Quick and concise - I like it! Keep it up! As for the Panel: The plastic looks a little cheap, but I suppose its functionality is a good argument for any Hornet enthusiast
Winwing nailed it with there FA/18 mip and UFC panels, I do not understand why they don't continue with accurate panel designs instead of making custom button boxes. If they would make them 1:1 recreations I would buy them all!!
as an offline reviewer and consultant for cockpit construction, I have to agree fully with the assement given in this review to every detail. I bought this for myself and have been using it since it arrived on 9/21/23. I myself run a VR cockpit and find everything easily managable with the array. however, i will state that the wingfold could have been better constructed due to it having an issue with coming off in your hand if you are not gentle with it. as for the select jett rotary, yes it is a bit soft and not easily readable for its position when looking through the nose cup of your VR headset. what would have been better for it would have to have each position light up on an individual basis as the knob is rotated. a quick fix to this for me was to take some UV epoxy and put a small "braille" line on the knob itself where the arrow indicator is, so i could feel which position the rotary is in.
I'm on the fence about this one. I use Virpil gear (T-50CM3 Throttle, SharKA50 Panel, MongoosCM2 Stick w/ WarBRD base) and recently got into flying the DCS Hornet. Loved it so much, I bought the WW "Iceman" UFC with the 2 MFD's. The build quality and ease of install of these WW items was phenomenal. I then started looking at this PTO2 panel but I just can't get past the crappy wing-folder, the half arsed park brake and the hook lever. If it was only $200 (AUD) yeah fair enough, I could justify the short comings at that price. Not for $320 AUD, though, it's disappointing. This needs some serious improvement. Perhaps they should have combined the discontinued combat-ready panel along with elements of this. It seems as per many reviews below, it duplicates switches on the existing Orion2. Whilst it doesn't matter for someone like me who doesn't use the Orion, it doesn't make logical sense. If this goes on sale with a convincingly priced argument, I'd take it, but not in it's current value equation state.
Based on the inputs this panel covers I'm not convinced we're likely to see a Panel Combat readiness 2 from winwing. At the very least, if we do I don't think it'd be that similar to the previous one, as most of the more distinct/bespoke pieces like the jettison and hard-point selector are present on the PTO2. This new version seems like it was a result of a real effort from winwing to combine it's two old modules into a single panel that covered basically everything you'd expect to find on that station. Def hope they do put out more stuff though, these panels look amazing and I'm looking forward to when I'm in a position to buy one
Maybe it's just me but I feel like if I'm gonna go spend tons of money on switch panels, I'd like them to be 1-1 to a specific aircraft. This seems like it would get pretty confusing trying to use in something like an F16
Flying in VR 100% of the time, I wish I could use these panels. However lifting your HMD every time to see what you are doing kills the moment in VR. So still waiting for a affordable way to track your hands in VR so you can actually manipulate the switches in the VR cockpit. 😉
As you use the panel you'll get used to the positions of things, and as mentioned they're keyed so you can figure out by touch. I use the panel without looking despite not generally using VR. That said, hopefully someone will come up with a hand tracking camera/sensor, so you can simply reach out and hand 'mouse' things. Swapping from hotas, picking up a vr controller to touch a switch and back is such a hassle. An improved leap motion perhaps.
The loose wing fold handle is a common issue with molded plastic and a pot shaft. I've always had good luck just cutting a shim from an aluminum soda can to fit the flat on the shaft, and pressing the knob (in this case handle) onto it. WW could fix the issue easily by using a brass insert in the handle when they mold it, so maybe it'll get fixed.
Yeah it's a bit of a shock they ship it like that. I hope they fix it up on an early revision model. Not impressed that got through QA testing during the product design stage. Shouldn't be too hard to fix, but as @CAL1MBO said, it shouldn't be on the customer to fix. Thanks for the suggestion, I'll take that into consideration when i get round to fixing my own!
@@RedKiteRender Yeah, it shouldn't be that way, but it's often a matter of tolerances. Plastic injection molding isn't as precise as you'd think it should be, too many variables. Then the makers of the hall senosrs/switches/pots don't hold the highest toelrances for the shafts, at times, either Sometimes the tolerances add up to a loose fit or a tight one (which no one complains about heh). The worst offender was CH products in their joysticks about 10 years ago. They changed suppliers for their pots, but did not change the hole size for the joystick cams, so they were such a loose fit that the joystick was unusable, due to the huge amount of slop. I contacted them, and pointed out the issue, to be told it was my problem, and they refused to even do a return. So far at least, WW seems to be very responsive to customer feedback, I would be surprised if this issue isn't addressed.
It looks like the main problem with the wing fold switch is how sloppy it is in the switch mount hole. I bet someone could 3D print a sleeve that goes over the outside of that mount and supports the switch itself further up which would make it feel a lot better.
Hopefully Winwing starts soon the production of similar instruments (Hotas combos, PTO and PCR panels, MFDs, etc) for the Chinese and Russian versions of the flanker, which be also valid for the JF-17.
The box is useful but as someone else mentioned, why not design the controls as they are in the cockpit (as they did with the MIPS, UFC, and HUD control)?
You all realize they are maybe five years from just making 1.1 clickable cockpits. Here why by each of the mods seperate and just buy the whole cockpit. 25,995 paid in twelv easy intallments lol
Yes indeed, but what WW have designed, reveals a little about their own design direction, as they want to keep it future proofed. I dread to think what shipping their rig would cost! Certainly a better option to go for a more local producer.
It looks like they used the Thrustmaster Airbus facsimile as a baseline, which is all the quality (and expense) most enthusiasts need. Not sure that price point is right tho, but ultimately, they're the only game in town, and I'm guessing they can't deal in volume like Thrustmaster can.
I really dislike that they have added buttons that are allready on other products like the store select and the refuling probe. I have the full hornet cockpit from winwing and it would be nice if the stuff would fit together without having some switches multiple times. I am confident that they will remake the combat ready panel too so to solve that issue but its still not ideal
Looks good. If one buys the panel you describe and plug it in can I set the bindings in DCS without the need for yet another 3rd party ‘configuration tool’?
Oh well… Nevermind! Seemingly, no UK supplier? And on both US & EU sites, unable to change delivery from ‘Cookstown’, wherever that is 🤣, to my UK location. Unless anyone else has found a UK supplier?
I agree this is well made and all but what is the purpose of all the dials? It doesn't seem you can map Dial Btn22 + Jet Center to an action... with 0 documentation and no setup controls in the software might as well just be a box of switches... Am I missing something? Seems to defeat the point of having a nice dial to select the hardpoint if you can't combine it with things logically.
Things like the Wing Fold might get some improvements later in life, but i doubt they'll do major re-arrangements. I know the Orion throttle 1 had a mid life improvement, as i have a launch day and late life base revision, Orion 2 has a special edition with metal switch toppers (Same as found on this). The PTO1 also had its landing gear change a little in later versions. So it might happen.
What I dislike about this is that most of the buttons and switches are already on the Orion2 throttle. So yes it is handy, but adds basically very little when you already own a orion2 throttle.
Great review! Can you add this on the top of the monstertechmount as it comes? If i mcgyver it on in some way? Or do you have to buy the expensive Monstertechmount winwing adapter thing? thanks
Monstertech have a mount adaptor for the old PTO/PCR panels, i don't know if they've got one for the new mounting bracket. If they support the MIP you can use the same adaptor.
Great video. I bought the pto2 for vr use, and will mount it centrally with a winwing desk clamp so I can reach up with each hand for certain controls similar to the real jet. I’d be interested in how/whether it can be mounted this way in combination with other panels eg the UFC or even the UFC/Hud combo. Doing so would get me away from the mouse and keyboard for more than 95% of cockpit actions.
What annoys me about this panel is that half of the switches are already on the Orion throttle base. Which halfes the value it adds for people that already own the throttle. Or at least for me. I know you can remap the keys but then the labels don't match and it makes it harder to remember what switch does what. A panel that aims to fully complement the orion base instead of competing with it would be perfect.
Whilst the PTO2's functionality certainly looks awesome, its plastic construction is such a big stepdown in terms of build quality. It gives of the look and probably also the feel of a toy whilst having a noticeable increase in price over its predecessor.
You can plug it in, no drivers or software needed and use it right away. However, you will need to bind controls manually, unless you use SimAppPro to import a premade profile.
why we want buy this if 3rd version of this come xD mayby landing gear fixed or 2nd of that other panel or genuine side panels just take your money again. i would buy all panels if they real match not just buttons and knobs around cockipit in one place. its confusing. and everyone have stream deck anyway
By the time it gets to me its almost $300. FOR A PLASTIC BUTTON BOX..... For half that I can buy a 3D printer and make one myself, lol. How fancy does it need to be when youre in VR?
Wow, looks really cheap compared to their earlier stuff. I have the original Super Taurus which has been solid (and massive), plus an Orion 2 HOTAS Max I bought for my son, but this looks really nasty by comparison.
The Super Taurus i had broke on me in the end, was never a fan of that sticky top layer material for the backlight/lettering, that started to peel at the corners. So in some respects I'm glad they've moved to the plastic, but it's an odd one, steps forwards and backwards. I wouldn't say its worse than the Orion 2 set though (ignoring the Wing fold anyway..)
In China, gamers were dissatisfied with the product, which was poorly built and expensive. At the same time, its functions have a lot of overlap with Orion2 Throttle Base.
I can understand that, they need to up the quality in a few places, they've made steps forwards and backwards on this one. It makes me wonder if the there will be a new Orion base specifically with different switches. WW are in a difficult position where they're trying to be a sim pit, but also be an all in one.
Master caution button directly next to the jettison button is really funny. Imagine that in a real aircraft. Guy just flying and gets some oil pressure warning, pushes jettision button instead of master caution, lmao. You'd think they put a folding cover, or at least a raised rim around it.
@@ProtomanBlues no its not... You can even see in the video that it's not. Check 1:17. Master caution is at the top left of the cockpit, lit up, and jettison is at the very bottom of the screen on the left(you can't quite see the button but you can read "emergency jettison"). They are quite a decent distance away from eachother.
Bold of you to assume I'll never be landing with my wings folded
lmao
Happy to report the wing fold switch on my PTO2 is really solid and can't be fulled off. Looks like they took that feedback on production model.
Same here, i was quite worried, but got my new one yesterday and overall wonderful!
Quick and concise - I like it! Keep it up!
As for the Panel: The plastic looks a little cheap, but I suppose its functionality is a good argument for any Hornet enthusiast
Winwing nailed it with there FA/18 mip and UFC panels, I do not understand why they don't continue with accurate panel designs instead of making custom button boxes. If they would make them 1:1 recreations I would buy them all!!
"ah crap not again" xD
thanks for the review! Love the Winwing lineup!
as an offline reviewer and consultant for cockpit construction, I have to agree fully with the assement given in this review to every detail. I bought this for myself and have been using it since it arrived on 9/21/23. I myself run a VR cockpit and find everything easily managable with the array. however, i will state that the wingfold could have been better constructed due to it having an issue with coming off in your hand if you are not gentle with it. as for the select jett rotary, yes it is a bit soft and not easily readable for its position when looking through the nose cup of your VR headset. what would have been better for it would have to have each position light up on an individual basis as the knob is rotated. a quick fix to this for me was to take some UV epoxy and put a small "braille" line on the knob itself where the arrow indicator is, so i could feel which position the rotary is in.
The opening has had me chuckling all day!
I'm on the fence about this one.
I use Virpil gear (T-50CM3 Throttle, SharKA50 Panel, MongoosCM2 Stick w/ WarBRD base) and recently got into flying the DCS Hornet. Loved it so much, I bought the WW "Iceman" UFC with the 2 MFD's. The build quality and ease of install of these WW items was phenomenal.
I then started looking at this PTO2 panel but I just can't get past the crappy wing-folder, the half arsed park brake and the hook lever. If it was only $200 (AUD) yeah fair enough, I could justify the short comings at that price. Not for $320 AUD, though, it's disappointing.
This needs some serious improvement. Perhaps they should have combined the discontinued combat-ready panel along with elements of this. It seems as per many reviews below, it duplicates switches on the existing Orion2. Whilst it doesn't matter for someone like me who doesn't use the Orion, it doesn't make logical sense.
If this goes on sale with a convincingly priced argument, I'd take it, but not in it's current value equation state.
Thanks for the honest review! 🙂
Based on the inputs this panel covers I'm not convinced we're likely to see a Panel Combat readiness 2 from winwing. At the very least, if we do I don't think it'd be that similar to the previous one, as most of the more distinct/bespoke pieces like the jettison and hard-point selector are present on the PTO2. This new version seems like it was a result of a real effort from winwing to combine it's two old modules into a single panel that covered basically everything you'd expect to find on that station. Def hope they do put out more stuff though, these panels look amazing and I'm looking forward to when I'm in a position to buy one
I use version one of the Take Off Panel and enjoy it very much. This appears to be a nice improvement to V1.
Thank you for the review
Maybe it's just me but I feel like if I'm gonna go spend tons of money on switch panels, I'd like them to be 1-1 to a specific aircraft. This seems like it would get pretty confusing trying to use in something like an F16
Flying in VR 100% of the time, I wish I could use these panels. However lifting your HMD every time to see what you are doing kills the moment in VR. So still waiting for a affordable way to track your hands in VR so you can actually manipulate the switches in the VR cockpit. 😉
As you use the panel you'll get used to the positions of things, and as mentioned they're keyed so you can figure out by touch. I use the panel without looking despite not generally using VR.
That said, hopefully someone will come up with a hand tracking camera/sensor, so you can simply reach out and hand 'mouse' things. Swapping from hotas, picking up a vr controller to touch a switch and back is such a hassle. An improved leap motion perhaps.
The loose wing fold handle is a common issue with molded plastic and a pot shaft. I've always had good luck just cutting a shim from an aluminum soda can to fit the flat on the shaft, and pressing the knob (in this case handle) onto it. WW could fix the issue easily by using a brass insert in the handle when they mold it, so maybe it'll get fixed.
Shouldn't need to with something that cost €300
Yeah it's a bit of a shock they ship it like that. I hope they fix it up on an early revision model. Not impressed that got through QA testing during the product design stage. Shouldn't be too hard to fix, but as @CAL1MBO said, it shouldn't be on the customer to fix. Thanks for the suggestion, I'll take that into consideration when i get round to fixing my own!
@@RedKiteRender Yeah, it shouldn't be that way, but it's often a matter of tolerances. Plastic injection molding isn't as precise as you'd think it should be, too many variables. Then the makers of the hall senosrs/switches/pots don't hold the highest toelrances for the shafts, at times, either Sometimes the tolerances add up to a loose fit or a tight one (which no one complains about heh).
The worst offender was CH products in their joysticks about 10 years ago. They changed suppliers for their pots, but did not change the hole size for the joystick cams, so they were such a loose fit that the joystick was unusable, due to the huge amount of slop. I contacted them, and pointed out the issue, to be told it was my problem, and they refused to even do a return.
So far at least, WW seems to be very responsive to customer feedback, I would be surprised if this issue isn't addressed.
@@RedKiteRender It is fixed on the version I just got yesterday. Can't pull it off at all and it is really stable from side to side.
It looks like the main problem with the wing fold switch is how sloppy it is in the switch mount hole. I bet someone could 3D print a sleeve that goes over the outside of that mount and supports the switch itself further up which would make it feel a lot better.
Hopefully Winwing starts soon the production of similar instruments (Hotas combos, PTO and PCR panels, MFDs, etc) for the Chinese and Russian versions of the flanker, which be also valid for the JF-17.
I mean for $189US dollars its amazing lol
The box is useful but as someone else mentioned, why not design the controls as they are in the cockpit (as they did with the MIPS, UFC, and HUD control)?
You all realize they are maybe five years from just making 1.1 clickable cockpits. Here why by each of the mods seperate and just buy the whole cockpit. 25,995 paid in twelv easy intallments lol
They've already come up with a mounting rig 'sim cockpit' you can see it in their product previews, no doubt they want to fill that up with panels!
You can already make yourself a cockpit if you wish. Plenty of choices.
Yes indeed, but what WW have designed, reveals a little about their own design direction, as they want to keep it future proofed. I dread to think what shipping their rig would cost! Certainly a better option to go for a more local producer.
I am waiting for fully featured haptic gloves. At that point you can get 1:1 clickable on any cockpit as long as ED update the cockpits.
@@jimmydesouza4375 two options already... Both suck, unfortunately
biggest issue is overlap with the throttle, need some additional panels/labels to not end up with a large number of duplicate buttons.
It looks like they used the Thrustmaster Airbus facsimile as a baseline, which is all the quality (and expense) most enthusiasts need. Not sure that price point is right tho, but ultimately, they're the only game in town, and I'm guessing they can't deal in volume like Thrustmaster can.
I really dislike that they have added buttons that are allready on other products like the store select and the refuling probe. I have the full hornet cockpit from winwing and it would be nice if the stuff would fit together without having some switches multiple times. I am confident that they will remake the combat ready panel too so to solve that issue but its still not ideal
Supposedly, no new combat panel is in the works... yeah go figure.
Can you use this for any game by binding game controls to the buttons and switches of the controller?
it makes me so jealous to see ur video's cuz i want all winwing's stuff especially the f-16ex combo
Looks good. If one buys the panel you describe and plug it in can I set the bindings in DCS without the need for yet another 3rd party ‘configuration tool’?
SimAppPro is entirely optional, The panel will work without it just fine.
@@RedKiteRender Thanks, was hoping that would be the case. Will look for a supplier 😎
Oh well… Nevermind! Seemingly, no UK supplier? And on both US & EU sites, unable to change delivery from ‘Cookstown’, wherever that is 🤣, to my UK location. Unless anyone else has found a UK supplier?
@@RebelNine There is a UK distribution centre, it should give you a country/region select.
@@RedKiteRender OK, many thanks
HI
Thank you so luch for this test 👍🏻👍🏻
Aplushhss 😇👍🏻
I agree this is well made and all but what is the purpose of all the dials? It doesn't seem you can map Dial Btn22 + Jet Center to an action... with 0 documentation and no setup controls in the software might as well just be a box of switches... Am I missing something? Seems to defeat the point of having a nice dial to select the hardpoint if you can't combine it with things logically.
good 3d prints, where did you get them?
I 3d modelled them in blender, and printed them myself on a modified Ender 3
I wonder if they will fix some of the issues.
Things like the Wing Fold might get some improvements later in life, but i doubt they'll do major re-arrangements. I know the Orion throttle 1 had a mid life improvement, as i have a launch day and late life base revision, Orion 2 has a special edition with metal switch toppers (Same as found on this). The PTO1 also had its landing gear change a little in later versions. So it might happen.
My jettison knob has quite strong indent
Will this work with MSFS2020?
What I dislike about this is that most of the buttons and switches are already on the Orion2 throttle.
So yes it is handy, but adds basically very little when you already own a orion2 throttle.
Great review! Can you add this on the top of the monstertechmount as it comes? If i mcgyver it on in some way? Or do you have to buy the expensive Monstertechmount winwing adapter thing? thanks
Monstertech have a mount adaptor for the old PTO/PCR panels, i don't know if they've got one for the new mounting bracket. If they support the MIP you can use the same adaptor.
Great video. I bought the pto2 for vr use, and will mount it centrally with a winwing desk clamp so I can reach up with each hand for certain controls similar to the real jet. I’d be interested in how/whether it can be mounted this way in combination with other panels eg the UFC or even the UFC/Hud combo. Doing so would get me away from the mouse and keyboard for more than 95% of cockpit actions.
The MIP set has the exact same desk mounts, so long as you have room to the side of the PTO2 you can fit a complete MIP setup next to it.
@@RedKiteRender Thanks. I am interested if I can mount the PTO2 (bottom) and UFC/HUD combo (top) on a single desk mount
Is someone having the problem that the landing gear lights don't turn off... If yes...what is the problem and what is the solution for fix it. Tnx!
Nice review but I think I'll keep my v1 ... that ministick is really useful.
I hope they will send you the Viper ICP for review :-)
Why a three position gear lever?
Some aircraft (like the Mig-21) have a neutral middle position on their gear.
What annoys me about this panel is that half of the switches are already on the Orion throttle base. Which halfes the value it adds for people that already own the throttle. Or at least for me. I know you can remap the keys but then the labels don't match and it makes it harder to remember what switch does what.
A panel that aims to fully complement the orion base instead of competing with it would be perfect.
I am considering buying it purely for that warning label lmfao.
I promise WinWing I'll only commit acts of violence with this panel in DCS.
"Don't commit acts of violence" A sobering warning label to attach to the control panel for a fighter jet.
Whilst the PTO2's functionality certainly looks awesome, its plastic construction is such a big stepdown in terms of build quality. It gives of the look and probably also the feel of a toy whilst having a noticeable increase in price over its predecessor.
What is with you boomers and your hate of plastic lol
@@TheFreedirt29 Lol, I'm 23 years old.
@@muammargaddafi2740 the 23 year old boomer strikes again
@@TheFreedirt29 Zoomers are all Boomers it's actually fucking crazy.
IS it plug and play ?
You can plug it in, no drivers or software needed and use it right away. However, you will need to bind controls manually, unless you use SimAppPro to import a premade profile.
@@RedKiteRender thx bro 🤟
why we want buy this if 3rd version of this come xD mayby landing gear fixed or 2nd of that other panel or genuine side panels just take your money again. i would buy all panels if they real match not just buttons and knobs around cockipit in one place. its confusing. and everyone have stream deck anyway
問題是，這一套要多少錢@@?
"Panel Of Take Off"
Would it be so much trouble for WinWing to run a name past some native English speakers at some point in design and planning?
You can buy a farming simulator device for half the price and it will apply to all dcs modules fairly. this is just dumb.
By the time it gets to me its almost $300. FOR A PLASTIC BUTTON BOX..... For half that I can buy a 3D printer and make one myself, lol. How fancy does it need to be when youre in VR?
Thanks for the review! Not really worth the upgrade from Gen 1.
5:32 Jingle bells, jingle bells, jingle all the way.
I'm quite disappointed with the build quality so nope, thanx. Anyway thank you for the review.
Wow, looks really cheap compared to their earlier stuff. I have the original Super Taurus which has been solid (and massive), plus an Orion 2 HOTAS Max I bought for my son, but this looks really nasty by comparison.
The Super Taurus i had broke on me in the end, was never a fan of that sticky top layer material for the backlight/lettering, that started to peel at the corners. So in some respects I'm glad they've moved to the plastic, but it's an odd one, steps forwards and backwards. I wouldn't say its worse than the Orion 2 set though (ignoring the Wing fold anyway..)
Looks large, yet too overcrowded
Leeeeever not levver!
That is one i did not realise, Ive used the two interchangeably.
@@RedKiteRender We aren't americans! No worries Big fan of yours man. :-)
In China, gamers were dissatisfied with the product, which was poorly built and expensive. At the same time, its functions have a lot of overlap with Orion2 Throttle Base.
I can understand that, they need to up the quality in a few places, they've made steps forwards and backwards on this one. It makes me wonder if the there will be a new Orion base specifically with different switches. WW are in a difficult position where they're trying to be a sim pit, but also be an all in one.
looks cheap af
It looking for cheap.
Made in China 🤣
Are you just becoming a review channel now? Stop uploading 5 minute long ads man
Master caution button directly next to the jettison button is really funny. Imagine that in a real aircraft. Guy just flying and gets some oil pressure warning, pushes jettision button instead of master caution, lmao.
You'd think they put a folding cover, or at least a raised rim around it.
That’s how it is in the real jet…
@@ProtomanBlues no its not... You can even see in the video that it's not. Check 1:17. Master caution is at the top left of the cockpit, lit up, and jettison is at the very bottom of the screen on the left(you can't quite see the button but you can read "emergency jettison"). They are quite a decent distance away from eachother.