At this point, CA should just make Sofia the "historical" branch instead of the "lesser" branch they've been keeping them as... I dread the thought of a Medieval 3 with the systems of Warhammer 3, but Sofia seems to be making some sense in how they're treating Pharaoh right now, like a sort of return from madness and a Sofia made M3 would probably be pretty amazing, especially if they got the appropriate funds and whatnot.
Sofia has some amazing ideas tbh - it's the execution that needs some work/funding. I share the same thought train,if Med 3 got the Pharaoh launch treatment,ooof... But with a full on focus,it could actually be damn good.
Old school Total war is dead. If you want it play the old school Total wars. CA doesn't want to make them. They are more expensive and therefore less profitable. The only reason CA doesn't outright say this is so they can string you along in the hopes of you buying the new stuff.
As one of the few Pharaoh players, I'm at least happy that they are continuing to expand on the game with more then just new factions. I enjoy the game and theres a small part of me that hopes for sustained support for at least a little longer
Hopefully - they chose one of the most limiting parts of the Bronze Age when it comes to cultures ( not when it comes to the drama at least ) - there's a lot of room for different timelines,asuming the game is brought back from the dead with tis.
Adding an RNG % oneshot mechanic in WH which already lets you mass destroy would lead to some hilarious moments for sure. Especially in monster matchups!
@@ReptilicusTV Honestly, I miss it because it makes the battlefield feel more dynamic where things can go either right or wrong without your imput. Nowadays TW battles feel sterile because that element of RNG is gone.
@@johndane9754 Completely agreed tbh,it's so unsatisfying seeing you dump a bunch of ammo into an unshielded unit only to barely get kills cause of the bloated hp/armor value - doesn't matter if the gold efficiency is there,it's just not satisfying.
I do like the direction here. You are never going to have the same unit variety as you have in warhammer so to compensate, you need to go hard on making things as tactical and deep as possible both on the campaign and in the battle side.
So CA is reinventing the bicycle introducing Lethality? I'm not really sure how it will synergize with the current HP system. Trajectories, visibility and map size changes are highly welcome though! P.S. And Assyria icon is absolutely massive, yes! 😄
Reinventing the wheel for sure,now the question is if it'll break down or actually roll for once ? Overall the changes are MUCH needed,now honestly I hope they reduce the HP because combining it with the current system with overbloated HP....it's just nonsense.
They need to institute wounded mechanics, especially from archers. They are removed from calculations during battles (they are incapable of fighting) but can recover a percentage of 'wounded' troops after battle (if victorious and resource requirements are met) and then a percentage troops can return to their units after subsequent turns. This can all be predicated on having healers and appropriate medical resources etc.
I love that they are bringing back ammo switching and making battles more interactive like the Rome 2 days To many total wars have relied on heros and lords having skills while units had nothing for a while
Absolutely love everything that i hear from the update team... Especially with the archers and the different tactical approaches we have now. Also so excited to see the Troy maps reworked with the new victory points.. I wonder when we can have a first look at all these..
The possibility of a instant kill through lethality always be easily modified, maybe archers have a lower lethality than infantry and CA specifically said that ranged chariots have a higher lethality than normal archers to balance their low entity number. Also by adding lethality, there can be difference between the clubs and axes, right now the clubs just feels like a lower replacement of axes.
the current ability of archers to ignore enemy shields maybe also increase their lethality, as in description it increases accuracy to look for enemy's weak spot
@@曾家旸 Clubs still break armor much faster rn and have their niche with the 2handed units. We'll need to see the final numbers for sure to judge but considering how fast archers fire in this game + ammo modifiers from the campaign....this is gonna be scary even with a low %
@@ReptilicusTV but the clubs don't have a higher basic damage or Ap damage compared to axes, so the benefit of decreasing enemy's armor faster are not very great. Also they are supposed to break through the enemy as fast as possible, suppose it wins the battle, but what good is it there to decrease the armor of the enemy that is defeated?
@@ReptilicusTV also that clubs don't usually have the time to decrease enemy's armor significantly to make much difference. They are chargers and are supposed to break through as soon as possible
@@曾家旸 They definately need to find a way to differentiate them further with lethality but right now they're fine compared to the wayyyy overtuned launch - there are still clubs that will body most units in a straight up charge or flanking like Hittite royal chargers or vanguard then there's clubs that don't scale past the early game DPS-wise since the weapon balance is so off. 1H clubmen are pretty much obsolete outside of meatshielding or as support units in the current version. On the topic of armor breaker it really does help out so much as the ratio it breaks armor compared to swords or even axes is so much higher esp. when fighting units that have Aegean Bronzework - it'll increase other units' dps too.
Oh bro 100 % feel you on this one. Autoresolve is already annoying with the way it calculates chariots so it ends up baiting me to play even something that's free a win.
@@ReptilicusTV I’ve found that the autoresolve button is just too tempting if I don’t play with the mod. And it contributes to campaign fatigue and boredom for me. I stick with the campaigns where I have to fight most battles manually, while I tend to abandon the ones where I snowball hard and nothing can stop me. I’m not even super good at the battles, I just like having to fight for my victories.
@@EisenKreutzer Campaign fatigue is real,I can feel that,once the snowball starts it's over.Rn i'm slugging through Peleset legendary to complete the achis ( missed some on the first run with them) and for the love of Zeus I cba fighting most battles so I ended up using t3/t4 units to actually force me.
in medieval 2, archers and crossbows simply changed their shot trajectory according to their line of sight and terrain. You didn't have to click anything.
@@ReptilicusTV No, I meant the Lethality stat. Each unit had a lethality stat attached to their weapons which played a role in whether it would kill or not. It was hidden info in the dxport_descr_strat file, commonly called "EDU" in the modding community.
Clasic CA. Remove a mehanic and later bring it back and say its brand new and groundbreaking. The game will still be bad and i dot see anything changing soon.
The visual combat are so arcadish and akward, they should get some more realistic approach in animations like they did in rome 2, shogun 2, attila, tob e etc.
Yeah the matched combat animations in this game are......nowhere near S2,let alone some of the insane R2 animations. I've seen soldiers kicking air. Knee jump kicking air.
@@ReptilicusTV yeah and those animations are recicled from warhammer 1, empire soldiers, some random and dull things like spin in the air with spear and shield, and the characters also looks VERY cartoonish, even with a better engine and better 3d modelling, they fail at this.
I knew chariots bad but still the game sets in Bronze Age so horseriding wasn't even a thing yet. Even when you play Rome 2 with Bronze Age Mod, the cavalry is always chariots(but their game mechanics is way better by spamming move order)
total war combat has just been terrible since the HP system and how missiles interact with that. individual models don't take damage, the collective unit takes hp damage from missiles. which means every subsequent missile will be fatal and melee more fatal after having been hit. i think rome 2 was the title that brought that in.
Also should work on charge speed and animations. No calvary or infantry were dumb enough to bluntly charge. It was more organized into battle and chaos as battle progresses.
the lethality is indeed what i did dislike here . in Rome 2 javelines and arrows were so bloody and deadly but in this game they take long and a soldier hit by an arrow doesnt die but if they are fixing this then this is even better news
Yeah I legit have jav units that earn ~ 1k gold value while dumping their entire ammo and barely getting any kills. Do they perform ? 100 % Is it satisfying ? Not really.
Yes, the first Rome Total War had lethality as a hidden stat, I think they removed it for Medieval 2 though, but I might be wrong. It was the best stat system in the series. Each weapon type had it's own lethality stat, so a unit was defined not only by it's own distinct attack and defense values but also by the lethality stat of their weapons. A weapon hit against an infantry unit could: interrupt their attack animation, stun(they fall down but get back up, like interrupt animation but longer) or kill(based on the lethality stat). It made for intuitive and immersive battle scenarios, since spearmen had high attack but spears had low lethality, short swords were average in both, long swords had slightly higher attack and lethality, axes had lower attack than swords but higher lethality, clubs had higher attack than axes but slightly lower lethality, same for double handed axes and clubs etc. Then you get into ranged units and range was specific for each bow/sling type, but lethality was based on the arrows/ammo used. Then cavalry had different lances, with lances being higher lethality than infantry units, with long lances being the highest lethality weapon in the game(apart from artillery and elephants I think). You really had to pay attention to what weapons each unit had, some cavalry had slightly higher attack stat than others, but then you realize they use short lances rather than medium ones. Then you realize A LOT of units had multiple weapons, each with it's own attack stat also, and you could tell them which to use, some cavalry had short swords, and if they had medium lances, you might be better telling them to stick to lances in melee rather than change to swords, some had maces or axes, which were superior against armored units, but if they had short lances, those had higher attack and would probably perform better against low armor units. Some spearmen had longswords or one handed falx, so you could tell them to switch to those when attacking other infantry. Some javelin units had spears as secondary, some swords or axes. Some pike units had axes as secondary, which would allow them to kill armored units way faster than with pikes while taking more casualties. The differentiation of units was at it's height in the first Rome Total War, it was all down from there.
Increasing lethality further turns total war into a crappy arcade game. Historically the wining side of a battle had between 5-15 percent deaths because winning a battles is mostly not about killing it’s primarily about imposing your will and forcing your enemy give up and flee. Sadly because it’s more “satisfying” for mass audiences to see the enemy die, videogames and other media will usually portray battles to the last man.
It really variated between conflicts succesor wars were for example rather mild because none of diadochi really wanted to risk it all for a minor extra slice of Alexanders empire. The punic wars however had major fatality factors because both really wanted to exterminate eachother.
@@rwouwenaarrw sure, there are battles like Cannae where Romans lost like 90% of their army. But the fact is that they incurred the vast majority of those losses after they lost the actual battle and were surrounded and could not escape. If we look at Carthaginian casualties it’s in the typical 5% to 15% range even for such a closely fought battle. And that trend holds up everywhere. Most of the killing always happens to the losing side during pursuit or encirclement where the routing enemy can not escape their fate.
Please don't support this awful game and company. There are so many amazing mods for Rome and Medieval 2 you can check out and the game is actually fun.
It should be more than just tweaking the game db - but how will it play out? We're either screwed or it might actually be the first step to un-fking everything.
What are your thoughts on the announced changes ? Huge vid dropping in a few days,stay tuned 👀
great the next f and q is 27 june the next vlog post is about Campagin Updates maybe we get then news to Dynastys
@@mariusbehm9874 Hopefuly the dynasty mechanic will be good
At this point, CA should just make Sofia the "historical" branch instead of the "lesser" branch they've been keeping them as... I dread the thought of a Medieval 3 with the systems of Warhammer 3, but Sofia seems to be making some sense in how they're treating Pharaoh right now, like a sort of return from madness and a Sofia made M3 would probably be pretty amazing, especially if they got the appropriate funds and whatnot.
Sofia has some amazing ideas tbh - it's the execution that needs some work/funding. I share the same thought train,if Med 3 got the Pharaoh launch treatment,ooof... But with a full on focus,it could actually be damn good.
Med 3 needs Naval warfare. Empire 2 too!
@@christiandauz3742 Don't get me started,I miss naval too much.
I agree. Sofia are doing good work. Pharaoh is turning out very nicely.
Old school Total war is dead. If you want it play the old school Total wars. CA doesn't want to make them. They are more expensive and therefore less profitable. The only reason CA doesn't outright say this is so they can string you along in the hopes of you buying the new stuff.
As one of the few Pharaoh players, I'm at least happy that they are continuing to expand on the game with more then just new factions. I enjoy the game and theres a small part of me that hopes for sustained support for at least a little longer
Hopefully - they chose one of the most limiting parts of the Bronze Age when it comes to cultures ( not when it comes to the drama at least ) - there's a lot of room for different timelines,asuming the game is brought back from the dead with tis.
Tell me, WHAT and WHY are you enjoy this crap?
@@TheMcMiodzio It's a fun game?
@@TheMcMiodzio I take it you're not a very mature person. So please do remember that people are allowed to have different opinions than you 😊
@@sativa-sloth6099the ai has gotten worse over time tho
Jesus...I wasn't ready for that League of Legends jump scare.
SCARS DON'T HEAL WHEN YOU KEEP CUTTING
tbh,i just uninstalled league a few days ago,got me the itch to play again,but i must stay strong,i will missed my full lethality talon build😭
@@alexanderlow919 The vicious cycle of league tbh. YOU CAN BEAT THIS ADDICTION (reinstalls for the 69th time)
If CA Sophia is gonna be the janitor team for Warhammer 3, I hope to God that they'll add these mechanics to that game as well
Adding an RNG % oneshot mechanic in WH which already lets you mass destroy would lead to some hilarious moments for sure. Especially in monster matchups!
@@ReptilicusTVWouldn't be that far off from tabletop.
@@johndane9754 I still have PTSD from some 7th and 8th ed matches..
@@ReptilicusTV Honestly, I miss it because it makes the battlefield feel more dynamic where things can go either right or wrong without your imput. Nowadays TW battles feel sterile because that element of RNG is gone.
@@johndane9754 Completely agreed tbh,it's so unsatisfying seeing you dump a bunch of ammo into an unshielded unit only to barely get kills cause of the bloated hp/armor value - doesn't matter if the gold efficiency is there,it's just not satisfying.
Really excited with all these news coming out. Personally waiting for the next blog to see the campaign new mechanics
Hopefully it'll spice things up hard
I do like the direction here. You are never going to have the same unit variety as you have in warhammer so to compensate, you need to go hard on making things as tactical and deep as possible both on the campaign and in the battle side.
Yeah,balls deep on tactics is definately a step in the right direction. Going back to the roots,just gotta see how it's gonna play out in reality.
So CA is reinventing the bicycle introducing Lethality? I'm not really sure how it will synergize with the current HP system. Trajectories, visibility and map size changes are highly welcome though!
P.S. And Assyria icon is absolutely massive, yes! 😄
Reinventing the wheel for sure,now the question is if it'll break down or actually roll for once ? Overall the changes are MUCH needed,now honestly I hope they reduce the HP because combining it with the current system with overbloated HP....it's just nonsense.
@@ReptilicusTV Exactly my thoughts. I hope they rework the combat system rather than blindly slapping "lethality" on top of it.
@@jangozubr Yeah we're looking at a whole giant mess here in the making if they don't tone down the numbers before launch.
Sea people dropping left and right ? sounds legit.
Turbulent waters
They need to institute wounded mechanics, especially from archers. They are removed from calculations during battles (they are incapable of fighting) but can recover a percentage of 'wounded' troops after battle (if victorious and resource requirements are met) and then a percentage troops can return to their units after subsequent turns. This can all be predicated on having healers and appropriate medical resources etc.
A really neat idea tbh - it's not a joke getting hit by an arrow ( and not just to the knee)
I love that they are bringing back ammo switching and making battles more interactive like the Rome 2 days
To many total wars have relied on heros and lords having skills while units had nothing for a while
Yeah,there's a bunch of stances on units too that make it more interactive other than right click and chill
@@ReptilicusTV Hell yeah, i remember the days of shield walls, tight formations, etc
might even purchase honestly
Deffo worth it after the update with most of the additions.
Absolutely love everything that i hear from the update team... Especially with the archers and the different tactical approaches we have now. Also so excited to see the Troy maps reworked with the new victory points.. I wonder when we can have a first look at all these..
Won't be surprised if it's in a few weeks,update out @ summer they said!
@@ReptilicusTV next week will be interesting also with the new campaign features... 🔥
@@Trigkas HISTORY CHADS RISE UP
The possibility of a instant kill through lethality always be easily modified, maybe archers have a lower lethality than infantry and CA specifically said that ranged chariots have a higher lethality than normal archers to balance their low entity number.
Also by adding lethality, there can be difference between the clubs and axes, right now the clubs just feels like a lower replacement of axes.
the current ability of archers to ignore enemy shields maybe also increase their lethality, as in description it increases accuracy to look for enemy's weak spot
@@曾家旸 Clubs still break armor much faster rn and have their niche with the 2handed units. We'll need to see the final numbers for sure to judge but considering how fast archers fire in this game + ammo modifiers from the campaign....this is gonna be scary even with a low %
@@ReptilicusTV but the clubs don't have a higher basic damage or Ap damage compared to axes, so the benefit of decreasing enemy's armor faster are not very great.
Also they are supposed to break through the enemy as fast as possible, suppose it wins the battle, but what good is it there to decrease the armor of the enemy that is defeated?
@@ReptilicusTV also that clubs don't usually have the time to decrease enemy's armor significantly to make much difference. They are chargers and are supposed to break through as soon as possible
@@曾家旸 They definately need to find a way to differentiate them further with lethality but right now they're fine compared to the wayyyy overtuned launch - there are still clubs that will body most units in a straight up charge or flanking like Hittite royal chargers or vanguard then there's clubs that don't scale past the early game DPS-wise since the weapon balance is so off. 1H clubmen are pretty much obsolete outside of meatshielding or as support units in the current version. On the topic of armor breaker it really does help out so much as the ratio it breaks armor compared to swords or even axes is so much higher esp. when fighting units that have Aegean Bronzework - it'll increase other units' dps too.
Installing a mod to make autoresolve more punishing is the best decision I ever made for Pharaoh. I fight 70% of my battles now.
Oh bro 100 % feel you on this one. Autoresolve is already annoying with the way it calculates chariots so it ends up baiting me to play even something that's free a win.
@@ReptilicusTV I’ve found that the autoresolve button is just too tempting if I don’t play with the mod. And it contributes to campaign fatigue and boredom for me. I stick with the campaigns where I have to fight most battles manually, while I tend to abandon the ones where I snowball hard and nothing can stop me. I’m not even super good at the battles, I just like having to fight for my victories.
@@EisenKreutzer Campaign fatigue is real,I can feel that,once the snowball starts it's over.Rn i'm slugging through Peleset legendary to complete the achis ( missed some on the first run with them) and for the love of Zeus I cba fighting most battles so I ended up using t3/t4 units to actually force me.
I fight 100% of my battles, and then there is an option to disable autoresolve for a campaign. Maybe try it too
@@Eruner279 i like to retain the option of autoresolving small battles where I either have overwhelming force or no chance of winning at all.
I bought pharaoh to support sofia
It all sounds great to me. Pharoah may have been a flop, but the work behind it should help future historical TW (provided there is some memory!).
Hope we're alive by the next historical release :crying:
in medieval 2, archers and crossbows simply changed their shot trajectory according to their line of sight and terrain. You didn't have to click anything.
This was a mechanic in Rome 1 BTW, it was removed in Medieval 2.
Was it removed ? Med 2 entities have 1 HP outside of the 2 HP on generals.
@@ReptilicusTV No, I meant the Lethality stat. Each unit had a lethality stat attached to their weapons which played a role in whether it would kill or not. It was hidden info in the dxport_descr_strat file, commonly called "EDU" in the modding community.
what were pros and cons of lethality in Rome 1? Compared to Pharaoh, how it worked? How fast were battles there? And what was the meta?
Clasic CA. Remove a mehanic and later bring it back and say its brand new and groundbreaking.
The game will still be bad and i dot see anything changing soon.
@@stefankatsarov5806 but why do you then watch
The visual combat are so arcadish and akward, they should get some more realistic approach in animations like they did in rome 2, shogun 2, attila, tob e etc.
Yeah the matched combat animations in this game are......nowhere near S2,let alone some of the insane R2 animations. I've seen soldiers kicking air. Knee jump kicking air.
@@ReptilicusTV yeah and those animations are recicled from warhammer 1, empire soldiers, some random and dull things like spin in the air with spear and shield, and the characters also looks VERY cartoonish, even with a better engine and better 3d modelling, they fail at this.
When does this update drop? I might pick the game up when it does?
Late summer I assume
This is great news imo
For sure,just hope the end result is good
It's gonna be less of a stat simulator? Wow we need this
Are battles slower or faster ?
I don’t like the battke system from rome 2 onward, so I prefer to autoresolve, also because manually doing it has less of an advantage
I knew chariots bad but still the game sets in Bronze Age so horseriding wasn't even a thing yet.
Even when you play Rome 2 with Bronze Age Mod, the cavalry is always chariots(but their game mechanics is way better by spamming move order)
That's the way it should be. That's a big issue with melee infantry in WH, their dumb health pool
I hope they atleast give us an iron age dlc campaign
Hope so too tbh,considering they added so many iron age assets already.
total war combat has just been terrible since the HP system and how missiles interact with that. individual models don't take damage, the collective unit takes hp damage from missiles. which means every subsequent missile will be fatal and melee more fatal after having been hit. i think rome 2 was the title that brought that in.
I genuinely miss the old system,this massive stat bloat was so not needed
Also should work on charge speed and animations. No calvary or infantry were dumb enough to bluntly charge. It was more organized into battle and chaos as battle progresses.
This patcho will be natcho.
the lethality is indeed what i did dislike here . in Rome 2 javelines and arrows were so bloody and deadly but in this game they take long and a soldier hit by an arrow doesnt die but if they are fixing this then this is even better news
Yeah I legit have jav units that earn ~ 1k gold value while dumping their entire ammo and barely getting any kills. Do they perform ? 100 % Is it satisfying ? Not really.
....this isn't new. This is a watered down version of old total war.
Yes, the first Rome Total War had lethality as a hidden stat, I think they removed it for Medieval 2 though, but I might be wrong. It was the best stat system in the series. Each weapon type had it's own lethality stat, so a unit was defined not only by it's own distinct attack and defense values but also by the lethality stat of their weapons. A weapon hit against an infantry unit could: interrupt their attack animation, stun(they fall down but get back up, like interrupt animation but longer) or kill(based on the lethality stat). It made for intuitive and immersive battle scenarios, since spearmen had high attack but spears had low lethality, short swords were average in both, long swords had slightly higher attack and lethality, axes had lower attack than swords but higher lethality, clubs had higher attack than axes but slightly lower lethality, same for double handed axes and clubs etc. Then you get into ranged units and range was specific for each bow/sling type, but lethality was based on the arrows/ammo used. Then cavalry had different lances, with lances being higher lethality than infantry units, with long lances being the highest lethality weapon in the game(apart from artillery and elephants I think). You really had to pay attention to what weapons each unit had, some cavalry had slightly higher attack stat than others, but then you realize they use short lances rather than medium ones. Then you realize A LOT of units had multiple weapons, each with it's own attack stat also, and you could tell them which to use, some cavalry had short swords, and if they had medium lances, you might be better telling them to stick to lances in melee rather than change to swords, some had maces or axes, which were superior against armored units, but if they had short lances, those had higher attack and would probably perform better against low armor units. Some spearmen had longswords or one handed falx, so you could tell them to switch to those when attacking other infantry. Some javelin units had spears as secondary, some swords or axes. Some pike units had axes as secondary, which would allow them to kill armored units way faster than with pikes while taking more casualties.
The differentiation of units was at it's height in the first Rome Total War, it was all down from there.
Definetely interesing new inclusions. We have to check them, and only 3 days to go! - revanhchismo
BETTER GET READY!
LoL back to rome 1 mechanics
They actually became desperate enough to half implement a feature that the community has been begging for? Keep the siege going, lads.
the beatings will continue
I wonder what's gonna be the cheat code for the next game at this rate,assuming lethality doesn't work out.
Wait what
Hype
big hype !
Increasing lethality further turns total war into a crappy arcade game. Historically the wining side of a battle had between 5-15 percent deaths because winning a battles is mostly not about killing it’s primarily about imposing your will and forcing your enemy give up and flee.
Sadly because it’s more “satisfying” for mass audiences to see the enemy die, videogames and other media will usually portray battles to the last man.
Yup,and I don't think people will get tired of stuff like that any time soon.
It really variated between conflicts succesor wars were for example rather mild because none of diadochi really wanted to risk it all for a minor extra slice of Alexanders empire. The punic wars however had major fatality factors because both really wanted to exterminate eachother.
@@rwouwenaarrw sure, there are battles like Cannae where Romans lost like 90% of their army. But the fact is that they incurred the vast majority of those losses after they lost the actual battle and were surrounded and could not escape. If we look at Carthaginian casualties it’s in the typical 5% to 15% range even for such a closely fought battle.
And that trend holds up everywhere. Most of the killing always happens to the losing side during pursuit or encirclement where the routing enemy can not escape their fate.
I still will not buy or play this game
Good to know?
Please don't support this awful game and company. There are so many amazing mods for Rome and Medieval 2 you can check out and the game is actually fun.
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
Is that even a mechanic? It's just more numbers and pluses and minuses. CA can't innovate
It should be more than just tweaking the game db - but how will it play out? We're either screwed or it might actually be the first step to un-fking everything.