Exactly. It's very easy for this sort of serialist technique to sound disjointed if you don't know what you're doing, but where Ron's skill lies is in phrasing these tones in ways that form proper melodies. Considering that the tone wheel is ordered in a way that each consecutive pair of notes forms a minor second interval (probably the most dissonant of all intervals, even over the diminished fifth), that's really damn impressive.
Blotted Science is amazing! I am extremely disappointed at how this type of music is still very "taboo" yet it is one of the only music styles that takes actual composition and planning to make, at least in my opinion. Cretaceous Chasm should be nominated for a ducking Grammy! \m/
@@kerbalscuffedprogram4705 just going by the term given by Hannes...I consider Gojira prog death metal as there are progressive undertones..tonality..in the music not just the progressive tech side of odd time signatures and dif root chords.. Progressive has a tonality to it, not just a technicality
The drimming is so amazing- awesome! And Jason is one of the best and most underestimated guitarists in the World. I saw him with Wathctower 15 Years ago and he was yet brilliant then.
Try Spastic Ink - it's another Jarzombek project. It's [relatively] lighter than this, but still technically way over the top. There's one track he does that was composed with animation from Bambi in mind. He scored the music to the animation.
That, and it's a run-through of the whole twelve-tone sequence. He's purposely designed the sequence to sound dark - if you look at the wheel, you'll notice that every pair of notes going clockwise, starting with "E", is only a semitone apart. These semitone intervals between notes (known as a minor second interval) sound very dissonant when played together, hence why the clean guitar at the beginning sounds foreboding.
that tone is the truth. its as if every riff is badass in its own right no filler all killer the guys sweep tech is redickalis id love to see there sound set up
You can get into the music theory and details if you like. To me it's simply some amazingly technical, advanced, interesting and groovy music. You don't need to "get" every single facet of a song to love the feel of it.
@markogeeko He is talented enough to do that, and has done. It's called innovation. I've heard enough of the bog standard progressions, this is breaking new ground, even though 12 tone systems were always around, it's a refreshing use of them
So this might be a stupid question but how does he pick the original 12 tones? All the pairs (if you put 'em in groups of two) seem just a half step apart and the first 3 pairs go up a half step and the last 3 pairs go down a half step but I'm not seeing how he got those pairs to begin with ( if you rearrange them ( the first) you can make 5 notes of an e minor scale except for the a#)
@neilprestemon thanks for the explanation neilprestemon. but please tell me, how does Ron organize the note-clock? does he put notes at random and then selects each 4 an 6-note groups from it? thanks
I see one pattern, that each group of 2 is a semi tone apart, switching from UP to down a step at Eb, but does anyone know WHY the notes are in this order? where they come from?
I think everyone talking theory is missing the whole point, you dont need theory by using this method. Its an unlimited song generator by sequencing random strings of randomly generated notes. Its pretty amazing.
Does anyone know if this is really 12-tone technique? I mean I am not an expert but I thought all notes in a 12-note piece must be repeated the same number of times so that none of them is used more and there's no more importance on concrete notes. If you see the note group at 1:11, it is repeated more times than the opposite one at 1:19... could this song be called 12-tones based? I'm not saying how good or bad is this music, it's just a doubt I have on theory.
yeah in Schoenberg's 12 tone system u have to play the row w/o repeating pitches but u can repeat a pitch immediately after it's heard. this isn't a true serialist/atonal work, but u can definitely call it 12 tone based/inspired.
Well Jarzombek invented the system used in this video so it's not 'really' 12-tone technique in the sense that the original serialists would have used or even accepted it as a legitimate method. It's still an interesting way to generate musical content using a 12-tone-row with its own unique set of artistic limitations (not mentioned in the video itself, but notice how he never switches note "groups" without playing every note at least once!).
. . . so; basically: those who are familiar with a fretboard, tend to think of composition in terms of interesting patterns of notes. Often that's the sound of the notes - sometimes, we do it visually, based on the shape it makes on the fretboard. What this "theory" is saying, is that you can also make an interesting composition, by arranging the notes into a circle, and playing them according to their visual/spacial relationship in the circle. That's all.
Many classical composers made their music by using similar musical calculations, combined with the attitude and musical taste of listener in a particular historic time period. That is why they wrote their music so fast and with freakish efficiency while "normal" listener has no idea what is going on. While others hunt for the golden riff RJ has the master's grip on the subject. Everything, even music, is based on a natural algorithm and he knows the impact its on the brain. Very scary.
Hot fuck. As a drummer, who has no damn clue about what any of this means, I find all of this pretty dang impressive. Is this something Ron invented? I know about the “circle of 5th” and all that jazz, is this some kinda new scale or note relation config he just made up for this song or for his whole style? Seems pretty interesting
i dont even understand how do i still enjoy playing guitar...im watching this video and im laughing out loud because its just so brilliant its beyond belief. And almost everyone i asked has never heard of Ron or never heard of any of his bands, mainstream sucks dinosaur balls. Im an atheist but if i had to pray to somebody it would be Ron:D GREAT WORK AS ALWAYS MAN !!!
It looks complicated and probably is to ppl who play guitar. I don't care, it sounds good and isn't just the same 4 or 5 chords repeated over and over. It's easy to think that more complicated = better, especially if you play the instrument. But that's not true. The point is and always will be about making music that sounds good. I love complicated music, as long as it sounds good. I also love simple music that sounds good.
He builds all his own guitars himself, usually he leaves a large portion of blank fret-board at the bottom so he can reach stuff like the 27th fret with his first and middle fingers. Crazy, right? Anyway, they're all hand build, by him.
It looks like a lot of Japanese imports. I have an old Yamaha from 81 and has a headstock with that shape. I picked it up from one of my dad's work friends for a steal, at 150, the hardware alone on that guitar is worth more than what I paid, even if it is cheap hardware.
who do the notes in the circle change spots at the beginning of the video.???? Confuses the living shit out of me.... Then the whole video they stay in the same spot in the circle...
David Ellefson is a great bassist, but him and Ron are incomparable. You shouldn't compare a bass player to a guitarist, they're 2 entirely different instruments
This is what happens when you let music theory get in the way of the music. Don't get me wrong, I really dig this stuff, but only in small doses. I like it more on a technical skill level, than a musical level.
+Zed Chuva Ron isn't really thinking of usual music theory when he's using this system, that's why he came up with it. You could probably analyse the sets of notes and group them in to scales / triads / arpeggios but I'm guessing that's not what Ron wanted to do.
+maj7#5 he actually does use scales. That's why he enharmonically equals all notes, to be able to think in common scales. The groupings are more meant to force your self to deal with uncommon note combinations. :)
Things like this make me wish I hadn't abandoned and forgotten musical theory when switching from piano to guitar when I was 15.
You don't need theory to be a good player
keep playing brother :)
you knew music theory? I certainly didn't and I played (and still play, but only because everyone in the family forces me to) piano
@@lordPix3lUKno but obviously it helps
I like the complexity of this music
Exactly. It's very easy for this sort of serialist technique to sound disjointed if you don't know what you're doing, but where Ron's skill lies is in phrasing these tones in ways that form proper melodies. Considering that the tone wheel is ordered in a way that each consecutive pair of notes forms a minor second interval (probably the most dissonant of all intervals, even over the diminished fifth), that's really damn impressive.
dropped A is a great tuning, I love how well he uses it.
Isaac bro ate you sure its not a standard tuning?
@@MsDavo123 Standard tuning and 7th string is a low B
@@maranathashalom9402 its a low A goofy ass
He hits a low A# on the first fret of the low string
The world needs more Blotted Science.
Remember people, this is just the rhythm guitars...
Its amazing how creative someone can be with just a few notes
a few, yes
He must have children this musical genius needs to be passed on to a Future Generation
Sheldon Cooper81 students*
Blotted Science is amazing! I am extremely disappointed at how this type of music is still very "taboo" yet it is one of the only music styles that takes actual composition and planning to make, at least in my opinion. Cretaceous Chasm should be nominated for a ducking Grammy! \m/
this is considered tech death metal but...it is more creative and less about speed then most TDM bands.
..fuzz yeah,..in a Musicaly Perfect world....but wE not live in one seems.
@@Selkirk69 ..is...is jus chromatic engineering..is jus post Schoenberg bop..is.🎶💕🤘🧠🎸🎓
@@Selkirk69 it’s called progressive death metal
@@kerbalscuffedprogram4705 just going by the term given by Hannes...I consider Gojira prog death metal as there are progressive undertones..tonality..in the music not just the progressive tech side of odd time signatures and dif root chords.. Progressive has a tonality to it, not just a technicality
The drimming is so amazing- awesome! And Jason is one of the best and most underestimated guitarists in the World. I saw him with Wathctower 15 Years ago and he was yet brilliant then.
so fucking on to this. i cant even stop listening to them. just find out about this band recently. so sad there is no more new material, or there is?
I heard a rumor there might be something coming... but, honestly, I can't honestly tell you.
Try Spastic Ink - it's another Jarzombek project. It's [relatively] lighter than this, but still technically way over the top. There's one track he does that was composed with animation from Bambi in mind. He scored the music to the animation.
This guy is crazy has some very technical compositions and difficult to play ron jamzorbek is a genius!!!!
That, and it's a run-through of the whole twelve-tone sequence. He's purposely designed the sequence to sound dark - if you look at the wheel, you'll notice that every pair of notes going clockwise, starting with "E", is only a semitone apart. These semitone intervals between notes (known as a minor second interval) sound very dissonant when played together, hence why the clean guitar at the beginning sounds foreboding.
this note clock really works :)
Such a beastly tone.
Probably the best thing to ever happen in music! So freakin good my ears bleed!
This is probably the best use of the comments section I've ever seen on a UA-cam video. Cheers guys!
Wow! I love the rather simple little tweak to the original rules for 12-tone serialism and you end up with this amazing sound.
that tone is the truth. its as if every riff is badass in its own right no filler all killer the guys sweep tech is redickalis id love to see there sound set up
Second Viennese School metal
Wow! This is incredible! I'm just barely grasping the concept and here you are making art with it. Sounds great -
Ron is a great musician, no doubt about it!
I wonder what Miss Jarzombek gave to her children. Bobby and Ron are just out of this world
That's one very interesting way of composing with 12 tone rows!
You can get into the music theory and details if you like. To me it's simply some amazingly technical, advanced, interesting and groovy music. You don't need to "get" every single facet of a song to love the feel of it.
This is just awesome he's brilliant. The best guitarist in metal
@ATMOSPH33R and they have to be syncing it up to movie clips at the same time! 2 tasks that are independently very difficult. Ron is a genious
@markogeeko He is talented enough to do that, and has done. It's called innovation. I've heard enough of the bog standard progressions, this is breaking new ground, even though 12 tone systems were always around, it's a refreshing use of them
27 frets!!!! HOLY COW!!!
So this might be a stupid question but how does he pick the original 12 tones? All the pairs (if you put 'em in groups of two) seem just a half step apart and the first 3 pairs go up a half step and the last 3 pairs go down a half step but I'm not seeing how he got those pairs to begin with ( if you rearrange them ( the first) you can make 5 notes of an e minor scale except for the a#)
Great progressive ideas, and a plethora of tones that are always mind boggling as well. This, I would say... is mastery.
Incredible!!
@neilprestemon thanks for the explanation neilprestemon. but please tell me, how does Ron organize the note-clock? does he put notes at random and then selects each 4 an 6-note groups from it? thanks
10/10, quality tonerow.
@LIPCoelho20 I've always asked my self the same question and how does he arrange the note duration?
He's literally made an metal EP using tonal science. Holy shit!
Ron is just beyond.... ha ha ha I love these vids Please dude Keep em comin'
It's like Dream theatre without the annoying singer, and 10 x heavier on guitar and bass.
That is so sick!
I see one pattern, that each group of 2 is a semi tone apart, switching from UP to down a step at Eb, but does anyone know WHY the notes are in this order? where they come from?
It's just a tone row. The only criteria are that it uses each note once and it sounds fairly interesting. :)
It's grouped to be as dissonant as possible.
I think everyone talking theory is missing the whole point, you dont need theory by using this method. Its an unlimited song generator by sequencing random strings of randomly generated notes. Its pretty amazing.
Does anyone know if this is really 12-tone technique? I mean I am not an expert but I thought all notes in a 12-note piece must be repeated the same number of times so that none of them is used more and there's no more importance on concrete notes. If you see the note group at 1:11, it is repeated more times than the opposite one at 1:19... could this song be called 12-tones based?
I'm not saying how good or bad is this music, it's just a doubt I have on theory.
yeah in Schoenberg's 12 tone system u have to play the row w/o repeating pitches but u can repeat a pitch immediately after it's heard. this isn't a true serialist/atonal work, but u can definitely call it 12 tone based/inspired.
Well Jarzombek invented the system used in this video so it's not 'really' 12-tone technique in the sense that the original serialists would have used or even accepted it as a legitimate method. It's still an interesting way to generate musical content using a 12-tone-row with its own unique set of artistic limitations (not mentioned in the video itself, but notice how he never switches note "groups" without playing every note at least once!).
Ugh! I take it back. He skips a few notes at 3:28. Now I no longer enjoy this song. :P
Garrett O'Donnell dat ocd tho
Garrett O'Donnell lol
My brain. It hurts. Ron Jarzombek understands music theory so ridiculously well.
If i hit the A#, the 5 notes left are the ones best matched in sound, right?
this is amazing
I dont understand this, but seema really interesting how can I google this topic?
"Schoenberg's 12-tone technique" springs to mind, and is the underlying idea behind this
+Mac thanks
+Mac wow thanks man! im really new in this kind of music, i started listening to mars volta and jhon zorn, and I really interested in this music!
+Golden Shag maybe not that sound new, but fredrik thordenthals special deffects, check that shit out.
***** He doesn't really play 12 tone chromatic, it's more skewed/atypical harmony from the school of Allan Holdsworth. Love that album though
i wish they had you cd at best buy
. . . so; basically: those who are familiar with a fretboard, tend to think of composition in terms of interesting patterns of notes. Often that's the sound of the notes - sometimes, we do it visually, based on the shape it makes on the fretboard.
What this "theory" is saying, is that you can also make an interesting composition, by arranging the notes into a circle, and playing them according to their visual/spacial relationship in the circle.
That's all.
my guitar idol ever
geometric music ! awasome!
@xOktavariuMx Don't forget, Alex Webster apparently gets this stuff too
what model of guitar is that ?
Holy shit 27 frets
hes makes it very technical by simplifying it
i need to be schooled on this 12 tone work.
he certainly gave us a crash course. my brain bluescreened on me
1:01 "Basic Guitar tracks" oh how blotted that statement is
.pretty basic.
More amazing than his playing, how did he get the notes to light up as he plays them, thats just pure insanity.
Amazing !!!
/,,/
Brutal!!! Brutal!!!
Many classical composers made their music by using similar musical calculations, combined with the attitude and musical taste of listener in a particular historic time period. That is why they wrote their music so fast and with freakish efficiency while "normal" listener has no idea what is going on. While others hunt for the golden riff RJ has the master's grip on the subject. Everything, even music, is based on a natural algorithm and he knows the impact its on the brain. Very scary.
Ron Jarzombek and Tosin Abasi should collaborate together on a music project
atonality...tone rows...that is all...great stuff!
Intro reminds me of Mastodon
Metal Marauder Dream Theater too.
Hot fuck. As a drummer, who has no damn clue about what any of this means, I find all of this pretty dang impressive.
Is this something Ron invented? I know about the “circle of 5th” and all that jazz, is this some kinda new scale or note relation config he just made up for this song or for his whole style?
Seems pretty interesting
@markogeeko
Personally, I would call Ron Jarzombek one of the most talented musicians alive today. Where is all your amazing music?
yes
Fuck yes.
Beast
Have to understand Beat division a lil bit too.. ;)
i dont even understand how do i still enjoy playing guitar...im watching this video and im laughing out loud because its just so brilliant its beyond belief. And almost everyone i asked has never heard of Ron or never heard of any of his bands, mainstream sucks dinosaur balls. Im an atheist but if i had to pray to somebody it would be Ron:D GREAT WORK AS ALWAYS MAN !!!
Sorry, I made some unexcusable mistakes...his Name is Ron- of course.
It looks complicated and probably is to ppl who play guitar. I don't care, it sounds good and isn't just the same 4 or 5 chords repeated over and over.
It's easy to think that more complicated = better, especially if you play the instrument. But that's not true. The point is and always will be about making music that sounds good. I love complicated music, as long as it sounds good. I also love simple music that sounds good.
12-tone rows are normally picked at random.
The theory is cool and all but holy shit this guitar looks badass!
Whatever happened to G,C,D?
He builds all his own guitars himself, usually he leaves a large portion of blank fret-board at the bottom so he can reach stuff like the 27th fret with his first and middle fingers. Crazy, right? Anyway, they're all hand build, by him.
Ron Jarzombek is the John Coltrane of metal.
What kind of guitar is that?
he makes his own guitars. more info on his website linked in the description
Cool, thanks.
headstock looks like ibanez
It looks like a lot of Japanese imports. I have an old Yamaha from 81 and has a headstock with that shape. I picked it up from one of my dad's work friends for a steal, at 150, the hardware alone on that guitar is worth more than what I paid, even if it is cheap hardware.
I seem to remember reading Ron custom builds his own guitars by hand. no "brand".
Epilepsy never felt so good.
Ron Jarzombek and David Ellefson. Separated by two strings.
@asqueezeoflemon
Me Too!
Such a fucking huge neck, damn.
Makes me think of some of Bucketheads stuff
THESE ARE NOT THE DROIDS YOU'RE LOOKING FOR.
27 frets + 4 fingers + 1000 npm = holy shizzle! ole Jedi m.t.
interesting way of putting it, but couldn't you also say that this song is just one big chromatic scale lick?
I dont even play guitar and this is insane
Ah, I see. The fact that you referred to them as being separated by strings made me think you were comparing their playing ability.
who do the notes in the circle change spots at the beginning of the video.???? Confuses the living shit out of me.... Then the whole video they stay in the same spot in the circle...
Is your brother Bobby!!!
Ron Jarzombek is the onlyone better than Asians.
Looks like a synthetic scale to me.
Its like the pich class theory, but with another variations.
David Ellefson is a great bassist, but him and Ron are incomparable. You shouldn't compare a bass player to a guitarist, they're 2 entirely different instruments
Eh.... The theory makes it seem wayyy more complex than it actually is
tonal. not 12 tone.
Oh that's weird and scary, but I like it anyway.
Wtf I can come here 666x I'm stil gona bow to you
Haha to the tone n all madness
i was watching the dial more than ron.
This is what happens when you let music theory get in the way of the music. Don't get me wrong, I really dig this stuff, but only in small doses. I like it more on a technical skill level, than a musical level.
+Zed Chuva Ron isn't really thinking of usual music theory when he's using this system, that's why he came up with it. You could probably analyse the sets of notes and group them in to scales / triads / arpeggios but I'm guessing that's not what Ron wanted to do.
+maj7#5 he actually does use scales. That's why he enharmonically equals all notes, to be able to think in common scales. The groupings are more meant to force your self to deal with uncommon note combinations. :)
reminds me of math just impossible !!