Done With Bitcoin Mining! Shutting Down Mining Farm After 5 Years! Lessons Learned From Managing.
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- Опубліковано 23 жов 2022
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This is probably the best video you have done. Speaking primarily to Bitcoin miner investors they can understand and sympathize with financial loss. Also shows your experience in the space over a number of years.
Thanks Gary, I debated with myself for over a month if should make this video.
@@SebastianOn 😢
Yup. Bitcoin is a scam mainly used by criminals and will go to ZERO.
Can't lose what you never had
Found you channel and wow damn bro. I really appreciate that kind of content where people talk for real and aren’t showcasing how cool it is. Totally sorry for your loss hopefully you get back on Track. I’m starting to educate myself on BTC mining and want to buy myself a couple s19j pros in couple months when Miners start to capitulate . But boy this video is like a Goldmine of all the Traps that are hidden in running such a great operation. Many thanks for the Upload. Got a like and a sub OF COURSE to say it’s the least
Thank you so much. That is why I did the video to let others know what to look out for. Don't know what your electricity cost is but that will be the number one cost that determines if you get an ROI on the equipment you buy or not. I wish you the best of luck, the good thing is that you are looking to buy in the bear market. Where you should be able to get the miners relative cheap. Thanks for watching and have a great night.
Thank you so much for this video, so much good content. As a miner who started at the end of 2020 I totally understand where you guys are coming from. Good luck in the future! Just subbed, cant wait to see more content from you guys
You're very welcome and best of luck to you as well. Thanks for subscribing and have a great day.
you are the reason GPU prices got skyrocket.
They actually skyrocketed before we were purchasing. We paid like 800 for each card. It was crazy, you couldn't buy them anywhere. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
😂
And now they will be cheap as ever. 😂
@@Platoface
Platoface: And now they will be cheap as ever. 😂
NVDIA: Ain't gonna happen! 😎
@@SebastianOn imagine spending all this money but not upgrading your transformer and or researching if it can handle your load. Yet some people plan and factor in electrical load initially and get it rolling. And before u can say who are u to talk well someone who upgraded transformers first 😆🤣
Wow, crazy story. Thanks for sharing!
I believe when setting up a farm like this the mining hardware should be the absolute last thing you buy. When you buy ASICs first and it takes one to two years to build out the infrastructure, the hardware is obsolete by the time you fire them up. I've made this mistake too, but on a much, much smaller scale in my garage 🙄
That is a good point. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
I can't believe that wasn't obvious from the start
@@DumbledoreMcCracken Ya was a bummer he didn't go mostly full GPU miners. I had a 12 rig operation with GPU miners, unfortunately built it during the 2017 bull run and didn't sell when I should of.. But between what I sold and being able to sell the hardware for 60-70% what I paid, I at least didn't lose money.
I'm thinking between mining rigs and ASICs from unigrade. Could you please advise? I am a beginner with almost zero knowledge. What are the points to look at please?
@@kertiz74 the cost of rigs and electricity, and the expected return from mining (that is, how many years will it take to break even).
To be safe, estimate the future revenue from mining is 1/2 what you expect it to be. So, if your costs are $3000 per month, and your estimate of revenue from mining is $2500 per month, don't get into that business
The algorithm brought me here and great video. I was just a small GPU miner, but I always wondered how the finances looked for a big miner. Thank you for being so open and hope things work out in the future.
I guess I should thank the algorithm. Are you mining anything now since ETH is done? It is expense to open a mining farm in a bull market. Lesson learned. We obviously made some mistakes, like the D3 miners, buying the miners in a bull market and so on. But you learn from those mistakes, pick your self off the floor and dust off and try again. Thanks for watching and you're very welcome. Have a great night.
Wow! What an amazing story... It really shows just how difficult mining really is, I tip my hat to you Seb for trying and persisting to make it work, must've been hard in some ways to pull the plug. Curious to ask, what's the thing you miss the most about it ?
You are putting your knowledge to good use with your channel Seb! Keep the great content coming!
The decision was actually pretty easy. We calculated that we would need BTC to be at 55k right now for us to make a profit and knowing that it's not going happen anytime soon. Possibly next year we might get to this price but at that point the network hashrate would increase as well and at that point we would need to BTC to be above 70k for us to be profitable. So the writing was on the wall.
I think I enjoyed the buildout the most. Getting things up and running. Once that was completed it was pretty easy and self automated. We would have to fix a miners fan, or change out the hashing board from time to time.
Thanks for watching and have a great day.
@@SebastianOn this is why I didnt pull the trigger on the s19s at 17k, with 10 cents power buying them so close to the halvening and hashrate increase I didnt see a path towards recooping the cost even at 4k per asic
Good decision. It seem like you could pick one up now for around 1.7k. Are you still thinking about mining? Thanks for watching and have a great evening.
@@SebastianOn I guess you have to keep an eye on the margins when your "work" is completely parasitic digital tulip bulbs.
Really Enjoyed This! Just found your channel and this was super insightful! Keep the knowledge bombs coming!
Thank you so much and will do. Have a great night.
Amazing content! Thanks for sharing this. Learnt a lot from how things work behind the scene of a mining farm.
Thanks so much. Timing and cost of electricity make all the difference. Have a great night.
Now that's a good lesson learned. Great business practice.
I have only a small mining rig in my main house and I wish to share how I do it. The elec bill is the biggest thing I see from the start, so I change my house electrical make up. I add solar, do my mini wind farm with 3D printers, yes it's cute small wind turbines but I made a hundred of them and it does make some electricity. I also mod my rig to heat my hot water 😂 and among everything that was the best decision ever.
Right now my case is special. It's not that profitable to mine. Hash rate is high as you say, but the rig has now integrated so much into my house. I turn it off, I don't have hot water. That hot water is for bath, and also affect my house and garden airflow so I can't really stop. It's a weird situation that I'm to this day cannot put absolute $ sign on pure business mining cost. Not a good practice. Like anything, don't mix your house with your business. I kinda like the setup tho.
Your setup sounds very interesting and as long as it work for you, that is even better. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
In my case, I had solar panels installed with extra capacity before I ever knew what mining was. I put together three 6 card miners and ran two 20 amp lines to where I keep them. They put out a lot of heat and so I ended up only using them in the winter months to heat my 1000 square foot home which they did just fine in the California valley. For the past 3 or 4 years now I had not the needed to run the central heating unit to warm the house. Depending on how cold it was, I'd run one or all three to maintain my comfort level.
The electricity used to run them was completely taken care of by the solar panels and pricing scheme I had with the utility company. At the time I got the panels, I was on a plan where electricity was expensive when the sun was shining and much cheaper when the sun went down. I altered my life around this fact. I held onto all the bitcoin I made through Nicehash until market peaks before selling off. It was a sweet deal while it lasted.
Just this year, the electrical company changed the rate where I'm simply charged by my usage. The more I use, the higher my rate as opposed to selling electricity back during the peak daylight hours at some 40 cents per kWh as how it used to be. With the new rate plan, I'll be lucky if my panels cover my usage without running my miners at all this winter season.
Last week I turned on one miner and updated the Nicehash software. I then let it rip. The long in the tooth now six 1070GPU's running at 100% were only going to net me a whole 78 cents per day. With this low rate of return and the high electricity costs I have now in operating them, I'm done. Going to break things down and start selling off the GPU's on eBay.
@@fahey6797 Thanks for sharing and have a great night.
It's amazing to see how far you guyz went with the setups.
@@GhostsOfSparta Had no other option. Thanks for watching and have a great weekend.
I'm not sure of the origin of this quote,but "failure isn't the opposite of success,it's part of it." Thanks for sharing Sebastian!
I like that one. Thanks.
“Failure is not the opposite of success - it’s a part of it. And as failures go,” he added with a lopsided grin, “this one was really spectacular, wasn’t it?”
- William Ritter
Fascinating stuff! Thanks for sharing your experiences with us. I wish you well in the future.
Thank you and you're welcome. Hope this helps in preventing others from making the same mistakes. Have a great day.
You know the cops checked that out. Probably forced entry expecting to see a grow lmao😂🎉
Actually we never had the police stop by. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
Thanks for sharing Sebastian, a humbling experience to be sure, but also many lessons learned
You're very welcome and it was great learning experience. Have a great day.
awesome thx for running us through your experience that was educational as a smaller gpu miner the ideas and lessons learned you hit on i kinda heard through the grape vine and try to practice in the event of worse case but could never validate so thank you for the validation. looks like the common problem across the board is the power companies.. as much as it pains me to say this it looks like being 100% self sufficient with power generation is the only way forward
You're very welcome. So I would agree about the power generation, whether it is solar, hydro or wind. If a you have control over that you will be in a much better position. Also timing has a lot to do with it as well. It is better build out in a bear market than a bull market. Thanks for watching and have a great night.
The key to making money was to be early, and fund growth from profits already made. I didn’t buy anything to start mining, you could use a standard PC. I also hot a point where the waste heat was able to be put to industrial use, and I had access to very cheap power, as well as even cheaper surplus power. Also, staying modular is key is key.
I also wasn’t obsessed with getting out at the peak. I’m not a mastermind. Right about the time you were ramping up, I sold everything to a group of investors. Those proceeds and the value of the coin that I slowly sold off over 5 years was a 9 digit number for me. I’m actually a real farmer and rancher, as in people and livestock food. It was a great way to become an enterprise that will support future generations and provide nourishment and comfort for thousands of people.
That's interesting. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
Thank you for your work. This is a very interesting venture.
You're very welcome. It was interesting venture and I learned a tremendous amount from it. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
This is my first time watching your video. Def great content for sure. You just earned yourself a new subscriber. Thanks for the amazing content Sebastian.
Awesome, thank you so much! Hope you have wonderful day.
This is such an interesting video! Thanks so much for all of these lessons learned!
You are so welcome! Thanks for watching and have a great Sunday.
I had a 5GH/s GPU farm back in 2017.. the thing I miss most was the fresh smell of PCB's /electrical as soon as you fired it up. And I found the sound of the GPU Fans was relaxing.
If I could turn back time and re-do it again.. it would all be in a co-lo, and all the ETH profits would be in separate wallets, WEEKLY, and invested in DEFI Layer 1/protocol coins.
Govt's will crack down on crypto mining regardless be cause its a good way to generate money out of ' thin air'... ie.. not a tax event.. no base cost
That is interesting, we do learn from our mistakes. Thanks for watching and have a great weekend.
Thanks for the story, info and lessons!!
You're very welcome, thanks for watching and have a great night.
One of the most interesting videos i have seen ,thanks for showing us .
Thanks and you're very welcome. Thanks for watching and have a great weekend.
Thank you for sharing. Without a strong and experienced team leader that's willing to push and plan 24/7, big projects can't get done.
You're very welcome. Thanks for watching and have a great weekend.
Good video thanks.
Thanks, have a great day.
super interesting, thx for sharing
Thank you and thanks for watching, have a great night.
Incredible video. Thanks for sharing.
You're very welcome and thanks for watching. Have a great night.
I appreciate you sharing for others to learn from.
Very interesting operation.
You're very welcome. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
Real lesson: When in a gold rush - just sell shovels instead of joining those digging.
I like that analogy. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
You guys were in the best timing when you started farming in early 2018. If you failed it’s on you. 2021 was blow off top. You had the chance to ride it to the top comfortably.
Actually that is not the case. We were in a bear market 2018, 2019 and 2020. Not the best time. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
Sounds like it was lack of planning and experience. Learning as you go is OK to some extent. If they went into this without a firm price on electricity, what were they thinking? Electricity cost would be the absolute #1 factor in the whole project.
Electricity was our top priority that is why we wanted to get the bill from our provider but couldn't for the first 5 months. Thanks for watching and have a great weekend.
@@SebastianOn noobs
@@SebastianOnYou did say in another comment that the best time to build rigs are in a bear market, therefore you should have been able to profit in the blowout year 2021. Most farms are not in US because of elec prices.. also the scale was too big before any profits. Hope your friend was able to pay back that loan.
Great story, thanks for the transparency. Sadly, I don't think we'll see another POW token create such an opportunity again. But fingers crossed.
You're very welcome and I agree. I don't think we'll see another POW with such huge opportunity. Have a great day.
Great Video! Love the content!
Thank you so much, have a great day.
Thanks for sharing! Amazing insight, amazing story.
You're very welcome. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
Good advice thanks you...
You're very welcome. Thanks for watching and have a great weekend.
Thanks for this video!
You're very welcome and thanks for watching. Have a great weekend.
Amazing story... this really helps us folks understand the nature of the business. The challenges you guys faced were incredible... I'm sorry it did not work out for you.
I now understand why you know the business the way you do... there's nothing better than first hand experience.
If you could do it all again... ethe mining only... would that have been the way to go? Obviously with ethe now being P of S, it doesn't matter anymore, but just curious.
Thank you for sharing Sebastian... and thank you for continuing this journey... I really hope you strike it big with your investments... you deserve it.
Cheers 🍻
Thanks Hank. And yes ETH would have been the way to go. We did try to get more GPU's but they were so hard to come by and the prices were high. To build a 6 GPU rig, it was about $3k. Cheers🍻
@@SebastianOn thank you for the correction. ETH 😊
@@ohio a comment with no substance is just that...a comment.
@@ohio It's a small business that went out of business. Have a great weekend.
Thank you very much for sharing your experience. I really appreciate it, takes too much strong to share our errors, but it can help so much. I really appreciate that you share your wisdom. Have a great day, thank you very much.
Glad it was helpful! Thanks for watching and have a great day.
Amazing video! Great insights surrounding your journey and thank you for sharing your failures. Lots of good lessons. Would you do it again? Given the opportunity? Not that I’m offering I’m afraid
You're very welcome. I probably would do it again if I had the time. Learned a lot in the process. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
thank you for the info. very informative.
You're very welcome, thanks for watching and have a great day.
Amazing info, hugely informative, thank you!
Glad it was helpful! Thanks for watching and have a great day.
already subscribed! thanks for sharing your journey on mining
Thanks for subscribing. I hopeful that by sharing my journey, others will learn from our mistakes and not repeat them. Thanks for watching and have a great night.
Fascinating stuff. Many thanks. The 5 months without an electrical bill must've been very stressful. I've not had a gas bill at home for 2.5 years (!!) since they put in a smart meter. And I've told them loads of times. We have a "back billing" rule in the UK where they can only charge you for a year of usage. I've pointed this sliding window out to my gas supplier to light a fire under them, so to speak. It's very hard to plan your finances when you have such a large unknown cost. Thanks again.
You're very welcome. Wow 2.5 years without a bill. It's good that they can only go back a year. Especially since you called them. And it was nerve recking not know what our cost per kwh was. A penny or two make all of the difference between being profitable or not. Thanks for watching and have a great weekend.
This video came across as a great job application (:
I hate jobs personally (don't have one) but if you did like working, how come you aren't trying to get into management at one of the top tier miners? If you enjoy doing it, it isn't a job anymore. It reminds me of when I was working a 9-5 job and renovating houses on the side. I loved renovating those houses and if I were to go back to working, it would be renovating them again. Perhaps since you "choose" this side hustle, it could be more ideal than your current job (just speculating).
Nice video, you have some thick skin and not egotistical given how you can easily express your past failures. 👍
Thanks! I love my current job. I've been there going on 26 years, it pays really well, I live only 5 minutes away so the commute is awesome and I go home for lunch everyday. Plus 4 weeks of vacation. But I've always had a side hustle. My current side hustle is this channel. As for going to work for the other miners. I don't want to relocate and start all over. Yes I've possibly gotten comfortable with the current routine. But doing this channel has given me new goals and challenges. We learn from our mistakes and hopefully by sharing others won't make the same mistakes. Have a great day.
Agree, time is something that you never get back or more of. That is awesome that you were able at 33.
Great Share thanks .... Good luck
Thanks and thank you for watching. Have a great day.
It's pretty easy to use a controller from Johnson Controls and write a basic PID Loop to control air flow based on inside temperature
What about temperatures at for different location? Thanks for watching and have a great weekend.
Nice video, thanks a lot man
Thanks and you're very welcome. Have a great day.
great video, thank you for sharing your experience
Thanks and you're very welcome. Have a wonderful night.
One of the lessons learned that you mentioned that wasn't on your list: Working a normal job and doing mining on the side.
That could be one. But once everything was installed and running there wasn't much else to do other then check on the farm, restart/fix the miners when necessary. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
If there is huge price swings, it would resemble commodity mining companies. In that case, the derivative market selling future crypto production could help to stabilize prices and more stable future (the way oil companies could sell years of their inventory via future contracts for future delivery). This was a great video which provided a lot of insights.
That is very interesting. Also a little above my understanding but I get what you are saying. Thanks for watching and have a great night.
@@SebastianOn In the video, you mentioned about electricity cost and signing long term contract at fixed kwh price. This means that the electricity company takes on the risk of electricity price fluctuations by guaranteeing a price for usage. From 2014 and onwards, bitcoin and main currency derivatives market started to develop. There are entities/traders who would buy a miner's future bitcoin production especially in bull market. E.g. If bitcoin is $60000, then there are entities that would buy your future production for $50000 up to 2 years out, and it could specific the numbers of bitcoin you have to delivery by certain dates. These are executed similar to contracts. This means bitcoin production 2 years out would be profitable (vs only mining when bitcoin price is above production cost) and you are giving up potential future gains if bitcoin goes up. For bitcoin, there is an actual futures market. The current price is the spot price, then Dec 22 contract, Jan 23 contract. Feb 23....Dec 23. You can sell via derivatives market these contracts for bitcoin delivery. This gives you price stability that after bitcoin is produced you already know what price it would be sold at.
In agriculture, if Mcdonalds wishes to use my farm to supply them with chicken for the next 5 years at a fixed rate, I would have to stabilize the input cost for chicken. The greatest uncertain input cost is corn feed for chicks so they grow into chickens. I would go to the futures market to buy future delivery contracts for corn up to 5 years out. This allows me to provide Mcdonalds with a fixed quote for chickens they would pay for 5 years. Mcdonalds in turn can sell their chicken burgers at a fixed price with potential annual price increases. Imagine if Mcdonalds did not stabilize the cost of chicken which is sold at market prices. Then anytime the price of chicken goes above a certain price, Mcdonalds would either have to raise the menu price (fluctuating menu prices are bad for customers) or stop selling chicken burgers until the price of chicken comes back down or selling chicken burger at a loss due to higher chicken prices and hope prices come down.
The miners I noticed follow a decay model meaning most of the revenue is earned at the beginning of lifecycle (why Butterfly labs were using customer miners to mine bitcoin before they shipped it out in 2013). If you are one of the first people to get newest miners, one can make their money back in weeks/few months. Once most people get their mining rigs online, revenue would drop quite substantially. The priority is getting miners quickly and bringing it online quickly. Most people see how much profit they can make but don't take into account the additional competition from others who are thinking the same thing as them.
Building out in a bear market mentioned is big because input cost is reasonable and one has time to build out the infrastructure which can take multi months or years to complete for big scale projects and get it right (e.g. electrical, green tech solar, recycling heat generated by miners). In a bull market, one pays substantially more due to anticipation of selling the produced coin at high premium compared to cost.
the key difference being commodity miners create value by extracting scarce minerals from the earth. I'm not sure that solving various coin crypto hashes really brings any value to society at large, does it? Appreciate your honestly, but kind of pleased you've finally terminated this activity. Sincerely hope you will decide to turn your energies to something more productive in future, rather than sitting around waiting for the next bull market.
@@hgm8337 Commodity miners create value by using a lot of energy and equipment to mine those scarce minerals. Bitcoin miners in comparison use lots of energy to secure to the network of a scarce commodity Bitcoin. The value in Bitcoin is it's utility. You can send it from one part of the world to another in about 10 minutes, will very low fees. Compared to the current financial system where sending a $100 will cost you 8 to 15% and takes days. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
For futures to work you need predictable demand. In crypto demand is still arbitrary.
Great video!
Thank you so much. Thanks for watching and have a great night.
I heard someone say buy when there is blood on the streets...seems like a lot of blood on the streets right now...excellent video BTW
Thank you and I've heard the same thing. Also heard this - be greedy when others are fearful and be fearful when others are greedy. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
Great video really interesting.
Thank you and thanks for watching. Have a great day.
Hi Sebastian, interesting vid. Considering the challenges for the mining companies such as cleanspark and marathon, isnt energy costs the number 1 variable on profitability, having said that, new hashrate coming online from places like Russia and Oman which have advantages in regard to energy costs which are difficult to compete with in western countries, istnt this the nunber one risk for the US miners? Can they be pushed out of the market by spiking difficulty from low cost countries?
And secondly, once energy companies notice the profitability of mining, how long will it take before the start plugging in the miners? And create a cost level that cannot be matched by pure mining companies.
What is your take on this?
Yes electricity pricing is a huge profitability driver. There is always a concern for countries to start mining but we really haven't seen much of it, yet. As for energy companies to start mining. I think that would depend on the country where they are located and the regulations that they have. Here in the USA, I don't think they can do it as it would be an unfair competitive advantage. Plus the regulations would prevent it.
I had to throw the towel in years ago. I faced another hardware upgrade. I already went through a big one before not to mention the plug and plays we used to used back in the day. I went through hundreds of those
Yeah, unfortunately if one is not upgrading at least every 2 years or so or has really low cost of electricity. One will not survive. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
Obviously, basically, basically, obviously.
Basically, so obviously basically obviously
Thanks for the criticism and for watching. Have a wonderful day.
I was able to see this problem years ago in my room. The more crypto is used, the harder the mining, the higher the cost, profit drops!
That is very true. Thanks for watching and have a great day
I had a similar situation happen with me but on a much smaller scale and happened at the end of the most recent bull run. I had the experience with building and my friend had the capital. Every time we solved one issues, another issue popped up
That it tough. How are you guys doing now? Thanks for watching and have a great day.
Good news. The more of these greedy environmentally disasters shut , the better.
Thanks for watching and have a great weekend.
Anything over ~3 cents/kWh is too much for Bitcoin mining. The big takeaway you missed is that as a miner you're competing with Bitmain and other manufacturers which mine with their own equipment for months before releasing small volumes to the market, can't really compete without fabbing your own ASIC chips. It's eye opening to see those 10+ MW sites.
We knew about that and it still seemed profitable on paper, but the delays really hurt us along with getting the D3 miners. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
@@SebastianOn The delays are by design, every manufacturer does it so and it was no different back then. I've made similar mistakes but luckily I stuck to GPUs mostly, just a small setup. Very grateful for the update!
Basically ur saying don't be the digger sell the shovels!
I started mining around the same time.. im stll doing great!! Selling the highs and shorting has been my trick to staying profitable in bear markets
Very nice, best of luck to you guys. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
Don't let the door hit you on the way out
Thanks for the great advice. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
The Planet will thank you for shutting down. Good video. Thanks.
Thanks and to be honest we had electricity that was carbon free. Thanks for watching and have a great Sunday.
@@SebastianOn Carbon free yes, but still pushing huge amounts of heat out. Using (wasting?) huge amounts of energy. The must be a better way. Crypto is a great concept, use your obvious talents to figure out a better way. Thanks.
@@alexmclaren9159 I agree with you there and thank you for the nice compliment.
I do some crypto mining myself. Clearly the key is buy low whether it's buying equipment, or just buying the coin. Don't get caught up, and FOMO in at the top. How do you know when to buy you ask? Now this is just my opinion, but I think you can clearly look at historical BTC graph data, and predict fairly well.
How long have you been mining? And I agree about the timing. Thanks for watching and have a great night.
@@SebastianOnWe grabbed 3 L3's probably around the same time you started. Then this last bull run we bought 8 gpus, and a s19 pro. Yeah we got caught up, lol. But I feel like we have learned what todo, or not todo. I have a lot of solar, so we run the GPUs on it.
What an excellent video. I am also a miner, but I dont think selling daily, monthly is a solution or setting up commercially. The market is so volatile that from my experience it should be a long term goal. So money invested should be done with the objective of a 5 year mine then sell. I just dont see how it can be profitable short term with the power costs... I have about 400 gpus set up over 7 different domestic sites where we dont pay rent & only cover electrical costs and these costs come out of our pocket not from mining. So things where great while mining ethereum, now its horrible profit wise.
Thanks and very good points raised. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
Down you go, too bad huh?
Very interesting, no way i would tackle this without a “free” energy source.
Thanks and free energy would have been great. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
I entertained buying a mining machine for about 2 days in 2020. Glad I never went through with it. Thanks for the info! Very informative video.
Thank you and smart move. Have a great day.
Awesome journey, bummer it's ending on a low note. I think the best way to mine is to keep it low scale so that you can fund it with other cash when it's not profitable.
Low scale is more difficult as electricity prices will eat you alive. Unless you have electricity at like 5 to 6 cents per kwh. Ethereum mining was great for small scale setups while it lasted. It helped us greatly to get through the bear markets. When it wasn't profitable to mine BTC. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
@@SebastianOn You can get hosts with 0.04 in South America and west Asia with no MOQ but its not easy to find them.
you are talking about all this losses and i'm just looking at the experience curve here. keep pushing content for people to learn thanks
Thank you! Will do! Have a great day.
to the moooon!!!
Wow.
Your experience is exactly like a friend of mine. He spends crazily on his business like it is a hobby and not a cash generating machine. I hope your next project is successful
Thanks so much and thanks for watching. Have a wonderful night.
Hello Sebastian, hope you can read this comment.
First of all kudos for such a detailed video. I am trying to raise capital for mining farm myself.
Just one question, do you think renewable energies, either hydro or solar power, (even if it requires a larger investment) would’ve help your project and how?
Cheers!
I think those would have helped but it also depends on the electrical draw a company has. The more draw the lower the cost, I would think. Thanks for watching and have a great night.
I feel the electrical companies are making bank, profit margins are gigantic since what do they do with unused power anyway. It isn’t a physical commodity.
I agree. Have a great night.
Bitmain Antminer KA3 (166Th) is next available Miner, might squeak out some profit
But that is for Kadena algorithm which is for a different coin. Be careful, we got burned with D3 miner. If you are going to get one make sure you get it as fast as possible because daily revenue will fall quickly. Thanks for watching and have a great night.
happy to see such ecological abheration beeing shut down
Thanks for watching and have a great day.
Good on you for giving it a crack Seb. Can imagine it's very difficult to juggle everything!
Cheers
Ryan
Thanks so much. The build out was the toughest and most time demanding. But once everything was in and operating, it was just monitoring the operations. I helped tremendously to be able to see the operations remotely and setup automation for the fans and exhaust to keep the place cool. Then it was a matter of restarting miners when they had glitch. Learned a lot from the experience. Thanks for watching and have a wonderful day.
yes good
Thanks for watching and have a great night.
Its amusing that their LED's glow a dramatic "money green". At least, here in the U.S. we associate certain shades of green with money.
That it is. Thanks for watching and have a great night.
Thanks Sebastian. I am in the same situation as you guys. I am in Indiana and invested 1 million plus. Then the market crashed. I have a 30k square foot facility and we have 2,500 kVa system installed and its prepped for another 2,500 kVa transformer at no cost from the provider. We are also approved for something called the Economic Development Rider with will give us a discount on our electrical rate for 5 years once we go above 500k watts usage. We are thinking about hosting since our miners are not profitable at the moment. I don't know where you guys are located, and, not sure what happened to your infrastructure since you mention that you have stopped mining and the building is owned by someone else. If you guys would like to look at what we have over here and possibly partner for the next bull run let us know. Its to expensive to do all this and plenty of capacity at the moment. Thanks
Sorry to hear you are in the same boat as us. What is your current cost per kw/h and what miners do you have? We are actually located in Illinois so not to far from you. Our miners are the S9's which will probably be no longer profitable unless BTC goes above 75k. Thanks for the offer to partner up but I don't think my friend is looking to invest any more into this endeavor. If you get into hosting make sure you do cost plus and not a fixed price. Best of luck to you guys.
I'm actually pretty interested. What's the best way to contact you?
@@SebastianOn Oh hello Sebastian, just saw your reply. We actually only get 8 cents a kWh but have been approved for the EDR (Economic Development Rider) from AEP (American Electric Power) because we spent more than 1 million in a Federal Redevelopment Economic Zone. With that said, if we exceed 500k watts per month then the rate shall drop to 5.9 cents and then graduate to 4.8 cents over a 5 year period. Are miners are older ones since we were using most of the capital investments on the infrastructure. We are trying to get certified right now to host with 600 to 800 possible spots available.
cool
Thanks for watching and have a great day.
If I 'm putting out that much money I'm getting my own land and solar.
You would need a lot of land and a lot of solar to power this very small mining farm. Thanks for watching and have a great weekend.
Do you ever wish you had bought land and built 25 tiny homes to Airbnb? You could generate approx $120-$150,000 a month gross rev. Then the cool thing, after get your property appraised by a lender and cash out refi. Then build another 25 units on another plot w less out of pocket.
So renting or something for Airbnb is on my radar. Right now I'm investing heavily into the public traded bitcoin miners. With the next bull run in BTC I'll be cashing those out and looking into real estate.
@@SebastianOn what’s your criteria you look for in a publicly traded miner?
@@Furtivo95 I'm looking for growth and low share holder dilution.
I have a question for you, actually I just discovered your channel, I have been offered to subrogate a mining contract for an s19j 100 and 104 and also an hs5, right now I would be losing money and paying out of pocket…. Should I do it? What do you think? Thank you so much
So you're talking about a mining contract where a company that has these machines is offering you to basically lease these miners. So it all depends on the what they are charging you on that lease/rental. If you currently not profitable with these that tells me that they are charging you somewhere around 9 to 10 cents per kwh plus other fees on top of that. To be honest and this is not financial advice. I would rather invest in the market right now and the publicly traded miners. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
@@SebastianOn thank you for your answer, some guy had those miners in teslawatt, but he can’t afford to run them anymore, so I would take over his contract, it comes around 11 cts kw, for what I know nothing else on top of that….. at that price right now I would be losing money because I try to hold the coins so it is like 700$ out of pocket…. If I do not is for the long run of course… the good side? Not paying a dime for the miners… just keep them el running and they are mine, and hoping to hodl for the next bull run… Downside? The rest
@@andreualonso5087 Here is the way that I see it. Currently at 11 kwh the cost is $8.84 per day, subtract from that revenue and you end up with around a $3 loss per day currently. You would need BTC price to go up to $25k before you turn a profit and that is if the network hashrate doesn't increase in that time. If it does, lets say it goes to 300M, not you'll need the BTC price to be above $28k. You might be better off just buying BTC at this point and HODL. NFA!!!
Thanks fantastic insight. Ok S, what was the bottom line? How much spent, how much made? Also when you closed up how much did you sell everything for?
So the total investment was 1.6m recouped between 250k and 350k from mining. We are still in process of trying to sell the unit so if that gets sold for 300k on the bottom end as there aren't a lot of people looking to buy a small mining farm. The D3 miners were a $400k mistake that only made around $20k back. $380k down the drain. If we bought more S9's I think we would have done much better and possibly been able to reinvest in newer miners. Lesson learned. The miners are now worthless except for the GPU cards which we are trying to sell online. We could maybe recycle some of the copper wire, the conduit and also sell the racks. There is also the possibility to rent out the unit.
@@SebastianOn Bob Burnett of Barefoot Mining likes to have "many small sites" not sure if your site would meet the criteria he is looking for to rent but I remember him mentioning small sites in an interview. They focus on site diversity.
Thanks for the info on Barefoot Mining. I'll reach out to them see if they might be interested.
if you miner you need to create company and list it on the market OTC... if not just buy BTC spot and hold with more than 1 mil in 2017 you guys would be in huge profit now. lesson learned and to the next one.
OTC would have helped but it also becomes way more complicated and neither one of us had experience in the markets. I like that "Lesson learned and to the next one". Have a great day.
You can Add Partners who are in Farm Mining and Grow your Crypto Farm..
That would have been a good option if we had access to wealthy investors. Have a great day.
I am not sure if this was in this excellent summary but what was the net net of all your efforts? I imagine it would be hard to sum everything exactly but what was the net after every cost factored in, all hardware infrastructure initial layout and buildout, all rents, all overhead, all electrical, including your labour and any other labour vs the dollar value of what was mined?
I'm just estimating here but somewhere around 40 to 50% return on investment. So we did not break even on this project. Hence the lessons learned. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
That is really too bad, seems like you guys worked really hard.
@@maggmaster thanks, not everything in life is a home run. Have a great weekend.
@@maggmaster We did but we also learned a lot. And all that knowledge has transferred into this channel. Hopefully I can prevent others from making the same mistakes. Thanks for watching and have a great weekend.
Interesting video. Key takeaway: if it was easy, everybody would be doing it.
Thanks and that is correct. Have a great day.
Step number one:
Secure the needed power AND get in writing the kWh rate!
Absolutely a lesson learned. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
Thanks for sharing! Why didn't you guys do all GPU to mine eth, if they were so profitable?
You're very welcome and the reason we didn't do all GPU mining is because the supply of GPU's just wasn't there. We were lucky to get the ones that we did. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
and all those used up shitty GPUs are flooding the market. Remember, a microchip is a bimetal in essence, and under any temperature it bends differently and those tiny shifts while bending causes microchips, all microchips, to eventually slow down. Don't be fooled. The GPUs that were used for mining are garbage, and you can't tell if they were used for gaming, editing or mining.
Good point, thanks for watching and have a great day.
Thanks for sharing. How do halving cycles impact your profits? I would think that would also play a role as well?
Halving cycles can have a big impact. And it all depends on the BTC price. Historically BTC has rallied into and after the halving cycles making it more profitable to mine. This is a great article about with some data on previous cycles. cointelegraph.com/bitcoin-for-beginners/bitcoin-halving-how-does-the-halving-cycle-work-and-why-does-it-matter Thanks for watching and have a great day.
Thanks for the fascinating run down of the life cycle of the farm and striving to keep the costs down.
So bottom line, is it too sensitive to ask, how close did it come to at least returning his investment? Or perhaps, as implied by not specifically answering that question in the video, was it a very painful experiment for the investor?
(Apologies if you answered this in the comments - I didn’t see it. Perhaps pin that comment.)
So looking back at the numbers it looks like we were able to recoup about 30% of the initial investment. This is not counting the unit that still can be leased out or sold for some profit. If we include the unit we're closer to 50%. Like I said in the video, there were at times months or even a year where we were not mining because the economics were just not there. But if the investor held on to the coins when they were mined and possibly sold them at the peak I think the return would have been close to 80% or higher but that is just a guess. It was/is painful for the investor as I'm sure it would be for anyone. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
@@SebastianOn thanks for that - all in all a good lesson for others - to eyeball the risk.
2022 nov 21 BITCOIN USD$15,900 (down from USD$32,000)
We may not be done with the price falling even more. Bear markets in BTC always are the worst. Thanks for watching and have a great night.
GOOD RIDDANCE. A total waste of power and resources to create a "coin" that wasn't even a coin. Maybe now this folly will end.
This folly is only getting bigger over time. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
IRS taking notes 🤣
Hope they are writing us a refund check. Thanks for watching and have a great night.
Interesting. I had a similar experience in the legal marijuana business in Colorado. We built in a bear market and lost one and a half million dollars.
I've heard that from a few people that got into that market, that they ended up loosing money. Not sure why that is but I wish you better success in the next project. Have a great day.
Fortunately my friend was able to draw his landlords electric from a plug in the hall way and saved an absolute fortune in electric costs.👍
That's one way to do it. Thanks for watching and have a great night.
I don't know anything about mining but I do know you can't pull that much amperage through your neighbors electrical outlet. Not to mention that is called stealing from your neighbor.
@@tomparker9966 Landlord*
@@firestarter1888 Landlord/neighbor? Did you see the size of their transformer? You can't pull that much power thru an outlet in the hallway. He even said 5 months of electric was $180,000.
@@tomparker9966 Im joking of course, it was just an idea. Dont believe everything you read, especially in crypto land.
Yes Mining is tough. Especially at your level. I just can not believe you didnt make money on this last bull run with Bitcoin hitting 60k. I mean it hovered at 50 for months then 40k. I mean if you were selling at 11-13k I mean your killing it at 60k. Thank You for sharing your story.
We had older s9 miners, so we made some profit last year but it wasn't huge. The network hashrate had growth a lot over the past 4 years from when we started and that affected our profitability greatly. Currently we would need BTC to be above 55k for us to generate 10 cents per miner. By the time BTC gets to that price the network hashrate will increase and we will need BTC to be over 70k to get a profit. For that reason we are closing shop. Thanks for watching and commenting. Have a great night.
@@SebastianOn the biggest thing that killed your business was not selling daily.
Unless you planned to hodl for way down the line and then recoup 10x but it's impossible to see that far ahead
Thankyou so much for this. I am currently building a social enterprise that seeks to connect the renewable energy sector to the charity sector via Bitcoin, basically because in the UK for the last twelve years, we have been trying the "kill the poor people" strategy. As it stands with retail energy prices in the UK, if i run 2 Bitmain ASICs, i can make a total monthly profit of minus seven-hundred pounds, which seems less than optimal.
My question is this- how on earth do you source cheap energy? Would you suggest I try people who already have small scale renewable projects, possibly off-grid?
My project is clearly not on the scale of yours, but I really would appreciate any guidance you could offer.
Sounds like an interesting project. So with regard to finding low cost electricity. I don't know how your electricity is regulated in England. I would recommend checking with an electricity consultant. They have more options available here in the US for customers that use more electricity than the typical household. So that would be my first step. The second would be to reach out to large scale miners in your country and see if they would be willing to donate space for a couple of miners either for free or for just the cost of electricity. Best of luck to you. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
Thankyou so much, I never even considered the possibility of an electricity consultant: i suppose it's one of those things one never thinks about except in certain circumstances. Your words of advice and encouragement have made a real difference, please remain in the space!
its game over
That it is. Thanks for watching and have a great night.
One lesson needed. Just invest in Bitcoin and forget about mining.
One better is to invest in bitcoin and the bitcoin miners that are publicly traded. They seem to outperform Bitcoin in gains. Thanks for watching and have a great day.
@@SebastianOn I am investing a little bit in coinbase
@@fatgirlboy9341 I did as well when they IPO'd, I have since sold out of them at a loss and moved into investing in the miners. Please always do your own research.
@@SebastianOn any stock code ?
@@fatgirlboy9341 riot, Clsk, Bitf, Hut, hive, Iren, btbt,