Traction tips when you are stuck︱Cross Training Enduro
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- Опубліковано 5 кві 2016
- Traction tips when you are stuck! There's a lot of wheelspin out there, which is fine if you are into that sort of thing. But it can tiring, and even work against you if you are stuck on a log, rock ledge, wet tree roots or in deep holes. First, a quick refresher on traction as we watch top extreme enduro rider, Ben Hemingway, in an extreme hill climb event. Roll back for a runup. This seems so obvious but we often forget. When stuck, often the easiest solution is roll back a little bit then use that run up, instead of wasting energy pushing the bike over with your legs. Stuck? It's usually a good idea to look down first and make sure there aren't any rocks or other obstacles your rear wheel will spin on. This uphill rut is perfect for this technique as there are various tree roots and ledges to get stuck on. If you do a lot of technical terrain, it can also be handy to put some tug straps on your bike too. As mentioned earlier, traction involves a pile of different techniques, here are links to our training vids on the key skills. As you can see on these trials bikes, as you bounce the rear tyre flattens out and creates a bigger tyres patch for a split second of extra traction. You can also do this from a standing position by bouncing on the footpeg. Stuck? Traction is a combination of many techniques such as weighting and deweighting over uneven ground, body to the rear but coming forward on steep slopes, precise throttle control and controlled dropping of the clutch when needed, paddling with one or both legs in the toughest bits, slipping the clutch to avoid unnecessary wheelspin and excellent balancing skills throughout. Stuck? We have all seen guys stuck on these types of obstacles and trying to wheelspin their way out but usually just digging a deeper hole for themselves. We will look at a few easy ways to get traction in these situations and make the bike do all the work instead of wasting your energy and making the track even more impassable. It's surprising how quickly you can use up all your energy trying to manhandle the bike past an obstacle, instead of taking a moment to think it through then pick the best way to make the bike do the work. Bounce on the bike. If you can't rock the bike through, another option is to get over small obstacles especially on steep hills is to bounce on the seat just as you take off. Rock the bike out. What if you can't move the bike back for a run up? A great technique is simply rocking the bike out. You use little bits of throttle and clutch to rock the bike forward and backwards against the obstacle, then give a final controlled drop of the clutch to get over. Remember to keep your weight on the seat, or on the footpegs if standing. The brilliant thing about rocking the bike through is the bike does all the work, and you aren't wheel spinning and wrecking the track. Just pull the bike through. There are times we just opt to pull the bike through, instead of digging unnecessary holes or trenches in the track. The tradition seems to be grab and pull the upper fork, but we've found rolling the front tyre is often an easier way. A controlled 'drop' of the clutch. In some situations, a controlled drop of the clutch and weighting the bike will give you enough traction to get over an obstacle. Going from a seated to a standing position puts extra weight on the back wheel for extra traction. For more details, we've covered this in these two training vids already. Stuck?
Weighting & deweighting
Body positioning
Throttle control
Dropping the clutch
Leg paddling
Clutch slipping
Balancing
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Great videos, you are a first class professor of the dirt!
Cheers Owen! Now if we could just ride like first class professors of the dirt.... 😁
...And I thought I was the only one who stared at my bike.
It's funny how life experience can affect your riding technique. Growing up here in Alaska, in the '70's I learned to drive in our family pickup truck, a two wheel drive '68 Dodge half ton with a slant six and three on the tree (straight six engine and three speed steering column shift manual transmission). Two wheel drive in snow, you learn about traction fast! My dad was the master, I have to say. We didn't have our first four wheel drive until '78, and I think Dad was disappointed. He could get any car or truck unstuck, and the 4x4 was too easy! LOL!!
Many of the techniques you mention carried over instinctively to bikes for me. Don't sit and spin, the roll back (amazingly effective, no matter how slight), rocking. Weighting of course is unique to motorcycles, but once you develop an instinct for traction, you get creative about finding it.
The number one lesson about traction, driving in snow and ice with two wheel drive, was not to lose it in the first place. It's a rule that translates directly to dirt bikes and is a hallmark of my own technique to this day. Momentum is a key element, and when coupled with techniques of weighting/de-weighting , clutch and throttle control, can be a powerful tool. It is in fact what the pro's are doing when we see them conquering impossible climbs.
When we first moved to Alaska in 1969, my dad was a teacher and school administrator in Homer. Among his duties was tending to the families schooling on correspondence (today it's called home schooling). One of those families was the Kilcher family, who lived on a ranch far outside of town, way down a steep mountainside from the road. The Kilchers are the subject of the Discovery Channel program "Alaska: The Last Frontier", and the brothers, cousins and other relatives of singer Jewel Kilcher (this was five years before she was born). Back in those days the family truly lived off the grid with mail service being their only connection, besides the road, to the world outside the ranch.
Dad had to meet with Atz, the patriarch of the clan, and so it was arranged that Atz would meet us at the top of their miles long, steep, icy driveway and take us down to the house. Dad brought my brother and I because Atz was famous for his driving technique on that icy hill and Dad knew we would enjoy it. We did! Oh my goodness, it opened a whole new world for my 9 year old brain! Atz drove then rare Subaru's, but that was before they were four wheel drive. They were front wheel drive, which helped of course. But what a roller coaster ride it was! Sliding and speeding through snow and ice, splashing through creeks that would be frozen solid if they weren't flowing so fast. It was crazy! But momentum was Atz's great effective weapon in the battle for traction.
Momentum comes in many sizes, and as you point out in this vid, even a few inches of rolling can develop the modicum of momentum required to tract over an obstacle. So momentum doesn't have to mean great speed (though it can!).
Great video Mr. Morris, I enjoyed it very much. Thank you sir.
+gncc1race an epic slice of more recent alaskan history there. that sounds so remote, having the mail as the only connection with the outside world... i think i mentioned i reread michener's novel 'alaska' recently and it's an incredible place.
but on the traction side of things, i found it applied in reverse as i went backpacking 20 years ago and these english backpackers kept bogging the 4WD in the soft sand, so i'd need to take over and do the rocking thing to get it out again. i'd never done any offroad driving but the motorbike principles just transferred directly.
also in our local areas we'll see drivers chewing up the tracks so badly, then an experienced guy comes along and does a very tough section with minimal wheelspin. awesome to watch, even if it's not a bike. :)
+CROSS TRAINING, ENDUROCROSS & ENDURO TECHNIQUES Oh yeah, it's all about understanding and applying the basic principles, no matter what you're driving.
Im no pro and like to think im quite skilled in the art of not falling off, yet i watch these vids because every day is a school day and i think watching other riders is the best tuition anyone can learn from there wins and fails on the trails.Good to see im not the only bloke tackling some snotty stuff on the good old drz shes a go anywere machine
Great vid that bears revisiting every little while to remind us of the basics of TM
Moto therapy , always make me smile to watch those video …. and a bit envious too..
Another cool video i just aplied the tecnique of rocking and trail with awesome result thanks alot and keep going best regards from mexico
simple but practical, good stuff mate , have a xt660r which is not light and carry luggage , and from your tips and birch tips in your videos it's got me out of tricky places as its always muddy and wet over here in the hills , thanks 👍👊
+darren fitzpatrick great to hear darren. yeah i'm finding even when i'm adventure riding on the DR650 there are all these techniques i can use once the terrain starts to get rough. we did a lot of adventure riding a few years ago, and there were often tricky moments like riding across broken bridges or over slippery clay where i know i'd be a lot more confident now.
Nice vid again !
Wow 4;39, i never see this technique, look like really nice !
Thx for your advices, and your good humour !
+Enduro Bastos it's a great technique, i learned it in our trials club then trasnferred it to the dirt bike. much less energy than wrestling the bike over the log.
Excellent tips! I see a lot of riders standing next to their bikes pushing with the wheel spinning...
With no weight on it the spinning isn't doing much at all so the rider gets exhausted.
I was glad you showed tug ropes at the end since I think every bike should have them if any riding puts them in the situation where they need help.
I like simple soft-loop webbing tie-down straps. They are inexpensive, come in various lengths and colors, are super strong, and are sewn with a loop on each end (actually they are one loop sewn closed in the middle).
Pop the top triple clamp off and drop a loop over each fork leg and bolt the top clamp back on.
The rear loop may be a bit more challenging to mount depending on the frame layout but should be easy to figure out a good way to fasten it on if you want one. The front loop is going to be used a lot more than the rear.
+JagLite48 agreed jaglite, the straps make it so much easier to help someone out of trouble. i like the built in handgrips on the rear of the beta, these make lifting the bike around so much easier. the old husaberg FE570 had them too.
If you’re a short rider and can barely touch the ground; you are highly motivated to maintain momentum.
I used to get stuck a lot, so i bought a DR650... problem solved 😁
I smile when ever I see that white drz we need more of that bike in future vids
+MARK5MAN7170 there's a bit of a change there, he sold it then bought a new RR300, had to sell that for various reasons and now he's on a WR250R of all things.....
+CROSS TRAINING, ENDUROCROSS & ENDURO TECHNIQUES very unfortunate to hear he sold the drz interesting in going from a 2 stroke 300rr to a 4 stroke wr250r if I was allowed to ride a smoker on the street I would. one of the reasons I chose the drz instead of the wr was there wieght was so close to eachother I chose the higher displacement bike with very little epa crap on it.
This video is so much helpful for newbies like me... Thanks a lot!
Glad it was helpful, Regin! We have around 100 free training vids now....
Yes it really is.. And will apply this tips as soon as i can buy tires.. Just don't have it yet...
The trick I use for getting over giant logs in one I learned somewhere is go in maybe 1st or second gear, stand up while you are leading up to it, compress the suspension and a blast of throttle will propel you over off camber logs that are slippery and big diameter logs or rocks that would otherwise slow you down and wear you out...
covered 10 different ways to cross logs in our 10 log series
Awesome vid thanks!
wheel spin. My favorite
Good stuff fellers!!!!!!!!!!
another great video. also very nice job on that log where you weight and deweight to the standing position land and then stop
+maXim0200 thanks maxim, that was a bit of a fluke with the stopping and balancing at the end. in trials i learned that if your rear tyre is still hard against the log when you finish it makes it very easy to balance at a standstill.
Following your videos for some time now. We took your advice, and bought every family member a trial bike to practice!
+N221BP cool! how is everyone enjoying it? they can take a while to get used to at first. :)
+CROSS TRAINING, ENDUROCROSS & ENDURO TECHNIQUES We took a paid trials training session first, just to see how everyone coped. My sons (4&7 yo) liked their electric OSET's big time, and the lady of the house ran circles around her class (despite no motorcycle experience...), and she kept asking the staff for more challenging routes. We all had a grin from ear to ear. It's quite physical actually, the workout is quite welcome.
+N221BP great to hear. :) even after months of throwing myself into it, i was surprised at how tiring it is to go slow... a great physical workout. and grinning of course!
Hello my gumby friends. I wanted to thank you for the vids they have really helped me improve my technical skills as well as basic stuff. thanks again!!
Ya same here,it has helped me out a lot
+Ryan Watson thanks ryan, i've always figured that the ideal is to shell out money for coaching from a professional but it's great to hear that the vids are helping guys develop better technique... if we gumbies can improve then there's hope for everyone lol.
Great video buddy! Cheers from spain
de nada noel... desde australia!
:)
You're the calmest biker I know. You probably meditate daily :D
i tried meditation once but it just put me to sleep, alex. lol i've done everything i can to avoid stress, live simply, only work as much as i need to.... works for me! ua-cam.com/video/zifEBWx2LEo/v-deo.html
oh common, clutch control, balance, body positioning... are all that I lack but I still back flip 5th wheels on a 80 degree slope!
Thanks for the vid - again very helpful. I'm still struggling to get traction on hill climbs on my new 300 RR. 2 stroke is more challenging to figure out and I think I am still having bad habits from a year of riding my 500 exc...but Im sure it will come some day.
+michail1963 it's a steep learning curve michail, i am still adapting after a year of two strokes! the top riders can actually do better on two strokes because they use that instant response so well, but many of us would do better on four strokes until we learn excellent throttle control.
+CROSS TRAINING, ENDUROCROSS & ENDURO TECHNIQUES With a throttle tamer and Midwest clever lever I am now able to modulate the throttle / clutch quite precisely. Also few extreme enduro training with a local champ have helped:). Once I convince myself to start filming, I will share a few rides here in Czech Republic:)
tq
great vids! dont know how you big guys ride???it be nice to be 160 lbs (for a day)
Great video! Traction is a huge concern when you get half of a dirt bike stuck in muddy water holes. Over here in Florida we have sugar sand and 1 to 2 feet deep dips that fill with water when it rains. Those dips retain water extremely well and can be there for weeks and weeks after a storm. When I ride through them I either launch the bike from second gear enough that that front wheel is about 2-3 feet off of the ground, come at it with some speed from the get or pop the clutch in first so that front wheels is waaaaay up and when it comes down land/ on the other side of the hole outside of the muddy water so I don't flip over the bar. I would LOVE to hear your break down on getting over muddy water holes that often come about in trails. I see and hear of people flipping over the handle bars all the time.
+Belicose777 yeah, me and mud don't mix that well belicose777! i'm a bit paranoid about mud since i shattered my lower leg years ago in muddy ruts, i just hobble through like a scared old man ever since. :) i tend toward chris birch's option which is always look for a way around if possible....
+CROSS TRAINING, ENDUROCROSS & ENDURO TECHNIQUES lol. Fair enough. Where I ride sometimes the only way around is through thick brush. There was a pile up blocking the way( some riders got stuck in said water hole) last time I rode and luckily a quad rider and myself had the idea to cut through some. He went first leaving all the big stuff on the ground for me to ride over. So far wheelies have been my only solution to water pits. Hope a video drops before I hurt myself plowing through 2 foot deep waterholes at 20mph.
Great vids! Can you do some videos on the proper techniques to ride those nasty off camber trails, without sliding down the mountain side?
+dieselworld definitely on the waiting list dieselword, it's just a case of getting enough footage to finish off the vid
Did you get this video up yet...something I would be interested in for sure !! Keep up the great work...love your vids !!
Great videos!!! Keep em coming!!
Tractions the only thing keeping me alive on black ice, momentum is key even when going through 2' of snow and ice which can act like mud real quick, dont ride in too high of a gear for two instances, you have to drop down one to keep momentum and rpms the same for engine braking and not too low of rpms so the engine isnt being asked for more power than it has
The most important part about finding traction is knowing which places you wont have traction
+threefiddyone yep, i love watching ben hemingway is slow motion up that extreme hill climb, and how he's backing off the throttle constantly where he knows he won't get grip, then back on the throttle again.
+CROSS TRAINING, ENDUROCROSS & ENDURO TECHNIQUES Yeah he definitely showed us how its done. Master that, and any hill climb is easy as pie.
+threefiddyone ben hemingway and graham jarvis just romped up that hill. it was so steep that walking around to film them was actually fairly dangerous. and that last section was almost impossible to walk up.
+threefiddyone In that sense Im great at finding traction. Its always over there and never under my bike.
+RKF427 perfectly put, that sums me up to a tee!
This is a random tip but its handy to take weightlifting straps with you, if you get your bike stuck in bad mud or water you can wrap the straps around the bike like you would a weightlifting bar and it will save your back when pulling it out.
+Slurm its highly addictive good point, we usually make sure we've got a tow rope that can double up for things like that
I love this channel
+Alberto Harres Rocha thanks alerberto :D
lol
+Alberto Harres Rocha doh.... ALberto, not alerberto!
CROSS TRAINING, ENDUROCROSS & ENDURO TECHNIQUES
hahahha no worries, I laughed about it
What do you recommend for being stuck on loose rocks uphill? I tend to just spin the tire. I know you are supposed to use a higher gear and lug the bike for traction but not sure what the best body position is
yea seen those video's mate , say ya be flying now 💪, maybe ya could do a video or 2 on your big bikes showing us guys less fortunate not to able to get birch schooling how's it's done
+darren fitzpatrick will start some training vids over on the adventure channel at some point, darren....
Can someone tell me what bike is the white one at 2:20? Is that a DRZ400E? Thank you, I love your videos!
yes :)
You speak slowly, and that's cool ! 😊👍
The tug strap images on the Freeride. How is the rear tug strap installed? I have looked for a solution but haven't stumbled upon a working one. I have lost quite a few bolts over time by experimenting with different attachment points. Front is easy and I use a cheap strap with a quick release so it doubles as a towing rope from time to time.
+helavatar i actually don't know helavatar. i found that image by googling enduro tug strap' or something like that so if you could find the forum post he might have explained it there.
what do you reckon about leaf hills? normally when it comes to rocks and stuff ill stay in the low revs but when it comes to a steep leaf hill I normally just gas it haha
+Dbikekid Throttle control for sure. I do the same thing, its fun to spin the tire and hear the bike rev high but if its a super difficult hill I try to keep the rpms about mid range so that your getting power to the ground but the wheel isnt spinning excessively.
+Dbikekid there are definitely a lot of faster hill climbs where you actually want a certain amount of wheelspin for the best traction. and the same applies in various situations like mud, sand, gravel etc. but watch the top riders and you'll see they never have too much wheelspin in those situations, they always dial in just the right amount.
What if you are stuck and your feet cant rich the rocks or soil ..
Somewhat related, but what width back tire do you usually run? My KTM says a 110 stock but that seems a bit thin to me.
+Sruikyl i think 120s usually, sruikyl
Please, where do you find those tug straps at the end
Direct: thetugger.com, or on Amazon sold by Highline Recreation, www.rockymountainatvmc.com/p/839/22967/Highline-Recreation-Tugger-Lift-Strap-Rear and a few other sites, just search "The Tugger"
GREAT ONE! i keep waiting for some midnight oil or men at work back ground music,but it never happens......... wolfmother too would be cool.
+markmtbrider that would be sweet, but then the vids gets blocked in some countries and in the rest they put ads on the vids due to copyright content. :(
The man ,keeping us down....
When are you guys coming g to South Africa? We have some of the best riding terrain nearby a city called Durban in KZN!
when someone can pay my way over, conor. :) i'm only just at a point where the level of support keeps food on the table and fuel in the bike... any travel i do is always sponsored by someone because i'm broke lol.
Okay cool, Il speak to some people. First step to get you over here is to make sure there is a bike here for you!
sounds good conor... one of the guys who i think sponsors wade was chatting with me about it a year ago but it just faded into nothing.
Maybe a dumb question. (beginner enduro rider here) When im stuck on a hill and I need to let the bike roll back I always have issues with not letting it roll back too much. Is it something that you use the front break with? Or is it pure fluttering of the clutch to keep the bike steady?
we've got a vid on hill climb recovery that might be useful emily. we often stall the the bike so you can use the clutch as a handbrake, along with the front brake. :)
I prefer the unwitting newbie rider in the group to help push my bike over the slippery tree roots while I apply a generous handful of throttle.
If you ever wanted to bring out a line of clothing, I reckon the image at 3:49 would work wonders on the back of a t-shirt. Where can I buy one from?
+Rustic Thumper lol that would be pretty cool hey?
Is there a minimum power requirements for the bike for all this crosstraining? I.e. is it possible to do all tricks on smth like an XR250?
+Andrey Diel I ride an '86 XR250R and have no trouble really, the key isn't always power and speed but balance and technique. The XR is reliable and bullet proof so I'd say you'd be okay on one.
+Andrey Diel i'd agree with armasadvish, andrey. as you tackle bigger obstacles there will be times more power works well, but usually you can do a controlled drop of the clutch with small engines to get that burst of power needed. a lot of coaches and top riders say it's always better to start with an underpowered bike than one that's too powerful if you want to learn good technique. ;)
I’d need a winch on my Beta trials bike. I’m ‘ well over the hill’ but the bike isn’t !
I know the feeling, John!
do you guys like taller bars / risers?
+I hatesusernames our coach chris birch is against them, but i'm so tall i do run them. will do a vid on this topic toon
I purposely get stuck in mud holes to practice getting out.
hahah in our group of riders, if they don't have a tugger strap, we don't help them!! Needless to say, the majority have a tugger strap now!
+JoeJoe Moto that will learn them, joe lol
Please tell me who sells those awesome budget tug straps in this video? Orange rope. See here ua-cam.com/video/G1lcuCjvavw/v-deo.htmlm41s
drop of the clutch means releasing or squeezing the clutch?? thanks!
Releasing... as explained in our clutch training vids.
And slipping the clutch, does it mean the same thing ? Sorry for the dumb question 😁
top traction tip just enploy a refugee to push me up the hills ,
just have them carry you and your bike around the forest while you sip mountain dew from a golden goblet.
dont forget to hire ten more refugees to cut a path with machetes but make sure your armed with an ar15 if they decide to attack you
what's the skid plate on the ktm at 0:55
ua-cam.com/video/34nQdxhKvco/v-deo.html
What would you pay for a kdx200 gonna offer 1500 for one with 801 miles?
+Connor Severance (conrecon16) no idea... but i guess it would depend on year model, the condition and is that 1500 pounds, us dollars, aussie dollars. other guys reading might have a clue.
+CROSS TRAINING, ENDUROCROSS & ENDURO TECHNIQUES U.S. dollar bills it looks brand new
Are you from Tassie?
no but we ride there sometimes
#nicelydone2016
As a fellow XC owner, I shed a tear seeing that poor unguarded linkage being battered!!!!
+johntheguru me too john, but he was doing it deliberately. :) that was ruben chadwick who is a junior trials and endurocross champion so normally his linkage never hits anything. i asked him to do a clumsy log hop so i could show how exposed the linkage can be if you do log hops....
I hoped to learn a magic trick to never get stuck again. Guess it ain't happening with my 200kg transalp on mitas e07's
lol yes i doubt the seat bounce would make much difference with all that weight, martin. but i reckon rocking the bike might still do the trick...
CROSS TRAINING ENDURO SKILLS I do use that trick quite a lot, but i often end up making wheelspin whilst rocking. And often there is so little grip i have to push all i can aswell
0 :41 cut fail lol
+ACreativeName he was trying to do that log recovery technique for the first time. :) he's persistent though, after about 20 tries he started to nail it....
C
Your films are great, but the slowmotion sound is horrible. You can change this in your editing software!
+goodguy2301 i don't mind the sound, but i know guys are divided over this. how would you up the pitch in sony movie studio?
Third
What is your most annoying riding thing? Mine is hitting neutral instead of second gear 😂
Verdi Accidentally hitting my pedals with my sad shin
your bloody knobs from editing, my editing becomes bloody get edited...
1 comment
Another cool video i just aplied the tecnique of rocking and trail with awesome result thanks alot and keep going best regards from mexico