't Texas have such a cold snap a while back that it shut down the power grid and the Governor had to declare a state of emergency or some such thing?
OK, your response is that of a smart ass. In my comment, I exactly said "I live in South Texas and multiple layers of clothing is rare." One week in a hundred years is rare, heavier clothes equal heavier carry... simple. 99.9% of the time my statement holds here in South Texas. Now, please go troll someone with less than a first grade education, you'll be right at home.@@robwilson3749
@@robwilson3749yes, and then we were back to wearing shorts a week later 😂
The ourpose of the 380 is that its small and light enough where it takes the excuse of "i dont feel like carrying a gun with me just to check the mail or walk the dog" off the table and gives you the option if having SOMETHING vs nothing bc you didnt want to carry a 9mm
Thank you for the tests. Some really good info.
Great informative video. I carry an LCP 380 for occasional off duty back up and as a primary for dog walking,Mtn biking in non sketchy areas.
Picked up a box of XTP this evening. Will test it out tomorrow for function.
Enjoyed your video. Thanks for posting! God bless you.
This is great info…I carry critical duty in my P10 generally…but I’m getting older and have spine issues…very happy with these results…thank you for the post…
Para Ordnance P10?
I have both of these guns (LCP MAX, GX4) along with an LCP II in 380 and an LCP II in 22lr. To me, the perceived recoil of the 380 variants is slightly higher than the GX4. I think this is because the GX4 has enough extra mass to negate some of the higher power inherent in the 9mm. The LCP II in particular seems to 'squirm around' more on firing and is kind of unpleasant to shoot more than a dozen rounds or so at the range.
As for carrying, when I'm wearing heavier, looser pants I pocket carry the GX4. For lighter, tighter pants I will slip the LCP II or LCP MAX in my pocket. The LCP II in particular is very skinny and doesn't 'print' very much when carried in your pocket.
I have all these guns also and I agree with your comments. I'm a big guy, but I do NOT enjoy shooting the LCP II in 380. But it does carry easily in a pocket. The GX4 works great for a pocket carry as you said if you have bigger pockets.
First of all the 380’is not a duty round, so so much for police input. What the 380 is , is a whole lot better than the old 25 or 32 pistols . A 380 in your pocket will be there to save your life, and if you carry a quality pistol it will do the job.I carried a stainless Ppk 380 for years. Accurate and reliable and enough power for ccw use. Eventually retired it for a Colt Mustang Pocketlite that is around 7 ounces lighter and with its locked breech mechanism , more pleasant to shoot, and just as accurate. Ask people who actually used one in a self defense shooting and they will tell you it did the job.
As a retired LEO that went through three on duty shootings w/my issued .38, I carry my LCP w/o reservation. It’s a get-off-me tool and adequate for a retired senior citizen who’s daily orbits are pretty tame. Most LE agencies authorize a .380 for off-duty/back up as long as the officer can qualify w/it.
380 has been a duty round on the global market for almost 100 years. A very successful one.
Not in America but they do use it in other countries for law enforcement. I prefer 9mm but I do carry a 380 or even a 22lr sometimes when I need something for deep concealment.
It is a duty round in some countries in europe
Haha duty 😂
Ty for this vid! Just got a 42 with the American Gunner rounds you tested for it. Your vid gave me more confidence I chose correctly!
To me the LCP Max is great for pocket carry, 12+1 with Critical Defense. A little hard to shoot accurately, but training has me reasonably accurate within about 7 yards, which is where I expect it would be needed. CCW a P365 otherwise - much more accurate and more power, but a little bulky for pocket carry. Only other CCW right now is a Keltec P32 I pocket when jogging. The P32 is more of a real up close gun, but training is getting me more accurate with it as well. Hopefully none of them ever have to be used.
My EXACT 3 gun CCW rotation!
@@mattlittell5876 Great minds… 🧠
Excellent Video! You have gotten my subscription. Being an older guy, I carry a .45 cal G30s as my primary winter carry. Summer carry will range from a Beretta 21a bobcat in .25 cal ( 9 rounds, better than nothing) to .38 special - .327 Federal Magnum - 9mm - and when clothing permits the 30s. When I was younger it was always 10mm, G29 summer and G20 winter. Never got into the caliber or capacity wars because as you said, "You make your own decision".
Great video man thanks
Thank you.... that helped!
Great video! I have the GX4 and an LCP Custom I’ve had for many years when I need a pocket carry. I’d say the DB9 Gen II which I own is a good comparison for size. So similar in size.
Great vid, and it confirms .380 results from some other vids I've seen. You didn't test Underwood's Extreme Defender, but that has shown to also be a great .380 round...it's really wild the wound channel it creates considering the bullet doesn't expand at all. I carry that in my lcp max. Out of a small gun with a 3" barrel, for self defense, let alone in the hands of a typical CCL holder...no brainer .380 is a great choice.
Thanks,, interesting video.
Thank you for the video. Here in hot sunny Florida when I wear basketball shorts LCP Max in a pocket holster. Pants or shorts with a belt it’s a 9mm. When I lived in the NW running to the grocery store 8 round revolver in 22LR I don’t even know why 😂 but never a semi-auto in 22LR.
Great video
Great test. Love the .380. XTPs are good. I've seen great tests from federal in the Punch and Hydrashok lines also. Underwood has some powerful (for a pocket gun) options. And Defiant Munitions has an all copper bullet that is very consistent in meeting the FBI standards for penetration and expansion through gel with the heavy clothing protocol.
What gets really interesting is the .380 from a 4" barrel. Some loads are right on the heels of the 9mm. Of course, that's with less recoil, too. I'm not saying it is as good in every way, but it would do the job.
Excellent video Drew. I've taken a liking to the LCP Max and may consider carrying 2 ( a NY reload so to speak, lol).
It tore that ham up buddy hope does as well mine has Mcarbo trigger and springs and a houge slip on grip I like it
I actually have both guns! Great review
Thank you for the test, would love to see you test the 380 V-Crown, those seem to perform well in the limited amount of tests I've seen
Thank you for using gel & ham.
I carry a pimped out LCP max with 13rds of XTP+P ammo. It's easy to score hits at 25yds vs an 8x12 A Zone silhouette, and is super small and lightweight. @Beyond Seclusion Somehow I've never seen your channel before. Have a subscriber from a fellow gun tuber.
Love my P365 in 380. 12+1 rds of self defense and self confidence. Super accurate and very low recoil.
Good info
German officers in WWII often carried a PPK in 380 or 32 ACP. I wouldn't want to face a Grizzly Bear with a 380 but I think any human would back down with a 380 hole in their chest or gut.
I agree and self-defense is not always to instantly KILL, simply STOP and halt the aggression/attack. Holes of any kind tend to do just that. We would all prefer to have a 12ga with buckshot always on hand or something large with lots of PUNCH but its just not always possible.
I carry Underwood 95gr +p HP in my Kahr Ct380 and love it!
My Bersa Combat just got excited.
I'm in north Texas so heavy clothing isn't much of a concern. For me, this .380 Auto fits my needs.
Placement is key.. practice and stay safe people.
Thanks
I’m a big fan of the LCP Max, it’s my go to. I’ve been debating rounds, currently have Federal Hydrashocks. I like the critical defense too. I am curious of your thoughts on the Underwood Extreme Defender rounds. Thanks
But federal removed the lack of punch in the 22lr cartridge…… ill see myself out now😂
Thanks for your in depth, common sense approach. A .380 has always been a ‘short’ 9mm when comparing the bullet diameters a used to be around the specs of a 38 special. I use the American Gunner in my 9mm 3.2” barrel a the 4” barrel. Always great penetration around 14” an very good expansion with good fps an ft lbs. The XTP bullet has a smaller hollow point that doesn’t load up thru the denim a such.. The .380 is perfect for the common scenario of a shoot altercation of; 3 shots fired, lasting 3 seconds, less than 3yds.
Thanks
Peeps tend to think that bigger is better and sometimes that is true. But for EDC the .380 is a fine round. I've been using a Browning 1911 in .380 and I shoot it really well so if a self defense event should ever occur, and God, I pray it will not, I will not feel under gunned, regardless of what someone else might be using. Shot placement is key in every situation and in the real world peeps should focus on that. Go to the range and shoot at least 1x a month.
Took some get getting used to but I shoot the LCP Max very well now whereas initially it was frustrating
I have a Ruger LCP that I have carried for 5 years or so. I bought a Bersa Thunder CC about two years ago. The Bersa is a much better pistol, but a inside the pants holster pistol. Depends on what I am wearing.
That really did a job on the ham nice.
The wife and I like are .380's the Ruger LCP&Bersa thunder! and yes I said bersa! Both guns have never gave us any trouble and make are needs as CCW's the .380 ammo we can buy now has come along way.Of course they are not are range gun's but they will do fine for what we need.
Carried a Bersa Thunder 380 for years. Still do on occasion
You should try the LCP Max with some of Underwood's 90 gr. Xtreme Penetrator ammo. It's perfect for very short barreled .380s, and rivals what you'd get in short barreled 9mms with JHPs. They also come in 68 gr. and +Ps, neither of which I've seen adequately tested, and would love it if you could.
While you are correct about the rating and the manual, limited usage has been tested and shows no noticeable issues. Again, that's limited use, as in oops, I'm being robbed, what shall I do with mu LCP Max since it's only got +P loads. And then there's the std. pressure XP 90 gr. and 68 gr. (better than the XCDs for just the .380), both hot loads well within factory specs.@@drivenbullet260
You can't put +p amo in it
Never say never. Occasional usage of +P has been tested and confirmed as non-problematic. I just wouldn't make a steady diet of it.@@jayreny5696
@@jayreny5696 I have been shooting +P in 4 different LCP's for 14 years.
@@Valorius ya that just shows you how much a fool you are . The gun maker says don't run it because the gun is not rated for it , so you don't care about your own life , wow
Wow I'm surprised by the American gunner but the critical defense done it's job pretty darn well to.
Even a smaller caliber gun, in the vast majority of cases, is likely to make most threats “disengage” and beat a hasty retreat, which should be the preferred outcome in most situations. Of course, if you want something that is going to stop all drugged out, crazy attackers than you should be carrying a shotgun every where you go ?
LOL....EXACTLY!
Exactly. 99.99% of 'stops' are psychological, not physiological.
im concerned about total gun weight. thanks for the video
Anyone who has fire a 380 round out of a pocket sized pistol like a TCP or LCP will attest that the recoil is not small when there isn't much gun to grip.
Might have been said before but….I use Lehigh in my 380’s . They make the bullets for the Underwood Extreme Defender also. These bullets are barrier blind and are good rounds.
Ammo quest did extensive testing of 380 self-defense ammo through a tiny Taurus TCP 380 (I own and carry daily that same Taurus TCP).. using genuine FBI gel blocks .. both three layers of denim covered and bare gel .. the best rounds for expansion and penetration where the xtp rounds.. Hornady xtp fiocci xtp .. and precision one xtp with the best although COBON DPX All copper hollow point did fairly well also
XTP isn't the latest or greatest but seems to be a good performer in 380. Try the Sig V-Crown.
Some .380 pistols are so small you feel the kick on your finger. Alternate placement helps
I have three 380’s as a pocket carry pistol. I have the most respect for them. The ammo is the key.
Fav ammo for the LCP Max???
Interesting the difference in pumpkin damage between the 380 and the 22 mag (your own tests). 22 mag blew the pumpkin apart. Velocity is the biggest determinant of energy.
I have a security 380 and love it. Its lots more bang for the buck than my old CC S&W Bodyguard. 15 +1 compared to 6 and it's a lot beefier and feels like a XD on the hand. The light rack slide is awesome.
FMJ is always an option for 380.
That was a really nice looking ham…..
Please talk about sound level of the 22 and the 380 . Can't forget about that . Do folks practice without ear protection on ? In real world applications, does anyone say " wait til I put on my ear protection on " . ?
9mm is my usual EDC however living in Texas sometimes its rather hot and I'd rather wear athletic shorts, in those cases I have to pocket carry and the G42 is my pocket gun. Run XTP's loaded hot. If I had to use it I think they would do ok, of course I'd be wishing I had something bigger with more rounds.
A person assumes a lot of they've never been in that situation. I had to pull my weapon 1 time and thankfully I didn't have to fire though I fully intended to. We came home one night from eating out and when we pulled in the driveway two guys ran from behind my shed towards the street. The one guy kept running, the other guy stopped and acted like he wanted to start a fight after I started chasing them. When he stopped I immediately pulled my gun and he all but tripped on himself trying to turn around and run, and he was screaming don't shoot I don't have anything. I called 911 and the deputies showed up pretty quickly. They said they have had a rash of thefts in our area, we live rural, and he was guessing they were on drugs.
JMB designed the .45 ACP for the battlefield and the .380 ACP for personal defense within a civilian and police context. As usual, he knew what he was doing. As is well known, it was nonetheless adopted by a number of militaries, and is even used today as a standard issue sidearm for aircrew in the Argentine Air Force.
For the garden variety civilian defensive gun use scenario - within ten yards, attacker not wearing body armor, no obstacles between the defender and the attacker so that the only things between the defender’s bullet and the attacker’s body are air and the street clothes of the attacker - .380 ACP will work just as well as any other commonly used centerfire handgun cartridge.
The main drawback of .380 is lack of versatility. It’s good for up close and personal defense, but if you have to engage at distance or shoot through some kind of obstacle - windows, doors, etc. - then it’s limitations relative to more powerful chamberings becomes more apparent.
The two rounds i carry in my lcp2! ; )
For many
Good lord turn the Audio down but thank you for the info though
Sir is the ammo for the 380 match up with .38 caliber ammo the Police carried for their weapons pre- 9mm?
I don’t go into bad areas of town,and I find my 380 more convenient to carry. If I was going to or through a bad area I would go bigger.
The lcp max is a very snappy little cuss but mine is good and broken in. People tend to get too analytical when it comes to ammo comparisons and capabilities. The only thing that matters is shot placement. A pellet gun will stop a threat. 99.99999% of self defense situations are point blank range. Caliber doesn’t matter.
This video made me hungry. Don’t watch this near lunchtime...😊
I've been loading for my Bersa Thunder 380, 4.3gr CFE Pistol with a WSP primer and 90gr Hornady XTP (max load for a 90gr bullet in 380 with CFE powder is 4.2, but I'm using .355" caliber instead of .356" caliber and my pistol is +P rated, I take no responsibility for your actions if you decide to load like I do), clocking in at 1020fps muzzle velocity with a 3.4" barrel.
It definitely has a lot more recoil and much louder report than a Taurus G2S 9mm, and in ballistic gel outperforms the G2S (using 115gr FMJ Blazer factory loaded ammo).
I load for accuracy and lethal performance.
Again, don't over-charge cartridges when reloading, my load data is not to be used, but if you decide to use it you should use it at your own risk and I would highly recommend not to reload unless you know what you're doing and are willing to take the risk. I am not responsible for any personal injuries or damages to your equipment.
Kinda like the Colt.
That ham is starting to look like my second wife definitely getting the job done
380 is just a 9mm short.. really anybody can manage a 9mm with a little training and the right firearm setup
That only works if your body works normally but if you have some arthritis in your hands, wrists, elbows and shoulders 9mm can be extremely painful.
@@_cal_techie I would say shoot a bigger smoother gun and there won't really be a difference
I like the lcp max for jogging loaded with fed hst because it doesn’t pull my shorts down lol, ask me how I know😅. Any other ccw I’m carrying my Hellcat
Exactly the purpose of doing this. Often, the 9mm is just a little too big.
👍
What I like about my lcp max is with the extend mag you 12+1 of +p is more then enough for most threats plus it’s small enough I goes everywhere with me… but to be honest it’s is a back up 50% of the time because I usually have multi opinions on me haha
The LCP Max is not rated for +P, if anyone cares.
@@ctapmgriley No pistol is rated for 380+P, its not a saami recognized round. Any locked breech 380 can handle 380+P fine though. Ive been firing 380+P through 4 different LCP's for 14 years.
Is the LCP Max rated for +p? Have you shot a lot of +p rounds through it, and if so, any problems? Thanks.
@@chrisryan8863 nothing is rated for +P because there is no saami approved rating for it. And yes, i have shot a lot of +P through 4 different LCPs for 15 years.
Xtreme Defense
I have the Ruger Max and I'm trying to like it but every other time I take it to the range I have failures to load. Ruger sent me a new top half of the gun but still having issues. Using full metal jacket.
Ya, that sucks, not sure what to tell you.
The Hornady absolutely increased its diameter when it mushroomed.
Professional Pumpkin Proctologist !
What laser is that on the lcp max
Damn. All this HAM, now I'm Hungry!!!
Should have put some denim or an old leather jacket over that ham to see peneration effect.
I own a Lcp max and it is unpleasant to shoot. That being said. It melts away in your front pocket with a VEDDER holster and it has a purpose.
+1
They conceal great and have enormous capacity for a gun that small. But I will say they are hard to shoot. They're so small that almost everyone shoots them 3 inches low. It's possible they're anticipating recoil or something else. But almost everyone has that problem with them. And that's at 10 yards. Anything further, you'll be very slow trying to make a hit.
@@TeddyBear-lb9hoI have the LCP2 in 380. Dead nuts accurate. Those shooting low....operator error.
@iamtheoffenderofall that's what I'm saying. The guns are as accurate as any full size. BUT, and it's a big but, the tiny size of the LCP lends it to being very difficult to shoot well. That's just a fact. You may be able to hit accurately with them with enough training. But you'd be 10 times faster and more accurate with a larger gun. Just how it is.
@@TeddyBear-lb9ho broad assumptions about who can shoot what and accurately comes down to a bias. There are people who cannot shot larger guns accurately where they can shoot smaller guns more accurately. And this isn't about training. This is about anatomy. Smaller people may not be able to handle large guns. This is just how it is. Just cause you suck at shooting small guns doesn't mean everyone does.
@@TeddyBear-lb9ho use the 12 rd mag, much easier to shoot well. I shoot mine vs 8x12 steel at 25 yds with little problem. I have made hits at 100yds, but at that range the "group" is the size of a small car, so it's pretty much random luck.
Yup nothing like a slim trim .380
Look at the Pasco movie theater shooting. 1 shot from a 380 hit a finger, then a 6'1 270lb guy, dropping and killing him.
If you load HPs 380 is really affective.
I cannot tell how far I’ve gone down the rabbit hole on the 380! 1st, the 365-380 is clearly the best 380 out there. 2nd, the best, most reliable 380 defensive round, is the ARX Interceptor and the Underwood Extreme defender. Test after test has shown this. And the Ruger, it’s little and that’s its most redeeming quality.
@7:09 I should call her
Was the ham cooked? If so, can you redo the ham test with an uncooked one ? This, I think, would be more like a person's body.
Don't have any raw meat, the ham was cooked and expired, why it was donated 👍. It would be great to test on RAW meat, hard to get and expensive.
Feeling the need for a pulled pork sandwich.
Only keyboard warriors consider .380 under-powered in 2024. It is definitely viable at close close range.
Ruger max9
Any gun is better than no gun at all
EXACTLY!!!