The easiest way to spot an amateur blue job, is to look at the surrounding wood. Most don't remove the barrel and receiver from the stock, and you can see bluing on the wood. Don't be lazy, take the time to remove the stock. Your bluing job will come out looking 110% better.
Good job on this series! Not too many people cold blue similar to your method. When I am refinishing an entire "unit", especially on larger parts.... I like the part a bit warmer, either sit it on an electric stove burner, low temp in oven, or even with a "plumbers" propane torch. But only a couple hundred degrees, not super hot. However, the heat gun is a good idea too, thats one I hadn't thought of even though I have one and use it all the time for other projects, might have to give it a try :-) And yes, most people are like *_"but this is cold bluing, why are you heating it?"_* *Two Reasons:* First, it basically "opens the pores" of the steel and makes the piece accept a much more durable bluing. And Two it also helps to evaporate any water out of the metal. Most people who don't work with metal don't realize that a seemingly "dry" piece of steel usually will have water in/on its surface. An easy way to see this is to take a piece of "dry" flat steel, then put a torch to it, you will quickly see the area the heat is being applied to dry out as the water evaporates. After I get the part good and warm, I apply several coats of the Brownells Oxpho-Blue LIQUID first, I do wipe down between coats, personal preference. After wiping off excess blueing, I rewarm a bit between coats if the piece begins to get cold. Then I use the Brownells Oxpho-Blue CREAM as a final coat. It seems to level out everything really nice, and give a deeper richer finish. And its better to just pour a small amount of oxpho-blue into a seperate container to avoid any contamination issues either with what you are bluing, OR with what you are applying the blueing with. As I've seen some guys who was using new "clean" applicators (cloths, paper towels, steel wool, etc) and it turned out the applicator wasn't as clean as it should have been. So if that ends up being an issue, at least you only lose what blueing you placed into the separate container (which if any is left over, you're going to toss anyway), and not the entire bottle. And you can always clean the piece and reblue if there is a contamination issue. Just my 2 cents :-)
I just did my 10/22 barrel with this stuff. Less than an hour prep and probably another 30 minutes to a perfect finish. Started with 600 grit sandpaper then 0000 steel wool, then a wipe down with alcohol, heat with hair dryer, followed with oxpho blue. Wiped on with gauze pads held in a leatherman pliers. The trick is to steel wool between coats for the first few applications. Then follow up by continuous application (as soon as it turns dry wipe it again) change pads frequently, and use a separate container to dunk your pads in, a little goes a long way. I did my barrel, bolt handle and my .44 blackpowder pistol barrel in one sitting wit a little less than 1 ounce. Once dry and wiped down with a clean slightly tough cloth (I used a new wash cloth), you can rub gun oil right into the finish. Came out sharp, deep, and probably nicer than factory.
I put in several coats as you suggested before rubbing down with steel wool. I had a lot of dark, spotty buildup spots. I stripped it and started over. One coat, steel wool, wash, and repeat. I did my whole rifle and it looks better than most factory finishes.
I often use Oxpho Blue in a multi-step process where I "steam" or humidify the parts after application. This helps in a dry climate like Colorado. The steaming step really helps the acids of Oxpho Blue to bite into the steel better. I buff with a carding wheel (soft soft wire brush wheel), and then do this 3-4 more times. This is similar to what I saw in a Midway video, but it's simpler and goes beyond just "touch-up" and really produces a quality primary bluing for new parts. Want more bluing? Do more steps, or steam them more (without condensation). Oxpho Blue is a good acid recipe. It's up to the user to get out of it what you want. I would say that Brownells under-sells this product. Do your research in procedures, and you can get top-notch professional results using OB.
I have to say that I'm kinda surprised that you didn't take the time to mask off the stock to keep from getting the Oxpho on it. The stock looks like it suffered quite a bit. Painter's tape is easy to use.
Thanks for the videos. I just finished a Remington 870 shotgun. When I started there was more rusted area than clear surface of steel. I only recommend that people take their time in sanding your steel. It took 4 coats to get it looking good. I did 7 treatments to get it looking like new. JUST DO AS IRAQVETERAN SAYS. Gloves, Heat, Clean Steel. etc. Thanks for your videos. rix34
One of the best cold bluing videos I have seen so far. Thanks, you explained in detail many of the questions I was seeking answers to. I'm using the same Brownells bluing but it's a cream base to try and re-blue my very first rifle that has seen much better days. Thanks again and for your service.
Just a quick hint with Oxpho... Using a hair dryer or heat gun to heat up the metal before application helps tremendously. Gives you a darker richer blue. Don't get the metal too hot. you don't want the oxpho to evaporate immediately or you will get blotching.
It will not make the finish more durable. Only easier to apply and richer looking. If you are looking for durable the best is Pilkington rust blue. It is very labor intensive, slow, but gives a superior finish that is arguably more durable than hot blue.
Re: cross contamination of Oxpho blue....I pour only what I intend to use into a PLASTIC 3-4 in. lid, and dip only into that, more can be added if required to complete the project, if in the end You have some left over pour it out, NEVER return it to the original container....I did many rebluing projects over a 20+ year timeframe out of the same 1/2 qt. bottle of Oxpho Blue....a great product....
NEVER apply bluing over rust. I don't care what the label says, you NEVER want to apply bluing over existing rust. Not only will it look like shit, but you have defeated your purpose! Get ALL rust off of the steel.
Gun bluing is rust. If you have an old beater with orange rust that you want to minimize the spreading, bluing over orange rust is fine. It won't look as great as a professional job, but it will look better than it did and you've converted the cancerous rust to stable rust. Ideally, yes, you'll want to take it down to the bare white and remove any orange rust, but saying NEVER in all caps implies that this is some fatal error that will ruin your gunmetal, which is absurd.
@@RockandrollNegro Gun bluing is a TYPE of rust, but it is far different from oxidative rust, or "orange" rust as you refer to it as. Oxidative rust will eat up steel eventually. GET IT OFF. Simply applying bluing over oxidative rust without first removing it is either ignorant or lazy. Gee, imagine that.
Hello Iraqveteran8888. Nice channel, very informative!! Question: Do you know if there is a good video about Hot Bluing? Like from the factory. I’m trying to find a video of that in here but there is none (good video). It would be nice to watch in details how Colt or S&W blue their revolvers for example. Anyway, just a suggestion.
Great vid Iraq vet! I am thinking of trying this on my blued guns when they need it. One thing though i can tell you are in one of the Free states (Texas I'm guesing?" and not California-the window view where peopel outside can see in. If i tried that Here in In California some obama-voting passerby would see the "evil guns" through your window, scream like a woman in terror and drop a dime in 5 minutes and the swat team would be at your place in ten. I wish i were exaggerating too..
I would have removed the action from the stock because unless that metal to wood fit was so tight as to not allow that bluing to run down under the action (and I doubt that it was, even glass bedded actions aren't that tight) then when someone finally takes that stock off there is going to be a considerable rust spot waiting for them where you couldn't wipe it off. They are gonna have you to thank for that. Good video otherwise.
i would pull the stock off that gun to get any bluing that leaked down between the barrel and stock and puddled up beneath the stock , potentially causing a streaky clumpy wad or eventual rust pocket
You might want to say a few words about gun values before describing refinishing projects. A worn finish on your old deer rifle will diminish it's value. But, on a rifle like the Finn M1891, finish wear is not nearly so damaging to it's value. these are witnesses to history and were hard used. The people most attracted to such weapons are collectors who, for the most part, value "original condition" above all else. Your Fin M91 may bring $350-$400+ depending on condition- ORIGINAL condition. A refinished (Finn) M91 may look more pleasing to your eyes but, put on Gun Broker will most likely only bring around $300 or less. That is a substantial hit that once done can never be corrected. And in a Finn M91, we are talking about a fairly common weapon. Many others are considerably more valuable... in original condition. A Finn Mosin-Nagant inn the M28 series would have an original value in excess of $500 but refinished, the value would be no better than the refinished M91. All the above applies equally well to the wood finishes too only, the lines are more blurred. The bottom line is that, once refinished, your gun's value is established the same as any other "used gun" and in original military configuration would have even less value than many older sporting arms. Know what you have and think well on it before refinishing.
awesome. you were talking about different products for a complete refinish with cold bluing - can you give me an example of one? I'm working on refinishing my grandfather rifle as a hobby. Thanks!
Hi, can you please tell me if you know where I can purchase this in the UK as Brownells do not ship to the uk, maybe you could find out on my behalf as to if there is any other way they could ship to me other than air, which they will not do. Many thanks in advance Ray
Standard Oxpho is also used in the Marine/ boating industry as a painting preparation for metal. You might check boat supply stores, be sure to test it on NON gun metal first to see if gives the desired finish first. Its Cheap $ 12.00 per liter.
Hi Roha, you should be able to get this on e-bay, I tried to get some Oxpho blue as well, but they don't ship to the UK. click on this link, it will take you straight to it.www.ebay.co.uk/itm/160316902512?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
so is the metal prep close to the same as the birchwood casey stuff? you said you dont have to be as detailed with this metal prepping, so what do you still need to do with this stuff?
you know you should take the action and barrel out of the stock right? you never put something like a bluing solution on a gun when the wood is so close to the metal. what will happen is the solution will be sucked under the wood by capillary action between the wood and the barrel. since bluing is a form of oxidation, that solution will soak into the wood and pit the crap out of that barrel.
Do you have any problems with the bluing solution rusting afterwards when you go strait to oiling from bluing? I find unless I boil the reblued parts they'll rust the very second oil thins on the surface.
Generally, creams are developed for states like California and Hawaii that don't allow liquid volatiles to be shipped to. They're almost always inferior to the liquid form. Multiply all the work you have to do with the liquid times six or seven, and that's what the paste or cream will accomplish. Birchwood Casey Permablue paste is absolutely useless; it shouldn't even be sold.
@Iraqveteran8888 That would be cool im also interested in slow rust bluing the old fashioned way which is apparently much better than any of the more modern types.... only problem is it takes much longer! (gofigure haha) i have an old gunsmithing book that has a few bluing recipes which il share when i find it
would this stuff work well to touch up scratches on an ar15 receiver right? (already blued aluminum). and i would guess using steel wool is out of the question b/c itd scratch it?
The easiest way to spot an amateur blue job, is to look at the surrounding wood. Most don't remove the barrel and receiver from the stock, and you can see bluing on the wood. Don't be lazy, take the time to remove the stock. Your bluing job will come out looking 110% better.
Wiping the excess off the wood with the glove, made my eye twitch.
Good job on this series! Not too many people cold blue similar to your method. When I am refinishing an entire "unit", especially on larger parts.... I like the part a bit warmer, either sit it on an electric stove burner, low temp in oven, or even with a "plumbers" propane torch. But only a couple hundred degrees, not super hot. However, the heat gun is a good idea too, thats one I hadn't thought of even though I have one and use it all the time for other projects, might have to give it a try :-)
And yes, most people are like *_"but this is cold bluing, why are you heating it?"_*
*Two Reasons:* First, it basically "opens the pores" of the steel and makes the piece accept a much more durable bluing. And Two it also helps to evaporate any water out of the metal. Most people who don't work with metal don't realize that a seemingly "dry" piece of steel usually will have water in/on its surface. An easy way to see this is to take a piece of "dry" flat steel, then put a torch to it, you will quickly see the area the heat is being applied to dry out as the water evaporates.
After I get the part good and warm, I apply several coats of the Brownells Oxpho-Blue LIQUID first, I do wipe down between coats, personal preference. After wiping off excess blueing, I rewarm a bit between coats if the piece begins to get cold. Then I use the Brownells Oxpho-Blue CREAM as a final coat. It seems to level out everything really nice, and give a deeper richer finish.
And its better to just pour a small amount of oxpho-blue into a seperate container to avoid any contamination issues either with what you are bluing, OR with what you are applying the blueing with. As I've seen some guys who was using new "clean" applicators (cloths, paper towels, steel wool, etc) and it turned out the applicator wasn't as clean as it should have been. So if that ends up being an issue, at least you only lose what blueing you placed into the separate container (which if any is left over, you're going to toss anyway), and not the entire bottle. And you can always clean the piece and reblue if there is a contamination issue. Just my 2 cents :-)
I just did my 10/22 barrel with this stuff. Less than an hour prep and probably another 30 minutes to a perfect finish. Started with 600 grit sandpaper then 0000 steel wool, then a wipe down with alcohol, heat with hair dryer, followed with oxpho blue. Wiped on with gauze pads held in a leatherman pliers. The trick is to steel wool between coats for the first few applications. Then follow up by continuous application (as soon as it turns dry wipe it again) change pads frequently, and use a separate container to dunk your pads in, a little goes a long way. I did my barrel, bolt handle and my .44 blackpowder pistol barrel in one sitting wit a little less than 1 ounce. Once dry and wiped down with a clean slightly tough cloth (I used a new wash cloth), you can rub gun oil right into the finish. Came out sharp, deep, and probably nicer than factory.
I put in several coats as you suggested before rubbing down with steel wool. I had a lot of dark, spotty buildup spots. I stripped it and started over. One coat, steel wool, wash, and repeat. I did my whole rifle and it looks better than most factory finishes.
I often use Oxpho Blue in a multi-step process where I "steam" or humidify the parts after application. This helps in a dry climate like Colorado. The steaming step really helps the acids of Oxpho Blue to bite into the steel better. I buff with a carding wheel (soft soft wire brush wheel), and then do this 3-4 more times. This is similar to what I saw in a Midway video, but it's simpler and goes beyond just "touch-up" and really produces a quality primary bluing for new parts. Want more bluing? Do more steps, or steam them more (without condensation). Oxpho Blue is a good acid recipe. It's up to the user to get out of it what you want. I would say that Brownells under-sells this product. Do your research in procedures, and you can get top-notch professional results using OB.
I would recommend Formula 44/40 for dry climates over Oxpho Blue. No need to steam using 44/40.
These is, in my opinion, your best type of videos. I love this type of thing! Great work man!
I have to say that I'm kinda surprised that you didn't take the time to mask off the stock to keep from getting the Oxpho on it. The stock looks like it suffered quite a bit. Painter's tape is easy to use.
Thanks for the videos. I just finished a Remington 870 shotgun. When I started there was more rusted area than clear surface of steel. I only recommend that people take their time in sanding your steel. It took 4 coats to get it looking good. I did 7 treatments to get it looking like new. JUST DO AS IRAQVETERAN SAYS. Gloves, Heat, Clean Steel. etc. Thanks for your videos. rix34
One of the best cold bluing videos I have seen so far. Thanks, you explained in detail many of the questions I was seeking answers to. I'm using the same Brownells bluing but it's a cream base to try and re-blue my very first rifle that has seen much better days. Thanks again and for your service.
Bluing starts @ 04:09
Just a quick hint with Oxpho... Using a hair dryer or heat gun to heat up the metal before application helps tremendously. Gives you a darker richer blue. Don't get the metal too hot. you don't want the oxpho to evaporate immediately or you will get blotching.
Thanks for the tip. Does using heat make cold-bluing any more durable?
It will not make the finish more durable. Only easier to apply and richer looking. If you are looking for durable the best is Pilkington rust blue. It is very labor intensive, slow, but gives a superior finish that is arguably more durable than hot blue.
Thanks for the tutorial on cold blue touch up. Excellent. I will be trying this product ASAP. You are a guru!
Re: cross contamination of Oxpho blue....I pour only what I intend to use into a PLASTIC 3-4 in. lid, and dip only into that, more can be added if required to complete the project, if in the end You have some left over pour it out, NEVER return it to the original container....I did many rebluing projects over a 20+ year timeframe out of the same 1/2 qt. bottle of Oxpho Blue....a great product....
NEVER apply bluing over rust. I don't care what the label says, you NEVER want to apply bluing over existing rust. Not only will it look like shit, but you have defeated your purpose! Get ALL rust off of the steel.
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Gun bluing is rust. If you have an old beater with orange rust that you want to minimize the spreading, bluing over orange rust is fine. It won't look as great as a professional job, but it will look better than it did and you've converted the cancerous rust to stable rust. Ideally, yes, you'll want to take it down to the bare white and remove any orange rust, but saying NEVER in all caps implies that this is some fatal error that will ruin your gunmetal, which is absurd.
@@RockandrollNegro Gun bluing is a TYPE of rust, but it is far different from oxidative rust, or "orange" rust as you refer to it as. Oxidative rust will eat up steel eventually. GET IT OFF. Simply applying bluing over oxidative rust without first removing it is either ignorant or lazy. Gee, imagine that.
Looks fantastic! I've got an old Mossberg 195KA that needs to be touched up in a few spots, and this might be the ticket!
What about the bluing that got trapped between the barrel and the stock?
Gonna rust, if it hasn't been neutralized
Removing the bolt and the stock would be a good idea for this "touch-up" job.
Thx RaqVet ~ Good Tutorial! Getting ready to do a 1924 Lefever Nitro Spl. Was my father-in laws. Giving it a good going over :>)
Good stuff. When you're finished, let it cure in oil a few days, degrease thoroughly and apply EEZOX for rust prevention. Works wonders!
Hello Iraqveteran8888. Nice channel, very informative!! Question: Do you know if there is a good video about Hot Bluing? Like from the factory. I’m trying to find a video of that in here but there is none (good video). It would be nice to watch in details how Colt or S&W blue their revolvers for example. Anyway, just a suggestion.
Crown Royal bag in the background! CHEERS!
is oxpho-blue just blackening (eye candy) or is it also kind of a surface/rust protection?
Great vid Iraq vet! I am thinking of trying this on my blued guns when they need it. One thing though i can tell you are in one of the Free states (Texas I'm guesing?" and not California-the window view where peopel outside can see in. If i tried that Here in In California some obama-voting passerby would see the "evil guns" through your window, scream like a woman in terror and drop a dime in 5 minutes and the swat team would be at your place in ten. I wish i were exaggerating too..
I would have removed the action from the stock because unless that metal to wood fit was so tight as to not allow that bluing to run down under the action (and I doubt that it was, even glass bedded actions aren't that tight) then when someone finally takes that stock off there is going to be a considerable rust spot waiting for them where you couldn't wipe it off. They are gonna have you to thank for that. Good video otherwise.
i would pull the stock off that gun to get any bluing that leaked down between the barrel and stock and puddled up beneath the stock , potentially causing a streaky clumpy wad or eventual rust pocket
Great vid IV8888, im gonna touch up the rails on my wasr10 after i smooth the rough edges out of it to prevent rusting. thanks
You have inspired me again my friend! I had no idea it was THAT easy!
Looks like new Eric, what originally took away some of that blueing was gasoline when I was cleaning the cosmo out of it.
i gotta ask, isnt re-serializing a firearm illegal? there are remnants of an old stippled serial.
non ya It was probably done by the importer. They have to do it even if there is already an existing serial number on the gun.
another great vid eric.
You might want to say a few words about gun values before describing refinishing projects. A worn finish on your old deer rifle will diminish it's value. But, on a rifle like the Finn M1891, finish wear is not nearly so damaging to it's value. these are witnesses to history and were hard used. The people most attracted to such weapons are collectors who, for the most part, value "original condition" above all else. Your Fin M91 may bring $350-$400+ depending on condition- ORIGINAL condition. A refinished (Finn) M91 may look more pleasing to your eyes but, put on Gun Broker will most likely only bring around $300 or less. That is a substantial hit that once done can never be corrected. And in a Finn M91, we are talking about a fairly common weapon. Many others are considerably more valuable... in original condition. A Finn Mosin-Nagant inn the M28 series would have an original value in excess of $500 but refinished, the value would be no better than the refinished M91. All the above applies equally well to the wood finishes too only, the lines are more blurred. The bottom line is that, once refinished, your gun's value is established the same as any other "used gun" and in original military configuration would have even less value than many older sporting arms.
Know what you have and think well on it before refinishing.
Thanks IV8888. I have a few surplus rifles where I can use it!
Another great vid. Im going to try it on a couple of spots on my old mossberg 500.
Good job, very professional.
awesome. you were talking about different products for a complete refinish with cold bluing - can you give me an example of one? I'm working on refinishing my grandfather rifle as a hobby. Thanks!
i normaly use perma blue . this product is new to me seems to work wonders though noce job
Real nice, but I couldn't see a high res 480 or 720 option. It's good to be able to up the video quality to better see the details or your work.
Cold bluing does not provide much rust protection. How do you take care of the barrel after the bluing to prevent rust?
do you have to rub the alcohol over the part youn just blued and wiped off before you go over it again
Hi, can you please tell me if you know where I can purchase this in the UK as Brownells do not ship to the uk, maybe you could find out on my behalf as to if there is any other way they could ship to me other than air, which they will not do.
Many thanks in advance
Ray
Standard Oxpho is also used in the Marine/ boating industry as a painting preparation for metal. You might check boat supply stores, be sure to test it on NON gun metal first to see if gives the desired finish first. Its Cheap $ 12.00 per liter.
Hi Roha, you should be able to get this on e-bay, I tried to get some Oxpho blue as well, but they don't ship to the UK. click on this link, it will take you straight to it.www.ebay.co.uk/itm/160316902512?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
Is "bluing" the same as black? My vp9 isn't exactly blue..
where can you get that stuff in canada cause brownells doesnt ship it here
so is the metal prep close to the same as the birchwood casey stuff? you said you dont have to be as detailed with this metal prepping, so what do you still need to do with this stuff?
great video!
Could you use different oil? Anyone got any idea what kind of oil is a good idea? Looking for suggestions...
Can you use brake cleaner to remove oils before bluing ??
it kind of looked like it flowed to the bare area. thanks for posting
you know you should take the action and barrel out of the stock right? you never put something like a bluing solution on a gun when the wood is so close to the metal. what will happen is the solution will be sucked under the wood by capillary action between the wood and the barrel. since bluing is a form of oxidation, that solution will soak into the wood and pit the crap out of that barrel.
Looks like someone was trying to modify the aerial number at 1 point or another
well damn... 👍👍👍👍great vid
Do you have any problems with the bluing solution rusting afterwards when you go strait to oiling from bluing?
I find unless I boil the reblued parts they'll rust the very second oil thins on the surface.
Does any one prefer the Brownells oxpha blue "creme" product over the original?? amazon' s listing both products.
Generally, creams are developed for states like California and Hawaii that don't allow liquid volatiles to be shipped to. They're almost always inferior to the liquid form. Multiply all the work you have to do with the liquid times six or seven, and that's what the paste or cream will accomplish. Birchwood Casey Permablue paste is absolutely useless; it shouldn't even be sold.
which bluing is the best?
does it matter what oil you have?
have you done any browning on guns?
Were do you buy that?
@Iraqveteran8888 That would be cool im also interested in slow rust bluing the old fashioned way which is apparently much better than any of the more modern types.... only problem is it takes much longer! (gofigure haha) i have an old gunsmithing book that has a few bluing recipes which il share when i find it
someones definately done the dodge on the serial number
how deep does this go?
would this stuff work well to touch up scratches on an ar15 receiver right? (already blued aluminum). and i would guess using steel wool is out of the question b/c itd scratch it?
JSwanny1030 that’s not blue lol it’s anodizing. This will not work
Sell it to the UK and Europe then if you think it passes muster!
excellent video! i love the milsurp restoring vids
hahaa, and i like the crown royal bottle covers.
will this work with Stainless steel?
No.
@duemamay Van's cold blue
@MrFederalistPapers keep it oiled.
Can I use rem oil
yes most gunsmiths use Rem oil to wipe down the area after bluing
Birtchwood casy products suck comparatively.
: )
Van's Instant blue is just as good but cheaper. vansgunblue com
Dude ! You talk way too much. Less talk more action......painful
Looks fantastic! I've got an old Mossberg 195KA that needs to be touched up in a few spots, and this might be the ticket!