Heated Debate on Anarchy w/ Michael Malice | PBD Podcast | Ep. 248
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- Опубліковано 15 бер 2023
- PBD Podcast Episode 248. In this episode, Patrick Bet-David is joined by Michael Malice, Adam Sosnick and Tom Ellsworth. Protect and secure your retirement savings now with this complimentary precious metals guide. Go to goldco.com/pbd 855-594-2758
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Patrick Bet-David is the founder and CEO of Valuetainment Media. He is the author of the #1 Wall Street Journal bestseller Your Next Five Moves (Simon & Schuster) and a father of 2 boys and 2 girls. He currently resides in Ft. Lauderdale, Florida. - Розваги
Protect and secure your retirement savings now with this complimentary precious metals guide. Go to goldco.com/pbd 855-594-2758
Can you talk about more real topics not just ride Joe Rogan’s 🌰? Please
There’s a reason Michael has been on Rogan more than pbd, this podcast clearly shows why.
Jackass
@TORGITRON with conversations like this, the people win💪🏾You might not always agree with what Pbd's point of views are on certain topics, BUT it's evident that he's honest, straightforward, and speaks from the heart. Voices like his, Rogan, Michael (to name a few)is what America needs more of these days because we surely are not getting it anywhere else 🙏🏽
Anarchism, adequately understood as the collective of autonomous individuals, is the thing of the future. It is still in the womb of history. That is why MM cannot give an example of an anarchist society. Forcing the fetus out of the womb will give you a stillborn. A set of particular technological conditions must be met, one of them being the material autonomy of an individual.
The PBD Cycle;
PBD: Asks long meandering/confusing 2 minute question.
MM: Begins to answer and goes on for about 10-15 seconds.
PBD: Interrupts and begins cycle anew.
Yea havent watched the podcast yet but this plot you layed out is quite common on this show
Yeah can’t argue with this.
Because pat is just a griffter.
Yes, indeed. I for one like this pod because its an entry level place for people to disagree rather peacefully. Which is rare. Pat is sincere and his ignorance really shows on certain subjects even with his supporting cast which really only 1 is imo above average intellectually but all entertaining at times. The invaluable quality of the pod is the willingness to discuss, argue, or laugh at whatever subject is at hand. It takes a person with confidence and conviction to host people with opinions so at odds with your own you can barely fathom why they are the way they are or think the way they think. Michaels pod is one where the conversations are more in depth and articulate. Or Lex Friedman. Its up to us the consumer to get the most out of whatever information we can fish out of the world.
I like his story questions but they could be shorter
I did not expect that, as a big fan of Patrick, he was very unprepared for Michael, almost felt like he just tried to show he is superior for some reason, and not really there in conversation. If this was on MSM I would really have thought was a hit piece against Michael. Knowing Patrick though these just shows we all have always new things to learn. Good job Michael always on top without even trying to be on top.
Because Mike's ideas are silly...too many bad ppl in this world to have no government....we do need a smaller government and remind these politicians that they work for us...poltitcans have gotten out of control....especially democrat's. Rebulicans as but these democrats are on a whole different level of fascism.
Wow I am only at 54 minutes of this pod and I am ready to throw my phone through the wall. Hats off to Malice for his patience through this "interview".
I'm pretty irritated, host really sees himself as presenting the hottest and latest synthesis, if he had less of an ego, the conversation could be much smoother and it'd be less pedantic
I agree. I can't even watch this further
Just paused and read this comment.. at the 54 min mark 😅 and i feel the same. Haha
This is typically how a sales meeting with an anarchist goes. The propaganda is strong.
O like this podcast but this interview was painful to watch. Very difficult to argue with people that are programmed to accept government authority and only cares about implementation, not principles
“Stop googling and just listen” - Yesss!!
Malice 100 times: “Anarchy is a relationship, not a place”
PBD 100 times: “What country is living by these principles”
You can’t figure out what PBD meant by that question?
Very easy to understand why PBD was asking that question. Because no matter how dumbed down Michael made it, it wasn’t getting through to him. I think the question is the perfect representation of the entire interview. Anarchy is not a political party or a country or person, etc. It is a relationship. Therefore, it can’t be a country. So, if you are asking where it has worked, the answer will not be a country. It would be, for example, this podcast.
@@Sloimer As an ancap of 15 years, I know entirely why he was asking that question.
Orania in South Africa is living in this 'Anarchy' there is an example.
@@indieeric6530
Michael malice: “Anarchism is a relationship”
Also Michael Malice: “Anarchism is a personal identity that I will constantly use as my self-identifying label to make money from on the capitalist system.”
This was a tough, but good watch. Malice clearly the smartest man in the room. Felt like the PBD team knew it and couldn’t level with MM’s concepts, so they resorted to pulling him down and ad hominem attacks.
It’s a shame cos it would’ve been great to have gone deeper in the conversation. I see these guys a bit differently now, but appreciate this podcast nonetheless.
Malice held his own so shout to him. We need more conversations on true anarchy!
Literally nailed it on the head so well I thought you were reading my mind
Elaborate on "smart"
I am interested in Malice's ideas but I dont know if Im hearing workable solutions to anything. Maybe I am just not "smart".
@@ventarfield7115 It's not that you're not "smart", it's that you're not actually hearing solutions. A correction: They're not "Malice's ideas" either, but the ideas of many anarchists before him of different traditions. What Malice is essentially doing is clearing up what Anarchy *is*, as not only does anarchy have a bad rep but as an idea it's never taken seriously in neither politics nor academia, which makes it easy to misrepresent and strawman. If you're interested in the ideas and want to know more, you could pick up the Anarchist Handbook which he compiled just for that purpose.
@@kompav5621 In theory >oh so wonderful... Using common sense and being practical it could not and will not work.
So many pro Michael comments, makes me so happy. Michael will be remembered as a great teacher too humanity
to* humanity
Agreed. Makes me even more white pilled 😉
No..... It's 'too, humanity! ' *eyes staring down humanity*
@@sicari7205 Anarchy!
These pro michael comments scare me more than anything on the left
This was actually painful. I’ve commended Pbd in the past for his ability to listen to his guests and actually try and understand their point of view. But he, and everyone else for that matter, were straight up adversarial to Michael. Pat wouldn’t even let him answer let alone listen. This one was bad. Kudos to Michael for remanding calm
Because anarchy is dumb and would never work let people govern themselves when with laws we’re top 20 in murder worldwide without government intervention at all it would be purge level
Asking wikipedia what is anarchy is like asking Biden what is democracy.
Boomer shit thinking. 😊
Especially when you have the foremost living anarchist sitting a few feet away from you. That was pathetic.
Let me interrupt you while I read Wikipedia was so pathetic 😂
Maybe just prepare for the interview?
Lol I came to the comment section right after that happened and this is the first comment I see
We’re not getting smarter, we’re just getting access to more information -Michael M.
Most people are getting dumber as machines do more cognitive work. Just how we've got soft and flabby from machines doing physical work.
Like it's not getting worse, we just know more about what's going on.
I came a PBD fan and left a Michael Malice fan. Respect is earned.
Malice did a great job presenting his perspective even though Patrick did his best to interrupt. It almost seemed like Malice was ambushed.
Mr. Malice really shook my American born and raised foundations to the core. I've never been the same and I am so glad I woke the f*ck up.
So you’re woke? lol jk
Are you ready to get knocked you, I’ll get you pregnant and ghost you
if you take MM seriously you probably need help
Woke up to what
@@tck243 probably to the fact that America’s political system is totally corrupt and the fact that the govt and companies are in bed means normal people ate screwed on the daily - but I’m just guessing
This is what happens when PBD comes up against an actual thinker.
I think PBD embarrassed himself in this pod, but there was that moment where he did make Michael argue that anarchy is a bad idea. You have to give him that.
@@kahwigulumtimestamp?
@@kahwigulum timestamp? I didn’t catch that
Anarchy is a bad idea. It was considered terrorism in earlier days.
@@MohitKumar-jf8lz lol
I love M.M. for not allowing himself to be baited! Awesome job of keeping your cool, Michael!!!
I'm 55 minutes in and I think this is a GREAT EPISODE ! I'm a big fan of PBD and I'm quite familiar with Malice, but PBD is being a bit of a jerk here and it's giving Malice an opportunity to show off his intellectual chops. I've never really cared much for Malice, but it's pretty obvious he's the smartest guy in that room.
How is he smart promoting a form of government that will never exist ?
@@lalaboards You watched this podcast and your takeaway included the idea that anarchism is a form of government?
@@lalaboards You're not exactly in a position to be judging who is an isn't smart if you refer to anarchism as a form of government.
@@DarrellVermilion so no government at all… how charming . I heard him making up rules to apply to some system …….. the whole time . Who enforces Malice’s rules ? Maybe you want to play it back.
@@_.Jon._ Yes I am. Malice wants to apply anarchism a ridiculous ideology of spoiled young boys with no life experience ,understanding of history or the power structure to some system or rules he is making up . Who is going to enforce them ?
If you understand Marx there’s an authoritarian government to take away the rights of the individual , to destroy all first world civilization before man is brainwashed of all of his natural instincts, ability to discriminate into socialist man . What Malice is describing is Marxist utopia to the tee . . It’s impossible to live in the first world without some sort of governing body and some sort of rules to protect private property and individual rights . The whole podcast he is making shit up how things should go down and how things should be run. What is that called ??? Is there a new politically correct term that I am missing? He’s applying anarchism to some system in his head . Listen again . He’s applying it to a system because he’s making up rules.
Patrick, I believe you are providing a great service to our culture with your podcast. Do you genuinely believe it was effective to interrupt your guest repeatedly while he's trying to develop answers to questions YOU asked? Michael's frustration was completely justified from my perspective as a member of your audience. Then you put your guest down on top of it? I was genuinely interested in hearing the answers to your questions, but I did not get them. I believe you are capable of being a much more effective and gracious host sir.
To some extent, though, I have to think, as much as I hear, understand, and agree with Michael Malice, that Pat's interrupting and his ability to do so exemplifies that there are always people in this world who gravitate towards power and will seek to conquer simply for the sake of conquering. How does anarchy prevent tyrants from acquiring and snow-balling power and then creating a government in their own image?
@@davida.taylor8444 Although I’m no mind reader, Patrick’s interruptions and condescension seemed to be the result of ignorance and a desire to establish dominance over his guest. So I agree, even otherwise virtuous people like Patrick are complex. Then to answer your question. The same way atheism is merely the belief that no claim for a gods existence seems credible yet allows for many secular ways to be a moral individual, anarchism is simply the claim that no state power is legitimate yet it allows for many ways in which societies can be formed. It is up to those who construct their societies to deal with those who bully. Consider how people choose between Rogan and CNN anchors. He’s very gracious and generous with his guests and pushes back when necessary. CNN anchors appear to be bought and paid for by their corporate owners, unnecessarily combative in some cases, and overly conciliatory in others. And the people choose Rogan overwhelmingly.
Patrick has lost his sincerity and patience with guests due to people who make him question his insurance monopoly
@@davida.taylor8444 I really like your point and it was sad that Pat didn't try or wasn't successful in making this exact point. With that said, I totally agree with Phillip Cullin's point too. Pat didn't handle it well and came across combative and condescending.
Pat reminds me of conversations with many naiv people who listen only to msn narratives and when one talks about scientific topics like climate change, corona or other 'controversial' topics they are oblivious to the point that 'truths' not get the spotlight its deserves. Michael made the point many times that 'truths' are not successful but its own. Many business people belives that if you have a good product it would sell like my friends thinks that if something is true the scientific and academic sphere would embrace it and talk about it rationally. Thats not how things are. Would've loved if they went into this topic more but it seems that they are too far off from each other.
Here are some quotes from my friends: 'if there is merit to it, the scientific/academic sphere would discuss it"
"scientists love controversy and love to discuss it"
"if it is true, the truth will come out"
"well even if it took 50 years to see that its actually true, this shows that the system works"
quality ≠ success
The simplest meaning of anarchy is everyone doing what is right in their own eyes, and this is exactly what chaos is…
PBD: Asks long meandering/confusing 2 minute question.
MM: Begins to answer and goes on for about 10-15 seconds.
PBD: Interrupts and begins cycle anew.
The adderall and roids are taking their toll
Yea dude his brain is getting fried. I like PBD but his mental acuity is really bad compared to what it used to be. I honestly am worried that he might have something going on behind the scenes
“What kind of guillotine?” Michael Malice
Literally dying! 😅😅😅😅
Michael Malice is the perfect embodiment of this quote to me : . First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.
M. Malice's grace while being interrupted from the guys holding him accountable for his interruptions early on was incredible to watch
I'm not sure I could handle someone telling me what I'm trying to say.
Malice has the patience of a saint. This PBD guy just cannot keep himself from interrupting answers to his own questions. Maybe that's why he has such difficulty grasping what is being said.
Malice, god love him, wasn't answering the questions. How do you implement Anarchy in a society in a functional way?
Dude everything he said was a dodge. Pbd was not interrupting him too much, Michael was pivoting away from every specific question
Too busy googling 'what is anarchism'
Michael’s argument of anarchy being a relationship not a place is his most compelling argument of late. We engage in anarchy almost everyday. Anytime we act within the market voluntarily, we engage in anarchy. Anytime we voluntarily spend time with friends and family we are engaging in anarchy. Anarchy is everywhere, all the time. Anarchy is the natural state of human interaction and the artificial construct is the state and injecting itself and regulating our voluntarily interactions.
Nailed it. Now, how great would it have been if PBD could've got that through his thick skull and moved on to other interesting topics. This shit was painful to watch.
This doesn’t make sense. Individuals act with the knowledge that they are in a society with laws enforced by government.
Some people can’t visit their families because of borders or money enforced by governments. He is ignoring coercion and calling it anarchy
@@MOME914 That is the state injecting itself into our lives. They are interfering with the natural ebb and flow of human relationships.
Anarchy is not a thing. It’s LACK of a thing: unjustified authority. Like atheism isn’t a thing, it’s a lack of a thing.
Everything peaceful and voluntary is beautiful anarchy.
Malice is going right over his head, you can tell from his questions PBD is not able to follow.
Damn. Lookin at PBD a little different way after this. It takes a real open mind to try and comprehend what Michael is saying. Patrick is saying people don't or won't get it, and is proving himself right by not really listening what Michael is saying. Huh...this was an interesting one.
Same feeling here, long time fan of both Michael and Pat.
Yeah was odd. Pat's worst interview for a while, I felt frustrated for Michael. Big fan of both guys too.
What do you mean? Patrick is like this with everybody he doesn't agree with. He is going to press you on the subject. Be ready. Doesn't mean he is not "real open minded".
@@Hughe1188 press? By insisting they are something they aren't? By literally repeating questions that have been answered? By constantly interrupting? Yeah, ok. 😅😅😅
@Renaissance Statesman He doesn't have an opinion on his own country. That is getting smashed BTW. I don't even need to go on.
I've never seen Malice get so annoyed at an interviewer lol
Because it wasn't an interview, it was PBD trying to express his views over his guests. He is so insecure its sad honestly.
Yeah but he never backs down to make it even a tiny bit more comfortable for himself. He probably knew these guys were dense but not that persistent, as if nothing gets through. Literally nothing.
Patrick straightened him out 😁
Because from the first second of the interview they were patronizing Malice. This whole interview seems smug, patronizing, and ill intent. PBD usually comes off curious and allows his guest to make their points. This seemed off
@@Christorment5 When disagrees he does this he doesn't treat views from the opposing side with the same curiosity
PBD lost the plot. Haha gets upset when interrupted only to later tell Michael to get use to being interrupted during this podcast...so good. Malice is a beauty for all his patience.
This has high school jock vibes. If you can't use the idea to ''win'' or be popular, PBD doesn't want it. Michael's point is logical and humane, and he doesn't care if it's popular.
Not really, it's an idealistic philosophy. It deserves challenge, but this isn't the show where you can expect a good challenge on this particular topic.
How does anarchist communities protect themselves from bigger and more powerful ones? How do they keep Machiavellians out? How do they protect themselves from being enslaved? Throughout history, the main commonality between enslaved people have been weak states, which couldn't protect it's people. Only with the rise of powerful nation-state and respective armies, people were protected from being subjected to slavery.
What is Michael's solution to this conundrum which makes state appear to be necessary?
Isnt communitarianism worth approaching more, since it's the political vehicle to actually form anarchist communities? These could've been topics which might have pin point some issues with anarchism or Michael could've dismantled them believable.
😁
@@k4yser Nothing is perfect, but having a government like we do now that steals money from us through taxes and can shut us down, force vaccines, forbid us to buy gas stoves, etc all while laundering our money and keeping our borders open and letting criminals rule the streets
@@k4yser I think you're operating under the assumption that Malice is an anarcho-pacifist when he outright stated he isn't a pacifist. Anarchism isn't antithetical to organization, for public defense or otherwise. Anarchism simply entails that organization can't be done through coerced participation. If you want to understand philosophical anarchism in constitutional terms as he represents it, amarchism entails that freedom of association is paramount above all other human rights. It's a constitutionally enumerated natural right that is infringed more than just about any other.
I don't like how Patrick had Michael on as a guest to interview but then he spent a good amount of time pushing his views and interrupting Michael. That came across as disrespectful and it was easy to see the disappointment on Malice's face.
You guys fundamentally misunderstood this man for over 2 hours straight 🤣😂🤣😂
It must have been so frustrating for him
Pat: “I want you to get upset”
Micheal: “I’m not gonna get upset” 😂
That’s the entire episode if you’re just watching.
I love that he kept his mindset on, “I’m American, I’m not Ukrainian.” I was born in Poland and my relatives as well. They are always stuck on the, “I love Poland, it’s my homeland, it’s so wonderful and I hate it here.” Well, we moved when I was 14. I was molded by the United States. Learned English, appreciated the culture, learned the laws, became a citizen, etc. I am not Polish…I am FROM Poland but I am American.
Soon you may wish you had stayed in Poland. We are falling fast along with Canada and Western Europe. You have no idea how bad it is now if you weren’t here pre-1966
@@lloydbraun6026 We have our issues. You are definately American born. Until you experience other countries and societies you do not see just how good we still have it. And we Are arguably approaching a low point.
@@lloydbraun6026 I don’t know. I travel back to Poland, Croatia and some other places quite regularly. Although I haven’t been back to Europe since 2019 but I can assure you despite our issues, this is still the greatest country on earth. It will become like the worst of the worst if they continue down this path but it’s still pretty awesome here. I respect other countries rules and culture. I’m not saying, “USA is the worlds authority.” However I wouldn’t trade any amenities or the freedoms we have here. Maybe better pierogis or holubtsi. 🫡😅
And as an American who was born here, I’m so glad you do call yourself American because YOU ARE ❤
@@lloydbraun6026 I 100% disagree with this. Things are bad but still the best place on Earth to live. Sadly, we may all be talking about how good it WAS soon.
Watching Michael continuously trying to explain how anarchy works was like watching someone explain fire to a fish. In the environment (mindset) that they hold, the idea of individuals not being under a false authority of another or others is just impossible for them to wrap their heads around.
Because it is. The only anarchist society would be a Hoppean anarchocapitalism
@kanyerules7606 interesting. I hadn't heard the term anarcho-capitalism before. I looked it up, and it sounds like what Michael was suggesting. My understanding of 'anarchy' is pretty much what anarcho-capitalism outlines.
To keep it simple, it's basically the free-market system 'the West' uses, minus the government rulership over the people. It's true individual freedom. The only thing stopping that from being a reality right now is the fact that most people, including Pat and his team, can't fathom the idea of not being ruled over by someone else.
Most of us have become accustomed to the idea of man's authority over other men and can't see how we could live without that sort of slave-tyrant dynamic. For a long time, society has been ruled over by kingdoms, religious organizations, or governments. All have proven to be more destructive than necessary because wielding power over others goes against human nature and requires force (proof that it isn't natural). It drives the ones who want rulership into psychopathy and the ones who are subject to such rulership into ignorance and poverty (monetary, physical, mental, spiritual).
@@tstyleartistry Yes. It's weird because he kind of mixes ancapism with normal anarchy. He quotes Rothbard a lot which was the founder of anarchocapitalism.
But then he goes on to say "aristocracy" is complete shit when ancapism IS a form of aristocracy, not democracy or anarchy. Anarchism means no hierarchy, not strictly non-state, while the hierarchy in the ancapism IS a NATURAL hierarchy formed through voluntary relationships, it's still a hierarchy. There would be systems of governance, the only difference is they are voluntary.
@@tstyleartistry I think there's a big reason ancapism is practically impossible and if it happened today without a "cleanse" of the ruling elites, it would be the complete destruction of Western civ. Plus, the pop mass is generally very dumb and can't grasp purely philosophical/abstract ideas and are more easily "converted" with a story. This is why I think a Christian base is NEEDED for Ancapism to work, so that the people are regulated by a set of voluntary, spiritual laws and so that we can actually put it into practice.
You may be anti-christian but the political philosophy of Catholicism thinkers like Aquinas is VERY, VERY similar to ancapism in practice and IMO should be used as a transitory form of governance before going into ancapism. A buddhist society would also be a great base for voluntarism/ancapism.
@@tstyleartistry Islam plus many other religions are AWFUL "moral bases" for ancapism, for instance. It simply wouldn't work there. I was a pure ancap for a long, long time though, but now I see a transition necessary
Man, I love PBD but Malice, unsurprisingly, wiped the floor with these folks. Truly incredible responses!
As choppy as the dialogue was, it was a great example of what it's like to talk to most people about these ideas. Talk about a master-class
Lol PBD lost this one, he never figured out what anarchy is
Michael's frustration at Patrick's inability to grasp his concepts is very understandable. Interruptions are stupid.
💯
When he said “I’m a very little boy” that was a ninja star to PBD’s head
I don't think it's because PBD can't grasp the concepts. He has an incentive to not understand them. He'll readily admit we're on a dark path and there are problems but he doesn't want fundamental change. He's in a blessed position and last thing he's going to do is rock the boat. So instead he'll just play stupid like the idea itself can't be understood.
Anarchy doesn't mean logic is your choice
"It's difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends upon his not understanding it"
-Upton Sinclair
Malice is on another level. No one can keep up with him.
I just don't get what you see that i don't, His arguments just don't make sense or have any kind of reality as a base.
If Anarchy works then Somalia is the pinnacle of society.
@@visiousbrute If
Democracy works then why the hell is america about ready to burn and die?
@@visiousbrute You are misunderstanding, Somalia has a government, the government is the gang leader, the police are the henchmen and the rules are what the gang leader. Somalia is another government country its just the government doesn't wear suits and call themselves politicians. It is still a government system based on coercion and violence. What anarchists want is less coercion and more voluntary transactions.
@@StrictlySealed No shit Sherlock. That what happens when you order society with anarchy.
I am not misunderstanding, you are too dumb to think.
@@visiousbrutedoes make sense and his points on why gov doesnt work. And its a realationship.
If I ever wondered before, more and more PBD shows he's a salesman through and through. Respect to Michael Malice for this conversation. Respect to the PBD Podcast and crew for having him.
Michael’s, “I’m a little boy that needs to be in bed” was absolutely brilliant. Unbelievable. Magnificently defused the situation that PDB kept creating. Michael always continues to impress me.
True, but PBD is the best! Did you see the gift he bought his friend at the end?
Huh, I thought Patrick was being Michael's straight man or led Michael into the comic relief. Michael sounded defensive and looked like a prickly uptight cactus. So, thank you Patrick.
@@beecee9681
But PDB is still way off base in his view of progress. It's based on looking at the last decade or so of history. When you look farther back you see his 'progress' is nothing more than a hiccup in our decades long slide into communism. It's the view of someone being beaten when their attacker tires of hitting him. You're still on the ground
It's because Mike comes off as annoying at times. That's not the interviewers fault....
@@devinvez3869
Disagree. PDB acted like a lot of leftist when you threaten their God (government). He fails to see how he's conditioned to believe the things he does and views Mike's ideas as dangerous. Has he ever once noticed how many things work well without any or minor government intrusion?
Billions of people drive cars everyday and yet most injuries are caused by accidents not madmen out to kill people. Millions of Americans own guns yet a tiny fraction of them are ever used to commit crime and most of the time by people who weren't supposed to have them to begin with.
Now I'm not saying I completely agree with Michael but it has to be pointed out that fear of having a weak or no government is exaggerated.
Most of us couldn't imagine the world we're living in now where the left goes insane over not being allowed to groom kids in school. If that sort of cultural unity can be created for something like grooming it sure as hell can be for basic anti-criminality. Ridding us of the need for a police state. And just like the left was indoctrinated to believe the things they do the same can be done for what Libertarians want.
Pat was being an obtuse jerk. Wasn't listening to Michael. Pat just came in with his argumentative game plan and it didn't matter what Michael said. Just moving the goal post, not trying to understand, being a rude antagonizing interviewer..... Michael keeping his composure was very impressive
100%
This is what he does when someone has opposing views, on his show. He can't helpself but make the show about his views and how the opposing view is wrong. Why even bring guests on if you are not going to let them finish their point or even engage they idea. You can be curious, and engage an opposing idea without saying you agree with it.
Yes
I unfortunately agree. I've never seen pat have this smug, close minded vibe. Or maybe I've never realized it, but this was just straight up out there.
100%
Malice wipes the floor with PBD.
If his goal was to demonstrate how his intellect was superior, then yes. If he was trying to benefit the population or explain to the common man the importance of his ideas, he failed miserably.
First time I am hearing Michael Malice speak. I am spellbound hearing his thoughts. Impressive and brilliantly smart. The way he answers every question calmly and politely while being probed is awesome 👏
Listened to this podcast on Spotify and had to come to UA-cam for the comments. Thank the lord everyone else can clearly see Michael running circles around the PBD team
Same lol. I love PBD but it seemed like Pat was consistently failing to grasp what Malice was saying and misunderstanding him.
How the hell is he running circles around him? Malice is thinking in a fantasy world. You implement what he believes I will be the one taking everything to have with the people who think like me. People who have his ideals will never have a successful society.
@@BeerBreath702 are you saying you have the right to steal stuff and commit aggressions? If not, then you're an anarchist.
Me too haha! Unbelievable innit
@@BeerBreath702 it's not so much that Michael is running circles around him based on the merits of his argument but PBDs failure to grasp what Michael is saying and making irrelevant interjections
You really think PBD is a smart guy until Micheal comes on the podcast😂
I think PBD is fine don't know about his buddies though.
I thought that too until Michael showed on Rogan that he still believes that a cop was murdered on Jan 6. Still doesn’t know that was a lie.
100%
@@via_negativa6183 well, buddy. There's only 1 person that isn't intelligent & well read up there.
PBD is perfect
You are a true gentleman Mr. Malice. I love how your ideas and how well you explain them triggered these guys, especially PBD.
Malice speaking facts, Pat got scared! 😂
PBD wasn’t very respectful with the interruptions. A lot of the answers they would’ve received and understood would be possible had they just listened thoroughly.
LMAO Michael's sense of humor is absolutely brutal and hilarious!
Yes!!!
I love Michael Malice and his sick sense of humor!
Lmao 🤣 I didn't realize Patt was more offended by Anarchy than he is by Communism. Interesting to see the perspective 🤔 👀
I love Michael Malice, although he is serious about his views, he has the natural ability to laugh at his self. Thanks PBD for having him on your show!
God bless your words my friend. I think you are more alive than dead. Jk ❤ It feels very pleasant to listen to him.
Malice spread the lie that Trump told people to drink Clorox … never forget
Funny how they tried to put words in his mouth.
This is his best quality.
I agree! He’s fabulous.
Malice's patience in this is shocking
I wanted to walk out and I’m just listening! Can’t believe how well he did dealing with them …
😂 Since the first couple of minutes I was like "Oh gawd"..still dig the pod tho.
Malice is showing deep respect for PBD. I'm sure they have great convos when it's just those 2.
yes.... also is hilarious he has to read from wikipedia what Anarchy means ... just prepare before the pod
Are you serious? Malice arguments was not that good. It’s just like an alchemist saying that they know the recipe for gold but everyone knows that it’s just imaginations.
Malice was arrogant in my opinion
Michael Malice is funny, smart and leaving the others behind him.
Michael is such a great guest, I hope you guys have him back many times.
I'll watch any podcast episode with Michael Malice. He's such an interesting and thought-provoking guy.
Sure but this put me off pbd and I thought I was a fan
@@declanellard1269 me too. This is fucking pathetic. He should be embarrassed. It’s not just a “bad day” for him. It’s two hours of him demonstrating consistent, very deep character flaws
@@declanellard1269 This is my first episode and I've come away with "Are they always this stupid?"
MM "That's the definition of anarchy."
PBD "No..." after just moments before finding out what anarchy was, from Wikipedia, and STILL not understanding THAT poor definition...
👍
when he was trying to explain to Michael what anarchy means I just lost it
I've never seen PBD interrupt any guests like this. The podcast gets better. Great guest with great points.
I love how malice cannot hide his 'are you stupid dude Wtf is this?' tone and face.
Now that PBD is getting way more popular guests, i wonder how long he will keep up the odd "I am a genius Podcaster that talks to smart people so I am also smart" illusion
‘fake it ‘til you make it’, perhaps?
@@kensurrency2564 I think it was good timing on his part. It used to be hard to make a podcast good. The Trump years helped him become very popular.
Now ah days you can rent out a podcast room for cheap that has everything you need. Cameras, mics, switching, and they may offer editing if someone there does that. So it is flooded.
I made a program a while back that used audio processing in real time to auto mute coughs, auto switching (already been done), and auto censoring swears in the first 10 or 15 minutes without a tone (that censor tone also tells UA-cam that it was a swear, fucked up but it is true.) but stopped there after it was a bit slow due to a crappy speech to text api.
Then after posting my thesis paper on it. A few months later nvidia had similar tech. Then later I found a physical device that does all of that and more.
Good that it is so much easier but now it is so lucky to get a popular one.
@@kensurrency2564 oddly he seemed to have made it. There was some flubs along the way that kinda showed how he got into this world.
The biggest one was going on Joe rogan and giving him a bunch of gifts. Asked him after to do something Joe already said he would not do because he does not want to.
Then he was basically given the thanks but no thanks.
Not gonna lie, Pat got cooked on this one. Great podcast overall 👏🏼.
😂 💯
pbd had such an interesting thinker on his podcast and messed it up
instead of trying to analyse why his ideas are well received and critically examine his ideas in a polite manner, they bullied him unneccessarily
I agree. I'm a huge PBD fan, but in conversations like this...PBD kinda gets in his own way. It sounds like... because Pat has achieved a fulfilling level of success with his own carved out philosophy/rationalization...there can't be any other thought, rationalization, or philosophical path to a similar level of fulfillment...or understanding of morality. That's what I got from him in this pod.
Yeah I'm barely 40min in and not quite understanding what's happening. It's like all the hosts are pissed at Michael for even daring to question authority lmao. Like they're taking it very personally for no reason. Normally the podcast is great and they have no trouble speaking to people from right or left. Yet apparently malice is too much for them. Very unbecoming.
@@dannyhorwitz39well said. Seems like many people do this too. If they can't understand an idea or philosophy then its not them, it's the idea itself must not be understandable by anyone.
@Dylan - and you can see it on Michael's face how agitated he is when he's either interrupted or his words were explained back to him in a twisted manner lol
@@dannyhorwitz39very strange. I've seen these guys talk politely with tons of guests they didn't agree with, but with malice they're just being dicks to him for no reason. As much as these guys see the surface level issues of our society I don't think any of them would ever want drastic change. Things may be fucked up but it's working out well enough for them so Malice's ideas are a danger to their reality. Never seen this kind of reaction from them before.
Was so excited to see this podcast happening! After the first hour, it was the podcast I came for. The first hour is felt like PBD pressing Michael on things he should have brought up in their last podcast together.
I've never gotten more poignant content out of a book on a per page basis than I did from The White Pill. It is truly special and would benefit anyone to read it.
The problem here is PBD and Team are only able to see the world in terms of Red and Blue. You bring on someone who has Green ideas and it’s like a video game glitch… Michael’s viewpoints are very abstract, and idealistic, they’re interesting, you have to come with an open mind to really try and understand what he’s trying to explain. Not a great conversation but enjoyed the show nonetheless.
PBD’s thinking is a millimeter deep. He should stick with basketball.
Michael has been hitting them with those green ideas and they just can't grasp it, if anything very disrespectful as if later in the day society will be ruled by anarchist and the hosts are trying everything to keep the current state of government 'Red and Blue' lala land. Just because something is popular or controlled doesn't mean it's the right way, unfortunately this common in society where green just doesn't exist as you say it's just a glitch
PBD only knows right and left and doesn’t understand alternative opinion
The utopian idea is a great idea but that's all it is, you cannot apply it in a large scale just like anarchism.
@@views8962 didn't say it was
WOW. PBD out of his league with Malice. Impressive. As usual.
A few points could have been better, but PBD is a national treasure. I'm liking his show more than JRE lately.
PBD really needs to take a freshman polisci 101 course, but he seems way too arrogant to realize his ignorance.
@@dmitriyk4322 so basically he doesn't share every political view as you do...? You know what...you must be a fan of Mike because he also seems like a know it all .
@@devinvez3869 no, he completely doesn't understand basic concepts like anarchy. Anarchy could be a political system but the concept itself is not. PBD had trouble understanding this.
LOL all of the anarchist nut huggers agreeing with this baseless statement, no reference to where one is "right" or the other "wrong" - just anarchist cope nut-huggin' without description or explanation. Seriously, Malice is breeding a useless contingent that is just as arrogant and clueless as the commies.
1:22:28 Pat’s head shake is so telling. He’s as brainwashed as most people.
yup
My rights are not up for discussion, let alone a vote. Whether it be 75% of the population, the will of one king, or the whim of 100 senators. - Michael Malice. #Voluntaryism #Anarchism #NaturalLaw #NaturalRights
But they can be sold to the highest corporate bidder.
@@peterhorton9063only if the government can take them in the first place
He is right, you all just love subduing the minority with your ideas
@@peterhorton9063Did you just not read the first 7 words of his comment?
@@barefoothippielibtard9691 It was a joke. Yall so sensitive. And yes i read it. He said they are not up for discussion, but they are for sale to the highest bidder.
Pat: "You can interrupt me, I'm a big boy"
Pat: "😢Don't interrupt me!!"
Lmao 🤣
I'm 25 minutes in, why are they being so adversarial towards Michael?
Are they threatened?
Right. I think all the hosts struggled to understand anarchy. And Michael didn't do a good job explaining.
They’re too dumb to understand
@@jrgarciab he explained it just fine.
@@user-ph2cl7fi8l Michael has become the ambassador of the anarchist movement, if we can call it that. He was on a podcast with three hosts that didn't understand his message. If a classroom didn't get the message, would you blame the students or the teacher? In this case, Michael was the teacher and didn't do a good job. I guess I'm putting more of the burden on Michael because, like I said, he's now an ambassador.
@@user-ph2cl7fi8l True. I can accept that.
Surpised at how combative Pat was towards Malice.
Yeah it's not a great way to learn from people.. I don't think he even considered anything malice said.
@@odriivaiilliianxlogically. Duh.
@@odriivaiilliianx Your inability to comprehend the logic is not evidence of a lack of logic. What option does that leave? Another one that you cannot comprehend.
@@odriivaiilliianx I'd recommend making an actual point, rather than just using an ad hominem. Otherwise you're just illustrating the point that you don't comprehend the word "logic" by committing a blatant fallacy.
@@odriivaiilliianx you are, yes.
I truly hope Michael read all these comments supporting him, it's refreshing to see everyones take on this episode. Michael is just mind-blowing.
My father taught me not to interrupt. I don't care what is going on, I'll let someone talk. My father told me that" you have 2 ears, and one mouth. Listen twice, speak once".
Michael is the man. I find it hilarious that pat and the boys can't comprehend any of malices points. I give it a like because of him. Pat you were kind of being a dick though...
Michael did a great job of being patient with Pat. 😂
I’m a big fan of this show and Michael, so very much enjoyed this one.
This is too funny. This is 2 hours and 28 minutes of Malice showing how intellectually superior he is, without even trying to do so.
michael malice 2 thumbs up. love his ideas
Malice outclassed and exposed y’all. Not in a malicious way but talk about saying you’re open to conversation without actually being open
Michael ran circles around pat on the anarchist debate honestly
this one was tough, Pat as always giving his "what if!" but I also could see how this anarchy situation can't really work and Pat was trying to make sense of it.
Michael is one of my heroes, I love that little SOB.
I really think PBD underestimated Michael's intelligence
I don't think he had ever heard of Malice and just kind of grouped MM in with Flat Earthers and other unhinged types. We all know MM has no problem being a wise guy and cutting stupid people down to size. That being said he showed extreme restraint on these gentlemen even though they may have deserved different.
Michael is my favorite guest, he is rational and very intelligent and I share his vision.
Pat really showed exactly what I been saying about him, he’s a salesman trying to sell you on the idea that he is a thinker. He has great guest but Pat rarely ever understands what they are saying.
This felt a lot like a Cathy Newman interview.
"so what your saying is...." --PBD the entire interview
Malice lowkey owned pbd and I’m a huge pbd fan.
Totally disagree, Michael wants in self governing fantasyland. PBD is right, when has anarchy worked
@@ewessel560lol you missed the point too. Anarchy works everywhere every day.
Malice owns everyone.
I agree.
@@ewessel560 you don’t get it. Michael wants to push the totalitarians so hard they give an inch, then a mile. Totalitarianism is the norm, he HAS to be on the other extreme to even get them to check their rierview, let alone let off the gas
I think Pat is so hung up on the label. Anarchy
it makes me wonder if we should rebrand
@@zackglickert4495 Maybe, I think it's a good term for clarity.
I think it's very common for anyone who advocates for freedom, look at how every time something bad happens they retcon a reason why it's deregulation that caused the problem.
Someday it will click for Pat.
@@philipvecchio3292 yeah i hope as he hears it more it will start to make more sense to him
The word has a bad reputation, by design. Those in power have to demonize the concept because it threatens their existence and thirst for control. A friend of mine in school first exposed me to the word, and I was totally unaware about what it meant. No government teacher will explain the concept. It is forbidden. That’s why the VAST majority of humans either have no opinion or a negative opinion on the concept. I’m not surprised that Pat is perplexed. He has become ‘successful’ under the rules of the current system. Sure, he works hard, but he cannot imagine a mode outside the current paradigm. Most people can’t.
Oh I like Michael....we speak the same language....thank you Patrick for bringing him on, and thank you Michael for accepting...Great to meet you....😇
Malice revealing that Liz Cheney was the model for Miss Piggy is by far my most favorite thing I’ve ever witnessed.
Malice is the demon troll of the people. Perhaps the only person in public life that doesn't take the internet seriously, at all. Always a breath of fresh air.
A monster that fights monsters
When it goes full circle and he's just a mindless grifter
He’s just another podcaster with a different grift. Relax.
@@Sloimer seems like grift is the word of the day from the peanut gallery. I am very relaxed. Your trolling is unproductive and pointless. If Malice is a grifter, then you are even lower ranking in troll status than that
More like an exasperation.
Pat looked very lost here , Micheals concepts are more in practice than Pat would admit.
I think it's more cause he still didn't quite grasp the concept
@@High_Key He literally asked him for an example of a anarchist government - he didn't grasp it all lol
@@dragonozwald9184 Haiti. Enjoy.
Pat, here’s a priceless piece of advice: when you ask a question you actually need to let the person answer. Or put simpler: STFU 😂
Genuinely shocked how much of a douche Patrick was in this episode. Usually such a level headed guy.
Eye opening conversation. Didn't realize what mental midgets PBD and his crew are.
I love this podcast but I've known this forever. Go watch old videos of Pat interviewing communists. He doesn't even debate them and just says stuff like "man you're wild, man you're out there." Then literally plays on his phone as they talk. And basically he ends the interview acting like "wow look at me, I was in a pit with a bear! Who else goes into bear pits?! I'm super open minded!" Used to piss me off but I've come to appreciate him for his positives.
That is because Pat and crew are "smart" within the corporate, capatilist, statistical outcome world. They don't seem to know much history, philosophy, or religion. Thus, ignorant to what Michael brings.
@@sheaholloway9537 I agree! And that's why I love the show. I'm not "smart" in that way and he gives me a great perspective on what's going on in America through the people who understand the systems eye. But man is he dumb on everything else. Also I like that his vibe is always pushing people to do better.
Whenever they have someone who doesn’t align with their worldview it gets hairy like that. But this was hard to listen too at all the times PBD kept interrupting.
@@sheaholloway9537 Exactly, whenever the convo gets steered off, these guys are over their skis
Based on this interview, I’m not doubting PBD lacking sleep. I feel like Malice answered the same question on repeat. PBD seemed to want a different answer.
That’s the easiest way to describe Michael’s ideas, “You do not speak for me”
This is so annoying to watch Michael being interrupted before he can get 1 full sentence in. I love MM.
Probably the best / clearest explanation I've heard on Anarchy, really great job by Malice and a very patient one ! Especially useful since the general public tends to have a negative bias on the term which would change if it was understood the way he so well described
If this is what anarchy is, it sounds like corporate rule or just feudalism
PBD is thinking for the future of cash, while Malice is thinking for the future of humanity
PBD is realistic. Malice is idealistic....and we know how those two philosophies turn out (well, if you've ever studied any history at all).
@@leetjohnson sure dude, grifting is all about realism ;-)
@Truth Seeker keep seeking the truth, you're on the right track being here on the PBD podcast.
which one of them employs and empowers people of all kinds ... its not who you think
@@leetjohnson unlike you, my eyes and heart are open and searching for truth. I'm not a mindless tribalist nor fanboy.
Takeaway: PBD and the crew were arguing from a perspective that they are able to thrive in the existing systems so its a good system and Michael is arguing that its not a good system for the people as a whole who are not benefitting from the system and would do better or at least be in a fairer environment under an anarchistic landscape.
Because of this, the VTainment crew was more trying to snuff out the opposing argument rather than argue their own point