Loved the Working Class Exile series ♥️ perfect example to reference if you want to learn how to play more efficiently. There are so many teachable moments... I’m a player who has been grinding since open beta and every episode I learned at least something from BalorMage. Great perspective @itsyoji!
I'd argue that there are three or so levels of 'budget'/build cost. The first level would be 'minimum requirements for the build to work at all'. As an example, you can't have a mjolner build without a mjolner, you can't have a redemption sentry spectre build without redemption sentries, and you can't have a max block aegis build without... you guessed it, max block and aegis. You can definitely do something similar, like a spellcaster that you'll swap to mjolner when you can afford one, or using slave drivers until you can raise sentries, or simply not speccing much into block until you find a good shield, and dual wielding instead until that point. Pre-build versions can often start from nothing (or next to nothing) but the actual minimum The second level of budget would be when the build 'comes online'-that is, when it starts to *feel* good. Redemption sentries may be decently strong, but they won't ever feel amazing on a 4-link when you only have three of them. Getting a 5L +1 spectre chest is a relatively cheap (especially in harvest) upgrade, but *immensely* boosts their dps and feel. For a lot of builds, this is normally a hundred or so chaos to a few exalts over the minimum requirements. The last level of budget would be when the build goes from "This feels nice :)" to "This is *amazing*" and is usually another ten exalts, or more. Using the spectres as an example, this would be like going from a +1 max spectres 5L chest to +1 max spectres 6L with T1-2 life or ES, along with cluster jewels, and maybe even an awakened shield for necromantic aegis, or a 5/6/7L helm. And I guess there's always the hidden 4th level, where you slap a headhunter on it and call it a day.
This is usually how I structure my build video coverage. One update of this is how I leveled. One of I just hit t10 to 13 maps. And then a full guide with more high end gear. My RF mjolner 3 video build progression follows that one exactly.
i'd argue there's a level 0 build (aka transition), where you don't have the mendatory items, but play with a close enough tree and use maybe non optimal gear to collect enough currency to move towards what you want. for example, in most cases you can play self cast arc in a tabula or a 5 link to kickstart a mjolner build.
I think this video is VERY well put, then again, it's the ItsYoji standard. BUT, (butts are nice btw), I think that play-time is playing a HUGE factor in currency making which ultimately gates a lot of people away from high budget builds that they might want to play. It's like you put it Yoji, it's very important to differentiate a "high budget build" vs an "low budget end-game viable build". Someone with close to no skills, knowledge, efficiency etc etc would have a much easier time generating currency by the simple fact that the person is "available" on the market for extended amounts of time compared to someone only playing the game for a few hours here and there. A lot of people asked how I made my currency this league as an example, and I respond with "Oh well, I just profit craft, I've made plenty of guides showing how to" but it goes beyond that. Investing currency in to items/crafts that would then need to be sold to yield a profit or simply selling items that you've found is only truly viable by being available on the market. If you craft or find a big item and you're only online 2h a day people that might be interested in buying that can only spot you selling it for those 2h a day compared to someone being online for more hours. Obviously what I'm mainly talking about is making currency which is as common as receiving the question "whats the budget of the build?". But I firmly believe that people are having a hard time understanding the difference between a build being end game viable and being high budget. With that said, it's also crucial here to remember that the game is, in fact, a game. Making sure you actually enjoy playing the game is the most important detail!
Someone with no knowledge or efficiency could spend his entire day picking up rares to vendor. Someone like you could spend 2 hours a day playing and amass way more wealth than that person ever could, even if he played 24/7. I firmly believe people who struggle to amass wealth spend their time playing inefficiently.
@@thePhished I think that's correct to some degree but when will you learn if not during your hours of play. How did we learn? I firmly believe people are generally ineffective but I also believe that everyone who can and does invest more hours are in general in a better state. The game is extremely complex for very casual play if you dont already have the knowledge and experience.
I agree with what you said. One could say playtime is basically a more multiplier to how much you can achieve in PoE. If you have your baseline of skill, efficiency, knowledge and build and you apply it 1h a day versus 4h a day you will get roughly 4x as much out of it in the beginning. Then when you factor in what "being ahead of the curve" gives you early during a league and that higher content also gives more rewards. So the further you are, the more returns the game gives you for the content. Then of course it is not as linear. I think the selling issues is way smaller for people who struggle to even get sick items. To KNOW when they are actually holding a sick item and not vendor or underprice it is probably a bigger issue that is also harder to identify. I think there are quite a few people out there who think if they could simply play 10h a day they'd be set. But if you don't have the base values of knowledge, skill and effort, then your more multiplier doesn't even do much. Your base value sucks, to say it in PoE terms :) But getting the base set up does take time which is why me having played full time before and having played for so many years is a bit of a cheat code as I said. Goal of the ramble was mostly to prevent people from focusing on the wrong things to improve so when you actually take a week off work to no life poe at some point, you actually get where you hoped you'd get.
@@ItsYoji Aye indeed! I love the video, maybe we content creators should try to focus a bit more on this type of information as there are several topics where this is a common issue of people not understanding that they don't have the required knowledge or simply don't have the knowledge whereas the knowledge in a game as complex as PoE is such an important detail.
For all this reasons I think migrating to SSF was the best thing I ever did and most people should do. I've played trade for around7 years, and always had fun, but always felt kinda pressured and got to the point of just following things instead of creating things. Migrating to SSF, I was forced to learn new things, to get better at some stuff, to learn how to convert currency and all of that. I think that playing SSF gives you a whole new way to interact and play the game, because everything you do in SSF is just for you. You're not competing with trade, dealing with people, you're just slowly progressing and making upgrades and testing new stuff. I feel a lot of people get stuck in this semi-competitive mindset of "I see this streamer/friend doing 50 maps per minute and getting 500 exalted per hour, I can't get there, so I can't enjoy the game".
The only thing I feel pressured to do in trade leagues is sell things. Then again I get to buy things. I think for me the convenience beats the annoyance.
SSF definitely changes the game. it makes you interact with the game instead of viewing everything as a chaos per hour calculator, which in my opinion is an insult to the art of this game and all it has to offer.
Great video Yoji. We've all been in the "dude honestly just keep playing your character more and you'll get there" mode when awnsering these kind of questions. As usual though you'll awnser the question in a more approachable manner.
But the "Keep playing and you'll be able to make more currency" is true, as long as you do the proper research to understand the game. In my guild I'm one of the guys who "knows about the game" and always they come to me "asking for help". Help = do all the work for me. To be fair there is nearly no content in spanish and lot of them don't speak english, but the point here is they want everything SUPER easy.
Agreed, too many people expect to the build to be able to insta jump to t16 maps after act10 Kitava and then start rerolling endlessly because "this build is kinda weak", well no wonder if you're missing 20+ passives and several gem levels and had budget of 50c. Why do people expect a build to perform the same when it reaches to maps as it should after playing it for 2-3 months no idea. I see the same in comments under guides "you said 50c league starter 10 million damage you lied" well ofc the league starter gear is not the same as the 10 million damage gear there are weeks if not months of playing it in between.
This video is one of the best i've ever watched on this topic. I even would argue that game knowledge is bigger then all other points together. After almost 5 years of not playing i started again with delirium it was pretty much a new player not knowing anything besides the very basics. With corona and stuff I had e shit ton of time to play. I would say i played in average like 6-8h per day in lock down the whole delirium league. I put in way more "effort" then i do in this league, but stayed pretty poor the whole time (still i cleared all content besides uber atziri). This league i took all the knowlege i got from last league and made the same amount of currency i got last league in 1.5 weeks (around 70ex). I played only like 3-4h a day this time. With knowing how the diffrent league mechanics (blight, betrayal, incursions, delving ect.) work in combination with the knowledge about a decent amount of meta builds (I only scouted them on poe.ninja not even played them my selfe) I find it now very easy to achieve my goals. This being said, acquiring the knowledge (and im not an expert at any means) is fucking tedious since the game does a shitty job to explain things and you need to google every single piece of information from different sources and put them together your self almost all the time. The click baity stuff from most popular content creators helped me almost nothing, since i simply lacked, in some cases still do, the "base knowledge" (it's a lot) to put them in perspective and i spent hours with trying to replicate what they do and getting almost nothing out of it. I honestly think the advice to push your time in maps by not spending time in your hide out is poison for new players. Every hour you "wast" mapping without knowing how to get value out of the mechanics you encounter in them, would better be spent in your browser. The occasional ex that will drop from grinding map after map will never out weight maximizing the value you get out of the different mechanics for example a proper set up interrogation board or targeting the bioms in delve to get valuable fossils.
I myself seem to always struggle to maintain the currency while "mapping", like with how they say juicing your maps for better returns and all, but then I feel like I am always out of sextants/chisels and such on my t14-16's that I'm running, the league mechanics sometimes just need a really in depth video guide or written guide for me to understand and that usually takes a long time for content creators to make one that just clicks with me. :D And other league mechanics like harvest (selling crafts and such) its just so tedious having to use multiple platforms like the game, discord, websites, etc. D: but overall I am still trying to improve slowly :D And with builds sometimes its just hard to decide what is the next "best upgrade" to aim for really, specially if following guides they just list the optimal gear, but very few list like a progression of importance on the higher end things. :o
@@Rwargrumble With juicing the maps, i would say it's impossible to maintain your "juicing" currency, if you don't buy chisels and sextants. But this beeing said i don't think its worth to juice every map. I usually try to stack those things to make every single one more worth while. For example if the next map I run spawns conqueror packs, i go for a full juice t16, 20% quality, alva mission (gives the most extra monsters), 4 sextants, 4 scarabs or sacrifice fragments, map device enchant and sometimes also delirium orbs, in this league i also harvest only in those juiced maps (even more monsters). The idea behind it is that the more monster you can pack in a map, the more item quantity and quality pays off. And in "normal" maps the pool of valuable items that can drop are more limited, since there is no chance to drop influenced items. The other remaining sextant charges i try to run with elder or shaper guardian maps if i have some. The rest of the time i upgrade the maps mostly only by slaming an alch on it and using the other missions on them. It's hard to tell what's the next best upgrade in general. I would go and look up on poe.ninja what the high level players use and identify what are core items which all of them use, since those are mandatory those are the first you should grab. After that I personally prioritize the more defensive items. And then i simply go from cheapest to most expensive.
Nobody that actually plays PoE argues it has no currency. It has tons of currencies. It just doesn't have a baseline currency like gold, gil, zeny, coins or whatever.
@@Ashtarte3D I don't disagree, but will point out that there is a difference between PoE "currency" and money... all of PoE's currency is functional and in some way derives its value from its function. "True" money is not functional, but simply a token of exchange.
@@Olvenskol "True" money is just something that is widely accepted as a payment. You're talking about "fiat money", which is the money system that is generally used by governments across the world. PoE's system is "commodity money". PoE definitely has money, it just doesn't have gold which is the system that most RPGs use.
More over fellas, 95% of the actual money in the world is virtual, so when you thought it was stupid to exchange a piece of paper for complex machinery, now the price of said machinery is a promise you made to your bank, not you or your bank accountant have the physical money to buy a car, but as long as the bank doesn't get broken down, that promise will be kept by another person who has to pay the physical money he promised way back when
This is my favorite path of exile stream of consciousness video ever. I've already watched it twice and I will continue to send people to this video for a long time. I have people in my Discord constantly that worry so much about the tiniest upgrades and where their currency is coming from. I always tell them " just keep playing and spend less time in your hideout worried about your stuff ". Video guides have an interesting place, because they're so easily digestible and can be understood so quickly, but some people just really, really need the hand holding of a written guide. There's nothing wrong with that, but more than ever this league I've noticed that some people learn best from a short video guide that they can branch off of, and some people want to know literally every step of the way written down. Each content creator is going to hit differently with different people, and well that's totally normal and okay, it can be super frustrating at times when you read the comments either on UA-cam or in the forums. Anyway, absolute top-notch video
I actually prefer written guides for indepth information and min maxing of complex builds. Video guides are better for showcasing gameplay, can be entertainment and guide at the same time and you get an overview over a build much easier. I just don't enjoy writing guides nearly as much as I enjoy making videos. Glad you enjoyed the video btw 😊
For me, when it comes to the budget, it's all about how much you need until the build start to feel like what you would expect. For exemple, for alot of slam build, you need so little, you can probably make a slam build work just fine on a 4 link, other you builds you need a couple of exalts ( enchantments, unique) Evantually even builds that super cheap will need at least 5 exalts just to get that 6link and good high rolled items
That's a budget definition I can get behind. How much currency to make the core gameplay loop of the build feel decent enough. Of course this can be subjective but I think that's a pretty good approach.
@@ItsYoji It doesn't help if people put out guides, that use only 23/21 and awakened gems, alongside uniques like headhunter. If 1000 people try these builds maybe one of them will get all these items as well. the other 999 will probably struggle to make it work, which is why they feel the need to ask if your builds are even realistic for them.
To further the enjoyment of the game to those who struggle I think GGG should elaborate more on their tutorials. Having to scour the web for info about a game, that requires a ton of effort to even like playing a lot of the time, when you are in the position of a "noob", is what makes a lot of people quit rather than put in the extra time to learn about things and eventually start having fun. This mentality of "it's all out there, we don't have to put it in the game as a tutorial" to me is a major reason why people only play a few days/a week on leaguestart and quit as soon as they get bombarded with past league mechanics.
When I make a build or use a guide as a template, I first focus on acquiring the rares and uniques necessary to make it *function* correctly. Not to maximize damage, but simply for its mechanics to work properly. Once I can comfortably run white maps and low-tier yellow maps, I gather currency and slowly upgrade my build, like Yoji. Over the years, I've learned that in general, you can make a respectable amount of currency just by running difficult content if your build is strong. So I focus on making my builds stronger throughout the league. A lot of the time, I fund the bulk of my builds with the first exalt I find during the league. From my experiences playing with newer players, they often lack the knowledge to know which part of their build to invest in first and how much to invest to make it stronger. I have a friend that regularly contemplates spending an extra exalt to buy an item that'd give a like a 3% damage increase over similar options. Mind you, he has barely any currency to spend in the first place. Another big issue is that newer players tend to be drawn to builds purely due to the promise of ridiculous damage. I'm talking about the ones with inflated PoB numbers on the forums. When the core identity of the build that you're playing hinges on you being able to one-shot the Shaper, until you actually experience that, you feel like you're not really playing the game. This might seem contradictory to what I said in the first paragraph about strong builds, but when I make a build, the damage is secondary. I play the build because I like the unique way it makes various mechanics interact, or because I like the way it looks and feels. When you approach builds that way, as long as you can get it working, mapping feels fun, even before you become filthy rich.
7:15 currently listening to this video during smoko, been playing poe for about 3 weeks now, probably listen to about 3 hours of poe, build guides, map guides, currency guides etc. each day at work
To me playing 90 minutes a day is an exceptionally large amount of time played. I play the game for maybe 2 hours a week. That's less than a fifth the playtime of Balormage. I do agree with the main point of not needing currency to enjoy the game though. I've played the game since beta and I've never played it enough to have ever even seen the highest tier maps. But that's fine, making a build out of cobbled together stuff and seeing where I end up is fun already. I don't need to defeat Sirus or the Elder or even see places like the similacrum to enjoy the game. I will play the game little by little, end up at maybe around tier 7 maps by the time the league ends and start over again and be perfectly ahppy with that
@@kokorochin01 What? Are you required to spend a certain amount of time on something or else you're not allowed to have fun? How does that make any sense?
Good vid Yoji. I've observed something similar as well, when playing in trade. When I usually get to endgame on my first character I've already upgraded them to a point where it can handle the content. Starting from 0 of course. There are definitely rough patches when your gear isn't quite there or you struggle on certain aspects, but overcoming them will make the eventual upgrade feel so much more satisfying. Once I can buy the whole gear straight away (or a good level of gear at least), I usually get bored quite quickly. Much better to start at 0 (or only the absolutely essential items in some cases) and upgrade from there.
Nice one. The way I see, there is at least two factors to undertand why people ask for budget: PoE is complex, and complexity may either be engaging for some, or cryptic for others (like myself); or seeing other players doing stuff you can't do make you envy them and desire to get there too - or justify why you can't.
I do exactly what you mention in regards to learning as much as I can when not playing, as I have become the information trove for my friends who don't take the time to research. I feel I am slowly and surely getting better and better every league. I have been playing since the end of Synthesis league, and have learned over the leagues of how to get to farming T14-T16 maps for currency. I have yet to defeat Sirius, however that is one of my goals for this current league. I find I am getting more efficient at achieving certain goals within said league, as well as learning to become more effective at making currency. Take this league for example, I have little knowledge of how to craft items for myself at any level of where I would not be wasting currency, so as I learn the ins and outs of crafting I decided that I can make more currency just by farming and selling seeds. Since I fall into that exact window of available playtime I try to be as efficient as I can so I can maximize time spent, however, I do try to keep it fun that way I do not lose interest in playing the game if it were to feel more like a chore than a game to enjoy. I wanted end by saying thanks for making this video, it took me awhile to understand the difference between how others make currency i.e. streamers and individuals who have time on their side as opposed to casual players like myself and I feel this video with be able to help others learn that as well. I also appreciate you linking the Balormage vids where he did a 90 min streams, I am interested to see how he manages the time spent playing, and I feel I can learn even more from watching it. Thanks for the time you put into your vids, I enjoy and appreciate your content.
Crafting is hard to learn and even harder to master. If you say no to crafting, i'll recommend selling craftingitems in bulk. There is nothing worse for crafter to trade with 10 Peoples to get 10 Fossils for example. So if you sell 5 Fossils instead of 1, you can prob. sell the Fossils for more Currency. With Seeds even better. Run 20 or 40 Maps and sell than all of them at once. (Care with seeds, the itemlvl must be high enough)
Never knew this either. Typical GGG, provides two clear options with a description of outcome, third option is a tiny icon in another location with no description. Great user interface work. Thanks ItsYoji, you're a legend!
i do it your way, i don't think about how much money i need to save to do a build, i find a build that works as you play the game and gets stronger as you gain currency to keep upgrading, most builds other then the a must have item to make the build work, other items i just figure out on my own. Some people will make fun of me because i always follow builds though, i just don't have time energy to create a build myself, i play once every other or 3rd league and then only play 1 or 2 builds, so i just don't have knowledge to build completely from scratch. I enjoy game following a build from someone i trust and know will at least work enough to get me to experience most of the game and in the end improve it in my own ways. I think only time i'd be concerned with the currency required of to play a build are those few builds that we sometimes see in forums that literally is unplayable until you get certain unique that cost a fortune, those are the builds i completely avoid, i like builds i can experience have fun with on first character of a league, not one i have to play a farming build to earn 60 exalts with first before i switch to the expensive build, and i'm guessing that's what people are afraid of? Like is a build playable from the beginning. Also keep in mind newbies who are new to POE and are simply not going to have knowledge to make as much currency as you for example, you may end up with 50 exalts due to your understanding of the game towards end of mapping where a complete new will be ecstatic to have 5 exalts at the same point of the game. So that's an issue as well, and you can't really teach all the intricacies of how to play the game in every build, you gotta make some assumptions that people know how to play rest of game or will figure it out with other resources.
Great Vid! I played this game a few leagues years ago and only ever made it to Uber Elder once (Very casual gamer and always played game like HCSSF). I came back 2-3 yrs later into Heist as a Dad. I get to play around 5-8hrs per week and I can tell you through my own frustrations and issues what I learned in order to enjoy this very overwhelming game. First....SSF...just forget about it unless you will change your mindset and enjoy the very slow and small results. HC...you will die because you need to go grab your child or your prgression in gears are slow but you really want to fight that T16 guardian. FOLLOW A GUIDE (Properly), which is low ish budget but can scale (there are loads out there this isn't rocket science). Get 50 life and some resists on all gear to cap resists and this should take you to red maps. Farm farm farm, learn learn learn, enjoy the process (DO CHAOS RECIPE FROM STORY EVEN) and you will gain chaos easily before you know it you have 100c. Invest all of it into your build and vwala you can do all maps.
Hey Yoji I haven’t played the game for 3 months now just got back and watched your vid. I haven’t full watched it yet but I cannot after more with the “ backwards “ opinion. If you have currency , even it is your last exalt orb, if you think it is worth for an upgrade, use it. You will make more currency while progressing deeper and deeper. Even sometimes you look back and realize hey I should not have spent that exalt on this jewel or that gear, you lose nothing by progressing.
If you make a meaningful upgrade with those exalts spent, then yes. I have seen people make lots of small upgrades burning currency and time in the process that could have been saved and used to farm up a more meaningful upgrade.
i am revisiting POE content for the up comming 3.19 patch and this is still true today... for me what made my life ez was looking at speed running techniques, these speedrunning guys makes there life ez by looking for the right affixes on blue gear at league start, one affix can change the game... Havoc got a great vid on that and tytykiller also, Ventura, Zizaran. don't look at the end gear look at how they run the acts and you will find that they never go back in town (town is lava meme) and deal whit gear on the fly, they progress whit sub-optimal gear they can craft or afford.
After playing POE for over a year now, i feel like knowledge is probably the most challenging hurdle to overcome because learning how to boost your character can be a challenge. There is many vendor recipes to look up and knowing what to pick up with the loot filter, I personally haven't made it too end game but was very close to beating the guardians.
Every league i got better. First league i hit T10 Maps. Last league i Hit T16 and this league i killed sirius the first time ever. Let's see how far i get this league. The game is all about learning how to play efficient. How to craft cheap and what mods/gems are best for your build.
@@TheRuediger1111 I am the same way, each league is getting easier. This league I got to T10 maps with ease but now I'm having some difficulty beating the conquerors and few red maps T12. I'm currently playing pyroclast mines. are you familiar with mines?
@@wanderingtrader1147 never played mines. As far that i know, you play 2 main skills. One for map clearing and the traps against bosses. A friend of mine played ball lightning and a mine last league and made Sirius, Elder and Shaper with his build. Which gear do you use? Pastbin would be nice, so maybe i see a lowcost improvement.
For me the holy trinity has always been efficiency= run the story mode and dont kill more mobs than needed and have a tight enough loot filter to keep you running instead of collecting things you dont need. Target gameplay= use all the league mechanics in the game to obtain items, crafts and levels you need. Investing in your gameplay= dont be scared to use your currency to improve your maps, the 1-3 chaos you use to roll a map will usually pay itself back in xp/time and items/currency.
I have one single build in which i managed to get really far, and I couldn't agree more. There are tons of ways of making currency, and tons of ways of making your character achieve end game strenght... But I do mostly the ineficient stuff so its quite hard to get to the finish line xD
For years i struggled to efficiently farm endgame.I followed other player builds to the point and it still it wasnt enough.Than i realised how the gear you have makes even the same build different from any other.It depends on how you build based on what you find on the road to making currency by farming,trading etc.No half baked build will manage that even with expensive gear.If you trade or drop a high life roll rare with res scale dps on tree for example.In reverse if you have a great unique to build upon solidify your ehp or defs in the tree or anyway you can.Its a thin line of balancing between choices.Can you be a glass cannon by dodging all the time?Some can.Do you want to build a tanky tree and patch dps little by little?A slow but steady approach.In general poedb is a nice roadmap for what mods to look for and it helps to have a strategy or goal when building.Lastly dont rush,probably you are not a streamer,you are not going to score first in the ladder,so chill and enjoy the game.
As an utter noob (i play since Sindicate, but only recently finally managed to down Elder and shaper (not even uber elder)), I'd say i first fell into the trap of thinking that i need to be able to buy the full build as well since it usually works that way in many Mmorpg and the like. But i found that it does indeed boil down to what you said but including some luck with drops. As example, last league i didn't quite get up to Sirus but i did run a good bunch of tier 16 maps. No exalts at all, barely any chaos and hardly any alchemy-orbs. My clear spead and -rate was pretty high. Whereas this league (Managed to kill Sirus, Shaper and Elder! yay!) i'm playing a slower build and i often leave a few packs left on the map because they're just so far off. I got a bunch of Exalts and tons of chaos (Alchemy orbs are still an issue) With about the same playing time. So, playstyle was even worse, time same, skill same, effort same, knwoledge roughly same, i got a vastly different output in currency. So, i'd advice people to take your video with a grain of salt.
For me, efficiency is a fun killer most of the time. That's not to say I don't try to be efficient in some ways but overall, having fun is the most important thing. I gave up on the "trek into the salt mines to get enough money to buy better stuff so the salt mines are easier" play style. SSF made the game fun again. Now I play and get as far as I can and when the game stops giving me upgrades I go play something else.
I don't usually make a second character in a league until I've finished the endgame on my starter. I end up finding ways to make currency along the way.
Gotta say i think most people think you can only have fun while having currency - I though i can say it's kinda "more" fun to have a lot of it and be able to afford whatever you want, whenever you want - some people should go play SSF for a league. Didn't think it would do so much but i kinda played SSF in Harvest even though i'm in trade league and im daring to go back to buying stuff all the time. I had fun gearing different characters and i usually reroll few times a league, but i do what i'm feeling like cause thats what the game is FOR - Having fun, playing whatcha wanna play. Not everyone needs to play the top .2% OP Build (lookin at Herald/aurastacker) but maybe they sure want, but i have to say even though it was a breeze, there was no challenge in that gameplay. I like the leaguestart environment, having near nothing, getting on through maps sometimes a bit slower but you're happy to find that helmet with 90life + 20 tri-res or something. Play the game and get currency as a proof of doing well, and dont play the Game just to make currency and feel bad if you can't. Just my two cents.
you lucky dawg, my kid still does not leave me alone on the playground :D. Was watching alge aquarium video from green aqua, and the guy said the best thing. If you have alge first thing you need to do is not to blame the fish/plants/water or the seller, you need to put some effort in maintaining that ecosystem because mother nature always comes :). Same like here, Chris is not to blame always, you need to step up your game via those 4 points that you mentioned. but those 4 points can kinda balance, but the only thing you have to have 10/10 is fun, and than on that balance other stuff, find some fun content try to get as efficient as possible and know what to sell and what you need from gear or gems or passives, if you don't know you can take a look at some1s guide and start with that until you find your own way. Stay sane exile, so you don't get to be the next endgame boss :D
This is one of the best videos I've seen about POE lately - maybe the best. Although our subscribers probably overlap a lot, I'm definitely recommending it to mine. A lot of practical advice to any casual player that aspires to be a powergamer.
This is a systemic issue with the game in general because a vast majority of the player-base just dont actually know how the game works. You have to remember that a huge percentage of people just look for a guild guide then do that and aside from the leveling process the game in its entirety is just about farming currency to buy items. This is why so few people actually know how to craft or scale a character because instead of trying to actually make a character and play the game they have just turned the game into speed running maps to farm currency to buy more gear to speed farm more maps. When most people relegate the game to just currency farming instead of learning how to make a flask, gem, or piece of gear it segments them from the core part of the game which is crafting to build up your character, it also removes the understanding of how stats, gear, gems interact with their character because they are just getting a pastebin of what someone else did with no investment from themselves. I used to hate poe when I was just farming currency to buy that next upgrade. The second I started playing SSF and had to teach myself how to craft and upgrade my character myself instead of hoping for that next exalt drop so I could buy someone elses knowledge and investment I fell in love with the game. The depth and scope of the game when you actually have to take advantage of all of the things that are in the game is amazing and anyone he is just playing the game to farm currency is just really missing out on the actual poe experience.
Luckily this is, almost entirely, fixed with the introduction of harvest league because it now requires massive effort NOT to learn crafting. If GGG can implement harvest mechanics in a way that they stand out above all other previous leagues I think it'll be a massive advantage for players such as the ones you describe that don't try crafting themselves. Guides will also start talking about different ways to get budget gear set up using harvest which introduces these build-playing people to the crafting system aswell. TL;DR harvest was a really fucking good idea.
To use the out of ten scale Yoji showed I'd say these are my stats: Playtime 7, Skill 7, Effort 4, Knowledge 8. I can be a bit of a lazy bitch sometimes and don't care about using a dump tab because I'm kind of OCD about sorting between maps. I don't sell anything I deem to cheap (this varies based on point in league) for the time to deal with annoying traders. But I know how to start a character up, get it up to low red maps and what content I want to start farming on a given build. I'm by no means a filthy rich streamer tier but I routinely make 100ex on average during a league. Main thing I'd recommend is people learn an easy to pickup starter they are willing to stick with until it starts churning out money or learn to roll with the punches on one that may be a harder start.
As being a starter in this game, really have a struggle on the "knowledge" point. Managed to "realize" what ascention is when I made it to lvl 65. And much more things of this sort(failed a huge amount of Syndicate and Temple missions simply because I didn't understand what was the goal). Is there any resource or something that I can read/view to get the "basics"? I do visit poe.wiki alot to understand this and that, but still feel that I'm missing a huge deal of the game.
I think what helps most (helped me most) is to just watch some streamers (like on twitch) or their youtube videos. Most of them explain game mechanics, crafting, progression and are generally very helpful. It really helped me to see someone play the build I wanted to play from start to red maps, to get an idea about what to expect and what to look out for. Zizaran, TarkeCat, Mathil, ThisIsBadger and many more give very insightful perspectives into the game.
The BalorMage series does the INVERSE IMO, to what you think. He played a build that required only a few cluster jewels really to function, and it was probably the second strongest build in the history of the game for clear and he STILL took almost a month to get it to a reasonably complete state with his knowledge of the game. That means you've gotta basically quadruple it for a new player. And when you look at it like that, a mediocre player, with sub-standard knowledge, and a non-meta build will take longer than the entire league to finish, without Harvest in the game. What streamers get wrong, and what you do also --Even on a working-class schedule, is that you have 10s of thousands of hours of experience with mobs types, layouts, boss design, mechanics, etc that allow you to progress in a period of a few sessions what will take the average 7hr A10 Kitava player an ice-age to finish. That knowledge is the key. And what makes people grow further out of touch with their audience because they can't remember what it was like not knowing these things and can't rationalize why someone else can't know what they know.
??? You begin your comment stating Working Class Exile does not prove my point, then go ahead reciting basically the whole video. Yes, knowledge is the key as you said not time. That was the point. I even mention that knowledge needs time to develope and call it the crux of the matter. I think we might actually agree mostly :D
Efficiency is what most people miss. I tried to start this league with a friend whos never played and nearly teared mt hair out. The amount of time we spent in town and in between maps was torture.
Totally with this. Normally its get to maps in w/e trash I can find. Once on maps spend 1-2 chaos trading on each slot to get max resists and some extra life/es From there I might jump to a 5link if I find one cheap otherwise its saving for a reasonable 6l. This should get you to red tier maps on almost any build out there. Finally its filling in other uniques and buying cluster jewles/abyss jewels and fine tuning. Almost all currency before red tier maps is made from chaos formula.
My benchmark for "build budget" is "T16 deathless 5min full clear". Usually like 10ex with bad mechanics/full defensive investment, very rarely 5 (3.11 spider guardian, prenerf zombies).
How much currency do I need to make the build that you showcase in this video? It looks really cool, but I am quite poor. :( Can I still make it if I dont have many orbs?
Past few leagues i played it's true, i don't bother with trying to make currency or even making much until end game. in fact several last builds i played i didn't even trade a single time until mapping and like maybe mid-tier mapping before i started trading and my builds were already doing ok, but then only get much stronger once i then start engaging in trade (i honestly hate trading though with a passion in POE, it's single most frustrating thing that keeps me skipping 2-3 leagues before coming back, i really wish there was a way to put items into a stall or something for people to come and pick then up from rather then you having to plan certain times/days to sell, or leave your delve/lab/maps to constantly trade!!! not to mention when you do need to buy certain things needing to msg 12 people to get a response)
I think what a lot of casual players lack is in the effort category. If you only have 1-2 hours to play a day, make the most of that time. The amount of downtime people have between maps or afk in in hideout fiddling in PoB is astonishing
Fellow dad gamer here. There are a lot of builds that doesn't require much currency to get to end game, but you can throw currency at it to do maps faster or kill bosses faster etc... There are some builds that are not league starters and require and upfront investment for them to even work. For instance, elemental conversion blade vortex assassin is big this league but requires a number of fairly expensive items to work like an explodey chest. Are people really trying to ask if it's a league starter build, and if not how much minimum currency do you need to get started?
I think I know my problem quite well. I have overcome most of the hurdles for a PoE player, getting to maps, starting mapping, getting to know most of the mechanics. But now, when I come across a hurdle, I most often just lack the grit to push over it. For me, it where two things this league. First, I barely got map drops from Tier 11 onward, which made my conquerer progression harder, which in turn made getting my upgrades harder, since I really needed influence bases and couldn't buy them, due to SSF. So that was meh. The second hurdle was the afformentioned upgrades would have been necessary to have a better experience in T12-13 maps. Dying one out of 5 maps isn't that fun for me. Instead, I made my own build, played it to Tier 6 maps, got frustrated since it wasn't as powerful and expected and switched to other games. But maybe I will pick up later this league again, I feel SSF was a good decision for me, since it feels like the league doesn't progress without (kind of like "run away" from me) So I might get back to the builds and push through it.
I feel you man, I had the same issue, because I had the mindset "I got this wall from using 50chaos on this build, maybe if I use 50 chaos on another build it will perform better". But since than I switched to SSF and I've been just playing the game and trying shit builds with shit uniques and trying my best to push than deeper in the atlas. SSF takes off some "pressure" of the game imo
Hey Yoji, if your ever bored and wanna have some fun with I feel is a really underused buffed this league item, try the black cane. The phantasmal mightnwas buffed a lot this update. I'm still trying to see what viable skill that scales off of physical spell damage and can be crazily buffed with this cane. So far blade vortex with fire conversion seems to work realllly nice. My level 50 with no gear just the cane and a 4l chest using blade vortex does 8-12k DPS. (Oh and princess sabre in offhand) I'm sure this thing can be hella scaled and you prob have the knowledge I'm looking for to do it. Up for a fun completely non meta test?
Fellow boomer gamer here, and this video is exactly me. Virtually every character in every league goes like this....Kill Kitava....make my first series of gear upgrades to cap resistances and get as much life as possible. Begin mapping.....make a little currency, then get my second round of upgrades on gear. By this time, I am in late yellow/early red maps. This is where I hit the wall. The next series of gear upgrades for my character far outweigh the currency I am making and stops me dead in my tracks. From my knowledge, the currency generating items are in the higher tier red maps, I'm just don't have much luck surviving there. What is sad is that I do have a lot of time to put into the game. I know I am missing something, as I hear about other newer players rolling in exalts, getting raw exalt drops every day.....I have played Harvest since the beginning and have seen 2 raw exalt drops, and I probably put around 25-30 hours of game time in each week. Yes, the gods of random chance have always hated me in every game I play. I eventually get frustrated and quit the league. But I keep trying each league, hoping it will be different....but it isn't.
You start making silly money once you are able to sustain T14+ (assuming you get there fast, ofc, not 2 weeks after league start) just by selling extra maps, elder/shaper fragments, blight maps etc. You should not need a 3rd round of item upgrades to switch from low red maps to high red maps if you are playing a caster (or any build where damage scales with gem levels instead of weapon dps). There are plenty of builds that can do t15s-t16s with absolute garbage build - tabula and barely capped resistances. Also - you can get some pretty crazy savings if you figure out what items you want, set up live searches for them and snipe them when they appear at a very low price, rather than doing a "buying" round every 12hrs or so (at which point you have to pay market price)
plenty of money to be made in lower tier maps as well tbh, though it revolves more around harvest crafting jewels and other generally low ilvl requirements.
Maybe in the future POB will have a section for putting in your time/skill/effort/knowledge matrix, and the ability to accurately calculate build budget from that :D "Okay this guy is lazy, he's going on trade site rather than his garden for sure! Budget go UP!"
The main reason for this problem is most of poe content you can find is end game build with many exalts investment or very specific high priced setup that is unaffordable as a first char. It is very hard to find true build guid that works from scratch until end game with upgrade and step up. Most of time if you want this kind of experience you have to make your own build and if you can do that you probably don't need this kind of guide. Path of exile is in fact a hard game that require a lot of time no mater what. Even if it is not play time, it's building time, trading time, wiki time, forum time. You need a crazy amount of knowledge and game experience to be able to make a build that is viable from scratch to end game on your own.
"It is very hard to find true build guid that works from scratch until end game with upgrade and step up." You must be looking in wrong places then, imo this is the problem when people look for builds on youtube and reddit which is mostly "build showcases" i.e. end min maxed state of a build. If you watch let's say Mathil stream he always streams levelling his character so you can see how he makes it. He crafts a lot of gear, but he also has to deal with restrictions of fresh league start on first char in each league. Or you can watch Zizaran he nearly always plays SSF HC so he can only make builds that function during levelling and can work with SSF gear. You can also search official POE forums and while many builds are lazy "showcases" i.e. POB + end gear + video, many others are EXTREMELY detailed and explain nuances like gear crafting and progressing from league starter to more expensive setup. Sadly I feel current generation of people lost the ability to focus on a multi page written text so they often go for videos and short, concise "build showcases" that don't explain anything. One guide I always recommend is Darkxell's ED Contagion Trickster, it's a very exhaustive guide for old school staple skill that is viable so far in every league and has multiple gear level / budget breakdowns.
As someone who has played the game since beta, but always at a very casual level. I don't have the time or the attention span to play characters for long enough to even reach tier 10 maps before the league ends(I boot up the game for maybe 2/3 maps every few days). I enjoy the game just fine making a character with some premise, upgrading my character slowly and seeing how far I get into maps this time. Last time I ever played with any serious consistency the hardest boss in the game was normal Atziri. I've never even seen Sirus or the Elder before but I think that's fine. Worrying about getting the money for a build just seems like the wrong way to play. Many random cobbled together builds are fun to play even if they don't 1 click kill even rares in tier 4 maps. Some leagues do fit what I need better than others. Delilrium was awful for me because I didn't have the time to make a character that could face delirium without dying to random explosion mechanics and ended up just avoiding the mechanics entirely. Harvest is perfect for me and I've been enjoying it (even though I've barely reached tier 7 maps this league so far)
3:20 it's because there is a difference between 10k hour player knowing exactly what to do and how everything works and what items are worth and then there is the new player who only knows what is good for the build they are playing. Which means you end up losing a lot of currency just because you have no clue what stats to look for on other pieces of gear also spending 3 hours efficiently is way better than 6 hours having no clue what to do like, I'll open a POE stream and the screen is filled with mobs at 5 frames per second and 10chaos div cards are flying around everywhere
For the people who see the streamers with big dollars I think its really important to know how the leagues behave in general. You can make an absolutely disgusting amount of money early in the league on any budget. Day 1 when exalts are only 40c for example you should be able to make 1-4 ex per hour based on how much you focus on chaos rec. But if you have only 90 minutes to play a day you won't get to maps probably until week 2. At that point the window for doing that is closed completely. Understanding the money making windows is important to making the big bucks. The issue must get worse with harvest in particular. Since there are less mobs on the map you just generally see less money / farming resources. Newer player's who came in during the loot explosion of metamorph or delirium must be really feeling the pain. Those were both leagues were it was easy to make money without a specific strategy.
i average about 1-2 hour a day and still make about 1-2 mirrors every league. if you cant make currency you're doing something very wrong. it's fairly easy to make money after getting into red maps, and extremely easy to make currency afterwards. just grab an easy to gear build and start playing. one league i made around 2200 ex just playing 3-5 hours a day. was insane. i didnt flip, or do anything weird, i just played the game. i think the problem people have is they reroll builds too much. if youre constantly getting to endgame and stopping and making a new character, you wont ever make any currency. you gotta make a character and stick with that to actually start to make some bank. all the rich ppl i know in poe basically only ever play 1-2 builds a league. so pick your build and get grinding, exile!
Maybe I am misremembering but wasn't it also you that gave the advice to keep playing your league start character and/or any character longer to make sure you actually progress into that harder endgame content? I def remember several leagues where I was more concerned with trying more builds and how many characters can I make in one league and never really progressed any of them far enough to get to those higher tier maps. I made a conscious effort to get my first character to the 90+ range after that advice and had much better success in high end gearing and mapping that league.
Two things that are not taken into account here : Luck and No trade... Trading is not things that i will do to gain upgrades cause killing mobs for upgrades is the game, not currency and / or gear flipping... Then comes luck, and i only hope that GGG will cut some of that with deterministic crafting... Other than that, i'm pretty much on par with what you say :)
I'm sure you have to have gotten this before, but you sound EXACTLY like the guy from the slingshot channel. When you start a build, I'm gonna need you to say "Let me show you it's features" XD
I did this Reddit post 3 days ago: www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/hz6v2h/mini_project_from_a_casual_player_irl_with_poe/ I have a full-time job and all that IRL stuff (I live with my wife, we work apart from each other throughout the day, I have a home-office job, so we spend some quality time when we are together again) and while I have some hours free after work, I usually would do something else instead of playing PoE actively, so my active playtime let's say is like 1.5 ~ 2 h per day while at weekends tends to be more. So, I decided to start a project for 10 days with a 2-hour sample with whatever IRL stuff may happen in the middle, to show that if you have at least 1 hour of active playtime on your day and you put the effort into it with just MAPPING (whatever the number of maps you can run within 1 hour) and interacting with the side content (this is the side content auto-generated in the map, not using Zana mods from the map device), using just a simple strategy like "alc-and-go" maps, you can make currency. That was the day zero, so it didn't count. What I mean with this is that the time does matter when you put the skill and effort to improve yourself, then you'll see the results, in the end, you'll manage to generate currency. You have to pick something that is easy to understand, easy to follow, and can do almost all the content without spending 3 hours per day looking for upgrades. All of this knowing that the time you spend playing your "easy-to-go" build gives you enough margin to invest currency in it, making more room to generate more currency and so on. I've been playing PoE since early 2018 and my knowledge has been growing since then, always playing some hours per day. And I went through all the processes of learning, watching video guides, copying builds, and so on up to this point that I can manage my own builds without any help unless I need to know something that I don't know or figure mechanics that I've never played before. Is just that, no matter how many hours you have per day, if you manage to focus on PoE while enjoying it, PLAYING AT YOUR OWN PACE, there's no way you will not make currency and improve your character. PoE is not easy but is not impossible to learn. I saw people making absurds amounts of currency while stating the only knowledge they have is just in market stuff, while having near to no knowledge about the game and its mechanics, it's all about knowing your weaknesses and strengths and putting the effort to improve the former while minimizing the latter.
I do exactly as you say Itsyoji, it's after that that i can't make currency or so slow i'm burning out, i spend 20 ex on my character it does T16 without dieing and can do boss but not deathless but still can kill them and then i play 10H a day and win what 2-4 exalt a day and then i think, i need to start crafting to min max my character but i never have enough money to do that because it's so slow to make money.
I think you just pointed out the major balancing issue with PoE... your formula should look like 4(knowledge) + 3(skill) + 2(effort) + 1(playtime) = currency. So a player with a ton of knowledge can get by with relatively little effort or playtime. A well-balanced game would have someone with enough playtime and little knowledge be as profitable as the all-knowing 90min/day working class exile. Boy I miss the days where Savestates were not a thing.
Ok but pretty much all builds can clear red maps on a 5L unless it's something really super dumb like glacial hammer. Point to me a decent build where giving up 30% damage (one gem link) means suddenly you can't clear any red maps. It's not a useful criteria to decide if the build is good, because pretty much all builds clear this criteria. Starter build vs non-starter is more about the required uniques cost, required cluster jewel mods, and how many influenced mods it needs. Look at instacker wander. By my proposed criteria, this is definitely a build that cannot be a starter build.
Well you can start as a normal wander and work into int stacking as you map, gameplay will feel the same, just the damage will be lower until you get the wand and int gear set up more and more.
Yeah, I definitely lack knowledge and time. I find white and yellow maps to be hard because I'm using random build that I put together myself. Still have no idea how to deal with physical and elemental damage reflect and unfortunately, the build does both physical and elemental damage. 🤣 I want to play other games as well, so I can't really play PoE by itself so it's just going to take a really long time to build up that knowledge. 🙂 Not complaining though, it takes me around 20 hours+ to just finish Act X, and that part is still enjoyable.
It's pretty normal that some builds simply cannot do ele and/or phys reflect so don't worry about that. Oh and I agree that learning PoE can be a very enjoyable process :)
I afk in hideout, take multiple minutes between maps to mentally prepare, waych NetFlix in other tab, eat food, chat in twitch chat, read wiki in other tab, etc... basically waste so much time; yet somehow I make tons of currency.. I have no idea how. 🤨🤔
Hey Yoji, while I agree with all you said, you might have not emphasize enough on the skill/effort/knowledge of selling/trading. Selling/Trading efficiently goes a long way into making currency. Ofc it doesn't apply to ssf players but I think thoses were not the first targeted by this vid. Some not so obvious examples: organizing and sharing specific curr with mates (one sells all essences, one sells all div cards), having a niche market you know and profit from (ex: crafting and selling specific flasks), running some undervalued unique/blight maps, trading splinters so it doesn't rot in stash, selling maps (probably in bulk coz pain-in-the-ass), ... insert-your-own-and-fun-way-to-make-money.
My number one advice: Stay away from the drama on reddit. It will poison and distort your perception of the game. Something is not true just because a lot of people say it is. Learn by doing instead, and take pointers from more positive and reliable sources.
That is the problem with some players. They always have this urge to race against something. Play the game at your own pace and you'll enjoy it more than looking for builds and wanting to achieve it as soon as possible. It often stems from looking up into streamers and they are in awe how they put up guides for league starters quick. Once the stress kicked in a game, maybe try to rest for few days and go back in the game. The game is not going anywhere.
Um.. I hate trade, so when I’m asking how much a build cost, I’m asking if it will be viable with the self found crap gear I have. Three hours on the train? Seems like knowledge = time. And effort? Yoji, You make it sound like a second job. I actually haven’t played for two years. I only have ~90 min/week, not really enough to make the game fun. But still love the Yoji content.
yea at only 90 mins a week youre definately better off playing in standard than in a league. while you can be successful at poe leagues with limited playtime, you really cant get anywhere in only 18 hours of playtime per league. poe does have a minimum time input to be successful. id definately recommend sticking with standard. i always recommend that if you dont have at least 100 hours to put into a league, play standard. you'll get alot further there and still have alot of fun.
Guides are a dangerous crutch imo as is participating in trade too early. Players too easily fall into the trap of not actually understanding what they are doing. When I first started I played primarily a self-imposed version of SSF, where I would only trade after I hit a noticeable plateau in my progression. I started in Synth and I took a Lacerate glad to early yellow before I started trading. In legion I took a Tornado-shot to mid yellow. Blight I took toxic rain to early reds. Metamorph I took Fire Wildstrike to elder but not uber elder. Finally In Delerium I took Fire Arrow to Sirius (What an awful decision, burning arrow in delerium was painful). Now that I've taken my Earthshatter to Sirius, I'm pretty confident I can take almost any skill to Sirius sans guide and without trading. What I'm trying to say is SSF for as long as your patience will allow because that is what will force you to learn the fastest IMO and if you can get red maps without trading you will literally be swimming in exalt by the time you reach there. I whole heartedly also agree with Yoji's assessment that you need to read read read.
Following a guide is a very useful thing to show someone what the game has to offer, so I'd always recommend that for any new player, but after that you should definitely explore the game and learn about mechanics.
@@Failzz8 FIrst of all I'd like to clarify that when I say guides I mean build guides specifically. Second, I just feel like the reason why players feel so frustrated about making currency is BECAUSE they read build guides. Even when guides are tiered, guides rarely if EVER bother to actually bother to detail what actually happen in between and even when guides are successfully followed they rarely if ever develop effort, knowledge, or sometimes even skill. I suspect that the vast majority of the people who yoji talk about in this video read build guides make an attempt, fail miserably, and misattribute their failure to a lack of currency and or time. No matter how much currency tiers you put on a build guide it is very meaningless if you can't beat campaign kitava because you dont craft res into your gear. I'm just saying build guides crush the souls of newbies.
Me: Playtime: 5/10 (1-2 hours per day) Skill: 3/10 ( suck at boss or crowd mob) Effort: 7/10 Knowledge: 5/10 ( just copy other people build even some time don't really understand the mechanic of that build)
Ad a casual player and newby (I started in metamorph) i have fede time to play but i like PoE over the rest couse in every league i try to learn something new,that said i have to admit this league for me was harsh being crafting the hardest part of poe.Secondly due to the lack of time sometime a casual like me comes to the conclusion that to play that funny build the only way is to buy in game currency for irl money and for me is a nay.i have seen the working class balor guide but now that guide gas been nerfed that even Balor doesnt play it.This game is not beginner or casual friendly even becouse the new philosophy of devs pushes away from loot explosions which was the last hope for those players who have few time to play.All your theory revolves around haveing knowledge that equals time to spend into the game,but the fun in a game should be accessable (with different layers sure) by all without being forced to buy exalts for Real money
Thats very nice video Agree on aloot of points gona send it to person who always complains im lucky and i have way mroe currency :D (ofc becouse its false his luck is just bad but that may help him anyway) :D
"Naturally progressing" for you (or that 90min a day guy), someone with years and multiple leagues under your belt is going to be different for others. The mechanics in this game, most good, some meh, are very disjoined and not at all intuitive. Thats what makes it hard for newer players to actually get a foodhold and leads them to asking your questions like that. This is a PoE flaw for the most part. The upfront learning needed is way more than most people want to put time into. I feel like GGG needs to take a league where they revamp all these disjointed mechanics (they dont seem that way to you or me, but to new players the definitly are) and streamlike it all into a coheasive system that has more intuitive nature. If they never do this, then they will see less gamer retention then they could have.
I can kill sirus, I can do all maps T16 and usually I did once a... Week? I can kill elder and shaper (not Uber yet) but can't get $. Clearly lack of knowledge :( ideas? So you say you get to endgame to get $. What do you do to get it in endgame???
Once you got all watchstones put in, I usually start putting 4 sextants on each map and put in the scarabs and atziri fragments I have. Put Zana, Jun, Einhar, Alva or Niko on maps whenever you can. When Zana offers Shaper or Elder Guardians, always run them. Run the Elders and Shapers you get and sell the Watcher's Eyes and Dying Sun's you might get. Sirus and Conquerors have a higher chance to drop loot at Awakening Level 8 too. You can run or sell uber elder fragments, depending on if you are comfortable with the fight too. All map bosses can also drop Guardian Maps in high tiers from Awakening Bonus now and Zana can offer Cortex and other high reward maps. You also get more Delirium once you add more to your maps and eventually you might have a full Simulacrum too. Endgame has a ton of rewards hiding behind most content tbh. Timeless Emblems, Breach stones upgraded with betrayal etc you can run or sell for quite a bit.
Yoji, just watching this video a little late. I will have to say though that the game can be very stingy to some accounts compared to others. No idea why. I will use myself and my friend as reference. I've been playing since beta. I have almost 4K hours on steam playing this game. My friend has about 1K hours. We both play a lot. Every league I get serious in I get characters past level 90. Currently just got my character to level 90 in 3.12 Heist and plan to go further still. My friend has about 4 or 5 level 70-80 characters instead in the same time frame. He has actually played less than me this league we have compared our time played. So what is the difference? He has had 5 exalt drops already, a bunch more currency, and lots of 6 links. He does his own fusing from time to time and typically takes 300-700 fusings to make a 6 link and then sells it. Does about 10 of those per league after finding some exalts. He typically ends up with 20-40 exalts worth of gear per league easy. I've tried 6 linking my own gear. One league it took me 4K fusings to make a single 6 link. I was that stubborn in trying. That was the only league I ever made a 6 link. I basically got the "Well-Connected" achievement from Steam 6 years AFTER beta on Jan 2019. I can't tell you how many tens of thousands of fusings I've tried over those years of playing and never made a 6 link. I've only done it once and that was in league 3.5 with Betrayal league. On the other hand, I have found 1 exalt. Only 1. With more magic find on my character, running harder maps as I am in T14 maps already and he hasnt even progressed past T3. I barely get to scavange enough chaos orbs through the chaos recipe system to make just enough to have a super budget version of any build. By the end of any given league I have about 3-5 exalts worth of currency and gear. I could chalk it up to just random RNG luck. But I know that isn't the case. We've been comparing this since beta. EVERY LEAGUE. It plays out the exact same. I can reach delve 700+ and he never goes beyond delve 100. He still gets better drops from delve. I can beat Sirius, Shaper, Elder, or whatever. He never has beaten any end game boss. Doesn't matter. I can literally run 10 times the amount of maps he does in the same time frame with more MF and more mods on each map. Again it doesn't matter. He always has better drops and more currency. Has been this way SINCE BETA. I have to pick super budget friendly builds because I can't get to do end game content if I don't. I've tried otherwise. If I go for a build that takes 5+ exalts worth of gear to complete, I am not able to complete that build. Just doesn't happen. So watching this video is basically like watching a smug slap in the face. Some people get drops in this game, and some people don't. I know my luck in this game is absolutely terrible. I put in a ton of hours into this game and have since 2013. I need to basically pick cheap builds every league if I want to even attempt end game bosses. Which is hard because the "meta" builds are typically the ones that can do end game bosses the easiest but since they are meta their costs to make are far to difficult for me to attempt. When I start seeing builds where a single item is 5+ exalts, I basically have to scratch that build. The chances of me making that much currency before the league ends is practically zero even if I played every minute of uptime during the league. So I have to go to the slightly off meta builds that can still do bosses but are actually cheap enough for me to get through the league.
It sounds like you're a bit too focused on big drops and forgetting the small stuff. I'm the opposite, I progressed from a 2.5 ex budged on my first non-starter character to a 20-25 ex build without really noticing since I barely got any good loot, maybe only about 2-3 ex, I've gotten most of my investment from just mapping and a bit of heist. That probably sounds smug as well so sorry about that, and I get what you mean, these kind of videos usually just tell you to run maps and you'll get a ton of currency, without telling you exactly how you'll make a lot of currency without for example exalted orb drops. Truth is that you have to look for all the small things you can make money from, for example I've sold Alterations, Chromatics, Jewelers and Divines for about 8 ex this league. Selling map fragments for example is another very consistent way to make currency, but you have to be on the lookout or else you'll barely get any. That's how I always makes sure I got a decent budget every league, everyone has their preferred method based on their knowledge. It does sound like there's something you're overlooking or doing wrong, it's hard to tell without going in-depth but it could be that you're not efficient when running maps or you've chosen a poor starter build, if it's a starter at all. Personally I started with blazing salvo totems and found out I was starting to need too much gear to make it work that I switched to Divine Ire totems which require barely any gear to start mapping. Swapping to something easier to scale made my mapping speed go up instantly and thus I made more currency over all just like that and let me start on my second character who require a lot more gear to work, but is able to the all of the content. Just these choices affect how much currency I've made, if I stuck with my original starter I would spend a lot more time invested in it, thus ending up with less currency overall.
@@BeyondBlizziC Not at all. Again, I have played characters up to level 99. I have killed level 8 Sirius in the past, and a few of the other big bosses. That doesn't mean I've ever had more than 8-10ex worth of wealth by the end of a league. Most of which is from grinding ever day 4-8 hours a day for the entire league. The vast majority of what I earn currency in the game with is the CC recipe. I don't run bots. I play mostly solo, but do use the online poe trade websites. I am lucky to find more than 1 exalt drop in a league. That is what I have found so far. I have a level 94 trickster in heist and only have found a single exalt drop. No 6 links, and no items worth more than 2-4 chaos outside a tabula rasa. I saved up enough chaos to buy 1600 fusing to make a 6link. Failed all 1600. That is typical for me every league. I actually had a friend that didn't believe me give me 6K fusings to blow through. Never made a 6 link in 6000 fusing during the Delve league as a test. I usually beat everything on a 5 link. This league i am lucky that Cospri's are going for cheap and was able to buy a 6 link for my main character for 50 chaos. As I said, if I can't find cheap builds then I can't even finish the atlas no matter how much I grind. This league Hexblast tricker is cheap and easy. I am working through T16 maps at the moment. My dps for AoE and clearing is insane with my cheap setup, but single target bosses I suck on. Playing with PoB and reading the forum it is going to be expensive to get the character good enough to do end game bosses. I doubt I will no matter how much effort I put in to the character. Unless somehow the game starts raining currency which I doubt. I am putting into perspective that there is sometimes no amount of effort one can put in to get certain builds done in a given leagues time frame sometimes. Again, I am someone with over 7000 hours into the game by my Steam counter. It is basically an average of 3 hours a day every day for the last 7 years. I still enjoy the game or I wouldn't have put in those hours. The difference is I know my luck in the game is far worse than the average from what I've seen. I don't know why, but it is. The point being that this video is a bit of a slap in the face to someone like me. I look for cheap powerful builds so I can do end game content without feeling frustrated. Not every league has been like that. There are some leagues where there really isnt any good cheap budget friendly builds that do well. Those leagues suck for me. I get stuck on yellow maps for 2-3 months and then the league ends. Do you know how boring it is to literally run the same map 30-40 times a day every day for 2 months with no progress? Been there. It sucks.
@@checkyoursixgaming You sounds unlucky, alright. However, you still don't need the big drops to make bank, and not the chaos recipe either, although it's good for getting the ball rolling. Are you taking advantage of all the ways you're guaranteed to make currency? I'm talking about things like betrayal where the proper set up can earn you roughly 120c from It That Fled alone each time you run the research. Or simply leveling gems in your unused/secondary weapon slots, right now getting 6 Vaal Haste gems to level 20 will earn you 90c, and as already said, shaper/elder influenced maps drops fragments. Alva temples can give you some nice profits as well but you kinda have to use discord for it to be safe, so personally I avoid her. Can't really comment on your build since Hexblast is new and kinda weird, personally I would've gone with something more safe, like ED/Contagion, which is kinda dull, but it's a standard starter build for a reason, or a slam build, which is lacking in speed, but easily gets tons of damage and survivability. It doesn't sound like your build is the problem tho, other than maybe being a bit difficult to scale. You do juice your maps, right? It's ridiculously easy to sustain this league due to heist basically giving away chisels, alchs, scouring and vaal orb, and scarabs here and there.
@@BeyondBlizziC Would be nice if It That Fled shows up on any given league. Even then, it isn't always easy to get It That Fled to research. Luckily I have it setup for that now for my character in Heist. Trust me, I know all the tricks to trying to gamble on making currency. I always level up gems and try to corrupt them to sell. In this league I have tried 52 gems this way. Only 1 hasn't bricked on me thus far. One that I am using. Everything else went down to lower level or reduced quality. I also juice my maps and use everything I can. Again, it doesn't matter if the RNG gods don't want to drop anything for you. Not even the little stuff. I get maybe 1 chaos orb drop per 5 map runs without the recipe. Majority of my heist drops are rares. I think they put in a fix for that recently, but i haven't gone back to check in the past week since the fix was put in. I was one of those unlucky few that were getting junk rares only from Heist for which there was literally a suppose patch to fix that. Only thing I got lucky on so far for a drop is a Primordial Might this league which is going for a decent price right now at 130-140c. Which was the reason I decided to make a summoner build using that :)
@@checkyoursixgaming Yeah, getting It That Fled to research can be a pain sometimes. About the other stuff, I'm not talking about gambling to get currency, I only mentioned things that guarantee a profit, hence why I specifically said Vaal Haste since at level 20 it goes for about 15c even if it's bricked, so that's 90c from a 6c investment. And like I said, you can make a decent amount of currency from just selling excess crafting currency, so no gamble there either, just takes a while to build up a sufficient amount to sell. Personally I never really gamble with anything until I get my character rolling into red maps so that even if I end up with a big loss I can still just run more maps as usual. Funny that you found a primordial might and started a summoner, I did exactly the same thing and it's been a breeze since, I'm doing Stone Golems and haven't had any issues apart from being a bit squishy until I got my Brass Dome. It's an expensive build, but what's nice is that there's lots of smaller upgrades so it takes a long time until you hit a wall.
Character played in the video:
ua-cam.com/video/FE4gfbjnTG4/v-deo.html
Balormage's Working Class Exile:
ua-cam.com/video/fUUZTl8GCUk/v-deo.html
Loved the Working Class Exile series ♥️ perfect example to reference if you want to learn how to play more efficiently. There are so many teachable moments... I’m a player who has been grinding since open beta and every episode I learned at least something from BalorMage. Great perspective @itsyoji!
I'd argue that there are three or so levels of 'budget'/build cost. The first level would be 'minimum requirements for the build to work at all'. As an example, you can't have a mjolner build without a mjolner, you can't have a redemption sentry spectre build without redemption sentries, and you can't have a max block aegis build without... you guessed it, max block and aegis. You can definitely do something similar, like a spellcaster that you'll swap to mjolner when you can afford one, or using slave drivers until you can raise sentries, or simply not speccing much into block until you find a good shield, and dual wielding instead until that point. Pre-build versions can often start from nothing (or next to nothing) but the actual minimum
The second level of budget would be when the build 'comes online'-that is, when it starts to *feel* good. Redemption sentries may be decently strong, but they won't ever feel amazing on a 4-link when you only have three of them. Getting a 5L +1 spectre chest is a relatively cheap (especially in harvest) upgrade, but *immensely* boosts their dps and feel. For a lot of builds, this is normally a hundred or so chaos to a few exalts over the minimum requirements.
The last level of budget would be when the build goes from "This feels nice :)" to "This is *amazing*" and is usually another ten exalts, or more. Using the spectres as an example, this would be like going from a +1 max spectres 5L chest to +1 max spectres 6L with T1-2 life or ES, along with cluster jewels, and maybe even an awakened shield for necromantic aegis, or a 5/6/7L helm.
And I guess there's always the hidden 4th level, where you slap a headhunter on it and call it a day.
Or the 5th level where your mirroring stuff.
@@sharkexpert12 That's min/maxing :)
Your Dashie icon is perfect for a comment explaining something, lmao.
This is usually how I structure my build video coverage. One update of this is how I leveled. One of I just hit t10 to 13 maps. And then a full guide with more high end gear. My RF mjolner 3 video build progression follows that one exactly.
i'd argue there's a level 0 build (aka transition), where you don't have the mendatory items, but play with a close enough tree and use maybe non optimal gear to collect enough currency to move towards what you want.
for example, in most cases you can play self cast arc in a tabula or a 5 link to kickstart a mjolner build.
I think this video is VERY well put, then again, it's the ItsYoji standard.
BUT, (butts are nice btw), I think that play-time is playing a HUGE factor in currency making which ultimately gates a lot of people away from high budget builds that they might want to play. It's like you put it Yoji, it's very important to differentiate a "high budget build" vs an "low budget end-game viable build". Someone with close to no skills, knowledge, efficiency etc etc would have a much easier time generating currency by the simple fact that the person is "available" on the market for extended amounts of time compared to someone only playing the game for a few hours here and there. A lot of people asked how I made my currency this league as an example, and I respond with "Oh well, I just profit craft, I've made plenty of guides showing how to" but it goes beyond that. Investing currency in to items/crafts that would then need to be sold to yield a profit or simply selling items that you've found is only truly viable by being available on the market. If you craft or find a big item and you're only online 2h a day people that might be interested in buying that can only spot you selling it for those 2h a day compared to someone being online for more hours.
Obviously what I'm mainly talking about is making currency which is as common as receiving the question "whats the budget of the build?". But I firmly believe that people are having a hard time understanding the difference between a build being end game viable and being high budget.
With that said, it's also crucial here to remember that the game is, in fact, a game. Making sure you actually enjoy playing the game is the most important detail!
Someone with no knowledge or efficiency could spend his entire day picking up rares to vendor. Someone like you could spend 2 hours a day playing and amass way more wealth than that person ever could, even if he played 24/7. I firmly believe people who struggle to amass wealth spend their time playing inefficiently.
@@thePhished I think that's correct to some degree but when will you learn if not during your hours of play. How did we learn?
I firmly believe people are generally ineffective but I also believe that everyone who can and does invest more hours are in general in a better state. The game is extremely complex for very casual play if you dont already have the knowledge and experience.
I agree with what you said. One could say playtime is basically a more multiplier to how much you can achieve in PoE. If you have your baseline of skill, efficiency, knowledge and build and you apply it 1h a day versus 4h a day you will get roughly 4x as much out of it in the beginning.
Then when you factor in what "being ahead of the curve" gives you early during a league and that higher content also gives more rewards. So the further you are, the more returns the game gives you for the content. Then of course it is not as linear.
I think the selling issues is way smaller for people who struggle to even get sick items. To KNOW when they are actually holding a sick item and not vendor or underprice it is probably a bigger issue that is also harder to identify.
I think there are quite a few people out there who think if they could simply play 10h a day they'd be set. But if you don't have the base values of knowledge, skill and effort, then your more multiplier doesn't even do much. Your base value sucks, to say it in PoE terms :)
But getting the base set up does take time which is why me having played full time before and having played for so many years is a bit of a cheat code as I said.
Goal of the ramble was mostly to prevent people from focusing on the wrong things to improve so when you actually take a week off work to no life poe at some point, you actually get where you hoped you'd get.
@@ItsYoji Aye indeed!
I love the video, maybe we content creators should try to focus a bit more on this type of information as there are several topics where this is a common issue of people not understanding that they don't have the required knowledge or simply don't have the knowledge whereas the knowledge in a game as complex as PoE is such an important detail.
@@FartSmucker I hope not.
For all this reasons I think migrating to SSF was the best thing I ever did and most people should do. I've played trade for around7 years, and always had fun, but always felt kinda pressured and got to the point of just following things instead of creating things. Migrating to SSF, I was forced to learn new things, to get better at some stuff, to learn how to convert currency and all of that. I think that playing SSF gives you a whole new way to interact and play the game, because everything you do in SSF is just for you. You're not competing with trade, dealing with people, you're just slowly progressing and making upgrades and testing new stuff. I feel a lot of people get stuck in this semi-competitive mindset of "I see this streamer/friend doing 50 maps per minute and getting 500 exalted per hour, I can't get there, so I can't enjoy the game".
The only thing I feel pressured to do in trade leagues is sell things. Then again I get to buy things. I think for me the convenience beats the annoyance.
SSF definitely changes the game. it makes you interact with the game instead of viewing everything as a chaos per hour calculator, which in my opinion is an insult to the art of this game and all it has to offer.
Great video Yoji. We've all been in the "dude honestly just keep playing your character more and you'll get there" mode when awnsering these kind of questions. As usual though you'll awnser the question in a more approachable manner.
But the "Keep playing and you'll be able to make more currency" is true, as long as you do the proper research to understand the game. In my guild I'm one of the guys who "knows about the game" and always they come to me "asking for help". Help = do all the work for me. To be fair there is nearly no content in spanish and lot of them don't speak english, but the point here is they want everything SUPER easy.
Ty so much :)
It helps when you cut down 35 minutes of rambling into the 9 minutes that actually made some sense :P
Agreed, too many people expect to the build to be able to insta jump to t16 maps after act10 Kitava and then start rerolling endlessly because "this build is kinda weak", well no wonder if you're missing 20+ passives and several gem levels and had budget of 50c. Why do people expect a build to perform the same when it reaches to maps as it should after playing it for 2-3 months no idea. I see the same in comments under guides "you said 50c league starter 10 million damage you lied" well ofc the league starter gear is not the same as the 10 million damage gear there are weeks if not months of playing it in between.
This is top quality content, right here.
This video is one of the best i've ever watched on this topic. I even would argue that game knowledge is bigger then all other points together.
After almost 5 years of not playing i started again with delirium it was pretty much a new player not knowing anything besides the very basics. With corona and stuff I had e shit ton of time to play. I would say i played in average like 6-8h per day in lock down the whole delirium league. I put in way more "effort" then i do in this league, but stayed pretty poor the whole time (still i cleared all content besides uber atziri). This league i took all the knowlege i got from last league and made the same amount of currency i got last league in 1.5 weeks (around 70ex). I played only like 3-4h a day this time. With knowing how the diffrent league mechanics (blight, betrayal, incursions, delving ect.) work in combination with the knowledge about a decent amount of meta builds (I only scouted them on poe.ninja not even played them my selfe) I find it now very easy to achieve my goals.
This being said, acquiring the knowledge (and im not an expert at any means) is fucking tedious since the game does a shitty job to explain things and you need to google every single piece of information from different sources and put them together your self almost all the time. The click baity stuff from most popular content creators helped me almost nothing, since i simply lacked, in some cases still do, the "base knowledge" (it's a lot) to put them in perspective and i spent hours with trying to replicate what they do and getting almost nothing out of it.
I honestly think the advice to push your time in maps by not spending time in your hide out is poison for new players. Every hour you "wast" mapping without knowing how to get value out of the mechanics you encounter in them, would better be spent in your browser. The occasional ex that will drop from grinding map after map will never out weight maximizing the value you get out of the different mechanics for example a proper set up interrogation board or targeting the bioms in delve to get valuable fossils.
I myself seem to always struggle to maintain the currency while "mapping", like with how they say juicing your maps for better returns and all, but then I feel like I am always out of sextants/chisels and such on my t14-16's that I'm running, the league mechanics sometimes just need a really in depth video guide or written guide for me to understand and that usually takes a long time for content creators to make one that just clicks with me. :D And other league mechanics like harvest (selling crafts and such) its just so tedious having to use multiple platforms like the game, discord, websites, etc. D: but overall I am still trying to improve slowly :D
And with builds sometimes its just hard to decide what is the next "best upgrade" to aim for really, specially if following guides they just list the optimal gear, but very few list like a progression of importance on the higher end things. :o
@@Rwargrumble With juicing the maps, i would say it's impossible to maintain your "juicing" currency, if you don't buy chisels and sextants. But this beeing said i don't think its worth to juice every map. I usually try to stack those things to make every single one more worth while. For example if the next map I run spawns conqueror packs, i go for a full juice t16, 20% quality, alva mission (gives the most extra monsters), 4 sextants, 4 scarabs or sacrifice fragments, map device enchant and sometimes also delirium orbs, in this league i also harvest only in those juiced maps (even more monsters).
The idea behind it is that the more monster you can pack in a map, the more item quantity and quality pays off. And in "normal" maps the pool of valuable items that can drop are more limited, since there is no chance to drop influenced items.
The other remaining sextant charges i try to run with elder or shaper guardian maps if i have some.
The rest of the time i upgrade the maps mostly only by slaming an alch on it and using the other missions on them.
It's hard to tell what's the next best upgrade in general. I would go and look up on poe.ninja what the high level players use and identify what are core items which all of them use, since those are mandatory those are the first you should grab. After that I personally prioritize the more defensive items. And then i simply go from cheapest to most expensive.
PoE: the game with no money where everyone worries about getting wealthy
Nobody that actually plays PoE argues it has no currency. It has tons of currencies. It just doesn't have a baseline currency like gold, gil, zeny, coins or whatever.
@@Ashtarte3D I don't disagree, but will point out that there is a difference between PoE "currency" and money... all of PoE's currency is functional and in some way derives its value from its function. "True" money is not functional, but simply a token of exchange.
@@Olvenskol "True" money is just something that is widely accepted as a payment. You're talking about "fiat money", which is the money system that is generally used by governments across the world. PoE's system is "commodity money". PoE definitely has money, it just doesn't have gold which is the system that most RPGs use.
True Exile experience
More over fellas, 95% of the actual money in the world is virtual, so when you thought it was stupid to exchange a piece of paper for complex machinery, now the price of said machinery is a promise you made to your bank, not you or your bank accountant have the physical money to buy a car, but as long as the bank doesn't get broken down, that promise will be kept by another person who has to pay the physical money he promised way back when
This is my favorite path of exile stream of consciousness video ever. I've already watched it twice and I will continue to send people to this video for a long time.
I have people in my Discord constantly that worry so much about the tiniest upgrades and where their currency is coming from. I always tell them " just keep playing and spend less time in your hideout worried about your stuff ".
Video guides have an interesting place, because they're so easily digestible and can be understood so quickly, but some people just really, really need the hand holding of a written guide. There's nothing wrong with that, but more than ever this league I've noticed that some people learn best from a short video guide that they can branch off of, and some people want to know literally every step of the way written down. Each content creator is going to hit differently with different people, and well that's totally normal and okay, it can be super frustrating at times when you read the comments either on UA-cam or in the forums.
Anyway, absolute top-notch video
I actually prefer written guides for indepth information and min maxing of complex builds. Video guides are better for showcasing gameplay, can be entertainment and guide at the same time and you get an overview over a build much easier. I just don't enjoy writing guides nearly as much as I enjoy making videos.
Glad you enjoyed the video btw 😊
For me, when it comes to the budget, it's all about how much you need until the build start to feel like what you would expect.
For exemple, for alot of slam build, you need so little, you can probably make a slam build work just fine on a 4 link, other you builds you need a couple of exalts ( enchantments, unique)
Evantually even builds that super cheap will need at least 5 exalts just to get that 6link and good high rolled items
That's a budget definition I can get behind. How much currency to make the core gameplay loop of the build feel decent enough. Of course this can be subjective but I think that's a pretty good approach.
@@ItsYoji It doesn't help if people put out guides, that use only 23/21 and awakened gems, alongside uniques like headhunter. If 1000 people try these builds maybe one of them will get all these items as well. the other 999 will probably struggle to make it work, which is why they feel the need to ask if your builds are even realistic for them.
To further the enjoyment of the game to those who struggle I think GGG should elaborate more on their tutorials.
Having to scour the web for info about a game, that requires a ton of effort to even like playing a lot of the time, when you are in the position of a "noob",
is what makes a lot of people quit rather than put in the extra time to learn about things and eventually start having fun.
This mentality of "it's all out there, we don't have to put it in the game as a tutorial" to me is a major reason why people only play a few days/a week on
leaguestart and quit as soon as they get bombarded with past league mechanics.
agreed. Shit could be better explained in game , make it its own league...the learning mechanics , tech info, data sheets, league...
When I make a build or use a guide as a template, I first focus on acquiring the rares and uniques necessary to make it *function* correctly. Not to maximize damage, but simply for its mechanics to work properly. Once I can comfortably run white maps and low-tier yellow maps, I gather currency and slowly upgrade my build, like Yoji. Over the years, I've learned that in general, you can make a respectable amount of currency just by running difficult content if your build is strong. So I focus on making my builds stronger throughout the league. A lot of the time, I fund the bulk of my builds with the first exalt I find during the league.
From my experiences playing with newer players, they often lack the knowledge to know which part of their build to invest in first and how much to invest to make it stronger. I have a friend that regularly contemplates spending an extra exalt to buy an item that'd give a like a 3% damage increase over similar options. Mind you, he has barely any currency to spend in the first place.
Another big issue is that newer players tend to be drawn to builds purely due to the promise of ridiculous damage. I'm talking about the ones with inflated PoB numbers on the forums. When the core identity of the build that you're playing hinges on you being able to one-shot the Shaper, until you actually experience that, you feel like you're not really playing the game. This might seem contradictory to what I said in the first paragraph about strong builds, but when I make a build, the damage is secondary. I play the build because I like the unique way it makes various mechanics interact, or because I like the way it looks and feels. When you approach builds that way, as long as you can get it working, mapping feels fun, even before you become filthy rich.
7:15 currently listening to this video during smoko, been playing poe for about 3 weeks now, probably listen to about 3 hours of poe, build guides, map guides, currency guides etc. each day at work
To me playing 90 minutes a day is an exceptionally large amount of time played. I play the game for maybe 2 hours a week. That's less than a fifth the playtime of Balormage. I do agree with the main point of not needing currency to enjoy the game though. I've played the game since beta and I've never played it enough to have ever even seen the highest tier maps. But that's fine, making a build out of cobbled together stuff and seeing where I end up is fun already.
I don't need to defeat Sirus or the Elder or even see places like the similacrum to enjoy the game. I will play the game little by little, end up at maybe around tier 7 maps by the time the league ends and start over again and be perfectly ahppy with that
@Auhuhhuu he plays, as stated, 2 hours per week. If you can finish the league in 26 hours I would love to see you make a video about that.
Why play a game for only 2 hours/week ? I'd rather not play. If you enjoy something, you play alot. If you don't, don't play.
@@kokorochin01 What? Are you required to spend a certain amount of time on something or else you're not allowed to have fun? How does that make any sense?
@@lowkey_Ioki Why would you only spend 2 hours/week on something, if you find it fun ? Makes no sense to me really, none
@@kokorochin01 There are people who simply do not have the time. People working two jobs to make ends meet, for example.
Good vid Yoji. I've observed something similar as well, when playing in trade. When I usually get to endgame on my first character I've already upgraded them to a point where it can handle the content. Starting from 0 of course.
There are definitely rough patches when your gear isn't quite there or you struggle on certain aspects, but overcoming them will make the eventual upgrade feel so much more satisfying. Once I can buy the whole gear straight away (or a good level of gear at least), I usually get bored quite quickly. Much better to start at 0 (or only the absolutely essential items in some cases) and upgrade from there.
Nice one. The way I see, there is at least two factors to undertand why people ask for budget: PoE is complex, and complexity may either be engaging for some, or cryptic for others (like myself); or seeing other players doing stuff you can't do make you envy them and desire to get there too - or justify why you can't.
I do exactly what you mention in regards to learning as much as I can when not playing, as I have become the information trove for my friends who don't take the time to research. I feel I am slowly and surely getting better and better every league. I have been playing since the end of Synthesis league, and have learned over the leagues of how to get to farming T14-T16 maps for currency. I have yet to defeat Sirius, however that is one of my goals for this current league. I find I am getting more efficient at achieving certain goals within said league, as well as learning to become more effective at making currency. Take this league for example, I have little knowledge of how to craft items for myself at any level of where I would not be wasting currency, so as I learn the ins and outs of crafting I decided that I can make more currency just by farming and selling seeds. Since I fall into that exact window of available playtime I try to be as efficient as I can so I can maximize time spent, however, I do try to keep it fun that way I do not lose interest in playing the game if it were to feel more like a chore than a game to enjoy. I wanted end by saying thanks for making this video, it took me awhile to understand the difference between how others make currency i.e. streamers and individuals who have time on their side as opposed to casual players like myself and I feel this video with be able to help others learn that as well. I also appreciate you linking the Balormage vids where he did a 90 min streams, I am interested to see how he manages the time spent playing, and I feel I can learn even more from watching it. Thanks for the time you put into your vids, I enjoy and appreciate your content.
Crafting is hard to learn and even harder to master. If you say no to crafting, i'll recommend selling craftingitems in bulk. There is nothing worse for crafter to trade with 10 Peoples to get 10 Fossils for example. So if you sell 5 Fossils instead of 1, you can prob. sell the Fossils for more Currency. With Seeds even better. Run 20 or 40 Maps and sell than all of them at once. (Care with seeds, the itemlvl must be high enough)
Really enjoy your content. Always super helpful.
This is a damn fine video. I know my flaws when playing PoE but I feel this video somehow helped me visualise them!
I just learned that you can release the target without modifying your investigation :o
Yeah. If all outcomes are bad for your plans you can set them free. You still get exp and loot but the time won't progress for prisoner Intel gain.
Never knew this either. Typical GGG, provides two clear options with a description of outcome, third option is a tiny icon in another location with no description. Great user interface work. Thanks ItsYoji, you're a legend!
We'll put as always Yoji! I believe the last 1:30 or so if the discussion is exactly what Chris Wilson means when he says "We own players souls" lmao.
nice broo! thank you for the advice, excelent videos
i do it your way, i don't think about how much money i need to save to do a build, i find a build that works as you play the game and gets stronger as you gain currency to keep upgrading, most builds other then the a must have item to make the build work, other items i just figure out on my own. Some people will make fun of me because i always follow builds though, i just don't have time energy to create a build myself, i play once every other or 3rd league and then only play 1 or 2 builds, so i just don't have knowledge to build completely from scratch. I enjoy game following a build from someone i trust and know will at least work enough to get me to experience most of the game and in the end improve it in my own ways. I think only time i'd be concerned with the currency required of to play a build are those few builds that we sometimes see in forums that literally is unplayable until you get certain unique that cost a fortune, those are the builds i completely avoid, i like builds i can experience have fun with on first character of a league, not one i have to play a farming build to earn 60 exalts with first before i switch to the expensive build, and i'm guessing that's what people are afraid of? Like is a build playable from the beginning. Also keep in mind newbies who are new to POE and are simply not going to have knowledge to make as much currency as you for example, you may end up with 50 exalts due to your understanding of the game towards end of mapping where a complete new will be ecstatic to have 5 exalts at the same point of the game. So that's an issue as well, and you can't really teach all the intricacies of how to play the game in every build, you gotta make some assumptions that people know how to play rest of game or will figure it out with other resources.
Great Vid! I played this game a few leagues years ago and only ever made it to Uber Elder once (Very casual gamer and always played game like HCSSF). I came back 2-3 yrs later into Heist as a Dad. I get to play around 5-8hrs per week and I can tell you through my own frustrations and issues what I learned in order to enjoy this very overwhelming game. First....SSF...just forget about it unless you will change your mindset and enjoy the very slow and small results. HC...you will die because you need to go grab your child or your prgression in gears are slow but you really want to fight that T16 guardian. FOLLOW A GUIDE (Properly), which is low ish budget but can scale (there are loads out there this isn't rocket science). Get 50 life and some resists on all gear to cap resists and this should take you to red maps. Farm farm farm, learn learn learn, enjoy the process (DO CHAOS RECIPE FROM STORY EVEN) and you will gain chaos easily before you know it you have 100c. Invest all of it into your build and vwala you can do all maps.
Hey Yoji I haven’t played the game for 3 months now just got back and watched your vid.
I haven’t full watched it yet but I cannot after more with the “ backwards “ opinion.
If you have currency , even it is your last exalt orb, if you think it is worth for an upgrade, use it.
You will make more currency while progressing deeper and deeper. Even sometimes you look back and realize hey I should not have spent that exalt on this jewel or that gear, you lose nothing by progressing.
If you make a meaningful upgrade with those exalts spent, then yes.
I have seen people make lots of small upgrades burning currency and time in the process that could have been saved and used to farm up a more meaningful upgrade.
Well made and awesome video yoji!
i am revisiting POE content for the up comming 3.19 patch and this is still true today... for me what made my life ez was looking at speed running techniques, these speedrunning guys makes there life ez by looking for the right affixes on blue gear at league start, one affix can change the game... Havoc got a great vid on that and tytykiller also, Ventura, Zizaran. don't look at the end gear look at how they run the acts and you will find that they never go back in town (town is lava meme) and deal whit gear on the fly, they progress whit sub-optimal gear they can craft or afford.
Thanks for sharing your kind & useful information. Stay healthy and have a great day. 🤗
After playing POE for over a year now, i feel like knowledge is probably the most challenging hurdle to overcome because learning how to boost your character can be a challenge. There is many vendor recipes to look up and knowing what to pick up with the loot filter, I personally haven't made it too end game but was very close to beating the guardians.
Every league i got better. First league i hit T10 Maps. Last league i Hit T16 and this league i killed sirius the first time ever. Let's see how far i get this league. The game is all about learning how to play efficient. How to craft cheap and what mods/gems are best for your build.
@@TheRuediger1111 I am the same way, each league is getting easier. This league I got to T10 maps with ease but now I'm having some difficulty beating the conquerors and few red maps T12. I'm currently playing pyroclast mines. are you familiar with mines?
@@wanderingtrader1147 never played mines. As far that i know, you play 2 main skills. One for map clearing and the traps against bosses. A friend of mine played ball lightning and a mine last league and made Sirius, Elder and Shaper with his build.
Which gear do you use? Pastbin would be nice, so maybe i see a lowcost improvement.
@@wanderingtrader1147 just checked the skill. Looks kinda nice and you don't need a second clearing skill. (Maybe my league starter next league)
That video was exactly my cup of tea
For me the holy trinity has always been efficiency= run the story mode and dont kill more mobs than needed and have a tight enough loot filter to keep you running instead of collecting things you dont need. Target gameplay= use all the league mechanics in the game to obtain items, crafts and levels you need. Investing in your gameplay= dont be scared to use your currency to improve your maps, the 1-3 chaos you use to roll a map will usually pay itself back in xp/time and items/currency.
I have one single build in which i managed to get really far, and I couldn't agree more. There are tons of ways of making currency, and tons of ways of making your character achieve end game strenght... But I do mostly the ineficient stuff so its quite hard to get to the finish line xD
For years i struggled to efficiently farm endgame.I followed other player builds to the point and it still it wasnt enough.Than i realised how the gear you have makes even the same build different from any other.It depends on how you build based on what you find on the road to making currency by farming,trading etc.No half baked build will manage that even with expensive gear.If you trade or drop a high life roll rare with res scale dps on tree for example.In reverse if you have a great unique to build upon solidify your ehp or defs in the tree or anyway you can.Its a thin line of balancing between choices.Can you be a glass cannon by dodging all the time?Some can.Do you want to build a tanky tree and patch dps little by little?A slow but steady approach.In general poedb is a nice roadmap for what mods to look for and it helps to have a strategy or goal when building.Lastly dont rush,probably you are not a streamer,you are not going to score first in the ladder,so chill and enjoy the game.
Agreed. Biggest part of the draw of POE for me is identifying how to get a good end game build from a clean league start.
Oh man I love working class exile! Great vid Yoji
As an utter noob (i play since Sindicate, but only recently finally managed to down Elder and shaper (not even uber elder)), I'd say i first fell into the trap of thinking that i need to be able to buy the full build as well since it usually works that way in many Mmorpg and the like.
But i found that it does indeed boil down to what you said but including some luck with drops. As example, last league i didn't quite get up to Sirus but i did run a good bunch of tier 16 maps. No exalts at all, barely any chaos and hardly any alchemy-orbs. My clear spead and -rate was pretty high.
Whereas this league (Managed to kill Sirus, Shaper and Elder! yay!) i'm playing a slower build and i often leave a few packs left on the map because they're just so far off. I got a bunch of Exalts and tons of chaos (Alchemy orbs are still an issue) With about the same playing time. So, playstyle was even worse, time same, skill same, effort same, knwoledge roughly same, i got a vastly different output in currency.
So, i'd advice people to take your video with a grain of salt.
For me, efficiency is a fun killer most of the time. That's not to say I don't try to be efficient in some ways but overall, having fun is the most important thing. I gave up on the "trek into the salt mines to get enough money to buy better stuff so the salt mines are easier" play style. SSF made the game fun again. Now I play and get as far as I can and when the game stops giving me upgrades I go play something else.
I don't usually make a second character in a league until I've finished the endgame on my starter. I end up finding ways to make currency along the way.
Gotta say i think most people think you can only have fun while having currency - I though i can say it's kinda "more" fun to have a lot of it and be able to afford whatever you want, whenever you want - some people should go play SSF for a league. Didn't think it would do so much but i kinda played SSF in Harvest even though i'm in trade league and im daring to go back to buying stuff all the time. I had fun gearing different characters and i usually reroll few times a league, but i do what i'm feeling like cause thats what the game is FOR - Having fun, playing whatcha wanna play. Not everyone needs to play the top .2% OP Build (lookin at Herald/aurastacker) but maybe they sure want, but i have to say even though it was a breeze, there was no challenge in that gameplay. I like the leaguestart environment, having near nothing, getting on through maps sometimes a bit slower but you're happy to find that helmet with 90life + 20 tri-res or something.
Play the game and get currency as a proof of doing well, and dont play the Game just to make currency and feel bad if you can't. Just my two cents.
you lucky dawg, my kid still does not leave me alone on the playground :D. Was watching alge aquarium video from green aqua, and the guy said the best thing. If you have alge first thing you need to do is not to blame the fish/plants/water or the seller, you need to put some effort in maintaining that ecosystem because mother nature always comes :). Same like here, Chris is not to blame always, you need to step up your game via those 4 points that you mentioned. but those 4 points can kinda balance, but the only thing you have to have 10/10 is fun, and than on that balance other stuff, find some fun content try to get as efficient as possible and know what to sell and what you need from gear or gems or passives, if you don't know you can take a look at some1s guide and start with that until you find your own way. Stay sane exile, so you don't get to be the next endgame boss :D
This is one of the best videos I've seen about POE lately - maybe the best. Although our subscribers probably overlap a lot, I'm definitely recommending it to mine.
A lot of practical advice to any casual player that aspires to be a powergamer.
This is a systemic issue with the game in general because a vast majority of the player-base just dont actually know how the game works. You have to remember that a huge percentage of people just look for a guild guide then do that and aside from the leveling process the game in its entirety is just about farming currency to buy items. This is why so few people actually know how to craft or scale a character because instead of trying to actually make a character and play the game they have just turned the game into speed running maps to farm currency to buy more gear to speed farm more maps. When most people relegate the game to just currency farming instead of learning how to make a flask, gem, or piece of gear it segments them from the core part of the game which is crafting to build up your character, it also removes the understanding of how stats, gear, gems interact with their character because they are just getting a pastebin of what someone else did with no investment from themselves. I used to hate poe when I was just farming currency to buy that next upgrade. The second I started playing SSF and had to teach myself how to craft and upgrade my character myself instead of hoping for that next exalt drop so I could buy someone elses knowledge and investment I fell in love with the game. The depth and scope of the game when you actually have to take advantage of all of the things that are in the game is amazing and anyone he is just playing the game to farm currency is just really missing out on the actual poe experience.
Luckily this is, almost entirely, fixed with the introduction of harvest league because it now requires massive effort NOT to learn crafting. If GGG can implement harvest mechanics in a way that they stand out above all other previous leagues I think it'll be a massive advantage for players such as the ones you describe that don't try crafting themselves. Guides will also start talking about different ways to get budget gear set up using harvest which introduces these build-playing people to the crafting system aswell. TL;DR harvest was a really fucking good idea.
To use the out of ten scale Yoji showed I'd say these are my stats: Playtime 7, Skill 7, Effort 4, Knowledge 8. I can be a bit of a lazy bitch sometimes and don't care about using a dump tab because I'm kind of OCD about sorting between maps. I don't sell anything I deem to cheap (this varies based on point in league) for the time to deal with annoying traders. But I know how to start a character up, get it up to low red maps and what content I want to start farming on a given build. I'm by no means a filthy rich streamer tier but I routinely make 100ex on average during a league. Main thing I'd recommend is people learn an easy to pickup starter they are willing to stick with until it starts churning out money or learn to roll with the punches on one that may be a harder start.
80% of society think they are above average.
As being a starter in this game, really have a struggle on the "knowledge" point. Managed to "realize" what ascention is when I made it to lvl 65. And much more things of this sort(failed a huge amount of Syndicate and Temple missions simply because I didn't understand what was the goal). Is there any resource or something that I can read/view to get the "basics"? I do visit poe.wiki alot to understand this and that, but still feel that I'm missing a huge deal of the game.
I think what helps most (helped me most) is to just watch some streamers (like on twitch) or their youtube videos. Most of them explain game mechanics, crafting, progression and are generally very helpful. It really helped me to see someone play the build I wanted to play from start to red maps, to get an idea about what to expect and what to look out for.
Zizaran, TarkeCat, Mathil, ThisIsBadger and many more give very insightful perspectives into the game.
@@leonsmuk4461 Thanks. Will watch those.
For beginner content, there is also Nathan Walker, who has a lot of really approachable beginner guide on some of the very basics of PoE.
One of the things I have always struggled with is generating fusings, how do people get 1500, or more of these? I'm lucky to end my league with 300
i see streamers buy them with jewellers orbs at vendors, or trade with players for chaos
It's called the Dunning Kruger Effect.
The BalorMage series does the INVERSE IMO, to what you think. He played a build that required only a few cluster jewels really to function, and it was probably the second strongest build in the history of the game for clear and he STILL took almost a month to get it to a reasonably complete state with his knowledge of the game. That means you've gotta basically quadruple it for a new player. And when you look at it like that, a mediocre player, with sub-standard knowledge, and a non-meta build will take longer than the entire league to finish, without Harvest in the game.
What streamers get wrong, and what you do also --Even on a working-class schedule, is that you have 10s of thousands of hours of experience with mobs types, layouts, boss design, mechanics, etc that allow you to progress in a period of a few sessions what will take the average 7hr A10 Kitava player an ice-age to finish. That knowledge is the key. And what makes people grow further out of touch with their audience because they can't remember what it was like not knowing these things and can't rationalize why someone else can't know what they know.
??? You begin your comment stating Working Class Exile does not prove my point, then go ahead reciting basically the whole video. Yes, knowledge is the key as you said not time. That was the point. I even mention that knowledge needs time to develope and call it the crux of the matter. I think we might actually agree mostly :D
Efficiency is what most people miss. I tried to start this league with a friend whos never played and nearly teared mt hair out. The amount of time we spent in town and in between maps was torture.
Totally with this. Normally its get to maps in w/e trash I can find.
Once on maps spend 1-2 chaos trading on each slot to get max resists and some extra life/es
From there I might jump to a 5link if I find one cheap otherwise its saving for a reasonable 6l.
This should get you to red tier maps on almost any build out there.
Finally its filling in other uniques and buying cluster jewles/abyss jewels and fine tuning.
Almost all currency before red tier maps is made from chaos formula.
My benchmark for "build budget" is "T16 deathless 5min full clear". Usually like 10ex with bad mechanics/full defensive investment, very rarely 5 (3.11 spider guardian, prenerf zombies).
How did you get the visuals to look that way? The cape and the bubble around you?
How much currency do I need to make the build that you showcase in this video? It looks really cool, but I am quite poor. :( Can I still make it if I dont have many orbs?
Past few leagues i played it's true, i don't bother with trying to make currency or even making much until end game. in fact several last builds i played i didn't even trade a single time until mapping and like maybe mid-tier mapping before i started trading and my builds were already doing ok, but then only get much stronger once i then start engaging in trade (i honestly hate trading though with a passion in POE, it's single most frustrating thing that keeps me skipping 2-3 leagues before coming back, i really wish there was a way to put items into a stall or something for people to come and pick then up from rather then you having to plan certain times/days to sell, or leave your delve/lab/maps to constantly trade!!! not to mention when you do need to buy certain things needing to msg 12 people to get a response)
Damn, here I am focusing getting 1M DPS build while I should speed mapping and such
It is a matter of perseverance.
I think what a lot of casual players lack is in the effort category. If you only have 1-2 hours to play a day, make the most of that time. The amount of downtime people have between maps or afk in in hideout fiddling in PoB is astonishing
@itsyoshi what podcast are u listening in terms of poe?
Fellow dad gamer here. There are a lot of builds that doesn't require much currency to get to end game, but you can throw currency at it to do maps faster or kill bosses faster etc... There are some builds that are not league starters and require and upfront investment for them to even work. For instance, elemental conversion blade vortex assassin is big this league but requires a number of fairly expensive items to work like an explodey chest. Are people really trying to ask if it's a league starter build, and if not how much minimum currency do you need to get started?
I think I know my problem quite well. I have overcome most of the hurdles for a PoE player, getting to maps, starting mapping, getting to know most of the mechanics. But now, when I come across a hurdle, I most often just lack the grit to push over it. For me, it where two things this league. First, I barely got map drops from Tier 11 onward, which made my conquerer progression harder, which in turn made getting my upgrades harder, since I really needed influence bases and couldn't buy them, due to SSF. So that was meh. The second hurdle was the afformentioned upgrades would have been necessary to have a better experience in T12-13 maps. Dying one out of 5 maps isn't that fun for me.
Instead, I made my own build, played it to Tier 6 maps, got frustrated since it wasn't as powerful and expected and switched to other games.
But maybe I will pick up later this league again, I feel SSF was a good decision for me, since it feels like the league doesn't progress without (kind of like "run away" from me) So I might get back to the builds and push through it.
I feel you man, I had the same issue, because I had the mindset "I got this wall from using 50chaos on this build, maybe if I use 50 chaos on another build it will perform better". But since than I switched to SSF and I've been just playing the game and trying shit builds with shit uniques and trying my best to push than deeper in the atlas. SSF takes off some "pressure" of the game imo
Hey Yoji, if your ever bored and wanna have some fun with I feel is a really underused buffed this league item, try the black cane. The phantasmal mightnwas buffed a lot this update. I'm still trying to see what viable skill that scales off of physical spell damage and can be crazily buffed with this cane. So far blade vortex with fire conversion seems to work realllly nice. My level 50 with no gear just the cane and a 4l chest using blade vortex does 8-12k DPS. (Oh and princess sabre in offhand) I'm sure this thing can be hella scaled and you prob have the knowledge I'm looking for to do it.
Up for a fun completely non meta test?
Fellow boomer gamer here, and this video is exactly me. Virtually every character in every league goes like this....Kill Kitava....make my first series of gear upgrades to cap resistances and get as much life as possible. Begin mapping.....make a little currency, then get my second round of upgrades on gear. By this time, I am in late yellow/early red maps. This is where I hit the wall. The next series of gear upgrades for my character far outweigh the currency I am making and stops me dead in my tracks. From my knowledge, the currency generating items are in the higher tier red maps, I'm just don't have much luck surviving there. What is sad is that I do have a lot of time to put into the game. I know I am missing something, as I hear about other newer players rolling in exalts, getting raw exalt drops every day.....I have played Harvest since the beginning and have seen 2 raw exalt drops, and I probably put around 25-30 hours of game time in each week. Yes, the gods of random chance have always hated me in every game I play. I eventually get frustrated and quit the league. But I keep trying each league, hoping it will be different....but it isn't.
You start making silly money once you are able to sustain T14+ (assuming you get there fast, ofc, not 2 weeks after league start) just by selling extra maps, elder/shaper fragments, blight maps etc.
You should not need a 3rd round of item upgrades to switch from low red maps to high red maps if you are playing a caster (or any build where damage scales with gem levels instead of weapon dps). There are plenty of builds that can do t15s-t16s with absolute garbage build - tabula and barely capped resistances.
Also - you can get some pretty crazy savings if you figure out what items you want, set up live searches for them and snipe them when they appear at a very low price, rather than doing a "buying" round every 12hrs or so (at which point you have to pay market price)
plenty of money to be made in lower tier maps as well tbh, though it revolves more around harvest crafting jewels and other generally low ilvl requirements.
Maybe in the future POB will have a section for putting in your time/skill/effort/knowledge matrix, and the ability to accurately calculate build budget from that :D
"Okay this guy is lazy, he's going on trade site rather than his garden for sure! Budget go UP!"
The main reason for this problem is most of poe content you can find is end game build with many exalts investment or very specific high priced setup that is unaffordable as a first char. It is very hard to find true build guid that works from scratch until end game with upgrade and step up. Most of time if you want this kind of experience you have to make your own build and if you can do that you probably don't need this kind of guide. Path of exile is in fact a hard game that require a lot of time no mater what. Even if it is not play time, it's building time, trading time, wiki time, forum time. You need a crazy amount of knowledge and game experience to be able to make a build that is viable from scratch to end game on your own.
"It is very hard to find true build guid that works from scratch until end game with upgrade and step up." You must be looking in wrong places then, imo this is the problem when people look for builds on youtube and reddit which is mostly "build showcases" i.e. end min maxed state of a build. If you watch let's say Mathil stream he always streams levelling his character so you can see how he makes it. He crafts a lot of gear, but he also has to deal with restrictions of fresh league start on first char in each league. Or you can watch Zizaran he nearly always plays SSF HC so he can only make builds that function during levelling and can work with SSF gear. You can also search official POE forums and while many builds are lazy "showcases" i.e. POB + end gear + video, many others are EXTREMELY detailed and explain nuances like gear crafting and progressing from league starter to more expensive setup. Sadly I feel current generation of people lost the ability to focus on a multi page written text so they often go for videos and short, concise "build showcases" that don't explain anything. One guide I always recommend is Darkxell's ED Contagion Trickster, it's a very exhaustive guide for old school staple skill that is viable so far in every league and has multiple gear level / budget breakdowns.
As someone who has played the game since beta, but always at a very casual level. I don't have the time or the attention span to play characters for long enough to even reach tier 10 maps before the league ends(I boot up the game for maybe 2/3 maps every few days).
I enjoy the game just fine making a character with some premise, upgrading my character slowly and seeing how far I get into maps this time. Last time I ever played with any serious consistency the hardest boss in the game was normal Atziri. I've never even seen Sirus or the Elder before but I think that's fine. Worrying about getting the money for a build just seems like the wrong way to play. Many random cobbled together builds are fun to play even if they don't 1 click kill even rares in tier 4 maps.
Some leagues do fit what I need better than others. Delilrium was awful for me because I didn't have the time to make a character that could face delirium without dying to random explosion mechanics and ended up just avoiding the mechanics entirely. Harvest is perfect for me and I've been enjoying it (even though I've barely reached tier 7 maps this league so far)
3:20
it's because there is a difference between 10k hour player knowing exactly what to do and how everything works and what items are worth
and then there is the new player who only knows what is good for the build they are playing. Which means you end up losing a lot of currency just because you have no clue what stats to look for on other pieces of gear
also spending 3 hours efficiently is way better than 6 hours having no clue what to do
like, I'll open a POE stream and the screen is filled with mobs at 5 frames per second and 10chaos div cards are flying around everywhere
For the people who see the streamers with big dollars I think its really important to know how the leagues behave in general. You can make an absolutely disgusting amount of money early in the league on any budget. Day 1 when exalts are only 40c for example you should be able to make 1-4 ex per hour based on how much you focus on chaos rec. But if you have only 90 minutes to play a day you won't get to maps probably until week 2. At that point the window for doing that is closed completely. Understanding the money making windows is important to making the big bucks.
The issue must get worse with harvest in particular. Since there are less mobs on the map you just generally see less money / farming resources. Newer player's who came in during the loot explosion of metamorph or delirium must be really feeling the pain. Those were both leagues were it was easy to make money without a specific strategy.
If you only have 90 min a day, you should still be at maps by end of week 1. Ffs, I even pulled it off with a 1k+ ping.
i average about 1-2 hour a day and still make about 1-2 mirrors every league. if you cant make currency you're doing something very wrong. it's fairly easy to make money after getting into red maps, and extremely easy to make currency afterwards. just grab an easy to gear build and start playing. one league i made around 2200 ex just playing 3-5 hours a day. was insane. i didnt flip, or do anything weird, i just played the game.
i think the problem people have is they reroll builds too much. if youre constantly getting to endgame and stopping and making a new character, you wont ever make any currency. you gotta make a character and stick with that to actually start to make some bank. all the rich ppl i know in poe basically only ever play 1-2 builds a league. so pick your build and get grinding, exile!
Maybe I am misremembering but wasn't it also you that gave the advice to keep playing your league start character and/or any character longer to make sure you actually progress into that harder endgame content? I def remember several leagues where I was more concerned with trying more builds and how many characters can I make in one league and never really progressed any of them far enough to get to those higher tier maps. I made a conscious effort to get my first character to the 90+ range after that advice and had much better success in high end gearing and mapping that league.
Two things that are not taken into account here : Luck and No trade...
Trading is not things that i will do to gain upgrades cause killing mobs for upgrades is the game, not currency and / or gear flipping... Then comes luck, and i only hope that GGG will cut some of that with deterministic crafting...
Other than that, i'm pretty much on par with what you say :)
thanks for this video broji
I'm sure you have to have gotten this before, but you sound EXACTLY like the guy from the slingshot channel. When you start a build, I'm gonna need you to say "Let me show you it's features" XD
so what are some good builds to get to endgame fast?
I did this Reddit post 3 days ago:
www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/hz6v2h/mini_project_from_a_casual_player_irl_with_poe/
I have a full-time job and all that IRL stuff (I live with my wife, we work apart from each other throughout the day, I have a home-office job, so we spend some quality time when we are together again) and while I have some hours free after work, I usually would do something else instead of playing PoE actively, so my active playtime let's say is like 1.5 ~ 2 h per day while at weekends tends to be more. So, I decided to start a project for 10 days with a 2-hour sample with whatever IRL stuff may happen in the middle, to show that if you have at least 1 hour of active playtime on your day and you put the effort into it with just MAPPING (whatever the number of maps you can run within 1 hour) and interacting with the side content (this is the side content auto-generated in the map, not using Zana mods from the map device), using just a simple strategy like "alc-and-go" maps, you can make currency. That was the day zero, so it didn't count.
What I mean with this is that the time does matter when you put the skill and effort to improve yourself, then you'll see the results, in the end, you'll manage to generate currency. You have to pick something that is easy to understand, easy to follow, and can do almost all the content without spending 3 hours per day looking for upgrades. All of this knowing that the time you spend playing your "easy-to-go" build gives you enough margin to invest currency in it, making more room to generate more currency and so on.
I've been playing PoE since early 2018 and my knowledge has been growing since then, always playing some hours per day. And I went through all the processes of learning, watching video guides, copying builds, and so on up to this point that I can manage my own builds without any help unless I need to know something that I don't know or figure mechanics that I've never played before. Is just that, no matter how many hours you have per day, if you manage to focus on PoE while enjoying it, PLAYING AT YOUR OWN PACE, there's no way you will not make currency and improve your character. PoE is not easy but is not impossible to learn. I saw people making absurds amounts of currency while stating the only knowledge they have is just in market stuff, while having near to no knowledge about the game and its mechanics, it's all about knowing your weaknesses and strengths and putting the effort to improve the former while minimizing the latter.
I do exactly as you say Itsyoji, it's after that that i can't make currency or so slow i'm burning out, i spend 20 ex on my character it does T16 without dieing and can do boss but not deathless but still can kill them and then i play 10H a day and win what 2-4 exalt a day and then i think, i need to start crafting to min max my character but i never have enough money to do that because it's so slow to make money.
I think you just pointed out the major balancing issue with PoE... your formula should look like 4(knowledge) + 3(skill) + 2(effort) + 1(playtime) = currency. So a player with a ton of knowledge can get by with relatively little effort or playtime. A well-balanced game would have someone with enough playtime and little knowledge be as profitable as the all-knowing 90min/day working class exile. Boy I miss the days where Savestates were not a thing.
Ok but pretty much all builds can clear red maps on a 5L unless it's something really super dumb like glacial hammer. Point to me a decent build where giving up 30% damage (one gem link) means suddenly you can't clear any red maps. It's not a useful criteria to decide if the build is good, because pretty much all builds clear this criteria.
Starter build vs non-starter is more about the required uniques cost, required cluster jewel mods, and how many influenced mods it needs. Look at instacker wander. By my proposed criteria, this is definitely a build that cannot be a starter build.
Well you can start as a normal wander and work into int stacking as you map, gameplay will feel the same, just the damage will be lower until you get the wand and int gear set up more and more.
Yeah, I definitely lack knowledge and time. I find white and yellow maps to be hard because I'm using random build that I put together myself. Still have no idea how to deal with physical and elemental damage reflect and unfortunately, the build does both physical and elemental damage. 🤣
I want to play other games as well, so I can't really play PoE by itself so it's just going to take a really long time to build up that knowledge. 🙂
Not complaining though, it takes me around 20 hours+ to just finish Act X, and that part is still enjoyable.
It's pretty normal that some builds simply cannot do ele and/or phys reflect so don't worry about that.
Oh and I agree that learning PoE can be a very enjoyable process :)
I afk in hideout, take multiple minutes between maps to mentally prepare, waych NetFlix in other tab, eat food, chat in twitch chat, read wiki in other tab, etc... basically waste so much time; yet somehow I make tons of currency.. I have no idea how. 🤨🤔
I work an average 60 hrs a week and I'm usually 50 exalts in 2 weeks from any league start.
Hey Yoji, while I agree with all you said, you might have not emphasize enough on the skill/effort/knowledge of selling/trading. Selling/Trading efficiently goes a long way into making currency. Ofc it doesn't apply to ssf players but I think thoses were not the first targeted by this vid.
Some not so obvious examples:
organizing and sharing specific curr with mates (one sells all essences, one sells all div cards),
having a niche market you know and profit from (ex: crafting and selling specific flasks),
running some undervalued unique/blight maps,
trading splinters so it doesn't rot in stash,
selling maps (probably in bulk coz pain-in-the-ass),
... insert-your-own-and-fun-way-to-make-money.
My number one advice: Stay away from the drama on reddit. It will poison and distort your perception of the game.
Something is not true just because a lot of people say it is. Learn by doing instead, and take pointers from more positive and reliable sources.
Or get into a mindset where it doesn't bother you anymore.
i take my time miss-clicking almost mirror tier items to brick then, tyu vry much! pf
That is the problem with some players. They always have this urge to race against something. Play the game at your own pace and you'll enjoy it more than looking for builds and wanting to achieve it as soon as possible. It often stems from looking up into streamers and they are in awe how they put up guides for league starters quick. Once the stress kicked in a game, maybe try to rest for few days and go back in the game. The game is not going anywhere.
Um.. I hate trade, so when I’m asking how much a build cost, I’m asking if it will be viable with the self found crap gear I have.
Three hours on the train? Seems like knowledge = time. And effort? Yoji, You make it sound like a second job.
I actually haven’t played for two years. I only have ~90 min/week, not really enough to make the game fun. But still love the Yoji content.
yea at only 90 mins a week youre definately better off playing in standard than in a league. while you can be successful at poe leagues with limited playtime, you really cant get anywhere in only 18 hours of playtime per league. poe does have a minimum time input to be successful. id definately recommend sticking with standard. i always recommend that if you dont have at least 100 hours to put into a league, play standard. you'll get alot further there and still have alot of fun.
Guides are a dangerous crutch imo as is participating in trade too early. Players too easily fall into the trap of not actually understanding what they are doing. When I first started I played primarily a self-imposed version of SSF, where I would only trade after I hit a noticeable plateau in my progression. I started in Synth and I took a Lacerate glad to early yellow before I started trading. In legion I took a Tornado-shot to mid yellow. Blight I took toxic rain to early reds. Metamorph I took Fire Wildstrike to elder but not uber elder. Finally In Delerium I took Fire Arrow to Sirius (What an awful decision, burning arrow in delerium was painful). Now that I've taken my Earthshatter to Sirius, I'm pretty confident I can take almost any skill to Sirius sans guide and without trading. What I'm trying to say is SSF for as long as your patience will allow because that is what will force you to learn the fastest IMO and if you can get red maps without trading you will literally be swimming in exalt by the time you reach there. I whole heartedly also agree with Yoji's assessment that you need to read read read.
Following a guide is a very useful thing to show someone what the game has to offer, so I'd always recommend that for any new player, but after that you should definitely explore the game and learn about mechanics.
@@Failzz8 FIrst of all I'd like to clarify that when I say guides I mean build guides specifically. Second, I just feel like the reason why players feel so frustrated about making currency is BECAUSE they read build guides. Even when guides are tiered, guides rarely if EVER bother to actually bother to detail what actually happen in between and even when guides are successfully followed they rarely if ever develop effort, knowledge, or sometimes even skill. I suspect that the vast majority of the people who yoji talk about in this video read build guides make an attempt, fail miserably, and misattribute their failure to a lack of currency and or time. No matter how much currency tiers you put on a build guide it is very meaningless if you can't beat campaign kitava because you dont craft res into your gear. I'm just saying build guides crush the souls of newbies.
Where is a good place to gather knowledge? Recommended wiki articles? Reddit threads? Podcasts?
Can you recommend me some poe podcasts?
Me:
Playtime: 5/10 (1-2 hours per day)
Skill: 3/10 ( suck at boss or crowd mob)
Effort: 7/10
Knowledge: 5/10 ( just copy other people build even some time don't really understand the mechanic of that build)
For the reasons above why 5/10? 2 or 3/10 makes more sense...
For me:
Playtime: 0.1/10
Effort: 5/10
Knowledge: 6/10
Skill: 3/10
how do you even endgame on 15ex character? any good endgame item's worth about 10ex 😄
You don't need 10 ex items to do red maps on many builds.
Reading this while doing red maps on my wand level 2 with +1 to all chaos spell gems LOL. BLUE.
Ad a casual player and newby (I started in metamorph) i have fede time to play but i like PoE over the rest couse in every league i try to learn something new,that said i have to admit this league for me was harsh being crafting the hardest part of poe.Secondly due to the lack of time sometime a casual like me comes to the conclusion that to play that funny build the only way is to buy in game currency for irl money and for me is a nay.i have seen the working class balor guide but now that guide gas been nerfed that even Balor doesnt play it.This game is not beginner or casual friendly even becouse the new philosophy of devs pushes away from loot explosions which was the last hope for those players who have few time to play.All your theory revolves around haveing knowledge that equals time to spend into the game,but the fun in a game should be accessable (with different layers sure) by all without being forced to buy exalts for Real money
Tea WeirdChamp
Thats very nice video Agree on aloot of points gona send it to person who always complains im lucky and i have way mroe currency :D (ofc becouse its false his luck is just bad but that may help him anyway) :D
what did I just watch?
"Naturally progressing" for you (or that 90min a day guy), someone with years and multiple leagues under your belt is going to be different for others. The mechanics in this game, most good, some meh, are very disjoined and not at all intuitive. Thats what makes it hard for newer players to actually get a foodhold and leads them to asking your questions like that. This is a PoE flaw for the most part. The upfront learning needed is way more than most people want to put time into. I feel like GGG needs to take a league where they revamp all these disjointed mechanics (they dont seem that way to you or me, but to new players the definitly are) and streamlike it all into a coheasive system that has more intuitive nature. If they never do this, then they will see less gamer retention then they could have.
I think this game is 90% knowledge. Im definitely the chat/youtube/random shit on second screen kind of player and I do pretty decent.
chest isnt 6-linked, and is weirdly 5-linked. Reeeeeeeeeeee
Yoji, you also get bonus points for being a boomer (+1intelligence) and if you are European (+1efficiency to all skill gems)
Ok
I can kill sirus, I can do all maps T16 and usually I did once a... Week? I can kill elder and shaper (not Uber yet) but can't get $. Clearly lack of knowledge :( ideas?
So you say you get to endgame to get $. What do you do to get it in endgame???
Once you got all watchstones put in, I usually start putting 4 sextants on each map and put in the scarabs and atziri fragments I have. Put Zana, Jun, Einhar, Alva or Niko on maps whenever you can. When Zana offers Shaper or Elder Guardians, always run them. Run the Elders and Shapers you get and sell the Watcher's Eyes and Dying Sun's you might get. Sirus and Conquerors have a higher chance to drop loot at Awakening Level 8 too. You can run or sell uber elder fragments, depending on if you are comfortable with the fight too. All map bosses can also drop Guardian Maps in high tiers from Awakening Bonus now and Zana can offer Cortex and other high reward maps.
You also get more Delirium once you add more to your maps and eventually you might have a full Simulacrum too. Endgame has a ton of rewards hiding behind most content tbh. Timeless Emblems, Breach stones upgraded with betrayal etc you can run or sell for quite a bit.
@@ItsYoji you forgot the blight maps.
@@ItsYoji this is awesome! I'm sorry it took me a month to see the reply hahahah I blame youtube 😂 thank you man
Yoji, just watching this video a little late. I will have to say though that the game can be very stingy to some accounts compared to others. No idea why. I will use myself and my friend as reference. I've been playing since beta. I have almost 4K hours on steam playing this game. My friend has about 1K hours. We both play a lot. Every league I get serious in I get characters past level 90. Currently just got my character to level 90 in 3.12 Heist and plan to go further still. My friend has about 4 or 5 level 70-80 characters instead in the same time frame. He has actually played less than me this league we have compared our time played. So what is the difference? He has had 5 exalt drops already, a bunch more currency, and lots of 6 links. He does his own fusing from time to time and typically takes 300-700 fusings to make a 6 link and then sells it. Does about 10 of those per league after finding some exalts. He typically ends up with 20-40 exalts worth of gear per league easy. I've tried 6 linking my own gear. One league it took me 4K fusings to make a single 6 link. I was that stubborn in trying. That was the only league I ever made a 6 link. I basically got the "Well-Connected" achievement from Steam 6 years AFTER beta on Jan 2019. I can't tell you how many tens of thousands of fusings I've tried over those years of playing and never made a 6 link. I've only done it once and that was in league 3.5 with Betrayal league.
On the other hand, I have found 1 exalt. Only 1. With more magic find on my character, running harder maps as I am in T14 maps already and he hasnt even progressed past T3. I barely get to scavange enough chaos orbs through the chaos recipe system to make just enough to have a super budget version of any build. By the end of any given league I have about 3-5 exalts worth of currency and gear.
I could chalk it up to just random RNG luck. But I know that isn't the case. We've been comparing this since beta. EVERY LEAGUE. It plays out the exact same. I can reach delve 700+ and he never goes beyond delve 100. He still gets better drops from delve. I can beat Sirius, Shaper, Elder, or whatever. He never has beaten any end game boss. Doesn't matter. I can literally run 10 times the amount of maps he does in the same time frame with more MF and more mods on each map. Again it doesn't matter. He always has better drops and more currency. Has been this way SINCE BETA. I have to pick super budget friendly builds because I can't get to do end game content if I don't. I've tried otherwise. If I go for a build that takes 5+ exalts worth of gear to complete, I am not able to complete that build. Just doesn't happen.
So watching this video is basically like watching a smug slap in the face. Some people get drops in this game, and some people don't. I know my luck in this game is absolutely terrible. I put in a ton of hours into this game and have since 2013. I need to basically pick cheap builds every league if I want to even attempt end game bosses. Which is hard because the "meta" builds are typically the ones that can do end game bosses the easiest but since they are meta their costs to make are far to difficult for me to attempt. When I start seeing builds where a single item is 5+ exalts, I basically have to scratch that build. The chances of me making that much currency before the league ends is practically zero even if I played every minute of uptime during the league. So I have to go to the slightly off meta builds that can still do bosses but are actually cheap enough for me to get through the league.
It sounds like you're a bit too focused on big drops and forgetting the small stuff. I'm the opposite, I progressed from a 2.5 ex budged on my first non-starter character to a 20-25 ex build without really noticing since I barely got any good loot, maybe only about 2-3 ex, I've gotten most of my investment from just mapping and a bit of heist. That probably sounds smug as well so sorry about that, and I get what you mean, these kind of videos usually just tell you to run maps and you'll get a ton of currency, without telling you exactly how you'll make a lot of currency without for example exalted orb drops.
Truth is that you have to look for all the small things you can make money from, for example I've sold Alterations, Chromatics, Jewelers and Divines for about 8 ex this league. Selling map fragments for example is another very consistent way to make currency, but you have to be on the lookout or else you'll barely get any. That's how I always makes sure I got a decent budget every league, everyone has their preferred method based on their knowledge. It does sound like there's something you're overlooking or doing wrong, it's hard to tell without going in-depth but it could be that you're not efficient when running maps or you've chosen a poor starter build, if it's a starter at all.
Personally I started with blazing salvo totems and found out I was starting to need too much gear to make it work that I switched to Divine Ire totems which require barely any gear to start mapping. Swapping to something easier to scale made my mapping speed go up instantly and thus I made more currency over all just like that and let me start on my second character who require a lot more gear to work, but is able to the all of the content. Just these choices affect how much currency I've made, if I stuck with my original starter I would spend a lot more time invested in it, thus ending up with less currency overall.
@@BeyondBlizziC
Not at all. Again, I have played characters up to level 99. I have killed level 8 Sirius in the past, and a few of the other big bosses. That doesn't mean I've ever had more than 8-10ex worth of wealth by the end of a league. Most of which is from grinding ever day 4-8 hours a day for the entire league. The vast majority of what I earn currency in the game with is the CC recipe. I don't run bots. I play mostly solo, but do use the online poe trade websites. I am lucky to find more than 1 exalt drop in a league. That is what I have found so far. I have a level 94 trickster in heist and only have found a single exalt drop. No 6 links, and no items worth more than 2-4 chaos outside a tabula rasa. I saved up enough chaos to buy 1600 fusing to make a 6link. Failed all 1600. That is typical for me every league. I actually had a friend that didn't believe me give me 6K fusings to blow through. Never made a 6 link in 6000 fusing during the Delve league as a test. I usually beat everything on a 5 link. This league i am lucky that Cospri's are going for cheap and was able to buy a 6 link for my main character for 50 chaos. As I said, if I can't find cheap builds then I can't even finish the atlas no matter how much I grind. This league Hexblast tricker is cheap and easy. I am working through T16 maps at the moment. My dps for AoE and clearing is insane with my cheap setup, but single target bosses I suck on. Playing with PoB and reading the forum it is going to be expensive to get the character good enough to do end game bosses. I doubt I will no matter how much effort I put in to the character. Unless somehow the game starts raining currency which I doubt.
I am putting into perspective that there is sometimes no amount of effort one can put in to get certain builds done in a given leagues time frame sometimes. Again, I am someone with over 7000 hours into the game by my Steam counter. It is basically an average of 3 hours a day every day for the last 7 years. I still enjoy the game or I wouldn't have put in those hours. The difference is I know my luck in the game is far worse than the average from what I've seen. I don't know why, but it is. The point being that this video is a bit of a slap in the face to someone like me. I look for cheap powerful builds so I can do end game content without feeling frustrated. Not every league has been like that. There are some leagues where there really isnt any good cheap budget friendly builds that do well. Those leagues suck for me. I get stuck on yellow maps for 2-3 months and then the league ends. Do you know how boring it is to literally run the same map 30-40 times a day every day for 2 months with no progress? Been there. It sucks.
@@checkyoursixgaming You sounds unlucky, alright. However, you still don't need the big drops to make bank, and not the chaos recipe either, although it's good for getting the ball rolling. Are you taking advantage of all the ways you're guaranteed to make currency? I'm talking about things like betrayal where the proper set up can earn you roughly 120c from It That Fled alone each time you run the research. Or simply leveling gems in your unused/secondary weapon slots, right now getting 6 Vaal Haste gems to level 20 will earn you 90c, and as already said, shaper/elder influenced maps drops fragments. Alva temples can give you some nice profits as well but you kinda have to use discord for it to be safe, so personally I avoid her. Can't really comment on your build since Hexblast is new and kinda weird, personally I would've gone with something more safe, like ED/Contagion, which is kinda dull, but it's a standard starter build for a reason, or a slam build, which is lacking in speed, but easily gets tons of damage and survivability. It doesn't sound like your build is the problem tho, other than maybe being a bit difficult to scale.
You do juice your maps, right? It's ridiculously easy to sustain this league due to heist basically giving away chisels, alchs, scouring and vaal orb, and scarabs here and there.
@@BeyondBlizziC Would be nice if It That Fled shows up on any given league. Even then, it isn't always easy to get It That Fled to research. Luckily I have it setup for that now for my character in Heist. Trust me, I know all the tricks to trying to gamble on making currency. I always level up gems and try to corrupt them to sell. In this league I have tried 52 gems this way. Only 1 hasn't bricked on me thus far. One that I am using. Everything else went down to lower level or reduced quality. I also juice my maps and use everything I can. Again, it doesn't matter if the RNG gods don't want to drop anything for you. Not even the little stuff. I get maybe 1 chaos orb drop per 5 map runs without the recipe. Majority of my heist drops are rares. I think they put in a fix for that recently, but i haven't gone back to check in the past week since the fix was put in. I was one of those unlucky few that were getting junk rares only from Heist for which there was literally a suppose patch to fix that. Only thing I got lucky on so far for a drop is a Primordial Might this league which is going for a decent price right now at 130-140c. Which was the reason I decided to make a summoner build using that :)
@@checkyoursixgaming Yeah, getting It That Fled to research can be a pain sometimes. About the other stuff, I'm not talking about gambling to get currency, I only mentioned things that guarantee a profit, hence why I specifically said Vaal Haste since at level 20 it goes for about 15c even if it's bricked, so that's 90c from a 6c investment. And like I said, you can make a decent amount of currency from just selling excess crafting currency, so no gamble there either, just takes a while to build up a sufficient amount to sell. Personally I never really gamble with anything until I get my character rolling into red maps so that even if I end up with a big loss I can still just run more maps as usual.
Funny that you found a primordial might and started a summoner, I did exactly the same thing and it's been a breeze since, I'm doing Stone Golems and haven't had any issues apart from being a bit squishy until I got my Brass Dome. It's an expensive build, but what's nice is that there's lots of smaller upgrades so it takes a long time until you hit a wall.
All this seems really obvious and can be applied to anything