I've had several people ask if this works on the P1 series. TLDR is if you have an enclosure and there's space next to the aux fan, it will probably work 🔥
The placement of all the main parts are the same between the X series and P Series. I actually just ordered everything so I can do this to my P1S. Maybe my Adventurer 5M too. I'll have to see if there is enough room for it. Then I'll get seconds of everything for that.
@@DrZylvon I have both printers (X1C,P1S) in use - they have the same internal clearances. I checked clearances on both prior to ordering in case there was something I missed.
I had issued with warping too. I solved the problem by wrapping my X1C with 1 inch polystyrene rigid foam. I modulate the temperature with the enclosure fan and keep the chamber temperature at 50 deg C. The fan usually runs between 30 and 40% with a build plate at 70 deg C.
Fighting a warping issue while trying to finish an enclosure, found the warping occurs to the parts closest to the door.. I ordered two of those heaters, along with my RP2040-Tiny that controls a SSR while talking to the printers controller, Klippers Chamber Temperature becomes a controllable reality.
I’ve used passive reptile heaters for chamber pre-heat. Hadn’t considered one for my X1C. You just add an Edison light socket and screw in ceramic “bulbs” of appropriate wattage. The smallest “bulbs” are about 2” in diameter so the footprint is a little deeper than this heater, but it should fit.
I was thinking about putting one of my old heat beds in the bottom, placing a aqara temp/humidity sensor on the inside was of the unit and turning the bed on and off with automation like most things in my house and using a smart outlet. According to the display mine holds about 46, but then again I will have to check that. FYI the temp sensor for the charmer is the same board as the standby button and emergency shut down button on top.
This is Genius! Just one thing I'm not so sure about: how the heater is simply sticking to the side panel with double-sided tape. Because if for some reason it eventually unsticks and falls inside the print chamber (either naturally due to vibrations + gravity, but also with the help of the heat that could soften the glue) then the build plate could crash onto it and get destroyed. That's why Bambu went from the terrible prior design of the aux fan, that was simply glued to the wall with double-sided tape initially (many of them ended up falling) to a 3D-printed bracket to securely support it. Whatever, nothing prevents anyone to add that kind of bracket under the heater, and I guess that some models will quickly appear on Printables and Makerworld.
I just did braces for my A1 in ABS-cf by putting a blanket over my X1C 😂 in a 20c room it was up to 60c in ~30 minutes or so. I wouldn't leave it unattended if you try this out. The first one I tried without this extra insulation warped pretty well.
Did something similar with my P1P. Heater, temp control, enclosed and insulated chamber and a cooling fan on the CPU plus and additional exhaust fan mounted into the back panel to prevent cooking the electronics. The heater is permanently attached to the enclosure with screws no tape.
I should probably use screws and add a fan at the back at some point...but it seems to be working fine so far (I've been running it non-stop 8+ hours every day doing some production ABS work 😅)
@@emberprototypes now if someone could find a way to get the nozzle up to 350c and bed to 120c I’d be golden. Would like to stay all BL to keep a homogenous ecosystem which would make my workflow easier but as of right now running Qidi Q1 Pro for PPS CF because for the price it’s the best bang for buck for that material.
An interesting idea, and the video is clear and understandable; there's a couple of audio issues but not during the "meat" of the video. So you got a like just for making a solid video, over an above the actual content! When I need my X1C's chambre to be warmer, I just throw an old blanket over it. You'll have a lot less energy loss if you insulate the printer, especially the top. Granted, it does complicate the AMS placement, but it's amazing what a few layers of poly-cotton can do.
So this is awesome. I even installed an identical setup thanks to you. However, after one print I think I’ve found a pretty decent flaw. The way poop flys around on the X1C I think it might be safer to mount the heater upside down in the current location or sideways under the aux fan. I’ve already had a piece of poop fly perfectly into the air intake hole. Just wanted to share. Thanks
I wonder if tearing apart one of those creality filament dryer things would give you a strong enough heater with all of the sensors/control panel. Not sure what the max temp is for those maybe some sort of adhesive insulation all around the enclosure would help out. I was thinking I would just make a replacement door panel or top glass and mount the heater to that so it could be removed easily and returned to normal.
Some prints/printers/filimate don't like the temp flucations. It's expansion and contraction (or attempted) that can release the part off the build plate. Not always - but some times - depends - just something to watch out for.
Have you considered insulating door and top glass panels? Also maybe good idea to install flap door to poop chute and to isolate motherboard from heating.
I was thinking about putting a chamber heater in my x1c, but i imagine it completely differently: an inkbird with 1 temp sensor. Heat tape, wrapped around a steel rod with the thermocouple directly on the tape so it doesnt overshoot, then wrap that in fiberglass... Have the steel rod shaped so it gives off the heat evenly and gently
That's not a thermal fuse. It's just a thermal switch to keep the temps between a certain range. If that part fails in closed state, it'll just stay heating (not sure what those chances are though). You could potentially try to add an (actual) thermal fuse in series to it, those will cut the power completely if a set temp is reached. Ideally before the flashpoint of the surrounding materials.
You're correct. I did mention it's a bi-metallic switch but the term "fuse" isn't correct...though it's somewhat similar to a resettable PTC "fuse". I do have some actual thermal fuses, and I know that some space heaters with dual safety features have both a bi-metallic switch and a thermal fuse. Maybe will throw one in on the next mod!
Although a high enclosure temperature may be good for the printing process, you must realize that every part inside the chamber (mechanical, structural, electronic) must operate and 'survive' at that elevated temperature. A practical and still feasible chamber temperature is 60degC at most This is also the max chamber temperature that can be set in the X1E. Obviously, the X1E is prepared for that chamber temperature. But are all the other printers that you are "upgrading" temperature-resistant? What about the almost 80degC that you reach in your heater experiment?
I've only upgraded the X1C. Also, as I mentioned in the video, thin gauge thermocouples often read at higher temperatures in applications like this because of their low thermal mass. The X1E uses all the same components and is rated for 60C. The temperature sensor is at the top near the front door and undoubtly has higher thermal mass and slower response than the thin gauge thermocouples I used. My controller setpoint is 65C and the average temperature measured with thermocouples oscillates between 55 to 70C. However, the temperature reading from the Bambulab sensor itself never goes over 60C. So assuming they use that same temperature sensor to control internal chamber temps on the X1E, I think we are fine. Only time will tell - but this is definitely something I have carefully considered.
@@emberprototypes One important difference between X1C and X1E is the extruder module, especially the controller PCB inside. The PCB or semiconductors of the X1E may have a higher temperature rating. Although your demo is only the X1C, people may be inspired to try the same heater for their own printer. If their printer contains PLA-structural parts as part of the chamber, these can be severely damaged when exposed to your heater module (PLA starts softening at 60degC?). I would mention a simple warning against this in your own pinned comment
@@vsijben if it does, I doubt it's real. Likely just another certification-less item from overseas (which is why I wanted to open it up and check for safety precautions)
i noticed that the poopchute kinda ruins the chamber fan's suction. if you block it off, the chamber fan will suck more air from the door if it's open. having the heater in that spot would be perfect for warming the air getting sucked in to the chamber by the chamber fan then.
How does the double sided tape hold up to temperature? My concern would be over time it would not hold the heater to the side wall. I have been wanting a chamber heater for awhile, and I will be building this. Thank you for sharing.
No problem - thanks for watching! So far it's been holding up totally fine - though I'm using some very high quality VHB. Mileage may vary with other tapes. I'm currently running some production ABS parts so it's been on almost every day for 8+ hours over the past several weeks and it's doing great.
Not sure if you're familiar enough with the differences between the p1s and x1c, but do you think there are any concerns with doing this on a p1s? Love the idea and the ease of upgrade/cost. Would be a game changer for my abs prints. Thanks for sharing.
Thanks for watching! I don't own a P1S, but as long as you have an enclosure and you have space next to where the aux fan is on the X1C, I don't see why this wouldn't work. Everything I've seen about the P1 series looks super close to the X1 so I would guess you would be good to go.
Hello! I assume the the Inkbird controller switches the whole heater on and off right? I guess it might provide better temperature stability if you bypass the controller and let the fan on the controller always on? But sure it will need some rewiring and more effort. Very nice solution as using off-the-shelf components anyways!
Oooh thanks for this, I was curious if I'd run into issues, I wanna design a whole PCB with an esp32 for this because I'm crazy. it'd be fun to have a built-in 100w PCB heater and also make it a bento box (Worried about ABS/Fume buildup on those CF rods which aren't resilient or can't be lubed, Wonder if fine graphite powder would work on them?!) I hope my 100c max heated bed isn't a problem! I highly recommend adding insulation to the sides and the rear too and the top actually, tey let out a TON of heat. just that alone (only half of the sides and the top) brough me from 40c to 51c when doing ABS (100c bed) I'd be very scared of going past 60c, and it might make the bushings lose and bind (brass expands more than CF) if i'm being honest 80C sounds like a lot, I'd love to be updated on how it lasts and what happens overtime!
There is definitely lots of heat loss through the panels, but I'm lazy and didn't want to slap a whole bunch of insulation on...and I also didn't want my X1 to look ugly from the insulation haha 😅 so this little heater does the trick!
@@emberprototypes yeah not gonna lie it’s ugly *sight* but o figured it’s cheaper, I already had a bunch laying around and glued only the top 1/3rd, figured I could take them off. I just lay the top ones on without gluing so I can take it off for PLA
@@emberprototypes Insulation doesn't have to be permanent ... how about an external "tea cozy" approach. Just place it snugly around the X1C when you need it and store it away when not in use. Works for teapots. 😉 🫖 Make separate parts for sides, bottom, and top of the printer that all velcro together.
A bit confused why you need the heater. A few printed parts will help seal up most of the holes between the electronics area and the main chamber. Once you do that the heat loss drops to where the bed can keep up and as a bonus your electronics should stay a bit cooler for possibly longer life.
Nice work. 9:33 these are only with heater right? Do you have temperatures on same spots without heater? It would be a nice comparison. You could use a small relay, when it is powered, turns on the heater (many options how to power the relay, for example power from LED, but I am sure there are nicer solutions too). It would be nice if BambuLab would came up with stock solution, but I think they are afraid of ther own printers as competition, forcing you to buy X1E..
Yes this is only with the heater on at equilibrium. The temperature oscillates by around 10C when I set the temperature to 65 on the controller and this matches what I see anecdotally in chamber temp with and without the heater. So it can boost chamber temps by at least 10C. I'm sure it can do more but then you start risking overheating the motors and electronics so I do not go above that. Agree it would be nice to have an official lower cost option. I hope their next printer comes with it standard, as all new flagship printers should IMO.
@@emberprototypes I will try up to 70c. The motor and boards are outside the enclosure. I don't think that 5c more will do a wild difference in the motors. Anyways I have a laser thermometer that I can use for test too. Did you turn on auxiliary fan to keep constant air flow. I think at 10% will help the heat distribution. Maybe we can design a funnel to change air direction, so the Nylon part don't warp
@@JoseAguiloworkshops I could definitely try hotter and see what happens haha. I don't have the aux fan on but the heater itself has a small fan and I have a carbon filter unit running too so I think there is some circulation already, maybe could use more though, but it's hard to tell. I'm not having any issues in its current form
This is awesome, I'll definitely keep this in kind if I need to print any of the more exotic materials. Also, unrelated question but what carbon filter are you using? How is it working out? Thanks!
It's my own design, as I'm testing a couple of other things with it. It's OK. I am skeptical about how well these actually work as there has been little to no scientific tests or experiments done...something I would like to do (and possibly make a video about) at some point
There is a small hole on the floor of the X1C on the exact corner you placed the heater. That’s the hole I used to get the cable out of the printer for my Bento Box and it’s easier than getting it out from the back of the printer.
Great video @emberprototypes. Have you tested the heater with the bimetallic switch bypassed ? Looking at the logs it looks more like the response of a bimetallic switch VS a PID controller (of course a PID loop can look like anything when not tuned to the system). Depending on the temperature of the switch there are 2 temperature controllers in the loop. Thanks again for the video.
I actually didn't test the bimetallic switch to find out what temperature it shuts off at...probably should have. The inkbird controller is simply turning the heater on and off, so it's not PID, hence why the temperature graph swings so much like that. PID would obviously be better, but requires more work. Thanks for watching!
An alternative to these three devices, but in the form of an all-in-one, single product (for the same price): the $50 mini heater advertised to heat the resin in MSLA 3D printers (the one that has +/- buttons under the screen for the temperature set point, not the one from Elegoo that lacks them). Especially for EU customers as I am discovering that the YOUCIDI Mini Space Heater shown in this video is sold exclusively in the US and cannot be sourced from China, as strange as it may seem. The mini heaters for MSLA printers are powered from the mains too. They are a bit less powerful but I think they would do the job as well, especially as they have an integrated thermostat so there's no need for a separate thermometer and timer or smart plug. The temperature set point goes as high as 50℃ (122℉) and the size is W.57 × D.32 × H.108 mm (2.25 × 1.26 × 4.25 inches) and the power connector is extra small and plugs on the side, so it can fit in the P1S or X1C print chamber without being suspended (so no need for extra strong tape nor 3D-printed bracket) and without touching the build plate. They also have a (tiny) replaceable activated carbon filter. And of course, these items are available worldwide!
I actually looked at these beforehand and I think there were a couple of problems: 1) I think they have a max setting to them (eg. 50C) 2) They are typically
@@emberprototypes Do you really need more than 50°C in the chamber of your X1C? I print ASA only but it's true that you are printing nylon, so YMMV. Anyway, pay attention because I suspect that more than 50°C for hours repeatedly could significantly shorten the lifespan of the motherboard and stepper motors, as in the Bambu Lab P1 and X1 series these elements are not isolated from the heated chamber, sadly.
@@fluxcapacitor There's a reason why Stratasys machines have 80C+ chambers for ASA, ABS, PC, etc. It's definitely very geometry dependent but it helps. The X1E has an integrated heater that goes up to 60C and uses the same internal components, so up to 60 should be fine. The temperature sensor is also at the door, whereas my location is at the back closer to heat sources, so my temperature controller is actually set to 65 to account for differences in temperature offsets.
This unit is on Amazon UK for £32 today. But the thermostatic ones for 3D resin printers are only £67 so by the time you add thermostatic control they end up much the same. The resin printers ones may be a good bet.
@@NickBR57 just be careful, I'm pretty sure some of those only allow you to control the setpoint to 50C which might not be good enough. Plus their wattage is low so it may or may not do anything at all (or take forever to heat).
meh you could probably eliminate warping with a dual adhesive method (gluestick with aquanet on top) but i'm going to Implement this anyway. Might use a pid controller instead i was working on an open source heater controller that was esp32 based with wifi etc that used kalman filters but i got distracted i have too much shit to do.
I already use Dimafix. A heated enclosure is way better and now I don't need to use adhesive for most parts. There's a reason why Stratasys machines and other higher end industrial machines have it. I believe it also helps with part strength and layer adhesion. PID would be nice but not necessary from what I've experienced. Good luck!
Conversely, can a Bambu P1S print chamber be too hot? I love in Florida and my printer is in an outdoor shed. Ive been experiencing some adhesion problems, and can't find if heat in the chamber will impact a print.
Yeah definitely - if the electronics overheat you'll get skipped steps on the motors, etc. I'm not sure why this would impact adhesion though unless the extruder motor is skipping steps and not extruding properly. You may just need to clean your plate. That's the most common adhesion issue for people.
One concern I have is that when I insulated my x1c I discovered that the extruder loses torque at higher chamber temps. A friend of mine had the same experience insulating his.
I haven’t had any issues when printing ASA, and then again I haven’t really printed any big dense parts like you. But I do have that heater in my cart. lol I couldn’t help but notice you have a different looking carbon filter in there instead of what I’m use to seeing, the bento box. What filter is that? Is it printable or something you made or bought?
Yeah you can get by with smaller lighter parts, but once you start scaling up size and density it becomes a whole different ball game and a heater is really helpful. I made my own filter system before the bento box really became a thing. I kind of hate that none of these filtration things have any sensors and/or scientific evidence of how many VOCs they can capture in terms of kg of filament...but maybe that's something for me to work on in the future 😅
Also you don't want a heated chamber for ASA (at least for the one from Bambu) I have had big problems with ASA since I use an active heater in my X1C and I found out that it is caused from the high temperature. ASA needs quick cooling to not get ugly (especially for sharp corners). I can also proof my point. When you change your printer in the software to X1E (with the active heater) and look at the ASA setting, the heater is set to 0°C. Bambu did that for a reason. When you look at the settings for PC you will see that Bambu set it to 60°C. I turned off my heater again when printing ASA and my prints looked good again.
I just ordered the parts, thanks for the idea. Also, did think that your success is because the heater or because you make some changes to the part? Did you think you will succeed without the part modification? Last question, I saw you top layer a little rough in some areas. It is happening to me too. How do you think or anybody here can tell how the get a almost perfect top layer in a part like that in pacf? Thanks
I think it was a combination of the two. Unfortunately I was on a deadline for the part so I didn't have the luxury of testing one variable at a time 😢
@@emberprototypes keep up posting in a future video. I will do test to compare later with you and all the people who do the upgrade. Keep the good work
Thought about doing the same just wondering what is the long term influence high temps will have on the electronics (stepper motors, components on the extrusion head, controllers on the back of the machine etc.) which will all be exposed to high temps for long periods of time (I wanted to get to 90°C chamber temp, but I guess 80 will do fine for most materials I need). Have you considered this? do you have any input on this?
The Prusa XL is capable of printing Nylon-CF without a heated bed. Similarly, Markforged printers also do not require a heated bed for this material. However, I love your mod. Will be super useful for PC, ASA and ABS.
Yes it's great for those amorphous polymers for sure. PACF formulations (along with literally all other filament types) can vary wildly...the Markforged Onyx is specially designed for no enclosure. Some PACF definitely warps less because the carbon inside helps retain stiffness...but it looks like the Bambu PAHTCF still wants to warp like crazy, as is evident with that mold I was trying to print 😅
I created your project and everything works (I installed two of them on a flashforge 5M Pro). The only problem is that at around 50°celsius the thermal fuse cuts off the heater. Do you have any idea? Do you think it can be replaced with one with a higher value?
Ugh, I just completed this upgrade and mine cuts out at 50c as well. If anyone has a link to a direct fit 85c thermal fuse part number I’d appreciate it.
@@joeziskend8463 I wonder if some of these are fitted with a different bimetal switch rated for a slightly lower temperature 🤔 You want to look for something like this: www.hctemp.com/AMT-bimetal-thermal-protector-thermal-switch-pd46516606.html If you take your heater apart, maybe there will be a part number on it indicating its temperature range (I should have checked on my when I tore it apart)
I'm afraid of the PETG parts the Prusa is made of and the electronics board inside the chamber. Did you modify any of it? Electronics outside, replaced printed parts with higher temp plastics? Do the steppers like the hot environment or do they need some sort of cooling?
I’m skeptical of the long term effects on reliability running at elevated temperatures. It’s relatively easy to raise the chamber temp but how do you deal with all the electronic components operating in that environment. Similar size stepper motors are rated to 40c. You’re doubling that. Before anyone cooks their printer I’d suggest you place a lot of thermocouples throughout the chassis, even on chips and assess what is going on. System engineering requires you look at the whole system.
The Bambulab X1E has a heated chamber, and uses the same components. There's a reason it's set to max 60C internally - specifically because of your concerns. Most electronics are rated -40 to 80C as well. There's definitely an upper limit though, so I wouldn't push it past what the X1E does. Going higher requires isolating the motors & electronics like they do on Stratasys machines.
I get around 58 °C in the regular X1C when I print with 110°C printbed. So therefore for me it makes no sense to have an active heater in the printer which could give me probably 3-5 °C more. Having no issues in printing PC, ABS or ASA. Also not with pure Nylon.
You must either live in a really hot climate, or have the machine insulated well. There's no way my machine gets to 58C with just the bed on. I have my heater set to 65C and things seem to be working well. Honestly, even at 60C chamber, if you print large, dense PC parts, they'll probably warp. Stratasys machines get to 80C+ for a reason.
@@emberprototypesI'm with you, my machine has never gotten anywhere near that. My room temp is ~72-75f. Typically, I see around 48-49c chamber temps after preheating for a while with the aux fan circulating. Even after many hours into the print, that's about all I can get. Hell, I've not hit 58c even with a blanket on the machine.
My stock Carbon will maintain 58-60C if you wrap the sides and front with a continuous piece of silver bubble warp and insulate the top with blankets, towels, etc. There is tremendous amount of heat loss thru the glass and glass joints. Its not pretty but it works. Without the insulation, 48C is the max chamber temp I will ever see. I like this mod and am order parts now.
@@bretkline4633 yeah that's similar to what I see without an active heater. I was too lazy to wrap insulation everywhere and wasn't thrilled with what it would look like 😅 I agree there is definitely lots of heat loss through the panels though, I can feel it when I touch the machine!
My concern with doing this on a printer not designed for it is you are heating the air around the hotend. As I'm sure you know, the hotend has a cooling fan to keep the cool part cool and the hot part hot, with a heat break between the two. If you heat the air, your not likely making the heatend hotter, but your definitely making the cool side hotter. Will the nozzle and heatend clog more? I guess only time will tell.
A very fair point. I have not noticed any clogs since the upgrade and I've been printing a ton. I find that amorphous polymers like ABS and PC don't really clog. With PLA you obviously don't need the heated chamber. Haven't had issues so far with PACF. We're not going too hot here because the electronics aren't isolated so there's a limit to internal temps anyway and I don't think the delta is high enough to cause problems here. Stratasys machines heat to 80C+. I'm curious if their hotend designs are any different, it's been a while since I've looked at one up close 🤔
Where did you read/learn this? A quick search shows that some activated carbons can work up to 200C in removing VOCs, but their efficiency may decrease with increasing temperature. It also sounds highly dependent on the type of activated carbon and the type of organic compounds themselves. I have not seen any sources say outright that they "do not work" at 60C, but I only spent a couple of minutes looking and asking ChatGPT.
@@emberprototypes BOFA touched on this during an interveiw at FormNext last year (2023). i cant find it now of coarse. but.... what i took from it is that carbon expands with heat as everything does and the specific VOCs related to 3d printing are smaller at temps about 60c. This allows them to pass right past the carbon and not be filtered. Mind you a thought i just had is....BOFA is in the market to sell filters.... so maybe some snake oil here. but it makes sence and i belive with heat carbon looses its ability to filter. Lots goes into it "working" what material your printing, temps not of the chamber but of the actual carbon ect.
@@emberprototypes One more thing to check out. NeverMore offers a product called "Scorch". its for ptinting in temps up to 65c.... they state that above 60c you see a significant decrease in performance of regular carbon. Scorch is carbon but modified somehow.
@@NWalker-zx6xu very interesting. I'll keep my eyes peeled for any further info or literature on that! I have a BOFA fume extractor and they definitely work great so I do trust them to some extent.
It's an affiliate link so it depends which country you're in. Amazon will try to find the closest thing to the actual unit I purchased in your country. If it's not giving you the same heater, you can try to search for it instead.
Nice! if you are after a tighter control on the temperature range go for a PID control. It might not need tighter control for short parts but tall ones get heat cycle markes that look like a wave that get worse the taller the part is. here is my set up on a resin printer. ua-cam.com/video/jAF_oXVqWSw/v-deo.html
Thankfully I haven't been seeing any issues like that. See this tall polycarbonate part as an example: ua-cam.com/users/shorts2BzALg6l7o0?si=oJPXEeywd_XJBiQ5
@@emberprototypes in the past there was a discussion about which profile to use for the X gantry and rather than CF square profiles the suggestion was to use aluminium or steel, since CF profiles were softening at 60C over prolonged use (quite common for resins used in CF profiles). However, I didn't consider that those 3rd party CF profiles are not meant for that use, while the CF rods in the Bambu Labs are. Thanks for checking the specs and correcting me. I will suggest to some people I know about the mod, but I think you should probably use a PID or a loop with smaller hysteresis to control it, those oscillations also mean that for quite some percent of time the temperature is significantly lower, and the strength of parts printed between 40C and 60C changes significantly (CNC kitchen did a video about it using the X-Max 3). So you could get a much more polished and effective setup just by adding 1 AC-DC supply (the cheapest phone charger), 1 resistor, 1 NTC, 1 Arduino micro or Wemos D1 board, and a ready-made MOS solid state relay. Cheers!
@@olafmarzocchi6194 no problem! I don't know if Bambu uses Igus rods, but that was a good reference to check since they are designed for the same purpose. Yes PID would be nicer, but I wanted something with minimal effort and cost, and it seems to be doing quite well thus far. Thanks for watching!
I've had several people ask if this works on the P1 series.
TLDR is if you have an enclosure and there's space next to the aux fan, it will probably work 🔥
The placement of all the main parts are the same between the X series and P Series.
I actually just ordered everything so I can do this to my P1S. Maybe my Adventurer 5M too. I'll have to see if there is enough room for it. Then I'll get seconds of everything for that.
@@martythestines Woot! Good luck!!!
@@martythestines where can we expect to find your findings? I'm interested as well for the P1S... thanks !
@@DrZylvon I have both printers (X1C,P1S) in use - they have the same internal clearances. I checked clearances on both prior to ordering in case there was something I missed.
@@martythestines waiting for your updates!
I had issued with warping too. I solved the problem by wrapping my X1C with 1 inch polystyrene rigid foam. I modulate the temperature with the enclosure fan and keep the chamber temperature at 50 deg C. The fan usually runs between 30 and 40% with a build plate at 70 deg C.
Fighting a warping issue while trying to finish an enclosure, found the warping occurs to the parts closest to the door.. I ordered two of those heaters, along with my RP2040-Tiny that controls a SSR while talking to the printers controller, Klippers Chamber Temperature becomes a controllable reality.
I’ve used passive reptile heaters for chamber pre-heat. Hadn’t considered one for my X1C. You just add an Edison light socket and screw in ceramic “bulbs” of appropriate wattage. The smallest “bulbs” are about 2” in diameter so the footprint is a little deeper than this heater, but it should fit.
I was thinking about putting one of my old heat beds in the bottom, placing a aqara temp/humidity sensor on the inside was of the unit and turning the bed on and off with automation like most things in my house and using a smart outlet. According to the display mine holds about 46, but then again I will have to check that. FYI the temp sensor for the charmer is the same board as the standby button and emergency shut down button on top.
This is Genius! Just one thing I'm not so sure about: how the heater is simply sticking to the side panel with double-sided tape. Because if for some reason it eventually unsticks and falls inside the print chamber (either naturally due to vibrations + gravity, but also with the help of the heat that could soften the glue) then the build plate could crash onto it and get destroyed. That's why Bambu went from the terrible prior design of the aux fan, that was simply glued to the wall with double-sided tape initially (many of them ended up falling) to a 3D-printed bracket to securely support it. Whatever, nothing prevents anyone to add that kind of bracket under the heater, and I guess that some models will quickly appear on Printables and Makerworld.
That's a good point. I used a fair amount of high quality VHB tape and it's still on there...I guess I'll find out if it falls off 😂
I’ve got a newer version X1C and the aux fan is actually bolted to the side panel now
You underestimate 3M VHB.
I've accidentally had some stuff get stuck under the bed, it doesn't harm the machine
@@Heiserton haha yeah, pretty amazing stuff!
I will use this, but only for faster preheating. Than you for sharing!
Thanks for watching!
Nice work and well done video too. I think I'll do this with my K1 Max for printing more challenging materials.
Thanks for watching!
I just did braces for my A1 in ABS-cf by putting a blanket over my X1C 😂 in a 20c room it was up to 60c in ~30 minutes or so. I wouldn't leave it unattended if you try this out. The first one I tried without this extra insulation warped pretty well.
Did something similar with my P1P. Heater, temp control, enclosed and insulated chamber and a cooling fan on the CPU plus and additional exhaust fan mounted into the back panel to prevent cooking the electronics. The heater is permanently attached to the enclosure with screws no tape.
I should probably use screws and add a fan at the back at some point...but it seems to be working fine so far (I've been running it non-stop 8+ hours every day doing some production ABS work 😅)
@@emberprototypes now if someone could find a way to get the nozzle up to 350c and bed to 120c I’d be golden. Would like to stay all BL to keep a homogenous ecosystem which would make my workflow easier but as of right now running Qidi Q1 Pro for PPS CF because for the price it’s the best bang for buck for that material.
An interesting idea, and the video is clear and understandable; there's a couple of audio issues but not during the "meat" of the video. So you got a like just for making a solid video, over an above the actual content!
When I need my X1C's chambre to be warmer, I just throw an old blanket over it. You'll have a lot less energy loss if you insulate the printer, especially the top. Granted, it does complicate the AMS placement, but it's amazing what a few layers of poly-cotton can do.
Thanks for the feedback and thanks for watching!
So this is awesome. I even installed an identical setup thanks to you. However, after one print I think I’ve found a pretty decent flaw. The way poop flys around on the X1C I think it might be safer to mount the heater upside down in the current location or sideways under the aux fan. I’ve already had a piece of poop fly perfectly into the air intake hole. Just wanted to share. Thanks
Oh interesting! This hasn't happened to me at all but I'll keep an eye out 👀
@@emberprototypes also I had a brain fart here^ I meant to say the poop lands in the heater . Not the air intake.
Temp sensor for the printer i believe is on the PCB where the power and pause print button is
Oh, that's an interesting place to put it 🤔
They make a green house temp sensor by the same manufacturer that would give you a more accurate measurement.
Nice idea, if anything worth it for faster preheating. Was slightly sad though you didn’t print the original model for a better comparison.
I was on a time crunch to get these molds out so I had to change two variables at once unfortunately 😢
Great project! Simple, effective and carefully thought out. Subscribed!
Thank you so much for watching & subscribing! 🙏
Phil! Great idea! Doing this right away!
Thanks for watching!! Hope it helps 😸
I wonder if tearing apart one of those creality filament dryer things would give you a strong enough heater with all of the sensors/control panel. Not sure what the max temp is for those maybe some sort of adhesive insulation all around the enclosure would help out. I was thinking I would just make a replacement door panel or top glass and mount the heater to that so it could be removed easily and returned to normal.
Thank you I've been looking how to do this for seriously a year I can't figure it out.
Thanks for watching!
Besides heating printer chamber, I’m thinking of filament box as well. Maybe Pid Arduino controller for pid and added safety measures programmed in.
Some prints/printers/filimate don't like the temp flucations. It's expansion and contraction (or attempted) that can release the part off the build plate. Not always - but some times - depends - just something to watch out for.
Thanks for the tip! Haven't run into issues related to this yet 😬
Have you considered insulating door and top glass panels? Also maybe good idea to install flap door to poop chute and to isolate motherboard from heating.
Yes I have, but a) I'm lazy and didn't want to have to source, cut, and stick on panels, and b) I didn't want to make my machine ugly 😂
@@emberprototypes It's certainly uglier, but insulation took 15 min and brought my x1c from 40c to 60c passively.
I was thinking about putting a chamber heater in my x1c, but i imagine it completely differently: an inkbird with 1 temp sensor. Heat tape, wrapped around a steel rod with the thermocouple directly on the tape so it doesnt overshoot, then wrap that in fiberglass... Have the steel rod shaped so it gives off the heat evenly and gently
We do this at work for a steam generator on our 10kw microwave plasma source
That's not a thermal fuse. It's just a thermal switch to keep the temps between a certain range. If that part fails in closed state, it'll just stay heating (not sure what those chances are though).
You could potentially try to add an (actual) thermal fuse in series to it, those will cut the power completely if a set temp is reached. Ideally before the flashpoint of the surrounding materials.
You're correct. I did mention it's a bi-metallic switch but the term "fuse" isn't correct...though it's somewhat similar to a resettable PTC "fuse".
I do have some actual thermal fuses, and I know that some space heaters with dual safety features have both a bi-metallic switch and a thermal fuse. Maybe will throw one in on the next mod!
Although a high enclosure temperature may be good for the printing process, you must realize that every part inside the chamber (mechanical, structural, electronic) must operate and 'survive' at that elevated temperature. A practical and still feasible chamber temperature is 60degC at most This is also the max chamber temperature that can be set in the X1E.
Obviously, the X1E is prepared for that chamber temperature. But are all the other printers that you are "upgrading" temperature-resistant? What about the almost 80degC that you reach in your heater experiment?
I've only upgraded the X1C. Also, as I mentioned in the video, thin gauge thermocouples often read at higher temperatures in applications like this because of their low thermal mass.
The X1E uses all the same components and is rated for 60C. The temperature sensor is at the top near the front door and undoubtly has higher thermal mass and slower response than the thin gauge thermocouples I used.
My controller setpoint is 65C and the average temperature measured with thermocouples oscillates between 55 to 70C. However, the temperature reading from the Bambulab sensor itself never goes over 60C.
So assuming they use that same temperature sensor to control internal chamber temps on the X1E, I think we are fine. Only time will tell - but this is definitely something I have carefully considered.
@@emberprototypes One important difference between X1C and X1E is the extruder module, especially the controller PCB inside. The PCB or semiconductors of the X1E may have a higher temperature rating.
Although your demo is only the X1C, people may be inspired to try the same heater for their own printer. If their printer contains PLA-structural parts as part of the chamber, these can be severely damaged when exposed to your heater module (PLA starts softening at 60degC?). I would mention a simple warning against this in your own pinned comment
Does the heater have any regulatory approval, like UL or the European CE? And I don't consider CE =Chinese Exports as a valid one...
@@vsijben if it does, I doubt it's real. Likely just another certification-less item from overseas (which is why I wanted to open it up and check for safety precautions)
i noticed that the poopchute kinda ruins the chamber fan's suction. if you block it off, the chamber fan will suck more air from the door if it's open. having the heater in that spot would be perfect for warming the air getting sucked in to the chamber by the chamber fan then.
How does the double sided tape hold up to temperature? My concern would be over time it would not hold the heater to the side wall. I have been wanting a chamber heater for awhile, and I will be building this. Thank you for sharing.
No problem - thanks for watching! So far it's been holding up totally fine - though I'm using some very high quality VHB. Mileage may vary with other tapes.
I'm currently running some production ABS parts so it's been on almost every day for 8+ hours over the past several weeks and it's doing great.
I will try this but using home-assistant a smart plug and the bambu integration for control as it exposes a shit load of sensors
Is there a wiki or guide to bambu home-assistant integration somewhere? I'm pretty out of the loop on that haha
I use the same PTC fan in my Resin printer - the fan craps out, elcheapo pancake motor - I'm on #3 in 6 months. Amazon supplier did warrant first one.
@@plasmadyn mines still running like a champ 🤞
Not sure if you're familiar enough with the differences between the p1s and x1c, but do you think there are any concerns with doing this on a p1s?
Love the idea and the ease of upgrade/cost. Would be a game changer for my abs prints. Thanks for sharing.
Thanks for watching! I don't own a P1S, but as long as you have an enclosure and you have space next to where the aux fan is on the X1C, I don't see why this wouldn't work. Everything I've seen about the P1 series looks super close to the X1 so I would guess you would be good to go.
After geometry changes?
What geometry changes did you make that helped it print so nicely?
Gotta be detailed! lol
Hello! I assume the the Inkbird controller switches the whole heater on and off right?
I guess it might provide better temperature stability if you bypass the controller and let the fan on the controller always on?
But sure it will need some rewiring and more effort.
Very nice solution as using off-the-shelf components anyways!
Yes it simply turns the heater on and off, so less precise control than something like PID, but with the convenience of a really easy solution.
Oooh thanks for this, I was curious if I'd run into issues, I wanna design a whole PCB with an esp32 for this because I'm crazy. it'd be fun to have a built-in 100w PCB heater and also make it a bento box (Worried about ABS/Fume buildup on those CF rods which aren't resilient or can't be lubed, Wonder if fine graphite powder would work on them?!)
I hope my 100c max heated bed isn't a problem!
I highly recommend adding insulation to the sides and the rear too and the top actually, tey let out a TON of heat. just that alone (only half of the sides and the top) brough me from 40c to 51c when doing ABS (100c bed) I'd be very scared of going past 60c, and it might make the bushings lose and bind (brass expands more than CF)
if i'm being honest 80C sounds like a lot, I'd love to be updated on how it lasts and what happens overtime!
There is definitely lots of heat loss through the panels, but I'm lazy and didn't want to slap a whole bunch of insulation on...and I also didn't want my X1 to look ugly from the insulation haha 😅 so this little heater does the trick!
@@emberprototypes yeah not gonna lie it’s ugly *sight* but o figured it’s cheaper, I already had a bunch laying around and glued only the top 1/3rd, figured I could take them off. I just lay the top ones on without gluing so I can take it off for PLA
@@ameliabuns4058 hey if it works, it works right?
@@emberprototypes Insulation doesn't have to be permanent ... how about an external "tea cozy" approach. Just place it snugly around the X1C when you need it and store it away when not in use. Works for teapots. 😉 🫖 Make separate parts for sides, bottom, and top of the printer that all velcro together.
@@robertlawson4295 haha that could work, but I'm lazy 😅
Will have to do this for my P1S
Hello. Nice video. Thanks. Can you tell me what the devive in the back right of your Bambu please?
@@robbiegrant4977 I made my own VOC scrubber and was testing some additional features. May be a future product 🙂🙃
@@emberprototypes Scrubber is an excellent idea.
I've been thinking about doing something like this with my K1C, thanks
No problem thanks for watching!
A bit confused why you need the heater. A few printed parts will help seal up most of the holes between the electronics area and the main chamber. Once you do that the heat loss drops to where the bed can keep up and as a bonus your electronics should stay a bit cooler for possibly longer life.
Nice work. 9:33 these are only with heater right? Do you have temperatures on same spots without heater? It would be a nice comparison. You could use a small relay, when it is powered, turns on the heater (many options how to power the relay, for example power from LED, but I am sure there are nicer solutions too). It would be nice if BambuLab would came up with stock solution, but I think they are afraid of ther own printers as competition, forcing you to buy X1E..
Yes this is only with the heater on at equilibrium. The temperature oscillates by around 10C when I set the temperature to 65 on the controller and this matches what I see anecdotally in chamber temp with and without the heater.
So it can boost chamber temps by at least 10C. I'm sure it can do more but then you start risking overheating the motors and electronics so I do not go above that.
Agree it would be nice to have an official lower cost option. I hope their next printer comes with it standard, as all new flagship printers should IMO.
@@emberprototypes I will try up to 70c. The motor and boards are outside the enclosure. I don't think that 5c more will do a wild difference in the motors. Anyways I have a laser thermometer that I can use for test too. Did you turn on auxiliary fan to keep constant air flow. I think at 10% will help the heat distribution. Maybe we can design a funnel to change air direction, so the Nylon part don't warp
@@JoseAguiloworkshops I could definitely try hotter and see what happens haha.
I don't have the aux fan on but the heater itself has a small fan and I have a carbon filter unit running too so I think there is some circulation already, maybe could use more though, but it's hard to tell. I'm not having any issues in its current form
I was able to get a similar effect just byt putting two towels over the machine and taping the door hinge
This is awesome, I'll definitely keep this in kind if I need to print any of the more exotic materials.
Also, unrelated question but what carbon filter are you using? How is it working out?
Thanks!
It's my own design, as I'm testing a couple of other things with it. It's OK. I am skeptical about how well these actually work as there has been little to no scientific tests or experiments done...something I would like to do (and possibly make a video about) at some point
@@emberprototypes Would love to see that video, hope you make it at some point!
Great idea! Ill definitely try to do this in my Prusa Enclosure!
Good luck! Thanks for watching!
There is a small hole on the floor of the X1C on the exact corner you placed the heater. That’s the hole I used to get the cable out of the printer for my Bento Box and it’s easier than getting it out from the back of the printer.
Interesting...I didn't see anything there but I'll check again!
That hole would be perfect if it was a little bigger, guess I could route it out a bit more.
Great video @emberprototypes. Have you tested the heater with the bimetallic switch bypassed ? Looking at the logs it looks more like the response of a bimetallic switch VS a PID controller (of course a PID loop can look like anything when not tuned to the system). Depending on the temperature of the switch there are 2 temperature controllers in the loop. Thanks again for the video.
I actually didn't test the bimetallic switch to find out what temperature it shuts off at...probably should have. The inkbird controller is simply turning the heater on and off, so it's not PID, hence why the temperature graph swings so much like that. PID would obviously be better, but requires more work. Thanks for watching!
Great job, I’m installing an heater as wel and it is nice to see how you did it. I only have one question, which carbon filter do you use?
I made my own as I'm testing some additional future things 🙂
An alternative to these three devices, but in the form of an all-in-one, single product (for the same price): the $50 mini heater advertised to heat the resin in MSLA 3D printers (the one that has +/- buttons under the screen for the temperature set point, not the one from Elegoo that lacks them). Especially for EU customers as I am discovering that the YOUCIDI Mini Space Heater shown in this video is sold exclusively in the US and cannot be sourced from China, as strange as it may seem. The mini heaters for MSLA printers are powered from the mains too. They are a bit less powerful but I think they would do the job as well, especially as they have an integrated thermostat so there's no need for a separate thermometer and timer or smart plug. The temperature set point goes as high as 50℃ (122℉) and the size is W.57 × D.32 × H.108 mm (2.25 × 1.26 × 4.25 inches) and the power connector is extra small and plugs on the side, so it can fit in the P1S or X1C print chamber without being suspended (so no need for extra strong tape nor 3D-printed bracket) and without touching the build plate. They also have a (tiny) replaceable activated carbon filter. And of course, these items are available worldwide!
I actually looked at these beforehand and I think there were a couple of problems:
1) I think they have a max setting to them (eg. 50C)
2) They are typically
@@emberprototypes Do you really need more than 50°C in the chamber of your X1C? I print ASA only but it's true that you are printing nylon, so YMMV.
Anyway, pay attention because I suspect that more than 50°C for hours repeatedly could significantly shorten the lifespan of the motherboard and stepper motors, as in the Bambu Lab P1 and X1 series these elements are not isolated from the heated chamber, sadly.
@@fluxcapacitor There's a reason why Stratasys machines have 80C+ chambers for ASA, ABS, PC, etc. It's definitely very geometry dependent but it helps.
The X1E has an integrated heater that goes up to 60C and uses the same internal components, so up to 60 should be fine. The temperature sensor is also at the door, whereas my location is at the back closer to heat sources, so my temperature controller is actually set to 65 to account for differences in temperature offsets.
This unit is on Amazon UK for £32 today.
But the thermostatic ones for 3D resin printers are only £67 so by the time you add thermostatic control they end up much the same.
The resin printers ones may be a good bet.
@@NickBR57 just be careful, I'm pretty sure some of those only allow you to control the setpoint to 50C which might not be good enough. Plus their wattage is low so it may or may not do anything at all (or take forever to heat).
meh you could probably eliminate warping with a dual adhesive method (gluestick with aquanet on top) but i'm going to Implement this anyway. Might use a pid controller instead i was working on an open source heater controller that was esp32 based with wifi etc that used kalman filters but i got distracted i have too much shit to do.
I already use Dimafix. A heated enclosure is way better and now I don't need to use adhesive for most parts. There's a reason why Stratasys machines and other higher end industrial machines have it. I believe it also helps with part strength and layer adhesion.
PID would be nice but not necessary from what I've experienced. Good luck!
@@emberprototypes bought your setup c:
Where did you route your temprature probe to? Thanks for this tutorial, it works great so far!🔥🔥🔥
It's at the back near the poop chute. See 7:58 in the video!
Conversely, can a Bambu P1S print chamber be too hot? I love in Florida and my printer is in an outdoor shed. Ive been experiencing some adhesion problems, and can't find if heat in the chamber will impact a print.
Yeah definitely - if the electronics overheat you'll get skipped steps on the motors, etc. I'm not sure why this would impact adhesion though unless the extruder motor is skipping steps and not extruding properly. You may just need to clean your plate. That's the most common adhesion issue for people.
Pretty cool
Thanks for watching!
Too bad I already bought the X1E 😂 but I have 3 more X1C's so def want to try this.
@@marcozacarias1675 hope it helps! Definitely has been great for me
Hello
it keeps turning off for me and can't keep the set temperature of 60 degrees, what could be the reason?
@@Polika270 it seems like some of these units have a temperature switch that turns on earlier. I'm not sure if this is country specific or not 🤔
One concern I have is that when I insulated my x1c I discovered that the extruder loses torque at higher chamber temps.
A friend of mine had the same experience insulating his.
This isn't surprising to hear. I have yet to encounter any problems though!
I haven’t had any issues when printing ASA, and then again I haven’t really printed any big dense parts like you. But I do have that heater in my cart. lol I couldn’t help but notice you have a different looking carbon filter in there instead of what I’m use to seeing, the bento box. What filter is that? Is it printable or something you made or bought?
Yeah you can get by with smaller lighter parts, but once you start scaling up size and density it becomes a whole different ball game and a heater is really helpful.
I made my own filter system before the bento box really became a thing.
I kind of hate that none of these filtration things have any sensors and/or scientific evidence of how many VOCs they can capture in terms of kg of filament...but maybe that's something for me to work on in the future 😅
Also you don't want a heated chamber for ASA (at least for the one from Bambu) I have had big problems with ASA since I use an active heater in my X1C and I found out that it is caused from the high temperature. ASA needs quick cooling to not get ugly (especially for sharp corners).
I can also proof my point. When you change your printer in the software to X1E (with the active heater) and look at the ASA setting, the heater is set to 0°C. Bambu did that for a reason. When you look at the settings for PC you will see that Bambu set it to 60°C.
I turned off my heater again when printing ASA and my prints looked good again.
what was the maximum temperture you can achieve with a setup like this?
I didn't actually test this because the inside of the printer shouldn't get above 60C...but I'm sure it can go higher than that.
I just ordered the parts, thanks for the idea. Also, did think that your success is because the heater or because you make some changes to the part? Did you think you will succeed without the part modification? Last question, I saw you top layer a little rough in some areas. It is happening to me too. How do you think or anybody here can tell how the get a almost perfect top layer in a part like that in pacf?
Thanks
I think it was a combination of the two. Unfortunately I was on a deadline for the part so I didn't have the luxury of testing one variable at a time 😢
@@emberprototypes keep up posting in a future video. I will do test to compare later with you and all the people who do the upgrade. Keep the good work
@@JoseAguiloworkshops thanks for watching!
Update:
I received today all the parts and my machine is ready. Printing ABS as we write. Chamber temp is at 56c. Thanks bro!
@@JoseAguiloworkshops no problem, thanks for watching 😊
Thought about doing the same just wondering what is the long term influence high temps will have on the electronics (stepper motors, components on the extrusion head, controllers on the back of the machine etc.) which will all be exposed to high temps for long periods of time (I wanted to get to 90°C chamber temp, but I guess 80 will do fine for most materials I need). Have you considered this? do you have any input on this?
80C is likely too high. The X1E maxes out at 60C for good reason. 80C+ requires isolation of the electronics & motors like Stratasys machines do.
The Prusa XL is capable of printing Nylon-CF without a heated bed. Similarly, Markforged printers also do not require a heated bed for this material.
However, I love your mod. Will be super useful for PC, ASA and ABS.
Yes it's great for those amorphous polymers for sure.
PACF formulations (along with literally all other filament types) can vary wildly...the Markforged Onyx is specially designed for no enclosure. Some PACF definitely warps less because the carbon inside helps retain stiffness...but it looks like the Bambu PAHTCF still wants to warp like crazy, as is evident with that mold I was trying to print 😅
I created your project and everything works (I installed two of them on a flashforge 5M Pro). The only problem is that at around 50°celsius the thermal fuse cuts off the heater. Do you have any idea? Do you think it can be replaced with one with a higher value?
That's odd, doesn't seem to happen on my units. But yes, you can source and replace them - they're a pretty common component!
Ugh, I just completed this upgrade and mine cuts out at 50c as well. If anyone has a link to a direct fit 85c thermal fuse part number I’d appreciate it.
@@joeziskend8463 I wonder if some of these are fitted with a different bimetal switch rated for a slightly lower temperature 🤔
You want to look for something like this: www.hctemp.com/AMT-bimetal-thermal-protector-thermal-switch-pd46516606.html
If you take your heater apart, maybe there will be a part number on it indicating its temperature range (I should have checked on my when I tore it apart)
print the object at an angle for nylon like 45 degrees it will help with warping and with a chamber heater you will have no warp
Those fan heaters die real quick. we tried a couple on our prusas
We'll just see how long it lasts! It's be running 8+ hours every day for the past several weeks with no issues doing some production printing 🤞
I'm afraid of the PETG parts the Prusa is made of and the electronics board inside the chamber. Did you modify any of it? Electronics outside, replaced printed parts with higher temp plastics? Do the steppers like the hot environment or do they need some sort of cooling?
@@drstefankrank I'm confused - this isn't for a Prusa machine and there are no printed parts in here haha 🤔
@@emberprototypes The message I replied to spoke about their Prusas.
@@drstefankrank oh sorry I totally missed that this was a reply to a thread, my bad 😅
I’m skeptical of the long term effects on reliability running at elevated temperatures. It’s relatively easy to raise the chamber temp but how do you deal with all the electronic components operating in that environment. Similar size stepper motors are rated to 40c. You’re doubling that. Before anyone cooks their printer I’d suggest you place a lot of thermocouples throughout the chassis, even on chips and assess what is going on. System engineering requires you look at the whole system.
The Bambulab X1E has a heated chamber, and uses the same components. There's a reason it's set to max 60C internally - specifically because of your concerns.
Most electronics are rated -40 to 80C as well.
There's definitely an upper limit though, so I wouldn't push it past what the X1E does. Going higher requires isolating the motors & electronics like they do on Stratasys machines.
PID control would be nice
Of course it would 😅was aiming for the cheapest, easiest way of doing this though
@@emberprototypes totally understand it and it came out very nice for the price point
Seems like a nice upgrade. Not expensive either
Very reasonable in terms of cost and easy to do, it's been a great upgrade so far!
I get around 58 °C in the regular X1C when I print with 110°C printbed. So therefore for me it makes no sense to have an active heater in the printer which could give me probably 3-5 °C more. Having no issues in printing PC, ABS or ASA. Also not with pure Nylon.
You must either live in a really hot climate, or have the machine insulated well. There's no way my machine gets to 58C with just the bed on.
I have my heater set to 65C and things seem to be working well.
Honestly, even at 60C chamber, if you print large, dense PC parts, they'll probably warp. Stratasys machines get to 80C+ for a reason.
@@emberprototypesI'm with you, my machine has never gotten anywhere near that. My room temp is ~72-75f. Typically, I see around 48-49c chamber temps after preheating for a while with the aux fan circulating. Even after many hours into the print, that's about all I can get. Hell, I've not hit 58c even with a blanket on the machine.
@@therealjonnyd Yup that's similar to what I see on my machine.
My stock Carbon will maintain 58-60C if you wrap the sides and front with a continuous piece of silver bubble warp and insulate the top with blankets, towels, etc. There is tremendous amount of heat loss thru the glass and glass joints. Its not pretty but it works. Without the insulation, 48C is the max chamber temp I will ever see. I like this mod and am order parts now.
@@bretkline4633 yeah that's similar to what I see without an active heater. I was too lazy to wrap insulation everywhere and wasn't thrilled with what it would look like 😅
I agree there is definitely lots of heat loss through the panels though, I can feel it when I touch the machine!
My concern with doing this on a printer not designed for it is you are heating the air around the hotend. As I'm sure you know, the hotend has a cooling fan to keep the cool part cool and the hot part hot, with a heat break between the two. If you heat the air, your not likely making the heatend hotter, but your definitely making the cool side hotter. Will the nozzle and heatend clog more? I guess only time will tell.
A very fair point. I have not noticed any clogs since the upgrade and I've been printing a ton. I find that amorphous polymers like ABS and PC don't really clog. With PLA you obviously don't need the heated chamber. Haven't had issues so far with PACF.
We're not going too hot here because the electronics aren't isolated so there's a limit to internal temps anyway and I don't think the delta is high enough to cause problems here.
Stratasys machines heat to 80C+. I'm curious if their hotend designs are any different, it's been a while since I've looked at one up close 🤔
Just an FYI, activated carbon doesnt filter VOCs above 60C. Stay safe.
Where did you read/learn this? A quick search shows that some activated carbons can work up to 200C in removing VOCs, but their efficiency may decrease with increasing temperature. It also sounds highly dependent on the type of activated carbon and the type of organic compounds themselves. I have not seen any sources say outright that they "do not work" at 60C, but I only spent a couple of minutes looking and asking ChatGPT.
@@emberprototypes BOFA touched on this during an interveiw at FormNext last year (2023). i cant find it now of coarse. but.... what i took from it is that carbon expands with heat as everything does and the specific VOCs related to 3d printing are smaller at temps about 60c. This allows them to pass right past the carbon and not be filtered. Mind you a thought i just had is....BOFA is in the market to sell filters.... so maybe some snake oil here. but it makes sence and i belive with heat carbon looses its ability to filter. Lots goes into it "working" what material your printing, temps not of the chamber but of the actual carbon ect.
@@emberprototypes One more thing to check out. NeverMore offers a product called "Scorch". its for ptinting in temps up to 65c.... they state that above 60c you see a significant decrease in performance of regular carbon. Scorch is carbon but modified somehow.
@@NWalker-zx6xu very interesting. I'll keep my eyes peeled for any further info or literature on that! I have a BOFA fume extractor and they definitely work great so I do trust them to some extent.
amazon link is for another model of heater.
It's an affiliate link so it depends which country you're in. Amazon will try to find the closest thing to the actual unit I purchased in your country. If it's not giving you the same heater, you can try to search for it instead.
What screw driver is he using?
I'm using this: amzn.to/4aTDdOv
Nice! if you are after a tighter control on the temperature range go for a PID control. It might not need tighter control for short parts but tall ones get heat cycle markes that look like a wave that get worse the taller the part is. here is my set up on a resin printer. ua-cam.com/video/jAF_oXVqWSw/v-deo.html
Thankfully I haven't been seeing any issues like that. See this tall polycarbonate part as an example:
ua-cam.com/users/shorts2BzALg6l7o0?si=oJPXEeywd_XJBiQ5
@@emberprototypes Wow that is perfection.
@@karlh6692 yeah it turned out very nice 🙂
lapel mic
I have a question about this hack. Who is we?
I sometimes use "we" colloquially to refer to Ember Prototypes as a brand, but it's basically just me!
@@emberprototypes I write it as I (we)
Just don't go above 50C, the carbon rods won't like it.
What makes you say that? A quick google for Igus Drylin carbon rods shows they operate up to 100C
@@emberprototypes in the past there was a discussion about which profile to use for the X gantry and rather than CF square profiles the suggestion was to use aluminium or steel, since CF profiles were softening at 60C over prolonged use (quite common for resins used in CF profiles). However, I didn't consider that those 3rd party CF profiles are not meant for that use, while the CF rods in the Bambu Labs are.
Thanks for checking the specs and correcting me. I will suggest to some people I know about the mod, but I think you should probably use a PID or a loop with smaller hysteresis to control it, those oscillations also mean that for quite some percent of time the temperature is significantly lower, and the strength of parts printed between 40C and 60C changes significantly (CNC kitchen did a video about it using the X-Max 3). So you could get a much more polished and effective setup just by adding 1 AC-DC supply (the cheapest phone charger), 1 resistor, 1 NTC, 1 Arduino micro or Wemos D1 board, and a ready-made MOS solid state relay.
Cheers!
@@olafmarzocchi6194 no problem! I don't know if Bambu uses Igus rods, but that was a good reference to check since they are designed for the same purpose.
Yes PID would be nicer, but I wanted something with minimal effort and cost, and it seems to be doing quite well thus far. Thanks for watching!
how long did the heater last?