Dishonored, and the Morality of Uncheckable Power
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- Опубліковано 15 лип 2023
- My name is Thane Bishop, and I need to talk about Dishonored.
I've loved this game since the first time I played it. As I've gotten older, and spent more time thinking about the media I consume, I've learned that that's only made me love this game more. Lots of games have morality, or Karma systems, but I don't know if I feel that any game has used the mechanic to the same level of effectiveness for me as Dishonored.
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High chaos certainly has the same feel as "You did it because you could. And because you could, you had to."
Ooh I like that
The temptation of power being too much to avoid, like those that argue power doesn't corrupt merely reveals what has always been there
- Sans Undertale
My x lover best friend and baby momma Jennifer Christine lamprecht, Isabelle Christina whomever she is I miss her terribly . I must also apologize to Natasha Pawliuk for breaking my other best friends heart ❤️ , are triangle has left me feeling dread as if both parties are currently in horrible condition and or being abused.
Jennifer Christine lamprecht will always be my baby momma and a true love, Natasha Pawliuk will always be my first real love.
Every day I feel like a spectre splitting into eternity from the book Four Zoas by William Blake, horrible agony as we split into eternity.
My x Jennifer Christine lamprecht, was friends with a coyote from mexico and has a best friend James , she's rumored to be with a killer called Kyle.
I worried her worst nightmare of dying alone could become a reality I said I'd never let that happen even if she hates my guts , it's my word.
@@edwardnashton553there are always a combination of choices and circumstances at play, it’s useful to remember that.
I do find some truth in the concept that the corruption that comes with power is often a result of it revealing or somehow unlocking an inner nature that was already there, but there’s different kinds of ways that happens with people as well, and their individual choices and intentions often play a big part in characterizing those differences.
All that aside, I think the simplest way to think of it this: that, as social creatures, the farther humankind ventures from being beasts, the closer we get to becoming monsters.
The reality is that our choice to frame it in terms of power having an intrinsic quality in that it corrupts those who have or wield it is an oversight that distracts us from the underlying fact that power just is. It is a tool like any other humans have invented. It is we who are intrinsically, inherently corruptible. It is not impossible to possess power and wield it responsibly, but it may be true that, by our very nature, it is inevitable that not everyone will be able or willing to make the best choices with how they use their power.
As thinking beings, we are capable of a broad range of behaviors in response to our environment. The more complex we get, the more varied and complex the behavior patterns that lead to success and survival will be, particularly in social contexts. Different thought processes and subsequent behaviors will inevitably crop up and combine in different ways over and over through time, and so long as there are incentives to choose to opt for short-sighted or self-serving behaviors for self-gratifying or short-term rewards, there will be times when the temptation works and leads to these undesirable outcomes. Most of us, if not all, are more or less equally capable of using both kinds of behavioral modality when it suits us, and often do use both, in varying degrees, in every day life. It’s not a bad thing or a flaw either, it’s just what it means to be human, and part of that is walking the line between serving oneself and the others around them, both of which are important to our well-being. Recognition of this fact is important so we don’t lose sight of where we are drawing this line between ourselves and the rest of world and so we are better able to actually determine where we set our expectations and perceptions of others.
Do keep in mind that low chaos is actually much harder than high chaos, you can only kill less than 20% of all available NPCs so if you actually end up FIGHTING people you basically get stuck in high chaos
As I put it to a friend,
Dishonored rewards mercy, but being merciful and being good are not the same thing.
That is a really interesting phrase. Being good and being merciful are not the same. Really like it, both in context and out of it.
That comment prompts you to explore a question of virtue ethics, which is to say, should we be more concerned with the rightness of our actions or of our outcomes? I personally believe there's a complex kind of overlap between the two answers and that it's not simply one of the other, but also that we are humans and if we were to obsess over outcomes exclusively, we would find ourselves in such spiritual misalignment that we wouldn't be able to keep up the charade, however "optimized" for utility it may be.
@TwentySeventhLetter They both matter. Outcomes are far more easily measured. And people tend to judge themselves by their intentions and judge others by the outcomes. Such is human nature.
@ashtonpeterson4618 I'd say the opposite is actually true. People tend to judge others by their intentions, and themselves by the outcome. This could simply be because someone is being more critical of others or simply because they measure intention more highly, but I've noticed that when you are in closer proximity to someone for a longer time, when you see more of them, rather, you judge their intentions more than their outcome. Probably because you have more stake in them.
If doing something right is measured by its outcome, then what is essentially evil can be called right. Which is a hoax on a philosophical level. No matter how much mental gymnastics you do, you can't end up calling that which is evil, good, or that which is good, evil. Unless your perspective is skewed. If by telling the truth, someone innocent dies, does that mean that telling the truth is evil? Which begs a broader question, do I have to have full knowledge of all the consequences before I do something? Which begs an even broader question, is righteousness attainable on a human level, seeing as we are imperfect beings with finite understanding?
Hide-and-seek community needs more representation in media
Honestly the worst part is that regionals was supposed to happen the next day. They had to cancel the whole event.
Fax
"Alright Corvo, now close your eyes and count to six months"
Dux
I haven't been able to find them??
Even if the first guard WAS mean to Corvo, he was almost definitely under the assumption that Corvo wasn't set up, like most people.
And last i checked, "big meanie" isn't grounds for changing someone's tense from present to past.
Think again: in the game you can choose to be merciful, but corvo is against the whole country, good people for good reasons and bad people for bad people, and he can't let people live, cause he's still human at the end
@@ralfdsouza-ko7dyMan you an angry mofo. I sympathize. But that's not what it's about. He's against the corruption and the conspiracy, but most people don't know anything about that. One thing about it is this. The random guard on the street probably knows less about it than any given noble at the party.
I think my favorite part of this game is the tone that The Outsider takes with you depending on whether you choose High or Low Chaos. He's neither good nor evil, sure. But he also *knows* that he gave you unrestricted power. He expects you to use that power selfishly, and hold it over the common man just like all the others have done.
Daud, Delilah, Granny Rags, the Executioner. They all have Marks, and they've all chosen to exert their power over others in one way or another. So he sounds...more or less bored when you do the same in High Chaos. In True Chaos he sounds mocking, like he gave you all that power and you still failed. It's only in Low Chaos that he sounds...satisfied. By showing mercy and leaving the world in a better state, you truly surprised and fascinated him by being totally unlike all the others. And as a result he seems content with what you showed him.
Nice take
Even to an audience or even as a player, Low Chaos is very entertaining to watch. And the Outside is starving for entertainment.
So... How is the outsider or any other version of spooky powerful entity who gives power to humans(almost exclusively to the ones most likely to have morally complex and personally scarring misadventures) not evil? Like, bring it down to a more human level, let's say some creepo observes a poor person for years and when that person is at their absolute lowest point the creep approaches them, hands them a gun, a lockpick, and a list of people's schedules in a 50 mile radius, just 100% enticing and empowering someone to commit crimes and maybe even kill people, that's evil!
@@devin5201 He isn't evil because he gives powers to people he finds "interesting". Meaning he could give those powers to anyone, good, evil, or somewhere in between. As long as they manage to catch his attention. For example, while he might not have given Pierro powers, he does find him interesting enough to visit him in his dreams and provide inspiration for his inventions.
He also doesn't force the marked to do anything. Unlike, for example, an evil Patron from D&D, he doesn't require any price in exchange. He only gives them the power, and then sits back to see what happens. What they do with it is completely on them. It's not the Outsider's fault that the previous people he's granted a Mark to have used the power for selfish gain.
@@Gabriel-oq8gsuhuh, and as stated these kinds of characters always give the powers to the people most likely to have a messed up quest, and the powers are never like the ability to heal people or magically make someone more empathic, it's almost always a very martially focused power, almost as if what they find "interesting" is inviting chaos and suffering into the world, hell by comparison the patrons that force the vessel to murder give the person the ability to say "I had no choice, if I don't do it the monster will punish me."
“Listen buddy, the rats need food and I make sure they have it. I’m doing a service.”
-Corvo Probably
My x lover best friend and baby momma Jennifer Christine lamprecht, Isabelle Christina whomever she is I miss her terribly . I must also apologize to Natasha Pawliuk for breaking my other best friends heart ❤️ , are triangle has left me feeling dread as if both parties are currently in horrible condition and or being abused.
Jennifer Christine lamprecht will always be my baby momma and a true love, Natasha Pawliuk will always be my first real love.
Every day I feel like a spectre splitting into eternity from the book Four Zoas by William Blake, horrible agony as we split into eternity.
My x Jennifer Christine lamprecht, was friends with a coyote from mexico and has a best friend James , she's rumored to be with a killer called Kyle.
I worried her worst nightmare of dying alone could become a reality I said I'd never let that happen even if she hates my guts , it's my word.
@@JoshuaMiller-rw3sjI ain't reading allat
@@JoshuaMiller-rw3sj i wonder if dishonored players around the world will band together to help the broken hearted Joshua Miller
Not sure :/ they at have tried to get rid of alot of us. Surprisingly unable to forgive myself for my thoughts of the last 3 years , I'm not sure if anyone will bring assistance.
Praying for the best.
I am noone just a reminder of a time in the past which led to the present, which led to the past.
My disabled friend Becca , severe schizophrenic , made the ohh you were hacked , didn't think much of it , till the last of my fall from grace .
I do blame trauma like some , although trauma played a huge roll , something Ethier on or my father's or mothers also friends who are not friends like Tyler Blaney wether jealousy , envi or just down right indifference I aloud to change who I was, this although not instantly was my fall from grace. I'm in great fear currently there are bigger snakes then myself long since extinct that may return that lack empathy understanding and above all else forgiveness.
I may be blamed forever for my fall , never to be forgiven or even if I was by others ,I myself will find it hard to forgive myself.
Dancing with the shadow of myself and others leads to a dark besmear a constant juggling of a contradiction within the self.
Recently this shadow has left , a storm drifting onward , peace reigns within myself a form of zen lulls over my mind like a blanket.
Lack of subjective knowledge of events paired with high trauma lead to memory blockages and damaged recollection, to a lack of evidence regarding blame on the matter ,lacking objective truths.
Verdict no one's to blame.
I still will find it a mammoth task to forgive myself.
We must learn to use discernment in all matters .
“Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgement.” is the quote that always comes to mind when a game lets me decide between killing and sparing. Dishonored gives you so many tools to effectively kill everyone in your way, then tells you you're a bad guy for using them and it's hard to really figure what I think about that. On one hand, you're missing out on all the fun by not killing, but on the other, it makes doing "good" a real mechanical concession and that adds so much you don't see in any other games with a morality system. You actually have to go out of your way to end on low chaos and not just slit every throat in the game and have rats feast on the corpse for your amusement, it's fantastic. But it's not as fun as high chaos, and games are supposed to be fun. All this without even going into the actual morality of the chaos system, which is also extremely interesting to analyse, considering how much bad you can do just to avoid slitting throats. The DIshonored series is super interesting to dive into.
games need to make being good hard and being evil easy. being evil should feel GOOD and doing good should kinda suck
In my opinion, the game doesn't do enough to pressure the player into being evil. It's far too easy to get through most levels with non-lethal takedowns and the basic Blink ability. I feel like the game really needed to do more to make the player desperate, and make them believe that a certain amount of evil was "necessary".
I wouldn't say games are meant to be fun. They are meant to be entertaining, rewarding and/or engaging. "Fun" is just an easy way to achieve these things.
@@tbotalpha8133 I don't think that pressure needs to really exist, honestly. It simply gives you the tools to accomplish both low and high chaos, and leaves the rest up to you.
@@negative6442 I quite agree. If the game pushed players more towards either good or evil, the players would be able to blame the devs for pushing one style or the other. Now if you are playing the high-chaos side, you have nobody to blame but yourself.
Power doesn’t corrupt, but you can trust the corrupt to want it more than most.
Power reveals, it always has.
"Power corrupts and absolute power, absolutely corrupts."
@@Get_It_Back_In_Blood I’m gonna be honest, I never agreed with that particular statement. I don’t think power corrupts, it just reveals what’s behind the mask.
@@Get_It_Back_In_Blood Incorrect. Power simply amplifies what has always been here all along.
@@Get_It_Back_In_Blood"if you want to test a person's character, give him absolute power." Abraham Lincoln.
I think another thing that is worth mentioning is that the introduction to the rats in the sewers also has very important dialogue. "Rookies like you never saw the guy. He could fight 3 on 1 in the yard. The guy is a whirlwind."
Even before being granted superhuman powers, Corvo was absolutely the best fighter in Dunwall, and probably even the entire empire. He was ALWAYS going to be unstoppable.
Of which fits perfectly into a plot to frame Corvo for the Empress' murder.
"I don't want to fight this guy."
"Naw, mate, I don't want to either."
"Okay.... let's use the justice system? See if he really is a good enough guy to stay in prison long enough for us to get the heck out of Dunwall."
"Hey! Corvo is getting executed tomorrow! We can stay at home and have brandy and cigars!"
"Got a baaaad feeling about this..."
@@karkosgiehexThey didn't originally mean to frame Corvo.
in the hound pits pub after the flooded district, theres two dudes talking outside about you. basically "i heard the guy is a monster, tearing through the city" "i heard they locked him in the cages for the hounds and only let him out at night with a blade the name of his target" the whole deal is "that man is fucking terrifying" and its a whole ass conversation lol i always listen to it whenever i get to that point
This game taught me that when no one can stop me... my preference is for nonlethal take downs. Even when I got to Nightcity, it was the same story. No one will ever know I was there, and no one can do anything to stop my actions, but they all get to wake up the next morning with the ringing headache of being swiftly knocked unconscious and a story to share with their friends.
Same with both, in dishonored I tried my best to be stealthily and fail many times, and in nightcity I preferred knockouts to kills and would only kill when I was forced.
Me too. Only when I have infinite reloads though haha.
I also play exclusively none lethal in MGS V including tanks ...until the game forces you to kill certain enemies like bosses and helis you can't capture them
I went out of my way to non-lethal most of 2077 as well. Unfortunately, despite using non lethal weapons pretty much exclusively, quite a few people ended up dead anyway because of various janky nonsense. Like if you do enough nonlethal to put someone down and then hit them with another nonlethal while they're falling, apparently that's killing now. Now that I'm looking at starting another play through, I'm hoping that's less of a thing. Or at least that they'll fall down faster.
I do the same in Metro on human levels. When no one can see me, when no one can _stop_ me... I only pass through, leaving everyone I can alive so that they may wake up hours later, only to find themselves with a splitting headache and without ammo.
Edit: It also saves you ammo to use on purely mutant levels.
"You watched and listened when other men would have shouted in rage. You held back instead of striking. "
My favorite quote of the game, made me realize the virtue of insight back in the day when I was a lot younger. And turned me wiser for it.
Well, i like to think it did.
Whenever I play dishonored, I can't help but go Clean Hand and Ghost at the same time. It just feels fitting that the man who was slandered, who's name was shouted and damned across an empire, would take down those same corrupt people without a word, or even a glimpse at who or what could do it. Plus I like the achievements.
Keep up the good work! Loving your vids from what I've seen.
I think there is a niche, very specific power fantasy that Dishonored delivers. The notion of, "we both know I could have, but I didn't even need to."
@@ThaneBishopI saw a post talking about the worst thing you can do to Daud is to take the key out from under him and leave. Not touching a hair on his head, but letting the best assassin in the world know that you held his life in your hands, and he wasn’t even aware of your presence.
Hard agree - I always do that too. I did one play through like a hurricane of knives, bullets and rats; I didn’t really enjoy it and felt kind of bad about it afterwards.
I've gone full villain angel of vengeance and moral high ground protagonist on all three games and DLC. I love it too and there's not enough games of this kind and quality around.
It is a superb observation on how power could corrupt and absolute power is dangerous on anyone's hands no matter the motivation.
I also think he'd do it for Emily's sake. Imagine how she'd grow up and into her role, knowing what Corvo did, AND knowing that power is essentially at her beck and call.
I didn't finish the video before commenting. Glad it was touched on at the end.
"Character, real character, is what you are in the dark, where no one would ever know or see."
Fun fact about Havelock at the end. On my second playthrough I tried something quite silly, knowing where the key is, I snuck behind him and grabbed the key, blinked to the door and let Emily out. The game ends right there with Havelock just standing right there somehow not hearing anything, completely unaware that I just saved Emily before he even knew I arrived on the island.
curiously you dont have to eliminate him. canonically corvo kills him
@@kawaiibats2822
Yeah, but what's he going to do either way?
Corvo can deal with him later, right then he needs to attend to his daughter.
@@Firesgone if blink can canonically work while holding someone he could just teleport away with emily if havelock tried anything
@@PhoebeTheFairy56 I didn't need that point, but that belongs in the pile. Yes.
Anybody else notice that Timothy Brisby, cladvin a rat mask, is a blatant reference to the Secret of NIMH?
Ahh, me childhood, 'tis well t' see ya again.
What I love about Dishonored's story is how it shows what having absolute power can do to a person.
High Overseer Campbell is supposed to be the head of the state church, but he is, of course, a massive hypocrite as he takes full advantage of his station and breaks most of the tenets of the Order.
The Pendleton twins are just spoiled rich brats who were always awful people, especially towards their younger brother, Treavor. Despite them being terrible people, the twins were the ones who inherited most of the family's wealth and are the ones calling the shots.
Hiram Burrows believed that he knew what was best for Dunwall and the Empire and believed that if everyone just did as he said, the world would be better. He first saw the poor as a blight on the City, so he used his connections as Spy Master to smuggle rats from Pandyssia and started the plague. When that failed, he decided to have Empress Jasmine assassinated so he could take over as Lord Regent, and all he did was make things worse.
The Loyalists become just as guilty as Hiram and his cronies. They realized that in their efforts to overthrow Hiram's illegitimate regime, they had replaced him, and were poised to take over the Empire for themselves. They could've been better than those they had Corvo take care of, but instead fell victim to their greed and lust for power. And just like Campbell, Morgan and Custis Pendleton, and Hiram Burrows, Martin, Treavor, and Haevlok pay the price for their corruption.
You can chose to have Corvo become corrupted by power the same as everyone else, or you can chose to restrain yourself, and do what's only necessary to achieve the greater good of the city and the Empire.
WAit what, Hiram caused the plague? I don't remember that info anywhere.
@SwordWieldingDuck When you infiltrate Dunwall Tower, there's a safe in his bedroom. Inside is a card that, once played on the broadcast tower, plays his confession to the whole thing. He had the rats brought in from Pandyssia with the intention that the disease they carried would wipe out the poor and homeless. As intelligent as Hiram makes himself out to be, he never considered that the plague would run out of control.
@@SwordWieldingDuck You didn't know? Then how did you eliminate him? Lethally? The nonlethal option reveals his hand over the plague in order to kill the poor.
As a wise man once said, "With great power there must also come great responsibility."
10:32 "She starves so that her children can have bread" - As my focus goes to the blinking purse just perfectly ready for the taking xD
I felt so bad with some of the loot you can take. Robbing Bunting is one thing, but taking elixir from the needy is just cruel
What i like, how Emily see you, the drawing of his father or the mask.
Finally someone who gets it. Whenever I hear people whine about "being punished for having fun" I get a little frustrated about how bad you can miss the narrative
Fully agree
There's games for mindless fun. Not every game has to be like that, just like not every movie is *BOOBXPLOSIONS!*
@@Ramsey276one My turn to fully agree with this ;)
The game is fun, it is a STEALTH GAME, of course you'll be punished for being seen
Well the problem with this whole narrative setup is that the tools for both outcomes are horribly unbalanced. They give you 20 lethal for every non lethal tool. It's fine to make it easier to take the lethal route but it's kind of annoying that they make it both harder and more monotonous to get the good ending. Spending tons of development budget making tools they don't want you to use is an annoying development choice. You're punished for having fun, not because the killing is too fun, but because nit killing is too boring. I think people would have a lot less qualms with the morality system if the non lethal tools were more fleshed out.
@@jonathanhay3212it’s like you didn’t even watch the video. you are literally the exact person the original comment was talking about. you’re completely missing the narrative
the entire point is that YOU, THE PLAYER want to go the lethal route because YOU think it’s more fun. YOU find yourself in corvo’s shoes wanting to take the easy way out and kill whoever gets in YOUR way because YOU think putting in the time & effort to do the right thing isn’t worth the trouble
if the player had the same options between lethal & nonlethal then there would be no choice to be made. which would go against the narrative touching on the nature of right & wrong and playing the role of an unstoppable supernatural force who can’t be held accountable for choosing wrong
and you’re not punished for going high chaos the game literally adapts to give you more enemies to kill so you can have more fun. which, again, loops back into the storytelling
And then there's the morality of sparing and how it doesn't equal forgiveness. You can "spare" Lady Boyle by giving her away to a pervert.
On a site note, I can't really rememeber if it's in the notes around the party's level, but she's basically a blackwidow and the future the entity saw was a result of her killing that guy to never go back to dunwall.
Take it with a grain of salt tho.
Yeah that's probably the most morally bad decision I've ever made for a "good" ending. Pretty sure even the Devs realised that it was a horrible idea so they semi-retconned it by having Boyle live out her life happily on the perv's estate after killing him and taking all his money
Still better than fate of Pendleton's
The best part of the game are most of the neutralize options. They’re so much crueler, they’ll wish you had just killed em.
This video really spoke to me on a personal level, because back when I started playing dishonored on my 360 was when I was actually beginning to explore "higher" concepts like empathy and consequence as a child. My first few dozen runs of the game were complete bloodbaths, where I ran through collecting as many runes and money as I could scrounge to buy more elixirs, bullets and powers so I can kill more guards and beat more levels. I developed this rhythm where I discovered optimal paths and ways to minimise the resources I needed to use so I could have the most fun and find the most creative ways to blow up a small squad of guards. It never really occurred to me that the reason things were so dark or there were so many dead people were because of what I was making Corvo do as the player, I was having fun and didn't really have the empathy to understand or care. Only when I came back to the game years later seeking out some lost nostalgia of better days did I start noticing all the little things little me didn't, and it was only then did I start to appreciate low chaos and stealth runs, even got my first no kill ghost run. I'm happy to see I'm not the only one who noticed these things.
had a very similar experience, played it on my 360 when i was a kid, killed everything and everyone that stood in my way, never it occurred to me that my decisions would influence the ending, then i searched on youtube what other people thought about the ending just to see some reactions, then i saw a different ending to mine which confused me, after i found out there were multiple endings i then saw how much difference there was between low and high chaos, how many more people lived and how things seemed less dark, having Samuel in the end be nice was shocking because i thought it was obvious the game wanted me to finish the story, so i was confused where he critcised me and shot to alert the others
overall once i finished the game like 3 times i really got a much more deeper of understanding, specifically in real life, how my actions can be different to what is normally expected, how my actions can influence for the best or worst, before that i was much more superficial boy, didn't think there was much to life other than being told what to do and complete the tasks given to me, but i gained a deeper and more comprehensive and thoughtful understanding of myself, my actions and my environment.
my issue with all stealth games is that im a perfectionist and so no one can spot me ever or I will restart the mission.
My x lover best friend and baby momma Jennifer Christine lamprecht, Isabelle Christina whomever she is I miss her terribly . I must also apologize to Natasha Pawliuk for breaking my other best friends heart ❤️ , are triangle has left me feeling dread as if both parties are currently in horrible condition and or being abused.
Jennifer Christine lamprecht will always be my baby momma and a true love, Natasha Pawliuk will always be my first real love.
Every day I feel like a spectre splitting into eternity from the book Four Zoas by William Blake, horrible agony as we split into eternity.
My x Jennifer Christine lamprecht, was friends with a coyote from mexico and has a best friend James , she's rumored to be with a killer called Kyle.
I worried her worst nightmare of dying alone could become a reality I said I'd never let that happen even if she hates my guts , it's my word.
Try committing and improvising. When you feel the urge to reload a previous save, instead stop and play out your current situation. It'll mix up how you play, certainly.
@@jimijenkins2548 real
Thanks, algorithm. Here from the stealth archer video. You do good work, sir!
same here
oh the accuracy lol
Lol same :D
Same.
What video?
I just wanted to say this has completely changed my life, and the entire way I play video games. I used to play an assassin stealth playthrough where I kill everyone, and now I have a hard time killing anyone a d go with the ghost playstyle.
It's a great way of looking at Spider-Man's motto of "With great power comes great responsibility."
man, these videos are sO SLEPT ON. ima be PISSED if this channel doesn't take off. you're seriously really good at this, it's clear you have a knack for writing, narrating, and analysis. let's hope you get the recognition that imo you more than deserve.
Haha thanks man! The channel has been doing really well this year, and I really appreciate the support! I'm really looking forward to keeping this thing going.
@@ThaneBishop good to hear it! will be looking out for future vids, made sure to turn notifications on (: wishing you luck
I remember when Dishonored 2 came out and I was so excited to do a Ghost+Clean Hands run. To be someone with all this power and to not been seen or even mentioned of gave me a huge sense of freedom, it really makes me appreciate the game as a whole.
The sad thing there’s always that one guy who’s been powerless so long he can’t even *role play* the idea of unregulated power
This was amazing. I've never played Dishonored but I loved your passion behind this. Keep it up.
I really appreciate you taking the gamble on a 30 minute video for a game you haven't played, and I'm even more thrilled that you enjoyed it. Thank you so much!
The pre-Deathloop games by Arkane are gems, if you ever get a chance I think you should try them! (And everyone else honestly!)
My x lover best friend and baby momma Jennifer Christine lamprecht, Isabelle Christina whomever she is I miss her terribly . I must also apologize to Natasha Pawliuk for breaking my other best friends heart ❤️ , are triangle has left me feeling dread as if both parties are currently in horrible condition and or being abused.
Jennifer Christine lamprecht will always be my baby momma and a true love, Natasha Pawliuk will always be my first real love.
Every day I feel like a spectre splitting into eternity from the book Four Zoas by William Blake, horrible agony as we split into eternity.
My x Jennifer Christine lamprecht, was friends with a coyote from mexico and has a best friend James , she's rumored to be with a killer called Kyle.
I worried her worst nightmare of dying alone could become a reality I said I'd never let that happen even if she hates my guts , it's my word.
Here from "The Stealth Archer Was Inevitable" video and heading into "What It Means To Be Human In Halo" because I adore how you present things and The Algorithm decided I should see them. A little rough, but the passion behind them is evident and that's enough to make me want to share my story.
I don't remember much of my first playthrough in Dishonored when I was younger. Mostly as an incredibly difficult stealth game where nothing ever seemed to get any easier until I got Time Stop and in the end, everything went to hell in a handbasket. Those I trusted, those who saved me from execution, who I did all the dirty work for, were more than eager to discard me like a broken tool after I had served my purpose.
In my absence, they turned on one another like the plague rats they were, too power hungry to wait even for my 'corpse' to cool before trying to cement their tyrannical rule. I was more than happy, despite Samuel's harsh words, to take each and every pound of flesh I felt they owed me. Martin died where he stood, calling out a challenge to the breached fortress wall. Pentleton was a spineless wretch to the end. But confronting Havlock? That was intoxicating. Watching him cower at the end of the walkway, understandably so when faced with the occult-infused monster I had become, seeing him use a child as a shield and laughing because I could simply make Time Itself bend it's great knee before plucking the pathetic life remaining from his body, then save the child he vainly thought would protect him from my wrath.. but due to an interaction bug, Emily, the one thing I was doing all this for, fell to her death. I had done everything asked of me, grown so powerful, for what? Nothing.
I remember walking away, more than a little disgusted with the game because it was a downward spiral with no modicum of happy ending, not even an 'evil' ending with me claiming the bloody throne I had fought so hard for.
"Who are you when you can't be stopped?"
Years later, when I was a more thoughtful, more careful teenager who had very little in the way of entertainment, I thought.. Sure, why not boot that game up? I pay more attention to my surroundings, I'm faster with the controls, I'll struggle far less. Hell, why not try to do an achievement run while I'm at it? I've got nothing but time and this is the only game I'll have for a good while, might as well learn to love it. "Clean Hands - Kill Nobody" and "A Man of (Mostly) Flesh And Steel - Never buy powers (except Blink) and don't upgrade them either" stood out to me. Surely, that would be so impossibly hard at the same time. Throw it on Very Hard too, just to force me to avoid the easy route of combat that little more.
But very quickly I learned this was actually far more doable than I first imagined. Actually, it was rather more fun since I had to be aware enough to save ANYONE from dying, not just keep my personal blade out of someone's neck. Be careful putting people down, since the wrong angle against a staircase could result in death because I simply tossed them without regard for their safety. Keep them off the streets, behind doors, even in dumpsters just so the rats couldn't find a hapless meal served on a cobblestone platter.
I had to learn other ways around certain segments through clever parkour or really learn patrol routes to slip past in all the little foxholes I could find. I could do this or that because someone asked me to, but some of those just felt.. wrong. Like dirtying my hands in a different way and all it got me was another useless piece of painted whale bone, or another few coins to spend on nothing I would need. I had Blink, Sleep Darts and strong arms to manually make anyone I needed 'out of the way' take a well-deserved break.
I cared about what I was doing this time. How "right" to give a woman to her stalker, simply so I didn't stop her heart from beating. Sentencing noble brothers to a short life of, admittedly, poetic justice in the prison of their own making. If having the High Overseer thrown into plagued streets as a Heretic whom absolutely nobody could help without consequences wouldn't result in his death all the same. About how my 'comrades' back at the pub viewed me this time, not as an unstoppable weapon with power beyond reckoning, but a man who was simply very, VERY, good at what he did. Who could make you disappear without killing a single soul or unsheathing his blade.
I was prepared for Samuel to berate me again, something which hardened me the first time around ("Now get off my boat.") as he felt like the only one who truly stood by you through everything you did, partly because I had completely missed he gunshot alert everyone in the last level on High Chaos.
Yet this time.. He was apologetic for the betrayal. Respectful enough to call me 'Sir' still. Praised me, even, for not becoming corrupt like the others. Wished me luck and truly, genuinely hoped I could save Emily to help the Empire get back on track to a brighter future. Maybe even that our paths would cross again. ("Good Luck, my friend.") Having very vivid memories of his admittedly rightful demonization of my first Corvo, I was touched. It really opened my eyes to how different things would be if you didn't see killing as a simple box to be checked and marveled at just how much was different this time around.
The feeling of accomplishment I got when I saw "Clean Hands" and "A Man Of (Mostly) Flesh And Steel", successful after hours and hours of work, was some of the most satisfying I've ever gotten to this day. Not even because of the rarity or difficulty, but because I felt... better. Like this was truly the 'Right' and 'Correct' option, as if I had learned whatever lesson the game was trying to teach.
Even now, if I have the barest inkling that Lethal versus Non-Lethal might make a difference to the story, you can bet I'll take Non-Lethal nearly every time. Cyberpunk 2077 and Prey(2017) were where this truly came to shine, but those are stories for another comment.
Dishonored wasn't a perfect game by any means, but it was good enough to change me.
For that, it'll always hold a special place in my heart.
I really enjoyed the line about the game valuing life as much as you, the player, does, and will match you. That's a pretty succinct and insightful comment on Dishonored
I recently replayed Dishonored and I was surprised at how well it held up, and your video was an excellent way to wrap up my Dishonored replay. Cheers mate!
Smooth movement and a unique art style really give the game a bit of a timeless feel, I think. I'm glad you enjoyed!
@@ThaneBishop The way the graphical style evokes the idea of a painting, rather than attempting to mimic a photograph of the real world the way most games do, mean that it will never feel dated any more than an oil painting would, I do believe.
Combined with the deep branching narrative you've explored so well in this video, I feel that it will always hold up.
The book bit reminds me of something from the witcher series, a vision of the future of a random character when he meets ciri, hes nobody, but he hopes to travel the seas. And the vision is of him discovering anew continent, naming a cove, finding islands. Living his dream, but ultimately dying overseas at the cove named after him from illness, far from his future wife and son.
That passage stuck with me and I believe it always will
I know I'm a few months late but I see you hearting new comments so here goes. Excellent video mate, perfectly reflects my own feelings on the game. It's one of the best games ever made in my opinion, and I replay it regularly and got all the achievements.
I've seen a lot of people criticize the chaos system, saying that the game gives you all these fun powers but using them gives you the bad ending, and that this is bad design. I find this to be a very shallow understanding that entirely misses the point. That point being that yes, power is fun, and killing is easy, but showing restraint and care is the more difficult but ultimately the right option. You said that the game's world will mirror your own respect for life and that's a perfect way to put it.
A few minor things I want to add that I feel are worth mentioning: one, in the Lady Boyle mission, you can as you said search for clues for which one is your target, and then either take her out or give her to her stalker. But there is another option that is much easier, as you don't need to hunt for clues: You can simply take out all 3 ladies. Rampaging through the party is not difficult, but it's even possible to wait for all 3 to be close to each other and kill them simultaneously with a time stop. Do with that information as you will.
The second thing is Daud's DLC story. In my opinion, it ties the whole package together like a ribbon. Here we have a man who already cut a path of destruction and regrets his life, wants to do one good thing before his past catches up to him, and by your choices he can either redeem himself, or go out in a blaze of glory. Your chaos determines if Billie betrays you and if Corvo kills or spares you at the end. And if he kills you, the last thing you see as you're falling is the statue of the Empress.
At the risk of sounding pretentious, when people talk about the Chaos system "ruining the fun", I can't help but feel like those people just didn't connect with the idea that Dishonored is not a normal game; it's essentially a sort of litmus test. And it's okay to not enjoy that kind of game, but to say that the main function and identity of the game ruins the game is a bit past the point. It's a bit akin to saying that having to fight all the big monsters in Monster Hunter ruins Monster Hunter.
Dishonored is my favorite game of all specifically for reasons like this! The diversity in play and story between runs, even in little background details means the world to me! My first run was as the wind took me, killing where I felt it was needed or deserved, but calm when I could, and I think I barely sneaked out the good ending. My second run was for the "mostly flesh and steel" achievement, and I cut down all obstacles in my path like a trained killer, powers or no. Finally my last run before I moved to other games was a clean hands/ghost run, where I even made a point to put those who I knocked unconscious into soft positions like beds or chairs. It was fascinating to really get into corvo's head in that run, since those aren't just goons, they're his wife and daughter's subjects, they're his co-workers as guards of the regency, and they're the men who killed his wife, who still deserve mercy.... Great video all around and I think I'm going to go play through the series again now!
Dishonored is one of the only games I ever replayed at the hardest difficulty, one of the only games I came back to for the challenge of a perfect run. Mostly Flesh and Steel, where you use and buy no powers beyond blink (Because unlike Dishonored 2 you can't choose to deny the Outsider's gift and blink is actually necessary); Shadow, where you're never seen; Clean Hands, where you complete the game not just never taking a life but also preventing a number of other murders from taking place, because even deaths that aren't your fault still accumulate chaos; And of course, Ghost and Poetic Justice, a combination of the other two. It took me weeks of playing, and thousands of save scums (Seriously getting out of the flooded district without being seen is SUCH A NIGHTMARE).But I did it, and it's still one of my proudest achievements in gaming.
This game is beautiful in its writing and execution
Blink isn't necessary. As a self-imposed challenge I encourage you to a blinkless run.
@@tyranmcgrath6871 it's necessary in one or two unavoidable void areas, but other than that I did avoid it when possible
I think that the moment I understood dishonored or at least the dishonored series was one of my favourite of all time was when I took an entire hour finding out by pure logic what the jindosh lock solution was instead of doing the entire level, I knew that I could do the level both killing everyone or knocking them out, or being spotted or sneaky, but the fact that I didn’t need to do any part of the level but use my brain in one room instead of the rest of the map made me enjoy the game all the more
To this day, Clean Hands Dishonored 1 playthrough was some of the best fun I've had in the stealth genre.
Is "clean hands" no killing or no killing and no detections?
@@ashtonpeterson4618clean hands no killing. Ghost no detections.
@@ashtonpeterson4618I played through the whole game only to miss that if you put a sleeping guard in the dumpster next to the door in prison, the bomb kills them.
@@rileyflack8010 That sucks!
Do both if you're good.
Do both with no powers if you're god.
You know Yu-gi-ohs shadow realm
It's kinda funny how a fate worse than death is bizarrely seen as more ethical or more wholesome for kids
Generally because death is permanent, but there's a chance that they'll be able to get out of that situation.
I think I read somewhere that canonically Boyle ends up killing her captor and seizing his wealth.
Hi hi, I was sent this by a really good friend and it got both of us thinking hard. Mostly about how we would act if *we* were given such immense power that nobody can truly stop us.
(for the record I have not played Dishonored 1, I couldn't have afforded it, and I only played through the first 60 minutes of Dishonored 2)
At about the 10-15 minute mark (well I said it first at the 3 minute mark but re-affirmed it at the 10-15) I said that I would be horribly violent and I would shatter the world that dared to harm me so cruelly. That I would see it all burn and that I am just NOT a good person at all. I went through the entire video wondering if I would have done anything differently than a High Chaos Corvo and... the answer was "No, No I would not."
But then you got to the ending of the game and reminded me that Corvo was doing this not only for Revenge, but for Emily too. And.. that reframes things drastically. I re-evaluated the entire game through the lens of "I need to Save Emily, these are the choices I have to make in the meantime... Can I look her in the eyes after having done *all* of that cruelty and wanton destruction, and tell her to not do what I did? To be *better* than me?"
The answer to that was an emphatic "No, No I cannot do all that, I need to lead by example if I am to expect her to be better than me."
Who am I when there is *nobody* who can stop me? I *think* I have my answer. It depends on if I am alone, or trying to do good for others. If I am alone, there is a very very strong chance I will burn everything down around me in a fit of blind rage and desire to lash out. If I am not alone, if I have loved ones who I care about, and they care about me in return, then I will work and strive to use my powers for the betterment of everybody that I am able to.
Of course I am not able to find out for certain since I am nothing but baseline human with above average strength. Thanks for the video it really got me to think hard on my own personal morals. =^w^=
Dishonored is easily in my top 3 favorite gaming series of all time. The stealth gameplay is incredible, the story is intriguing, and the morality system is damn near perfect in my eyes. I can't help but go out of my way to always do a Ghost/Clean Hands run, not just for the extra challenge of it, but because for me personally, it just feels the best to me. I have endless tools and powers to tear the city apart, I'm unquestionably the apex predator even on an ontological level thanks to the Outsider. But I use the heart to hear people's stories. I stay out of sight to not cause unnecessary fear to those who don't deserve it. I go out of my way to aid those in need, even when it is out of my way.
At the same time, I don't extend grace to those that ruined me and my family. I can forgive the guard that's doing their duty with the facts they have at the time, or the terrified citizen that only knows what is fed to them, but I will destroy those who framed me, used me and thought they could get away with it with no consequences.
It's endlessly satisfying to complete the low chaos ending with no kills, because it proves that I am the better man in every possible criteria to those that wronged me.
I absolutely loved this game. My first run was Low Chaos, which I attribute to having played Thief "4" beforehand. Which was super fun.
Of course, I immediately did a High Chaos run afterwards, and this game fucking nails the "supernatural assassin" thing. It's insane how fun it is to demolish everything in your path. Samuel had more of an impact on me that playthrough. Losing his respect genuinely felt bad.
This was an amazing watch, brilliant video. I've played dishonoured and its sequel many times and seen many videos covering it but none have done something quite like this.
Thank you.
Alright, so, I’ve only watched this video from you so far, but, firstly, what I have seen is excellent. This is great content, and the fact that it only has close to 30,000 views disappoints me greatly. Still, much better that it has 30,000 than 300, but regardless, I really hope for its, along with this channels, success and growth, as it is greatly deserved.
Having said that, I thought I’d go ahead and dump out my thoughts on this subject. Not particularly because I feel they’re notable, but because this brought me back to thinking about things quite a bit.
A small side note, I think people underestimate just how wide reaching the Chaos system is in Dishonored 1. In Dishonored 2, it is essentially just a kill meter. But in 1, stuff like how many times you’ve been seen affects it. You can reach high chaos by being constantly caught by guards. Is it effectively impossible to do so? Absolutely. But it’s a lot more than just a kill under 20% and you’re a good guy.
Let’s start with my playthroughs of this game. This game was easily my favorite game for a few years, and I’ve done hundreds. And yet, in the vast majority, I play as what I believe to be a generally moral ghost. More specifically, I tend to avoid all guards I can, with a few exceptions. Those who harass people I generally find innocent (Griff, Elsa, Lady with the art dealers key. Elsa in particular I believe to be innocent, since we never actually see proof, and I’m generally distrusting of religious orders accusing people of being witches.) get knocked out.
The only people I really kill are my targets. I almost always swap the wine, I simply stab the Pendleton’s, I sedate and then kill Lady Boyle, and I kill the Lord Regent, followed by releasing his audio log. I generally avoid Daud, as I consider the DLC canon, and when I play as him, I try to atone. And finally, the loyalists are all killed.
In truth, I generally choose to do so for the simple fact that I don’t believe in fates worse than death. Between the options we’re given, I think it’s best to just end my targets while they’re living the high life, rather than let them fall.
In particular, I don’t think Lady Boyle even deserves the pain of a conscious death. Sure, she’s a noblewoman who is ignoring the plight of the people around her so she can enjoy herself, but, quite frankly, I think it’s hypocritical to act as if were any better.
Our world has plenty of people suffering, and yet the vast vast majority of people who play video games aren’t out there helping. Plenty of us have the methods to, we have the ability to help. And yet we don’t, and why is that? Because we like where we live, we like the life we live, we don’t want to give up our luxuries for the sake of people we don’t know, and likely never will know.
And so sure, she ties to those who fucked us over, but quite frankly, I don’t think it’s enough of one, nor do I think her actions are so totally unreasonable that she deserves either a violent death or life in horrific conditions.
But that’s the thing about dishonored. It poses a question on the surface level, but oddly enough, I think it actually misses its mark with me. More specifically, I don’t think I’m the right kind of person to be asked the question, since it isn’t really one for me.
There’s a reason why despite my dozens of playthroughs of New Vegas, I have joined Caesar’s Legion 3 times, and each only for achievements.
Simply enough, in a world where being an asshole takes just as much, if not more effort than being good, why not just be good? More than that, even if it takes more effort, good should always be strived for.
Maybe I’m just basic. Hell, my favorite god damn superhero is Superman, for the express point of his absolute sense of righteousness, his unwillingness to do bad (Don’t even get me started on Injustice, it’s as bad of a misread of his character as the whole ‘Batman doesn’t kill because if he did he wouldn’t stop.’ Which, tangent, but that’s not fucking it, he doesn’t kill because he has belief in the absolute sanctity of human life. That’s it. It’s not that he’s holding himself back, or anything like that. Sure, he might have doubts, but if he ever went through with it, I don’t believe for a single moment that the real Batman would just fucking go crazy.), that all is what makes Superman so enjoyable in my opinion. That he’s the Paragon of good. He will always do what’s right, even with godlike power.
So, when Dishonored poses a question in the vein of ‘Does Absolute Power Corrupt Absolutely’, I have to say that it doesn’t. Those who let power corrupt them aren’t actually being corrupted. They’re being held back by their worry of punishment, nothing else. They aren’t, at least in my opinion, actually moral, but rather, simply feigning it for any number of reasons.
But, I think that’s one of the great things about Dishonored. That on the surface level, it seems to point towards the idea that power corrupts. It’s the major theme of all of its antagonists.
And yet, you can prove that saying wrong. You can be the change you want in the world, the person with power who doesn’t let the world get worse. Who doesn’t just see everyone else doing bad things, and so thinks it’s okay.
Dishonored lets you have all that power, and then rewards you for the good you do, if not mechanically, then emotionally.
Civilization was built on empathy, on helping your fellow man, built on us working together, and so pretty clearly, it fucking works. We’re a planet spanning civilization that, if not completely uniform, still have some amount of connection. The good you do makes an impact, just as much as the bad.
And I think the greatest take away I’ve had from my time with Dishonored, is that it’s worth the effort to be good.
*Power doesn't corrupt, it shows everyone who you really are.*
Just discovered your channel through my recommendations, absolutely brilliant videos! Am looking forward to the next already!
how have I not heard of this channel before? This Video is sooo good, you have definetely earned a subscriber here.
I love your videos so much, YT recommended your first cyberpunk video to me because it blew up but I've spent all day watching through your channel and the love and thought you put into each video is incredible. Can't wait to see more of what you do!
I first found you from your first video a year ago back when you only had around 300 subscribers and then kind of forgot until now, it's really nice to see how much this channel has grown
I feel like Dishonored's ethical messages and themes probably would have come through a lot better for me if there were no nonlethal options. As it stands, what is the difference between stabbing someone and choking him out? What is the difference between shooting someone with a crossbow bolt and a sleep dart? Not much, besides the nonlethal options have less fun animations, and that small sacrifice on your part is supposed to mean you give a shit.
Suppose instead that you only have lethal options, but are still encouraged to let your foes live. Now the player is in a situation where if they don't want to be a murderer, they have to avoid the enemy entirely, as violence will always lead to an undesirable outcome, no matter who wins. The player has to actively make the game harder in order to keep their hands clean, and even then may find themselves in a situation where they have to kill an innocent person in self defense.
Dishonored is a fantastic game, don't get me wrong, but as far as the gameplay goes, the only functional difference between being a murderer and not is what crossbow ammo you click on, and I think that's kind of a missed opportunity.
Great video btw. You have a lot of potential as a video essayist!
Honestly, I think you make some great points. I think Dishonored has my personal favorite use of a morality system in games, but it also came out, what, 11 years ago? And it shows. I love how much the system made me think about the rest of the game, but I also can't not think about how much further the system could be pushed if made today.
Thank you so much for the support!
I would respectfully disagree wrt the idea of making nonlethal options require effort since it would contradict the thesis. Both lethal and nonlethal require similar amounts of effort, the difference is in the kind of person you are (or at least have chosen to be this playthrough) when you make the decision.
The idea is that you have unchecked and uncheckable power. If you decide to be a bad guy, no good guys can stop you. If you decide to be a good guy, no bad guys can stop you. The world and circumstances don't factor into it. The world will in fact change to align with the choices you make.
Not saying I wouldn't mod the game to make a good ending take more effort. I love games where "you work hard for a happy ending and are rewarded". It's just that for the sake of the thesis of "who are you when nobody can stop you" having both options require similar effort fit perfectly.
Edit: tldr - if being good requires no effort than why wouldn't you? To bring in a meme. Returning or leaving a shopping cart requires no effort and incurs no consequence one way or the other so what do you do?
@@ScriptedviolinceThe situation presented in Dishonored is much more complex than returning a shopping cart back to its original spot. Yet, the morality system in the game fails to capture this complexity.
The way I see it is that the game imposes on you how you should behave in a situation where you have been defamed to be considered "good".
Being a good guy equals not killing a lot of people on your way to achieve your goals, the game says.
But it directly contradicts the idea that you are given the power to decide what is the right thing to do in this particular circumstances as Corvo.
The game already knows what's okay to do and what's not.
Sure, you can leave a trail of bodies behind you but the game will punish you for that and complain about it every step of the way.
So, you get to decide if robbing and killing others to further your goals of ending tyranny and saving your daughter is morally okay...
but c'mon dude, we all know it's not okay ;>
In a way, you get to be the judge and make the decisions only for the game to become the judge later on. And this judge follows only one rule:
kill = bad
not kill = good
It's simplistic. Too simplistic for my taste
That makes no sense...... destroying innocent people IS bad though. And the fact that the more people you destroy, means more chaos in the streets and prevalence of the rat plagues MAKES logical and narrative sense.
They give you the choice to be lethal or not. And each action has consequences. Which is accurate to real life. We all have the ability to do so, but it doesn't mean we should.
You complain because lethal has consequences. And yet in the real world it is no different.
Whatever you idea of simplistic is, is subjective, because it is complex enough in my opinion.
It just sounds like you are upset that actions have consequences and would like to do whatever you want and not be punished for it, as somehow complex. That isn't how the real world works... The real world is filled with constraints, and unintended consequences, which I thought the game captured, at least thematically and narratively.
You are expecting the game to be something it is not, instead of enjoying it for what it is.
Had to reword this because the AI auto removed my original message.
@@Teisho_ "So, you get to decide if robbing and killing others to further your goals of ending tyranny and saving your daughter is morally okay..."
You don't. That's the point of the game.
The idea isn't that all killing is always wrong - you can beat the game by killing only your main targets and still get the good ending.
The core point of chaos system isn't to entertain some idea of le gray morality - it's to teach you that actions have consequences, that slaughtering countless people will inevitably lead to more suffering and decay. Slaughtering civilians because they stand in your way or due to your recklessness is morally wrong, even if your main goal is to overthrow tyranny and save your daughter.
It is simplistic, because there is no real "complex" way to spin it - a man with a godlike powers should always take the path of restraint, because otherwise, people will die. And the less restraint he is showing, the more people will die. Some ridiculous moral relativism will only weaken the message and turn the game from a powerful story about power and responsibility into a post-modern edgefest.
You are very, very quickly becoming one of my favourite video essayists on UA-cam. Exceptional work. Your topic selection is so, so interesting
I loved this view into the game man. Thank you for making this!
Wow, what a lovely piece of work. It's been a some while since I played the first game, but I've never heard someone so deftly articulate what made this game so special to myself and so many others.
Wow. Just incredible work. Dishonored was my first ever “favorite” game when I was too young to even understand media at the surface level, let alone so deeply. Thank you for giving me inspiration in the quality with which I should approach my analyses and for the joy, of getting to live through Dunwall again through your work.
I never played dishonored but this video really made me interested in it. Your videos are always nice to see pop up in the recommended feed.
That was a beautiful, beautiful essay! DH1 is one of my favorite and comfort games, I always come back to it, every other year or even once a year. Thank you for making this video
Yo I absolutely love ur videos man.. it helps rhar u tend to talk about games I love, like this one and cyberpunk.. but every video of urs I watch I learn something or see something from a diff perspective .. just excellent work man.. can’t wait to watch ur phantom Liberty videos after this one
I really hope more of your videos really pop off, this was an amazing love letter to Dishonored
I fucking love your videos man these are some favorite essays I’ve heard about gaming in a while man
Amazing video bro, keep it up!
The Dishonoured series is truly my favourite game series of all time. This video does one of my favourite games and a very interesting topic justice, thank you for your work.
22:30 I was NOT expecting such a sudden change in tone, had me chortling fr 😂
Bloody great analysis. Ever since playing this game 14 years ago I've found it hard to put into words what you have in this video. Well done.
Thank you for this video Thane.
This is such a great video. Lots of thought provoking ideas.
This video definitely deserves more views❤ this was brilliant
Fantastic video. Thoughtful
I really love how "no one can stop you" makes you rethink how you view the game
A truly amazing, engaging and thought provoking video. This has given me some interesting things to consider and think about as well as a new way to look at these games. It's almost like a true social experiment that was subtle and revealing at the same time. Thank you!
oh man i love this game, you have done well in writing and narrating this video on it
This was very, very well done. I really enjoy your take on this concept. Who you are when no is looking and who you are when no one can stop you are just amazing concepts to play out in games or tabletop.
I have always loved the dishonored games because of these concepts and because of how intimately you can shape the game.
An interesting insight I had when going for the Mostly Flesh and Steal achievement (not buying any upgrades to your Outsider powers, only using the default, single rank of Blink), is that it's actually a LOT easier to play the game than you think. Because here's the thing....most of the map layouts, are simply filled with loot to fuel your upgrades. But if you aren't actually using whale bone, or bone charms, there really isn't much in the way of motivation to go explore the maps. Usually the only reason you go off the beaten path, is because you picked up your lover's heart, pointed it around, and saw "....ooh! There are 2 whale bones that way, AND a bone charm!!" so you go off to encounter whatever challenge is over there. And run the risk of having to actually cause harm to the denizens of Dunwal. But....if you don't embrace the temptation of the Outsider, to "be interesting", to go and try and find resources to make you more powerful, you really have no need to even bother. You can actually navigate the maps towards your actual TARGET, incredibly easy, with just the single rank of Blink. And since you aren't actively engaging with 80% of the map, or it's denizens....you can easily get a low chaos, no death, no detection result for each map. Because why bother? You're here to take out your target....nothing else. The rest of the neighborhood never even needs to know you were near, because you weren't.
So the temptation to become stronger, in itself, the drive to obtain the resources the game tempts you with, is another layer of moral/ethical checks on the player. Will you go mess with these people just to accumulate wealth and power? Do you really need it? I'm sure you WANT it...the temptation is there but....is it needed? And the answer is....no, it really isn't.
The first playthrough of Dishonored, I got both the Ghost and Clean Hands achievement. When I did my second playthrough to get Mostly Flesh and Steel, I thought it was going to be a frustrating slog of save scumming, and endless frustration to complete. But no joke, it was the EASIEST run I had of the whole game. Missions were super short, super direct, super focused. The only way it was difficult, is if I strayed from my objective, to try and gain wealth and power.
"Who are you when no one can stop you?"
Not a simple question by any means. But, to answer in brief: a flawed individual trying to be a good person. A monster seeking to do what's right. And, I hope, able to save the world from itself.
All I want is the means to make the misery stop. For all of us.
I've never played Dishonored, and I've barely even heard of it. The title of this video intrigued me, and I was not disappointed.
I had a different experience with dishonored 1.
It gave me the power to right wrongs and choose to try to do the right thing. I could shatter the glasses instead of swapping them because I knew I would still be able to swoop in and deal with the consequences if things went wrong. I didn't need to be pragmatic or take the easier path for fear of failing. Nobody could stop me from forcibly trying to make things go better.
Amazing video, i didn't even knew you made cyberpunk videos(wich i also love) but was recommended this, and it didn't disappoint!
I found this interesting, and made me feel a bit better about myself. My first blind playthrough I did my best to Ghost missions without killing... except the primary targets. In my mind, no only was my *job* to kill them, but I could find little to no redeeming qualities for them and the targets continued existence was a threat to everything the late Empress stood for. I rarely if ever found the kind of proof to make a judgement like that for the rank-and-file, and besides, the others in the loyalists were the Judge and Jury, I was just the Executioner, even if I was still exercising my best judgement against the targets.
Subbed. Thanks for expressing one of my favorite parts of the game
a video about Dishonored? in this time and age? and a good one too! It's so cool this game gets more appreciated. I liked your approach in telling the story. pls, keep up the good work!
This was great. Subbed.
I love stealth games, and I enjoy the idea of sneaking into a place, past everyone and taking out the target before vanishing again. However, my first "stealth" game was Metal Gear Solid for the PS2. And that taught me to high chaos stealth mission, slowing whittling the enemies down as I get deeper into the level. Dishonoured grabbed my attention when I realised the impact of the chaos system and got me back to loving being the shadow that never gets seen.
Great video. Made me pickup dishonored for a quick low chaos run
Man, thank you for putting in words the sensations i got when i first played the game
dude this is such a good video! keep it up homie. I just subscribed too
This is such a thought provoking and fascinating video. I was shocked you don’t have more subs. One sub from me. Keep up the great work!
2 totally ruins the morality of the first game by making everyone - every single person so unabashedly, revoltingly evil if analyzed with the heart that by not killing them, you're letting hundreds of actual serial killers walk free for the cleanliness of your own hands.
And repeatedly the cutscenes and boat-talks with megan make the entire conflict out to be the result of corvo and emily's unwillingness to keep monsters like the duke in check.
But literally ALL of this could have been avoided if there wasn't a system making people more evil the more kills you have. That guy down the street shouldn't retroactively become a serial killer of 10 years because you stopped an overseer from shooting someone yesterday. I actually checked, you only need TWO kills in the prologue to have the entirety of the first karnaca level stained with 90% murderous sociopaths.
So choose. Ramses or the guy attacking the newspaper writer.
I choose the latter, because it's not like knocking him out solves anything. He could come back the next day. Which is a complexity the game is not equipped to handle.
Did you know overseers canonically have a holiday where they abduct as many kids as they can catch from their native city, march them outside, recruit some and sacrifice the others?
As a person who average people can't endanger, every single time you let the overseers live, you are solely responsible countless children being torn from their parents' arms and killed.
Yeah that my problem with dishonored it got clearly right answer and it punishes you for not taking them. It also makes like 70% of your kit completely worthless like get what your going for but narrative is taking away from gameplay here.
Very good video, I enjoyed it immensely
Loved every minute of this
this was beautifully done indeed. I dont know why you only have 24k subscribers
These are my favorite videos on the internet currently, 10/10 no notes
warms my heart people are still talking about this game 12 years later. I revisited the game from steam recently and it was so interesting to have a more adult mind to wrap around the ideas presented in this game. Much more impactful than my tween mind's love of the combat system alone.
might be the best Essay ive ever seen on Dishonored. Incredibly underrated!
I happen to love Dishonored (like 600+ hrs worth :3 ). This was a wonderful love-letter to the game. Subbed!
You’re a wonderful writer, thanks for sharing with everyone even though you don’t have to :)
I have tried playing dishonored 2, but couldn't really get into it. I really enjoyed your video and it honestly inspired me to try playing the first part. Maybe after that i can get into part 2 as well. Unfortunately for me this happens a lot, where i get a game, wich i should like, play it for a few hours, cant really get into it and have to play it months later where i absolutely love it and finish it asap.
Damn.. This video is fantastic.
And now I want to replay Dishonored again.
As someome who has played Dishonored for years. This is by and far the most amazing and intropsective perspective I have ever seen someone put on the Chaos and morality system of these games. It makes them while hard to work with for gameplay, fantastically introspective for what happens to people who get unlimited power and treated wrong by societu
I personal philosophy when it comes to power is this:
If you have the power to help people, and it would cost you almost nothing to do, then therefore you should be obligated to help.
As for absolute power, for good or bad anyone with it would eventually become authoritarian, enforcing their will on everyone.
Hella good video. I'm glad I'm not the only person out there who understands that the chaos system isn't meant to create a living breathing world where your actions have direct and realistic consequences, but instead to implicate the player themselves on a meta level. No it doesn't make diegetic sense for those overseers to be more brutal with their sick brother or for the final level to be grimdark af based on whether or not you killed one more person, but it makes total sense for the *themes* of the game. BECAUSE THEMES ARE A THING THAT IS IMPORTANT AND CAN BE EXPLORED WITHOUT THE NEED FOR CONSTANT REALISM AND COHERENCE, HATERS NEED TO WATCH A FRICKIN' NOLAN MOVIE I SWEAR-
I absolutely loved this video! Based on it, have a sub! I look forward to binging your other videos later!
This was a brilliant video
absolutely the best video essay on Dishonored on this website. would love to hear your thoughts on any of the Thief games as well! Though there's a lot of material to go through, and the games probably aren't that fun to people nowadays, lots of stealth and so little action, but the lore is interesting