I feel like an easy way to explain this is with this comparison: If you are told to think of a marker and your brain immediately thinks of Crayola markers, all of the other marker brands are still markers.
@@FanOfLightning95 It was made by Rippa, a black guy. It's malicious, not racist. They kinda did it to themselves by giving the black Spider-man a black suit.
The funny thing is that people have no problem with Spider-Woman versions. There are like 7 different Spider-Woman (Jessica Drew, Julia Carpenter, Mattie Franklin, Gwen Stacy, May Parker etc) and people seem to have no problems with it. But when it comes to Spider-Man, suddenly people get mad. There are a lot of Spider-Man in the comic (Peter Parker, Miguel O Hara, Miles Morales, Takuya Yamashiro etc) but people only have a problem with Miles. Im not even counting the different version of Peter Parker. Which version of Peter is the "real" Spider-Man? My fav version is Peter from Earth 18119, but does he count as Spider-Man? He's not 616 Peter who people count as the only Spider-Man.
@@amazingpsm In my headcanon, One More Day is just simply a nightmare that Peter had and Peter, MJ and Annie live happily together. Im so excited that Spider-Verse 2 included Spinneret and Spiderling in the trailer.
I really respect you for trying to keep this civil. It seems like nowadays if content creators even slightly disagree it turns into a screaming match between the creators and the community. But on the topic of this video. I used to think that people didn’t consider Miles to be Spider-Man because he was black. And the only reason he was even created was to be a token character. Now that I’m older I realize it’s just because people don’t like change simple enough. People believe that Miles would replace Peter as the definitive Spider-Man. But that’s not the case. Peter is Spider-Man. Miles is Spider-Man. Anyone can wear the mask. Spider verse was literally about this concept.
yeah, that’s the point. stan lee said it himself. "What I like about the costume is that anybody reading Spider-Man in any part of the world can imagine that they themselves are under the costume. And that’s a good thing." Anyone can wear the mask and take up the mantle. While peter was the first, spider-man is the concept of a hero who’s connected to grounded reality, especially the reality of being a teen and coping with life. Miles is spider-man, so is peter. they and all the others still embody the true concept of spider-man that make the character such an icon.
The truth is that while I do really like Miles, Peter will always be my favorite. But I am happy that these Spider-Verse movies get to be his stories. So even though nothing can ever truly replace Peter, there are valid reasons to keep Miles as Spider-Man. He’s his own hero that that does things his own way while living up to the legacy that comes from his original Spider-Man, his family, and even his multiverse spider hero friends. So yeah, there can be more than one.
@@theverminator4219 "Easy for normie to digest" Lmao Spider-Man comic has been bad this couple of years. It sold well, but the essense of Peter Parker is nowhere to be seen. Especially after Peter calling MJ as his sister. Renew Your Vows should be the main 616 universe seeing how bad the main 616 Spider-Man comic is
Comics wise, I agree. Wholeheartedly. Movies....... I ain't gonna lie me and my friend (enormous Spidey comics fan), agree that he's the best movie Spidey. Id argue second best is Peter B Parker. They're the most whole heartedly true to what the character is in my eyes. Hell I may even like Gwen more than Tom's, Tobey's or Andrew's as a character thanks to the last film...
@@theverminator4219 People care about the movies and games more because they actually portray him as a unique character. Why do you think as soon as Brian stopped writing the character the characters comic has been better received?
As someone who used to be on the other side of this argument, I just want to point out that anybody claiming “Wally West isn’t The Flash” would get laughed out of the room.
Wally West was The Flash after Barry died/ran into the speed force for a few decades. There's a difference. People would've accepted Miles sooner if they didn't destroy the Ultimate Universe. Having multiple Spiders in New York is weird. Having them spread out across the country (Scarlet Spider 1 and 2) or globe (Spider-Man UK) or even to different dimensions (Spider Gwen) makes sense. Both Spiders sharing the name Spider-Man while being in close quarters all the time is strange too. Spread out. Cover more ground. Stop hogging eachother's turf. New York already has a crap ton of heroes anyways.
Also, he seems to forget that the reason that Stan Lee had Spidey be covered from head to toe, was so we can all imagine being Spider-Man. Doesn't matter what is your race, gender, orientation, or beliefs. Also Spider-Verse summed it up perfectly in that: ANYBODY can wear the mask.
Yh but no one does it like the original. You can literally say this about almost ANY other superhero😂. This comments makes it sound like you're WATERING DOWN the idea of Spiderman and when you break down Peters original character...its literally that NO ONE ELSE could be him.
@@no.1spidey-fan182 you can’t say this about the Hulk, Thor, Silver Surfer, The Thing, Wonder Woman, Cyborg, or any superhero that show their body in their outfit. The purpose of his comment was to point out that the CREATOR of Spider-Man has always intended for the character specifically his costume to be a costume anyone could wear without worrying about looking like someone else. Peter’s purpose as Spider-Man is that when you picture yourself or someone else as Spider-Man, this is how they behave under the mask, someone who has great power but is greatly responsible with it.
@@manwithopinions12 literally every superhero has said at one point that "its not the suit, its the person inside". Or something along those lines. I have no idea why so called spiderman fans are so HELL BENT on ripping his identity away and acting like he's the ONLY hero that said something similar Stan Lee also spoke about how much POTENTIAL PETER PARKER as Spider-Man had and where his growth. Spiderman was practocally his som the way he spoke of him. Alsoas "relatable" as he is Spiderman is one of the most unique characters out there. Most people on this planet dont have his level of maturity given his situation and CANNOT do what he does. They would ceumble with even a QUARTER of the trauma and weight this man has on him, theres a reason in lore why Nick Fury and Literal GOD comment on his Will power in not becoming the BIGGEST VILLAIN KNOWN TO MAN after all the crap life put him through. Not just ANYbody can be Spider-Man cause most people ARE NOT Peter Parker🤷♂️. Not to mention I dont know may people who are Orphans AND raised by a single parent😂 And also there are MULTIPLE Hulks and Wonder Women😂. Thing and Silver Surfer don't appear human so as long as its a dude...ANY man can literallt take their place at least visually🤷♂️
I agree. There are clearly multiple Spider-People. But when we say Spider-Man, we’re obviously going to think of Peter Parker. He’s just too iconic. But that doesn’t mean Miles Morales isn’t Spider-Man. Anyone can wear the mask, you can wear the mask
Of course anyone can wear the mask but what Important is the skin colour, gender and disability. it's he black under that mask? It's she pregnant under that suit? It's he gay under that mask? It's her lower half of her body dead under the suit? SMH
He needs an addendum to his name like that again, 2099 is called spiderman but nobody raises a fuss cause he's really 2099 Spiderman. They place a distinction between them
He IS Ultimate Spider-Man. Or, well, Ultimate Spider-Man is Miles. The Ultimate comic run from Marvel had a whole Ultimate Spider-Man storyline following an alternate version of Peter Parker. When he died and Miles replaced him, Miles was Ultimate Spider-Man because he was the Spider-Man of the Ultimate universe. I think they switched away from this for a couple reasons; first, they didn’t want to give the impression that Miles is somehow “superior” to other Spider-Man characters. Second, and more pertinently, he is no longer associated exclusively with the Ultimate canon. There is a version of Miles in the mainline comics, a version in the game, and a version in Spider-Verse. These are alternate versions of Miles just like how there are different versions of Peter. Since only one is actually Ultimate Spider-Man, the label no longer fits other portrayals of him.
My theory is reason why most older people say "Miles Morales isn't Spider-Man" is because Peter Parker is original and more iconic and since Miles is the second most popular version of Spidey people reject Him due to bias because most hate change where as Reilly and O'hara are more easily excepted since they are less known where as someone like me who grew up in the early 2000s is more used to multiple popular versions of Spider-Man such as Miles before
@@ahobbyist9520 oh I’m aware, yellow flash too. My point is that sometimes it’s just people mad that a black character is the successor to a white one. Especially one as beloved and iconic as Peter.
I think what it ultimately comes down to (heh) is that we will always call him Miles Morales. Because you need to do that to let someone know who you mean. Peter is just too iconic and will probably always be what people first think of when they hear Spider-man. But the difference is Miles doesnt have an Iconic monicker and is akwardly called by his name. Same with Spider-Gwen. Im just not sure Ghost Spider stuck. And thats the problem. 2099s monicker kind of works in concert with the Spider-man name hence Spider-man 2099. Miles and Gwen dont.
By a technicality, Miles would be named as Ultimate Spider-Man since he took over after the Peter of that world died. But there could still be a different adjective to make him stand out better
Anyone can see themselves as Spider-Man, yes. But within the context of comics, unless Parker is dead and replaced, or it’s a different dimension so that Parker wasn’t ever Spidey in the first place, then he is the only one.
How can someone call themselves Spider-Man when Peter is still there? That's like claiming you're the president while there's still one, you're not and people will always think that unless you own that title only to yourself.
I usually call Miles “Ultimate Spider-Man” cause that’s the comic he came from, and I know Peter was originally spidey in the ultimate universe but he died young and miles has had the mantle for much longer, 1610 Peter is my fav version of Peter but I still call him the 1610 Peter Parker because the main Peter Parker is 616, and miles either by his name or ultimate Spider-Man
Miles even recently had his own version of a clone saga, which haters would call lazy but it was done way differently, which later got expanded to an alternate future where the clones one before the series got rebooted
It's wild that people will be SO against a thing existing because it's not specifically for them. I'm Afro-Latino just like Miles. Spidey was always my absolute favorite hero growing up and even before Miles I was able to put myself in the suit mentally just like Stan Lee wants us to. But when i first learned about Miles, it impacted me in a way i can never really articulate. This kid who grew up looking up to Spider-Man just like me, he had parents like mine, he spoke English and Spanish, he was MY Spider-Man. He was OUR Spider-Man. Nuestro gente. Miles Morales, tú eres el hombre arañe último.
Literally this right here. I grew up damn near in love with Peter and loved every show, game, and comics he's been in. And when Miles was released, to me he wasn't a carbon copy of Peter but black like Just Some Guy's video painted him out to be. I watched his video before this, and realized he was basically being disingenuous about other facts and just full blown going off his own feelings. I didn't see a tokenism Afro-Latino placed in for identity politics, I saw a genuine story of a kid who has to realize his own path, and his own worth as Spider-Man, just like in the Across the spider verse movie.
It's always so weird to me that rhody is one of the first black characters (at least to my knowledge) to replace a well known one and still got enough love to get their own identity with war machine (since rhody was ironman for a time when tony was having problems with alcohol) and nobody seems to care but miles gets this rejection from people to not accept the character or give him a chance
Rhodey was an previously established character, and him putting on a suit of armor to cover for Tony was a natural progression. He didn’t build his suit, he used a suit Tony built and forged his own identity as war machine. Iron man’s best friend and backup. His sidekick who reigned him in. He played a role that magnified both his and Tony’s character. Riri Williams on the other hand, had none of that and is just supposed to replace iron man. Likewise, Miles is also meant to be a replacement of his universe’s Spider-Man. Out with the old, in with the new. If Miles had been like Spider-Man’s Robin, helping him go through his own arc of growing up and becoming a mentor, moving away from his teenage superhero paradigm where he always works alone, I think people would have liked Miles a lot better. Because then Miles would be his own character that improves “Spider-Man” instead of just worse copy of what we already have.
That cause the internet wasn't a thing back then....and didn't get advenced enough to have social media platforms to spread toxicness than what you can in real life. In fact, if Rhodey was Iron Man today, even breifly like in the arc, I'd garunetee you they WILL be a pissed off hate mob screaming about the idea of a black man as Iron Man like it's still 2016.
He’s obviously a Spider-Man, but his comic had to be rebooted 4 times in the past 7 years because his sales are so low compared to Peter Parker’s comics
@@TrueUnderDawgGaming ... no, that's what being rebooted is. Being cancelled is when they don't make the comics anymore. You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about.
@@patrickdixon7202which was also canonically given permission to be passed on to miles. doesnt matter what your personal bias is if it's just not fact lol
Saying that Miles Morales isn’t Spider-Man is like saying Wally west isn’t the flash (for those that don’t know, Wally basically replaced Barry Allen as the new flash in the comics, just like the way that Miles replaced Peter as the new Spider-Man). They might not be the original but they’re almost like reincarnations of the original
I've never read a comic in my life so I really dont know anything about Wally west. Does Wally have the exact same powers as barry allen or does he have some abilities the barry doesnt?
@@angel7661 That's a great point. Wally was an established character way before he became The Flash. He took over the mantle of The Flash after he earned it for years. That's what a lot of people dislike about Miles Morales. Calling him Spider-Man without any good story of his own, no real personality makes him feel too shallow be called Spider-Man.
Wasn’t the Miles’ whole arc in both spider-verse and his insomniac game about him learning to become his own Spider-Man and to accept that he is also Spider-Man. The insomniac game literally has Ganke say “you keep saying Spider-Man when you mean the other guy, your Spider-Man.” How could it get more obvious that Miles is in fact Spider-Man.
People have a hard time accepting that Peter isn't the one and only anymore. Peter Parker will always be the original and my personal favorite, but I like Miles, at least in the movie and video games. As long as Peter is Spider-Man somewhere in some universe, there's no harm in having other characters take up the mantle. Miles is not the first and he certainly won't be the last.
Saying he's Spiderman, doesn't make him Spiderman. He's a fake, a poser, there's only one Spiderman. There are many spidermen, but only one Spiderman. You don't see Kane being called Spiderman, Ben being called Spiderman, 2099 being called Spiderman and so on, in fact Ben who was once under the thought he was Spiderman (*as he was a clone with the same exact memories ) Once he found out he was a clone, he realized he was in reality not Spiderman. Miles is just as much Spiderman as everyone else who is in fact not Spiderman, but a spider person. It's like calling Jane Thor, simply because marvel calls Jane Thor doesn't make her Thor as Thor is literally his name and not a title.
@@Elnegro.. bro Spider-Man is quite literally a title, Spider-Man is by definition not a single person. I understand that maybe it’s hard to comprehend but multiple characters using the same name as another at the same time isn’t new, you heard of Captain America? Wolverine? Spider-Woman? Miles is Spider-Man because that’s what his comic run is called, it’s the hero name he goes by, he’s referred to as Spider-Man in universe and also because he got bit by a radioactive Spider-Man. Also a big part of all the Spider-people I’m the multiverse is that all of them are explicitly all Spider-Men of their own universe. I can tell your kinda dumb so this might go over your head but there isn’t just one Spider-Man anymore and it doesn’t matter how many times you whine about it won’t change the fact that your wrong.
It doesn’t matter who you are, Miles, Gwen, Peter, or Miquel. These are people who were made to be their own spider man, or spider woman, it won’t Change the fact that these characters have great stories, and perspectives on being a spider man, or spider woman.
@@scamon4u Do you know why classic comic books didn't feature diverse characters? There is a body called the comics code authority (CCA) which had the purpose of filtering and censoring comics to be safe for young readers. The CCA would authorise comics that confirmed to the hegemonic Christian conservative views at the time. In other words they would unauthorise comics which featured women, POC, and LGBT in prevelant roles. They went out of their way to segregate these types of characters and their creators from mainstream comic books. This is the real reason why comics haven't been diverse historically.
@@MichaelMiller-wc6jl Having diverse characters means that modern comics creators want to tell stories which are more reflective of the world we live in TODAY. There's nothing wrong with that.
weirdly enough you don't see this with the flash, I believe it because enough of people grew up with the wally west flash in the 90s and jla cartoon to the point were people are conftorble agreeing both Barry and Wally are the flash, it also helps they wear the same costume. I think what makes Miles jaring is that he shares the same name but has a different costume so it doesn't really have the same synergy that the flash mantel has.
The issue with miles is that miles even to this day doesn't have a decent rogues gallery. Before spiderverse, he was just genius Peter parker but black. Uninspired. Nowhere close to as cool or good as spiderverse. He also never truly replaces spidey. That's because marvel has a weird fixation in keeping Peter in a regressive state of being of being everyone's punching bag.
“Miles morales is not spider-man, how do i know. Because you call him miles morales, not spider-man.” Joe biden is not the president, how do i know, because you call him joe biden, not mr. President.
Completely different. When someone says “the president” you assume he’s referring to the current one which is Biden whereas when you say “spiderman” almost nobody would think of miles first. This is a terrible example because Peter Parker has been spiderman since the 60s whereas a president at most is there for 8 years and “president of the United States” is literally a mantle but “spiderman” is Peter’s alias.
@@DirtyDev u analyzing this shit way to hard maybe it was a bad comparison but u still get the point he tryna say honestly i think u was just bored and wanted to argue about something ik this cause i do the same thing sometimes (used too anyways)
@@amazingpsmNgl I think Christopher Daniel Barnes is the best version of Miguel O’Hara and That Edge of time is underrated I would love if their was a reference to Edge of time in spider verse 2 and I love how your playing The Ultimate Spiderman game not many people mention it as much ❤ also he was a really good 90’s spider-man
I loved your explanation on everything but I would also like to add this classic line by Stan Lee about Miles growing into the suit. As much as I love Spider-Man as a character a ton of versions of Peter exist hell a lot of Spider-People exist! But when I watched Into the Spider-Verse the line Stan Lee gave after Peter's death was so iconic "It always fits- - -eventually" some of the struggles that Miles faced during the film was trying to be a copy of Peter in general and when he bought the costume from the shop his intentions wasn't to be himself but to be the hero Peter Parker of his earth had been. This is also very visible in a lot of scene's when he's talking to his uncle and trying to imitate his uncle. As for JSG I've seen a lot of his videos and disagreed with some of his view points they're not always valid because it's a surface level view point on certain characters such as Miles not being Spider-Man or he's Miles isn't Peter Parker but Peter Darker as comical as it might sound this seems like a much LARGER issue at hand when taking this kind of view point and putting it to other characters such as Madam Web or Cassandra Webb, 2099, Jessica Drew, Kaine, Otto, Anya, Julia, Ezekiel, and so many more characters that aren't peter but happen to be spider-people that people do not associate them as "checking a box" but as individual characters with complexity to the story they're in. If I generally said "I LOVE SPIDER-MAN and the SPIDER-UNIVERSE" it's taking the time to look at the different spider characters and having my likes and dislikes of those characters but understanding that Cindy Moon AKA Silk is liked by me not because she's Asian and a Spider-Variant but because Cindy is her own character with her own problems such as her social anxiety issues or her way of wanting to combat her social anxiety is by putting herself out in the world to make new friend's and this is coming from someone that has anxiety issues... So when listening to Just Some Guy it feels as if his only argument revolves over something as mediocre as Miles race and nothing more that he quickly gave up on the character without giving him a chance, which is sad...
I like the background music a lot :0, and I think this leads to another unique trait that I think exemplifies Miles as a Character: Music. Spiderverse has an amazing soundtrack and incorporates the unique sounds from different artists to the point where in the beginning of the movie he *listens* to the soundtrack, making him have a relatable and outstanding trait for the movie and the characters' iteration within it.
I'm a 40 year old dude who grew up with Peter Parker, but I enjoy Miles Morales as Spider Man much more since discovering him. I still like Peter, but there is something about Miles rhat really speaks to me. Into the Spiderverse is a master piece, and one of the movies that are very near and dear to my heart.
It's just frustrating. I think Miles as a character can fix alot of the problems modern Spider-man has with the constant push and pull between the comics wanting a "younger relatable Peter" and a vocal part of the fanbase wanting Peter to be "more mature". My biggest issue with the whole thing is the constant "moving of the goals". It's important to recognize how far Miles has come and that him being Spider-man is kind of an accepted part of Spidey Lore. But no matter how much he succeeds or fixes what they see wrong it'll never be enough for them. I am not saying people aren't allowed to hate certain Spiderman (lord knows how much I don't care Ben Reilly). But the way they go about it comes off as annoying and disingenuous. I'll admit as a someone who has always loved Ultimate Spider-man and the Ultimate universe I am kinda biased to towards Ultimate versions of characters and exclusive characters like Miles so I have an active interest in being happy that they succeed.
I heavily agree with this statement. I never read Ultimate Spider-Man, but I did get into Miles's run as the successor to Ultimate Peter's Legacy and I really loved it, despite the flaws it has.
Good observation but don't u see what's happening in the culture rn. they change and force characters for political reasons. Theres people tht defend these characters tht don't even read the books. Marvel has been taken over by the progressives and they care about their agendas more than they do characters. And then they attack the core fan base for not liking the new stuff...
The problem with Mike’s is that he’s just Peter 2.0. There’s nothing that defines him as a character other than inexperience and trying to live up to his hero. That’s not a character. Just like Pete, he’s awkward, smart, young, in a prestigious school and dealing with the responsibility of having superpowers. Only genuine difference is that he’s trying to measure up to someone and he lacks Pete’s conflict of a normal life with MJ/paying rent and being a superhero. He has potential to be much more but they only make him a shadow of Peter and that’s just sad.
@@squirrelthegamer8483 Miles character is very different then Peter. In the original series he is way more insecure about his powers and using them, imposter syndrome is important to his arc but not just as Spider-man it's also his insecurity about being at that school. His family dynamic is also very different which affects his views of the worlds and on top of his own supporting cast like Ganke and Judge etc. He has very different dynamics to Peter's remaining supporting cast and other heroes like the Ultimates. This also applies to when he comes to the main universe mostly. Only difference is it's less about legacy per say. Peter never went to a prestigious school(I guess ESU is but the context of Miles going to a special high school is way different). Also what do you mean he lacks struggle in his normal life. He struggles with all the basic Spider-man stuff, like romance, his secret identity, how he's perceived because of his Spider-man duties etc. I suggest reading more Miles content.
As huge Miles fan and a cosplayer too, I can agree that Movies and Video Games have really improved the character by giving him a personality and things that actually make him different than Peter Parker. It really is what makes him different than the original that makes him special
@@budgiecat9039 The problem isn’t Miles, it was the way he was introduced into the Marvel Universe that drove people insane. He had things around him that made him different but the early days of Miles were definitely him being a Peter Parker clone (personally wise) until ITSV.
@@kolby3636 At the end of the day he's just another one in the long line of pointless derivative characters that only exist riding the coattails of preexisting legacy characters. Its laziness in creation pure and simple. You want representation? Fine. Make an original character. Like Black Panther, Falcon, Storm, Luke Cage, Blue Marvel, Cloak, Dust, Thunderball, Shang Chi, etc The first official Spider-Man derivative; Spider-Woman, literally was only created because Funimation made a character called Spider Woman in 1977, so Marvel had to get their lawyers out and make them change it to Web Woman, then to prevent it from happenig again, created a Spider-Woman (Jessica Drew) whos was so far removed from Spider-Man she might as well been called "Web Woman" since completely different character, which was cool...but then they made Julia Carptenter 4 years later further diluting the brand...and now we got over 30 different Spider-people its past the point of ridiculousness. Miles however exists only because of Peter and only for social political propaganda reasons.
@@alaina4070 Not realy no. Unless you can convince me "wheelchair Spider-man/woman" whatever is selling off the charts. If it was so smart they'd have done it 40 yeas ago. Also, his comics arent even selling well which just further proves my point people pretend to like him; they only like the idea. Spider-verse animated movie was well made and appeal to mass audience but they coulda done the same thing with Peter in the lead hypothetically. The whole idea of 'you need to see your own raceethnicity in a fictional character in order to identify with' is a fallacy and only pushed by people with a political narrative/agenda. Because for decades people all over the world could identify with Peter because he is broke. Most people arent rich.
Peter Parker is known as just Spider-man because he is the original.. We usually call every other spider-man something else such as "Miles Morales", "Spider-Monkey", "Spider-Man Noir", "Old Man Spider", and so on.. This is so that people know who you are talking about, because if you just say Spider-man they will think of the red and blue Spidey.
What I don’t like is how Miles was created just for the BLM movement back in 2008 He wasn’t created cuz they had an idea… He was made because people wanted BLACK spider man. So that’s what the writers did. Killed Peter and made miles. I don’t like that personally. Miles should be his own. And miles shouldn’t be called spider man. That title belongs to Peter. The only proper way to reference miles is “The Ultimate Spider-Man.” Just like we refer to Miguel O hara as Spider Man 2099
I never see this argument applied to other legacy characters like, say, Robin. People just accept that Dick Greyson is Robin and so is Jason Todd, Tim Drake, Damien Wayne, etc. I wonder what the difference is. I wonder why a certain sect of fans want to cut Miles out and deny him the title of Spider-Man 🤔
My official terminology for addressing Miles Morales is still "Ultimate Spider-man," because that's the universe and comic title he came from, and there's nothing going on with Ultimate Peter Parker.
Exactly. Ultimate Peter Parker was even brought back after Secret wars, but now I haven't seen anything done with him since then. So Miles is The Ultimate Spider-Man.
@Sharavy If Miles wasn't the definitive Spider-man of his own universe, Marvel wouldn't have brought him into the main continuity, continued to write stories for him, and abandoned Ultimate Peter entirely, despite his resurrection.
I do agree with some of the points made on the other side of this discussion, but I agree with a lot of what you’ve said also. Good on you for trying to maintain civility in the conversation, not enough of that going around. Great video
LOL he's not trying to maintain civility, he just doesn't want this video to get back to the people who tried to lambast because he knows if he did it'd get his video ratioed.
@@parkeranimations3671 Nope, just some dude in a brand x Spydor-Man costume. Dude needs to go out & get his own identity, because Marvel is never going to kill off Peter Parker, which means Miles is always going to be the king of Peter Parkers sloppy seconds, always be the guy whose not going to be Spider-Man.
@@matthewlane you have no logic. So what if Peter is still alive? Ben Riley and Miguel O Hara both Spider-Man yet Peter is still alive. Are they not Spider-Man then? Can no one be Spider-Man? Only Peter can? Shut your ass up. You don’t get to decide. Marvel does. Miles became Spider-Man so he is Spider-Man. Even Peter himself in multiple adaptations calls him Spider-Man, especially in the comics. 🤷🏾♂️
@@parkeranimations3671 "So what if Peter is still alive?" While Peter is still alive, Miles can't be Spider-Man.... that's why they call him Miles Morales & not Spider-Man. "Ben Riley and Miguel O Hara both Spider-Man yet Peter is still alive." Nope. Neither of them are Spider-Man. O'Hara is Spider-Man 2099 & Ben Rielly is The Scarlet Spider. Neither of them are Spider-Man. In fact Ben's entire identitiy is wrapped up in NOT being Spider-Man or Peter Parker, no matter how hard he tries. But i understand you didn't know that given you didn't read the books in question. "You don’t get to decide. Marvel does." MArvel aready decided. See Miles is a character who exists to be the next Spider-Man but for that to happen they would have to get rid of the original, permanently.... But Marvel is never going to do that, so Miles can never be Spider-Man, he's stuck hanging around waiting for his turn to be Spider-Man. He can never progress as a character in his own right, because the second he does, he's no longer the guy whose next to be spider-man & he just becomes "that guy whose his own character & will succeed or fail based on the quality of the writign of the book he's in that's not called Spider-Man." And so Miles is perpetually stuck being the king of Peter Parkers sloppy seconds.... Constantly stuck in the shadow of a much better character. Time for Marvel to pull a Nightwing on Miles & make him his own character.
People really dont think he is spider-man I thought it was a joke???? HE HAS THE POWERS, THE SUIT, THE RESPOSIBILITY HOW MUCH MORE SPIDER-MAN CAN HE GET?
yes Shure you can have the bun, cheese, lettuce and ketchup. but you just have a bland sandwich, Peter is the meat that makes it a burger. Miles is hotdog, yes Shure there both meat, bred and condiments. and both can be enjoyed equally, but they can never be the same and peter will always be the bigger more fulfilling meal.
Thank you for making this video, the arguments over this were getting tiring to see... People kept missing the point, no he's not THE (original) Spider-Man, but he is A Spider-Man, just like any other variant like 2099 or even more-so in his case. You made a great point about the naming, especially with your Peter B. Parker example, just because he's referred to his name to distinguish from others doesn't make him not Spider-Man.
And that’s the thing. He is the best ALTERNATE Spider-Man. No matter how hard Marvel or fans try to convince you Miles will never be THE Spider-Man and especially when Peter is around with him. I’m sorry but whenever Peter and Miles are together, Miles is just a sidekick. This is why he really works better in his own universe because in it he truly is Spider-Man. But as long as he is with Peter he will never be Spider-Man to me plus naming two superheroes with the same name in the same area is convoluted.
I watched both vids and I can say this was a really REALLY solid follow-up to their video. I understand the feeling that a character feels the need to be referred to as the TRUE version of the character but to be honest... Spider-Man was appealing to me as a character bc due to them being completely covered unlike most other heroes, it helped me attach to the character more. And the countless other versions of him, be it Miguel, Ben, Miles, and others, I saw em as different people taking on the mantle of being Spider-Man and doing it in their own way, which I love greatly
I love miles. I do think he is the best alternate form of Spider-Man, other than Peter but I didn’t love him until around 2018 I think his character made it giant leap in progress separating himself from Peter in the last couple years.
I still think it’s weird to have Superhero identities be mantles that can be passed down or shared. I’m used to always calling superheroes by their superhero names, when there’s multiple heroes with the same hero name I have to specify which version I’m talking about. I found this annoying even with Robin in Batman comics. There’s so many Robins now, I have to specify which one. One of the Robins even became Batman for a short time, it’s ridiculous.
My man you are speaking about things that happened 30 years ago like they are recent. Superheroes being mantles is older than Spider-Man as a character even. Ever heard of the characters the Flash, Green Lantern? Barry Allen and Hal Jordan are not the first Flash and Green Lantern, even though they are the most well known, they are both the second with the title, getting it in the 50s, you know, a decade before Spider-Man was created. That you were not aware of something when you were an infant does not mean it hasn't always been the case.
@@spectacleHD I mean, I know, I’m just saying I wish it were simpler. Of course, it can be forgiven with Green Lantern considering Green Lantern is a team in itself rather than an identity created by and for one guy then later used by more guys. Also I’m pretty sure the second versions of both the Flash and Green Lantern were straight up retcon reboots that pretended the originals never happened.
@@pjdougherty6442 Well, Green Lantern began as a mantle used for one guy. You are right about the last part, but only for a few issues, it was established pretty quickly that Barry Allen was the Flash of an alternate universe, IE, basically the same thing as Miles Morales started out being. Now, both Jay Garrick and Barry are in the same universe, so it is basically the same situation.
Also the first costumed crimefighter ever seen in comics was the Phantom, whose entire character is based around the idea of a legacy mantle, if you want me to go back even more.
Exactly, when two spiders have the same name nobody says anything (this happens more often with the Spider-Woman name) but when is about Miles Morales they cry hard
As a long time fan of miles, thanks for this, I don't know where this entire argument of miles being Peter lite came from but it is ridiculous, I don't remember Peter having a burglar uncle or constantly trying to live up to a mantle and prove himself. Its so obvious that they've never read Miles either
My theory is that its people who watched Godzilla Mendoza's "Into the Spider-Verse - The Problem With Miles" video and didn't pay attention or watch his other vids about miles so they left with the wrong message. They left thinking "miles is just a race swapped peter" instead of "miles' character was a tad underdeveloped before into the spider-verse and deserved more."
@@scifiguy9000 Exactly. Miles still has family that he can return home to after Spider-Manning or something, whereas Peter has basically no one except his Aunt May.
I believe a good way to explain this is by using Robin from DC Comics. There are multiple characters that held the title - Dick Grayson, Jason Todd, Tim Drake, etc. However, we never thought about why there are multiple Robins. The reason why is because Robin was leading the Teen Titans and they wanted Batman to still have a sidekick, so they created Jason Todd. Unfortunately, he was absolutely hated, and when he was infamously brutalized, the audience had the choice to save or kill him; and we all know what happened after that. After all of that, they still wanted Batman to have a sidekick by giving him Tim Drake. This devolved into making it a tradition to create a new sidekick for the Bat Family. Now, the reason why I am telling you this is because this exact thing is happening with Spider-Man. Peter dies in the Ultimate comics and Miles becomes his successor. He was later brought to the main universe by the Secret Wars event. Then there is Spider-Gwen, a character originally created for a variant cover of a comic that was beloved. She got her own universe and apparently jumps into Earth-616 to hang out with the other Spider-Mans. The point is that New York will be filled with a Spider-Family like Gotham’s Bat Family in a couple decades., the way it’s heading.
@@nighthero_gaming9021 That is true as far as I know. However, there are multiple spin offs that feature multiple Robins, like Batman: Wayne Family Adventures. Also, DC comics also have multiple Green Lanterns at the same time; with Hal Jordan and John Stewart being two iconic examples. Finally, I didn’t think I need to mention this, but the Spider-Verse comics made everyone use to the concept of multiple Spider-Mans.
@@Gabriel-doodle Meanwhile the two spidermen are sharing the EXACT SAME city WITH THE EXACT SAME SUPER HERO NAME. - it's odd. Also, with the green lanterns... Don't they ever really focus on the one? I dunno I don't care about DC much other than BatMan tbh. Most people are going to be confused about the same name thing. Just how it'll be. And just cause a comic does something in the past doesn't mean it was a good decision. Anyway I digress. Think what you want guys.
Whether or not Miles is Spider-Man isn't really up for debate. Whether or not he's a good Spider-Man or should be Spider-Man is however. Personally I think he's an ok character but he'll never be a particularly good character unless he can get out of Peter's shadow. Permanently getting rid of Peter either by killing him or having him retire simply isn't a option (Because it would make fans of Peter hate Miles), so the best thing to do for Miles would be to give him his own completely original identity. If Miles's main character trait is being individual and creative than why would he in universes where he and Peter coexist not have his own name and look that aren't based on another hero? In the Ultimate Universe and Spider-Verse he's Spider-Man to honor the original Spider-Man which makes perfect sense. But in 616 and the games it just feels like he didn't want to come up with own his thing so he just put on a recolored Spidey suit called himself Spider-Man and called it a day.
Honestly my biggest issue with Miles Morales Spider-Man is that he doesn't have enough stories that are just about him. His uncle being a villain that he has to fight is pretty much the best I've seen from him aside from that almost everything I remember about him is some slightly different take or Peter Parker stories. Including his recent clone saga.
@@-Teague- I don't remember him losing his mom though that probably happened before Secret Wars so he probably got his mother back. I will tell you this his dating Gwen Stacy is a what-if Peter Parker and Gwen Stacy's relationship worked out because they both had spider powers or at least that when it looks like to me
@@eliandervalderen5849 yeah she's back now post secret wars but it was a pretty big deal at the time. Spider-gwen and miles have very different personalities from OG Peter and Gwen so idk if it's a full on what if but I see what you mean
i think his story is that the fact that he is, ultimately, not unique in his experience / having similar stories to be the story itself. it’s an exploration on how he can confront that and still retain the sense of self and grapple with it. i think what drew me to miles’ story was the existential horror of it all, how can he break apart from this mould how he can use his experience of knowing what might happen / how his life could play out to break free . how he can hold tight to his sense of self . in part his story is interesting because of the butterfly effect that the characters in his story like his uncle play the same roles but how do their differences to what we know change how the story may play out or do these different personalities have no effect on the ending, is everything pre determined etc. sorry if this doesn’t make sense ckkskfowo
I very much so didn't like miles in the original ultimate comics. However the newer versions of the character aka spiderverse and ps4 have made me fall in love with miles spider-man. He's among my top 5 spider-men only beat out by Peter, Miguel, and Ben. And frankly I'd take him over recent ben
Yeah I sort of treat those as my reintroduction to miles morales since I never really got attached to the character and into the spider verse and ps4 he’s awesome
Yeah comics Miles was pretty shit tier, he has gotten way better at least in other media, the ultimate spiderman cartoon show, into the spiderverse and ps4 have done leaps and bounds for him
@@valeria262I thought his storyline in the Ultimate Spider-Man comics were great. Miles vs Prowler Miles vs Venom Peter returns Spider-Man no more And recently at the time I'm writing this, Miles gets a sword (I don't know the title of the comic.)
It's also worth noting that refering to legacy characters by their names isn't limited to Spider-Man, like, when you talking to someone about Robin you pretty much always refer to them as "Damian Wayne Robin" or, "Jason Todd Robin" or when you're talking about the flash you always say "Barry Allen Flash" or "Wally West Flash" but you don't see anyone saying that any of those characters "aren't the real Robin" or "not the real Flash" so why would it be any different with Spider-Man?
The difference is that in those cases you mentioned (except for Wall and Barry both wearing the name Flash in DC Rebirth, which is just as stupid as having two Spider-Men in the same universe) the mantle was inherited and there weren't multiple characters wearing the same monicker. Every Robin didn't become the next one until the previous one stopped wearing the mantle and when Damian became Robin Tim Drake became Red Robin, same goes for all the other cases you mentioned. Miles wearing the name Spider-Man made sense when he was created and replaced Peter who died in the Ultimate continuity (same goes the Spiderverse movie continuity), but then when Miles came over to 616 it became stupid, just as it is stupid in the Insomniac games.
Miles deserves so much better instead permanently stuck in Peter Parker's shadow and needs, no must get his own identity to survive because at the end of the day when people think Spiderman it's Peter Parker, not Miles Morales and that will never change
The fundamental problem is that people see Spider-Man as a mantle like Black Panther. That's simply not accurate. Black Panther was a title passed down in the royal line in Wakanda. Where Spider-Man is a character and not a mantle of any kind. Marvel and DC as well have tried making some of their characters "mantles" as well and it just falls flat. Don't get me wrong, they didn't all fall because they were badly written, (it didn't help though) but because the concept is faulty.
@@tommywright2487 They are trying to call Spider-Man a mantle so that they can reinvent him as a new character. I get why they are doing it: they simply don't have the imagination to create new heroes. What Marvel and DC have been doing with some of their heroes is basically using the names of the heroes as if they were character skins from a Mortal Kombat game and inserting a new identity into the hero. I can understand why that's confusing to some people. Black Panther is a title bestowed upon the leader and protector of Wakanda and goes with the crown. That's the difference between Black Panther and Spider-Man. Black Panther is a literal mantle while Spider-Man is just a singular hero.
@@joeyellis850 but the mantle of black panther had to start somewhere, there had to be a first black panther before the mantle was passed down, just like the mantle of spider-man. It’s actually pretty pathetic that you’re trying this hard to disregard Miles and i can’t help but get racial undertones🤷🏽♀️
Miles is Spider-Man But he’s not THE Spider-Man Peter will always be THE Spider-Man. Nothing Spider-Man could’ve happened if Peter hadn’t been bitten. Miles is called Spider-Man because he dawns the suit, has the same powers, etc. Personally, I really like how Miles was done in Into The Spider-Verse. I had no clue he was a thing until then tbh. He’s a pretty cool character. He had great character development, great training, and overall has a great first outing on the big screen. As said before, Miles is Spider-Man, but he isn’t THE Spider-Man. That title will belong to Peter forever. Miles is great. He deserves some recognition. Either way, Spider-Man as a hero will live forever 🕷 (Edit: Miles has a couple different powers compared to Peter, but they’re still roughly the same power set)
No one's arguing that he's the OG Spiderman. They're arguing that people are saying he's not Spiderman at all when there have been a ton of other Spider Men without any push back.
Miles is called Spider Man by Marvel because they invented him with the explicit intention of replacing Peter Parker. That is literally the reason. The only Reason. And it STILL hasn't caught on. Every other male character with spider Powers marvel has have their own names, with the exception of Miguel O'Hara, who ACTUALLY replaces Peter, because by that time, Peter is dead. And he STILL has the 2099 moniker so as to distinguish him from the original.
@@Alexander_Kalehe was created to succeed an alternate universe Peter Parker, and has caught on big time. Go to the theaters recently? Oh right, everything’s probably too “woke” for you
I’ve never heard anyone say he isn’t spider-man. In pretty much every universe with Miles in it he’s the legitimate successor to Peter Parker’s Spider-Man, sanctioned by the original to take the title. That’s literally all the proof you need.
2:42 again, thats where you can easily flip it around and say "peter parker isnt spiderman because we call him peter parker" its just his default legal name 💀💀
I think the main thing here is that you guys are discussing two different points. PSM is saying Miles Morales is A Spider-Man While JustSomeGuy is saying Miles Morales is not THE Spider-Man
You have heard JustSomeGuy say that Miles Morales is not A Spiderman. You have received this information with your own ears. You know very well that what you're saying is completely incorrect, yet you keep saying it. Kinda sad my guy.
What if we used these arguments on other super heroes like in DC 1) Batman is not Batman because he wouldn't have to keep telling people he is Batman. 2) Wally west isn't the flash cause when we're talking about Wally west, we have to say Wally west. Barry Allen isn't the flash because when we're talking about Barry Allen, he's addressed as Barry Allen 3) Raven (an Emo girl daughter of a witch and an alien creature constantly mistaken as a demon or the devil himself, with significant powers tied to her emotions, so she has to show no emotion to keep it at bay) is a blank slate with no neat character archs. 4) Batman is so uninteresting, DC created a what if series, where they see what would have happened if Bruce Wayne was a different super hero (dark knights metal) Anyways, I just saw the other video before this one LITERALLY today early morning so seeing this is a breath of fresh air. You've earned a sub man, I couldn't agree more with everything you have said.
Real Spider-Man fans never argue on these topics because they know that Anyone can wear the mask. A hero can be anyone even a man doing something as simple and reassuring as putting a coat over young boy's shoulder to let him know the world hadn't ended yet.
@@EF-fc4du Exactly, I just wish they gave him his own original hero name, instead it seems like they’re taking everything that’s already been established for Peter and giving them to Miles. His name, his powers, his villains, his personality, he even dated Gwen Stacy ffs
@@Johnnysmithy24 in most versions where miles is Spiderman is because there is no Peter. Yeah in universes where there is Peter he probably should go by a different name but usually kid arachnid is chosen which is a bad name.
I'm on the fence with this. In Miles' original appearance, and most recently 'Spider-Verse', Miles becomes Spider-Man AFTER Peter Parker dies. Meaning he takes up the mantle, and becomes the new Spider-Man. This makes sense, and in this instance I would agree that Miles Morales IS Spider-Man, because he is the only one, and he's there to fill the hole left by the original. However, in cases where Miles becomes Spider-Man while Peter is still alive AND ALSO Spider-Man (most notably the Insomniac Games), it REALLY bugs me that Miles doesn't give himself an alternate identity to differentiate himself from Peter. They're both just called Spider-Man. The only way for people in universe (who don't know their real names) to differentiate between them, would be to literally call Miles 'The Black Spider-Man'... like, really?? One of the main morals of Miles' story is that he shouldn't try to replicate the original Spider-Man, but instead do his own thing and be his own man, yet he's still just gonna copy his identity? It makes sense as a successor, not as a partner.
But he doesn't copy Peter's identity as Spidey at all. He has his own style, his own way of doing things, his own way of stopping crime and his own sense of being a hero. Yes, he's in 616 but he's the Spider-Man of Brooklyn and Peter's the Spider-Man of Manhattan. They protect 2 different parts of New York and that's another way for people to differentiate them. Along with Miles's additional powers too. That and Miles doesn't tell jokes all that much, if he does, they're really bad ones. He needs to work on them for real. So there's that. Plus, Peter doesn't see him as someone who steals his identity as a hero. To him, they're equals, BOTH of them share the name Spider-Man and he's proud of that. They're both Spider-Man and they do so much good together as Spider-Man that Peter's proud to have someone like Miles as both his partner and successor. Well this is also something he said in the recent comics too.😅
There are multiple Green Lanterns at once and they're all called Green Lantern. It's really not that difficult. It's a title, like being a cop. You're Spider-Man. I'm Spider-Man.
I do actually see both sides to the argument in this case. I can see the argument of anyone being Spider-man but I also see people saying that Peter made that identity and Miles just used it.
What's so great about spiderman is that there could be anyone under the mask, yet when you see him you don't think of race or gender or whatever. - some wise guy
Funny enough that’s like half the reason I like him. I feel like there are a lot of characters where their whole defining trait is that they’re black or white or asian. And Miles is so much more.
The only issue with miles’ original stories is that he didn’t have his own villains outside of prowler, and even then that’s being changed in the current comics
Prowler is a Peter Parker character, literally started out as a Peter Parker villain. Just another example of how Miles is the king of Peter Parkers sloppy seconds.
@@oraclescrolls Doesn't matter, it's still tied in to Peter Parker first. Which means it's not "his own villain" it's a co-opted Peter Parker villain. Just another example of how Miles is the King of Peter Parkers sloppy seconds.
@@matthewlane not exactly. While prowler originally fought Peter, his relationship with miles is completely different as he is Miles’ uncle. This allows for completely different feeling while they fight as it isn’t another villain of the week. It’s a nephew fighting someone he loves and wants to redeem. That’s not sloppy seconds, that’s a unique dynamic.
@@matthewlane there's a lot of villains that used to be Spider-Man villains (FIRST) that are now villains for other Heroes, but I'm 100% sure you wouldn't say that's just Peter's sloppy seconds, you're only saying it because we're talking about Miles Morales
Mfs are ok with a spider man that is a pig and one who is a literal t-rex, but miles can't be spider man... I think I have a clue for why that is but imma keep it for myself
To me, Miles always felt like what Robin is to Batman. Has the potential and strength to be his own hero but not as iconic as the one who started it all.
Ben Riley isn't Spider-Man, John Stewart isn't Green Lantern, Terry McGinnis isn't Batman, etc. Who TF is Wally West? Barry Allen is the only Flash ever! Where did this ignorant idea come from?🤦🏾
TL ; DR 1. Miles Morales is Spider-Man because Marvel said so. 2. If Miles Morales isn't Spider-Man no one else is. If you thought he's actually going to debunk something, you were wrong clicking on this video. Just like me.
Yeah but spider-man at the exact same time? Same name? Imagine if there was two Iron MANS. With the SAME NAME. We have War Machine. Which is dope. But he isn't called Iron Man As well... Because why the heck would they?
@@bejitostk Yes I watched the whole thing. But this issue is bigger than the video went on about. Anyone can be Spider-Man yes. But can someone BE HIM. At the EXACT same time Peter Parker, being called Spider-Man. Is ALIVE??? - Sharing the exact friggin name at the same time BOTH are alive and well? - Is pure dumb. Heck I asked my mother this question about this and she doesn't give a darn about super heroes and agrees he should have a different name.
I’m not the most well-versed when it comes to comics whatsoever, but have there not also been countless What If comics about different heroes taking up each other’s mantles? There has to have been at least a few “What If Peter Parker was…” books before right?
I think the best thing for Miles would be to distance him from Peter in terms of identity, location, etc. Look at Dick Grayson. He doesn't try to compete with Batman in people's perception of the character, he is his own man despite similar methods, similar "abilities", and time spent under Batman. Miles needs a fresh location, new villains, and a modified persona to make him more distinct. The changes made in Spider-Verse and the PS4 were steps in the right direction, but I think we need to go even further with comic Miles to really live up to his potential. Take Miles places Peter has never been and let him do things Peter has never done. You can still even call him Spider-Man, but he needs that crucial characteristic that defines him like 2099, Superior, etc.
He has his own comic where Peter is barely a factor, people just need to actually read it before critiquing his character. If you ask me, Ben Rielly is the one who actually needs to get away from Peter. Writers know how to make Miles his own thing doing his own stuff. Notice that he’s never, not even once, been turned into a villain to distinguish him or pull in attention
This didn’t debunk a thing. “Because Marvel says so” isn’t the argument. When people say Miles isn’t Spider-Man they’re obviously not referring to the fact that Marvel is just lazy in making new characters. They’re talking about how Peter and Spider-Man will forever be one and the same and nothing will ever change that. The same can’t and will ever be able to be said about Miles. Go up to anyone in the world and ask them who Spider-Man is, you will NEVER get Miles as an answer. Ever ever ever ever ever. Peter is Forever Spider-Man. Miles can be lazily referred to as Spider-Man if Marvel wants but that will never make him Spider-Man where it counts. Spider-Man and who he is, is too much of a cultural phenomenon engrained in history to ever be changed. Same goes for Star Wars. Yeah Lucas Film says Rey brought balance to the force but everyone who matters will forever know it was Aniken. End of discussion.
Are you brain dead or something? Obviously people will think of Peter when they think of spiderman. When people think of batman they won't think of damian, dick or Jason they will think of Bruce. When people think of superman they won't think of Jon or Connor they'll think of Clark because they're the og. That doesn't mean we should throw away the whole batfamily or superfamily because legacies chacaters can still exist and make a name for themselves. Miles is still a new charcater so obviously he won't be as iconic as Peter but with time he'll definitely be in people's minds when they think of spiderman
Just stumbled upon this channel and I'm definitely subscribing. I respect the fact that he decided to lay out his points without making things personal. And advising his fanbase to be civil is actually pretty rare on youtube. I more than agree with your points in the video but I respect the class bro. You deserve millions of more subs ngl
I completely agree. Miles is Spiderman... period. Saying otherwise is such an intentionally obsequious argument. Someone could just as easily say... Wally West is not the Flash... Damian is not Robin... Barry Allen is not the Flash... Terry Mcginnis is not Batman... Johnny Storm is not the human torch Carol Danvers is not Captain Marvel Hector Hall is not Dr. Fate Hal Jordan/Kyle Rayner/ Guy Gardner is not Green Lantern Diana is not Wonder Woman Jason is not Firestorm Yelena Belova is not Black Widow Jack Knight is not Star-man Jon is not Superman Sam is not Captain America Shuri is not Black Panther All of these characters held identities passed down in a legacy and sometimes at the same time as another character having the same name. Miles is Spiderman, people need to get over it
NEED TO REMIND THAT RHODEY WAS IRON MAN WAY BEFORE BEING WAR MACHINE *IN FACT, BEFORE HE BECAME WAR MACHINE, RHODEY WAS PART OF THE AVNEGERS FOR A LONGER TIME AS IRON MAN THAN TONY* _& HE WAS AN AMAZING IRON MAN_
They should do like they did with Ironman and War machine. Both where suits of Ironman but Tony's friend became, "The War machine", instead of another Ironman. They should have done something like this with Miles Morales.
“Anyone can wear the mask. You can wear the mask.” It’s literally the most perfect line And I can’t believe there are people saying a character who has been Spider-Man for years Isn’t Spider-Man?
Spider Man is a name, not a title. Anyone can wear the mask, true. But only one person can be spider Man. That is why every single other character with spider Powers that originated from the Spider Man comics has either a different Name or a qualifier to the name. Ben Reilly is "the Scarlet Spider", not "Spider Man". Miguel O'Hara is "Spider Man 2099", not "Spider Man". Every single female iteration of the character has their own name. Silk, Spider Woman, ghost spider, Araña. They are not all called "Spider-Girl". You might as well say "Anyone can be Peter Parker". No. They can't.
The issue is when they make him the same thing during the same time the original spidey is. Like the new ps5 game coming out. I love miles, and these games so much. But TWO spider-men with THE SAME NAME is a little odd.
@@Randomperson11121 yes it is. Both Miles and Wally had to pick up the mantle after their heroes died. Miles Morales IS spider-man, just like Wally IS Flash. If you disagree, that's kinda too bad.
Yeah the thing about Some Guy and usually people within a similar sort of comic book commentary like his the reason why he says Miles Morales isn't Spider-Man is because he sees it as a "needless race swap" for some sort of "diversity quota". This kind of thing is very typical of him and other people in his circle of comic book commentary on UA-cam. He does it almost all the time whenever it comes to characters like this
The writers literally said miles was only created to be a mixed race spiderman because obama was also mixed. Its not like just some guy is making things up the writers themselves have said as much.
@@OGP2293 I'm aware for the of the story. The concept of a Spider-man being mixed race was already thought of before Obama took office. Marvel took inspiration from Obama and Donald Glover when they showed interest in Spider-man. DirtyDev there is being disingenuous I asked that question to try and get him to be more truthful. As you can see that didn't work.
@@OGP2293 and only one person mentioned anything about Obama's heritage when talking about the creation of Miles and they definitely didn't claim Miles is of mixed heritage only because Obama is.
It's the same thing with Wally West. He's the Flash, but we call him Wally West to differentiate him from Barry Allen. Jay Garrick is also the Flash, and the same thing is applied to his case.
He's robin. Or Spider-Man beyond. And no matter how many new powers they give him or how much they shit on Peter to make him look better, this is always going to be the case.
To me what makes or a character is how much they contributed. Peter is Spider-Man because he gave us one the biggest rogue gallery ever. As well as the Venom and Carnage. Miles gave us nothing. He’s a parasite character that constantly living off of Peter successes.
@@Peasham 10. His origin. Both “Spider-Men crossover”. Some his adventure in the ultimate universe. Some 616. Not a fan, but I read some on occasion to see if he get better. Always average. Most the time it just crossovers with Peter, where story goes out it way make Miles seem superior, it always come across has shallow. Marvel constantly reboots the book so I never feel invested. What’s the point when just going change of a dim.
@@ffjj3964 So, Miles brings nothing even though he's better than Peter, and most of the time he crosses over with Peter even though only 2 out of the 10... issues? You've read feature a crossover.
@@Peasham 1. Yes, I read read some of miles crossover. But always feel plain. 2. It the “Character being validated nonstop” trope you find on the CW Supergirl and Batwoman. Where everyone has to state he’s the best, no matter what. It shallow and annoying. 3. Miles character always play so safe. He never loses or suffer or anything. Always just validation for being Spider-Man. So all of his feats feel plastic.
Twitter warriors love to cling to mediocrity with rebranded corporate marketing gimmicks. It keeps the low barrier to entry for lazy writing up with wide open doors. But I guess somehow Miles Thor and Miles Wolverine really proves how creative this character must be. He’s his own personality. He’s definitely not just entirely meant to be a reskin character for traditionally white characters. Honestly, calling that out is what should make even passive consumers of entertainment pass on what’s simply a bad marketing pitch. Sloppy seconds ought to be viewed as an insult to any appreciator of entertainment.
"what has miles done in these 10 years" um, I don't know been the front man of an entire new era of cinematic animation. brought an entire new fanbase to spiderman. gotten the character of spiderman more in touch with areas of Brooklyn peter didn't interact with as much, u know a plus since spidermans entire identity is being the friendly nieghboorhood spiderman.
I feel like an easy way to explain this is with this comparison:
If you are told to think of a marker and your brain immediately thinks of Crayola markers, all of the other marker brands are still markers.
You aren’t wrong.
I said something similar to this in PSM's last stream but with Terry McGinnis from Batman Beyond.
@@rodimusmagnus5586 It works then and it works now.
If PSM is actually reading this then I know for a fact miles will not win against the PS4 insomac Spider-Man
@@---98771 Bro no one is betting who would win in a fight at all.
Stay on topic.
the "what if miles was spiderman" joke was actually a 10/10 i wasnt ready for that one
I wanted to include the part where he calls him Peter Darker so bad
@@amazingpsm is That That Name Racist
yeah
@@amazingpsm I love your videos but i still have your video from why batman would lose to almost everyone brunt into my mind lol
@@FanOfLightning95 It was made by Rippa, a black guy. It's malicious, not racist. They kinda did it to themselves by giving the black Spider-man a black suit.
The funny thing is that people have no problem with Spider-Woman versions. There are like 7 different Spider-Woman (Jessica Drew, Julia Carpenter, Mattie Franklin, Gwen Stacy, May Parker etc) and people seem to have no problems with it. But when it comes to Spider-Man, suddenly people get mad. There are a lot of Spider-Man in the comic (Peter Parker, Miguel O Hara, Miles Morales, Takuya Yamashiro etc) but people only have a problem with Miles.
Im not even counting the different version of Peter Parker. Which version of Peter is the "real" Spider-Man? My fav version is Peter from Earth 18119, but does he count as Spider-Man? He's not 616 Peter who people count as the only Spider-Man.
I knew you were based the second you said renew your vows was your favorite
@@amazingpsm In my headcanon, One More Day is just simply a nightmare that Peter had and Peter, MJ and Annie live happily together.
Im so excited that Spider-Verse 2 included Spinneret and Spiderling in the trailer.
I haven't heard anyone spit facts so well in my entire life but you finally did it( and probably Spider-Man)
I agree to this comment I haven't heard anyone spit such true facts in so long( besides the first comment and probably Spider-Man)
@@jeppyjep I literally squealed when I saw them in the trailer I'm so happy I love Renew Your Vows
I really respect you for trying to keep this civil. It seems like nowadays if content creators even slightly disagree it turns into a screaming match between the creators and the community. But on the topic of this video. I used to think that people didn’t consider Miles to be Spider-Man because he was black. And the only reason he was even created was to be a token character. Now that I’m older I realize it’s just because people don’t like change simple enough. People believe that Miles would replace Peter as the definitive Spider-Man. But that’s not the case. Peter is Spider-Man. Miles is Spider-Man. Anyone can wear the mask. Spider verse was literally about this concept.
Yeah probably spiderman has really matured since then 😊 ❤ he is a very civil youtuber guy
yeah, that’s the point. stan lee said it himself. "What I like about the costume is that anybody reading Spider-Man in any part of the world can imagine that they themselves are under the costume. And that’s a good thing." Anyone can wear the mask and take up the mantle. While peter was the first, spider-man is the concept of a hero who’s connected to grounded reality, especially the reality of being a teen and coping with life. Miles is spider-man, so is peter. they and all the others still embody the true concept of spider-man that make the character such an icon.
It's only been like a month since he compared she-hulk critics to the KKK lmao
@@darkenergy9760 What does this have to do with anything I just said?
@@halffruit9245 Just the first part of what you said. He's not usually the best at keeping things civil.
Miles Morales is Spider-Man not THE SPIDER-MAN
Agreed!
The perfect way to put it really
Perfectly well said
true
My thoughts exactly.
saying Miles Morales isn't Spider-Man is like saying Johnny Storm isn't Human Torch because Jim Hammond is the original Human Torch
The truth is that while I do really like Miles, Peter will always be my favorite. But I am happy that these Spider-Verse movies get to be his stories. So even though nothing can ever truly replace Peter, there are valid reasons to keep Miles as Spider-Man. He’s his own hero that that does things his own way while living up to the legacy that comes from his original Spider-Man, his family, and even his multiverse spider hero friends. So yeah, there can be more than one.
Comic sales would agree with you, Peter is irreplaceable, that’s why people only care about the miles movie and game, easy for normies to digest
@@theverminator4219 "Easy for normie to digest"
Lmao Spider-Man comic has been bad this couple of years. It sold well, but the essense of Peter Parker is nowhere to be seen. Especially after Peter calling MJ as his sister. Renew Your Vows should be the main 616 universe seeing how bad the main 616 Spider-Man comic is
Comics wise, I agree. Wholeheartedly. Movies....... I ain't gonna lie me and my friend (enormous Spidey comics fan), agree that he's the best movie Spidey. Id argue second best is Peter B Parker. They're the most whole heartedly true to what the character is in my eyes. Hell I may even like Gwen more than Tom's, Tobey's or Andrew's as a character thanks to the last film...
@@theverminator4219 People care about the movies and games more because they actually portray him as a unique character. Why do you think as soon as Brian stopped writing the character the characters comic has been better received?
so we just gonna ignore the whole “anyone can wear the mask”
Just some guy will.
As someone who used to be on the other side of this argument, I just want to point out that anybody claiming “Wally West isn’t The Flash” would get laughed out of the room.
Wally West was The Flash after Barry died/ran into the speed force for a few decades. There's a difference. People would've accepted Miles sooner if they didn't destroy the Ultimate Universe. Having multiple Spiders in New York is weird. Having them spread out across the country (Scarlet Spider 1 and 2) or globe (Spider-Man UK) or even to different dimensions (Spider Gwen) makes sense. Both Spiders sharing the name Spider-Man while being in close quarters all the time is strange too. Spread out. Cover more ground. Stop hogging eachother's turf. New York already has a crap ton of heroes anyways.
@@noahf863mf huh? Their both from new york u want miles to move to a different country just to be spiderman?
Also, he seems to forget that the reason that Stan Lee had Spidey be covered from head to toe, was so we can all imagine being Spider-Man. Doesn't matter what is your race, gender, orientation, or beliefs. Also Spider-Verse summed it up perfectly in that: ANYBODY can wear the mask.
Yh but no one does it like the original. You can literally say this about almost ANY other superhero😂. This comments makes it sound like you're WATERING DOWN the idea of Spiderman and when you break down Peters original character...its literally that NO ONE ELSE could be him.
@@no.1spidey-fan182 'Number 1 fan' my fucking ass
@@no.1spidey-fan182 you can’t say this about the Hulk, Thor, Silver Surfer, The Thing, Wonder Woman, Cyborg, or any superhero that show their body in their outfit. The purpose of his comment was to point out that the CREATOR of Spider-Man has always intended for the character specifically his costume to be a costume anyone could wear without worrying about looking like someone else. Peter’s purpose as Spider-Man is that when you picture yourself or someone else as Spider-Man, this is how they behave under the mask, someone who has great power but is greatly responsible with it.
@@manwithopinions12 literally every superhero has said at one point that "its not the suit, its the person inside". Or something along those lines. I have no idea why so called spiderman fans are so HELL BENT on ripping his identity away and acting like he's the ONLY hero that said something similar
Stan Lee also spoke about how much POTENTIAL PETER PARKER as Spider-Man had and where his growth. Spiderman was practocally his som the way he spoke of him.
Alsoas "relatable" as he is Spiderman is one of the most unique characters out there. Most people on this planet dont have his level of maturity given his situation and CANNOT do what he does. They would ceumble with even a QUARTER of the trauma and weight this man has on him, theres a reason in lore why Nick Fury and Literal GOD comment on his Will power in not becoming the BIGGEST VILLAIN KNOWN TO MAN after all the crap life put him through. Not just ANYbody can be Spider-Man cause most people ARE NOT Peter Parker🤷♂️. Not to mention I dont know may people who are Orphans AND raised by a single parent😂
And also there are MULTIPLE Hulks and Wonder Women😂. Thing and Silver Surfer don't appear human so as long as its a dude...ANY man can literallt take their place at least visually🤷♂️
@@no.1spidey-fan182 goofy ahh internet person. Seriously, ur a dumbass LMAOO
I agree. There are clearly multiple Spider-People. But when we say Spider-Man, we’re obviously going to think of Peter Parker. He’s just too iconic. But that doesn’t mean Miles Morales isn’t Spider-Man. Anyone can wear the mask, you can wear the mask
Spider-People. Next we'll have non Binary spiders. Spider pronouns.
@@Infamous1892 I identify as a Ninja Turtle
@@LeonardoTMNT444 I identify as Randy Cunningham 9th grade ninja
Not anyone can wear the mask. For example, Galactus cant wear the mask. Neither can Godzilla
Of course anyone can wear the mask but what Important is the skin colour, gender and disability. it's he black under that mask? It's she pregnant under that suit? It's he gay under that mask? It's her lower half of her body dead under the suit? SMH
I miss when people called Miles "Ultimate Spider-Man"
I do too.
He needs an addendum to his name like that again, 2099 is called spiderman but nobody raises a fuss cause he's really 2099 Spiderman. They place a distinction between them
He IS Ultimate Spider-Man. Or, well, Ultimate Spider-Man is Miles.
The Ultimate comic run from Marvel had a whole Ultimate Spider-Man storyline following an alternate version of Peter Parker. When he died and Miles replaced him, Miles was Ultimate Spider-Man because he was the Spider-Man of the Ultimate universe.
I think they switched away from this for a couple reasons; first, they didn’t want to give the impression that Miles is somehow “superior” to other Spider-Man characters. Second, and more pertinently, he is no longer associated exclusively with the Ultimate canon. There is a version of Miles in the mainline comics, a version in the game, and a version in Spider-Verse. These are alternate versions of Miles just like how there are different versions of Peter. Since only one is actually Ultimate Spider-Man, the label no longer fits other portrayals of him.
@@greanbeen2816 Makes sense, I still refer to him as USM sometimes.
Same
My theory is reason why most older people say "Miles Morales isn't Spider-Man" is because Peter Parker is original and more iconic and since Miles is the second most popular version of Spidey people reject Him due to bias because most hate change where as Reilly and O'hara are more easily excepted since they are less known where as someone like me who grew up in the early 2000s is more used to multiple popular versions of Spider-Man such as Miles before
Nah, it's because he's black. Literally the only reason why.
One reason why he’s more accepted is because everyone calls him spider man
2099 not just spider man
Or their just racist, it’s really not that deep sometimes.
@@galientl4723 he's just racist (Just some guy)
@@ahobbyist9520 oh I’m aware, yellow flash too. My point is that sometimes it’s just people mad that a black character is the successor to a white one. Especially one as beloved and iconic as Peter.
I think what it ultimately comes down to (heh) is that we will always call him Miles Morales. Because you need to do that to let someone know who you mean. Peter is just too iconic and will probably always be what people first think of when they hear Spider-man. But the difference is Miles doesnt have an Iconic monicker and is akwardly called by his name. Same with Spider-Gwen. Im just not sure Ghost Spider stuck. And thats the problem. 2099s monicker kind of works in concert with the Spider-man name hence Spider-man 2099. Miles and Gwen dont.
Yeah. They should’ve come up with better names like they’re doing nowadays with Web Weaver and the others
By a technicality, Miles would be named as Ultimate Spider-Man since he took over after the Peter of that world died. But there could still be a different adjective to make him stand out better
Spider-Shock
Miles has had names like 'Kid Arachnid', 'Spinn' and I think...'Spy-D'?
@@scifiguy9000those are god awful
"If Miles can not be Spider-Man,No one else can"Good point.
No one except Peter Parker
Anyone can see themselves as Spider-Man, yes. But within the context of comics, unless Parker is dead and replaced, or it’s a different dimension so that Parker wasn’t ever Spidey in the first place, then he is the only one.
@@pio1483agreed
How can someone call themselves Spider-Man when Peter is still there? That's like claiming you're the president while there's still one, you're not and people will always think that unless you own that title only to yourself.
Yeah. That includes 2099 and Noir.
If Miles isn't Spider-Man then all of the other alternate Spider-Men aren't Spider-Man either
Precisely.
I usually call Miles “Ultimate Spider-Man” cause that’s the comic he came from, and I know Peter was originally spidey in the ultimate universe but he died young and miles has had the mantle for much longer, 1610 Peter is my fav version of Peter but I still call him the 1610 Peter Parker because the main Peter Parker is 616, and miles either by his name or ultimate Spider-Man
I completely forgot that he's technically the ultimate spiderman
Honestly I wish they would bring back that monicre for him.
yeah but Peter is also the ultimate Spider-Man in the cartoon and the game as well so probably not best title for miles.
I feel like marvel should just lean into the whole spiderman of Brooklyn thing. Just call him Brooklyns spiderman. Saves all the confusion.
@@Dwyer-nl9fz Ultimate Peter is irrelevant now though
Miles even recently had his own version of a clone saga, which haters would call lazy but it was done way differently, which later got expanded to an alternate future where the clones one before the series got rebooted
Nobody bought those books
It's wild that people will be SO against a thing existing because it's not specifically for them. I'm Afro-Latino just like Miles. Spidey was always my absolute favorite hero growing up and even before Miles I was able to put myself in the suit mentally just like Stan Lee wants us to. But when i first learned about Miles, it impacted me in a way i can never really articulate. This kid who grew up looking up to Spider-Man just like me, he had parents like mine, he spoke English and Spanish, he was MY Spider-Man. He was OUR Spider-Man. Nuestro gente. Miles Morales, tú eres el hombre arañe último.
I know this has nothing to do with your comment but, I don't think you really speak Spanish.
You’re awesome, keep being you
Literally this right here. I grew up damn near in love with Peter and loved every show, game, and comics he's been in. And when Miles was released, to me he wasn't a carbon copy of Peter but black like Just Some Guy's video painted him out to be. I watched his video before this, and realized he was basically being disingenuous about other facts and just full blown going off his own feelings. I didn't see a tokenism Afro-Latino placed in for identity politics, I saw a genuine story of a kid who has to realize his own path, and his own worth as Spider-Man, just like in the Across the spider verse movie.
@@thesecretone6531 agreed
@@sauron6977 And how would you know 😂
It's always so weird to me that rhody is one of the first black characters (at least to my knowledge) to replace a well known one and still got enough love to get their own identity with war machine (since rhody was ironman for a time when tony was having problems with alcohol) and nobody seems to care but miles gets this rejection from people to not accept the character or give him a chance
People relate to Peter more than they do Ironman.
Rhodey was an previously established character, and him putting on a suit of armor to cover for Tony was a natural progression. He didn’t build his suit, he used a suit Tony built and forged his own identity as war machine. Iron man’s best friend and backup. His sidekick who reigned him in. He played a role that magnified both his and Tony’s character.
Riri Williams on the other hand, had none of that and is just supposed to replace iron man.
Likewise, Miles is also meant to be a replacement of his universe’s Spider-Man. Out with the old, in with the new. If Miles had been like Spider-Man’s Robin, helping him go through his own arc of growing up and becoming a mentor, moving away from his teenage superhero paradigm where he always works alone, I think people would have liked Miles a lot better. Because then Miles would be his own character that improves “Spider-Man” instead of just worse copy of what we already have.
That cause the internet wasn't a thing back then....and didn't get advenced enough to have social media platforms to spread toxicness than what you can in real life.
In fact, if Rhodey was Iron Man today, even breifly like in the arc, I'd garunetee you they WILL be a pissed off hate mob screaming about the idea of a black man as Iron Man like it's still 2016.
Rhodey got heat back in the day but because it wasn't in the social media era it's not as widely known.
@@gangofheroes Really? Jesus Christ, history repeats but in a overblown way...
He’s obviously a Spider-Man, but his comic had to be rebooted 4 times in the past 7 years because his sales are so low compared to Peter Parker’s comics
Oh do I got some news for you regarding comics whose sales actually underperform
@@Peasham Please go on. I know tons of Marvel and DC books underperform.
@@TrueUnderDawgGaming Comics that actually underperform get cancelled you fucking moron lmao
@@Peasham That is what being rebooted is. They started Miles back from issue #1 four times already after ending the current run.
@@TrueUnderDawgGaming ... no, that's what being rebooted is. Being cancelled is when they don't make the comics anymore. You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about.
Spider-man is a title not a person
Owned by Parker's Industries.
@@patrickdixon7202which was also canonically given permission to be passed on to miles. doesnt matter what your personal bias is if it's just not fact lol
@@rhinuu045fax
Saying that Miles Morales isn’t Spider-Man is like saying Wally west isn’t the flash (for those that don’t know, Wally basically replaced Barry Allen as the new flash in the comics, just like the way that Miles replaced Peter as the new Spider-Man). They might not be the original but they’re almost like reincarnations of the original
I've never read a comic in my life so I really dont know anything about Wally west. Does Wally have the exact same powers as barry allen or does he have some abilities the barry doesnt?
@@whodat879 Wally has the same powers as Barry and was his sidekick as kid flash for over 20 years and is Faster
I think Wally West became the Flash after the death of Barry Allen
@@felixmartinez1100 He did, and he wasn't all of sudden better than him. He had to struggle and was at first slower
@@angel7661 That's a great point. Wally was an established character way before he became The Flash. He took over the mantle of The Flash after he earned it for years.
That's what a lot of people dislike about Miles Morales. Calling him Spider-Man without any good story of his own, no real personality makes him feel too shallow be called Spider-Man.
Wasn’t the Miles’ whole arc in both spider-verse and his insomniac game about him learning to become his own Spider-Man and to accept that he is also Spider-Man. The insomniac game literally has Ganke say “you keep saying Spider-Man when you mean the other guy, your Spider-Man.” How could it get more obvious that Miles is in fact Spider-Man.
Gotta make the views somehow… even if the concept is stupid
People have a hard time accepting that Peter isn't the one and only anymore. Peter Parker will always be the original and my personal favorite, but I like Miles, at least in the movie and video games. As long as Peter is Spider-Man somewhere in some universe, there's no harm in having other characters take up the mantle. Miles is not the first and he certainly won't be the last.
Saying he's Spiderman, doesn't make him Spiderman.
He's a fake, a poser, there's only one Spiderman.
There are many spidermen, but only one Spiderman.
You don't see Kane being called Spiderman, Ben being called Spiderman, 2099 being called Spiderman and so on, in fact Ben who was once under the thought he was Spiderman (*as he was a clone with the same exact memories )
Once he found out he was a clone, he realized he was in reality not Spiderman.
Miles is just as much Spiderman as everyone else who is in fact not Spiderman, but a spider person.
It's like calling Jane Thor, simply because marvel calls Jane Thor doesn't make her Thor as Thor is literally his name and not a title.
@@Elnegro.. bro Spider-Man is quite literally a title, Spider-Man is by definition not a single person. I understand that maybe it’s hard to comprehend but multiple characters using the same name as another at the same time isn’t new, you heard of Captain America? Wolverine? Spider-Woman? Miles is Spider-Man because that’s what his comic run is called, it’s the hero name he goes by, he’s referred to as Spider-Man in universe and also because he got bit by a radioactive Spider-Man. Also a big part of all the Spider-people I’m the multiverse is that all of them are explicitly all Spider-Men of their own universe. I can tell your kinda dumb so this might go over your head but there isn’t just one Spider-Man anymore and it doesn’t matter how many times you whine about it won’t change the fact that your wrong.
@@Elnegro..He literally debunked everything you just said. Miles IS Spider-Man. He may not be *”THE* Spider-Man” but he is Spider-Man
It doesn’t matter who you are, Miles, Gwen, Peter, or Miquel. These are people who were made to be their own spider man, or spider woman, it won’t Change the fact that these characters have great stories, and perspectives on being a spider man, or spider woman.
But Peter is superior to everyone
Nope.. just diversity bullshit that doesn't hold up well with people who have been fans since before the marvel movies lol
That's why their sales are trash compared to the real Spider-Man
@@scamon4u Do you know why classic comic books didn't feature diverse characters?
There is a body called the comics code authority (CCA) which had the purpose of filtering and censoring comics to be safe for young readers. The CCA would authorise comics that confirmed to the hegemonic Christian conservative views at the time. In other words they would unauthorise comics which featured women, POC, and LGBT in prevelant roles. They went out of their way to segregate these types of characters and their creators from mainstream comic books. This is the real reason why comics haven't been diverse historically.
@@MichaelMiller-wc6jl Having diverse characters means that modern comics creators want to tell stories which are more reflective of the world we live in TODAY. There's nothing wrong with that.
weirdly enough you don't see this with the flash, I believe it because enough of people grew up with the wally west flash in the 90s and jla cartoon to the point were people are conftorble agreeing both Barry and Wally are the flash, it also helps they wear the same costume. I think what makes Miles jaring is that he shares the same name but has a different costume so it doesn't really have the same synergy that the flash mantel has.
No its cause Wally had time to GROW outside of Barry's shadow
@@no.1spidey-fan182 that too
He was the mainline flash for years in the main continuity
The issue with miles is that miles even to this day doesn't have a decent rogues gallery. Before spiderverse, he was just genius Peter parker but black. Uninspired. Nowhere close to as cool or good as spiderverse.
He also never truly replaces spidey. That's because marvel has a weird fixation in keeping Peter in a regressive state of being of being everyone's punching bag.
@@lordraiden7397 You think that if they let peter get old/stay dead back then he'd have an easier time establishing himself in their eyes?
@@ahobbyist9520 Nah. Marvel sucks now
The original Miles Morales is real bad. Into the spider verse gives us what should be the gold standard to be Miles
Someone finally said it besides me lol
“Miles morales is not spider-man, how do i know. Because you call him miles morales, not spider-man.”
Joe biden is not the president, how do i know, because you call him joe biden, not mr. President.
😭😭
Completely different. When someone says “the president” you assume he’s referring to the current one which is Biden whereas when you say “spiderman” almost nobody would think of miles first. This is a terrible example because Peter Parker has been spiderman since the 60s whereas a president at most is there for 8 years and “president of the United States” is literally a mantle but “spiderman” is Peter’s alias.
That's such a dumb comparison, it doesn't even make sense
@@DirtyDev u analyzing this shit way to hard maybe it was a bad comparison but u still get the point he tryna say honestly i think u was just bored and wanted to argue about something ik this cause i do the same thing sometimes (used too anyways)
And? Are their two presidents at the exact same time??? No. Cause hoe would you differentiate the two?
5:31 correction: Ultimate Spider-Man was retitled to "Ultimate Comics Spider-Man" after ultimatum, even before Peter died
I actually checked the books while making the video, the title still says ultimate Spider-Man during the new run
@@amazingpsm I just checked. You’re right. Idk why I remembered it being called Ultimate Comics Spider-Man in the 2009 run
@@amazingpsmNgl I think Christopher Daniel Barnes is the best version of Miguel O’Hara and That Edge of time is underrated I would love if their was a reference to Edge of time in spider verse 2 and I love how your playing The Ultimate Spiderman game not many people mention it as much ❤ also he was a really good 90’s spider-man
@@ahmadkhalaf8952 it's okay baby boo 😘
I loved your explanation on everything but I would also like to add this classic line by Stan Lee about Miles growing into the suit. As much as I love Spider-Man as a character a ton of versions of Peter exist hell a lot of Spider-People exist! But when I watched Into the Spider-Verse the line Stan Lee gave after Peter's death was so iconic "It always fits- - -eventually" some of the struggles that Miles faced during the film was trying to be a copy of Peter in general and when he bought the costume from the shop his intentions wasn't to be himself but to be the hero Peter Parker of his earth had been. This is also very visible in a lot of scene's when he's talking to his uncle and trying to imitate his uncle. As for JSG I've seen a lot of his videos and disagreed with some of his view points they're not always valid because it's a surface level view point on certain characters such as Miles not being Spider-Man or he's Miles isn't Peter Parker but Peter Darker as comical as it might sound this seems like a much LARGER issue at hand when taking this kind of view point and putting it to other characters such as Madam Web or Cassandra Webb, 2099, Jessica Drew, Kaine, Otto, Anya, Julia, Ezekiel, and so many more characters that aren't peter but happen to be spider-people that people do not associate them as "checking a box" but as individual characters with complexity to the story they're in. If I generally said "I LOVE SPIDER-MAN and the SPIDER-UNIVERSE" it's taking the time to look at the different spider characters and having my likes and dislikes of those characters but understanding that Cindy Moon AKA Silk is liked by me not because she's Asian and a Spider-Variant but because Cindy is her own character with her own problems such as her social anxiety issues or her way of wanting to combat her social anxiety is by putting herself out in the world to make new friend's and this is coming from someone that has anxiety issues... So when listening to Just Some Guy it feels as if his only argument revolves over something as mediocre as Miles race and nothing more that he quickly gave up on the character without giving him a chance, which is sad...
I like the background music a lot :0, and I think this leads to another unique trait that I think exemplifies Miles as a Character: Music. Spiderverse has an amazing soundtrack and incorporates the unique sounds from different artists to the point where in the beginning of the movie he *listens* to the soundtrack, making him have a relatable and outstanding trait for the movie and the characters' iteration within it.
I'm a 40 year old dude who grew up with Peter Parker, but I enjoy Miles Morales as Spider Man much more since discovering him. I still like Peter, but there is something about Miles rhat really speaks to me.
Into the Spiderverse is a master piece, and one of the movies that are very near and dear to my heart.
It's just frustrating. I think Miles as a character can fix alot of the problems modern Spider-man has with the constant push and pull between the comics wanting a "younger relatable Peter" and a vocal part of the fanbase wanting Peter to be "more mature".
My biggest issue with the whole thing is the constant "moving of the goals". It's important to recognize how far Miles has come and that him being Spider-man is kind of an accepted part of Spidey Lore. But no matter how much he succeeds or fixes what they see wrong it'll never be enough for them. I am not saying people aren't allowed to hate certain Spiderman (lord knows how much I don't care Ben Reilly). But the way they go about it comes off as annoying and disingenuous.
I'll admit as a someone who has always loved Ultimate Spider-man and the Ultimate universe I am kinda biased to towards Ultimate versions of characters and exclusive characters like Miles so I have an active interest in being happy that they succeed.
I heavily agree with this statement. I never read Ultimate Spider-Man, but I did get into Miles's run as the successor to Ultimate Peter's Legacy and I really loved it, despite the flaws it has.
Good observation but don't u see what's happening in the culture rn. they change and force characters for political reasons. Theres people tht defend these characters tht don't even read the books. Marvel has been taken over by the progressives and they care about their agendas more than they do characters. And then they attack the core fan base for not liking the new stuff...
@@goldtiger9453 I guess I missed the part where that's my problem. I kinda like alot of those characters and status quos.
The problem with Mike’s is that he’s just Peter 2.0. There’s nothing that defines him as a character other than inexperience and trying to live up to his hero. That’s not a character. Just like Pete, he’s awkward, smart, young, in a prestigious school and dealing with the responsibility of having superpowers. Only genuine difference is that he’s trying to measure up to someone and he lacks Pete’s conflict of a normal life with MJ/paying rent and being a superhero. He has potential to be much more but they only make him a shadow of Peter and that’s just sad.
@@squirrelthegamer8483 Miles character is very different then Peter. In the original series he is way more insecure about his powers and using them, imposter syndrome is important to his arc but not just as Spider-man it's also his insecurity about being at that school. His family dynamic is also very different which affects his views of the worlds and on top of his own supporting cast like Ganke and Judge etc. He has very different dynamics to Peter's remaining supporting cast and other heroes like the Ultimates. This also applies to when he comes to the main universe mostly. Only difference is it's less about legacy per say.
Peter never went to a prestigious school(I guess ESU is but the context of Miles going to a special high school is way different).
Also what do you mean he lacks struggle in his normal life. He struggles with all the basic Spider-man stuff, like romance, his secret identity, how he's perceived because of his Spider-man duties etc. I suggest reading more Miles content.
As huge Miles fan and a cosplayer too, I can agree that Movies and Video Games have really improved the character by giving him a personality and things that actually make him different than Peter Parker. It really is what makes him different than the original that makes him special
Shoulda been an original character to begin with instead of riding on the coattails of a legacy character. From a creative standpoint its just lazy.
@@budgiecat9039 But from a marketing standpoint (which is their main concern) it's smart.
@@budgiecat9039 The problem isn’t Miles, it was the way he was introduced into the Marvel Universe that drove people insane. He had things around him that made him different but the early days of Miles were definitely him being a Peter Parker clone (personally wise) until ITSV.
@@kolby3636 At the end of the day he's just another one in the long line of pointless derivative characters that only exist riding the coattails of preexisting legacy characters.
Its laziness in creation pure and simple.
You want representation? Fine. Make an original character. Like Black Panther, Falcon, Storm, Luke Cage, Blue Marvel, Cloak, Dust, Thunderball, Shang Chi, etc
The first official Spider-Man derivative; Spider-Woman, literally was only created because Funimation made a character called Spider Woman in 1977, so Marvel had to get their lawyers out and make them change it to Web Woman, then to prevent it from happenig again, created a Spider-Woman (Jessica Drew) whos was so far removed from Spider-Man she might as well been called "Web Woman" since completely different character, which was cool...but then they made Julia Carptenter 4 years later further diluting the brand...and now we got over 30 different Spider-people its past the point of ridiculousness.
Miles however exists only because of Peter and only for social political propaganda reasons.
@@alaina4070 Not realy no. Unless you can convince me "wheelchair Spider-man/woman" whatever is selling off the charts.
If it was so smart they'd have done it 40 yeas ago.
Also, his comics arent even selling well which just further proves my point people pretend to like him; they only like the idea. Spider-verse animated movie was well made and appeal to mass audience but they coulda done the same thing with Peter in the lead hypothetically.
The whole idea of 'you need to see your own raceethnicity in a fictional character in order to identify with' is a fallacy and only pushed by people with a political narrative/agenda.
Because for decades people all over the world could identify with Peter because he is broke. Most people arent rich.
Peter Parker is known as just Spider-man because he is the original..
We usually call every other spider-man something else such as "Miles Morales", "Spider-Monkey", "Spider-Man Noir", "Old Man Spider", and so on..
This is so that people know who you are talking about, because if you just say Spider-man they will think of the red and blue Spidey.
Red and blue Spidey? You mean Takuya Yamashiro? Or Miguel O Hara?
What I don’t like is how Miles was created just for the BLM movement back in 2008
He wasn’t created cuz they had an idea…
He was made because people wanted BLACK spider man.
So that’s what the writers did.
Killed Peter and made miles.
I don’t like that personally.
Miles should be his own.
And miles shouldn’t be called spider man.
That title belongs to Peter.
The only proper way to reference miles is
“The Ultimate Spider-Man.”
Just like we refer to Miguel O hara as
Spider Man 2099
If I can be honest I’m really proud of this take
That's what I'm saying
Miles Morales is a spider-man. Peter Parker is spider-man.
I never see this argument applied to other legacy characters like, say, Robin. People just accept that Dick Greyson is Robin and so is Jason Todd, Tim Drake, Damien Wayne, etc. I wonder what the difference is. I wonder why a certain sect of fans want to cut Miles out and deny him the title of Spider-Man 🤔
Rasicm
My official terminology for addressing Miles Morales is still "Ultimate Spider-man," because that's the universe and comic title he came from, and there's nothing going on with Ultimate Peter Parker.
Exactly. Ultimate Peter Parker was even brought back after Secret wars, but now I haven't seen anything done with him since then.
So Miles is The Ultimate Spider-Man.
He can't even be the definitive of his own universe. What a loser.
@@sharavy6851 That's not his fault. That's on Marvel really.
@Sharavy
If Miles wasn't the definitive Spider-man of his own universe, Marvel wouldn't have brought him into the main continuity, continued to write stories for him, and abandoned Ultimate Peter entirely, despite his resurrection.
@@bluehero-96 Excellent point! And currently, Miles's comics have been getting some good arcs. I think.
I do agree with some of the points made on the other side of this discussion, but I agree with a lot of what you’ve said also. Good on you for trying to maintain civility in the conversation, not enough of that going around. Great video
LOL he's not trying to maintain civility, he just doesn't want this video to get back to the people who tried to lambast because he knows if he did it'd get his video ratioed.
@@matthewlane cope harder. Miles is Spider-Man
@@parkeranimations3671 Nope, just some dude in a brand x Spydor-Man costume.
Dude needs to go out & get his own identity, because Marvel is never going to kill off Peter Parker, which means Miles is always going to be the king of Peter Parkers sloppy seconds, always be the guy whose not going to be Spider-Man.
@@matthewlane you have no logic. So what if Peter is still alive? Ben Riley and Miguel O Hara both Spider-Man yet Peter is still alive. Are they not Spider-Man then? Can no one be Spider-Man? Only Peter can? Shut your ass up. You don’t get to decide. Marvel does. Miles became Spider-Man so he is Spider-Man. Even Peter himself in multiple adaptations calls him Spider-Man, especially in the comics. 🤷🏾♂️
@@parkeranimations3671 "So what if Peter is still alive?"
While Peter is still alive, Miles can't be Spider-Man.... that's why they call him Miles Morales & not Spider-Man.
"Ben Riley and Miguel O Hara both Spider-Man yet Peter is still alive."
Nope. Neither of them are Spider-Man. O'Hara is Spider-Man 2099 & Ben Rielly is The Scarlet Spider.
Neither of them are Spider-Man.
In fact Ben's entire identitiy is wrapped up in NOT being Spider-Man or Peter Parker, no matter how hard he tries.
But i understand you didn't know that given you didn't read the books in question.
"You don’t get to decide. Marvel does."
MArvel aready decided. See Miles is a character who exists to be the next Spider-Man but for that to happen they would have to get rid of the original, permanently....
But Marvel is never going to do that, so Miles can never be Spider-Man, he's stuck hanging around waiting for his turn to be Spider-Man.
He can never progress as a character in his own right, because the second he does, he's no longer the guy whose next to be spider-man & he just becomes "that guy whose his own character & will succeed or fail based on the quality of the writign of the book he's in that's not called Spider-Man."
And so Miles is perpetually stuck being the king of Peter Parkers sloppy seconds.... Constantly stuck in the shadow of a much better character.
Time for Marvel to pull a Nightwing on Miles & make him his own character.
It's not just about the money Spider-Man
ITS ABOUT THE METS
People really dont think he is spider-man
I thought it was a joke????
HE HAS THE POWERS, THE SUIT, THE RESPOSIBILITY HOW MUCH MORE SPIDER-MAN CAN HE GET?
Still not Peter Parker.
@@patrickdixon7202bro adjust your hearing aids this silly ass pointless remark was addressed dozens of times in the video
@@patrickdixon7202Right, because he's Miles Morales.
yes Shure you can have the bun, cheese, lettuce and ketchup. but you just have a bland sandwich, Peter is the meat that makes it a burger.
Miles is hotdog, yes Shure there both meat, bred and condiments. and both can be enjoyed equally, but they can never be the same and peter will always be the bigger more fulfilling meal.
@@mgallogical7114 idk man, i've been playing spider-man 2 and i liked used miles more than peter
Thank you for making this video, the arguments over this were getting tiring to see... People kept missing the point, no he's not THE (original) Spider-Man, but he is A Spider-Man, just like any other variant like 2099 or even more-so in his case. You made a great point about the naming, especially with your Peter B. Parker example, just because he's referred to his name to distinguish from others doesn't make him not Spider-Man.
Miles Morales is the best alternate version of Spider-Man
I respect that
Respect too
Truueee, I also love Noir Spider-Man, he's a cool S-M as well
And that’s the thing. He is the best ALTERNATE Spider-Man. No matter how hard Marvel or fans try to convince you Miles will never be THE Spider-Man and especially when Peter is around with him. I’m sorry but whenever Peter and Miles are together, Miles is just a sidekick. This is why he really works better in his own universe because in it he truly is Spider-Man. But as long as he is with Peter he will never be Spider-Man to me plus naming two superheroes with the same name in the same area is convoluted.
Your user name is tripping me out
I watched both vids and I can say this was a really REALLY solid follow-up to their video. I understand the feeling that a character feels the need to be referred to as the TRUE version of the character but to be honest... Spider-Man was appealing to me as a character bc due to them being completely covered unlike most other heroes, it helped me attach to the character more. And the countless other versions of him, be it Miguel, Ben, Miles, and others, I saw em as different people taking on the mantle of being Spider-Man and doing it in their own way, which I love greatly
I love miles. I do think he is the best alternate form of Spider-Man, other than Peter but I didn’t love him until around 2018 I think his character made it giant leap in progress separating himself from Peter in the last couple years.
I still think it’s weird to have Superhero identities be mantles that can be passed down or shared.
I’m used to always calling superheroes by their superhero names, when there’s multiple heroes with the same hero name I have to specify which version I’m talking about.
I found this annoying even with Robin in Batman comics.
There’s so many Robins now, I have to specify which one.
One of the Robins even became Batman for a short time, it’s ridiculous.
Agreed
My man you are speaking about things that happened 30 years ago like they are recent. Superheroes being mantles is older than Spider-Man as a character even. Ever heard of the characters the Flash, Green Lantern? Barry Allen and Hal Jordan are not the first Flash and Green Lantern, even though they are the most well known, they are both the second with the title, getting it in the 50s, you know, a decade before Spider-Man was created. That you were not aware of something when you were an infant does not mean it hasn't always been the case.
@@spectacleHD I mean, I know, I’m just saying I wish it were simpler.
Of course, it can be forgiven with Green Lantern considering Green Lantern is a team in itself rather than an identity created by and for one guy then later used by more guys.
Also I’m pretty sure the second versions of both the Flash and Green Lantern were straight up retcon reboots that pretended the originals never happened.
@@pjdougherty6442 Well, Green Lantern began as a mantle used for one guy. You are right about the last part, but only for a few issues, it was established pretty quickly that Barry Allen was the Flash of an alternate universe, IE, basically the same thing as Miles Morales started out being. Now, both Jay Garrick and Barry are in the same universe, so it is basically the same situation.
Also the first costumed crimefighter ever seen in comics was the Phantom, whose entire character is based around the idea of a legacy mantle, if you want me to go back even more.
There is two scarlet spiders. Don't hear anybody saying Kaine or Ben isn't scarlet spider.
Exactly, when two spiders have the same name nobody says anything (this happens more often with the Spider-Woman name) but when is about Miles Morales they cry hard
As a long time fan of miles, thanks for this, I don't know where this entire argument of miles being Peter lite came from but it is ridiculous, I don't remember Peter having a burglar uncle or constantly trying to live up to a mantle and prove himself. Its so obvious that they've never read Miles either
Precisely. People these days need to learn to grow up.
My theory is that its people who watched Godzilla Mendoza's "Into the Spider-Verse - The Problem With Miles" video and didn't pay attention or watch his other vids about miles so they left with the wrong message. They left thinking "miles is just a race swapped peter" instead of "miles' character was a tad underdeveloped before into the spider-verse and deserved more."
Not to mention Miles isn't an orphan like Peter.
@@scifiguy9000 Exactly. Miles still has family that he can return home to after Spider-Manning or something, whereas Peter has basically no one except his Aunt May.
@@milesmorales-intothespider9861 uhm....
I believe a good way to explain this is by using Robin from DC Comics. There are multiple characters that held the title - Dick Grayson, Jason Todd, Tim Drake, etc. However, we never thought about why there are multiple Robins. The reason why is because Robin was leading the Teen Titans and they wanted Batman to still have a sidekick, so they created Jason Todd. Unfortunately, he was absolutely hated, and when he was infamously brutalized, the audience had the choice to save or kill him; and we all know what happened after that.
After all of that, they still wanted Batman to have a sidekick by giving him Tim Drake. This devolved into making it a tradition to create a new sidekick for the Bat Family.
Now, the reason why I am telling you this is because this exact thing is happening with Spider-Man. Peter dies in the Ultimate comics and Miles becomes his successor. He was later brought to the main universe by the Secret Wars event. Then there is Spider-Gwen, a character originally created for a variant cover of a comic that was beloved. She got her own universe and apparently jumps into Earth-616 to hang out with the other Spider-Mans. The point is that New York will be filled with a Spider-Family like Gotham’s Bat Family in a couple decades., the way it’s heading.
the Robin that was ¨brutalized¨ was Jason Todd: the Srcond Robin
@@felixmartinez1100 THANK YOU!!!
I felt I screwed something up hold on…
Onlyyyyy there was never two people being called ROBIN at once. With Spider-Man there has been.
@@nighthero_gaming9021 That is true as far as I know. However, there are multiple spin offs that feature multiple Robins, like Batman: Wayne Family Adventures.
Also, DC comics also have multiple Green Lanterns at the same time; with Hal Jordan and John Stewart being two iconic examples.
Finally, I didn’t think I need to mention this, but the Spider-Verse comics made everyone use to the concept of multiple Spider-Mans.
@@Gabriel-doodle Meanwhile the two spidermen are sharing the EXACT SAME city WITH THE EXACT SAME SUPER HERO NAME. - it's odd. Also, with the green lanterns... Don't they ever really focus on the one?
I dunno I don't care about DC much other than BatMan tbh.
Most people are going to be confused about the same name thing. Just how it'll be. And just cause a comic does something in the past doesn't mean it was a good decision.
Anyway I digress. Think what you want guys.
Miles is “a” Spider-Man, not “the” Spider-Man
Spider-Person.
This is where the fun begins… wait wrong franchise-
Whether or not Miles is Spider-Man isn't really up for debate. Whether or not he's a good Spider-Man or should be Spider-Man is however. Personally I think he's an ok character but he'll never be a particularly good character unless he can get out of Peter's shadow. Permanently getting rid of Peter either by killing him or having him retire simply isn't a option (Because it would make fans of Peter hate Miles), so the best thing to do for Miles would be to give him his own completely original identity. If Miles's main character trait is being individual and creative than why would he in universes where he and Peter coexist not have his own name and look that aren't based on another hero? In the Ultimate Universe and Spider-Verse he's Spider-Man to honor the original Spider-Man which makes perfect sense. But in 616 and the games it just feels like he didn't want to come up with own his thing so he just put on a recolored Spidey suit called himself Spider-Man and called it a day.
Anyone could have gotten bitten by the spider, anyone could be under the mask.
-Stan Lee
Honestly my biggest issue with Miles Morales Spider-Man is that he doesn't have enough stories that are just about him. His uncle being a villain that he has to fight is pretty much the best I've seen from him aside from that almost everything I remember about him is some slightly different take or Peter Parker stories. Including his recent clone saga.
True, I hope Across The Spider-Verse can give him a good story that doesn’t revolve around the same Prowler storyline Miles usually gets stuck with
Him dating Gwen is kinda interesting plus in the ultimate comics he loses his mom which is a big story moment
@@-Teague- I don't remember him losing his mom though that probably happened before Secret Wars so he probably got his mother back. I will tell you this his dating Gwen Stacy is a what-if Peter Parker and Gwen Stacy's relationship worked out because they both had spider powers or at least that when it looks like to me
@@eliandervalderen5849 yeah she's back now post secret wars but it was a pretty big deal at the time. Spider-gwen and miles have very different personalities from OG Peter and Gwen so idk if it's a full on what if but I see what you mean
i think his story is that the fact that he is, ultimately, not unique in his experience / having similar stories to be the story itself. it’s an exploration on how he can confront that and still retain the sense of self and grapple with it. i think what drew me to miles’ story was the existential horror of it all, how can he break apart from this mould how he can use his experience of knowing what might happen / how his life could play out to break free . how he can hold tight to his sense of self . in part his story is interesting because of the butterfly effect that the characters in his story like his uncle play the same roles but how do their differences to what we know change how the story may play out or do these different personalities have no effect on the ending, is everything pre determined etc. sorry if this doesn’t make sense ckkskfowo
I very much so didn't like miles in the original ultimate comics. However the newer versions of the character aka spiderverse and ps4 have made me fall in love with miles spider-man. He's among my top 5 spider-men only beat out by Peter, Miguel, and Ben. And frankly I'd take him over recent ben
Yeah I sort of treat those as my reintroduction to miles morales since I never really got attached to the character and into the spider verse and ps4 he’s awesome
Yeah comics Miles was pretty shit tier, he has gotten way better at least in other media, the ultimate spiderman cartoon show, into the spiderverse and ps4 have done leaps and bounds for him
@@valeria262I thought his storyline in the Ultimate Spider-Man comics were great.
Miles vs Prowler
Miles vs Venom
Peter returns
Spider-Man no more
And recently at the time I'm writing this, Miles gets a sword (I don't know the title of the comic.)
It's also worth noting that refering to legacy characters by their names isn't limited to Spider-Man, like, when you talking to someone about Robin you pretty much always refer to them as "Damian Wayne Robin" or, "Jason Todd Robin" or when you're talking about the flash you always say "Barry Allen Flash" or "Wally West Flash" but you don't see anyone saying that any of those characters "aren't the real Robin" or "not the real Flash" so why would it be any different with Spider-Man?
The difference is that in those cases you mentioned (except for Wall and Barry both wearing the name Flash in DC Rebirth, which is just as stupid as having two Spider-Men in the same universe) the mantle was inherited and there weren't multiple characters wearing the same monicker. Every Robin didn't become the next one until the previous one stopped wearing the mantle and when Damian became Robin Tim Drake became Red Robin, same goes for all the other cases you mentioned.
Miles wearing the name Spider-Man made sense when he was created and replaced Peter who died in the Ultimate continuity (same goes the Spiderverse movie continuity), but then when Miles came over to 616 it became stupid, just as it is stupid in the Insomniac games.
Miles deserves so much better instead permanently stuck in Peter Parker's shadow and needs, no must get his own identity to survive because at the end of the day when people think Spiderman it's Peter Parker, not Miles Morales and that will never change
The fundamental problem is that people see Spider-Man as a mantle like Black Panther. That's simply not accurate. Black Panther was a title passed down in the royal line in Wakanda. Where Spider-Man is a character and not a mantle of any kind. Marvel and DC as well have tried making some of their characters "mantles" as well and it just falls flat. Don't get me wrong, they didn't all fall because they were badly written, (it didn't help though) but because the concept is faulty.
except it fully is a mantle, why would u even try to argue that it isn’t?
@@tommywright2487 They are trying to call Spider-Man a mantle so that they can reinvent him as a new character. I get why they are doing it: they simply don't have the imagination to create new heroes. What Marvel and DC have been doing with some of their heroes is basically using the names of the heroes as if they were character skins from a Mortal Kombat game and inserting a new identity into the hero.
I can understand why that's confusing to some people. Black Panther is a title bestowed upon the leader and protector of Wakanda and goes with the crown. That's the difference between Black Panther and Spider-Man. Black Panther is a literal mantle while Spider-Man is just a singular hero.
@@joeyellis850 but the mantle of black panther had to start somewhere, there had to be a first black panther before the mantle was passed down, just like the mantle of spider-man. It’s actually pretty pathetic that you’re trying this hard to disregard Miles and i can’t help but get racial undertones🤷🏽♀️
Why is the black Spiderman's self expression "vandalism" 💀💀💀💀
Bro damn 🤣
Miles is Spider-Man
But he’s not THE Spider-Man
Peter will always be THE Spider-Man.
Nothing Spider-Man could’ve happened if Peter hadn’t been bitten.
Miles is called Spider-Man because he dawns the suit, has the same powers, etc.
Personally, I really like how Miles was done in Into The Spider-Verse. I had no clue he was a thing until then tbh.
He’s a pretty cool character. He had great character development, great training, and overall has a great first outing on the big screen.
As said before, Miles is Spider-Man, but he isn’t THE Spider-Man.
That title will belong to Peter forever.
Miles is great. He deserves some recognition.
Either way, Spider-Man as a hero will live forever 🕷
(Edit: Miles has a couple different powers compared to Peter, but they’re still roughly the same power set)
No one's arguing that he's the OG Spiderman. They're arguing that people are saying he's not Spiderman at all when there have been a ton of other Spider Men without any push back.
Miles is called Spider Man by Marvel because they invented him with the explicit intention of replacing Peter Parker. That is literally the reason. The only Reason. And it STILL hasn't caught on.
Every other male character with spider Powers marvel has have their own names, with the exception of Miguel O'Hara, who ACTUALLY replaces Peter, because by that time, Peter is dead. And he STILL has the 2099 moniker so as to distinguish him from the original.
@@Alexander_Kalehe was created to succeed an alternate universe Peter Parker, and has caught on big time. Go to the theaters recently? Oh right, everything’s probably too “woke” for you
I’ve never heard anyone say he isn’t spider-man. In pretty much every universe with Miles in it he’s the legitimate successor to Peter Parker’s Spider-Man, sanctioned by the original to take the title. That’s literally all the proof you need.
2:42 again, thats where you can easily flip it around and say "peter parker isnt spiderman because we call him peter parker" its just his default legal name 💀💀
I think the main thing here is that you guys are discussing two different points.
PSM is saying Miles Morales is A Spider-Man
While JustSomeGuy is saying Miles Morales is not THE Spider-Man
You have heard JustSomeGuy say that Miles Morales is not A Spiderman.
You have received this information with your own ears.
You know very well that what you're saying is completely incorrect, yet you keep saying it.
Kinda sad my guy.
What if we used these arguments on other super heroes like in DC
1) Batman is not Batman because he wouldn't have to keep telling people he is Batman.
2) Wally west isn't the flash cause when we're talking about Wally west, we have to say Wally west. Barry Allen isn't the flash because when we're talking about Barry Allen, he's addressed as Barry Allen
3) Raven (an Emo girl daughter of a witch and an alien creature constantly mistaken as a demon or the devil himself, with significant powers tied to her emotions, so she has to show no emotion to keep it at bay) is a blank slate with no neat character archs.
4) Batman is so uninteresting, DC created a what if series, where they see what would have happened if Bruce Wayne was a different super hero (dark knights metal)
Anyways, I just saw the other video before this one LITERALLY today early morning so seeing this is a breath of fresh air. You've earned a sub man, I couldn't agree more with everything you have said.
I don't fully understand your point at all. But DC is about the legacy of Superheros unlike Marvel, so Dc tends to have more and better mantle's.
@@therealdoctordoom5912 What the fuck are you talking about
Real Spider-Man fans never argue on these topics because they know that
Anyone can wear the mask. A hero can be anyone even a man doing something as simple and reassuring as putting a coat over young boy's shoulder to let him know the world hadn't ended yet.
The point isn't that Miles can't be a hero
The point is that he isn't Spider Man. He's not.
He's Spider Homie.
based dark knight rises reference
@@EF-fc4du Exactly, I just wish they gave him his own original hero name, instead it seems like they’re taking everything that’s already been established for Peter and giving them to Miles. His name, his powers, his villains, his personality, he even dated Gwen Stacy ffs
@@Johnnysmithy24 in most versions where miles is Spiderman is because there is no Peter. Yeah in universes where there is Peter he probably should go by a different name but usually kid arachnid is chosen which is a bad name.
@@randomahnameisthename3147Better than fucking “Spin”
I'm on the fence with this.
In Miles' original appearance, and most recently 'Spider-Verse', Miles becomes Spider-Man AFTER Peter Parker dies. Meaning he takes up the mantle, and becomes the new Spider-Man. This makes sense, and in this instance I would agree that Miles Morales IS Spider-Man, because he is the only one, and he's there to fill the hole left by the original.
However, in cases where Miles becomes Spider-Man while Peter is still alive AND ALSO Spider-Man (most notably the Insomniac Games), it REALLY bugs me that Miles doesn't give himself an alternate identity to differentiate himself from Peter. They're both just called Spider-Man. The only way for people in universe (who don't know their real names) to differentiate between them, would be to literally call Miles 'The Black Spider-Man'... like, really?? One of the main morals of Miles' story is that he shouldn't try to replicate the original Spider-Man, but instead do his own thing and be his own man, yet he's still just gonna copy his identity?
It makes sense as a successor, not as a partner.
But he doesn't copy Peter's identity as Spidey at all. He has his own style, his own way of doing things, his own way of stopping crime and his own sense of being a hero.
Yes, he's in 616 but he's the Spider-Man of Brooklyn and Peter's the Spider-Man of Manhattan. They protect 2 different parts of New York and that's another way for people to differentiate them. Along with Miles's additional powers too.
That and Miles doesn't tell jokes all that much, if he does, they're really bad ones. He needs to work on them for real.
So there's that. Plus, Peter doesn't see him as someone who steals his identity as a hero. To him, they're equals, BOTH of them share the name Spider-Man and he's proud of that.
They're both Spider-Man and they do so much good together as Spider-Man that Peter's proud to have someone like Miles as both his partner and successor.
Well this is also something he said in the recent comics too.😅
There are multiple Green Lanterns at once and they're all called Green Lantern. It's really not that difficult. It's a title, like being a cop. You're Spider-Man. I'm Spider-Man.
I know this isn't in the comics, but in the Ultimate cartoon he was given the name "Kid Arachnid". Not the best, but it was a start
@@GoliathWarfare Exactly, it’s not exclusive to one person.
@@GoliathWarfare can bro not make up his own name though?😂😂 why he need to hop on spider-man dick like that
I do actually see both sides to the argument in this case. I can see the argument of anyone being Spider-man but I also see people saying that Peter made that identity and Miles just used it.
That wasn't JSG's argument.
What's so great about spiderman is that there could be anyone under the mask, yet when you see him you don't think of race or gender or whatever. - some wise guy
The gender part is pretty bs, he's called Spider-Man, not just Spider.
He said that Mile’s defining character trait is that he’s black? Sounds like he’s projecting his internal bias there.
Funny enough that’s like half the reason I like him. I feel like there are a lot of characters where their whole defining trait is that they’re black or white or asian. And Miles is so much more.
The only issue with miles’ original stories is that he didn’t have his own villains outside of prowler, and even then that’s being changed in the current comics
Prowler is a Peter Parker character, literally started out as a Peter Parker villain.
Just another example of how Miles is the king of Peter Parkers sloppy seconds.
@@matthewlane except they tie prowler into miles in a way not done for Spider-Man.
@@oraclescrolls Doesn't matter, it's still tied in to Peter Parker first. Which means it's not "his own villain" it's a co-opted Peter Parker villain.
Just another example of how Miles is the King of Peter Parkers sloppy seconds.
@@matthewlane not exactly. While prowler originally fought Peter, his relationship with miles is completely different as he is Miles’ uncle. This allows for completely different feeling while they fight as it isn’t another villain of the week. It’s a nephew fighting someone he loves and wants to redeem. That’s not sloppy seconds, that’s a unique dynamic.
@@matthewlane there's a lot of villains that used to be Spider-Man villains (FIRST) that are now villains for other Heroes, but I'm 100% sure you wouldn't say that's just Peter's sloppy seconds, you're only saying it because we're talking about Miles Morales
Mfs are ok with a spider man that is a pig and one who is a literal t-rex, but miles can't be spider man... I think I have a clue for why that is but imma keep it for myself
Spider-People not Spider-Man.
To me, Miles always felt like what Robin is to Batman. Has the potential and strength to be his own hero but not as iconic as the one who started it all.
He still stronger than Peter
@@ThirsTDemon he literally isn’t but keep on being a miles morales meatrider
@@dantemcmillan6337 he literally is because he already beat Peter already but continue to cope...it's not going to change nothing for you fan girls 😂
@@ThirsTDemon no he isn't idiot. 🤣
@@spider-man500 yes he is dumbass...he's stronger because marvel said he was stronger. you fan girls hate facts 😂😂
Ben Riley isn't Spider-Man, John Stewart isn't Green Lantern, Terry McGinnis isn't Batman, etc.
Who TF is Wally West? Barry Allen is the only Flash ever! Where did this ignorant idea come from?🤦🏾
"um actually Barry Allen is not the flash it's Jay Garrick"-🤓
@@robertbay9354 Exactly. Look at all the characters you'd miss out on.
@@AllsparkSupremacy i agree
TL ; DR
1. Miles Morales is Spider-Man because Marvel said so.
2. If Miles Morales isn't Spider-Man no one else is.
If you thought he's actually going to debunk something, you were wrong clicking on this video. Just like me.
Sounds like all the actual arguments presented were debunked to me.
Not to mention how the message his most popular story, into the spider verse, is literally that anyone can be spiderman
You really think that message is literal right?😂😂
Yeah but spider-man at the exact same time? Same name?
Imagine if there was two Iron MANS. With the SAME NAME. We have War Machine. Which is dope. But he isn't called Iron Man As well... Because why the heck would they?
@@nighthero_gaming9021 did you watch the video?
@@bejitostk Yes I watched the whole thing. But this issue is bigger than the video went on about.
Anyone can be Spider-Man yes. But can someone BE HIM. At the EXACT same time Peter Parker, being called Spider-Man. Is ALIVE??? - Sharing the exact friggin name at the same time BOTH are alive and well? - Is pure dumb. Heck I asked my mother this question about this and she doesn't give a darn about super heroes and agrees he should have a different name.
I’m not the most well-versed when it comes to comics whatsoever, but have there not also been countless What If comics about different heroes taking up each other’s mantles?
There has to have been at least a few “What If Peter Parker was…” books before right?
Yup
Something tells me when drafting his video essay, Miles' race was Guys first bullet point.
I think the best thing for Miles would be to distance him from Peter in terms of identity, location, etc. Look at Dick Grayson. He doesn't try to compete with Batman in people's perception of the character, he is his own man despite similar methods, similar "abilities", and time spent under Batman. Miles needs a fresh location, new villains, and a modified persona to make him more distinct. The changes made in Spider-Verse and the PS4 were steps in the right direction, but I think we need to go even further with comic Miles to really live up to his potential. Take Miles places Peter has never been and let him do things Peter has never done. You can still even call him Spider-Man, but he needs that crucial characteristic that defines him like 2099, Superior, etc.
He has his own comic where Peter is barely a factor, people just need to actually read it before critiquing his character.
If you ask me, Ben Rielly is the one who actually needs to get away from Peter. Writers know how to make Miles his own thing doing his own stuff. Notice that he’s never, not even once, been turned into a villain to distinguish him or pull in attention
Have him be since his Debut "Ultimate Spider-Man".
This didn’t debunk a thing. “Because Marvel says so” isn’t the argument. When people say Miles isn’t Spider-Man they’re obviously not referring to the fact that Marvel is just lazy in making new characters. They’re talking about how Peter and Spider-Man will forever be one and the same and nothing will ever change that. The same can’t and will ever be able to be said about Miles. Go up to anyone in the world and ask them who Spider-Man is, you will NEVER get Miles as an answer. Ever ever ever ever ever. Peter is Forever Spider-Man. Miles can be lazily referred to as Spider-Man if Marvel wants but that will never make him Spider-Man where it counts. Spider-Man and who he is, is too much of a cultural phenomenon engrained in history to ever be changed.
Same goes for Star Wars. Yeah Lucas Film says Rey brought balance to the force but everyone who matters will forever know it was Aniken. End of discussion.
Are you brain dead or something? Obviously people will think of Peter when they think of spiderman. When people think of batman they won't think of damian, dick or Jason they will think of Bruce. When people think of superman they won't think of Jon or Connor they'll think of Clark because they're the og.
That doesn't mean we should throw away the whole batfamily or superfamily because legacies chacaters can still exist and make a name for themselves. Miles is still a new charcater so obviously he won't be as iconic as Peter but with time he'll definitely be in people's minds when they think of spiderman
But what makes Miles Morales different from lets say Spiderman 2099 is that 2099 doesnt aim to replace the original spiderman.
Miles is still Spider-Man regardless. Just how Joseph Joestar pushes out Johnathan Joestar as the next JoJo. They are both JoJo regardless of that.
That’s what’s Great about The Spider-Man Persona- it’s about The Person Behind The Mask First and not “The Mask” Itself. Great Video, Man
You're doing good Kai.
Just stumbled upon this channel and I'm definitely subscribing. I respect the fact that he decided to lay out his points without making things personal. And advising his fanbase to be civil is actually pretty rare on youtube. I more than agree with your points in the video but I respect the class bro. You deserve millions of more subs ngl
I completely agree. Miles is Spiderman... period. Saying otherwise is such an intentionally obsequious argument. Someone could just as easily say...
Wally West is not the Flash...
Damian is not Robin...
Barry Allen is not the Flash...
Terry Mcginnis is not Batman...
Johnny Storm is not the human torch
Carol Danvers is not Captain Marvel
Hector Hall is not Dr. Fate
Hal Jordan/Kyle Rayner/ Guy Gardner is not Green Lantern
Diana is not Wonder Woman
Jason is not Firestorm
Yelena Belova is not Black Widow
Jack Knight is not Star-man
Jon is not Superman
Sam is not Captain America
Shuri is not Black Panther
All of these characters held identities passed down in a legacy and sometimes at the same time as another character having the same name. Miles is Spiderman, people need to get over it
NEED TO REMIND THAT RHODEY WAS IRON MAN WAY BEFORE BEING WAR MACHINE
*IN FACT, BEFORE HE BECAME WAR MACHINE, RHODEY WAS PART OF THE AVNEGERS FOR A LONGER TIME AS IRON MAN THAN TONY*
_& HE WAS AN AMAZING IRON MAN_
They should do like they did with Ironman and War machine. Both where suits of Ironman but Tony's friend became, "The War machine", instead of another Ironman. They should have done something like this with Miles Morales.
“Anyone can wear the mask.
You can wear the mask.”
It’s literally the most perfect line
And I can’t believe there are people saying a character who has been Spider-Man for years
Isn’t Spider-Man?
Spider Man is a name, not a title. Anyone can wear the mask, true. But only one person can be spider Man. That is why every single other character with spider Powers that originated from the Spider Man comics has either a different Name or a qualifier to the name. Ben Reilly is "the Scarlet Spider", not "Spider Man". Miguel O'Hara is "Spider Man 2099", not "Spider Man". Every single female iteration of the character has their own name. Silk, Spider Woman, ghost spider, Araña. They are not all called "Spider-Girl".
You might as well say "Anyone can be Peter Parker". No. They can't.
@@Alexander_Kalethat is the most stupid analogy I have ever heard bruh😂
@@raytheswift422 Okay. But there is no analogy in my post...
The issue is when they make him the same thing during the same time the original spidey is. Like the new ps5 game coming out.
I love miles, and these games so much. But TWO spider-men with THE SAME NAME is a little odd.
True isn't that right been or otto or that tine miguel got atuck in 2014
Maybe if they give miles an in universe nickname, like some New Yorkers call him spin so they don't get confused.
Saying "Miles Morales isn't Spider-Man" is like saying Wally West isn't Flash.
No it’s not
@@Randomperson11121 yes it is.
Both Miles and Wally had to pick up the mantle after their heroes died. Miles Morales IS spider-man, just like Wally IS Flash. If you disagree, that's kinda too bad.
@@SUthunder14 or like saying john Stewart and Kyle Rayner aren't green lantern
@@starbreaker269 Facts
@@starbreaker269 or saying Johnny Storm isn't Human Torch because Jim Hammond is the original Human Torch
People really forget that ANYONE CAN BE HIM
Isn't that usually Miles' character arc? Miles proving to everyone and himself that he's worthy of being called spider-man.
Yeah the thing about Some Guy and usually people within a similar sort of comic book commentary like his the reason why he says Miles Morales isn't Spider-Man is because he sees it as a "needless race swap" for some sort of "diversity quota". This kind of thing is very typical of him and other people in his circle of comic book commentary on UA-cam. He does it almost all the time whenever it comes to characters like this
Exactly. And the fact that hes black and having these types of viewpoints… so embarrassing lmao hes a 🦝
The writers literally said miles was only created to be a mixed race spiderman because obama was also mixed. Its not like just some guy is making things up the writers themselves have said as much.
@@DirtyDev Where did they say this?
@@OGP2293 I'm aware for the of the story. The concept of a Spider-man being mixed race was already thought of before Obama took office. Marvel took inspiration from Obama and Donald Glover when they showed interest in Spider-man. DirtyDev there is being disingenuous I asked that question to try and get him to be more truthful. As you can see that didn't work.
@@OGP2293 and only one person mentioned anything about Obama's heritage when talking about the creation of Miles and they definitely didn't claim Miles is of mixed heritage only because Obama is.
It's the same thing with Wally West. He's the Flash, but we call him Wally West to differentiate him from Barry Allen. Jay Garrick is also the Flash, and the same thing is applied to his case.
Miles is one of the few legacy characters that I can say lives up to the title they hold
He's robin. Or Spider-Man beyond. And no matter how many new powers they give him or how much they shit on Peter to make him look better, this is always going to be the case.
To me what makes or a character is how much they contributed. Peter is Spider-Man because he gave us one the biggest rogue gallery ever. As well as the Venom and Carnage. Miles gave us nothing. He’s a parasite character that constantly living off of Peter successes.
And how many Miles comic books have you read?
@@Peasham 10. His origin. Both “Spider-Men crossover”. Some his adventure in the ultimate universe. Some 616. Not a fan, but I read some on occasion to see if he get better.
Always average. Most the time it just crossovers with Peter, where story goes out it way make Miles seem superior, it always come across has shallow.
Marvel constantly reboots the book so I never feel invested. What’s the point when just going change of a dim.
@@ffjj3964 So, Miles brings nothing even though he's better than Peter, and most of the time he crosses over with Peter even though only 2 out of the 10... issues? You've read feature a crossover.
@@Peasham
1. Yes, I read read some of miles crossover. But always feel plain.
2. It the “Character being validated nonstop” trope you find on the CW Supergirl and Batwoman. Where everyone has to state he’s the best, no matter what. It shallow and annoying.
3. Miles character always play so safe. He never loses or suffer or anything. Always just validation for being Spider-Man. So all of his feats feel plastic.
Twitter warriors love to cling to mediocrity with rebranded corporate marketing gimmicks. It keeps the low barrier to entry for lazy writing up with wide open doors.
But I guess somehow Miles Thor and Miles Wolverine really proves how creative this character must be. He’s his own personality. He’s definitely not just entirely meant to be a reskin character for traditionally white characters.
Honestly, calling that out is what should make even passive consumers of entertainment pass on what’s simply a bad marketing pitch. Sloppy seconds ought to be viewed as an insult to any appreciator of entertainment.
It's like saying Jotaro is not JoJo, Jonathan is JoJo
"what has miles done in these 10 years" um, I don't know been the front man of an entire new era of cinematic animation. brought an entire new fanbase to spiderman. gotten the character of spiderman more in touch with areas of Brooklyn peter didn't interact with as much, u know a plus since spidermans entire identity is being the friendly nieghboorhood spiderman.
Miles is Spider-Man