The U.S. has had 19 Republican and 16 Democratic presidents to date. More than 90% of American wealth is in the hands of less than 1% of the population. More than 70% of Americans are living paycheque to paycheque and many are just one crisis away from becoming homeless. Hundreds of thousands of Americans are homeless in one of the wealthiest countries in the world. The root cause of homelessness is the lack of affordable housing. Drug use increases the longer a person is homeless. Almost 1/2 of unemployed Americans are food insecure. Excerpt: The Iroquois Book of Rites, page 85 The Iroquois, who had seemed little better than demons to the missionaries while they knew them only as enemies to the French or their Huron allies, astonished them, on a nearer acquaintance, by the development of similar traits of natural goodness. "You will find in them," declares one of these fair-minded and cultivated observers, "virtues which might well put to blush the majority of Christians. There is no need of hospitals among them, because there are no beggars among them, and indeed, none who are poor, so long as any of them are rich. Their kindness, humanity and courtesy not merely make them liberal in giving, but almost lead them to live as though everything they possess were held in common. No one can want food while there is corn anywhere in the town." Excerpts from Iroquoian Women: The Gantowisas - Barbara Alice Mann, "Good Rule: They Assist One Another" Pages 205 206 "Cooperation was the primary means of production as people worked together in gendered teams. At the same time, communal ownership of the goods and services necessary to life led to the primary means of distribution, under which the Clan Mothers held and circulated the goods of life at regular community events. Under such a system, the traits of competition and individualism leading to accumulation of wealth--central mechanisms of capitalism--were seen as expressions of insanity." "When the Iroquois first saw the European system of hoarding on the one hand and desperation on the other, they literally could not believe their eyes. Montaigne immortialized their horror by recording it in 1580, after he had been lucky enough to converse on matters of politics and economics with three Iroquoian visitors to France. The trio was amazed that, among the Europeans some people were fat, engorged on every sort of commodity while "leurs moitiez"--their other half--were dying, famished, and poverty-struck, on the very doorsteps of the rich. The imbalance of the situation threw the Iroquois for a major loop. It perplexed them that the suffering half would put up with such iniquity. Why, they wondered, did not the dispossessed half seize the wealthy by the throat, or set their houses on fire, thus to restore a proper social balance between the halves?"
I've been married for almost 50 years. Excerpt from: Iroquoian Women: The Gantowisas - Barbara Alice Mann, Page 241 As modeled by Creation tradition, the Mother-Daughter bond was paramount in Iroquoian life, with the social sphere ruled exclusively by the gantowisas. Unlike western cultures, in which mothers, and especially mothers-in-laws, were the butts of demeaning jokes, Iroquoian cultures esteemed elder women as sowers of wisdom and givers of life, the guardians of the next generaton. Daughters inherited these mantles upon maturity. This female focus led to social practices outrageous to Christian patriarchy: inheritance through the female line; female-headed households; pre- and extramartial sexual relations for women; female-controlled fertility; permissive child rearing; trial marriages; mother-dictated marriages; divorce on demand; maternal custody of the children in case of divorce; polyandry; and female-appointed Hunting Wives. As Arthur Parker noted in 1926 , "Domenstic life was entirely controlled by the women, and they were regarded as the heads of househiold. Father Le Jeune recorded the same in 1633-1634. These institutions left the early European eplores gasping for air, so contrary were they to what Christian Europeans had been taught to regard as God's Immutable Plan for MANkind.
Thanks for this important topic. I believe that capitalism and the way we live have greatly impacted our mental health. On one hand, it is important to leave the family of origin and find oneself and on the other, we need to find communities that can support us and in which we feel home. Capitalism, individualism… social Darwinism… pollution and wars. We are a disgruntled society, world. We will have to deal with thousands of traumatized children and families because of wars, famine, illnesses. The nuclear family won’t be able to overcome all of it on its own. But at the same time, old models of extended families don’t work either all the time. Not for me at least. It is hard to find our own families, what works for each one of us, to make this world a better place to live. Too much to talk about. Thank you and look forward to hearing you again
This is incredibly thought provoking. So communal living is a reaction to adversity, but people from the earliest biblical times and even ducks have nuclear families. In my 2 marriages and several relationships without direct influence from the church for several generations, my husbands cooked more because they liked to, while I worked more because my work was more demanding. I had a child not because of external pressure but because I wanted to give and create. Childcare was shared. We cleaned up after ourselves while washing machines etc do most chores. Domesticity is no longer a full time job. What I have seen change is that money has been sucked out from people until it is no longer financially or emotionally comfortable to have children. And of course it is no longer existentially desireable. Less children is good for the planet. But the greed and inequity which has caused it is true evil. And in every direction, that evil has always come from and been protected by the religion which has been hijacked. I do not believe religion (as opposed to the philosophy and ethics most espouse) would have survived if it hadn't been aggressively spread by people wanting control.
For an excellent and well known book, I suggest Capitalism the family and personal life by Eli Zerensky. Written in the early seventies, the book is one of a kind.
Thank you for a wonderfully insightful video. As a gay man (65 years old and out since 1974), I look forward to seeing more marriages of this sort between two men. Surely, we can't include one gander in these new families and not the other. ALL human beings deserve a chance at happiness and love. I will proclaim that right to my dying day and last breath. I'm so glad for these new human possibilities. Thanks for posting.
All this makes a lot of sense to me. That's why we need immigrants. As people come to industrialized countries, usually called developed countries, they bring with them an agrarian attitude toward children and family. People on farms need children to help with chores and harvesting. They want their children to help them in old age. When immigrants come to other countries for a chance to improve their lives they may have more children than establishedf couples who don't choose to have children at all or as many children. Then they too don't want bigger families after they assimilate. We have built this country on immigrant and slave labor. Slavery neve valued the nuclear family ,though slaves did.. But immigrants did and still do value family and children.
nu·cle·ar fam·i·ly; a couple and their dependent children, regarded as a basic social unit. There may be an evolution of the nuclear family, but I believe it will continue to be the cornerstone of community/society.
In tribal families where there is no institutional law, there is no marriage or divorce-let alone lawyers. Very little or no money is involved in constructing a partnership between a man and a woman. The transaction is kept plain and simple. That is the way it should be.
Sorry for my initial reactive comment to your speech. I will leave it for the algorithm. Yes, I saw all this going down in my lifetime. Thanks for saying it.
I am so sorry that I had children although they are doing well enough (40 & 30 years of age) yet instill, I came from a karmic dysfunctional family where and when I was nothing but the scapegoat and a token. I over stayed my welcome. Then I went on to associate with like minded people who replicated said identities barring two children by these caliber of men. The adult karmic daughters treat me like a 2nd class Citizen instead of the loving, objective mother that I am. What a waste of precious time and great intentions. Thanks.
1. time is not piece of matter that can be wasted, as if it rots before it can be used. 2. It's up to you how you see it anyway. 3. there are plenty and enough people of the age group of your offspring who need someone like you who's prepared to give them the attention they want. Part of what Dr Fraad is talking about is that the old ties of duty, respect, obligation and affection based on genetic linkage or family connection, sometimes legally or theologically recognised, sometimes not, have broken down everywhere (decreased birthrate one cause they say) or are breaking down and (re birth rate etc) will not be reconstructed in the same way again. We are in process of finding out how to get the satisfactions formally expected or hoped from family from others and other sources. Your guess as good as mine how that'll go. Not that smooth.
@@bluewater454 There it is - the dumbest question that rational people like me hear every time we post a rational comment about lowering the numbers of our species.
@@bluewater454 Anyone's single death isn't what I'm talking about. In another video of Fraad's she objects to the downturn of human births in the world. I regret the reasons for it but it's about time. Obviously we cannot go on forever doubling our numbers on this finite planet.
@@bluewater454 _"Are you volunteering to go first? "_ This is obviously a troll comment. The video just pointed out that people are "volunteering" to it do all over the world. And who is screaming about it? Trying to make laws to stop them from "volunteering"?.
The more educated a populations woman are the less children they have. Money doesn't play as much of a role as we think. But yes, we are going back to a feudal lord system in which most people will not or never know who their father was.
The nuclear family is not and invention by the bourgeoisie. This is silly. It's been around for 1000s of years. Outside the nuclear family is the community. Also important, but to a lesser degree.
You make this sound like progress, it's not, it's just a different mistake. Everything we like and want in life comes from a person. If we are not making people, all the things we want and want to accomplish don't happen anymore. We have an evil class of super rich out to depopulate us, the tried to do it the early part of this decade quickly but failed, but managed to sow the seed of a different decline. Each sex has their own sexual responsibility to the human race, It's about time we all stopped being stupid about our selfishness, and look just more more step ahead.
Beginning a discussion about economics by focusing on the nuclear family is misleading and even irrelevant. As for the Vatican, that is counter-productive. You began with a promising premise of co-op economic organization, but then immediately lost your way. Disappointing.
Revolution has been happening for decades and I believe you are correct saying it is due to economics. However you confabulate the issue with oppressive patriarchy and communal living. Birth rates are down across the globe and we are heading towards a dismal and callous future. Stay on focus (the 1% elites) and purge the woke crap
Wow. I think I just learned something very important today. No wonder we have proposals such as "project 2025". And no wonder we have the MAGA movement.
That is what a hierarchy is... An imbalance in the power dynamics of a structure or institution, Marxism abolishes systemic hierarchies by democratising the workplace and political system. There will always remain non-systemic hierarchical structures but Marx recognized this, our aim is to abolish systemic unjust hierarchy
@@Betweoxwitegan Right. You mean like Wolff constantly stating his support for undemocratic authoritarian regimes like china? You claim to support democracy. Marxist rhetoric and Marxist actions never seem to jive.
If you do not have capital, if you do not own the means of what you are producing then you cannot even start a business, let alone a coop. You underestimate the costs associated with opening a coop such as who will pay health care? Who will control and provide decent housing and transport, as well as communications to name a fw fields. In China the State provides all of thi which is why the cost of labor is so low compared to say, the US. But by providing the basic services people need to live from work to recreation under a socialist system, the costs of abovesaid is born by the government who gets its money by taxing the plutocrats. The US is a rentier society and it is simply too costly for any business to operate in the US. No government help so the cost of labor has to be higher so people can reproduce themselves. Understand capitalism.
Thank you for confirming that Marxists support the democrats. They may not be ideologically parallel, but they are fellow travelers. And as we see here, a vote for blue is a vote against strong nuclear families.
We have communism now in the US. It's called the Federal Reserve Board, controlled by their constituency ... Wall Street, the handmaiden of the US klepto-oligarchs.
Is anything you just mentioned remotely related to the ideas and arguments discussed in this video? If Marx was a terrible father, does that fact make any of the ideas presented by Dr. Fraad any less valid or true?
@@alejandrosolano7421 It is only relevant in the sense that socialists have despised the nuclear family since at least the time of Marx, who openly stated his contempt for the “bourgeoisie”(aka, nuclear) family.
@@bluewater454 Marx's repproachable personal trates are not relevant. You're pointing in the direction of an important discussion: is the nuclear family a 'natural' institution or a historic product of changes in the economic landscape during the shift from feudalism to capitalism?
@@alejandrosolano7421 We not only see the nuclear family going back thousands of years in historical documents, we see it in the animal kingdom as well. If it takes a male and female to create a child, then what could be more “natural” than the family unit consisting of a male and female who procreated and the offspring of their union living as a basic unit of a larger community?
The U.S. has had 19 Republican and 16 Democratic presidents to date.
More than 90% of American wealth is in the hands of less than 1% of the population.
More than 70% of Americans are living paycheque to paycheque and many are just one crisis away from becoming homeless.
Hundreds of thousands of Americans are homeless in one of the wealthiest countries in the world. The root cause of homelessness is the lack of affordable housing. Drug use increases the longer a person is homeless.
Almost 1/2 of unemployed Americans are food insecure.
Excerpt: The Iroquois Book of Rites, page 85
The Iroquois, who had seemed little better than demons to the missionaries while they knew them only as enemies to the French or their Huron allies, astonished them, on a nearer acquaintance, by the development of similar traits of natural goodness. "You will find in them," declares one of these fair-minded and cultivated observers, "virtues which might well put to blush the majority of Christians. There is no need of hospitals among them, because there are no beggars among them, and indeed, none who are poor, so long as any of them are rich. Their kindness, humanity and courtesy not merely make them liberal in giving, but almost lead them to live as though everything they possess were held in common. No one can want food while there is corn anywhere in the town."
Excerpts from Iroquoian Women: The Gantowisas - Barbara Alice Mann, "Good Rule: They Assist One Another" Pages 205 206
"Cooperation was the primary means of production as people worked together in gendered teams. At the same time, communal ownership of the goods and services necessary to life led to the primary means of distribution, under which the Clan Mothers held and circulated the goods of life at regular community events. Under such a system, the traits of competition and individualism leading to accumulation of wealth--central mechanisms of capitalism--were seen as expressions of insanity."
"When the Iroquois first saw the European system of hoarding on the one hand and desperation on the other, they literally could not believe their eyes. Montaigne immortialized their horror by recording it in 1580, after he had been lucky enough to converse on matters of politics and economics with three Iroquoian visitors to France. The trio was amazed that, among the Europeans some people were fat, engorged on every sort of commodity while "leurs moitiez"--their other half--were dying, famished, and poverty-struck, on the very doorsteps of the rich. The imbalance of the situation threw the Iroquois for a major loop. It perplexed them that the suffering half would put up with such iniquity. Why, they wondered, did not the dispossessed half seize the wealthy by the throat, or set their houses on fire, thus to restore a proper social balance between the halves?"
I've been married for almost 50 years.
Excerpt from: Iroquoian Women: The Gantowisas - Barbara Alice Mann, Page 241
As modeled by Creation tradition, the Mother-Daughter bond was paramount in Iroquoian life, with the social sphere ruled exclusively by the gantowisas. Unlike western cultures, in which mothers, and especially mothers-in-laws, were the butts of demeaning jokes, Iroquoian cultures esteemed elder women as sowers of wisdom and givers of life, the guardians of the next generaton. Daughters inherited these mantles upon maturity. This female focus led to social practices outrageous to Christian patriarchy: inheritance through the female line; female-headed households; pre- and extramartial sexual relations for women; female-controlled fertility; permissive child rearing; trial marriages; mother-dictated marriages; divorce on demand; maternal custody of the children in case of divorce; polyandry; and female-appointed Hunting Wives. As Arthur Parker noted in 1926 , "Domenstic life was entirely controlled by the women, and they were regarded as the heads of househiold. Father Le Jeune recorded the same in 1633-1634.
These institutions left the early European eplores gasping for air, so contrary were they to what Christian Europeans had been taught to regard as God's Immutable Plan for MANkind.
They practised socialism. Share everything. No one is hungry or homeless. There are also no superrich among them.
In the West we are actively made to FEAR others, anything new or different!
Thanks!
Thanks for this important topic. I believe that capitalism and the way we live have greatly impacted our mental health. On one hand, it is important to leave the family of origin and find oneself and on the other, we need to find communities that can support us and in which we feel home. Capitalism, individualism… social Darwinism… pollution and wars. We are a disgruntled society, world. We will have to deal with thousands of traumatized children and families because of wars, famine, illnesses. The nuclear family won’t be able to overcome all of it on its own. But at the same time, old models of extended families don’t work either all the time. Not for me at least. It is hard to find our own families, what works for each one of us, to make this world a better place to live. Too much to talk about. Thank you and look forward to hearing you again
This is incredibly thought provoking.
So communal living is a reaction to adversity, but people from the earliest biblical times and even ducks have nuclear families. In my 2 marriages and several relationships without direct influence from the church for several generations, my husbands cooked more because they liked to, while I worked more because my work was more demanding. I had a child not because of external pressure but because I wanted to give and create. Childcare was shared. We cleaned up after ourselves while washing machines etc do most chores. Domesticity is no longer a full time job.
What I have seen change is that money has been sucked out from people until it is no longer financially or emotionally comfortable to have children. And of course it is no longer existentially desireable.
Less children is good for the planet. But the greed and inequity which has caused it is true evil.
And in every direction, that evil has always come from and been protected by the religion which has been hijacked. I do not believe religion (as opposed to the philosophy and ethics most espouse) would have survived if it hadn't been aggressively spread by people wanting control.
Professor wolf I work 60 hrs a week I can't afford to buy it new car. What's going on
For an excellent and well known book, I suggest Capitalism the family and personal life by Eli Zerensky. Written in the early seventies, the book is one of a kind.
Co living organizations... A brilliant idea!!!
Thank you for a wonderfully insightful video. As a gay man (65 years old and out since 1974), I look forward to seeing more marriages of this sort between two men. Surely, we can't include one gander in these new families and not the other. ALL human beings deserve a chance at happiness and love. I will proclaim that right to my dying day and last breath. I'm so glad for these new human possibilities. Thanks for posting.
2 straight men in a gay-marriage,😅 yeh ... that's not gonna happen (except in 'it's always sunny')
@@TerrorTerros It's already "happening".
@@pausereflect5911 im happy for the two of you.
@@TerrorTerros Thank you! Live and let live so long as you're not hurting anyone else.
He isnt saying that@@TerrorTerros
Why would want to have children in this day and age population and war no thanks
All this makes a lot of sense to me. That's why we need immigrants. As people come to industrialized countries, usually called developed countries, they bring with them an agrarian attitude toward children and family. People on farms need children to help with chores and harvesting. They want their children to help them in old age. When immigrants come to other countries for a chance to improve their lives they may have more children than establishedf couples who don't choose to have children at all or as many children. Then they too don't want bigger families after they assimilate. We have built this country on immigrant and slave labor. Slavery neve valued the nuclear family ,though slaves did.. But immigrants did and still do value family and children.
nu·cle·ar fam·i·ly; a couple and their dependent children, regarded as a basic social unit.
There may be an evolution of the nuclear family, but I believe it will continue to be the cornerstone of community/society.
Thank you for the insights
I LOVE YOU DECIDED TO BE ON UA-cam !
I enjoyed your historical perspective of the French Revolution and the causes that determined the development of the family.
Here Here!
Love this show 💕
A.I. is the end of humanity...
In tribal families where there is no institutional law, there is no marriage or divorce-let alone lawyers. Very little or no money is involved in constructing a partnership between a man and a woman. The transaction is kept plain and simple. That is the way it should be.
Sorry for my initial reactive comment to your speech. I will leave it for the algorithm.
Yes, I saw all this going down in my lifetime. Thanks for saying it.
I am so sorry that I had children although they are doing well enough (40 & 30 years of age) yet instill, I came from a karmic dysfunctional family where and when I was nothing but the scapegoat and a token. I over stayed my welcome. Then I went on to associate with like minded people who replicated said identities barring two children by these caliber of men. The adult karmic daughters treat me like a 2nd class Citizen instead of the loving, objective mother that I am. What a waste of precious time and great intentions. Thanks.
1. time is not piece of matter that can be wasted, as if it rots before it can be used. 2. It's up to you how you see it anyway. 3. there are plenty and enough people of the age group of your offspring who need someone like you who's prepared to give them the attention they want. Part of what Dr Fraad is talking about is that the old ties of duty, respect, obligation and affection based on genetic linkage or family connection, sometimes legally or theologically recognised, sometimes not, have broken down everywhere (decreased birthrate one cause they say) or are breaking down and (re birth rate etc) will not be reconstructed in the same way again. We are in process of finding out how to get the satisfactions formally expected or hoped from family from others and other sources. Your guess as good as mine how that'll go. Not that smooth.
I don't see a problem with reducing our numbers. Be logical. Can't you see that it has to happen at some point?
@@vivalaleta Are you volunteering to go first?
@@bluewater454 There it is - the dumbest question that rational people like me hear every time we post a rational comment about lowering the numbers of our species.
@@vivalaleta Hardly irrational, unless you think asking someone if they are willing to live up to their own own expectations is irrational.
@@bluewater454 Anyone's single death isn't what I'm talking about. In another video of Fraad's she objects to the downturn of human births in the world. I regret the reasons for it but it's about time. Obviously we cannot go on forever doubling our numbers on this finite planet.
@@bluewater454 _"Are you volunteering to go first? "_
This is obviously a troll comment. The video just pointed out that people are "volunteering" to it do all over the world.
And who is screaming about it? Trying to make laws to stop them from "volunteering"?.
Same as it ever was, same as it ever was.
The more educated a populations woman are the less children they have. Money doesn't play as much of a role as we think. But yes, we are going back to a feudal lord system in which most people will not or never know who their father was.
Amen.
I think we need DAO'S
💗🍃🙏🏻
The nuclear family is not and invention by the bourgeoisie. This is silly. It's been around for 1000s of years. Outside the nuclear family is the community. Also important, but to a lesser degree.
Wrong. Parenthood didn’t evolve as a two person job. You need a village.
🙏🏽🙏🏽🙏🏽
You make this sound like progress, it's not, it's just a different mistake. Everything we like and want in life comes from a person. If we are not making people, all the things we want and want to accomplish don't happen anymore. We have an evil class of super rich out to depopulate us, the tried to do it the early part of this decade quickly but failed, but managed to sow the seed of a different decline. Each sex has their own sexual responsibility to the human race, It's about time we all stopped being stupid about our selfishness, and look just more more step ahead.
Beginning a discussion about economics by focusing on the nuclear family is misleading and even irrelevant. As for the Vatican, that is counter-productive. You began with a promising premise of co-op economic organization, but then immediately lost your way. Disappointing.
Revolution has been happening for decades and I believe you are correct saying it is due to economics. However you confabulate the issue with oppressive patriarchy and communal living. Birth rates are down across the globe and we are heading towards a dismal and callous future. Stay on focus (the 1% elites) and purge the woke crap
Wow. I think I just learned something very important today. No wonder we have proposals such as "project 2025". And no wonder we have the MAGA movement.
We don't live in times of Chaos, we live in a time of extreme order..... Rigid conformity.
This notion that Marxists oppose hierarchies is laughable. You hardly oppose hierarchies, just the ones you don’t control.
That is what a hierarchy is... An imbalance in the power dynamics of a structure or institution, Marxism abolishes systemic hierarchies by democratising the workplace and political system.
There will always remain non-systemic hierarchical structures but Marx recognized this, our aim is to abolish systemic unjust hierarchy
@@Betweoxwitegan Right. You mean like Wolff constantly stating his support for undemocratic authoritarian regimes like china? You claim to support democracy. Marxist rhetoric and Marxist actions never seem to jive.
@@Betweoxwitegan Yes, and Marxists have always supported authoritarian regimes, defined by an “imbalance of power” in the hands of a few.
Yes well, the problem here is that Marxists have always supported authoritarian regimes - the very embodiment of “imbalance of power”.
Go ahead and start co-ops. NOBODY is stopping you.
Somebody is a disgrunted employee/wannabe billionare
If you do not have capital, if you do not own the means of what you are producing then you cannot even start a business, let alone a coop. You underestimate the costs associated with opening a coop such as who will pay health care? Who will control and provide decent housing and transport, as well as communications to name a fw fields. In China the State provides all of thi which is why the cost of labor is so low compared to say, the US. But by providing the basic services people need to live from work to recreation under a socialist system, the costs of abovesaid is born by the government who gets its money by taxing the plutocrats. The US is a rentier society and it is simply too costly for any business to operate in the US. No government help so the cost of labor has to be higher so people can reproduce themselves. Understand capitalism.
Which way does US/China immigration go???? Understand the red pill...
Spoken like someone who has never owned a business
@@genreartwithjb5095 I ran a small contracting business, and was on the gravy train a few times..
Vote Blue Everyone 🩵🩵🩵
Thank you for confirming that Marxists support the democrats. They may not be ideologically parallel, but they are fellow travelers. And as we see here, a vote for blue is a vote against strong nuclear families.
Blue like for Biden a war criminal x2. Red is just as bad.
No way for communism
We have communism now in the US. It's called the Federal Reserve Board, controlled by their constituency ... Wall Street, the handmaiden of the US klepto-oligarchs.
Go read about Karl Marx and his family... Talk about a terrible father...and terrible person.
Is anything you just mentioned remotely related to the ideas and arguments discussed in this video? If Marx was a terrible father, does that fact make any of the ideas presented by Dr. Fraad any less valid or true?
@@alejandrosolano7421 She's a full on Marxist.. Her father was in the communist party.. IT'S TOTALLY RELEVANT...
@@alejandrosolano7421
It is only relevant in the sense that socialists have despised the nuclear family since at least the time of Marx, who openly stated his contempt for the “bourgeoisie”(aka, nuclear) family.
@@bluewater454 Marx's repproachable personal trates are not relevant. You're pointing in the direction of an important discussion: is the nuclear family a 'natural' institution or a historic product of changes in the economic landscape during the shift from feudalism to capitalism?
@@alejandrosolano7421
We not only see the nuclear family going back thousands of years in historical documents, we see it in the animal kingdom as well. If it takes a male and female to create a child, then what could be more “natural” than the family unit consisting of a male and female who procreated and the offspring of their union living as a basic unit of a larger community?