Man, hearing this music over SFV makes me hope that Capcom will release some SFX and music packs to the store. Classic SFII and SFIII OST's, SFX and announcers, that would be so dope!
the jump is there to mitigate the risk of whiffing a raw throw due to a throw escape attempt. The jump itself typically cannot cover throws because this input is meant to come *after* the opponent's attack. If you jumped to preemptively avoid meaty throws you'd leave yourself open to meaty normals. That said, it's perfectly possible that the opponent threw you too late and you simply jump out as a result; matching your OS timing with your opponent's offense is crucial.
+joellera ah wait now i get it i think, basically the opponent's throw input would be successful in theory cause it comes during my 1 but the 71lp+lk comes somewhere late during the techable frames of his throw?
is there some way this can be applied/modified with a neutral jump so you could come down on opponents if they whiff a heavy recovering move like a command grab?
+eL Cueva definitely, just do a 181 motion instead of 171, just keep in mind it may not be worth the risk because you won't be able to create any distance by jumping away, and since you whiffed a normal you won't be able to block until you land and recover.
When i set the dummy ti do a button instead of throw, i jump but when you had to anything other than a neutral jumping attack, you blocked it but still did the input for 171+LP LK. Any advice on how i'm doing it wrong and how to better myself at it? I feel like im doing the input, but i dont know
+MikeandIke12 that means you're jumping too early. If you want to force yourself to practice timing the OS while getting hit by a meaty attack, you can try recording the dummy doing a knockdown on you and then do a normal attack or throw (make sure it hits meaty, of course). I showed an example that you practice without knockdowns because you can practice using this OS while being pressured in general, not just on wakeup.
+FMRoss not trying to start a terminology war here, fuzzy jump is what these inputs were known as in Guilty Gear, BlazBlue and P4AU. I know 3rd Strike had the same option select, I just went by what it was called in more recent games.
She can fuzzy jump, but some characters have really good means of catching your jump on the way down so it's not a get out of jail free card. If they're just trying to bait a throw whiff by stepping out of range you can fuzzy jump with little risk, since they'll generally just wait for you to whiff something on the ground and by the time they realize you're jumping away it's too late. It's only a big issue for a character like Dhalsim since his jump leaves him way too vulnerable. Chun-Li having an air throw is not an issue, in fact it's often times better because you can throw people right out of their neutral jump if they're trying to bait a throw.
Thanks! I'm starting to break more throws but I'm still having trouble blocking when the opponent goes in and does cr. lk, lk. It seems I'm always at the u/b lp+lk input command at that point. Do I do the fuzzy jump OS EXACTLY when my opponent inputs his command?
A big part of this OS is being able to "synchronize" your timing with the opponent's. The easiest way to illustrate this is by looking at the timing of the opponent's attack when he's trying to hit you meaty on your wake-up. In order to do the OS properly you will input and hold d/b at the same time the opponent would do a meaty attack, but I can't understate just how short this window actually is - I'm talking about holding d/b for several frames *at most* after your wakeup. Once you're able to grasp this, everything else should fall into place since the rest is just about speed. You want to input u/b LP+LK, d/b as quickly as possible, otherwise you leave yourself open to a second low attack assuming that you blocked the first one. Once you can do this on wakeup situations you can expand this OS to any situation where you're being pressured, you have to assess the situation and make the call as to when their next action is going to occur and therefore synchronize your OS timing with their action.
This is correct, you'll be airborne by the time you confirm what happened, so you have to press db again to cover the option where they do two low attacks.
+Mr. Grape when you block an attack while performing the OS, you're still doing the up-back motion afterwards, so if you want to block subsequent attacks you have to quickly go back to down-back. If you didn't do this you'd be hit by low attacks that come immediately after you block the first attack (this is why I set the training dummy to do cr.LKx2).
+joellera so if I were to meaty with an overhead, like ryu's forward mp or birdies forward hk it would blow up the os anyway? I mean I get that there's plenty of ways to blow up this os in the first place but I'm curious if that's something to consider.
+thwak this is correct, but you should keep in mind that any smart player would use this OS when *throws* are a perceived threat. Meaning that if you wanted to kill this OS with an overhead, you would need to get a knockdown that allowed you to get a meaty overhead at throw range. You can take this OS and vary it depending on the matchup and situation as well: instead of 171 you can input 174 or even 474, it all depends on how threatening you feel the opponents lows, throws and overheads are. This video is just meant to introduce the concept, so hopefully players will be curious about it and explore the idea more :D
+Jair Brian De la cruz Zavaleta it still works, the only relevant thing that changed is jump startup frames increasing for back and neutral jumps. For the OS to not work they would have to disable throw techs when pressing any up direction.
+JuPiTeR RaIN if you look at the number pad on the keyboard, the numbers represent directions on the joystick. So 1 would be down+back, 7 is up+back, 8 is up, etc.
It depends, in theory command throws always beat fuzzy jump because this defensive OS abuses the fact that throws have an escape window. Command throws executed at the same timing of a normal throw will beat your options because you can't break out of them. However, in practice most command throws are slow and require additional inputs to execute compared to normal throws, so in scramble situations where the opponent's offense isn't structured perfectly command throws tend to lag behind in timing by a few frames, and this can be enough for fuzzy jumps to slip out and go airborne.
Yup, the only requirement is that you match the timing of your OS with the timing of the opponent's actions, which is easier said than done but it's important for defending in general. In this example, Ken's second dash is the visual cue that the opponent is about to take *some* kind of offensive action on you. However, it could be any action as long as you're vulnerable: 1. You're waking up and he does a meaty attack 2. You block a jump attack and he walks up to you 3. You block a standing jab and the opponent is close enough to throw you 4. Etc. Hope this helps!
They're directional inputs based on numpad numbers, 1 means "down+back" and 7 means "up+back", if you look at the numpad on your keyboard you can visualize those inputs (2468 should be the cardinal directions for example, down left right up respectively, most keyboards should have arrows on the cardinal directions as well).
![[β] Soul-Stealer Nash | Bankrupting your opponents meter in SF5](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/hShBsODPcFM/mqdefault.jpg)
![[β] Soul-Stealer Nash | Bankrupting your opponents meter in SF5](/img/tr.png)
It's ok Capcom will fix this by removing jumping.
Man, hearing this music over SFV makes me hope that Capcom will release some SFX and music packs to the store.
Classic SFII and SFIII OST's, SFX and announcers, that would be so dope!
This hasn't been rmeoved and it's almost July. Think I'll start using it now.
Isn't the throw input redundant since jumping back covers throws as well?
the jump is there to mitigate the risk of whiffing a raw throw due to a throw escape attempt. The jump itself typically cannot cover throws because this input is meant to come *after* the opponent's attack. If you jumped to preemptively avoid meaty throws you'd leave yourself open to meaty normals.
That said, it's perfectly possible that the opponent threw you too late and you simply jump out as a result; matching your OS timing with your opponent's offense is crucial.
+joellera ah wait now i get it i think, basically the opponent's throw input would be successful in theory cause it comes during my 1 but the 71lp+lk comes somewhere late during the techable frames of his throw?
+toemaetoe correct!
+joellera cool, thanks! You're great at explaining these concepts.
+toemaetoe thanks, I'm glad it helped! :D
is there some way this can be applied/modified with a neutral jump so you could come down on opponents if they whiff a heavy recovering move like a command grab?
+eL Cueva definitely, just do a 181 motion instead of 171, just keep in mind it may not be worth the risk because you won't be able to create any distance by jumping away, and since you whiffed a normal you won't be able to block until you land and recover.
+joellera gotcha. appreciate the reply man. thanks for putting up this kinda content. more power to ya
When i set the dummy ti do a button instead of throw, i jump but when you had to anything other than a neutral jumping attack, you blocked it but still did the input for 171+LP LK. Any advice on how i'm doing it wrong and how to better myself at it? I feel like im doing the input, but i dont know
+MikeandIke12 that means you're jumping too early. If you want to force yourself to practice timing the OS while getting hit by a meaty attack, you can try recording the dummy doing a knockdown on you and then do a normal attack or throw (make sure it hits meaty, of course).
I showed an example that you practice without knockdowns because you can practice using this OS while being pressured in general, not just on wakeup.
+joellera oh okay thanks .. I figured this OS will be useful for people who love to dash throw or dash button. Ryus online tend to do it lol.
My fuzzy jumping is whack. I'm bloody jumping out of the throws and the ground hits....
yeah this will be removed when alex comes out..
We should call it Jump Tech as that is the name in 3s.
+FMRoss not trying to start a terminology war here, fuzzy jump is what these inputs were known as in Guilty Gear, BlazBlue and P4AU. I know 3rd Strike had the same option select, I just went by what it was called in more recent games.
fair enough
is chun li able to do fuzzy jump due to her floaty jump? Also because she has a chance of doing an air grab as well?
She can fuzzy jump, but some characters have really good means of catching your jump on the way down so it's not a get out of jail free card. If they're just trying to bait a throw whiff by stepping out of range you can fuzzy jump with little risk, since they'll generally just wait for you to whiff something on the ground and by the time they realize you're jumping away it's too late. It's only a big issue for a character like Dhalsim since his jump leaves him way too vulnerable.
Chun-Li having an air throw is not an issue, in fact it's often times better because you can throw people right out of their neutral jump if they're trying to bait a throw.
Thanks! I'm starting to break more throws but I'm still having trouble blocking when the opponent goes in and does cr. lk, lk. It seems I'm always at the u/b lp+lk input command at that point. Do I do the fuzzy jump OS EXACTLY when my opponent inputs his command?
A big part of this OS is being able to "synchronize" your timing with the opponent's. The easiest way to illustrate this is by looking at the timing of the opponent's attack when he's trying to hit you meaty on your wake-up. In order to do the OS properly you will input and hold d/b at the same time the opponent would do a meaty attack, but I can't understate just how short this window actually is - I'm talking about holding d/b for several frames *at most* after your wakeup.
Once you're able to grasp this, everything else should fall into place since the rest is just about speed. You want to input u/b LP+LK, d/b as quickly as possible, otherwise you leave yourself open to a second low attack assuming that you blocked the first one.
Once you can do this on wakeup situations you can expand this OS to any situation where you're being pressured, you have to assess the situation and make the call as to when their next action is going to occur and therefore synchronize your OS timing with their action.
Thank you very much for that explanation :)
But Chunli's SBK make fuzzy jump much difficult, I have to reset charging to avoid 28lk when I execute 171lplk.
Can it works by just pressing db, ub+LP+LK with small delay inbetween ? if not why ?
I think the last db is in case of multiple hits from the oponent. If you only press db, ub + throw, the second hit will connect.
This is correct, you'll be airborne by the time you confirm what happened, so you have to press db again to cover the option where they do two low attacks.
i dont understand why you have to end the motion in down-back? what purpose does it serve?
+Mr. Grape when you block an attack while performing the OS, you're still doing the up-back motion afterwards, so if you want to block subsequent attacks you have to quickly go back to down-back. If you didn't do this you'd be hit by low attacks that come immediately after you block the first attack (this is why I set the training dummy to do cr.LKx2).
+joellera so if I were to meaty with an overhead, like ryu's forward mp or birdies forward hk it would blow up the os anyway? I mean I get that there's plenty of ways to blow up this os in the first place but I'm curious if that's something to consider.
+joellera Ah i see... brilliant. thx for this, much appreciated.
+thwak this is correct, but you should keep in mind that any smart player would use this OS when *throws* are a perceived threat. Meaning that if you wanted to kill this OS with an overhead, you would need to get a knockdown that allowed you to get a meaty overhead at throw range.
You can take this OS and vary it depending on the matchup and situation as well: instead of 171 you can input 174 or even 474, it all depends on how threatening you feel the opponents lows, throws and overheads are. This video is just meant to introduce the concept, so hopefully players will be curious about it and explore the idea more :D
Does this OS still work? Or anything similar?
they don't because the guile patch that came with some jumping changes. Capcom is trying to get rid of the OS
+Jair Brian De la cruz Zavaleta it still works, the only relevant thing that changed is jump startup frames increasing for back and neutral jumps. For the OS to not work they would have to disable throw techs when pressing any up direction.
171 181 474 ....whats the meaning of those numbers...? motion. ..im lost help plz i will appreciated tnks
+JuPiTeR RaIN if you look at the number pad on the keyboard, the numbers represent directions on the joystick. So 1 would be down+back, 7 is up+back, 8 is up, etc.
Thank you much....I don't play keyboard that's why ,,I was lost ty ,,ur awesome
what is 171
does this lose to command throws?
It depends, in theory command throws always beat fuzzy jump because this defensive OS abuses the fact that throws have an escape window. Command throws executed at the same timing of a normal throw will beat your options because you can't break out of them.
However, in practice most command throws are slow and require additional inputs to execute compared to normal throws, so in scramble situations where the opponent's offense isn't structured perfectly command throws tend to lag behind in timing by a few frames, and this can be enough for fuzzy jumps to slip out and go airborne.
if they meaty what happen ?
+6700adam meaty attacks should be blocked when you do the OS correctly
Thanks a lot, I love you lol I Will train this so
+6700adam it is possible to do it when we block ( light / frame trap ) ?
Yup, the only requirement is that you match the timing of your OS with the timing of the opponent's actions, which is easier said than done but it's important for defending in general.
In this example, Ken's second dash is the visual cue that the opponent is about to take *some* kind of offensive action on you. However, it could be any action as long as you're vulnerable:
1. You're waking up and he does a meaty attack
2. You block a jump attack and he walks up to you
3. You block a standing jab and the opponent is close enough to throw you
4. Etc.
Hope this helps!
Ok.. Scrub question, but what do the numbers (171) mean?
They're directional inputs based on numpad numbers, 1 means "down+back" and 7 means "up+back", if you look at the numpad on your keyboard you can visualize those inputs (2468 should be the cardinal directions for example, down left right up respectively, most keyboards should have arrows on the cardinal directions as well).