Clive Barker Games: Jericho vs. Undying
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- Опубліковано 2 жов 2024
- This is a video critique of Clive Barker's two major attempts to explore horror in the medium of video games. It talks about what makes each game Clive-Barkery in the first place and how both gaes do as shooters in their own right. Total spoilers for both games.
__TABLE OF CONTENTS__
Undying--
Jericho--
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Regarding your final thoughts about Jericho: One Jericho dev gave a talk at my uni some years ago and said that Clive Barker's involvement in the game was only the story outline, some reports they sent him about the art direction, and one dinner with the studio leads around mid-development. The team felt more like they were doing their own game based on Barker's world instead of a game directed by Clive Barker.
So his assumption that the game failed because of the studios direction is correct. It also excuses the awful writing as it is probably not from Clive Barker himself.
@@JoshDoVids I think with Jericho he may have had a larger hand in the aesthetic than with Undying. Barker says as much with the quote in this video. I feel like the name 'Clive Barker' being attached was enough back in Undying's day to give at least a little more marketing zip to an up-and-coming studio.
So he had shit to do. What's your excuse?
@@INFILTR8UStake a nap
@@INFILTR8USwhat a weird thing to say
"Does anybody in this room know anybody called Magnus? No."
Well, he obviously didn't ask that in a room full of Swedes.
If he’d asked me I would mentioned Doctor Magnus from Gerry Anderson’s supermarianation show Captain Scarlet (episode: Operation Time).
Yea in Sweden Magnus is a very common name.
Or anyone who likes chess either.
Jericho looks like it's running at a buttery smooth 12-18 fps in this video.
It was a very demanding game at its time, but these demands were quite justified in my opinion, it was beautiful in its own very disturbing way.
They were probably going for a silent era cinematic feel with 16 fps.
Mattchester Was it stylistically designed to be that way?
***** Of course, it had absolutely nothing to do with bad optimization, that would be preposterous! Besides, everyone knows that the human eye can't see more than 2 fps.
hheheHEHEheEHHEHE
gO tO tRuThcoNtEstcOm, read THe pReseNT
Oldest book in the trick
Oldest Brick in the Took
@@fuzzydunlop7928 Boldest crook in the brigg
something that would be absolutely bitchin: Clive Barker's Bloodborne
Bloodborne is Lovecraft and Van helsing inspired for the most part.
Damn, I thought I was being original with that kind of comparison. I feel like a fucking schmuck now. lol Should probably delete my comment. Arriving late to the party is one thing but arriving two years late is like... World War caliber.
@@felixdumbravescu2725 It's my contention that Lovecraft - a noted antiquarian and anglophile - was functionally continuing the thread of Gothic Horror, just in the age of quantum physics and air conditioning. He certainly made his own contributions, that were wholly Lovecraft in nature, but they sat on a bedrock of Gothic tropes. Crumbling manses home to corrupt lineages. A fear of the foreign and unknown. Supernatural horrors that defied scientific classification. And the pervasive theme of old evils being allowed to fester for generations.
While the vampires, ghosts, and curses were (mostly) replaced with aliens and elder gods, Lovecraft carried on the _spirit_ of Gothic Horror.
Noah, the title of this video alone made me jump to the ceiling. This is a video that i would never think of, but secretly always wanted, because those are two games very dear to my heart. Thank you very much. You made my day.
I actually enjoyed Jericho. It had some nice uncomfortable moments.
Jericho had some good moments but those QTE's killed the game for me. That game for me was/is a pile of frustration, not horror.
Madness1 I almost gave up with Church's segment where a crusader jumps on her when she is descending in that tunnel.
Samuel Antonio Castillo Meza Yup I gave up on that game for years then got back to it around the time the newer consoles came out.
From a purely gameplay point of view, I wanted to like Jericho but I simply couldn't. It felt as if it were riding the coattails of other "modern" shooters of the time without adding much of its own. For a crude comparison, it's somewhat reminiscent of original Doom 4 teaser, or what a Quake revival at the time would have been.
The first time I played Jericho I was sucked in by the story concepts enough to overlook the vapid gameplay. Whenever I tried to return, though, holy hell was it a grueling mess.
Despite it's flaws, Jericho is one of my favorite games to go back to.
yeah it's not like it's great but it's diuerse enough and technically competent (works in 4k) while having good art style
Mine too. I mean, gameplay might be linear and streamlined, but everything else is just awesome.
I apologise for the wall of text in advance, but I disagree with you about Jericho on several points. I have I enjoyed Jericho very much when it came out, and things that you point out as its flaws I actually liked. For instance the goofy characters that seems at home in some 90-s adult cartoon might seem cheesy and banal, but the fact that their endless bravado and badassness turns out to be absolutely inadequate to what they are facing actually adds an interesting feeling of a familiar story suddenly turning into a twisted nightmare with no end in sight. It is like watching a Scooby-Doo cartoon, and seeing them trying to unmask another ghost only for it to bit Shaggy's head off and send characters to hell, and not just any hell, but one from Hellraiser series.
As for the ending - I had no idea that there ever was a sequel planned for this game, so I did not even think that the ending should be considered "open ended". For me the story was actually quite logical. The team of utter badasses go to save the day, pretty much tricked into a suicidal mission. They arrive and find that everyone is already dead, they are too late, they even fail to save the last survivor, after they promised to do so. When they try to prevent pretty much the beginning of the end of the world, they fail and the main character, despite being so cartoonishly badass dies in the first act. I will not go through the entire story, but things get from bad to worse, and in the end, before the final confrontation, two characters that went with you through the entire game are squashed like flies, with no rhyme or reason, making you realise that the evil you are facing is just that, evil. After the final fight you would expect a happy ending but no. You went back in time, further and further into Pixis, passing through the pieces of the world it swallowed. The last one is so ancient that there is nothing but an endless ocean surrounding you. First layer, where there are no people, not even a trace of civilisation that spawned you. You defeat the evil that threatens the world but there is no way back, no way out, nothing even to return to in the world you got yourself into. In a way I actually felt it being very similar to your description of the first FEAR series. The ending is just as bleak. No matter what you do, the characters are doomed, even if they win the day, because they were screwed from the moment they were sent against the evil they can not even fully comprehend. I would say that is very much a horror, wouldn't you?
The ending indeed has those cosmic horror notes as well as being bittersweet
Jericho is the epitome of a brilliant idea with poor execution. I feel there are several ways they could have approached this project and the first is if they had dropped the horror aspect altogether (while keeping the really grotesque and disturbing imagery) and made it into a straight up FPS with old school 90s design with maze-like level design, health, ammo and weapon pickups as well as a story that's more implied through environmental storytelling rather than cutscenes then it would have been an absolute blast of a game; hell I would argue it would be heralded as the true successor to Doom after id disappointed fans with Doom 3.
The other route they could have took is a very strong coop-focused FPS game similar to Left 4 Dead with a much slower and methodical pace, where players need to work together as monsters are crawling around and can jump out from absolutely anywhere with a very high damage output that can scare the crap out of players on a mechanical level. Once again they could keep the environmental design because the dark, grotesque and nightmarish visions of the real world throughout history is an excellent setting.
The third route I think they should have taken is a surreal, dark and morbid survival horror in the style of Silent Hill, where the player would need to survive with limited resources and have to explore the world from a normal setting which gradually become more disgusting and horrific the further you get into the game with that lovely touch of Lovecraftian and Steven King-ish inspiration with Clive's lovely twist on them in its story, enemy design and world that Undying also had going for it.
And the final is that they should have simply did a sequel to Undying - a faithful one to the original game that expands and refines everything that the original game did and didn't do so well while concluding the story no matter how morbid it may be.
Y'know with classic survival horror being almost non-existent these days, I think it's high time that Clive takes another stab at the video game industry and develop a game in the genre that would best define his vision of art and storytelling. Now if that happens then I reckon it would be pretty great.
Yeah, imagine how cool it could be from the story side. You are a bunch cool-ass special ops who been thru hell and back, and litterally go into hell, facing all this grotesque horror, presumably trapped forever. How they gonna lose their shit, descending into madness and apathy, and showing what people they really are.
The mechanical aspect of swapping between characters could've been a lot better in Jerocho as well. Imagine if you didn't have to swap to a specific character for an action and instead they would do it on their own, but you could swap to them while preforming that action to see what they were doing in real-time. Also, being able to switch between bodies during cut-scenes would've been sweet.
I think I'd enjoy it as an old school shooter, but I still want them cutscenes in there and the occasional scripted sequences. I think Jericho has a lot of spectacle, and I wouldn't wanna lose that.
Idiotic commnt
Noah, would you consider rereleasing these videos in a form of an audio podcast on itunes/soundcloud/etc.? It would be really amazing to listen to you on the go, not to mention, that it's gonna attract some new viewers/listeners, what do you think?
Yeah, the thoughts don't often correspond to the video, and sometimes the video distracts from your complexity IMO. It would make a sweet podcast.
Shit, that's why I thought. As an avid listener podcasts, I can definitely see this as a big draw. Most of the time when I watch them I don't even watch the videos I just listen to what he says.
"Without the irritating vagueness[of Lovecraft]."
But...but I like the vagueness...
*Gibbous moon intensifies*
*Eldritch cyclopeans intensify*
Me too. Silent Hill and Dark Souls do video game vagueness pretty much perfectly.
3 squamous 5 me
***** Fuck yeah, give me all of that non-euclidean geometry, H.P.
Although vagueness can allow for the imagination to take root sometimes I crave a canon answer. It doesn't mean there SHOULD be a definitive answer to certain questions but sometimes I really want one hahah.
"Everything I love is here" is actually much more than just a badass one-liner. It's Delgado's way of accepting the inevitable doom. He realises, there's no way he will ever enjoy normal things again or be at peace, and will slowly go insane in this eternal cycle of violence and carnal pleasures. This is a way for him to reconcile. It's kinda like when my ex dumped me and I was feeling horrible, I got into the whole "feelings are bullshit" vibe and convinced myself, that I actually love being alone, because you can't ever trust people anyway. Althought, I'm still not sure if that's not genuine. Hell, I dunno what's going on.
I'm sad nobody commented on this. I hope you're okay, wherever you are now in life!
What's your just describe is both pretty deep for former and very personal for ladder. I hope you're doing well in these recent years.
@@KeflYeen I'm guessing the reason nobody's commented on this is mostly because of how very personal it became after the very end. I hope he's doing well and moved on in those 3 years.
I understand what you are saying. Hell, i myself am at a point in life where i believe that "hell is other people". I find comfort in the thought that everything passes and this will too. And i hope that you will find comfort and certainty in your life, if you haven't already. I'm mostly wishing for those
Didn't Delgado love one of the other squad members, hence the "Everything I love is here" line? It's been a long time since I played it so I might be mistaken.
Precisely. He and Billie Church are supposed to be a couple, and that's made pretty explicit from the very beginning of the game
I think when Delgado says "everything I ever loved is right here" he's speaking about Billie Church, if not the entire team
Ding ding ding
I will note that Barker is not the only credited writer on Jericho (this writer is credited for Evil Dead: A Fistful of Boomstick before Jericho, and that fits some of the writing's style), and like with any other game of that period-on there was likely a lot of uncredited creativity, especially when you take into account MercurySteam being on record as saying the publisher interfered plenty and basically told them to release the game a year ahead of schedule (resulting in the levels being slapped together and the total lack of anything beyond shoot, move forward, shoot) because they didn't have any faith in it selling.
As a side note, when I originally heard of the concept, I'd assume it'd slowly get more demented as you moved through the layers of the city, but it seems like a mistake how they went to 11 with the very first one.
Nice video, though, I just recently found your channel and have been enjoying the content.
Everytime you start to wonder "when is "Noah Caldwell-Gervais coming out" you have a new one out
I thought this was going to be a gay joke at first.
Me to. LOL
Cliffhanger? I actually think the firstborn dies there. I always thought that: back when I first played the game in 2008 and when I replayed it recently. I think the way it's directed genuinely hints at its death. I honestly never even considered it being a cliffhanger, and I don't assume it to be now either.
the art style and premise of Jericho is quite unique for a video game in my opinion
Shame Clive Barker never collaborated with Bioware... I feel that the concepts of Cabal/Nightbreed would play perfectly with Bioware's frameworks for game design...
can you be any more up your own ass? #iamverysmart
romancing hellspawn or romancing spawhell
in reply to the trollish question - yes - for I have had a fist up there but not yet a foot.
Fun fact!
There IS a "Nightbreed" style tabletop RPG. They lost the rights partway through and so, cunningly, changed the name from Nightbreed to NightBANE, and mixed in They Live.
It's basically They Live meets Animorphs, but instead of transforming into animals, the teenage/college aged heroes transform into fucking terrifying murder-monsters.
It was a really cool concept, but...let down by the fact it was designed and produced by Palladium! If you're not big in the tabletop RPG market, Palladium is a company *infamous* for making games that are poorly balanced, worse formatted, and filled with an nearly infinite array of baffling design decisions.
The old Bioware - that could work, but if they did a Mass Effect with it, it wouldn't be any better than Jericho. Mass Effect, if you take away the dialogues, is essentially a pretty bad corridor shooter with simplistic RPG elements (not any more simplistic than the tactical elements in Jericho).
rewatching this video for the umpteenth time, feels like sinking into a comfy chair. also, when i type in the YT search bar, the moment i type 'N', and 'Noah Caldwell-Gervais' doesnt IMMEDIATELY pop up, i feel betrayed lol. thats how much i love and rewatch your vids Noah. much love
Undying is definitely my favorite horror game. I've actually replayed it in 2016 and despite the fact that I did see more flaws with the story, I've really enjoyed that playthrough and confirmed that the game is as good as I remember it. Which I can't say about all old games that I try to play in 2016.
What I love about Undying is how it combines the sensibilities of gothic and cosmic horror, as well as the sensibilities of some of the best games of the late 90s/early 2000s. Since it's based on the Unreal engine, Unreal's influence on its gameplay, immense level design, and atmosphere is totally evident (it even has Unreal's amplifier items). The rest of Undying's influences I can see from games like Half-Life, Jedi Knight, Wheel of Time, System Shock 2, and a little bit of Blood. The Eternal Autumn section reminds me very much of Turok: Dinosaur Hunter and Seeds of Evil. The time travel parts, and the Scythe that can decapitate the undead, sort of feel like major improvements on some of Daikatana's ideas. Beth and her living plants feel like they foreshadowed how Poison Ivy and her plant critters would be handled in Arkham Asylum. I still think Undying has much to offer in terms of influences for modern games.
I just dont understand the hate ? I loved Jerico and still play it sometimes :D
Looks like i'm the only one who liked Jericho
FINALLY ANOTHER 40 MIN VIDEO FROM NOAH!
OtavioFesoares
Jericho was actually extremely fun to me
Undying is one game I'd love to see an updated remake of. Considering that mechanically it's pretty much BioShock 6 years before BioShock was a thing, there really isn't much to do other than bringing it up to snuff in terms of presentation, and maybe iron out some of the kinks in the map design to make it less linear (and less pointless, in case of the final stretch).
Hi Noah, I randomly discovered your videos with the Homefront one, and until then I thought no one would ever surpass SuperBunnyHop in terms of video game analysis. Well I was wrong. Since last month I binge watched the hell out of your videos and loved every second of it, they are clear, entertaining, informative and very nice to listen to (your kind of "lyric" way of writing is perfect to learn new words for a french guy like me).
Other people also seem to notice that your videos are all about content and not so much esthetics, which is fine to me, I don't know if you would be able to make so much content if you had to add a week of editing. Have you ever considered giving your audio and video content to a video editor fan ? As an editor myself, I'm sure some people would be very interested in helping you with that, and since English is not my mother language, I know sometimes the editing makes me understand an essay better when I lack vocabulary.
Anyway, thank you so much for your videos, I'm always amazed by your writing talents. I can't even begin to imagine how much work is needed for your videos.
Aw yes, waking and baking with a new Noah critique. Good shit.
I shall carry on the tradition
Out of all the remakes and remasters possible in the video game medium, these two games deserve another shot! Mainly for the reasons you illuminated; you remake original games that are FLAWED and fix their core systems!
You have sent me on a massive tangent by telling me that rich people in the 18th century made fake ruins on their land. This has blown my mind.
i absolutely loved the art direction of Jericho. it's one of the rare examples of aesthetics so repulsive, but in an artistic way. the visualisation of carnal pain and suffering here is truly horrifying
I concur that Undying is a hidden gem of a game, I loved it and wish it was available on Steam to play again
It's on GOG for less than $10.
I still have my disk. Play it every other year or so.
I absolutely love your channel. Keep these great videos coming.
Jericho has some great ideas, wish the game attached to it was better.
3:42 - "The oldest book in the trick"
For there are many books in the trick... and it was good.
I love Jericho. Enjoyed it so much when I played it.
noah, i love you dude. as movie with mikey puts it, you are total 'apointment viewing', editing quirks and all. forget the haters, your analogue style is what makes you.. you.
thank god for you, peace
I loved the design of Jericho but the story with very few exceptions and gameplay were so devoid of redeeming qualities.
Barker is one of the biggest inspirations in my own creative processes and if it didn't have his name on it you couldn't have convinced me that he over saw that monstrosity.
Note: You will not find a toilet, nor and outhouse in Undying.. Back then, folks just shit in the yard.....
I too always look at the practical stuff in games, movies and series. Like you need to jump all over to get somewhere, how do the normal peeps do that?
I'm one of those few people, who loves Jericho and doesn't really like Undying. Though I'm a huge fan of horror, I'm not much of a fan of it in games. I find most survival horror games frustrating, rather than scary. And in Undying, like you said, it's easy to get lost. That's a huge problem for me, I hate running around, trying to figure out where to go. Jericho is very linear and not a great shooter, but it never frustated me. It plays pretty straightforward and allows to just kick back and enjoy the story and spectacle.
Jeriho is a cool game...main problem is "simplification" so clearly rooted in console development of that period and its genre...but its not it. Approach to subject wildly modify experience...and right here what i see is a fan of quality horror books who stomps game not exactly because its so bad, but because he didn't get more meaningful Barkers performance. Undying allowed for your imagination to run wild and made you feel more in line with experience from all those great books, but judging by how game makes you feel rather than what it really is and what contain is as subjective as possible...undying by FACT is a terrible shooter and all this black "iseeshit" environment just gives a headache and is not visual appealing...yet it gets thumbs up - couse its not a shooter but more like Vampire The Masquarade: Bloodlines where climate mystery and story is in the core, rather than action and combat fitting more into your alley. This whole review is not about GAMES ...but about Bakers performance, as those two games are totally different genre YOU CANT COMPARE, like comparison of Star Wars RPG , Shooter and Simulator and critique about "Star Wars Experience" as main factor in rating game. Regards.
"But there have been Get Well Soon cards written by Barker with greater depth of narrative and character than Jericho"
DAMN
These games ain't as bad as people make em out to be. I've seen far worse
It's worth noting that Count Magnus Wolfram is still in Undying as a character. He's seen during the opening when Patrick is recounting the story of how he got the Gel'ziabar Stone, he's the guy who's holding it who Patrick shoots at. Essentially the old protagonist being killed by the new one.
However one flaw I noticed with Undying is it feels slightly jarring during the opening to have Patrick say he suspects that there are magical forces that exist, and be completely unsurprised to the presence of magical creatures and to start the game already knowing magic. It feels like a holdover from Magnus and always felt slightly out of place to me.
both games are scary as fuck! i can never play them at night, especially undying >.> jericho was also pretty epic. one of my favorites for sure! awesome final boss music too.
Oh, hey, I'm so glad someone else likes Hellraiser 2 more than 1! Wish the third act was a little bit better but I love the darkly fantastic and deeply horrific qualities of it up to that point. The first was a really good, very tight movie but the second opened the doors on something *greater* I think. And speaking of great, I really, really like the style of critical analysis you adopt - I'm so tired of loud and bombastic reviewers, you put so much insight and effort into this and its really interesting. Really glad a friend pointed me towards your videos!
Tho I disagree with the vagueness of Lovecraft - he usually says "Its utterly loathesomely indescribable! ...Now, let me describe it to you in detail." That idea seems to be more persistent in stylistic references (See Crouch End by Stephen King) than in Lovecraft himself. Real issue? The racism and his inability to write characters or dialogue.
A GREAT choice of games for Halloween :)
Excellent choice of topics, Noah. Undying is an old favourite of mine, and standing up Barker's two games against one another like this is an awesome way to view them both, for their weaknesses and their strengths. You always manage to find an interesting way to look at things - thanks for surprising me yet again. And Happy Halloween!!
thank you for bringing light to the Beautiful Evil of Clive Barker. People are coming to try and ban this kind of art; I hope you and I can stop them. as a Demoness, this kind of perversion is like honey or lifeblood to me. See you soon !
Love your videos. THANK YOU!
God, Jericho was so ugly. It's all brown and grey and has that really shitty post processing that those early to mid 2000's games loved to use.
Man, it's ashame Jericho is apperantly so bad, because it's art design looks awesom (2000s era brown color pallete be damned)!
*Weaveworld* is a great Fantasy-Horror adventure! My fav Barker book (altho I've only read 4 or 5, wa-ay back in the '90s)
I'm surprised you consider the concept for the story of Jericho to be "not too bad". Name me another game, that has any similar concept. Seriously, I'd be happy to know if there is another game like that. There's none that I'm aware of.
what was the song used in the beginning?
I think this might be one of your best videos, based on its shorter length and higher information density. Thanks for the insight on an author I didn't know. Having this background, it does make the games a lot more interesting, even if just through your video, as I don't intend to play them.
"Without the irritating vagueness [of Lovecraft]."
What vagueness? Lovecraft describes everything. In "Mountains of Madness" the protagonist tells you over and over again, that he is no archaeologist, but reconstructs the whole history of the Old Ones just through their reliefs. And at last, it is not the vagueness of unknowing that drives the people mad, but the certainty, that the Mythos is real.
I like your videos verry much.
Sorry for my grammar, I am from Germany.
Mountains of Madness is a great piece, but a lot of the rest of Lovecraft's work leans pretty hard towards 'the monster is so disgusting that just looking at it makes you go insane'. More often, he does not thoroughly describe his monsters.
"Corridors... outdooridors..."
Dude's a poet.
Am I the only person on the internet that enjoyed Jericho? It was great, the only point that it disappointed me was the final boss, seemed like it had an opportunity there to go balls to the wall with the concept, have the firstborn living inside some kind of tessaract made from each timeline it had absorbed while at the core was just a void. Was interesting that you had to use your powers rather than any weapons to combat it, but the ending being a cliffhanger just seemed rushed. The game doesnt hold up today but I really enjoyed it.
No, you are not the only one, i installed it on pc this week, played it years ago on console, was a great game for me back in the days and its still a great game right now😃
A new video, hell yeah!
"They used to be terrible humans, which makes them excellent monsters." I love that.
That image of a crucified man being fused to the cross he’s nailed to should be in a better game
I was a lot younger when I played Jericho and I have to say that I really enjoyed it back then. As an older gamer now I might find it dull if I picked it up again, but back then... damn... I loved the game.
As for the gameplay - shooting mechanics were not bad, guns felt just the way they were supposed to, and on maximum difficulty I found my teammates being very useful indeed. They were not just cannon fodder, and I could rely that if we form a circle, nothing will stab me in the back. The points where you are supposed to use a specific character are actually very well telegraphed - to lift something heavy you need the biggest and strongest guy, to break something blocking the path you need telekinesis, etc. And usually you were told that you need to switch to a specific character when you approached this point. Liearety of levels was not as bad as you describe, not worse than in 99% of other shooters, especially "cinematic" ones. The levels were very tightly made in terms of themes, and you were never stuck at one type of corridor for too long.
And the environments were scary. Not just that, but they were disturbing. The feeling that half of the "nazi" part you were walking on the giant pile of rotten corpses made me slightly sick, so well was it done. I tried not to look at the ground when I was not shooting. Enemies were equally disturbing. I have seen many monsters in games, but these, despite being so seemingly "banal" - I mean have we not seen rotten bloated corpses wrapped in barbed wire? - managed to actually make me feel rather disturbed when I saw them up close.
Apart from that - quick time events were rather rare, apart from one short bit in the "crusader" part, enemies were interesting to shoot and actually pretty dangerous, and switching from one member of the team to another added, if I might put it that way, personality to the weapons you were using. Despite Delgado's pistol and your shotgun doing absolutely the same thing, using one I felt different emotions. Add to that that each character had two special abilities, which they used quite smartly by themselves, and you have a much more unique experience than many games usually offer.
Undying was one of them games that I would often play over and over. It was so immersive. Great graphics back in the day. The locations really captured my imagination and made me want to live there.
Keep up the great work Noah. You're style, the games you cover and your musings are so in sync with who I am. I hope you look at the Condemned games one day.
Yes! Thank you for mentioning The Great and Secret Show. That book and Weaveworld are very under-appreciated, in my opinion :)
Very interesting video, I played Jericho back in the day as a kid actually and really enjoyed it, maybe because it was so simple and straight forward.
I'm replaying Jericho right now and while the gameplay does have some snags here and there, the story and style is just a treat. It has some amazingly unique lore: the firstborn, the Jericho squads throughout the years, the Pyxis, the antagonist being a tantrist, and so much more. It's well worth playing through even on easy difficulty, just for the concepts.
Top notch review man, I totally love Undying and played it back in the day a lot. I do have the other one, but haven't played it yet.
I actually really like the premise and character designs of Jericho.
I wish it was possible for it to get a second chance, like a remake with changes to the game's structure, gameplay, tweaks to the personalities of the squad and the removal of son of the cliches...
I loved Jericho. The game was fun but cliché.
I played Jericho when I was younger and I loved it. I guess it was before I started noticing the tropes that mark it. =/
Loved Undying but avoided Jericho because of all the bad stuff I heard about it. Kind of starting to feel more open to it now.
I don't think I've ever gotten past the first two hours of Jericho. Every year or so I see some screenshots and see that gorgeous Doom but even more hellish and I go and play the first hour or two and get turned off by how sheerly unfun playing it is. I'm glad you did this video and pointed out the interesting stuff so now I don't have to worry about struggling through the displeasurable game. Really wish it was a better game, or just a comic or something.
I like how you talked about a lot of clive barkers stuff he is very underated nowadays but it's still good that some people like you still talk to him
The fact that Jericho isn't a good game really makes me sad. All i wanted it to be is at least somewhat good.
N.K. Jemisin is a patron? The science fiction writer?
I would love to have your take on Cthuhlu mythos (inspired) games like Call of Cthuhlu, Eternal Darkness, etc.
I loved undying back in the day, such a gem! great video
Clive BarkersUndying was a pretty e experience but my God that last level almost ruined it. One of the most boring levels ever constructed
Hi Noah,
I just discovered your channel through this video, and it was a rather enjoyable one. It was good that you mentioned that Barker joined the Undying team later in the project’s life since many believe Undying was Barker’s baby from start to finish.
Your video was published in 2016, so I’m not sure if you’ll read this, but I wanted to bring a few details to your attention. Worst-case scenario, other people watching your video may see this.
While it’s true that Clive Barker helped the team by changing some aspects of the game, such as the main character-Patrick may not be the most memorable video game protagonist, but he is far more relatable than Magnus would have been-others were far more dubious. One notable example is Lizbeth and the howlers: the original idea of the team, which is what the team went with although it isn’t explicitely stated, is that she had somehow seduced the howlers to do her bidding; Barker’s idea was to have Lizbeth give birth to the howlers, and he had even planned a cutscene depicting the event-a very Barker idea. Thankfully, the team insisted to stick to the original idea.
There are also other concepts that sadly did not get developped in the game. One is Eternal Autumn, which you were right to call awful in its current form. From what I remember, the team simply had to wrap up the project and left it in a very barebone state, but it was supposed to be expanded compared to what we got in the end. One interesting tidbit is that Bethany supposedly did not create it but stumbled upon it and took control of it.
As for the finale, it is quite confusing, with the mummy turning to dust, the alien (Lovecraftian?) monster, and very little information. I strongly believe that a work of art (be it a book, movie, or video game) is its own best explanation, and that if you need to resort to extra-diegetic sources then something is wrong with it. That said, knowing the original plan of the team, even if it only partially made it into the final product, does help there. The idea is that, ages ago, a powerful otherworldly entity (the final boss) found its way into our world, lured by a well of eldritch energy. The place of this well of energy was at what would later become the islands of standing stones, and the entity lodged itself under the island and started to slowly consume the energy. People from the neighbouring land became aware of the monster’s presence and decided to trap it there. To do that, they erected the standing stones and completed the ritual by burying their king alive on the island. According to the story, the man was a powerful hero who decided to sacrifice his life in order to trap the monster, but the in-game cutscene shows that he may not have been so willing after all, or maybe had second thoughts. In any case, the ritual worked and the beast was trapped. You have to imagine the monster residing under the island with the standing stones on top: since it looked like a crown, the monster was henceforth called the Undying King. Fast-forward to the events of the game, and Jeremiah cast the ritual on his sibblings and himself that basically tied them to the island and the King. They became immortal and gained powers in undeath, but their destruction at Patrick’s hands basically weakened the ritual that held the monster prisonner. After Patrick killed Jeremiah at the end of the game, the ritual was finally broken and the King was able to expulse the stones and hero’s body (which then turned to dust in front of Patrick) that held him ensared. Finally free, the King attacked Patrick.
There, a bit lengthy but I hope you (and any who read it) found it interesting!
François Grandjean you talk so much I didn’t red it
wow, thats some really good insight. thanks
From this video... it almost sounds like Clive Barker is hugely influenced by Japanese manga/anime writing when he made Jericho. Using one main trait of a character as a focal point is very typical Japanese manga/anime writing and when done well it can create a cast of extremely flamboyant characters. But when done poorly, you get a cast that's more like caricature than anything else.
And Delgato's big moment is also hugely bounded in the Japanese manga/anime trope where you have a very tense and conflicted moment. When the cast's dumbest character steps forward with the solution to save the day because of how their single mindedness make them see through the deception. It reminds me of how Digimon 02's climax Daisuke Motomiya is the only one who didn't got fooled by the illusion, and he's the one who rallied all the people to beat the big bad.
But those kind of characterization is generally better in manga/anime where you have volume of pages or several season of airtime to help flesh out the character, with multiple character moment that both contrast and supplement their character focal point to create depth and individuality out of their character archetype.
Of course, I might just be seeing connections where none exist because I'm a pretty huge Japanese manga nerd.
Why does this guy look like Stephen Kings son?
I knew nothing about these games and this was still very fascinating! Awesome vid!
happy halloween noah and thanks for this treat
19:50= "tribal drums play in the background and you fight half-naked cave-men with spear-guns."
=I can totally imagine that's what Clive Barker's house is like on Saturday nights... :)
I'm serious, that's the deal... LOL
I wish I could look up how many times I've watched this.
Since I cant get anything out of clive barker on it on twitter, what is your belief of what undying 2 would have been, please?
Ahh Scrying AKA The Spooky Button
A game consisting of mostly boss fights that need to be solved more like puzzles than combat encounters would be such a great way to impart a sense of gravitas to the enemies and the environment and a sense of smallness in the player. It would work so well for a horror-fantasy aesthetic. Reminds me of Alien: Isolation in a way. Someone should REALLY get around to making a horror/fantasy game like tha-.... wait a second...
...Imagine an alternate universe where "Clive Barker's, Dark Souls" was a thing. Tbh, I'd like to see what Barker could come up with in that type of format. I feel releasing that kind of game within the package of a FPS shooter at that time was a doomed prospect any way you slice it. Think "Legendary" - if they ditched the FPS trappings that would've really given their minds room to wander. The best they could hope for was "Republic Commando" - which is a damn fine game - but I can't imagine that with a Clive Barker twist working out without some serious whiplash.
I actually enjoyed JEricho's campy style. The actual bad part was super imbalanced gameplay - some parts were just outright sadistically unfair. But I dig the artstyle and grotesque in full. The roman part of the game is still one of my favourite gaming experiences.
Quick FYI, in Huis Clos (the Satre Play) the characters know they're in hell from the first line and did NOT know each other in life. They're just sort of chosen based on thier personal beliefs and habits as the worst people to be together with.
I am one to admit as you said, i couldn't progress to the next chapter as i could not find it. Farthest i got was the green valley in daylight leading up to a lighthouse i believe. I ran in circles there for quite some time before accepting awkward and disappointing defeat. The opening few hours of the game will always stay with me, especially having experienced it as a 12 year old
It would be really interesting to see Clive Barker attempt another game, now that AAA games don't have to be as linear as they tended to be in the mid 00's. Something like Prey but with a Barkerian pocket universe instead of Talos 1 would be pretty damn sweet.
Noah, you are one charming dude. I'm glad I found your channel.
These videos are my happy place.
i think im the only lifeform on this planet who likes Jerichos gameplay. That character switching on the fly. And that awesom minigun dude and katana bitch. ofc the ai sucked u got to rescue them all the time but i could finish it even on hardest diff.
undying is one of the greatest games ever. jericho isn't that great at first but halfway through it also really got me, it's mostly the artistic vision and the ideas that many overlook that can bring one a real sense of horror, even the gameplay gets better when you've found your play style. sure, there are many things to improve but tbh there aren't really any other games like jericho.