How Star Wars was saved in the edit
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- Опубліковано 6 гру 2017
- A video essay exploring how Star Wars' editors recut and rearranged Star Wars: A New Hope to create the cinematic classic it became.
Check out more essays at / rjfilmschool
Written by David Welch (@watsonwelch)
Narrated and Edited by Joey Scoma (@joey2meals)
References:
Deleted Magic
• Star Wars Deleted Magic
Deleted Scenes
• Video
Harmy's Star Wars: Despecialized Edition
• Harmy's Star Wars: Des...
Empire of Dreams
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For a little more background on the edit. Marcia Lucas was told by George that she was an okay editor and she says after working with him for so long that was his only compliment he ever gave her. They got divorced after Jedi and she ended her career there. She was an amazing editor and Lucasfilms tries their best to remove her from the history of star wars despite her monumental work as seen in this video. I believe her absence is obvious in the prequels.
Editing is such a misunderstood art but you can see from her portfolio that she was exceptionally talented, much moreso than George. In a way, the fan revolt against the prequels was perhaps her best revenge.
odstlover George Lucas was, and probably still is, an ass with a narcissistic view of himself. I'll never forget an interview I saw of him around the time of the original trilogy where he is lamenting all these people talking back to him, doubting his "vision" of the story, wanting to try different approaches...and the whole time I realize he's begrudgingly talking about the people who saved his films, what an ass.
The Rosalind Franklin of science fiction.
Its such a shame, because George had fantastic ideas but simply was terrible at implementing it. Imagine how good the sequels would have been with editing like the original trilogy...
Yeah, editing is very important in all aspect of film making, especially before pre-production and on the script. Seriously, bad stuff happens when you give the directors too much leeway in the story side. An example of this is the crap that is Alien Covenant.
I kind of feel sorry for Luke's buddies who were cut. Sitting in a bar years later.."I was in the very original Star Wars, but then something happened...."
I feel sorry for Wedge - he's Scottish; and a trained Shakespearian actor as well.
But the Rebel Alliance only lets in Americans apparently (against the evil British Empire!)
So Wedge's dialogue was dubbed over by an American voice actor.
lol, i must say that is certainly the most epic 'fail' of all time! lol... oh my god... Each time someone say they watch star wars.... lol oh god....
@@jazzx251 Brits have made up for it in later and spin off films though ;)
I was thinking the same thing, wondering if they were watching it like 'here comes my scene! ... Oh...'
Although Anthony Forrest (who played Fixer) did manage to stay in the movie. He played the sandtrooper who Obi-Wan used Jedi mind tricks on.
At 13:35, C3P0 talks about the tractor beam. In his autobiography, "I Am C3PO," Anthony Daniels recalls that in 1977, after he finished recording his lines, he thought he was done with the role. But they called him back to the studio three weeks before the film was released, to record one more line: "He says he's found the main computer to power the tractor beam that's holding the ship here."
The reason the filmmakers gave him for recording the new line: "We forgot to tell the audience what a tractor beam is for."
When people say "this video is all lies" does that include C-3POs lines in this scene being done later?
@@sandal_thong8631 The only factual mistake in this entire video -- which sadly gives more fuel than intended (or warranted) to people claiming it's "all lies" -- is its claim at 13:28 that C3-PO's line about "7 locations" was added during editing. In actually, this line was never in the original theatrical cut.
It was added later, in the "silver screen edition" (the first "altered cut" Lucas ever released, in 1981). In general, C3-PO having new lines via ADR is one of those special edition changes so subtle and so pointless, that most people don't even realize it's there. Many people falsely believe C3-PO's new lines are in the original theatrical version, then baffled when they aren't there (I know I was). So this isn't an intentional error, because that was one of the _first_ changes Lucas ever made to SW, but the fact they got it wrong is now used as "proof" the entire video is fake (it's not, there are literally hundreds of sources confirming what it says).
@@Lady-Ythis video is nothing but a collection of falsehoods, half truths, blatant omissions and misinformation.
ua-cam.com/video/olqVGz6mOVE/v-deo.htmlsi=IQWFeUFoauJ3EopW
Cutting the Luke/Obi-Wan hut scene right next to the Vader/Tarkin scene where he chokes the guy out was brilliant. Because you have back to back explanations about what the Force is, once from the good guy and then from the bad guy. I always thought that was a masterstroke because you have this same powerful force juxtaposed and explained from two wildly different perspectives one after another.
I didn’t even think about it that way, really is brilliant!
When I first found out about how terrible the initial versions of the movie were, it made a lot more sense how George Lucas could be the same person who made the prequels and this movie. The editors should get a ton of credit for making this series as big as it is.
George Lucas's strength is world building and the amazing creativity and imagination that takes. When it comes to directing he isn't the best. His best work is when he is overseeing the project as a producer like in Episode 5 or Star Wars the Clone Wars.
Rekasha couldn't agree more. Dave filoni really took George's outlandish vision and was able to make fantastic stories. In the new movies, I feel like part of that is missing. Disney seems to miss the point that Star Wars isn't great because of storm troopers and tie fighters and at-ats and x-wings, it's great because of the fantastical nature of the setting and the interestingly realistic world that is a resultant of the story. Again, the one thing the prequels got right is the imaginative part of Star Wars, something I hope Disney learns with The Last Jedi.
I think you are underestimating the need to reintroduce Star Trek to the market. Yes for someone where all the films are in their memory, Force Awakens may see to not push things.
But for for everyone else it reintroduces and pushes forward.
Also those elements are things that attract people. Don't think imagination solves everything.
Neoblackdragon True, I do think that bringing in a new generation is a good idea, and bringing new life to old characters is wonderful but if it has no creative spark it just feels like a heartless cash grab.
He's also an innovator. Every movie he made introduced technology that had never been used before (or hadn't been used that way). Lets also never forget LucasArts.
In the original script Obi Wan, during his fight against Vaders would originally say this:
"If you strike me down, my ground will become higher than ever"
I wonder why they didn't talk about their last battle on Mustafar? Vader tells Obi-Wan, "When I left you, I was but the learner. Now I am the Master". That's not how it was at all.
@@gregr3720 "When i left you, my ground was lower, but now, my ground is higher than ever!"
@@DarkOmegaMK2 It's true, when he was just a torso he was very low to the ground.
Another 'higher ground idiot who doesn't know what he's talking about LMAO Surprise...
@@DJRitty Another lower ground idiot who can't even distinguish proper height, lmao, get back to your low ground where you belong, peasant!
I saw it as a teen in 77, in my opinion the sound sold the movie. Loaded with cool unique sounds for the special effects, The voices, and the Music was so well loved it sold as a double album.
Sound makes the difference! Ben Burtt is a genius.
It's over 100 year old classical music but i bet you didn't know
I asked for _The Empire Strikes Back_ soundtrack, but didn't get it. It must have been a double album too, and doubly expensive. Instead I got a record that had one track from SECO's disco groove.
When you compare it to some of the stuff in theatres and on TV at the time, with it's halfhearted computer noise and literal "pew pew" noises, Star Wars significantly raised the bar for science fiction. 2001: A Space Odyssey used a pioneering classical music score in '68, and Star Trek used original classical music scores in its run from 66 - 68, but Star Wars solidified these elements in a way that resonates to this day. Now that I think of it I wonder if Star Trek's serious take on science fiction on TV didn't influence Kubrick in some way.
How "How Star Wars was saved in the edit" was saved in the edit (sort of, but not really) - ua-cam.com/video/olqVGz6mOVE/v-deo.html
Fight the good fight!
"But I was going into Toshi Station to pick up some power converters with my friends."
"Your friends are such a drag on this story, we're just cutting them out."
You know what the irony is? By removing the scenes with Biggs, a major emotional beat was lost on audiences, so Lucas had to go back to the edit and re-insert the scene where Luke reunites with Biggs.
@@qty1315 no. it slowed the film down. we didn't need to see Biggs at the start.
@@agfagaevart It's 70s sci-fi, it's supposed to be a bit slow in the start.
@@qty1315
Star Wars did not start off slow in the beginning, if you've seen the movie there is an action sequence right at the start. George Lucas wanted a "James Bond" feel to the movie, where the audience sees the end of a character's last adventure, at the beginning. Interrupting the flow of that sequence with scenes of Luke and his pals added nothing more to the story. They were interesting to read in the novelization, but, they had to be cut! Lucas even decided to kill Ben off while shooting. But it was the correct decision. This video should mention that ALL MOVIES are changed by editing. Lucas still had his vision, and thanks to the late Gary Kurtz it was greatly improved!
@@agfagaevart The movie starts off with a slow text crawl, then a shot of a space battle which looks like two spaceships lazily drifting through space, then the action sequence begins.
So yeah, slow start.
Also, again, it did add to the story because we got to know Luke's pals who would die later in the movie. Without that sequence, it doesn't make sense for Luke to react the way he does later in the movie when his friends are killed, because the audience doesn't know that they were his friends.
Like 5 seconds in I forgot I was watching rocket jump. This was actually refreshing lol .
Holy shit I didn't even know until i read your comment. After watching the whole video. Lol!
Same here.
Yup! Usually RocketJump posts stupid pointless FX videos, but this was actually entertaining and also eucational for once.
@@kurkuless7719 None of those FX videos are "Stupid" or "pointless" As they're all incredibly informative. The hell are you talking about?
Ah yes... the line, "Evacuate? In our moment of triumph?" really highlights that the Death Star was "just sitting there waiting to be blown up."
Up next, how John Williams saved Star Wars by adding music.
It's based on a classical music composition called Jupiter. He modified it a little.
Try watching a scene without John Williams music.
@@mrkitty777
A little? Well, I guess Avatar is just Pocahontas modified a little because they have a similar structure. JFC people like you are so insufferable
I thought other people and myself like the opening 20th Century Fox theme because of nostalgia. But I read John Williams made the opening score align with that fanfare. Definitely better to have John Williams than to use classical music; it was OK for _2001: A Space Odyssey_ which is so slow, and we hadn't seen it before.
The score for _Star Trek: The Motion Picture_ was also good (they re-used the title for _The Next Generation),_ but there's too much staring at the models.
That one is actually true
Thank you Marcia Lucas
Trevor Estrada if you watch the "making of" for Lord of the Rings you find that Peter Jackson's wife Fran Walsh had a similar critical role in ensuring that Jackson didn't make huge blunders, like having Aragorn fight Sauron at the end. Lesson: always listen to your wife.
Yeah let's thank Marcia for running out on George and leaving him to look after the kids.
I'm glad she's getting more kudos for Star Wars. Did you know she also helped with the script? Along with Willard Huyck and Gloria Katz (although they all went uncredited, presumably since Lucas wanted to seem like he knew how to write). She also edited The Empire Strikes and Return Of The Jedi. I have nothing but love for the woman.
P Ferreira Why are you shitting on a woman you don't know about her divorce arrangements? What does that have to do with anything? What does it have to do with you? Oh I get it, someone is giving credit to someone other than George Lucas for Star Wars huh? That upsets you doesn't it?
Read a little deeper and don't believe every piece of bullshit you have been brought up to believe about who was responsible for Star Wars. I was brought up with that belief too but, after the prequel trilogy (when I couldn't understand how the man who made Star Wars could make three such ineffective films), I researched a little deeper. The more I researched, the more it became obvious that one of my childhood heroes was not responsible for a lot of the stuff he took credit for.
If it hadn't been for Marcia Lucas then the first film would have been shit and Star Wars as a concept would not have grown into the behemoth it is today. She nurtured that film, like she no doubt nurtured her husband through the film, so effectively you're criticising someone who is largely responsible for one of the most loved films on planet Earth because you don't agree with their divorce arrangements?
You make me laugh.
Come to think of it your statement is sexist even. Where is it written that a woman should end up with the children in a divorce proceedings? You're also assuming that was her decision and not the result of Lucas hiring expensive lawyers. I will answer my own question though. Nowhere, nowhere is it written that women should keep the kids. Like I say, that is a sexist assumption on your part.
Marcia is/was a freaking genius. If GL had bothered to come home once in a while...
My jaw dropped when you said "The Death Star wasn't about to blow up the rebel base." It's mind blowing how they were able to edit that entire sequence practically out of thin air.
mightyvoovoo Credit where credit is due! She (Marcia Lucas) came up with that ALL on her own.
... and mind blowing that GL would overlook such an obvious way to make the movie not suck. Guy understands world building but that's it. Not story telling, not dialog, not characters...
When I watched that scene as a kid, I didn't notice to plot line about the Death Star about to blow up the rebel base, and I found myself getting bored watching that sequence. Now when I watch it I'm more on the edge of my seat.
@@stevecarter8810 That's my big problem too. I'm good at world building, but that's it. Unlike GL, I have the humility to admit it and (should I ever become a filmmaker) defer to the expertise and wisdom of others to make up for my shortcomings.
Because it isn't true.
The NOVEL, which came out in DECEMBER OF 1976, has the sequence in full, including Luke and Co. making TWO runs on the trench.
How Star Wars went through the normal editing process that all films go through.
Which is not true. The editing in Star Wars did change key tactical points of the narrative and made the film the classic that it is. Other films adhere pretty much to the screenplay. The only other film that I could readily think of where the narrative structure was built through editing was Apocalypse Now! which was also edited by Marcia Lucas.
@@toddsputnik8265 That's just a lie. The narrative structure was not changed by the editors (apart from the fact that George supervised all the editing!), and certainly not by Marcia 🤣
For example, it was Marcia who fought to keep the earlier introduction of Luke in the film (according to Rinzler's "Making of Star Wars" book).
I did not mean to imply that Marcia made the changes and that George was not an integral part of the editing process, after all, he wrote the screenplay. George and Marcia did work hand in hand during THX 1138 and American Graffitti so the narrative changes in the editing process were done under his auspice. But SW is amazing as to how it improved from the original raw cut to the version released in 1977. And the editing out of the Biggs scenes was brilliant because those scenes are really bad.@@fundhund62
@@toddsputnik8265 You know nothing of how the editing process works. I'm a skilled hobbyist editor myself and can straight up TELL you that every film relies upon the editing process to fundamentally shape the final film. Editing isn't just placing scenes in order. There's a rhythm to editing; every single shot has to be framed and cut to a beat. Your argument is akin to saying that individual musicians don't make any real impact upon a song. They just play the notes in order. You're ignorant.
Literally every great film ever made owes a part of its success to the editing process, just as it owes a part of its success to the script and to the direction and to any number of other filmmaking techniques and skillsets. As a skilled editor myself, I am sick to death of ignorant plebs thinking that the editing process is akin to putting a child's jigsaw puzzle together and essentially monkey work. It's an art form, so show it some damn respect.
Did you watch the video at all?
Im fairly sure the death star was about to blow up the rebel base in the script.
It was. You can find the shooting script online. RJ created that narrative out of thin air.
It was. RJ lied MANY TIMES in this video
It’s been in the script since then second draft
"Help us Marcia Lucas , you're our only hope!"
And hten they divorced, and lucas had full control in phantom menace... It all makes sense now
Lucasfilm should totally re-hire Marcia for episode IX
R. G. W 50,000 points!!
@Jkd Buck76 it costed enought that he had to sold what today is known as Pixar..
@@murciadoxial8056 If you think about that.. they divorced during ROTJ production.. wich is where the problems began :we got a frakin boring and redundant Jabba's palace that takes over 1/3 of what was suposed to be the saga grand finale.. 40m where one character gets captured, then another, then another then another.. and all that "just" for getting Han.. they could had done it in 10m ..15 tops. then there is the whole Ewoks thing.. and the final simultaneous ground-space-throne battle. Wich ok its awesome.. but why every time i watch it i find myself fast forwarding all Ewok scenes? there is barelly NO rebels fighting footage.. mere seconds.. Han and Leia just hide in the door and shot at troopes here and there until Chewie (and Ewoks) capture an AT-ST.. the whole ground battle becames Ewoks vs Stormtroopers and thats it..
Two things really jump out at me:
1. The way the scenes are placed in the rough cut are the exact sort of things the prequels suffer from
2. This also seems to be why Lucas likes changing things in post so much.
listen to Lucas's audio commentary on Ep4. . Lucas contradicts every thing you are saying. Can you provide links to real interviews to back up what you are saying?
@@JohnMorris-ge6hq Don't believe Lucas for a second.
@@JohnMorris-ge6hq To whom are you responding ?
Marcia Lucas fought to keep the Biggs scenes in.
Brandon Smith Though I do find The Phantom Menace boring, I personally find that Attack of the Clones is the “peak” of George’s directing. I feel that at least Phantom Menace could’ve been saved with some editing which is why I think it’s somewhat better than Attack of the Clones
You know what I find ironic? Many of the deleted scenes from the original trilogy would have made the originals worse, but a lot of the deleted scenes in the prequels would have made the prequels better. You can really make or break a movie depending on how you edit it.
ua-cam.com/video/olqVGz6mOVE/v-deo.html
The prequels are good as they are
@@Replica_Films2000 don't click on that
@@firebal6129 why not?
@@observerdude9809 it’s just...not worth your time
It’s a hate video specifically against this vid
John Jympson was the original editor, and it would be impossible to overstate his contribution to the art of film editing on A Hard Day's Night (which, when you think about it, was essentially the very first music video, almost 20 years before anyone had ever heard of such a thing). But it was clear that Star Wars was too new and unique for Jympson, and he didn't quite grasp what it was going for.
The notion that the Beatles created the first "music video" with "A Hard Day's Night" is complete nonsense. It was a musical and musicals existed before the Beatles came along, even in rock 'n roll music. Did you ever see "Jailhouse Rock" or "The Girl Can't Help It?" Just about every Elvis movie was a "music video," and as far as I know, John Jympson didn't work on any of Elvis'' films.
@@metv2363 Take a class in film montage or read a book about it and you'll find out that AHDN has WAY more in common with music videos than with Elvis movies. Good Lord.
@@edfelstein3891 "Take a class in film?" Like you did at as community college? Come see me in Hollywood, if you ever make the trip.
@@metv2363 You're looking for a flame war. I'm not biting. Let me just say as a final response:
ua-cam.com/video/y8AavEpS6CI/v-deo.html
"...reconceived the movie musical and exerted an incalculable influence on the music video..."
@@edfelstein3891 , go back to school and complete your education. You don't meet the height limit on this ride.
they won an oscar for best edition, yet he went back and tampered with their work, jesus!
I understand why he did the space parts, but things like putting large animals in Mos Eisley was just unnecessary.
and the Jawa comedy. Yuck.
Exactly!
George purposely left Marcia out of the history credits. How unfair.
He didn't re-edit the movie. He just added a few touches and fixed the special effects.
So Lucas had a great idea, but couldn't execute it without his team. Makes sense. Prequels, "I'm a big boy. I don't need your help." Makes sense too.
Yeah, definitely a difference. No more, "No, George, we need to do this..." only "Yes, sir!"
But to be honest, everything 'wrong' with the prequels was there in Return of the Jedi.
@@GinjaNingerMan Not everything. No long expositional walks through Marriott hotel lobbies, for instance. No complete lack of a compelling conflict. (There's nothing in the first two prequels anything like the tension between the Emperor and Luke--nor nothing as subtle and complex--as the tension between Vader and the Emperor--"Strange, that I have not felt it (Luke's presence)...are you sure your feelings on this are clear, Lord Vader?" "They are clear...my master." Ewok nonsense aside, the main plot was completely compelling in Return and the final throne room battle...Luke's unmasking of his father...and the funeral pyre scene all well realized, powerful moments.
Have you ever seen the credits at the end of a movie. How many thousands of people it takes to get a movie done and most of them are not that good. This was a great movie. Lucas didn't fall off the turnip truck one day and accidentally make a great movie. Watch the documentaries on the making of Star Wars. Every editor saves the movie. That's the editors job. But if he or she doesn't have anything to save, it won't be a great movie no matter how good the editor is.
@@davidc.2878 Yeah but the 'Ewok nonsense aside' covers a large chunk of the story. The problem with Jedi is that you have basically two extremely successful parts within the story, which are the Jabba introduction and the Throne Room sequence (which is extraordinary, true). But they are act I and III of the story. The whole act II (which in screentime is almost half of it) should have been the epicenter of conflict, but it is mostly Luke brooding and... Ewoks. And Han & Leia become glorified extras in Jedi. They have nothing to do. Clearly Lucas did not want to make something out of Luke's newfound identity except use to it to fuel his internal conflict. We could have had a film where the rebellion found out about it and started to question Luke, or something of the kind, something that would have exteriorized his internal conflict and turned it into proper plot material (not filler) and given muscle to his character development. Leia has literally no interesting lines past the introduction and Han and Lando are basically the same character in Jedi. Only Luke and Vador get interesting stuff (and of course the Emperor) throughout.
what about the sequels?
"Everybody has their ace in the hole...mine's ̶e̶d̶i̶t̶i̶n̶g̶ my under appreciated ex wife."
Yes, when you read what Marcia did with the film story in edit, divorcing her took the heart out of George Lucas' work. Imagine what the prequels could have been like if George took a breather from film-making like she asked him to focus on his family for a bit.
Joker 😂
His wife didn't save the film LMAO. Hirsch and Chew did the vast majority of the editing. She contributed the most on Return of the Jedi.
@@kchishol1970 Imagine if Marcia just didn't decide to cheat on him with a worker building Skywalker Ranch. BTW she contributed to the relative disappointment that Return of the Jedi became compared to Empire and ANH and she had the least amount of input on Empire. So her savior capabilities were probably overblown.
And Lucas was so unwilling to focus on family for a bit he quit directing/making films literally 6 months after she asked for divorce to raise their adopted daughter for 15 years AND have 2 more kids. LMFAO bro.
She only edited about a third of the film. George closely supervised the entire editing process, and he edited the famous gunport battle sequence on his own.
The third of the film Marcia was responsible for editing included the scenes of Luke on Tatooine before he meets the droids. George was the one who wanted to cut them out. Marcia wanted to keep them in. Pretty fucking strange that this video doesn't mention that fact at all.
I think this youtube video about editing has been brilliantly edited. The rough cut of this video about editing did not convey well enough how important editing is.
I recommend watching this video which is a response to this one: ua-cam.com/video/olqVGz6mOVE/v-deo.html
As a kid I used to look down on editing, I just thought it cut things and I believed the more stuff the better. Later I realized it is essential. You convinced me it is an art form of its own.
as a kid you thought every scene in every movie should begin with the director yelling “action!” and contain every take of every shot? like how could you not think editing was important
@@MetalMarauder they were a kid dawg chill out
Wow it's almost like kids haven't lived long enough to gather all the nuance that goes into the filmmaking process.
We cannot live in this reality. If we want to save the future, then we have to repair the past. --Jean-Luc Picard.
They do give awards just for editing you know.
wow, I consider myself a pretty diehard Star Wars fan and I didn't know about 90% of this. Excellent video. I have even more respect for the editors now
Maybe you've read the JW Rinzler books, but if you haven't I'd recommend them highly. You can get these on a kindle/tablet with sound bites and small videos embedded in them.
Also this explains a lot. Lucas is simply mediocre. He has a vision, but that is it. Apparently (with that quote in mind) he does terrible job as a director (of actors and scenes), hates it and if able, make his films just about editing few algorithms. And based on the films that followed (prequels) he is also terrible editor.
So kudos for his creativity that introduced us to the Force, little green monsters and so on. Nothing else is earned, just parasited. All his 4bln empire would be nothing. A F-rated (not even B-rated) space crap that would fall into oblivion.
Awesome man. I haven't read those and I will definitely check them.
Malisman77 Since you are so easily persuaded by UA-cam videos to a certain opinion, I have a gift for you:
Look up "What the sequels can learn from the prequels" on the Schmoesknow channel.
@@Malisman77 mediocre but made THX-1138, american graffiti and star wars. and he was awarded heavily and acclaimed heavily for graffiti which is why star wars was greenlit in the first place. AND was tabbed to do APOCALYPSE NOW because studios and his colleagues thought he was that good.
Do some actual research....maybe you have in the 2 years.
EVERY MOVIE IS SAVED IN EDITING.
We just don't know enough about most movies to understand the extend to which their rough cuts did NOT work. The first cut of almost every movie is a mess.
Ummm no, Phantom menace was not saved in editing, is bloated with useless scenes.
As a professional editor, this isn't entirely true.
Yes, there have been MANY films that were saved in editing. However, most GOOD films had a very deliberate and planned concept of how they would be edited before they were even shot, because not having any kind of clear idea of the film's overall structure would be utterly incompetent. Hence, _STAR WARS_ is a unique case of an editor (Marcia Lucas) actually being more responsible for authoring a film than its Director. This is certainly not a common process for most films.
For a better indication, the rough cut of _RAIDERS OF THE LOST ARK_ was virtually identical to the finished film. There were a few scenes that got trimmed, but the ones that stayed were generally left untouched from their rough version and their sequence order in the film was also the same. The only major change from rough to fine ("fine cut" is the most commonly used term in the industry for a final cut) was the addition of the closing romance scene, outside the steps of Washington...
...The original included no such scene...
...but then Marcia Lucas commented how odd it was that such an integral character just disappeared from the film, never to be heard from again. So George Lucas and Lawrence Kasdan wrote it as a new scene, which Spielberg filmed as a reshoot; it was added between the final two scenes. Otherwise, it's the same film.
This is probably a more common example of what happens during movies editorial processes; trimming and minor addition. The "fine tuning" segment of the video is usually all that happens on most films, but some exceptionally troubled productions have had to do more work in certain historical instances. _STAR WARS_ is one of them. Interestingly, since that film was made, it inspired a radical new way of working; in which directors will now DELIBERATELY shoot their films with next to zero vision, and drastically rework them in editing. Terrence Malick is an example of a great filmmaker who works this way on purpose. Every film he shot since 1998 stopped using storyboards, and every film he shot since 2010 (with the exception of _A HIDDEN LIFE_ ) was shot without a script. So this style is usually done INTENTIONALLY when it happens now, as opposed to this film where it was a happy accident of being able to save a film with no vision upfront.
@@MrMarsFargo No, Marcia Lucas herself debunked this idiotic theory, look it up. George Lucas is one of the greatest filmakers of all time, and he alone came up with everything Star Wars fans have grown to love today. To pretend that literally everyone else "fixed" the movie is moronic at best.
@@MrMarsFargo Also, George Lucas was one of the chief editors on the project as well, because he is also a great editor. So if the movie was "saved" in the edit, guess who saved it?
@@calebadams690
Kay, go ahead and argue with an ACTUAL PROFESSIONAL EDITOR who had to study and research how this film was made as part of his training.
That’s not arrogant at all 🤩
I actually understand what they were trying to do with those opening scenes. They were trying to show that Luke was this small town boy, who was always looking up at the stars and dreaming of leaving. They also go to show how he was always trying to keep up with the war against the empire. Also, if I remember correctly, there was a scene originally with his friend Biggs on Tatooine when the film was released, but it was cut latter. A lot of people actually thought this was a mistake, as it doesn't really make as much sense or hit as hard when Biggs is shot down later and dies during the attack on the death star. Also, his extreme reaction to C3PO talking about the war makes less sense with that intro.
The solution should not have been to cut it out, but to reshoot it, and have it occur after we saw the un-interrupted battle on the ship. Lot's of movies do this, where they show another perspective of what had just happened a few moments before.
The funny thing is, Marcia Lucas wanted to keep those scenes in as she had worked on them- it was George Lucas's decision to take them out :)
When they went to make _Star Wars: The Radio Drama_ for NPR they expanded the movie into 13 nearly 1/2 hour episodes. The first episode is Luke on Tatooine with his peers, racing down Beggars' Canyon and the deleted scenes including him seeing a space battle and Biggs's return where he says he's going to join the Rebel Alliance. I didn't know they filmed them or were in the original script; I thought they made them up. But it works as an introduction.
I think they did make up the second episode where we see Leia on a mercy mission meeting Darth Vader, and later with her father on Alderaan before stealing the plans.
@@onemoreminute0543 I just watched _Icons Unearthed: Star Wars_ that had clips of the interview with Marcia and she wanted those scenes out.
@@sandal_thong8631 Rinzlers book seems to tell a different story.
@@onemoreminute0543 I don't have that book. But I did listen to the audiobook of _The Secret History of Star Wars._ On the author's webpage for Marcia Lucas, he says:
"2007's _The Making of Star Wars_ treats Chew as the primary cutter and only credits the space battle and the (deleted!) Anchorhead scenes to Marcia as a solo editor, but given the book's tendancy [sic] to downplay her (not even including her photo on the editors page) and the fact that she was not spoken to for the book, this is suspect (other publications, like Baxter and Pollock, treat her as the main cutter)."
I strongly suspect that despite whatever exciting behind-the-scenes stories that book has based on documents from the 1970s, it was made by a fellow working at Lucasfilm and therefore subject to the revisionist-history that George Lucas is known for saying years after the fact.
Hey everyone. In this current form our pro-collaboration message has been interpreted by many as anti-Lucas. That was never the goal, nor the intent of this video. It should go without saying that George Lucas supervised, approved, and even contributed to all of these editorial changes. However, having seen the response, this is a point of fact that clearly should’ve been stated and it was an oversight on my part that that simple acknowledgment wasn’t included. George Lucas made Star Wars with the help of incredible team of people and that is an achievement worth celebrating. -Joey
You gave Lucas credit - it's just that us fans have a love / hate relationship with the man. Clearly, he was at his best when he had a smaller ego and had the sense to listen to others.
well put to the commentor. As the 2004 DVD set explains, the first edit was terrible, because the first editors, just did as they wanted, and didn't listen to George Lucas. George Lucas had to fire them and hire the two men and his wife, who created the final film. This video doesn't explain this.
Perhaps you should have used Annie Hall as an example. That movie went through some genuinely extensive changes and revisions through the editing process (much more extensively than any Star Wars movie that Lucas made) and went on to win Best Picture.
RocketJump Good, I am glad. Because in your anti-Lucas rant you forgot to mention how when Star Wars was a big success he shared his earnings with the cast. Lucas has thanked and acknowledged the talented people that made Star Wars possible. You didn't mention that did you.
Oh, by the way...JOHN WILLIAMS SCORE WAS NOT ALTERED IN THE 1997 VERSIONS.
Star Wars hard core fans are a joke. They complain about 3 frames missing from a scene 18.
Since you are so much into nitpicking - Let's look at what happens when Mr. Lucas is removed from Star Wars. Oh, that's right the crappy Episode 7.
Merry Christmas....
Francis Hooton Thank you sir. God bless you sir.
I never knew how much editing changed the film.
90% of the work is in the editing.
Scenes can be completely re-cut, re-arranged, & altered. It is how it is presented to the audience
That's how it is with most films
It didn't, this entire video is nonsense
@@cryogenixoldskool5803 its only right in the sense that every movie ever made goes thru extensive editing, but ofc hese acting like this is a special case which either means hes extremely bias or just dumb. both maybe?
Again people trying to make up the narrative that Star wars is good in spite of Lucas and not because of him. “How star wars was saved in the edit was saved in the edit” clears up all these points.
Nerdnonymous
If you look at the original opening crawl, you can tell that George from the very beginning knows exactly how this vast world should bet set up. Pretty much every piece of information that was left out from the original opening crawl were all later fulfilled during the making of the prequel trilogy. George may not be a person who is good at making good tempo for his stories, but he knows exactly how to structure his world in a way that is more fascinating than anything we've ever seen.
He has his flaws sure but I think his strengths balance out
Furthermore he IS the creator of the franchise
C3PO could have been the Jar Jar Binks of the Original Trilogy
He was, he would never shut the fuck up, and the only thing useful he EVER said was that they hyperdrive was damaged in empire.. which, wasn't really needed. The clunking sounds told us that
Meesa C3PO meesa can speaksa 6 millionsa forms of dialogsa. I think 3PO can safely go down in Star Wars history as actually being loved by most people who actually understand the value of having characters of different tone to give the other characters balance. EI Mary & Pippin in LOTR. Jar Jar and his ridiculous race is only enjoyed by light sabre loving fan boys who need to cling to something
Yes but C3PO nailed it. I loved him playing the victim in his British accent. He was an awesome character. He should have been used in TPM and the rest of the prequels instead of JJ Ab.... oh I mean Jar Jar... LOL
@@Artielectric okay, see, I loved him too, he was like salt, he enhanced and added contrast to what was there. If you pay attention, in the prequels, esp TPM jar jar is in every. Fucking. Scene. Fan edits have an awful time removing him because he's always there, so integral. Like salt.. too much kills the food.
C3PO is the key to all of this.
To be fair, most great movies go through a lot of re-writes, scene deletions and recuts. Even reshoots. As a professional film editor I can tell you it is standard practice to call the editing process the 3rd writing process. For all movies. That said, seeing this process you put together is fascinating! Thanks for doing it.
George Lucas was the chief editor on the original Star Wars. He oversaw the entire process and edited the acclaimed gunport sequence himself. His wife Marcia only edited a third of the film and left to work on another film before the final edit was even completed. There were two other editors on the film, who edited the other 2/3 of it. And besides, nearly every film, as you said, is saved in the edit. ua-cam.com/video/olqVGz6mOVE/v-deo.html
While I believe this video wasn't meant to bash George Lucas, it omits a lot of key elements about the making of the film, and makes Lucas pass for a clumsy guy who really didn't had much idea of where his film was going... which is far from being the truth
He omitted and changed so much from the original source (JW Rizzlers book).If he didn't do this intentionally, then he simply has worst research skills. Either way, RJ isn't worth listening to.
It WAS intentional. He doesn't just omit key info, he presents actual lies, warping the timeline of all of this. How did Marcia Lucas save Star Wars after Lucas's rough cut screening when she LITERALLY QUIT BEFORE IT!? Why is John Jympsan NEVER EVEN referenced? Why is Marcia credited as cutting the Tatooine scenes when the book explicitly states she FOUGHT to keep them in?
Not to mention the way they precisely choose to clip quotes... Yeah they knew what they were doing
Yeah, it's always said that they were people all around Lucas who helped to cut down some of his ideas, but somehow we never talk about the ideas his surrounding had which he didn't retain for the better...
But yeah, for a subject with this much documentation, they really should have gone further, unless they really wanted to discredit Lucas...
@@ludwik7326 They did want to. It's almost irrefutable at this point. The information they leave out, and the WAY they choose to leave it out. As well as the random lies that they start pulling
this video is very "trust me bro" material.
Yeah, just watch another video debunking this kne with actual facts about what really happened.
This is such a great example of how such a great step in cinematic history was not taken by just one man. It would have failed without his colleagues and friends. If it was just up to Mr. Lucas, he would have dropped the ball and never changed the future of Sci-fi.
"Sci-fi"
This is probably why the prequels are so bad compared to the originals, he surrounded himself with yes-men/women and made some stupid decisions (like not making jar-jar a sith, which only made him that much more of a useless and annoying character, also that's probably why the 2nd movie is generally considered the worst, because they had to rework the entire thing)
@Litshttam The prequels were Anakin's story. Why would Episode II and III hang on Jar Jar?
@@ludde12345678950 Where did you hear Jar Jar Binks was going to be a Sith? Jar Jar was the comic relief meant for the kids.
@Litshttam huh?
Marcia Lucas; The TRUE unsung hero of Star Wars
Roland Rockerfella well you know, except for coming up with the whole universe and all
She is the reason Lucas made the special editions, if he had not vastly changed them, he would have to pay Marcia a % of the earnings. And now that Lucas appointed Cunthleen Kennedy to run Lucasfilm, who gave us TLJ, I just want to say: Fuck you George!!!
Without george lucas no STAR WARS!
Lucas had people like Ralph McQuarrie and Joe Johnston design EVERYTHING you see on screen. I've seen Lucas behind the scenes and he just asks people to design a spaceship and they design it for him. His input is THAT basic!
@@Jucelegario blame steven spielberg for kennedy. he collaborated with her husband on close encounters in 1977. and then rather than firing her for being a terrible PA to spielberg on raiders, he appointed her to a producer role, which is what she was for almost all of spielberg's movies including the indy films, ET and jurassic park and movies like the bourne films.
Had he fired her, she might not have grown to such heights and been trusted by lucas. although the signs were there she sucked like the jurassic park /// trainwreck production and other stuff.
this time it wasn't george's fault.
Every movie is saved in the edit. Empires rough cut was also a disaster
No, you see, only anything that involves George Lucas needs saving from his grubby little hands.
I'm mocking every Anti-Lucas asshole.
Amen.
Lot of those cut bits were used in the radio drama. Being made up of short episodes makes the flow work better with less hard cutting so they add a lot of good interactions between bits.
I loved that as a kid for several years, as it was how I knew the original _Star Wars._
Also the Alan Dean Foster novelization which came before the radio drama - I had read the book before I first saw the film in 1978 in some very early re-release.
Nice shoutout to the Despecializied Editions!
Epic showdown. Who wins?
"It's stylistically designed to be that way." -George Lucas
vs.
"It was all editorially manufactured" -Marcia Lucas
"It's like poetry, everything rhymes."
@@dialecticalmonist3405 "I may have gone a bit too far in places..."
"Jar Jar's the key to all of this."
I think both worked very well together. People blame that GL was not instrumental, which is wrong. George clearly had a unique talent no one ever thought of at the time. He had a vision, an original idea, and a mettle to do things no one tried before. However, he needed a team of good crews to make that dream come into true. Original ideas in prequels were genuine and good. The execution was horrible. I wonder what prequels will be like if Marcia Lucas and other editors that helped GL were there. Unfortunately, GL failed to see how important his support crews were.
@@youngbear2258 Correct. George couldn't have made Star Wars great on his own...but his team also couldn't have made it great without him.
It should be noted that Marcia's work on Star Wars (about 4 weeks worth) was on the BAD version, being discussed at the beginning of this video. She was in tears after the fateful New Years Eve screening for their friends.
All of the improvements were made AFTER she had already gone back to work on another project.
Certainly Star Wars was greatly improved by the time of its final edit, but it was long after Marcia's work had ended.
I can't believe most of the things said and shown on this video were all lies... In such a crafted manner.
Yup. Go figure. I'm glad they were called out on it. Down vote,shame on this channel's creators.
One wonders if this could be used in the classroom, as an example of how propaganda manipulates and lies.
Very happy they were called out.
This video w as saved in the edit
I mean I knew they were stupid criticisms, but I didn't expect them to also be made up.
@@mattgilbert7347 I'm hoping that professionals realize this
It seems that George Lucas is more of a world builder than a storyteller.
Absolutely nailed it - give this person a cigar!
He's an Idea Man. Put him 5 feet near a script and the universe implodes tho
True of many, many fantasy series writers as well.
Is that why Lucas was involved with loads of fantasy films y'know about storytelling...
He need to colaborate more with his crew
"If my blade should find its mark, you will cease to exist. But if you strike me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine."
That sounds pretty damn badass, actually.
I know, I liked that.
@@Digital111 I bet Sir Alec Guinness told Lucas to say that line rather than the original dialogue. Guinness did openly complain to Lucas the lines were incredibly clunky and poorly written. Carrie Fisher and Mark Hamill said the same.
Alexandre Bourgoin I agree. Basically saying Vader’s screwed either way.
It's needlessly wordy and inferior to what we saw in the original 1977 theatrical edition. It's the equivalent of turning the Terminator's "I'll be back" into "Give me a moment. I will return shortly after I've completed other tasks."
Of course, "needlessly wordy" and "inferior" are exactly the words to describe 90% of the dialog, story, and imagery in the prequels too. You know, those movies where George had full creative authority and nobody around him to tell him how much it sucked. In this respect he's much like Gene Roddenberry: a guy who came up with a great idea and then made it suck (a.k.a "ST:TMP") when he got his way. At least Roddenberry was stopped after ruining one film. George got to ruin three prequels and retroactively ruin the original trilogy.
George is a great idea man. He took Kurosawa's stories and transformed them into a sci-fi universe. But that's where it ends. George is not a good movie maker. The success of 1977's Star Wars is despite him, not because of him. Empire, arguably the best of the originals, had George involved the least. One is compelled to wonder how much better RotJ might've been had that trend continued.
Eric Smith The prequels are great; YOU'RE needlessly wordy.
teamwork makes miracle for the eye and the heart, thank you
ua-cam.com/video/olqVGz6mOVE/v-deo.html
Amazing Documentary.
Thank you for making and sharing this 🎞 film 🎞
Everyone's saying Lucas was a crap director/writer, but he was actually opposed to the Luke scenes at the beginning. A colleague (Barwood, I think) told Lucas he needed those scenes to make the movie "more human." Also, the Twin Suns scene? It originally had WAY different music. It was switched AT LUCAS'S REQUEST. Lucas hated the first cut himself ("It's not the movie I wanted to make"). The main reason the first cut was bad? It wasn't Lucas. It was just REALLY POORLY EDITED. That's the whole point of this essay.
Lachlan Macfarlane I think the idea was that the script (by Lucas) has bad pacing. And the first edit mainly followed it. It was just at the first screening it was realized that the script flow/dialogue did not work on the screen.
So it needed a major not just re edit but more so reconstruction.
Stefan Holmqvist The script had that pacing at the behest of others, so the point still stands
that's all great alexandre but in the end he didn't do the first edit, he highered some one from the studio to edit the film he showed to his friends. Who later helpped him edit the film so your point falls.
Simply the Best Well not really though right?
Cause, if parts of the script were studio mandated and he hired someone to do the first cut per the script, then it really weren't his choices that were the problem there no? The script problems don't really fall squarely on his shoulders there is the point I was making.
When the first screening helped break studio mandate, Lucas was able to work with his team to make a much better final cut.
In the end, all movies are team efforts and that's the real takeaway here. It's never 100% a single person's film. That's why you often see the greats working with the same people often; they work well together.
Lachlan Macfarlane great points and thanks for the info! People are so bent on criticizing Lucas because they’re mad about the prequels that they are blind to the fact that he is actually a great director.
Without the edit Chewbacca would've unleashed his true power and one shot the death star just by staring at it
yea
Without Marcia Lucas, we may not have known that Chewbacca was someone to be feared. She not only edited the movie -- she provided a lot of input during the entire production. For instance, it was her idea that Chewie would scare a Mouse Droid.
And that wasn't even his final form!!!
Chewie is Jiren confirmed
NOT A SKETCHY LIKE AT ALL
by your logic, every cake was saved in the owen
i'd recommend to anyone watching this: How was "how was star wars saved in the editing" saved in the editing.
Some hopeless inaccuracies in this video:
1. It fails to convey that the 'rough cut' was made by Jympson, and Lucas fired him in the summer of 76, because he hated the cut.
2. The cut that De Palma and Spielberg saw was the movie we got, with WWII dogfights in place of finished effects. We know that because Katz and Huyck have said as much on camera in the Omnibus documentary on Lucas. They didn't see the Jympson rough cut as implied.
3. The revised fourth draft of Jan 15 1976 (before filming) has the dialogue between Luke and Obi-Wan (and R2's beep) as it appears in the movie. It was not "edited" to fix the script. The message from Leia was moved, but the conversation is the exact same, while the video implies that unnecessary back and forth took place.
4. The revised fourth draft has the Death Star attacking Yavin 4, and Tarkin saying you may fire when ready. It's also apparent at the *start of the movie* that the intention is to destroy the rebel base - that's why they put the tracker on the Falcon. Leia taking the Falcon to Yavin amounts to using Yavin as bait in a high stakes endgame.
5. The video exaggerates how much the scenes were swapped around.
6. Earlier versions of the script, Luke and earlier versions of Luke, on Utapau [that became Tatooine] are brought into the story through the droids. The reason the revised fourth draft has early scenes with Luke is because Lucas' friends suggested audiences would not tolerate droids for so long. And so it was shot just in case. This is an example of Lucas listening to others, and that advice being *wrong*
7. A minor point, but the video shows the length of the opening crawl with an earlier draft of it, where it is longer. By the time they began shooting it was much shorter, so there's no reason why the opening crawl would have been from the 2nd or 3rd draft. This was merely done to exaggerate.
8. Most of the movie was cut by Paul Hirsch, under supervision of Lucas, with assistance of Chew. Hirsch said this on camera in a recent interview with Star Wars Theory.
9. On a side note, Roger Christian [who made the first lightsaber prop] the 2nd unit director on TPM says Rick McCallum was anything but a 'yes man' if that is the implication of the difference between prequels and originals, based on the presumption that Lucas needed other people disagreeing with him.
10. Hirsch said the main thing Marcia worked on was the trench run scene. It's true that they emphasised the Death Star's proximity, and she cut out the first trench run by Luke. It's also true that she suggested Obi-Wan die and become a ghost. She made lots of useful inputs. And it's commonly known she helped make emotional scenes work better.
It is however, a total misrepresentation to claim that Marcia "saved" the whole movie in the edit. It's fair to say they were in a total mess because of the complexity of the effects, and the pressure from the studio to finish the movie. It's also fair to speculate that Kurtz was one of the reasons the movie went over budget, and that executives tried to interfere. It's also fair to say that cast and crew didn't really understand what Lucas was making until they saw the finished product, which made them less agreeable during the production.
I don't really think Marcia made George kill Obi-Wan, unless it was when George was writing previous drafts of the script. Obi-Wan dies in the final script, the shooting script, you can read it online. Unless I'm missing something.
@@emoxvx Marcia is on record as saying it was her idea. Maybe she misremembered that, as people can, but I think it is plausible it was her idea. She acknowledges that she worked on the trench run sequence, which has been corroborated by Hirsch, so I've no reason to doubt that. He also said that she had many suggestions that add a little extra emotion to scenes, so I've no reason to doubt that.
I don't always buy into what's in the script, because some of the ones online may be more like a transcript of the movie, rather than the actual shooting script, even if they claim to be the shooting script.
Given that the General in Hidden Fortress survives, I think it is plausible that Kenobi originally survived and didn't do much after his battle with Vader. I don't know when that change was made and I don't believe it was specified by Marcia, or anyone else. That said, it seems most people who exaggerate Marcia's contribution are not Marcia, but other people desperate to downplay Lucas' instincts and decision-making.
I'm not familiar with the early scripts, although I know that many things were changed around. It's plausible than when Luke was added to the script, the General role still survived.
Maybe this decision was even made aloud but not written down until a later draft.
Alternatively, perhaps that change was made after Guinness had signed on for the role. I don't remember if he ever talked about his death scene or the fact he didn't survive.
While it's possible the idea didn't come from Marcia, or several people came to the same idea, I don't have any reason to believe this is utter nonsense, unlike most of this video, which is entirely bad faith or ignorance.
@@Ruylopez778 I have the '76 novelization of the film and Obi-Wan dies in there. It was published after they started filming the film, I'm not sure when it was written though. There's a lot of contradicting and unclear information, that's why I don't buy that she decided in the middle of shooting that Obi-Wan lives, unless she decided that much earlier in pre-production.
They've deleted comments that initially pointed this stuff out before, they know what they've gotten wrong, and they're intentional about it
If Lucas didn't have Marcia, Geoff Unsworth's photography (Lucas intended a gritty, hand-held style, not old school Hollywood), Ralph McQuarrie's incredible artwork that basically defined the visuals of Star Wars, the ILM guys that made the Universe real, the woman that designed Stormtroopers (I forget her name), the writers that were brought in to inject some humour and warmth to the rather cold script and, of course, John Williams' legendary score...Star Wars could well have been a cult 70's sci-fi B movie. Lucas owes an awful lot to a lot of people. I hope he paid them all their relevant dues.
This is how all movies are made. Its not a one man show. I'm sure Lucas is aware of that.
@@FancyFramePictures You're right, but when seeing the sheer amount of Star Wars iconography that was actually conceived by other people, while Lucas continues to be regarded as 'the creator', it seems worthy of mention.
@@Tokiofritz He is still the creator since it was his idea and he made the production happen. As well as we humans are lazy and it would be too time consuming to look up all that was contributing and mantion them in dialouge.
To be fair, he choose most of these people, even the ones that polished and re-cut some of the shit he had produced up until that point. It’s not as if anyone was forced on him.
Not to mention the woman who designed the logo!
Holy crap I never knew! This makes all those hours planning and editing my short films worth it!!! I always felt like the whole story was changed no matter what during editing but this proves it1
TrifelinJ Few things are perfect from the first draft.
TrifelinJ How about you spend some of that time editing your comment. I’ve read it three times and it still makes no sense.
Editing gives the perfect timing for things to happen.
vjrei Yea I'm starting to realize that the final rythym of youre video is so important. Something to keep in mind while planning/shooting
Apparently Top Gun went through some serious editing, probably a good doc about that out there somewhere.
"How A New Hope was almost The Phantom Menace"
yes but it wasn't and he had the wisdom to have it changed. Most movie scripts go through many changes. I am going through the 7th revision of a movie script now. THIS IS HOW MOVIES ARE MADE.
Like the phantom menace was worse than the last jedi
@@armywife04012000 other way around buddy
The Phantom Meanace had pretty good editing actually. It's not like we jumped to young Anakin playing with his friends in the middle of Obi Wan and Qui Gon's battle on the ship.
@Legendary Vocalists Dumb stories are dumb stories. The opinion that the Phantom menace is a bad film is a personal one, and not an objective one. The plot holes and incoherence in the last Jedi, the contradictions with the rest of the saga, and the fact that it's forced to continue from the worst sequel of all time... those are objective problems. TPM is a star wars film. The last Jedi is not
The film was in danger because of unfinished sound, unfinished special effects, stock footage? That’s literally every film ever dude.
People are over blowing the argument that star wars was saved in the editing room because for every great movie there's a previous version of it that it's inferior. No matter what editing techniques they used, if the script wasn't working then the movie would still be a mess!
@@adamcade604 True. Given what they say towards the end of the video about the special editions, I think these guys have a chip on their shoulders with Lucas.
and also video games
@@adamcade604 Well the main point of the video is that Star Wars had crucial *script* changes in the edit without which it probably wouldn't have been a smash hit.
To quote Paul Hirsch (the co-editor): “it was tougher than rough cuts usually are”
Use the edits, Luke
Lucas*
*after releasing star wars special edition*
Remember, the edits will be with you, always
George Lucas was the chief editor on the original Star Wars. He oversaw the entire process and edited the acclaimed gunport sequence himself. His wife Marcia only edited a third of the movie and left to work on another movie before the final edit was even completed. There were two other editors who edited the other 2/3 of the movie. The notion that Lucas had nothing to do with the editing of the original movie, that he's a terrible editor, or that his wife singlehandedly saved from the movie from him--it's all a myth.
I love this video! I've heard many times that Star Wars was saved in editing by Marcia Lucas but now I know how exactly she did it. This must have taken an insane amount of research and it's really well written and edited. Thank you!
Harmy Despecialized he read a Wikipedia article lmao
Except the fact the GEORGE worked hand in hand with Marcia in the edit room - uncredited. G Lucas has edited *all* his films and others (like THE GODFATHER and APOCALYPSE NOW). Something the history revisionists either hide or forget.
peterthx oh, don't overplay what Lucas did on Coppola's films, he helped a bit. That doesn't mean he was a co-editor.
He was on STAR WARS. The type of revisionist history in these videos need to end, people still so butthurt about the prequels they want to rob Lucas of any accomplishment.
thats pretty much because the prequels were rubbish.
“Dinner was saved by cooking it”
More like dinner was saved by preparing the table. One table editor had the idea that chairs shoud be used to sit on. Originally they were all standing. She also took away a chair that no one was sitting on. This ingenious change saved the dinner.
@@Grivian 'The cake was saved in the oven' ROFL :o
You should take this down after Nerdonymous body bagged you 😂
that failed fusion dance between cinema sins and mauler? no thanks
Couldn't agree more. It's the difference between a well thought out and well-researched deconstruction where fact is the goal, versus a poorly conceived one with shoddy research and a very clear agenda to be served, rather than the exposition of truth.
@@motor4X4kombatYea, who cares that it completely debunked all these points the Star Wars community still believes to this day, thanks to UA-camrs like Rocket Jump.
@@bigdoubleu117 sure and zack snyder is a better director than Stanley Kubrick and and alfred hitchcock, and only people with small brains like me don't like him just like i don't like the star wars prequels or the ewoks in return of the jedi because our lord and savior lucas is an absolute artist created by gos himself and every must love everything he does and say... even if he says that jumping of a cliff will give as eternal enlightment.
All hail our lord and savior lucas and the snyder cult for giving us the truth and nothing but the truth.
Lol, treadwell was wall-e
Actually he was Number Five, and then WALL-E came after that.
Wow, everyone involved in making Star Wars won an Oscar except Lucas. Now I understand the Salt.
lol
Woody Allen deserved best directing and best writing...but Gary Kurtz deserved best picture !
"its salt"
Specially when you ex-wife wins one.
And you secretly know that your ex is the only reason why your movies were a success to begin with! lol
Thanks to Nerdonymous, I am confident in saying this video is AAAAAAIIIIIIDDDSSS
What a marvelous video! Thank you for that
This is fascinating! It brings to mind the numerous fan edits that exist of the Star Wars prequels. Last night, I watched Red Maple's 45 minute edit of Rogue One featuring John Williams' score and a few alterations, and found it immensely better than the actual film.
Timothy Mably
Interesting! Is it on UA-cam? If not, would I just google Rogue One fan edit?
i would like to know as well
www.maple-films.com/rogue-one-downloads.html
Timothy Mably Rogue One had pretty good music, replacing it with John Williams seems a little unnecessary
@@peterjoyfilms It seemed like it was just an experiment, since Rogue One is meant to take place shortly before A New Hope. Interestingly, even though the music was pretty good, the score was composed by Giacchino just a month or so before the film was released. They fired the original composer who was attached to the film, who I imagine had an entire soundtrack ready to go that Disney wasn't happy with.
YOU ACTUALLY STATED YOUR SOURCES!!! IS THIS EVEN UA-cam !?!
Times change, huh
hahaha ikr
Well not quite. It seems he cheery picked and hand waved a lot of contradictory information . . . ua-cam.com/video/olqVGz6mOVE/v-deo.html
Actually, it was George's idea to take out the unnecessary scenes of Luke in the beginning, and Marcia fought to keep them in. It says so in JW Rinzler's book. ua-cam.com/video/olqVGz6mOVE/v-deo.html
Really now
@@taylanozdemir8616
Yeah this video claims to use JW Rinzler's book as a source but the book debunks all the claims rocketjump makes
Ssshhhh you're killing thier narrative..
This video makes lots of false statements like that to fit his narrative that Lucas is a dunce whose mediocre work was saved in the edit by brilliant editors. The rough cut that DePalma & co saw was edited by her, for instance, and a lot of the other things this doco likes to credit to her is in the original script, written by Lucas. And none of them said the rough cut was a disaster, etc. DePalma made fun of the missing special effects scenes, and “this force shit”. They were great friends and liked to tease Lucas.
@@msandersen Hey now! Never let the truth get in the way of a good story!
Storytelling: what do we need to know and when do we need to know it. Also moviemaking. Nice work, well done.
wow this video made me appreciate the original movie even more.
The original turned into the classic we know it today because there were people around to tell Lucas "Nah, let's go back and take another look at this."
If only they'd been around when he made the prequels...
Honestly this is why I hate the Prequels with the passion of a thousand suns. I rage at what could have been, what we would have in their place if talented people had still ridden herd on Lucas. And that lack of second thought was an albatross around the necks of the people charged with giving us the last trilogy.
@randomguy8196 you do know that Lucas offered both the director of empire strikes back and spielberg the direction of the prequels but they rejected it? He also asked chew and Hirsch to come back and they declined.
@@thecollector4332 I see we have some logic in the comments section. Good job! :)
@@onemoreminute0543 I can't understand how people can be so naive and believe in any nonsense they are told. I don't know really much about film industry. But I'm 100% sure that director of any movie has full control over filmmaking process, this is why he is called Director. Editor can't just say "Fuck you" to director, make his own scenes out of nothing and put it in the movie without permission. He is not involved in shooting process, he is working with the material he is provided. If this material is shit, not a single editor can save it. It is same with music. If it has shitty chords and melody it can't be saved in the mixing process.
Just watched a much longer and more detailed video essay that debunks the whole narrative of this video essay. It's called "How ,How Star Wars was saved in the edit' Was Saved In The Edit".
Preach
Yea i saw that too, but I think it misses the main thesis.
The point is not that other films are not also saved in the edit, nor that star wars is unique in changing significantly through editing.
The point is that Star Wars, as originally cut was a mediocre film. It only became a great film because of good editing.
@@jessehunter7197 George Lucas is a genius
@@jessehunter7197 Buuut the guy here lies and says the rough cut was what was shown to everyone when it was a later cut. He does stuff like that throughout this video, lie and misrepresent what happened to support his narrative.
The more promotion of that video the better
Such an incredible short documentary. Nice work!!
Could be the most important and Valuable Star Wars video on UA-cam. Bravo, good job guys.
too bad it is mostly made up or directly a lie
@@FlakeCZ true ua-cam.com/video/olqVGz6mOVE/v-deo.html
My uncle has worked directly with George Lucas on a number of projects and knows Lucas personally. He told me a lot about how the editing of Star Wars was so important, noting, "You can understand the dramatic flow of Star Wars by not watching the movie itself, but turn around in your seat and just watch the audience reactions." Getting a nice, detailed analysis on the editing was great to see, thank you!
i find it funny that editing, sfx, sound and music got academy awards but no golden man for George lucas, in other words he is chewbaca at the end of the movie lol
THE ACADEMY BACK THEN DIDN'T THINK MUCH OF SCI-FI.
lucas could have gotten the award if he had chosen to include his name on the editing credit.
@@JohnMorris-ge6hq they still don’t.
George Lucas was the chief editor on the original Star Wars. He oversaw the entire process and edited the acclaimed gunport sequence himself. His wife Marcia only edited a third of the movie and left to work on another movie before the final edit was even completed. There were two other editors who edited the other 2/3 of the movie. The notion that Lucas had nothing to do with the editing of the original movie, that he's a terrible editor, or that his wife singlehandedly saved from the movie from him--it's all a myth.
ua-cam.com/video/olqVGz6mOVE/v-deo.html
@@user-xx6vy9ri8p oversaw as in did what? I only have his re-edits to judge the movie by and it's not painted a rosy picture of his editing skills. I also wouldn't say she alone single handedly saved the movie as there was lots going on such as sound, music, etc. but if not for the editors people would've been sleeping to john william's scores
Wow Marcia was like the Bill Finger of Star Wars.
Not at all LMAO. She got her due credit and her work on the film was a lot less than Bill Finger's work on Batman. Finger MADE those characters. Marcia edited one sequence for a few weeks.
Excellent video essay! George was the visionary behind the entire concept, but film is a collaborative effort. When George himself got TOO MUCH credit and too much control, we got...well, you know what we got. Thank heavens for good editors and a director with the good sense (or wife) to listen.
He tried to do the same with the prequels but no one would help him. Too much risk I guess. We ended up with a good story but bad acting and dialogue and CGI. Some good lightsaber duels here and there. Not the best movies but hey, it could have been worse. Could have been The Last Jedi.
ua-cam.com/video/olqVGz6mOVE/v-deo.html
@@ejn8982 Based ;)
I like the story that Marcia said "What happened to Marion" in _Raiders_ so they went back and filmed a scene on the steps. Too bad she wasn't around to fix Willie Scott's character. There was a point when Indy might have left the kids to their fate and just run off with the treasure. She could have been the person to turn him around, then no more screaming from her. But of course, part of the reason _Temple of Doom_ was dark was due to the divorce. I even saw a scene recently where Indy punches the cigarette girl in the face (accidentally, but still!).
1:35 “Star Wars snatched victory from the jawas of defeat”
"In the first five minutes, we were hitting everybody with more information than they could handle. There were too many story lines to keep straight: the robots and the Princess, Vader, Luke."
If this doesn't sound exactly like the prequels, I don't know what does. It highlights PERFECTLY what happened to the series once George Lucas took command of editing.
Marcia Lucas fought to keep the early Luke scenes in. George didn't want them in and got his way. Ergo those cuts are not proof that Marcia and Marcia alone saved Star Wars.
@Grasshopper From JW Rinzler's The Making of Star Wars p.232:
"George also felt there was no reason to see Luke until he became an active participant in the story. But it was not an easy decision to make to just delete those sequences; Marcia fought to keep them in, and the four scenes with Luke and his friends were tried in different places. But more arguments for cutting came from the fact that George didn't like the performances, and that the later relationships Luke creates are stronger."
George edited a good chunk of Empire Strikes Back and aided Spielberg's editorial of Jurassic Park once Steven moved on to Schindler's List during post. And he was involved in lesser extents to the editorial process for all the films he directed and/wrote. As well as the Indy films. He CAN edit just fine.
@@MiguelCruz-oz7km Marcia had minimal input on the film. George, Chew and Hirsch presided over many more of the changes. Really it was Chew's baby if any of them.
@@scottb3034 picked up Paul Hirsch's memoir. According to him, his and Chew's contract ended at the end of 76, but Marcia left to go work on Scorsese's New York, New York after his original editor died. Of the two editors remaining Lucas chose to keep Hirsch on board into 77 to work on the fine cut of the film as well as inserting the VFX shots as they came in from ILM. What lends credence to his account is that Hirsch was hired as the sole editor of The Empire Strikes Back.
Hirsch says he ran into Lucas at the premiere of The Force Awakens. Lucas told him, "You were the last man standing. You saved my picture."
The only time I will ever listen to someone talk about this is with THOSE WHO WERE INVOLVED IN IT"S MAKING! THE END!! Anyone else is just making facts up as they only have hearsay to go on.
They actually omit stuff purposefully. Really shameful.
Actual, REAL Documentary quality ? On UA-cam? WITH sources stated?!?! Is this real life??
Awesome ! THANK YOU! :-)
I always say that 90% of everything on UA-cam is crud but every now and then you find some good material or gold nuggets in this ocean of filth.
Is this the first youtube documentary you saw?
Yeah, wtf you on about? This isn't 2012; people actually put effort into their videos, specially documentaries like these. Sure crap is still more popular, because crap will always sell, but this isn't that uncommon anymore.
It's not that quality. It portrays Marcia as some kind of savior of Star Wars. She edited one sequence in the entire film. Battle of Yevin. The other two editors did the vast bulk of the work that turned it into what it is today. Ppl like to over sell her role.
@@alcovitch Yes true but she was also script doctor to the film
Thank you Marcia Lucas, you saved the franchise before it was even born
By editing ONE sequence, the battle of Yevin. She didn't edit the whole movie. Jesus.
@@alcovitch She did help edit the whole film. She was a regular editor for the whole trilogy. Jesus
There were also two other editors including Lucas himself who cut the gun port sequence.
keep in mind george was telling her what to edit. it was his vision and it would have turned out exactly the same if he was the one doing it
@Captain Brandon Horror Lover Yes, and if George cared enough about his marriage during the original trilogy, he could have saved it and kept the one collaborator, his wife, and co-editor, during the Prequel trilogy whose artistic opinions he couldn't ignore.
The CC on this makes watching it so damned funny. Yosh the Foss, Lope.
Such a well done vid though. Thank you for making it!
Holy fuck... isn't this exactly what editing is for? To save it?
I know this is hard to believe, but I sincerely think Lucas was aiming more for a "Godfather 2" kind of epic movie, a visual feast with some lengthy exposition, but he couldn't do it, so instead we got a tightly-edited James Cameron-style blockbuster. In fact, look at Terminator 2, and check out how much stuff was edited out. Lengthy and very expensive scenes had to be cut, once Cameron realized they didn't work too well. We get a better movie, but with a slightly odd feel and quirky pacing. In the end, the amazing effects sequences in both films save the day, and make them classics.
You mean that James Cameron's movies have a George Lucas-Style.
Aliens is another good example movie of a husband director/wife production team. Gale Anne Hurd made huge and very effective changes to cut down and tighten up the theatrically released version. IMHO Cameron's full 'director's cut' version isn't nearly as good as the theatrical release.
@@gfarrell80 Cameron is very passionate about his films, and tends to go overboard with excessive scenes. He knows when to listen about making cuts.
Moral of the story to production: fix it in post
Moral of the story to post: fuck production
there is a radio version with all the cut audio put back in and it's really well done
It's a shame how a really interesting documentary about how editing "saves" a movie it brought down by deliberate misinformation about when the changes were made and who made them. By February 1977 the rough cut you describe didn't exist, many of the changes you describe were already made, and two of the three editors had left the picture already. The rough cut you describe is the October/November 1976 cut, in which Chew, Hirsch and Marcia Lucas worked. Instead of describing the editing as an organic process that slowly improved the movie, you present it as "Lucas' first edit was bad, then three editors came in and they saved the film". A shame really.
I know it drives me nuts. This is deliberate misinformation to bash on Lucas and people are too stupid to look any of this up.
Current narrative is that "women are amazing", to score social media points, and it's always easy to use Lucas as blame for everything. That's all they did with this vid. Promote a narrative based on current meta, that has nothing to do with facts but feelings.
@@Janzer_ I mean it's pretty well documented the Prequels were ass because Lucas didn't have anyone to tell him no, and was kind of megalomaniac while running them.
So it's not just a phony narrative to look back and notice the differences between who he collaborated with on his earlier projects compared to his later films.
@@llJiggyFlyll I mean, it's not really documented at all. It was claimed in some retarded internet video by RLM and then repeated ad nauseum by even shittier internet commenters.
@@llJiggyFlyll The idea that Lucas was surrounded by 'yes men' for the prequels has been rejected by film historians Paul Duncan and JW Rinzler
As a filmmaker, editing is rewriting and a good editor can make it even better. This was such a beautiful essay. So true, wonderful and something many people should watch and learn from on how a film should be made. Awesome, awesome job.
ua-cam.com/video/olqVGz6mOVE/v-deo.html
The video is full of many lies meant to discredit George Lucas. They did a great job clipping their quotes in just the right place to adhere to their false narrative
9:15 "You see, his blood... it drained into the boards and I had to change 'em..."
Every day I worry all day...
About what's waiting in the bushes of love.
I know you want someone to hold on to,
but we all got a chicken duck woman thing waiting for us...
Zuwel Scratch Everyday I worry all day....
Thank you. I really enjoyed this video. Great work.
Nerdonymous video is better.
It's also truthful and accurate, unlike this shambolic POS video.
It's the magic of editing !
🔮
3:00 Shows that Lucas is a genuis with a huge imagination, but needs other experts to help him simplify. It's like channeling the rage of a beast to something great
If only he would use his powers for good instead of evil...
How did he use his powers for evil?
Benjamin Tyus prequels
That's how it is with all of them. The advice and assistance Lucas received from the other filmmakers at that screening is similar to the advice and assistance Lucas provided to those same filmmakers on their projects. And a lot of those filmmakers were present and offered feedback on the prequels. The hatred comes not because they are bad movies, but because they didn't line up with fan expectation.
@@urshitheads Exactly :(
Editing can make or break you. Never underestimate editing.
People are braindead saying that better editing would've fixed the prequels. No, the problem with the prequels is the acting and the screenplay not the editing because something that was poorly filmed can't be fixed by edits. They would have to reshoot everything pretty much to fix it and I haven't seen any good deleted scenes that would've fixed anything
Looking at how bad it was pre-editing, Episodes I-III suddenly make sense.
I think that explains the unofficial edit of the Episode-1 which was applauded by many
those films get way too much hate
By "get," I think you mean "deserve."
YEP!!!
The problem with the prequels lay more with Lucas' shortcomings in the areas of screenwriting and directing actors, as far as I'm concerned. Even so, I'll take them over any of the movies Di$ney has put out so far. They clearly don't "get" Lucas' universe.
Wait, you make video essay too? 😲
Please make more video essay
Vardamas thank you ✋😁
This is my favourite video on youtube.
Nice work, man. Good stuff.