3 years, it took them 3 years just to get this into a presentable state. In that same amount of time, Rockstar originally released Vice City AND San Andreas Just think about that.
That's what happens when you outsource games to people who don't give a crap if it's good and don't speak english or live in north america. They don't understand why the game was made as it was due to lacking cultural context, they don't notice typos since they don't speak english, they know they won't be punished for mistakes or the game being awful, etc. A small team of fans (20-50) with development knowledge could have made a better remaster than these in less time. EDIT: Since people think they are geniuses for saying Grove Street Games are from Florida, they outsourced most of the development to India. Look at the game's credits. EDIT: If you think this comment is racist, imagine Americans remastering a game that was in Hindi about people living in India without speaking that language or having ever lived there. It would be a disaster. Doesn't matter where you're from or what you look like. Vastly different cultures exist and their differences are a lot more nuanced than it seems to people who haven't experienced those cultures.
technically iii as well, as the time between it and san andreas were the same amount of years (both ending with a 1 and a 4 even!) for this update to come to the definitive edition
As a speedrunner for the original GTA:SA and GTA games, I can tell you there's still a lot missing in the latest update. The movement/controls are still very wrong, stuff like not being able to move while aiming rockets/sniper rifle, having physics freak out in car crashes sometimes, or just car handling in general being very inaccurate. Swimming is still agonisingly slow, and sky diving is still way too fast, both of which all stem from the game running above 30 FPS without all the frame rate dependant physics being fixed. For god sake you still just yeet hay bales into the next town over whenever you drive into them instead of them exploding into lots of pieces like they do in OG. The further into the game you play the more you realise it's still bad. Los Santos is the most polished, but play past San Fierro and the game really starts to fall apart. You still cannot control the camera inside aircraft, it's just locked to the Horizon. "Accelerate" in Helicopters still makes them lean forwards instead of going up (like ya know, accelerating the engine would?) and unless you wanna unbind W from accelerate in every other vehicle you can't fix that through settings/rebinding. Overall the update is good, a big step in the right direction, but for me to consider this the "definitive" edition of the game they'd had to fix a lot more stuff.
@@NightFyreTVhonestly I think it's more the point that it just isn't being worked on anymore and that was actually doing the series justice by being true to the original experience
I dunno man, ports based on it are still being actively developed. There’s no putting the genie back in the bottle, GTA3 and VC are open source now whether it’s entirely legal or not.
This isn't "the good ending". This is the "acceptable ending". The good ending would be if this game were actually worthy of the title "the definitive edition". This is closer, but it's not there yet.
If there’s ever any remaster or remake it cannot be in shy way worse than the original. Unless it’s the same or better in each aspect then it’s a failure
I don't feel bad for Grove Street Games. They've been working nearly exclusively with porting GTA games since like 2011, and not once have they managed to get it even close to right. They should have never been put on a project like this to begin with.
I mean, they were also given completley ridiculous time frames and kept getting the project changed whenever they got anywhere. They absolutely did no get the opportunity to remaster the games to the best of their capacity.
@S0daB there's the whuh happen video going into the development history, if you're interested: ua-cam.com/video/DhtOzwKqeYQ/v-deo.htmlsi=CegbD2T8EGKuh0e7
@@DoritosBurger Rockstar should have done right by these classics in the first place.. This update is a "feeling gulit" update and shouldn't have been a thing at all.. The updates should have been minor fixes or adding something new to the games..
Easily replaced original games for me. Deleted that buggy crap (not playable on modern systems without special tricks and fixes) and not going to install them back again.
All music is there except the radio sounds. I didn't even like the radio on, I used to turn the radio off everytime some song was playing. Except that song which was something like 'I will make you dance'.
Dead Rising Deluxe Remaster has the same problem with terrible AI upscaling, only worse because a lot of the little details with text are completely mangled. It still got good reviews, though, somehow.
@Bob_Smith19 Not only I am like that, there are millions of players who aren't interested in radio that much. Only I am in the comment doesn't mean that only I am like that.
I.... what? It's still miles away from fixed, and still the worst possible way to play these classics imo. Riddled with bugs, graphical issues, awful looking models, terrible parallax interiors, poor flight controls etc etc. Feels like I'm going crazy seeing so many people praise this update so much. Sure it's an improvement on the last patch, but it's still not worth buying by any stretch.
Lets also keep in mind that there are over 40 songs that have been removed across all 3 games due to Licensing issues and the package is priced at 60 bucks Thats like selling a reprint of a Harry Potter book at the same price of the original while having some chapters missing from said reprint
11:07 That's not how it goes, man... They can't just make that call and hide the proper credits like that... It doesn't matter if the initial work they did had issues, if they worked on that, they deserve to have that spotlight. They shouldn't have the right to do that, at all. Credits are not judgement of merit.
Yea I honestly wonder what the "right" answer is. I understand the work of updating etc is theres but the IP is Rockstars, the code etc is Rockstars. A team that was given the responsibilty (as he alluded to we dont really know about the level of time/resources given) put out a very poor quality product that in the end couldve affected sales on Rockstars end. I think of it like in any business. If you put together a project for a company and the conpany gives you the green light and it flops and they have to take over what you did and fix it, then they have the right to remove you from it because you put it together poorly. Maybe thats part of it?
@@Tyler-hs9eualso, like MVG mentions, their name wasn't removed completely, it's still in the credits But what I think happened, from a PR standpoint, is this: Rockstar must've come to the conclusion that having Grove Street Games's logo stamped on the Definitive Edition's loading screen was a bad move, considering how poor of a job they did. And judging from the public's perception of GSG and their work, as scummy as it may be, it was definitely the better call, at least for Rockstar. That being said, the latter's more at fault in general for the work we've had for three years, because they hired a studio who'd already done poor work for them, such as the mobile ports and the GTA SA PS3 and Xbox ports, and they didn't even give them enough time to at least deliver a somewhat finished product
They absolutely can. The actual primary developer of these games is obviously Rockstar. GSG was contracted to do work and they did a bad job. Now Video Game Deluxe has put in a bunch of work to clear up the disaster they paid GSG for. Both companies are listed in the actual credits.
More than 15 billion dollars at their disposal and they can't spend like 500k to port the games that made them who they are in the first place to modern consoles.
They could have added so much more to these classics.. New gaming modes, online multi-player and countless other things.. This is a missed opportunity.. Rockstar has the money to revamp these games and should do it while they got a chance to prove themselves again..
This is exactly the same situation they had for GTA Vice City on iOS back in the day. Stuttering constantly, black screens, missing frams, crashes etc, app was left untouched for 4 years, then out of the blue they updated it. Sad that THIS is the norm for Rockstar.
And guess who made that port? War Drum Studios. Who is also Grove Street Games. I don’t know who to fault more. The studio that has been trying to remaster GTA classic games for over 10 years, or Rockstar Games for continuing to allow them the opportunity.
The problem isn't Grove Street Games, the problem is that Rockstar didn't want to budget for a decent remaster. And I still prefer the originals because anything that requires a third-party launcher or sign-in for single-player on Steam is an instant non-starter.
GSG has done nothing, ever, to even give us a benefit of doubt. Even with a limitless budget I don't think they would've done a good job, because they never have given even the bare minimum of effort.
@@JDelwynn Apparently they did a good job with Ark on the Switch according to some other comments. It's not an effort thing, it's a mismanagement and greed thing on Rockstar's side. If they wanted it done well they should've given GSG more time and money
@@maybebutwhateverthey are, Rockstar is essentially an autonomous company due to the size of it and how much money it brings, even tho it technically is a subsidiary of take two it works more like a partnership
I still think they kinda suck. A botched, incoherent art style thats only "technically" better, downgraded controls from the mobile port, bad performance/high requirements because of course since its UE4 running the show, broken LODs. Just mod the pc version instead.
Not to mention, they butchered the soundtracks, because one of the most profitable developers in the history of gaming was unwilling to shell out for new licensing agreements.
@@no1DdC relicensing tracks gets ridiculously expensive with a major proven game. the music labels often want exponentially more the second time around, as they know how well the game sold. rockstar however could easily afford it with how much they're making off shark cards.
On PC the OG games (especially San Andreas) with mods blows this "Definitive Edition" out the water. Better textures, better models and just an overall better experience brought to the masses by a bunch of passionate modders for free rather than monetary gain. Most of the mods have been worked on for years, incrementally adding features and improvements and all Rockstar have done is get the game to playable and stay somewhat faithful to the original games and charging a ridicous price for it.
The definitive editions of the trilogy are in the original Xbox. GTA 3 for example has better textures, models and bugfixes that arent present nor in PS2 and in the PC port.
@@Peb02497 while graphically better, the San Andreas version had a weird lighting when it comes to night driving, when the PS2 version did better on that. I owned both versions, but this was one annoying thing that bothered me about the Xbox version.
@@Peb02497 The original Xbox version of Vice city and 3 are the superior versions. The PS2 version of San Andreas has noticeably better graphics and better load times because it takes advantage of the PS2 ludicrious pixel fill rate. (like triple that of the Xbox. Its also why Silent Hill 2 looks better on PS2)
That's all they had to do.. That's all!! The updates we were supposed to be getting were supposed to be minor fixes and adding new content.. Not a major update to fix something another team failed to do..
Rockstar wont even credit devs who leave the company during development. Buddy of mine worked on Red Dead 1 and didnt get credit cus he quit rockstar. He got a job at Double Eeven and worked on the remaster. Despite leaving there during the remasters development, his name made it into the credits for that version.
Kind-of off topic, but kids today will never appreciate what it was like to wait for games back in the day. Internet was still relatively new, so we had to rely largely on gaming mags like EGM to get updates on development. I remember reading a magazine and seeing just a handful of screen-caps from the game. When they showed us police bikes in San Andreas I remember hardly being able to wait to play the game. One or two years of waiting feels like a long time… but now twenty years has passed… What’s really crazy is more time has passed since the release of San Andreas, than the amount if time that passed between Vice City and when it takes place.
While it is great that they’re actually fixing the definitive edition, they should still relist the original versions at least on Steam by either including them when you buy the definitive edition or just to make them available separately again
Very much this. I want to be able to use the old mods again, instead of being stuck with a new game trying its best to ape the experience of the original. Let me worry about any compatibility issues with modern hardware myself (well, me and the modding community).
its extremely strange that they haven't done this since you can buy the original pc releases off the rockstar store. They definitely should at the very lest bundle in the original pc releases with purchases of definitive edition and then people can more accessibly play the versions they prefer
Original PC versions had issues compared to the consoles. Original Xbox had exclusive HD models and some better effects than the PS2 versions, PC was about the worst version.
@ I only ever played the originals on ps2 but I remember the PC versions looking and seeming to perform better. In any case, I think the mobile versions were the wrong starting point for the “definitive” edition
Especially when it's not even true. There's still a bunch of broken stuff in the "definitive" editions. I guess we've just now reached the point where the average normie isn't going to notice glaringly obvious things straight away, so that's "fixed" apparently.
And with Rockstar only doing remakes and still messing up so bad! I still can't believe they RDR1 just got remastered like just put everyone you have on the new game and stop remastering!!
And once more People completely overlook a company essentially scamming people All because EVENTUALLY they fixed it "they fixed the game for their fans , they care about us 🤡 " Pathetic mindset
It's till not where it should be though. Character models still look like crap, the lighting is still fucked up in cutscenes, flying controls in San Andreas are still garbage because they just copied the mobile controls etc. I still am of the believe that the DE has the potential to actually be difinitive. But it still needs so much work it's ridiculous.
Still I wouldn't forgive Rockstar for what they did to their community, especially by taking to the court the re3/revc team. I still believe the reverse enginnering of the old trilogy can be archieved again but it need a more cautelous code an some OG content to not mess with the Rockstar IP. At least the "Defective Edition" is not so defective right now andshows that Rockstar still cares for their games aside from selling shark cards and exploting GTA Online, it gives some good vibes for what will come for GTA VI
yeah, i'd love to see they do GTA 4 Definite edition but they probably won't release this. But you know.. if they did RDR Remastered recently.. who knows...
just stop with "i dont have hopes for gta 6 cause they did this and that" everything they do gets forgotten after they release another masterpiece because theyre just that good for anyone to care
When a film is coming out that a director doesn't feel is worthy of their name, they credit it to Alan Smithee. I don't know why a developer would want their name plastered over a shit game.
Sadly the games are still missing parts of their music catalogue. Without having all the original songs on the radio, it just doesn't feel worth it to ever pay for this, Rockstar is one of the wealthiest game studios, they can afford to re-up the music licenses.
Sadly it's almost impossible. For exampple, we will never have Michael Jackson songs in a videogame because Universal will never license his songs again.
I'm not defending Rock Star whatsoever, & I could be 100% wrong, here, but from what I read with a few of the songs, for whatever reasons the copyright holders don't want them in the games anymore, so no amount of money would get them put back in.
I hate the remaster because it looks like the models and stuff are made of playdough or something. Rather play the originals with SilentPatch or play on the PS2. Also, people shouldn't be supporting this AI texture upscale dogshit.
some physics have been fixed. llamp posts and street lights used to just drift into the ground if you knock them over. but they fall over and clatter to the ground correctly now.
@@JamesThomasJeansExcept San Andreas. Street lights and traffic lights still fall though the ground when you crash into them. It happens with other breakable props in the game such as fences.
"Good ending"? Rockstar still should give us back the possibility to buy the original trilogy. By removing them from Steam they destroyed their own legacy, their own child. So I'd say, it is rather "welp, could be worse" ending than a good one
i haven't seen a lot of people mention this, but they finally fixed the swimming speed in SA. arguably one of the biggest problems the game still had before this update
@@nerdError0XF they absolutely did, it's in every patch note article you can find and i've seen it in a couple videos. if you can prove me wrong then go ahead
@TheRageLivesOn i just checked like 5 videos on the update an noone showed the comparison. And speedrunner Joshimuz played the update on stream and it was absolutely not fixed. I have no idea where you took it from
6:25 Sadly no, just checked after hearing this, there's no gyro aim on the PS5, such a shame that some companies to this day relegate the gyro aim to switch as "It's a Nintendo gamer thing" WHEN THE TECHNOLOGY IS RIGHT THERE SINCE THE PS3
The good ending will be when this version (or later version) is on disk/cartridge. After reading the comments, this game is supposedly still a bug ridden mess... Hopefully it's fully fixed before a potential physical re-release, but its doubtful we'll ever get one.
For me personally the only way to play GTA3 and VC are the reverse engineered versions. I know the projects were taken down by T2, but the files are still out there. Too bad we never got a reverse engineered SA.
I got this trilogy in 2022 and by then, it was patched at least enough that the game played enjoyably. I hadn't noticed a lot of the issues you pointed out, and played through GTA3 and Vice City's story modes with a lot of enjoyment. Unfortunately, the one thing I did notice, that really marred my experience is that they removed a bunch of tracks from the radio stations. Now, I get it, licensing fees probably fluctuate, and it was probably cheaper to license Michael Jackson in 2003 than it is now that he's passed away, but still, not having Billie Jean and Wanna Be Starting Something in Vice City is almost enough to make me want to just play the original SD version instead.
We know those fixes have existed for quite a while because they were available on the mobile versions long ago, so I agree that it is a dick move for Rockstar to paint this update as something that came as a result of taking the wheel from Grove Street Games, they did a terrible job at launch (and this definitive version is still far from perfect), but removing credits specially in a update to fix several problems is a terrible thing to do
Is this the same Thomas Williamson that three years ago tweeted "enjoying this unparalleled level of scrutiny" after the disastrous launch? Yeah, I'm sorry, Rockstar has the entire blame for launching the trilogy in the state they did, but you sentenced your relationship with the community with that tweet.
Not properly managing to achieve 30fps on Switch is a massive L, that was the one platform they had to nail, I really wanted to have the trilogy perfectly playable on the go, but it's still not there. All three games not being on cartridge is also a dealbreaker.
i still stand on the hill that says all "definitive" editions are the first attempt that we all fell in love with. the whole experience, including the glitches and bugs is apart of the immersion. changing ANY of that automatically strips it of truly being the definitive way to play any given game
*I (this word should always be capitalized) *The whole *a part (meaning "one part") apart = separate from (so basically the opposite meaning) When two people fall in love, they're each *a part* of a couple. If they break up, they split apart. *Changing *game.
Rockstar just super cheap out on outsourced developers and don't give them enough time for actual development. Greed is single problem with dat GTA port...
their past works were awful aswell so its not a budget thing theyre one of the worst studios in the industry stop putting blame on rockstar and defending crappy devs for ruining a masterpiece
@@aiIeri @aiIeri Bro it's exactly about greed and budget - Rockstar don't wanted to spend money on good dev team and just buy a cheapest ones. Cheap, fast, quality - u must pick 2 of 3... Rockstar wanted to make quick money on customers nostalgia - it's okay, but not that way... It`s Rockstar fault an only them!
I’m still not sure why Rockstar/GSG didn’t just keep the original versions and try to combine the best visuals from each version, I.e. the PS2’s visual effects plus the Xbox’s HD models and textures. These games still look great if you’re able to get the right restoration mods on the original PC versions
No reward to Grove Street Games for fucking up TWICE. To this day the awful "HD" mobile port they released of San Andreas is a broken mess on PS3 and XBOX.
@@KaitouKaijuRemoved from the intro screen only. They are still in the credits. They did work on this game, even if it was poor work, so it stays in the credits.
Switching over the dev team was the move. Finally reinstalled all 3 after leaving them in 2021. They look fantastic now. They look polished but with the beautiful nostalgic look of the originals. They did a phenomenal job
People love doing this crap nowdays, and companies have noticed. Release an awful, broken product, then fix it later and people will suddenly praise you like you're the Messiah because you "listened to consumers", even though all you did was get it to the barely acceptable level that should have been at release, or in this case, even below that. This piece of crap collection is still riddled with bugs and problems.
A few Switch-Impressions here: It's impressive it actually got the Update. But the Framerate is completely untouched. I've bought the collection in an eShop sale about 2 years ago, paid around 25 Euro for it with a few Gold Points. Since a few days I've been playing GTA III on the Switch and my mood went from "That's not half bad compared to the crappy PAL PS2 Classics" to "Yeah, screw it". The Framerate is plagued by Frame Pacing issues. It's been marked as 30 FPS but it is constantly "switching" between 25-30 FPS or something like that. The mission where you have to protect 8Ball can be tricky with this framerate. I just gave up on it and simply bought it in the Black Friday Deals on Xbox for, 23 Euros? Yeah, that's worth it and I think the games are playing pretty great with the new control layout. Really curious if this get's an FPS boost on the next Switch system, then I will gladly come back to that versions.
The rain doesn't even come close to the original. You don't see the rain hit the cars or ground, no reflections of the lights on the road, it's terrible. It's still nowhere near the quality of the original games.
They fixed that I just noticed that actually I was driving a black car on San Andreas and it started raining and I noticed the rain drops falling on the car
7:13 If you've ever seen company logos 30 years ago vs today, that's the same feeling I get looking at that screenshot. Not to speak of the incorrect spelling, but the clear lack of effort and passion in the new version compared to the old one. Even if they fixed the spelling, it won't fix that sterile and overly 'neat' feel that is so devoid of passion.
Regardless of budget. People seem to forget Grove Street Games (Wardrum Studios) made all of ports of the Rockstar titles on mobile devices. They made those 10 years prior and were still clueless then - changed how basic things worked from the get go and it wasn't even just simply because it worked better on touch controls. It was just straight up not needed to be changed - they messed it up then. Had a 2nd chance and messed it up again and even worse this time as it was a more public wide spread game - I don't blame Rockstar or whoever for removing them from the intro credits. They caused it themselves
Actually verify this last night while I couldn't sleep on my switch and it is so much better and since the last time I played on switch was around 2021 the performance is a lot more stable and it actually feels like I'm playing the PS2 version to a degree. I think it's wonderful
My opinion on the Thomas Williamson situation is simple- developers should know their limitations instead of trying to bite off more than they can chew... Also that guy needs to learn how to humble himself and stfu when it's those "100's of fixes" his team worked on was a result of problems created by his own incompetence...
if a publisher that had been funding subpar projects with me for over a decade writes me off our latest release so they can pretend like they weren't being incompetent with their own IPs... I'd be pissed too. That's not even mentioning the pushing back bug fixes part, which if actually true doesn't hype me for GTA6 even if RDR2 was a masterpiece.
There's still some texture bugs and some glitches still present in these versions left to iron out, but VGD has done an excellent job fixing the games.
Yeah, the San Andreas military vehicles are still the wrong colour, rather than the Army tan the humvee like vehicle is bright green and the barracks army truck is red for some reason lol, not sure how the hell they missed that (still broken right now after update but you can get mods to fix it), but they did miss the VCPD SWAT van being made of glass lol, partially fixed allthough the VCPD SWAT van has some opaque windows that are broken.
It's almost unimaginable a big company like Rockstar couldn't outsource these games to a good developer with all the money that they have. It's frankly unbelievable. Very very weird.
San Andreas does not feel right without Tom Petty's " Running Down a Dream", or NWA's" Express yourself". It's not the full game without the full soundtrack.😢 Edit: not to mention Rage Against the Machine's "Killing in the name of", among many others.
I finished GTA III 2 days ago and immediately started Vice City. The improvements are just amazing ... Especially Vice City looks amazing and perfectly captures the atmosphere of the original and further gives away these "Miami Vice '86" vibes ...
I don't feel bad for Grove Street games having their logo removed from the splash. I'd be pissed too if I had an iconic IP bungled so badly by some third party. They caused all kind of grief and had every opportunity to make it right, but I just don't think they were competent enough for a job of this scale. Dumping all the textures into an AI uprezzer and calling it a day isn't good enough. You can't tell me that no-one had the time to sanity check them after the process, especially the textures with text on them, or that the QA didn't notice the very glaring issues with them.
I don't mind the reduced performance, I enjoyed playing the GTA Trilogy on Switch. I still have the PS2 Classics version on PS4, so I'm more interested in playing on a handheld. The classic lighting option is a huge improvement, the fog has restored the perceived scale and atmosphere of San Andreas. Interestingly around the same time, the Metal Gear Solid Master Collection got a big update after a year of poor performance.
Should be titled still broken but with better lighting. A company the size of rockstar should've put the resources into this update 3 weeks after the disastrous launch not 3 years.
Im kind of surprised you can’t understand why they kept the original lighting in the game MVG? First off more options in the Settings menu is always better. Secondly, again, why take something away, when it can just remain in the background? The option to switch between Lighting is great, it reminds us how much different atmosphere can be when Artistic flare is added over modern lighting. It is a good reminder to keep in the game. I like having the option to show friends the difference between how modern games can lack atmosphere as opposed to early GTA titles.
I can understand having such a small initial budget for a niche game series from a tiny indie dev like Rockstar resulting in the original mess, but you'd think at least someone would have play tested it for issues prior to release. I feel like if it took an additional 3 years to complete, they should have held off on release.
I can kinda understand Rockstar removing grovestreet games from the opening. Rockstar has made a game that is so well known and loved. Grovestreet tarnished that badly.
I wish credits for patches was a thing so we can see who specifically is responsible for continued work on the game. Because if Grove Street Games is upset about that, why would they remove the credit at the beginning if they were the ones working on it?
Great video! I'm happy to see work continuing to improve this release. However, until they include the omitted music from the 3 titles in this release I hardly consider it "Definitive". The music was such a big part of these games. Especially Vice City and San Andreas. Rockstar needs to give these titles the love they need and bring back Billie Jean, Running with the Night, Rockit, Express Yourself, I Don't Give A F#$@ and Killing in the Name among others. Just ridiculous they couldn't pony up the cash for the music that really made these games special. Well done MVG!
3 years has flown by. Remember when they got upset at their fans for expecting the usual high quality experience & cancelled the GTA 4 definitive edition after backlash
@@waffleson45 Not quite. GTA IV definitely needs some ironing out, the original PC release requires a multitude to patches to actually make it not lag on modern hardware.
I always wanted a remaster of the PS2 Scarface game...The original PC version was broken and unplayable on modern systems, and the Wii version runs at 30fps only. I would love to see a quick remaster of the game in this fashion.
Time to watch based programmer man Fun fact: the GInput mod adds the ability to use a GTA4 style control scheme, which is nice. Including partial throttle with the triggers (this is due to the ps2 pressure sensitvity code still being in the game).
Great video, time for a little tech history lesson! At around the 3:40 mark you reference the fog found in the original PS2 version of the game. This is a common and huge misunderstanding. The "red fog" is framebuffer effects which are used for the timecycle of the game and are extremely demanding on the hardware, same way as Shadow of the Colossus uses its HDR rendering techniques, same way as MGS3 uses it for the skybox "glow", the water rendering and many other effects. Contrary to what many claim, it has absolutely nothing to do with draw distance, which itself is high on PS2. It's the LOD for faraway objects that's limited, which is completely understandable given the amount of stuff rendered. The Original Xbox version was a huge downgrade as it is lacking these atmospheric effects, along with the time-based texturing on buildings, even the actual Sun is missing. In the PS2 version, all textures gradually change lighting based on the time of day and the Sun has powerful post-processing. Xbox is lacking these features completely, among other things, and is just an awful way to experience the game. Surely you'd think that with so many effects removed, the Xbox version would have run at 60 FPS? Except it doesn't. It was simply incapable of rendering such huge amounts of effects due to lackluster bandwidth -- only 6.4 GB/s compared to 48 GB/s VRAM bandwidth on PS2. Thanks to the superfast eDRAM used for VRAM on PS2 as a solution for VFX streaming via the Graphics Synthesizer. Meanwhile, Xbox had to use shaders which were very demanding and didn't provide good results with the DirectX 8.1 and bandwidth limitations. Hence the numerous downgrades seen in many multiplats, including Silent Hill 2, Timesplitters, MGS2, etc etc.
3 years? I don’t even care anymore I paid full price for an incomplete game and already played through them all (reluctantly). I’ve already moved on and they won’t ever get the bad taste out of my mouth from that experience.
There's still nothing "definitive" about this compilation. Better lighting hardly fixes the hundreds or even thousands of other issues with these versions of the games. This is too little, too late. They don't deserve props for this. We need to stop accepting garbage like this. This is NOT the good ending, this is more like having to buy the ending as a separate dlc and it sucking.
I had such egg on my face when they released this trilogy and the lighting, the one thing I thought they knew to be so crucial to the atmosphere, was genericized. I had laughed at mods that tried to remake vice city in V and now nobody is laughing. But maybe now we're getting somewhere!
Not sure the exact events that led to this, but hypothetically, if i was running a developing team that was given too little time to remaster a game, was released and hated on for sloppiness, and Rockstar then removes us from the credits for the updates - effectively removing any opportunity to redeem the company - I'd be PISSED. Again, not sure if this actually happened, but it would suck if true
@@MimonJesus67 and theyre spending it on gta 6 instead of a 20 year old game let go of those games let them work and spend money on new games instead of wasting it on 20 year old games so babies like u wont cry about music
@@aiIeri Idiotic zoomer comment. Rockstar definitively has the budget for both endeavours, they're not hurting for money. And the games deserve to be treated well, specially considering how seminal they are. Also when you're older, you will want the games that defined your generation to receive respect as well. Not that the games of your generation will leave any respectable legacy behind, other than a lesson on how not to be insanely woke derivative and exploitative, that is.
A 20 year old game that is being bought again. It should include what it did 20 years ago. New sales means new royalties. It doesn't make much sense to raise received royalties. When the old contract profits you nothing.
3 years, it took them 3 years just to get this into a presentable state.
In that same amount of time, Rockstar originally released Vice City AND San Andreas Just think about that.
Backwards development
So what cyber junk 2077 took 3 years just to add some garbage wanted system in their game and they needed the help of modders
That's what happens when you outsource games to people who don't give a crap if it's good and don't speak english or live in north america. They don't understand why the game was made as it was due to lacking cultural context, they don't notice typos since they don't speak english, they know they won't be punished for mistakes or the game being awful, etc.
A small team of fans (20-50) with development knowledge could have made a better remaster than these in less time.
EDIT: Since people think they are geniuses for saying Grove Street Games are from Florida, they outsourced most of the development to India. Look at the game's credits.
EDIT: If you think this comment is racist, imagine Americans remastering a game that was in Hindi about people living in India without speaking that language or having ever lived there. It would be a disaster. Doesn't matter where you're from or what you look like. Vastly different cultures exist and their differences are a lot more nuanced than it seems to people who haven't experienced those cultures.
@@caldera11 or the budget you give a developer forces them to cut corners.
technically iii as well, as the time between it and san andreas were the same amount of years (both ending with a 1 and a 4 even!) for this update to come to the definitive edition
As a speedrunner for the original GTA:SA and GTA games, I can tell you there's still a lot missing in the latest update.
The movement/controls are still very wrong, stuff like not being able to move while aiming rockets/sniper rifle, having physics freak out in car crashes sometimes, or just car handling in general being very inaccurate. Swimming is still agonisingly slow, and sky diving is still way too fast, both of which all stem from the game running above 30 FPS without all the frame rate dependant physics being fixed.
For god sake you still just yeet hay bales into the next town over whenever you drive into them instead of them exploding into lots of pieces like they do in OG.
The further into the game you play the more you realise it's still bad. Los Santos is the most polished, but play past San Fierro and the game really starts to fall apart. You still cannot control the camera inside aircraft, it's just locked to the Horizon. "Accelerate" in Helicopters still makes them lean forwards instead of going up (like ya know, accelerating the engine would?) and unless you wanna unbind W from accelerate in every other vehicle you can't fix that through settings/rebinding.
Overall the update is good, a big step in the right direction, but for me to consider this the "definitive" edition of the game they'd had to fix a lot more stuff.
Perfectly said. They are still garbage and I'll stick to the originals.
Acting like 2004 san andreas didn't have any game breaking bugs.
Nailed it Josh. Funny enough this update came out just when Silent just made Silent Patch open source. Couldn't make it up.
@@VoyagerVentures acting like the remasters aren't worse.
Thanks you. Still a hot broken mess as expected
the actual good ending was release of gta decomp project which is lost forever thanks to take two lawyers
wayback machine exists.
You can still find it if you search in the right places, unfortunately there weren't a GTA SA version.
@@NightFyreTVhonestly I think it's more the point that it just isn't being worked on anymore and that was actually doing the series justice by being true to the original experience
I dunno man, ports based on it are still being actively developed. There’s no putting the genie back in the bottle, GTA3 and VC are open source now whether it’s entirely legal or not.
It's not lost forever.
This isn't "the good ending". This is the "acceptable ending". The good ending would be if this game were actually worthy of the title "the definitive edition". This is closer, but it's not there yet.
This isn't acceptable, though.
The "a bit less shit" ending?
I definitely agree with the "definitive" moniker. How can "worse than the originals" be called definitive? Grr
not there yet, not even close, shouldn’t even of tried at this point this is absurdly ridiculous
Engagement clickbait title, this guy can make great videos I don't know why he sometimes stoops to this level
If there’s ever any remaster or remake it cannot be in shy way worse than the original. Unless it’s the same or better in each aspect then it’s a failure
I don't feel bad for Grove Street Games. They've been working nearly exclusively with porting GTA games since like 2011, and not once have they managed to get it even close to right. They should have never been put on a project like this to begin with.
In 2021 I was excited for the remasters until I saw the words “Grove Street Games” and I was reminded of the terrible GTA SA remaster for the ps3
I mean, they were also given completley ridiculous time frames and kept getting the project changed whenever they got anywhere. They absolutely did no get the opportunity to remaster the games to the best of their capacity.
@@TiMona42
Source?
They apparently only wanted to do gta 3 for now but were told to remaster all of them
@S0daB there's the whuh happen video going into the development history, if you're interested: ua-cam.com/video/DhtOzwKqeYQ/v-deo.htmlsi=CegbD2T8EGKuh0e7
I’m not giving rockstar credit for doing what they needed to do three years ago
You’re not giving them credit because you’d prefer it if it remained unfixed so you can keep complaining.
@@DoritosBurger Not giving someone credit for screwing their customers in the first place
@@DoritosBurger Rockstar should have done right by these classics in the first place.. This update is a "feeling gulit" update and shouldn't have been a thing at all.. The updates should have been minor fixes or adding something new to the games..
@ except it wasn’t rockstar that originally worked on this remaster, it wasn’t until rockstar fired them and took control of it that things got fixed.
@@DoritosBurger They still choose to hire Growth Street though.
How are people calling this good? If it can't replace the original and then some, then it's not a definitive edition. It just went from alpha to beta.
Original is a classic. This is like a bad copy version.
@@anjali21ful It's like those zero budget scam games on mobile that use stolen footage in their ads.
Easily replaced original games for me. Deleted that buggy crap (not playable on modern systems without special tricks and fixes) and not going to install them back again.
Apparently that's how gaming is nowadays, you buy a bad game and you cant complain because "it will get good eventually"
@antoniosanpuchino8244 have fun with the defective edition.
A "smoggy metropolis" is the perfect descriptor for fog being added back into San Andreas.
The shitty thing is the low quality AI upscaling in the games. The lack of music also kills it.
All music is there except the radio sounds. I didn't even like the radio on, I used to turn the radio off everytime some song was playing. Except that song which was something like 'I will make you dance'.
@@samzony
Dude yeah I was always annoyed by the radio so I couldn’t care less
Dead Rising Deluxe Remaster has the same problem with terrible AI upscaling, only worse because a lot of the little details with text are completely mangled. It still got good reviews, though, somehow.
@@samzonyJust because you played that way doesn’t mean everyone did. The music is a big part for a good portion of players.
@Bob_Smith19 Not only I am like that, there are millions of players who aren't interested in radio that much. Only I am in the comment doesn't mean that only I am like that.
It’s absolutely *not* fixed. It’s still riddled with hundreds of bugs, glitches, and bizarre issues.
Aw my gawd zaddy yaaaaaaaassss ahh😩😩
@@sparkybig9799😂😂
I.... what? It's still miles away from fixed, and still the worst possible way to play these classics imo.
Riddled with bugs, graphical issues, awful looking models, terrible parallax interiors, poor flight controls etc etc. Feels like I'm going crazy seeing so many people praise this update so much. Sure it's an improvement on the last patch, but it's still not worth buying by any stretch.
Yeah, I’m seeing tons of people saying it’s still a mess.
Pretty much, probably a gtao update is due 😂
I hate all the videos with "they're fixed" in the title. They're still garbage.
@@joshuaDstarksI play all these on vita not much errors happen
Lets also keep in mind that there are over 40 songs that have been removed across all 3 games due to Licensing issues and the package is priced at 60 bucks
Thats like selling a reprint of a Harry Potter book at the same price of the original while having some chapters missing from said reprint
11:07 That's not how it goes, man... They can't just make that call and hide the proper credits like that... It doesn't matter if the initial work they did had issues, if they worked on that, they deserve to have that spotlight. They shouldn't have the right to do that, at all. Credits are not judgement of merit.
Yea I honestly wonder what the "right" answer is. I understand the work of updating etc is theres but the IP is Rockstars, the code etc is Rockstars. A team that was given the responsibilty (as he alluded to we dont really know about the level of time/resources given) put out a very poor quality product that in the end couldve affected sales on Rockstars end.
I think of it like in any business. If you put together a project for a company and the conpany gives you the green light and it flops and they have to take over what you did and fix it, then they have the right to remove you from it because you put it together poorly. Maybe thats part of it?
@@Tyler-hs9eualso, like MVG mentions, their name wasn't removed completely, it's still in the credits
But what I think happened, from a PR standpoint, is this: Rockstar must've come to the conclusion that having Grove Street Games's logo stamped on the Definitive Edition's loading screen was a bad move, considering how poor of a job they did. And judging from the public's perception of GSG and their work, as scummy as it may be, it was definitely the better call, at least for Rockstar. That being said, the latter's more at fault in general for the work we've had for three years, because they hired a studio who'd already done poor work for them, such as the mobile ports and the GTA SA PS3 and Xbox ports, and they didn't even give them enough time to at least deliver a somewhat finished product
They absolutely can. The actual primary developer of these games is obviously Rockstar. GSG was contracted to do work and they did a bad job. Now Video Game Deluxe has put in a bunch of work to clear up the disaster they paid GSG for. Both companies are listed in the actual credits.
A 20 year old game running at a chunky 30 fps on a PS5 was enough crap for me
There a frame rate mode go to 60fps
@@GhostGamer799 bro, it's a 2004 game on a ps5, it should be running 120fps locked (at least in 1080p perf), remaster or not
@@k680B”memememh i need muh frames i shit myself and eat it”
@@lucadasillywolf imagine being a corpo-cvck
@ imagine being concerned about frame rates and not going tf outside
More than 15 billion dollars at their disposal and they can't spend like 500k to port the games that made them who they are in the first place to modern consoles.
500K is probably what they did over-spend on Grove Street "Games". 😂
GTA remaster really needed at least 10 mil per game.
They could have added so much more to these classics.. New gaming modes, online multi-player and countless other things.. This is a missed opportunity.. Rockstar has the money to revamp these games and should do it while they got a chance to prove themselves again..
This is exactly the same situation they had for GTA Vice City on iOS back in the day. Stuttering constantly, black screens, missing frams, crashes etc, app was left untouched for 4 years, then out of the blue they updated it. Sad that THIS is the norm for Rockstar.
They are my favorite game developer by far but when it comes to stuff like this they're pretty damn awful
And guess who made that port? War Drum Studios. Who is also Grove Street Games.
I don’t know who to fault more.
The studio that has been trying to remaster GTA classic games for over 10 years, or Rockstar Games for continuing to allow them the opportunity.
did they recently update the iOS version of those games? I had no idea.
@@clarkesuperman at this point it's the fault of Rockstar because they keep allowing people to "remaster" their games in such a crap way.
I have none of these issues.
The problem isn't Grove Street Games, the problem is that Rockstar didn't want to budget for a decent remaster. And I still prefer the originals because anything that requires a third-party launcher or sign-in for single-player on Steam is an instant non-starter.
GSG has done nothing, ever, to even give us a benefit of doubt. Even with a limitless budget I don't think they would've done a good job, because they never have given even the bare minimum of effort.
@@JDelwynn Apparently they did a good job with Ark on the Switch according to some other comments. It's not an effort thing, it's a mismanagement and greed thing on Rockstar's side. If they wanted it done well they should've given GSG more time and money
What...? If it weren't for GSG working on it, it'd likely be much better. GSG are close to useless.
Take-two
How hard is it to understand that rockstar is not making decisions her?
@@maybebutwhateverthey are, Rockstar is essentially an autonomous company due to the size of it and how much money it brings, even tho it technically is a subsidiary of take two it works more like a partnership
I still think they kinda suck.
A botched, incoherent art style thats only "technically" better, downgraded controls from the mobile port, bad performance/high requirements because of course since its UE4 running the show, broken LODs. Just mod the pc version instead.
Silent Patch is the way to go
@@SRC267 AND some minor elements are still better, such as menu UI and SFX-- the aesthetic
Not to mention, they butchered the soundtracks, because one of the most profitable developers in the history of gaming was unwilling to shell out for new licensing agreements.
@@no1DdC relicensing tracks gets ridiculously expensive with a major proven game. the music labels often want exponentially more the second time around, as they know how well the game sold. rockstar however could easily afford it with how much they're making off shark cards.
@dan_loeb They're a multi billion dollar company. GTA online BY ITSELF makes more money than they know what to do with.
On PC the OG games (especially San Andreas) with mods blows this "Definitive Edition" out the water. Better textures, better models and just an overall better experience brought to the masses by a bunch of passionate modders for free rather than monetary gain. Most of the mods have been worked on for years, incrementally adding features and improvements and all Rockstar have done is get the game to playable and stay somewhat faithful to the original games and charging a ridicous price for it.
The definitive editions of the trilogy are in the original Xbox. GTA 3 for example has better textures, models and bugfixes that arent present nor in PS2 and in the PC port.
@@Peb02497 while graphically better, the San Andreas version had a weird lighting when it comes to night driving, when the PS2 version did better on that. I owned both versions, but this was one annoying thing that bothered me about the Xbox version.
Modding this will be better. UE4 + 64 bit.
@roothome-em8jjmods are only unstable if you don't know what you are doing with them.
@@Peb02497 The original Xbox version of Vice city and 3 are the superior versions. The PS2 version of San Andreas has noticeably better graphics and better load times because it takes advantage of the PS2 ludicrious pixel fill rate. (like triple that of the Xbox. Its also why Silent Hill 2 looks better on PS2)
All you had to do was Remaster the old game, Grove Street!
Read this in Big Smoke’s voice
They did, but it was a dirty work so Video Games Deluxe had to clean their dirty work.
@@kaiser9321 Yes thank you Ted that was the joke
That's all they had to do.. That's all!! The updates we were supposed to be getting were supposed to be minor fixes and adding new content.. Not a major update to fix something another team failed to do..
Rockstar wont even credit devs who leave the company during development. Buddy of mine worked on Red Dead 1 and didnt get credit cus he quit rockstar. He got a job at Double Eeven and worked on the remaster. Despite leaving there during the remasters development, his name made it into the credits for that version.
"Fixed" is bit of an overstatement. It's still a bad, broken, ugly version of the game. Just a bit less broken than before.
Kind-of off topic, but kids today will never appreciate what it was like to wait for games back in the day. Internet was still relatively new, so we had to rely largely on gaming mags like EGM to get updates on development. I remember reading a magazine and seeing just a handful of screen-caps from the game. When they showed us police bikes in San Andreas I remember hardly being able to wait to play the game. One or two years of waiting feels like a long time… but now twenty years has passed…
What’s really crazy is more time has passed since the release of San Andreas, than the amount if time that passed between Vice City and when it takes place.
While it is great that they’re actually fixing the definitive edition, they should still relist the original versions at least on Steam by either including them when you buy the definitive edition or just to make them available separately again
Very much this. I want to be able to use the old mods again, instead of being stuck with a new game trying its best to ape the experience of the original. Let me worry about any compatibility issues with modern hardware myself (well, me and the modding community).
its extremely strange that they haven't done this since you can buy the original pc releases off the rockstar store. They definitely should at the very lest bundle in the original pc releases with purchases of definitive edition and then people can more accessibly play the versions they prefer
I will never forgive rockstar for delisting the original games
Their biggest mistake was porting the mobile versions and not the PC versions
Original PC versions had issues compared to the consoles. Original Xbox had exclusive HD models and some better effects than the PS2 versions, PC was about the worst version.
And the mobile versions were better?@@Spendingryan
but the mobile versions are better than the pc versions
@ I only ever played the originals on ps2 but I remember the PC versions looking and seeming to perform better. In any case, I think the mobile versions were the wrong starting point for the “definitive” edition
@@WayStedYou no they're not all chars look like plastic dolls
8:02 finally, the game looking like what we expected a remaster to look like, 3 years later. This is how it should have been.
I'm absolutely fed up of people patting the backs of companies for fixing these games YEARS down the line... They don't deserve the coverage.
Especially when it's not even true. There's still a bunch of broken stuff in the "definitive" editions. I guess we've just now reached the point where the average normie isn't going to notice glaringly obvious things straight away, so that's "fixed" apparently.
This was the last of the trilogy of games that were bad on launch I believe, No Man’s Sky, Cyberpunk and this game, and yeah, I agree entirely
And with Rockstar only doing remakes and still messing up so bad! I still can't believe they RDR1 just got remastered like just put everyone you have on the new game and stop remastering!!
@@kaiser9321 cyberpunk is still a terrible game though
Bro did not wake up on the right side of the bed today 😂
And once more
People completely overlook a company essentially scamming people
All because EVENTUALLY they fixed it
"they fixed the game for their fans , they care about us 🤡 "
Pathetic mindset
It's till not where it should be though. Character models still look like crap, the lighting is still fucked up in cutscenes, flying controls in San Andreas are still garbage because they just copied the mobile controls etc. I still am of the believe that the DE has the potential to actually be difinitive. But it still needs so much work it's ridiculous.
\*It's still
*the belief (noun)
believe = verb (and is pronounced slightly differently on the end)
*definitive, but
Exactly!!
The only reason Grove Street Games would want their name on the title is the humiliation fetish of CEO.
Still I wouldn't forgive Rockstar for what they did to their community, especially by taking to the court the re3/revc team. I still believe the reverse enginnering of the old trilogy can be archieved again but it need a more cautelous code an some OG content to not mess with the Rockstar IP.
At least the "Defective Edition" is not so defective right now andshows that Rockstar still cares for their games aside from selling shark cards and exploting GTA Online, it gives some good vibes for what will come for GTA VI
yeah, i'd love to see they do GTA 4 Definite edition but they probably won't release this. But you know.. if they did RDR Remastered recently.. who knows...
just stop with "i dont have hopes for gta 6 cause they did this and that" everything they do gets forgotten after they release another masterpiece because theyre just that good for anyone to care
@@SC-lc7tm that wasnt a remaster it was just a pc port not done by them
When a film is coming out that a director doesn't feel is worthy of their name, they credit it to Alan Smithee. I don't know why a developer would want their name plastered over a shit game.
Sadly the games are still missing parts of their music catalogue. Without having all the original songs on the radio, it just doesn't feel worth it to ever pay for this, Rockstar is one of the wealthiest game studios, they can afford to re-up the music licenses.
its insane the og Xbox had custom sountracks, but nothing like that feature is available for modern consoles
Sadly it's almost impossible. For exampple, we will never have Michael Jackson songs in a videogame because Universal will never license his songs again.
I'm not defending Rock Star whatsoever, & I could be 100% wrong, here, but from what I read with a few of the songs, for whatever reasons the copyright holders don't want them in the games anymore, so no amount of money would get them put back in.
Good to see there are still people that actually care for their wallet
I hate the remaster because it looks like the models and stuff are made of playdough or something. Rather play the originals with SilentPatch or play on the PS2. Also, people shouldn't be supporting this AI texture upscale dogshit.
I'm sp glad your videos drop early in the morning in my area. I always have something to look forward to when I wake up
I always found it odd to call it the "Definitive Edition" when it doesn't include the 'Liberty City Stories' or 'Vice City Stories' titles.
Maybe because it's called The Trilogy?
Wish we could get real Definitive Editions with these 2 games
😂@@gowary
I mean, it's the definitive edition of "GTA: The Trilogy", a bundle of 3+VC+SA that came out in 2005, those 2 just obviously aren't part of it
@@malucart then call it a pentalogy, because that's what the 3D series is
They haven't fixed any of the physics which is tied to framerate so the slightest bump still makes your car explode after three seconds
some physics have been fixed. llamp posts and street lights used to just drift into the ground if you knock them over. but they fall over and clatter to the ground correctly now.
@@JamesThomasJeansExcept San Andreas. Street lights and traffic lights still fall though the ground when you crash into them. It happens with other breakable props in the game such as fences.
"fixed" is a big word.
they made a class action lawsuit worthy scam to a 4/10.
👏🏽
"Class action lawsuit"
Lmao, gamers are such deranged little dorks.
I have 15 days in DE. This is easy a 7/10 now. you're just salty
@@hEAVyCRUNCH556 Thats usual coming from gamers nowawdays.
@@Turok1134 Fr they can just look at it, if it looks weird just move on. They're gonna sue someone for a game their parents didn't buy them?
"Good ending"? Rockstar still should give us back the possibility to buy the original trilogy. By removing them from Steam they destroyed their own legacy, their own child.
So I'd say, it is rather "welp, could be worse" ending than a good one
You could always get an Xbox or PS2.
You can still buy them on Rockstars website for PC.
@@TheRed_02 No, you can't anymore. Only the Definitive Edition is for sale
When it’s 75% off on Steam I will be interested.
Same. It's bad enough that the original games run kinda janky on PC, but I'm not paying $60 to get them again.
I will put it on my list.
Iam most interested in replay vice city.
@@Nordlicht05I wish we could by them separately, I only really want Vice City for now.
It’s 50% off on Xbox right now for like $23 and they aren’t even going to get that from me.
Ive only seen it as low as 50 off in the past 3 years.
That patchnote looks like something I would do as a developer...
patch notes v1.01
- fix issues
patch size 10GB
you gotta make your commit messages readable, and use the conventional commits, and use like a script or something to make a changelog
@@boreal3255 Where's the fun in that
i haven't seen a lot of people mention this, but they finally fixed the swimming speed in SA. arguably one of the biggest problems the game still had before this update
@@TheRageLivesOn why are you writing this??? No, they didnt fix it. You clearly didnt even try the game
Army vehicles in San Andreas are still not tan, like the humvee and barracks truck, they are still bright green and red respectively.
@@nerdError0XF they absolutely did, it's in every patch note article you can find and i've seen it in a couple videos. if you can prove me wrong then go ahead
@@Spendingryan that has nothing to do with what i said but thanks for letting me know
@TheRageLivesOn i just checked like 5 videos on the update an noone showed the comparison. And speedrunner Joshimuz played the update on stream and it was absolutely not fixed. I have no idea where you took it from
6:25 Sadly no, just checked after hearing this, there's no gyro aim on the PS5, such a shame that some companies to this day relegate the gyro aim to switch as "It's a Nintendo gamer thing" WHEN THE TECHNOLOGY IS RIGHT THERE SINCE THE PS3
The good ending will be when this version (or later version) is on disk/cartridge.
After reading the comments, this game is supposedly still a bug ridden mess... Hopefully it's fully fixed before a potential physical re-release, but its doubtful we'll ever get one.
Spotting the odd typo is actually more realistic
Still disgraceful coming from a company that has more money than god
Exactly. This was REALLY easy to get right, especially for a company with unlimited resources smh
1. Putin
2. Elon Musk
3. Nvidia
4. Rockstar Games
5. God
God is the richest entity that exists
Take 2 probably gave grove street games like 50 bucks and a 6 month timeframe because of how cheap they are despite being loaded.
@@Tinfoilistlol nice
Great video dude. I just got it to work on my SteamDeck by changing the Command line and the lighting difference is night and day!
For me personally the only way to play GTA3 and VC are the reverse engineered versions. I know the projects were taken down by T2, but the files are still out there. Too bad we never got a reverse engineered SA.
Need to change the title its misleading.
Its not even 90% fixed and likely will never get fixed and it still has many problems within these games.
cry about it as always
I don't care if they've fixed it. The fact it took them 3 years to fix a broken game makes me want to stay far away from it. I'll never buy it.
Same.....pirate approved 👍🏻
Makes you wonder how long it'll take to fix GTA6 if it comes in a broken state.
That seems a little exetrme to me personally.
@@billwehadababyitsaboy1684 Don't.
Good for you. I couldn't even trade my copy because they sent me a copy with no age rating on the box making it illegal to sell in the UK 😂
I got this trilogy in 2022 and by then, it was patched at least enough that the game played enjoyably. I hadn't noticed a lot of the issues you pointed out, and played through GTA3 and Vice City's story modes with a lot of enjoyment. Unfortunately, the one thing I did notice, that really marred my experience is that they removed a bunch of tracks from the radio stations. Now, I get it, licensing fees probably fluctuate, and it was probably cheaper to license Michael Jackson in 2003 than it is now that he's passed away, but still, not having Billie Jean and Wanna Be Starting Something in Vice City is almost enough to make me want to just play the original SD version instead.
We know those fixes have existed for quite a while because they were available on the mobile versions long ago, so I agree that it is a dick move for Rockstar to paint this update as something that came as a result of taking the wheel from Grove Street Games, they did a terrible job at launch (and this definitive version is still far from perfect), but removing credits specially in a update to fix several problems is a terrible thing to do
Is this the same Thomas Williamson that three years ago tweeted "enjoying this unparalleled level of scrutiny" after the disastrous launch? Yeah, I'm sorry, Rockstar has the entire blame for launching the trilogy in the state they did, but you sentenced your relationship with the community with that tweet.
Not properly managing to achieve 30fps on Switch is a massive L, that was the one platform they had to nail, I really wanted to have the trilogy perfectly playable on the go, but it's still not there. All three games not being on cartridge is also a dealbreaker.
Garbage ports on a garbage system, what did you expect?
Steam Deck
@@JDelwynn lol ignoring Nintendo being a terrible company the Switch is like the one console worth owning
switch is ass thats not anyones problem
i still stand on the hill that says all "definitive" editions are the first attempt that we all fell in love with. the whole experience, including the glitches and bugs is apart of the immersion. changing ANY of that automatically strips it of truly being the definitive way to play any given game
*I (this word should always be capitalized)
*The whole
*a part (meaning "one part")
apart = separate from (so basically the opposite meaning)
When two people fall in love, they're each *a part* of a couple. If they break up, they split apart.
*Changing
*game.
Rockstar just super cheap out on outsourced developers and don't give them enough time for actual development. Greed is single problem with dat GTA port...
their past works were awful aswell so its not a budget thing theyre one of the worst studios in the industry stop putting blame on rockstar and defending crappy devs for ruining a masterpiece
@@aiIeri @aiIeri Bro it's exactly about greed and budget - Rockstar don't wanted to spend money on good dev team and just buy a cheapest ones. Cheap, fast, quality - u must pick 2 of 3... Rockstar wanted to make quick money on customers nostalgia - it's okay, but not that way... It`s Rockstar fault an only them!
I’m still not sure why Rockstar/GSG didn’t just keep the original versions and try to combine the best visuals from each version, I.e. the PS2’s visual effects plus the Xbox’s HD models and textures. These games still look great if you’re able to get the right restoration mods on the original PC versions
No reward to Grove Street Games for fucking up TWICE. To this day the awful "HD" mobile port they released of San Andreas is a broken mess on PS3 and XBOX.
GSG is no longer working on these ports. Their name is completely scrubbed from the credits
@@KaitouKaijuRemoved from the intro screen only. They are still in the credits. They did work on this game, even if it was poor work, so it stays in the credits.
Switching over the dev team was the move. Finally reinstalled all 3 after leaving them in 2021. They look fantastic now. They look polished but with the beautiful nostalgic look of the originals. They did a phenomenal job
I don't know why people praise this all of a sudden. The pedestrian models and textures are still awful. They are nowhere near close to the originals.
People love doing this crap nowdays, and companies have noticed. Release an awful, broken product, then fix it later and people will suddenly praise you like you're the Messiah because you "listened to consumers", even though all you did was get it to the barely acceptable level that should have been at release, or in this case, even below that. This piece of crap collection is still riddled with bugs and problems.
A few Switch-Impressions here: It's impressive it actually got the Update. But the Framerate is completely untouched. I've bought the collection in an eShop sale about 2 years ago, paid around 25 Euro for it with a few Gold Points. Since a few days I've been playing GTA III on the Switch and my mood went from "That's not half bad compared to the crappy PAL PS2 Classics" to "Yeah, screw it". The Framerate is plagued by Frame Pacing issues. It's been marked as 30 FPS but it is constantly "switching" between 25-30 FPS or something like that. The mission where you have to protect 8Ball can be tricky with this framerate. I just gave up on it and simply bought it in the Black Friday Deals on Xbox for, 23 Euros? Yeah, that's worth it and I think the games are playing pretty great with the new control layout. Really curious if this get's an FPS boost on the next Switch system, then I will gladly come back to that versions.
The rain doesn't even come close to the original. You don't see the rain hit the cars or ground, no reflections of the lights on the road, it's terrible. It's still nowhere near the quality of the original games.
They fixed that I just noticed that actually I was driving a black car on San Andreas and it started raining and I noticed the rain drops falling on the car
7:13 If you've ever seen company logos 30 years ago vs today, that's the same feeling I get looking at that screenshot. Not to speak of the incorrect spelling, but the clear lack of effort and passion in the new version compared to the old one. Even if they fixed the spelling, it won't fix that sterile and overly 'neat' feel that is so devoid of passion.
Regardless of budget. People seem to forget Grove Street Games (Wardrum Studios) made all of ports of the Rockstar titles on mobile devices. They made those 10 years prior and were still clueless then - changed how basic things worked from the get go and it wasn't even just simply because it worked better on touch controls. It was just straight up not needed to be changed - they messed it up then. Had a 2nd chance and messed it up again and even worse this time as it was a more public wide spread game - I don't blame Rockstar or whoever for removing them from the intro credits. They caused it themselves
Actually verify this last night while I couldn't sleep on my switch and it is so much better and since the last time I played on switch was around 2021 the performance is a lot more stable and it actually feels like I'm playing the PS2 version to a degree. I think it's wonderful
My opinion on the Thomas Williamson situation is simple- developers should know their limitations instead of trying to bite off more than they can chew... Also that guy needs to learn how to humble himself and stfu when it's those "100's of fixes" his team worked on was a result of problems created by his own incompetence...
if a publisher that had been funding subpar projects with me for over a decade writes me off our latest release so they can pretend like they weren't being incompetent with their own IPs... I'd be pissed too. That's not even mentioning the pushing back bug fixes part, which if actually true doesn't hype me for GTA6 even if RDR2 was a masterpiece.
Classic lighting also affects the weather effects a great deal. It restores the sandstorm in SA, storm effects, and high wind.
There's still some texture bugs and some glitches still present in these versions left to iron out, but VGD has done an excellent job fixing the games.
Yeah, the San Andreas military vehicles are still the wrong colour, rather than the Army tan the humvee like vehicle is bright green and the barracks army truck is red for some reason lol, not sure how the hell they missed that (still broken right now after update but you can get mods to fix it), but they did miss the VCPD SWAT van being made of glass lol, partially fixed allthough the VCPD SWAT van has some opaque windows that are broken.
enough time and they'll fix it
It's almost unimaginable a big company like Rockstar couldn't outsource these games to a good developer with all the money that they have. It's frankly unbelievable. Very very weird.
Profits I'm afraid
It takes 3 years to get the game to an acceptable state. The state of the games industry these days.
San Andreas does not feel right without Tom Petty's " Running Down a Dream", or NWA's" Express yourself". It's not the full game without the full soundtrack.😢
Edit: not to mention Rage Against the Machine's "Killing in the name of", among many others.
Or a custom radio option to restore the deleted songs
I finished GTA III 2 days ago and immediately started Vice City. The improvements are just amazing ... Especially Vice City looks amazing and perfectly captures the atmosphere of the original and further gives away these "Miami Vice '86" vibes ...
I don't feel bad for Grove Street games having their logo removed from the splash. I'd be pissed too if I had an iconic IP bungled so badly by some third party. They caused all kind of grief and had every opportunity to make it right, but I just don't think they were competent enough for a job of this scale. Dumping all the textures into an AI uprezzer and calling it a day isn't good enough. You can't tell me that no-one had the time to sanity check them after the process, especially the textures with text on them, or that the QA didn't notice the very glaring issues with them.
I don't mind the reduced performance, I enjoyed playing the GTA Trilogy on Switch. I still have the PS2 Classics version on PS4, so I'm more interested in playing on a handheld.
The classic lighting option is a huge improvement, the fog has restored the perceived scale and atmosphere of San Andreas.
Interestingly around the same time, the Metal Gear Solid Master Collection got a big update after a year of poor performance.
They may have 'fixed' the environment bugs and graphics, but they will never de-censor it.
This isn't 100% fixed.
I had to stop the video and just sit in my car, during my lunch, as I was stunned, thinking that it had been three years since the software came out.
Should be titled still broken but with better lighting. A company the size of rockstar should've put the resources into this update 3 weeks after the disastrous launch not 3 years.
Im kind of surprised you can’t understand why they kept the original lighting in the game MVG?
First off more options in the Settings menu is always better.
Secondly, again, why take something away, when it can just remain in the background?
The option to switch between Lighting is great, it reminds us how much different atmosphere can be when Artistic flare is added over modern lighting. It is a good reminder to keep in the game. I like having the option to show friends the difference between how modern games can lack atmosphere as opposed to early GTA titles.
6:55 Actually, it was laziness
I can understand having such a small initial budget for a niche game series from a tiny indie dev like Rockstar resulting in the original mess, but you'd think at least someone would have play tested it for issues prior to release. I feel like if it took an additional 3 years to complete, they should have held off on release.
I can kinda understand Rockstar removing grovestreet games from the opening. Rockstar has made a game that is so well known and loved. Grovestreet tarnished that badly.
exactly i dont get how people arent more mad at this they quite literally ruined rockstars rep so badly
I wish credits for patches was a thing so we can see who specifically is responsible for continued work on the game. Because if Grove Street Games is upset about that, why would they remove the credit at the beginning if they were the ones working on it?
It’s amazing how we are impressed these days when people actually do their job, even if it’s 3 years late!
For doing the bare minimum in three years, the ports are still bad at their core.
Great video! I'm happy to see work continuing to improve this release. However, until they include the omitted music from the 3 titles in this release I hardly consider it "Definitive". The music was such a big part of these games. Especially Vice City and San Andreas.
Rockstar needs to give these titles the love they need and bring back Billie Jean, Running with the Night, Rockit, Express Yourself, I Don't Give A F#$@ and Killing in the Name among others. Just ridiculous they couldn't pony up the cash for the music that really made these games special.
Well done MVG!
3 years has flown by. Remember when they got upset at their fans for expecting the usual high quality experience & cancelled the GTA 4 definitive edition after backlash
GTA 4 and red dead are already good on their own, didn't need a demaster
@@waffleson45 GTA 4 could use some technical fixes. You have to lock it to 60fps or you encounter all types of problems. The RDR1 port on PC is good.
@@waffleson45 not really the point I was making but that’s your opinion. I’d love a real modern day remaster for older rockstar games personally.
@@waffleson45 Not quite. GTA IV definitely needs some ironing out, the original PC release requires a multitude to patches to actually make it not lag on modern hardware.
I always wanted a remaster of the PS2 Scarface game...The original PC version was broken and unplayable on modern systems, and the Wii version runs at 30fps only. I would love to see a quick remaster of the game in this fashion.
Time to watch based programmer man
Fun fact: the GInput mod adds the ability to use a GTA4 style control scheme, which is nice. Including partial throttle with the triggers (this is due to the ps2 pressure sensitvity code still being in the game).
hello there mister project heartbeat game
No, GTA 4 style controls is part of GInput, not SilentPatch.
@@BDozer666 you're right, my bad
@@freebyte hello (I just realised I forgot to reply)
Great video, time for a little tech history lesson! At around the 3:40 mark you reference the fog found in the original PS2 version of the game. This is a common and huge misunderstanding. The "red fog" is framebuffer effects which are used for the timecycle of the game and are extremely demanding on the hardware, same way as Shadow of the Colossus uses its HDR rendering techniques, same way as MGS3 uses it for the skybox "glow", the water rendering and many other effects. Contrary to what many claim, it has absolutely nothing to do with draw distance, which itself is high on PS2. It's the LOD for faraway objects that's limited, which is completely understandable given the amount of stuff rendered.
The Original Xbox version was a huge downgrade as it is lacking these atmospheric effects, along with the time-based texturing on buildings, even the actual Sun is missing. In the PS2 version, all textures gradually change lighting based on the time of day and the Sun has powerful post-processing. Xbox is lacking these features completely, among other things, and is just an awful way to experience the game. Surely you'd think that with so many effects removed, the Xbox version would have run at 60 FPS? Except it doesn't. It was simply incapable of rendering such huge amounts of effects due to lackluster bandwidth -- only 6.4 GB/s compared to 48 GB/s VRAM bandwidth on PS2. Thanks to the superfast eDRAM used for VRAM on PS2 as a solution for VFX streaming via the Graphics Synthesizer. Meanwhile, Xbox had to use shaders which were very demanding and didn't provide good results with the DirectX 8.1 and bandwidth limitations. Hence the numerous downgrades seen in many multiplats, including Silent Hill 2, Timesplitters, MGS2, etc etc.
GSG did a lousy job.. if they didn't none of this would have happened..is what it is
The worst thing is that they did away with the ability to load your own songs! WTF?
I think I'll still play the originals.
3 years? I don’t even care anymore I paid full price for an incomplete game and already played through them all (reluctantly). I’ve already moved on and they won’t ever get the bad taste out of my mouth from that experience.
There's still nothing "definitive" about this compilation. Better lighting hardly fixes the hundreds or even thousands of other issues with these versions of the games. This is too little, too late. They don't deserve props for this. We need to stop accepting garbage like this. This is NOT the good ending, this is more like having to buy the ending as a separate dlc and it sucking.
I had such egg on my face when they released this trilogy and the lighting, the one thing I thought they knew to be so crucial to the atmosphere, was genericized. I had laughed at mods that tried to remake vice city in V and now nobody is laughing. But maybe now we're getting somewhere!
I still prefer playing the original ps2 version for some reason
Not sure the exact events that led to this, but hypothetically, if i was running a developing team that was given too little time to remaster a game, was released and hated on for sloppiness, and Rockstar then removes us from the credits for the updates - effectively removing any opportunity to redeem the company - I'd be PISSED.
Again, not sure if this actually happened, but it would suck if true
I don't know whether to feel pleased it finally got fixed to some degree, or disappointed that it took this long to do so...
they couldn't spare 50 people from the 1000s from the 10+ studios they have and handle it in house ?
Calling it the definitive edition when half the songs from the original games are missing is quiet rich
>in before muh 'licensing' is expensive
Bro, R* literally made billions out of GTA5.
@@MimonJesus67 and theyre spending it on gta 6 instead of a 20 year old game let go of those games let them work and spend money on new games instead of wasting it on 20 year old games so babies like u wont cry about music
@@aiIeri Idiotic zoomer comment. Rockstar definitively has the budget for both endeavours, they're not hurting for money. And the games deserve to be treated well, specially considering how seminal they are. Also when you're older, you will want the games that defined your generation to receive respect as well. Not that the games of your generation will leave any respectable legacy behind, other than a lesson on how not to be insanely woke derivative and exploitative, that is.
A 20 year old game that is being bought again. It should include what it did 20 years ago. New sales means new royalties. It doesn't make much sense to raise received royalties. When the old contract profits you nothing.
When this dropped I realized I didn't have the original games on my Steam account and rushed to purchase.