Elton John sent a Christmas card to the Lennons in New York, where they occupied an entire floor of the Dakota Building. He inscribed: "Imagine six apartments/It isn't hard to do/One is full of fur coats/Another just for shoes".
The room full of fur coats was refrigerated to protect the natural animal hair from deterioration and insects. The room had almost 100 full-length mink and other highly valued fur coats. Elton John probably had a large room to hold his vast collection of designer eye-glasses.
My car has garbage speakers and only the amp built into the head unit, and Steely Dan still sounds phenomenal. Just all around expertly crafted music. Perhaps not coincidentally, I mostly listen to Steely Dan while driving.
Correct. Why would Steely Dan model themselves after a multi-millionaire who when he wasn't writing gibberish like "Imagine no possessions?" liked to run around a club in LA wearing a Kotex pad on his head ?.
This gets said a lot. But most don’t anticipate getting assassinated at 40. Even if a person gets sick at that age they have trouble writing out a will
A multi millionaire rock star telling me to have no possessions has never sat well with me and I applaud Donald Fagan for writing the song. See I'm not the only one.
Lennon was such a hypocrite , talking about “peace” while he beat up his first wife, Cynthia. He was also notorious for getting drunk and brawling with anyone who pis#ed him off ( the May Pang-Los Angeles -Lost Weekend ). Mr Peace and Love, my ass.
Fully agree and that’s why he was killed too not that it’s a reason to kill but what a hypocrite ! RIP Walter . Walter and Donald were both geniuses. Thank God we still have Donald.
20 years ago when I was younger and certainly dumber I would have disagreed with you. Thankfully many of us, including me got older and wiser. To the greater degree, John was just another boring virtue signaler. And Yoko Ono? OMG... WTF. But his marrying her only serves to support my feelings on the matter today. My god she's a tw*t.
I remember Can't Buy a Thrill but I was pretty busy with young living at the time and there was so much amazing music going on. Their catalog is just brilliant and today, I play them almost every day.
I'll always be grateful I got to see these legends in a live performance. They were doing one of their rare tours, and were at Irvine amphitheater c. 1997, normally I really dislike crowds and lines but to see these two greats, I felt like I was walking on air while cold sober. Becker was dressed in jeans like an every man, which he wasn't of course, but Donald Fagen proceeded to take over the show dressed in 90's dark casual suit with no tie that was the style. Fagen's performance was effortless and it was obvious we were watching a master at work; watching him and Becker perform as Steely Dan for one of the last times, was an experience I remember with reverence. Sadly Walter Becker left us in 2017 - but I'll always remember the time I saw two legends of music perform live.
I was at that show - unfort NOT very sober. But... I swear you could drop the needle on any song they were playing and you'd be hard pressed to tell the difference between the live song and the LP version. They were just that good. Definitely in the top #5 concerts I've been able to go to.
Thanks for the description. I got every record the Dan ever made but didn't get to see them live. They always inspired me to be a better musician. Thanks for filling out the image.
As a 14 year old, I thought it was a nice song. As a 24 year old, I realized more what it meant. By age 54 I remember having experienced a deeper feeling and thought process about it.
Saw them do that album at the Beacon in NY some years back.Was great except for some 22 yr olds standing and dancing making noice,was ready to throw a punch the ushers had to come by and stop them,more than once,America for you.
Hey Dancer, ever the rabbit hole diver, I’ve wasted a lot of time in the past trying to analyze Becker & Fagen’s lyrics. I’ve resigned myself to just enjoy what I’m hearing musically first, and the analysis is just not that “important” anymore. I’ve heard all the interpretive stories of their deep meaning…and sorry - but I’m just not convinced they want or need ME (of all people) to try and decode the message. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar…
I saw them in April 1974 at the San Diego Sports Arena I was 18yo. I bragged all thru the 80's that I was one of the very few people who had seen them live, then the 90's came and everybody had seen them live! I also saw them here in Houston in the 90's. But yeah, what a band! I was dancing like crazy on the floor of the Sports Arena to my favorite song, Bodhisattva.
@@AndySalinger33 They were sooooo good ! I don’t think that SD got the recognition that it deserved; BUT I’m so happy that they were inducted by the R&R HOF in 2001, before Walter passed. It blows my mind that they only received 4 Grammys, and not until the 2000s.
@@graciesmom62 right on. I’m with you. And yeah, even at the time they were inducted, I recall feeling so glad it was happening while they were both still with us! And though I realize SD is highly regarded by people like us, I agree…they don’t get nearly the accolades and adoration their art rightly deserves. They were simply too smart for this world. Their music was too advanced for its time. And thank God that’s the case, eh? It sure makes for some good listening. As in…a whole lifetime of listening. They are the soundtrack. Cheers. And send my regards to Gracie…wherever she may be.
True Lennon didn't live his ideals, but if he was an 'elite', Fagen and Becker probably weren't far behind. Donald Fagens net worth was recently estimated at fifty million, presumably Walters worth was about the same. So pretty 'elite" too. Nothing against them haveing a shot at Lennon though, he was a troubled man and could be a right insensitive d**k.
Hmmm. It's possible to see "Only a Fool" as an answer to "Imagine," but in this video I didn't hear any real connection showing Fagan and Becker intended that. On the other hand, Costello's line--"Wasn't it a millionaire who said imagine no possessions?" --leaves no doubt as to the target of his skepticism.
When you realize that Imagine is a hateful anti western society, pro atheists pro communist propaganda piece. Then you get it. I just wish I had heard about their connection sooner. John Lennon was a pos in my opinion. He deserves to be derided. Particularly for how he allowed Ono to treat his son Julian.
Cerebral & masters of tongue in cheek self abasement. "The kid will live & learn..., As he watches his bridges burn..., From the point of no return...,😅!
@@ACDZ123- Get over your hero worship. Lennon was a hypocrite and an ass, and his music self-important to the point of being trite. Fagan and Becker nailed it, seeing him for exactly what he was.
Clean this mess up or we'll all end up in jail Those test tubes and the scale. Just get em all outta here. Is there gas in the car? (Yes there's gas in the caah!) I think the people down the hall know who you are! Nobody was singing about stuff like that!!
I was a DJ at a small station in central Vermont in '72. Went to Baltimore to visit my very hip cousin who turned me on to SD ("Do It Again"). Bought a copy of the album and played the vinyl on air, for the first time in that area, I suspect. Was that really half a century ago?
Donald Fagan can be polarizing, arrogant, opinionated, and cynical but he's certainly not stupid! He's got a razor sharp wit, and he's pretty well spot on with his criticism.
@@terryboyer1342 Complete opposite of Trump. complete. Intelligent, sincere, hard working, creates things of value. On one of their later albums he sung "That right-wing hooey sure stunk up the joint".
I don't know about anyone else, but it seems to me that "Do It Again" has lyrics describing various addictions or vices. So I love to play it on the jukebox as I indulge my Bowling addiction. It really is something!
I had bought their greatest hits CD from 1972 to 78, And in 2000 and they were least “Two Against Nature”. I finally saw the band in 2009. Fagen and Becker Pretty much kept it in the studio releasing album after album. It was very ingenious of the two of them not basing their success on showmanship and more with the songwriting. It was also one of Michael McDonald’s first gigs as a session artist before joining the Doobie brothers in 1976 full-time.
No disrespect to Becker or Fagen (they are musical geniuses), but deciding to forego touring to create albums in the studio was done by another popular band a few years earlier.
My earliest childhood memory was recognizing "Dirty Work" at age 3. It came on in my parents Corolla two days in a row when i was in the back seat with my family as my dad ran errands. I said outloud this is that dirty work song. It was my first cognizance. The year was 1979 or 1980. Steely Dan will always be my favorite band and i still have never done it without the fez on!
Only wrote a few good songs? I wouldn't even agree with the statement "they only wrote a few bad songs!" They arguably are one of the top 5 greatest American bands of the 70s & 80s.
Elton John was a friend of Lennon he rewrote the lyrics and gave them to John as a joke. "Imagine six apartments, it isn't hard to do, one is full of fur coats, another's full of shoes."
As to Lennon’s abandonment issues as a child, here are a couple things to know about his mental health and his likelihood to throw violent tantrums: (1) Lennon almost killed a child, I believe, because of his inability to drive a motor vehicle at some point. (2) his contradictory relationship with money and wealth could be to insulate himself from others. I know that, for some reason, he loved to play Monopoly and hold certain acquisitions that speak of wealth, luxury, and fear of poverty(?). On the other hand, Yoko Ono, as a designer and so on, probably influenced Lennon and his material choices in dress. In conclusion, Lennon does not come to mind as much as a rich man flaunting his wealth; he is indeed a mentally sick man trying to get by undiscovered as a (flawed) person.
There is only one winner! John Lennon! Steely Dan has A long way to go YET to equal what John Lennon and The Beatles gave to the World!! Steely Dan didn't even get the real meaning of "IMAGINE"
Many grew up in the shadow of the Beatles. Yes, I understood the meaning of their songs once I got a bit olde & started liking "boys" @ 14-15 years old, the time Steely Dan became so popular. I believe many, many solo artists & rock/Pop groups resented The Beatles, especially John Lennon. It's the musician's world where there is too much ego. I loved Lennon & still do, regardless of his antics, but I also admired Fagan & the group, because they were different, highly talented, & a good piece of my teenage years.Those years in the '70's were AWESOME, thanks to the great musicians.
It's easy to find fault with others. Steely Dan's forte was acting as the cynical, sardonic, satirical and sarcastic elders to a musical inheritance that had devolved from the pure elemental energy of Santana singing 'Soul Sacrifice' to Claptons 'You Look Wonderful Tonight' and it's view of decadent 'Stars' enjoying the high life in their huge mansions with their star-studded accoutrements, surrounded by their sycophants, a universe away from the person in the street. But Lennon's song is perfect. It's an expression of an idealism that, while it can not really exist in this world, on any large scale, is still a way of thinking and being that we can each emulate in our immediate circles, and thereby bring a little grace into our lives. The end of all life is death, but that does not make life itself meaningless; in fact it makes it all-the-more precious. By the same token, the idealism Lennon expressed in 'Imagine' is immensely valuable and valid, and will remain so for me, my cohorts, and for younger generations in whom the spark of youthful idealism is perennial. Lennon was a discarded child, brought up by his aunt. He had to scrape together the money for every step he took towards success. I know the feeling, because I spent a couple of years in London doing paper-rounds at 5 in the frosty morning, to get the money to buy second-hand speakers, amp and turntable, so I could play the LP's I purchased from mail-order coupons in Oz magazine in 1970's London. George Harrison was the first artist to pull together a benefit concert with his friend Ravi Shankar. That was 'The Concert For Bangladesh.' For all it's inevitable problems, the fundamental fact is that Harrison was able to convince a plethora of fellow artists to use their fame to provide relief to people who knew nothing of their music, but who were starving to death on the other side of the world.
Thank you. Here's a song by Barclay James Harvest called 'Titles'. ua-cam.com/video/KhXmnu-3HkA/v-deo.html It's full of bittersweet disillusionment at what became of the 'Universal Love' movement of the 60's. You may know it already.@@marshwetland3808
Pretty articulate, but it may be overthought. Even before SD existed, rock stars were raking in the big bucks. You mention Santana, but there is nothing unique about them in terms of lifestyle. Carlos Santana may have grown up poor, but he became famous by the time SD hit the scene. He was likely sipping expensive champagne through the entire 70s (and probably still is today). Frank Zappa was much more of a satirist in his music than SD were. But your views on the "Imagine" song seem spot-on, I will give you that.
@@susanb5058Thank you Susan! So sweet of you to reply. I'm in Goa, India, meeting up with old friends after 17 years in the US. My son Azan will be playing at several small venues as he develops his trajectory as a singer-songwriter. He plays some of the songs that I used to play on an old cassette deck as I'd take him on the 8 hour drive from Auroville, where we lived, to his boarding school in Kodai Kanal, songs like Jackson Browne's "I'm Alive," and Van Morrison's "Into the Mystic." Many of his generation have embraced the music of the 60's and 70's. It's almost like the fulfillment of prophetic lyrics in the Crossby Stills Nash and Young song "Teach Your Children." Just as they learn from us, we learn from the dreams they embrace. I wish you more Sweetness and Light.
Underappreciated. A lot of people dont get even slightly complex music. And lyrics that have different words than you usually hear, and references to places and events not everyone has heard of. I think a lot of people who listen t them also read books!
I've never tried to figure out Steely Dan lyrics. Half the time, donald and walter didn't even know what they were writing about. It's not a matter if I don't think this song is about john lennon. I know for a fact it's not about john lennon. @conceptualclarity
Elvis Costello's track, "The Other Side of Summer": "Was it a millionaire who said 'imagine no possessions'? A poor little schoolboy who said 'We don't need no lessons'".
Pure Marxist communist drivel given to him by his guru/cult leader Yoko so called wife. She like most upper echelon communists is a rip roaring money hungry creep. She tried to cheat Julien out of his inheritance and was a major reason John rarely saw his son. She did NOT want to share at all. She just wants everyone else to so she doesn't have to pay taxes. Champagne socialist is there any other kind? Ugly, greedy rich folks telling everyone else to share that crust of bread and that 5 to a room tenement apt. Yeah sure when you share what you have and life in a one room apt! What no then shut up John or all those over paid fools of 2020. Hollywood was allowed to work while mom and pop places when bankrupt.. So compassionate don't you think. Try tone deaf and condescending.
I can't pick a favorite Dan album. Although I think the first four (Can't Buy A Thrill to Katy Lied) are slightly stronger than the next three (Royal Scam to Gaucho). And the "comeback" albums were pretty weak.
Fair enough. I've gone full circle, having lived through John Lennon worship, and seen the anguish of high school classmates when he was shot. In the end we have to accept that there may be people who accomplish wonderful things, but those same people can be shitty individuals in real life. Whether John or George were as wonderful or as awful as some claim, they impacted generations in tremendous ways.
Then of course Paul, never moved overseas and became a tax exile, continued grafting away making music because he loves doing it, has been a clean living vegitarian for decades, set up a school for young musicians, works for numerous charities and travels on public transport.
EXACTLY. It was from reading a volume of Caro's biog. of LBJ I came to think this. LBJ was pretty manipulative reaching the presidency and then he did wonderful things for the common people-the Voting Rights Act, rural electrification, etc. One can't let the perfect be the enemy of the good.
I think it would have made a huge difference if, in the song Imagine, John had said "I wonder if WE can," instead of "you". I saw a video of him singing it live once where he did make the change...
1] John was known for notoriously slipping up and forgetting lyrics -listen to the Beatles recorded version of _"Tell Me Why"_ and you'll hear him have a bit of pronoun trouble… *that was left in the final mix.* 2] Since the narrator/singer is asking _you_ to imagine something it is because he or she have *_already imagined it._*
I'm not sure why the interpretation came to be that John Lennon is singing to only poor people. Yeah, John had money and was a pretentious artsy-fartsy type and Steely Dan were resentful that the only real hit they had was intended as a mockery of Bob Dylan, not in their own style. But I always thought of it as criticizing the conservative orthodoxy of classism, war and especially religion. IDK that Lennon's ideal hinged upon control/obedience and intolerance like those he was challenging. I'm not convinced that it requires a vow of poverty. Hippy-dippy, yes, but hypocritical?
I agree. I’ve been listening to (and playing) Imagine for decades. The more I think about the lyrics the more clearly they seem to be an indictment of capitalism, organized religion and nationalism. It has literally never crossed my mind that he was suggesting anyone take a view of poverty or speaking to the poor or disadvantaged.
it helps that recording technology was finally able to capture sounds accurately. had SD been born earlier, they'd be stuck with whatever tech there was in earlier decades. makes a HUGE difference. Timing is everything.
@@guscooger5366 Steely Dan also said that if the sophistication of the music matched the sophistication of the technology, we'd all be listening to Debussy. 🙂
Fagan's song, "IGY/What A Beautiful World" speaks exactly of what Lennon wrote in "Imagine". Either this too is tounge-in-cheek or he was just coming around to the idea of making a better world tomorrow, today.
IGY was written about the international geophysical year, which Donald Fagen experienced as a kid, in 1957-58. He was expressing the optimism of the late 50s in America, the IGY had all these great plans but fell short, much like today with various causes
@@paulhundy2986 Fagen is now 75 and Lennon would have been 73, so they likely both were aware of IGY in '57/'58. I do agree that "Imagine" is a bit maudlin, Sometimes, we need optimistic persons who say foolish things sometimes.
@@jameswaters3939 Good to put these artists into their contexts, particularly as entertainers of complex ideas jammed into 3-to-5 minute pleasures. Lennon: "I don't believe in Buddha". "God" is a test, quite as extreme as "Imagine". Meanwhile "Bodhisattva" sounds too good to be mere satire, but, yes, it's tongue in cheek- SD's detachment is an end in itself while Lennon consistently searches for deeper belief. Lennon (83 this year) is a cynic too, but rarely portrays other people while Fagen and Becker rarely portray themselves. Lennon's work is filled with ways to legitimate something as childlike and elegant as "Imagine". ...."Why on earth are we here? Surely not to live in pain and fear."
@@kanlithunder The wry & sly and just the musicianship - S.D. - best ever. Good analysis. S.D. warps my mind with great lyrics, best melodies, just takes me on a ride.
@@paulhundy2986Exactly! Well said! I was a kid in the 1950’s and received a yearbook describing the International Geophysical Year. I never forgot it so when “IGY” came out I knew exactly what Fagen was describing. (Fun fact: I printed the album cover for “The Nightfly” by Fagen which included “IGY”. 😁)
Love Steely Dan, clever lyrics and sublime music that doesn't sound like any other band. I never knew this song was about John Lennon though 😂 Funny. I'm a Beatles fan too but John was no angel and himself no stranger to songs that mock others! How do you sleep? 😳
When he wrote "How do you sleep," he was responding to three McCartney ditties on Ram that had attacked him, George and Ringo. "But he doesn't publish his lyrics, and I do," John said on U.S. tv, so he still gets blamed for a biting song. Ringo replied to Ram with his own smash hit "Back Off Boogaloo," and the second song on George Harrison's Living in the Material World was "Sue Me, Sue You Blues." So it started with McCartney publicly attacking--and suing--the others.
@@dreamfable It's been over fifty years and people still don't get it. They forced Paul into a contract with Allen Klein that he did not want, and the only way out of it was to sue the corporation, which -- unfortunately -- included the other three Beatles.
I heard a Lennon interview where he says Imagine is an internal dialogue with himself (not preaching to others). Imagine is also supposedly based on Yoko's writings from her book Grapefruit.
@@joesmoker3378 Nah. Steely Dan just pointed out the glaring hypocrisy of the words versus the lifestyle reality of John and Yoko. And even if Yoko had a hand in the writing, it is a soppy piece of fantasy dreaming which none of his/their fans (or a bunch of famous ceiebrities) could ever live by. The song still makes me vomit till this day, and I turn it off whenever it comes on.
One of the best gigs I ever went to was Steely Dan at the Hammersmith Odeon - or The Apollo as it’s now called. It was in Sept. 2000 & the tickets were an expensive (at that time) £45 each, but the concert they gave was easily worth the money… a superbly balanced sound system meant that each instrument’s output was heard crystal clear with ‘space’ around it, and boy… could the guys play those instruments. The lead guitarist in particular was absolutely brilliant, I think he may have been a session musician Dan liked to tour with, but I don’t actually know. So glad I finally managed to see them live after too many years waiting!
@@keithkoenig5320 If you're a Beatles fan there are plenty of interviews where John Lennon explains the motivation behind his songs, Help being the most poignant. He was also the first to say if a song was just wordplay & non sense such as Hey Bulldog. Imagine was an idealized view of existence.
I agree.' Imagine' is an atheistic, utopian song by a man whom only saw the world from a balcony. He wrote some great stuff with McCartney, but his solo work was angry. He had no peace in his life until Sean, and even then, look how he treated Julian. Here is a life who missed God, imho.
Michael Mcdonald who met Skunk Baxter through his sessions as a vocalist/piano player for Steely Dan said it wasn't uncommon for him to do hundreds of takes on a song !!!!!! Using as many as 3 entire bands they kept floating around. Peg took 9 guitarists to get the right solo. 😮
Yup. Finding the right guitar solo for Peg was an ordeal. Becker and Fagen were almost crazed in their perfectionism. It always seems to have paid off though.
Skunk Baxter didn't mind SD's perfectionism. He said the duo spent half an hour finding just the right chair for him to sit on. He didn't care as he was being paid $300 an hour. SD is great, but not on the level of Lennon or McCartney.
Never was a Steely Dan fan. Haave come to appreciate them more now that I'm older. As I have with a lot of musics and artists I may not have cared for when younger
Same. It took me years and years of hearing the Rolling Stones to realize that yes, they are the greatest band ever, or at least one of the greatest bands ever.
Steely Dan though I always liked. Ever since I heard the commercial for Aja when I was 11 or 12, with the opening to Josie playing in the background. I was instantly hooked on them.
Two words: perspective. And viewpoint. I personally (and boy am I not wealthy!) feel the idea and ideals of the song "Imagine" are awesome & relevant … But of course how one perceives it might be different than the original intention (as can happen with many forms of art). In any event, I certainly am a big Steely Dan fan - especially some of their later work, such as the albums Gaucho & of course my favorite, Aja 🙂
Great point. I'm sure Lennon was referring to the super rich when he sang "Imagine no possessions; I wonder if you can." I like Steely Dan too, though I'm more the Greatest Hits kind of fan. I've listened to all their albums on Spotify, but I don't think this song stood out. Have to give it a re-listen now.
@@russellziske7385 -- "Imagine" just pinpoints the three main reasons man wages war: Possessions (aka, 'riches'), religion, and borders. No possessions, no religions, no borders ... no war. Has very little, if nothing at all, to do with Marx or socialism. It's an anti-war song ... a.k.a, "livin' life in peace."
John Lennon thought he was a working class hero but he was just another rich, famous guy telling poor people how to live. I love his music but not his preaching.
Lennon's son Julian called him a hyprocrite. Lennon actually beat his first wife and once he hooked up with Yo-yo Oh-No he totally cut Julian out of his life, his will and all. Sad that so many people worshipped him as a world man of peace when he was no better than anyone. Just a rich jaw flapper...
John was known to be a very bad drunk. He kicked Stu Sutcliffe in the head when he got angry at him for leaving the band, and that may have done him in.
As a die hard BEATLES fan I am not blind to the fact that John was not a God and would even hate that thought...( Even though he famously said they were bigger than Jesus..).. He was a flawed man, but without a doubt a true genius. I always think of Paul being the HEART of the band and John the SOUL. STEELY DAN were the Coen Brothers of music and they made great music with a sardonic 'wink wink' which I would think John would appreciate. A lot of great music from both bands.
Lennon talked about love yet dumped his son, spoke about kindness but got into fights, and no possessions while living in that penthouse. And Lennon being p-whipped by Ono was a major factor in the bands breakup. Lennon reminded me of that guy who has no male friends because he is under his woman’s control.
@@williamgullett5911 Paul wrote Hey Jude for Julian and was more of a father figure to him. John was a Man Child and maybe why he needed a mother figure like Yoko who was much older than him. A truly flawed genius.
@lonwolf8245 Sounds like his contemporaries didn't like John much. Steely Dan wrote a couple songs about Lennon that mocked him. Supposedly Elton John mocked Lennon by asking how a guy who talked about no possessions could have a huge penthouse. Imagine. The Beatles were good, they just weren't my favorite
Seems pretty obvious the members of the Beatles were swapped with lookalike replacements for the Pepper album onwards. The lawyer and author Cynthia F. Hodges a.k.a. Tina Foster and AurigaBooks online has spent many years uncovering this as a Beatles fan herself.
Right up there with the sentiment ‘all you need is love’. Easy for someone worth many, many millions to say it. But you trying paying the rent, or buying groceries, or keeping the heat on with ‘Love’. 🙄
Wow....... I like both......... But SD is within my frequency of perfect taste! Both were great in their own right! But I like nearly everything SD, not so much Beetles! They were of my sisters generation!
I just learned last weekend that Steely Dan was a band started at Bard College, and originally had three members including a drummer named Chevy Chase. Chase was expelled, and the other two stayed as a band. And it looks like both sides ended up quite successful.
It’s hard for anyone to say exactly what either songs true meanings are, especially because very few where there. Also there seems to be a common thread among struggling actors musicians and the like. They will do anything to make it big and put in all the effort and sacrifice. But then after making it they realize the true cost of this, and it staggers them.But let’s face it maybe imagine and that line was John realizing life’s true wealth was not material things at all. I’m a fan of both bands seen the Dan but not The Beatles.
I don’t know why people can’t use their imagination? That’s what his point was. Imagine if the things that divide us didn’t exist? He’s really talking about eliminating the “ things “ in your life that hold you back. I see it as a personal challenge to rise above selfishness and a narcissistic culture.
When Donald Fagen was still in Jay and the Americans, he must have had some kind of criminal arrest wherefrom he couldn't leave the state of Maryland and couldn't drive. He lived with his grandparents durin that time and all the gigs were around DC. He went to a community college same as myself, Montgomery Junior College (later Montgomery College) in John Fahey's town Takoma Park Maryland. He used to hitch-hike to his grandparents' house after school, and I picked him up and drove him to there every day. As formerly reported in Wikipedia (since deleted) all the members jokinly used ficitious names. He told me his name was "Howard Wittenberg". I knew he was in Jay and the Americans, because I saw him outside one of their gigs, wearin a Beatle suit. He replaced the original Bass player, and was younger than the other members of the band.
Yea, far out man. I appreciate that Steely Dan have written some very witty and cryptic lyrics; the problem that I have with it though, is that you have to wade through so much shlocky pop and cod funk in order to get to them.
@@granthurlburt4062 It's ok. We're all allowed to have an opinion. In my own defence though, I did point out that I appreciated their songwriting skill - I have my own preferences. They tend to be the earlier compositions.
Me too. Leave it to Steely Dan to troll John Lennon🤨🤑😴 Imagine if musicians were not allowed to daydream or dream and were relegated to writing cynical songs about other musicians and the occasional joyous song about their coke-dealer buddies. You'd probably end up with Steely Dan.
Uhmmmm he was singing.... IMAGINE.... Lennon was not in any of the worlds he was IMAGINING. For writers that did so much great work, I wonder why they didn't get that.
TBH, I have no problems with either song. Setting John Lennon's foibles aside, "Imagine" is a nice sentiment and something worth working towards, though I can't see it happening as a world event any time soon. I wouldn't want to give up all my possessions, but I wouldn't mind parting with a lot of them.
Whether it was hypocritical or not Lennon was trying to spread positivity and what he considered to be valid ways for society to improve. All Steely Dan did was drop a diss track without offering any alternatives
You are correct and very well said.. Steely Dan just put down and doesn't help so his comments are worthless. I only liked 1 Steely Dan song. I loved and still love Lennon and his music.
@@brmbkl So? Most people could do better at spreading positivity to their family and friends, what’s your point? My comment was about Steely Dan’s lyrics on “Only A Fool Would Say,” and your response was basically, “well, John was a bad guy, so…”
Can't Buy a Thrill is by far their most interesting album. All their stuff is great but the first album is just so quirky, and Do It Again is a great first hit.
It's a stretch to say it's about John Lennon specifically. Like a lot of Dan tracks, it's ambiguous, capable of many interpretations. It comes across as a piece of bitterness, siding with the common man against the iniquity of cheap but convincing-sounding easy solutions. Given their attacks on cults on other tracks, this feels like one of their generalised ironic commentaries on the state of political theatre and the games of the rich compared to the realities faced by most.
"Preach" is the word - rich evangelical mega-church preachers asking the poor to tithe. Then, keeping it all and not using it to do good works for the poor.
In defense of John Lennon:He paid his taxes in America and didn't whine about it (they were high taxes) and those taxes went to support the poor in the U.S..Also some of that tax money went to support the U.S. government.
I was never a big jazz fan but somehow, when Steely Dan fused it with Rock they created lightning in a bottle. A great band with a unique sound. I always found John Lennon's Imagine to be a pompous and pretentious song. The fact that Steely Dan mocked it makes me like them even more.
Steely Dan is simply pure unadulterated genius on the highest level. I didn't notice anyone mentioning how they got their name. Everyone probably already knows.
Frank Zappa ridiculed Lennon with his song Oh No too. It was also nice of Lennon to steal King Kong from Frank, re name it Jamrag, and not give FZ any credit for the song.
It's a bit obscure favourite of mine, but how about The Forgotten Rebels' "England Keep Your Stars"? I remember you so many years ago What I saw in you I don't know I saw stars when I opened your door They landed on our fair shores Their novel accents made them so rich While I'm stuck playing In a rotting ditch Now London don't swing like a pendulum do England keep yer starts So won't you keep yer stars England Keep yer stars Won't you keep yer stars England keep yer stars Two days later says she'll be my girl Think I found my place I wanna be with her She's got a real classy personality I wanna hold her tight when she's walkin' with me Every time I look at her and every time I hold her hand I wanna tell her things that I'll never tell no one She's got a neat way of makin' it so fun Since she's walked in to my life I don't even need to think twice The girl I was lookin' for all along I can't tell her every thing in this song I'll always be true to her There ain't nothing I won't do for her Through Canada and America they played the biggest arena They took money from our pocket then they got ripped off I wanna be so bloody rich, I wanna be a snob And make my wife a bitch Now London don't swing like a pendulum do England keep.yer stars Radio loves the English bands Radio loves the American bands Have they censored Canada to get their money from foreign lands? Rebels like us who have it rough Canadian radio will not play our stuff Now New York don't swing like a pendulum do England keep yer stars
Zappa 4 years earlier did a song, Oh No, critical of All You Need Is Love, with a melody (in 5/4--previously an instrumental segment on the orchestral Lumpy Gravy) and lyric much better than Steely Dan's mockery. Even so John and Yoko later performed in 71 with the Mothers at the Fillmore.
A sharper parody of "Imagine" was buried in Elvis Costello's The Orate Side Of Summer" ... : Was it a millionaire who said "Imagine no possessions". a poor little schoolboy said "We don't need no lessons" [ouch]
John praised Costello's 'What's So Funny About Peace, love and Understanding.' He didn't dole cudos to his peers often. Could you imagine to have just read the Playboy interview in which John gave the rare shout-out to him only to be utterly shocked hours later in learning of his violent death by five bullets to the back? Elvis had only the highest regard for the Beatles and John. Besides doing a cover of his song 'Bulldog,' as did the Foo Fighters(Dave Grohl), he believe it or not covered Yoko Ono's song 'Walking On Thin Ice.' Elvis lyric you're referring to probably was a jab at Steely Dan looking at a grownup song like a kid who fights over toys or all jazzed for the new Nike shoes Daddy bought for him.
It seems John had profound childhood losses. Through his youth, he covered his grief and fears with bravado that often came out as bitter sarcasm and cruel anger. As a young man he would mug drunks and, when one resisted, John beat him severely then feared he'd left the man for dead. His moderate poly-substance use disorder was growing at this time, a disease which he'd try in vain to control. His brilliant wit and songwriting talent enabled him to use the Beatles to build a broad support network which enabled his addictive disease. As his disease became severe he became increasingly violent, seeking bar fights as entertainment with his friend Harry Nillson. He once grabbed Peter Lawford by the collar and put his fist to Lawford's face (Lennon sent an explicit apology the next day which confirms the story). Demonstrating hippie values was a feeble best effort to counter his rage and self-hatred; he was powerless over his childhood grief and illness, and his addictions were enabled by so many people, that he didn't stand a chance. -Doug Pratt, Atlanta, Georgia, USA.
I don't think that...For me 'Imagine' is a song about a different world...and not about the world we live in where money is important and peace has to be fought for...so I don't see the hypocrisy in the song that other people seem to do for that very reason...I mean the clue is in the title...surely
SD's take is appropro but as a Lennon fan he was simply describing the perfect nap. ie.,, escape from life's minefield..Make the world go away feeling.. Imagine's been hijacked by many and now has life and meanings of its own. But its nothing to get hung about. John was a basic regular guy, full of our typical contrasting impulses, he liked gadgets, he liked "stuff". The eastern communist philosophies wrestled with the surrounding societal contradictions making our heads want to explode. Johns genius was his ability to blend opposites into ironic harmony. This song is simple escapism. No guru, no method, a bit mad, An artist.
Having only gotten into "The Dan" around the time of Katy Lied, there are several of their older songs I haven't paid much attention to, so it was interesting to hear about this song's reference to Imagine, which is fairly obvious, now that you've pointed it out. I differ with you, though, in terms of how you interpret Becker's and Fagen's attitude as lyric writers. You must have noticed that a lot of their songs are written from the point of view of an imaginary character, whose views are not necessarily the same as their personal opinions. Songs like Don't Take Me Alive, Everything You Did, Kid Charlemagne, and Goucho being obvious examples. So, given that tendency, I think it's risky to presume, based on the lyrics of this song, that they were actually disdainful of Lennon, as distinct from painting a portrait of someone who was. You also state that Lennon "wasn't enamored" of Steely Dan, which seems like an assumption on your part (I'd be interested to know if Lennon ever said something publicly in that regard). I understand that UA-cam is largely driven by the public's love of conflict, but I think you may have cooked up a feud here that never actually existed.
I never realized this number was about "Imagine", but personally I always wondered why so many people were enamored with John Lennon. He to me seemed so fake and contrived, an axe to grind with God for who knows why. Instead of his reasons, we hear his complaints and his downright denial, displaying an utter lack of curiosity for the most important event to have ever occurred, simply to give vent to his apparent self-assured superiority to the creator of everything we see, when I think it should be abundantly clear that he lacked so much. Humility, John had none. Steely Dan shows so much more true musical ability than John Lennon, they hardly belong in the same sentence. A well-done video, likely the best I've see in a long while. I hope you keep at it and work out more of these gems.
So agree. Imagine there's no religion (read faith in the creator ) . . . Well the west has largely delivered on Lennon's wish, and consequently it gets uglier, sicker, less safe and more without hope by the day. Lennon didn't have a dream, he had a nightmare.
@@bcssylf you will have your day to regret your words. I could tell you about the day an alien came into my delivery van, but alas, would it have any effect on you?
It is a bittersweet song without a hint of mockery. And SD were not known for ramming their opinions down people’s throats in their lyrics, but rather, were ironists who wrote in other people’s voices. So there is doubt in my mind about the premise of this video.
Yeah, it could be about a girl he knew that wouldn't just shut up and screw , so Don snapped bad . A lot of his lyrics are sections that inspire each other but aren't a continuation of the preceding section , so the Man on the Street part might have come from an op ed Don read about rich liberals vs working poor . I notice he doesn't quote Fagen anywhere , so this interpretation is just something he thought of .
"Satire should, like a polished razor keen, Wound with a touch that's scarcely felt or seen...." -- Mary Wortley Montagu Steely Dan's writing style in a nutshell.
@@terryenglish7132 "A lot of his lyrics are sections that inspire each other but aren't a continuation of the preceding section." That's a good way to put it. I'm still confused by the lyrics from the end of Hey 19 and how it relates to the rest of the song: "The Cuervo Gold/The fine Colombian/Make tonight a wonderful thing." I read something somewhere about this is just the song's narrator fantasizing about 19 in a tequila haze after realizing that they can't be together, though where the evidence of that is in those lyrics, I don't know.
I was a huge Beatles fan as a kid, but to me their stuff has not aged well. After “Revolver” it just got sillier and sillier. Steely Dan’s stuff, on the other hand, still sounds fresh and intelligent, even though some of it is over 50 years old.
That’s a terrible opinion lol. Sgt Pepper, White Album, and Let it Be are among the very best of all time and that’s not even a little bit controversial to say. Steely Dan on the other hand is like a watered down variant of elevator jazz.
@@daffyduck5351 The white album is actually my personal fave of all the Beatles LPs. I do think your assessment of SD is a bit on the extreme side tho. They are basically a rock band with strong jazz influences.
I loved Steely Dan. Good point there about the obscenely rich and famous laying down supposed inspirational ideas for the working classes... while walking hand in hand into fantastic estates... Look at Yoko in this film segment - totally spaced out, detached?
Yes. Like @megamarkd I always tell my friends that McCartney was driving force of The Beatles. They claim that Lennnon was the one but they I think that their opinions are incorrect. He vital and amazing in the early years but later lost focus and interest while McCartney was still reeling in the years.
@@howie9751 That's true...if by “feelings” you mean “feelings toward his mother and aunt.” Paul certainly was the more romantic Beatle. John’s “feelings” toward women were located more in his pants.
@@Panglos Paul could be very expressive, as in "Penny Lane". But when it came to relationships he went for the so-called romantic stuff or the "granny" tunes, as John called them. He couldn't write things like "Help", "No Reply" or "Run For Your Life", or even "Norwegian Wood", which required more depth of feeling, things people actually felt. They both gave us great music, and I'm not implying Paul was inferior. It took both of them.
Elton John sent a Christmas card to the Lennons in New York, where they occupied an entire floor of the Dakota Building. He inscribed: "Imagine six apartments/It isn't hard to do/One is full of fur coats/Another just for shoes".
😆😆😆
Elton is da man!
The room full of fur coats was refrigerated to protect the natural animal hair from deterioration and insects. The room had almost 100 full-length mink and other highly valued fur coats. Elton John probably had a large room to hold his vast collection of designer eye-glasses.
Elton John has always been too harsh on himself.
Elton - infinitely better songwriter than Paul McCartney has ever been
To this day I still use Steely Dan tunes to demo stereo gear. Not many better bands to do this with, and the songs are still fresh today.
Me too, also Alan Parsons
My car has garbage speakers and only the amp built into the head unit, and Steely Dan still sounds phenomenal. Just all around expertly crafted music. Perhaps not coincidentally, I mostly listen to Steely Dan while driving.
If you went into MOST stereo shops you would find Alan Parsons. One of the best sound engineers who did Abby Road and Dark Side of the Moon.
What's a 'stereo?'
@@williamchiafos3889 100%
They didnt "model themselves on the Beatles". They just didnt like touring.
No. Becker was a perfectionist.
@@michaelfallon2527 They both were known as perfectionists.
I literally laughed out loud when he said that.
Yup.
Correct. Why would Steely Dan model themselves after a multi-millionaire who when he wasn't writing gibberish like "Imagine no possessions?" liked to run around a club in LA wearing a Kotex pad on his head ?.
My daughter graduated from Bard College - where Steely Dan originally formed. They are still legends there and . . .everywhere else.
"Imagine no possessions..." John left his son, Julian, out of his will.
He left everything to his wife, apparently trusting her to take care of things fairly...
@@QueenAstroParticle I heard that he had left it all to her to be used for singing lessons.
I heard that Julian actually had to buy some of the things from Yoko that should have been his birthrights.
This gets said a lot. But most don’t anticipate getting assassinated at 40. Even if a person gets sick at that age they have trouble writing out a will
Imagine no possession Yoko
The older I get the more I like Steely Dan.
It happens.
Less.
It’s old fart 💨 music
@@danielprune7921I resemble that remark!
Truth!
A multi millionaire rock star telling me to have no possessions has never sat well with me and I applaud Donald Fagan for writing the song. See I'm not the only one.
Lennon was such a hypocrite , talking about “peace” while he beat up his first wife, Cynthia. He was also notorious for getting drunk and brawling with anyone who pis#ed him off ( the May Pang-Los Angeles -Lost Weekend ). Mr Peace and Love, my ass.
he said Imagine
Fully agree and that’s why he was killed too not that it’s a reason to kill but what a hypocrite ! RIP Walter . Walter and Donald were both geniuses. Thank God we still have Donald.
20 years ago when I was younger and certainly dumber I would have disagreed with you. Thankfully many of us, including me got older and wiser. To the greater degree, John was just another boring virtue signaler. And Yoko Ono? OMG... WTF. But his marrying her only serves to support my feelings on the matter today. My god she's a tw*t.
It was, and is, an aspiration, but only an unintelligent goon would think otherwise!
I didn't truly appreciate the genius of Steely Dan until I was in my 40's. They're brilliant.
I remember Can't Buy a Thrill but I was pretty busy with young living at the time and there was so much amazing music going on. Their catalog is just brilliant and today, I play them almost every day.
I was in my 50s, having listened mostly to bop. Felt right at home right away
I can relate
I'll always be grateful I got to see these legends in a live performance. They were doing one of their rare tours, and were at Irvine amphitheater c. 1997, normally I really dislike crowds and lines but to see these two greats, I felt like I was walking on air while cold sober. Becker was dressed in jeans like an every man, which he wasn't of course, but Donald Fagen proceeded to take over the show dressed in 90's dark casual suit with no tie that was the style. Fagen's performance was effortless and it was obvious we were watching a master at work; watching him and Becker perform as Steely Dan for one of the last times, was an experience I remember with reverence. Sadly Walter Becker left us in 2017 - but I'll always remember the time I saw two legends of music perform live.
Me too. Once, outside Scranton, PA. The band was like one huge instrument, all parts working perfectly together. Loved them from their first album.
Yup. Saw them in '93 and '94. Unforgettable.
I was at that show - unfort NOT very sober. But... I swear you could drop the needle on any song they were playing and you'd be hard pressed to tell the difference between the live song and the LP version. They were just that good. Definitely in the top #5 concerts I've been able to go to.
Watched their live performance in Minneapolis in 1997. They were great!!
Thanks for the description. I got every record the Dan ever made but didn't get to see them live. They always inspired me to be a better musician. Thanks for filling out the image.
I have always liked Steely Dan since the 1970's
Same here.
The older you get as a man in this world, the more you understand and appreciate Steely Dan
Exactly
Very talented & not fully appreciated at the time
S*ckd back then and still does. Thas facts man. 😂
I agree completely. One of the best bands ever, musically and lyrically.
As a 14 year old, I thought it was a nice song. As a 24 year old, I realized more what it meant. By age 54 I remember having experienced a deeper feeling and thought process about it.
Aja is one of the best albums of all time
That's a fact
This song isn't part of "Aja."
Saw them do that album at the Beacon in NY some years back.Was great except for some 22 yr olds standing and dancing making noice,was ready to throw a punch the ushers had to come by and stop them,more than once,America for you.
@@trailblazer1047 The nerve of some people, dancing and carrying on at a concert!
Truth.
Nearly every Steely Dan song has a message you can spend a lifetime trying to decipher.
Or as my girlfriend used to say, "Their lyrics don't make any sense." It was hard to argue with her on that one.
Hey Dancer, ever the rabbit hole diver, I’ve wasted a lot of time in the past trying to analyze Becker & Fagen’s lyrics. I’ve resigned myself to just enjoy what I’m hearing musically first, and the analysis is just not that “important” anymore.
I’ve heard all the interpretive stories of their deep meaning…and sorry - but I’m just not convinced they want or need ME (of all people) to try and decode the message.
Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar…
@@danielh9844, if your girlfriend is anything like mine, it's pointless to argue with her *on any topic.* 🤗🤗🤗
Each to their own, I suppose..
Yes, who really was Josie?
Saw The Dan live 3 times…they were FANTASTIC ! One of my favorite bands of all time. RIP Walter Becker.
lucky bastard! Fantastic! 🤝👍
I saw them in April 1974 at the San Diego Sports Arena I was 18yo. I bragged all thru the 80's that I was one of the very few people who had seen them live, then the 90's came and everybody had seen them live! I also saw them here in Houston in the 90's. But yeah, what a band! I was dancing like crazy on the floor of the Sports Arena to my favorite song, Bodhisattva.
@@AndySalinger33 They were sooooo good ! I don’t think that SD got the recognition that it deserved; BUT I’m so happy that they were inducted by the R&R HOF in 2001, before Walter passed. It blows my mind that they only received 4 Grammys, and not until the 2000s.
@@graciesmom62 right on. I’m with you. And yeah, even at the time they were inducted, I recall feeling so glad it was happening while they were both still with us! And though I realize SD is highly regarded by people like us, I agree…they don’t get nearly the accolades and adoration their art rightly deserves. They were simply too smart for this world. Their music was too advanced for its time. And thank God that’s the case, eh? It sure makes for some good listening. As in…a whole lifetime of listening. They are the soundtrack. Cheers. And send my regards to Gracie…wherever she may be.
@@AndySalinger33 Thank you, Andy. Gracie has passed, but always missed.
"Imagine there's no money, it easy if you're rich."
In other words, "Money's not important . . . unless you don't have any."
Imagine there's no money, it's easy if your rich; lennon's an efin as*h*le, Yoko's a real b*t*h.
Money can’t buy happiness, but it does make the misery easier to bear.
"I said pretend you've got no money, and she just laughed and said 'ha, you're so funny! I said 'yeah?'..."
"john"= the average worker "lennon"= communist "imagine"=commie love song thanks for nothing tavistock institute
This made me an instant fan. Calling out the hypocrisy of the elite. They were absolutely right!
True Lennon didn't live his ideals, but if he was an 'elite', Fagen and Becker probably weren't far behind. Donald Fagens net worth was recently estimated at fifty million, presumably Walters worth was about the same. So pretty 'elite" too. Nothing against them haveing a shot at Lennon though, he was a troubled man and could be a right insensitive d**k.
John Lennon was not elite. He was a working class boy who lucked into money.
@@themoviedealers BWAHAHAHAHAHAHHA, whatever you say.
@@themoviedealers lucked????
he wrote and sang he had talent not everyone does!
if you say so lol
Hmmm. It's possible to see "Only a Fool" as an answer to "Imagine," but in this video I didn't hear any real connection showing Fagan and Becker intended that. On the other hand, Costello's line--"Wasn't it a millionaire who said imagine no possessions?" --leaves no doubt as to the target of his skepticism.
Good point but I still think he may be right about the true meaning of this song's lyrics.
It only feels like a few parts are directed at him, not a huge deal imo
When you realize that Imagine is a hateful anti western society, pro atheists pro communist propaganda piece. Then you get it. I just wish I had heard about their connection sooner.
John Lennon was a pos in my opinion. He deserves to be derided. Particularly for how he allowed Ono to treat his son Julian.
Pretty sure they literally said it was targeted at Lennon in an interview.
Elvis Costello's "Mighty Like a Rose" (from which the line you've mentioned) doesn't have a bad song on it. Really great.
Cheers
Steely Dan remains forever one of the cerebral and talented bands of all time.
ok, ok...
Cerebral & masters of tongue in cheek self abasement. "The kid will live & learn..., As he watches his bridges burn..., From the point of no return...,😅!
At last some sanity. Well said that man
Yer so talented that they mis interpret John. He said imagine no possessions. He didn't say do it ffs
@@ACDZ123- Get over your hero worship. Lennon was a hypocrite and an ass, and his music self-important to the point of being trite. Fagan and Becker nailed it, seeing him for exactly what he was.
Their Royal Scam is a masterpiece,instrumentally and lyrically.
Completely correct.
Yes! I love that album!
Shall check it out thankyou
Clean this mess up or we'll all end up in jail
Those test tubes and the scale.
Just get em all outta here.
Is there gas in the car?
(Yes there's gas in the caah!)
I think the people down the hall know who you are!
Nobody was singing about stuff like that!!
@@davedecker1725love that song, it’s about owsley Stanley.
Old school has references to g Gordon liddy lol
I remember someone doing a one line review of the song at the time "Imagine John with no possessions"
"Imagine" is basically the Communist Manifesto set to a catchy tune.
@@Nzbdjcnx
What am I biased about exactly?
@@someguy7805that you feel socialism is a bad thing. Shame on you.
@@MrDavidknigge
Shame on you for apparently being ignorant of history.
@@someguy7805 I'm on your side. Just clarifying @NoTime84
I was a DJ at a small station in central Vermont in '72. Went to Baltimore to visit my very hip cousin who turned me on to SD ("Do It Again"). Bought a copy of the album and played the vinyl on air, for the first time in that area, I suspect. Was that really half a century ago?
Yes...time Rolls...Laugh it Up.
Yep hard to believe, but true. Time flies while you're having fun.
Wow, back when DJs could actually do things like that. Radio and music was so much better.
Donald Fagan can be polarizing, arrogant, opinionated, and cynical but he's certainly not stupid! He's got a razor sharp wit, and he's pretty well spot on with his criticism.
Fagan had "the courage to be disliked" (as Bruce Lee might have put it).
And good thing he did. Otherwise we wouldn't have any Steely Dan songs.
Kinda sounds like Trump.
@@terryboyer1342 Complete opposite of Trump. complete. Intelligent, sincere, hard working, creates things of value. On one of their later albums he sung "That right-wing hooey sure stunk up the joint".
@@granthurlburt4062 Yeah all those Jobs Trump created were nothing of value to the people that have them.
@@granthurlburt4062 yeah, almost as bad as that left wing hooey!
I don't know about anyone else, but it seems to me that "Do It Again" has lyrics describing various addictions or vices. So I love to play it on the jukebox as I indulge my Bowling addiction. It really is something!
Bowling is a great addiction. Good for you!
You need to rock "Miss Marlene" by Fagen. "Can’t you hear the balls rumble? Miss Marlene, We’re still bowling Every Saturday night"
@@kamikariad Nice!
Dr. Wu will cure the addiction. ;)
The dude abides man
Lennon treated his son like shit. That's enough for me.
And he beat his wives, was a fake activist, fetishized his own mother, Lennon was a garbage person. I like Paul better and always have.
They’re both and all great, it’s not an either/or music is a both/and, there’s no need to but boundaries on taste. Grateful for all their music!
I had bought their greatest hits CD from 1972 to 78, And in 2000 and they were least “Two Against Nature”. I finally saw the band in 2009. Fagen and Becker Pretty much kept it in the studio releasing album after album. It was very ingenious of the two of them not basing their success on showmanship and more with the songwriting. It was also one of Michael McDonald’s first gigs as a session artist before joining the Doobie brothers in 1976 full-time.
They also have 2003's Everything Must Go
at that point The Doobies were dead to me.
No disrespect to Becker or Fagen (they are musical geniuses), but deciding to forego touring to create albums in the studio was done by another popular band a few years earlier.
My earliest childhood memory was recognizing "Dirty Work" at age 3. It came on in my parents Corolla two days in a row when i was in the back seat with my family as my dad ran errands. I said outloud this is that dirty work song. It was my first cognizance. The year was 1979 or 1980. Steely Dan will always be my favorite band and i still have never done it without the fez on!
I wanna be a holy man too. We're about the same age with the same good SD memories. Cheers.
One of the few good songs they did.
@@daverichardson924horrible take. Steely Dan has countless. Kings is 10 times the song off the same album. You don’t know anything
Only wrote a few good songs? I wouldn't even agree with the statement "they only wrote a few bad songs!" They arguably are one of the top 5 greatest American bands of the 70s & 80s.
@@user-zo8hh4dv3b agreed. They made so many classic songs. They aged like fine wine. Truly one of a kind. My favorite album is Katy lied
Elton John was a friend of Lennon he rewrote the lyrics and gave them to John as a joke. "Imagine six apartments, it isn't hard to do, one is full of fur coats, another's full of shoes."
As to Lennon’s abandonment issues as a child, here are a couple things to know about his mental health and his likelihood to throw violent tantrums: (1) Lennon almost killed a child, I believe, because of his inability to drive a motor vehicle at some point. (2) his contradictory relationship with money and wealth could be to insulate himself from others. I know that, for some reason, he loved to play Monopoly and hold certain acquisitions that speak of wealth, luxury, and fear of poverty(?). On the other hand, Yoko Ono, as a designer and so on, probably influenced Lennon and his material choices in dress. In conclusion, Lennon does not come to mind as much as a rich man flaunting his wealth; he is indeed a mentally sick man trying to get by undiscovered as a (flawed) person.
I like John Lennon and I also like Paul McCartney and Steely Dan. Jeez.....do we really have to choose and pick a winner ?
I like John Lennon too. And I also agree with Steely Dan's take on John Lennon's song. There. I didn't choose sides or pick a winner.
Just thought it was a lovely song. That’s all.
There is only one winner! John Lennon! Steely Dan has A long way to go YET to equal what John Lennon and The Beatles gave to the World!! Steely Dan didn't even get the real meaning of "IMAGINE"
@@billmiller6274 Mary Ann
Thank you
Steely Dan. True MUSICIANSHIP
More like truly great writing. That was their strength. Aja became the first where they relied upon only or mostly hired guns
McCartney himself said John would have hated being turned into "Martin Luther Lennon".
They both suffered the same fate in the end, though.
Many grew up in the shadow of the Beatles. Yes, I understood the meaning of their songs once I got a bit olde & started liking "boys" @ 14-15 years old, the time Steely Dan became so popular. I believe many, many solo artists & rock/Pop groups resented The Beatles, especially John Lennon. It's the musician's world where there is too much ego. I loved Lennon & still do, regardless of his antics, but I also admired Fagan & the group, because they were different, highly talented, & a good piece of my teenage years.Those years in the '70's were AWESOME, thanks to the great musicians.
The song was not written about Lennon. Totally made up by the author of the article
It's easy to find fault with others. Steely Dan's forte was acting as the cynical, sardonic, satirical and sarcastic elders to a musical inheritance that had devolved from the pure elemental energy of Santana singing 'Soul Sacrifice' to Claptons 'You Look Wonderful Tonight' and it's view of decadent 'Stars' enjoying the high life in their huge mansions with their star-studded accoutrements, surrounded by their sycophants, a universe away from the person in the street. But Lennon's song is perfect. It's an expression of an idealism that, while it can not really exist in this world, on any large scale, is still a way of thinking and being that we can each emulate in our immediate circles, and thereby bring a little grace into our lives. The end of all life is death, but that does not make life itself meaningless; in fact it makes it all-the-more precious. By the same token, the idealism Lennon expressed in 'Imagine' is immensely valuable and valid, and will remain so for me, my cohorts, and for younger generations in whom the spark of youthful idealism is perennial. Lennon was a discarded child, brought up by his aunt. He had to scrape together the money for every step he took towards success. I know the feeling, because I spent a couple of years in London doing paper-rounds at 5 in the frosty morning, to get the money to buy second-hand speakers, amp and turntable, so I could play the LP's I purchased from mail-order coupons in Oz magazine in 1970's London. George Harrison was the first artist to pull together a benefit concert with his friend Ravi Shankar. That was 'The Concert For Bangladesh.' For all it's inevitable problems, the fundamental fact is that Harrison was able to convince a plethora of fellow artists to use their fame to provide relief to people who knew nothing of their music, but who were starving to death on the other side of the world.
Well said!
Thank you. Here's a song by Barclay James Harvest called 'Titles'. ua-cam.com/video/KhXmnu-3HkA/v-deo.html It's full of bittersweet disillusionment at what became of the 'Universal Love' movement of the 60's. You may know it already.@@marshwetland3808
Pretty articulate, but it may be overthought. Even before SD existed, rock stars were raking in the big bucks. You mention Santana, but there is nothing unique about them in terms of lifestyle. Carlos Santana may have grown up poor, but he became famous by the time SD hit the scene. He was likely sipping expensive champagne through the entire 70s (and probably still is today). Frank Zappa was much more of a satirist in his music than SD were. But your views on the "Imagine" song seem spot-on, I will give you that.
Thank you for this!! Relieved to find a comment from someone who understands and stated it so beautifully.
@@susanb5058Thank you Susan! So sweet of you to reply. I'm in Goa, India, meeting up with old friends after 17 years in the US. My son Azan will be playing at several small venues as he develops his trajectory as a singer-songwriter. He plays some of the songs that I used to play on an old cassette deck as I'd take him on the 8 hour drive from Auroville, where we lived, to his boarding school in Kodai Kanal, songs like Jackson Browne's "I'm Alive," and Van Morrison's "Into the Mystic." Many of his generation have embraced the music of the 60's and 70's. It's almost like the fulfillment of prophetic lyrics in the Crossby Stills Nash and Young song "Teach Your Children." Just as they learn from us, we learn from the dreams they embrace. I wish you more Sweetness and Light.
Most underrated band. I swear I havent heard a song by them that I wasn't vibing to.
Underappreciated. A lot of people dont get even slightly complex music. And lyrics that have different words than you usually hear, and references to places and events not everyone has heard of. I think a lot of people who listen t them also read books!
Hardly underrated
Steeley Dan never sound dated. Always fresh.
@@sloburnjo If ANYTHING, they HAVE to be the MOST overrated band ever!
How are they underrated?
Really good to hear that somebody pushed back against the most overrated song of all time!
YEAH, THE GOOD SONG IS "WOMAN"
The only problem is the song is not about john lennon. That was all made up by the author of this story.
@@petefogel2133 so what do you think the song is about if it is not about the song Imagine by John Lennon
I've never tried to figure out Steely Dan lyrics. Half the time, donald and walter didn't even know what they were writing about.
It's not a matter if I don't think this song is about john lennon. I know for a fact it's not about john lennon.
@conceptualclarity
@@petefogel2133 please explain
I loved Steely Dan already.
I love Steely Dan even more now.
Elvis Costello's track, "The Other Side of Summer": "Was it a millionaire who said 'imagine no possessions'? A poor little schoolboy who said 'We don't need no lessons'".
"You know why music critics like Elvis Costello ? Music critics look like Evis Costello" - David Lee Roth
he is talking about a world that doesn't exist. I think that's where the word "imagine" comes in. Could be wrong, but I'm not the only one.
With today’s globalists wanting us to own nothing and be happy by 2030, seems it will exist sooner than never.
And if you're rich, you have the luxury to sit idly contemplating utopia.
@@markpawlowski4863 He was a hard working musician who brought a lot of joy to millions of people though his music. What are you up to?
@@markpawlowski4863That's why theres half a billion Buddists. Unlike Christian, Muslims and Jews, they haven't started any wars. Must work.
Pure Marxist communist drivel given to him by his guru/cult leader Yoko so called wife. She like most upper echelon communists is a rip roaring money hungry creep. She tried to cheat Julien out of his inheritance and was a major reason John rarely saw his son. She did NOT want to share at all. She just wants everyone else to so she doesn't have to pay taxes. Champagne socialist is there any other kind?
Ugly, greedy rich folks telling everyone else to share that crust of bread and that 5 to a room tenement apt. Yeah sure when you share what you have and life in a one room apt! What no then shut up John or all those over paid fools of 2020. Hollywood was allowed to work while mom and pop places when bankrupt.. So compassionate don't you think. Try tone deaf and condescending.
The 1977 album "Aja" was the pinnacle of their career. I fell "Gaucho" was a close second.
Do yourself a favor and listen to ‘Royal Scam’ in its entirety
✌🏽
I can't pick a favorite Dan album. Although I think the first four (Can't Buy A Thrill to Katy Lied) are slightly stronger than the next three (Royal Scam to Gaucho). And the "comeback" albums were pretty weak.
Fair enough. I've gone full circle, having lived through John Lennon worship, and seen the anguish of high school classmates when he was shot. In the end we have to accept that there may be people who accomplish wonderful things, but those same people can be shitty individuals in real life. Whether John or George were as wonderful or as awful as some claim, they impacted generations in tremendous ways.
It’s the devils work. He can manipulate and deceive us into believing crap like a stupid Beatles song is worthwhile. It is garbage.
Then of course Paul, never moved overseas and became a tax exile, continued grafting away making music because he loves doing it, has been a clean living vegitarian for decades, set up a school for young musicians, works for numerous charities and travels on public transport.
EXACTLY. It was from reading a volume of Caro's biog. of LBJ I came to think this. LBJ was pretty manipulative reaching the presidency and then he did wonderful things for the common people-the Voting Rights Act, rural electrification, etc. One can't let the perfect be the enemy of the good.
Yeah, it's the impact of that song on legions of vacuous groupies and fanbois that I condemn Lennon for
He made the deal though
"It's just a bloody song, mate." - John Lennon
It is a song that sucks.
"Let's write us a Swimming Pool"-Paul McCartney
Imagine he was on downers that day......
Your correct it's only a song!
Yup, love Lennon but don't like this particular song.
At least Lennon didn't want to write*******SILLY******* Love songs. And there's nothing wrong with that, if you would like to know.
I think it would have made a huge difference if, in the song Imagine, John had said "I wonder if WE can," instead of "you". I saw a video of him singing it live once where he did make the change...
1] John was known for notoriously slipping up and forgetting lyrics -listen to the Beatles recorded version of _"Tell Me Why"_ and you'll hear him have a bit of pronoun trouble… *that was left in the final mix.*
2] Since the narrator/singer is asking _you_ to imagine something it is because he or she have *_already imagined it._*
Nah.
I'm not sure why the interpretation came to be that John Lennon is singing to only poor people. Yeah, John had money and was a pretentious artsy-fartsy type and Steely Dan were resentful that the only real hit they had was intended as a mockery of Bob Dylan, not in their own style.
But I always thought of it as criticizing the conservative orthodoxy of classism, war and especially religion. IDK that Lennon's ideal hinged upon control/obedience and intolerance like those he was challenging.
I'm not convinced that it requires a vow of poverty. Hippy-dippy, yes, but hypocritical?
I agree. I’ve been listening to (and playing) Imagine for decades. The more I think about the lyrics the more clearly they seem to be an indictment of capitalism, organized religion and nationalism. It has literally never crossed my mind that he was suggesting anyone take a view of poverty or speaking to the poor or disadvantaged.
Vow of poverty…not “view”
Reelin in the Years is 50 years old. It sounds nothing like music today but is still modern. Excellence never fades
It's one of the first songs I remember hearing on the radio in my mom's Pacer when I was 3 or 4 years old. It's a gem that I've always loved.
it helps that recording technology was finally able to capture sounds accurately. had SD been born earlier, they'd be stuck with whatever tech there was in earlier decades. makes a HUGE difference. Timing is everything.
@@guscooger5366 Steely Dan also said that if the sophistication of the music matched the sophistication of the technology, we'd all be listening to Debussy. 🙂
Almost all music today is generic sound-alike music - anysong by anyband.
I know that STEELY DAN (No matter what iteration) are GREAT MUSICIANS... I saw them in concert and I was BORED TO TEARS...
Really? I almost paid several hundred dollars to see them in person. That bad?
For me Steely Dan is like a great meal. Every bite is layered with flavor and depth and leaves you wanting more
Fagan's song, "IGY/What A Beautiful World" speaks exactly of what Lennon wrote in "Imagine". Either this too is tounge-in-cheek or he was just coming around to the idea of making a better world tomorrow, today.
IGY was written about the international geophysical year, which Donald Fagen experienced as a kid, in 1957-58. He was expressing the optimism of the late 50s in America, the IGY had all these great plans but fell short, much like today with various causes
@@paulhundy2986 Fagen is now 75 and Lennon would have been 73, so they likely both were aware of IGY in '57/'58. I do agree that "Imagine" is a bit maudlin, Sometimes, we need optimistic persons who say foolish things sometimes.
@@jameswaters3939 Good to put these artists into their contexts, particularly as entertainers of complex ideas jammed into 3-to-5 minute pleasures. Lennon: "I don't believe in Buddha". "God" is a test, quite as extreme as "Imagine". Meanwhile "Bodhisattva" sounds too good to be mere satire, but, yes, it's tongue in cheek- SD's detachment is an end in itself while Lennon consistently searches for deeper belief. Lennon (83 this year) is a cynic too, but rarely portrays other people while Fagen and Becker rarely portray themselves. Lennon's work is filled with ways to legitimate something as childlike and elegant as "Imagine". ...."Why on earth are we here? Surely not to live in pain and fear."
@@kanlithunder The wry & sly and just the musicianship - S.D. - best ever. Good analysis. S.D. warps my mind with great lyrics, best melodies, just takes me on a ride.
@@paulhundy2986Exactly! Well said! I was a kid in the 1950’s and received a yearbook describing the International Geophysical Year. I never forgot it so when “IGY” came out I knew exactly what Fagen was describing.
(Fun fact: I printed the album cover for “The Nightfly” by Fagen which included “IGY”. 😁)
Love Steely Dan, clever lyrics and sublime music that doesn't sound like any other band. I never knew this song was about John Lennon though 😂 Funny. I'm a Beatles fan too but John was no angel and himself no stranger to songs that mock others! How do you sleep? 😳
Only Bradley can sing sublime songs
When he wrote "How do you sleep," he was responding to three McCartney ditties on Ram that had attacked him, George and Ringo. "But he doesn't publish his lyrics, and I do," John said on U.S. tv, so he still gets blamed for a biting song. Ringo replied to Ram with his own smash hit "Back Off Boogaloo," and the second song on George Harrison's Living in the Material World was "Sue Me, Sue You Blues." So it started with McCartney publicly attacking--and suing--the others.
Neither Donald Fagen nor Walter Becker ever said the song was about Lennon. Only this rag is saying it.
@@scurvybro8850 Also, "Imagine no possessions" isn't asking poor people to give up their crust of bread. I'm a fan of both bands, anyway.
@@dreamfable It's been over fifty years and people still don't get it. They forced Paul into a contract with Allen Klein that he did not want, and the only way out of it was to sue the corporation, which -- unfortunately -- included the other three Beatles.
I heard a Lennon interview where he says Imagine is an internal dialogue with himself (not preaching to others). Imagine is also supposedly based on Yoko's writings from her book Grapefruit.
Yeah, well, Yoko is so far up her arse and away from reality.
@@thedolphin5428 no, she isn't
John's lyrics were strong and some just didn't get it, like these steely Dan guys
@@joesmoker3378
Nah. Steely Dan just pointed out the glaring hypocrisy of the words versus the lifestyle reality of John and Yoko.
And even if Yoko had a hand in the writing, it is a soppy piece of fantasy dreaming which none of his/their fans (or a bunch of famous ceiebrities) could ever live by.
The song still makes me vomit till this day, and I turn it off whenever it comes on.
Well then, he should have kept it to himself. Why release a poem or a song if you dont want others to hear it and love it and believe it?
One of the best gigs I ever went to was Steely Dan at the Hammersmith Odeon - or The Apollo as it’s now called. It was in Sept. 2000 & the tickets were an expensive (at that time) £45 each, but the concert they gave was easily worth the money… a superbly balanced sound system meant that each instrument’s output was heard crystal clear with ‘space’ around it, and boy… could the guys play those instruments. The lead guitarist in particular was absolutely brilliant, I think he may have been a session musician Dan liked to tour with, but I don’t actually know. So glad I finally managed to see them live after too many years waiting!
I feel bad for you.
@@henryettacollins9095 you feel bad for me because I went to a great gig?! 🤣
Jon Herington is one of their favorites.
Lennon was much better at describing his own life than some imagined one.
Imagine, one of his own songs...
...oh, so you knew John Lennon? No? Then how can you spectulate...
@@keithkoenig5320 If you're a Beatles fan there are plenty of interviews where John Lennon explains the motivation behind his songs, Help being the most poignant. He was also the first to say if a song was just wordplay & non sense such as Hey Bulldog.
Imagine was an idealized view of existence.
I never took Imagine as telling people to abandon anything, possessions, God, religion….anything. Lennon was putting a thought experiment to music.
@CornbreadOracle "You never took." Good for you, but the rest of us take it another way.
Also John Lennon sang about "Power to the People."
I agree.' Imagine' is an atheistic, utopian song by a man whom only saw the world from a balcony. He wrote some great stuff with McCartney, but his solo work was angry. He had no peace in his life until Sean, and even then, look how he treated Julian. Here is a life who missed God, imho.
What’s wrong with atheism? Almost everybody is atheist since chose one god and reject the others 😂
Michael Mcdonald who met Skunk Baxter through his sessions as a vocalist/piano player for Steely Dan said it wasn't uncommon for him to do hundreds of takes on a song !!!!!! Using as many as 3 entire bands they kept floating around. Peg took 9 guitarists to get the right solo. 😮
Yup. Finding the right guitar solo for Peg was an ordeal. Becker and Fagen were almost crazed in their perfectionism. It always seems to have paid off though.
Yet Steve Gadd recorded aja one of the most coveted drum tracks of all time in 1 take.
I'm not surprised Peg is a brilliant song
@@sarahwelty9223 it is brilliant. The guitar work is sublime.
Skunk Baxter didn't mind SD's perfectionism. He said the duo spent half an hour finding just the right chair for him to sit on. He didn't care as he was being paid $300 an hour. SD is great, but not on the level of Lennon or McCartney.
Never was a Steely Dan fan. Haave come to appreciate them more now that I'm older. As I have with a lot of musics and artists I may not have cared for when younger
Same. It took me years and years of hearing the Rolling Stones to realize that yes, they are the greatest band ever, or at least one of the greatest bands ever.
Steely Dan though I always liked. Ever since I heard the commercial for Aja when I was 11 or 12, with the opening to Josie playing in the background. I was instantly hooked on them.
Two words: perspective. And viewpoint. I personally (and boy am I not wealthy!) feel the idea and ideals of the song "Imagine" are awesome & relevant … But of course how one perceives it might be different than the original intention (as can happen with many forms of art).
In any event, I certainly am a big Steely Dan fan - especially some of their later work, such as the albums Gaucho & of course my favorite, Aja 🙂
Great point. I'm sure Lennon was referring to the super rich when he sang "Imagine no possessions; I wonder if you can."
I like Steely Dan too, though I'm more the Greatest Hits kind of fan. I've listened to all their albums on Spotify, but I don't think this song stood out. Have to give it a re-listen now.
So glad to see that there are still individuals that are critically thoughtful and not reactionary.
Imagine was essentially written by Karl Marx 🙄
@@russellziske7385 -- "Imagine" just pinpoints the three main reasons man wages war: Possessions (aka, 'riches'), religion, and borders. No possessions, no religions, no borders ... no war. Has very little, if nothing at all, to do with Marx or socialism. It's an anti-war song ... a.k.a, "livin' life in peace."
John Lennon thought he was a working class hero but he was just another rich, famous guy telling poor people how to live. I love his music but not his preaching.
Lennon's son Julian called him a hyprocrite. Lennon actually beat his first wife and once he hooked up with Yo-yo Oh-No he totally cut Julian out of his life, his will and all. Sad that so many people worshipped him as a world man of peace when he was no better than anyone. Just a rich jaw flapper...
BS
@@bettertoolatethannever, actually that is true. Hard to believe, but true.
Sometimes the truth hurts @@bettertoolatethannever
John was known to be a very bad drunk. He kicked Stu Sutcliffe in the head when he got angry at him for leaving the band, and that may have done him in.
👍
Passing a fat doobie around and listening to steely dan what great times those were.
haha, and still are !!
@@swingymcswing🤡 Ooooo....you're sooo cewl doing bongs....
@@lemurianchick youre so cool for making fun of people enjoying themselves 🤡
@@lemurianchickLemuria, huh? Oooh, your so cool doing new age delusions.
Yes indeed.
As a die hard BEATLES fan I am not blind to the fact that John was not a God and would even hate that thought...( Even though he famously said they were bigger than Jesus..).. He was a flawed man, but without a doubt a true genius. I always think of Paul being the HEART of the band and John the SOUL. STEELY DAN were the Coen Brothers of music and they made great music with a sardonic 'wink wink' which I would think John would appreciate. A lot of great music from both bands.
Lennon talked about love yet dumped his son, spoke about kindness but got into fights, and no possessions while living in that penthouse. And Lennon being p-whipped by Ono was a major factor in the bands breakup. Lennon reminded me of that guy who has no male friends because he is under his woman’s control.
@@williamgullett5911 Paul wrote Hey Jude for Julian and was more of a father figure to him. John was a Man Child and maybe why he needed a mother figure like Yoko who was much older than him. A truly flawed genius.
@lonwolf8245 Sounds like his contemporaries didn't like John much. Steely Dan wrote a couple songs about Lennon that mocked him. Supposedly Elton John mocked Lennon by asking how a guy who talked about no possessions could have a huge penthouse. Imagine. The Beatles were good, they just weren't my favorite
"Bigger" meaning "more popular". Although Jesus was and is pretty popular, too.
Seems pretty obvious the members of the Beatles were swapped with lookalike replacements for the Pepper album onwards. The lawyer and author Cynthia F. Hodges a.k.a. Tina Foster and AurigaBooks online has spent many years uncovering this as a Beatles fan herself.
It's political of course. Lennon, the intellectual socialist vs SD, the down to earth conservative. It gets people thinking at the very least.
Trumpers with guitars!
2:12 - the name of the song is "Only a Fool Would Say That." It's literally the subject of your video, and you got the name wrong.
Thanks, I didn’t want to watch the whole video.
This was the remark I was looking for, THANK YOU!
He also got the date of imagine wrong, they said it was written in 1971. Ha ha ha….. just off by 10 years
@@shortaybrownit was written in 1971.
Right up there with the sentiment ‘all you need is love’. Easy for someone worth many, many millions to say it. But you trying paying the rent, or buying groceries, or keeping the heat on with ‘Love’. 🙄
Never could stand Lennon. What a shyte
Well if you're a hooker, then yes, you can do all that with Love. As long as you charge enough.
SD wrote a lot of catchy songs but they never inspired me like the Beatles did.
Wow....... I like both......... But SD is within my frequency of perfect taste! Both were great in their own right! But I like nearly everything SD, not so much Beetles! They were of my sisters generation!
Sd where easily the equal of the fab four I'm a fan of both sd are a underrated band they deserve far more praise 👏
Haha 😂
I listened to the Beatles growing up but I BOUGHT Steely Dan albums. I wore the grooves out on every one!
They were always a unique band.
Loved Lennon and steely Dan no need to pick one over the other.
I just learned last weekend that Steely Dan was a band started at Bard College, and originally had three members including a drummer named Chevy Chase. Chase was expelled, and the other two stayed as a band. And it looks like both sides ended up quite successful.
I also read years ago that Chevy Chase was their drummer, but I thought he quit on his own.
It’s hard for anyone to say exactly what either songs true meanings are, especially because very few where there. Also there seems to be a common thread among struggling actors musicians and the like. They will do anything to make it big and put in all the effort and sacrifice. But then after making it they realize the true cost of this, and it staggers them.But let’s face it maybe imagine and that line was John realizing life’s true wealth was not material things at all. I’m a fan of both bands seen the Dan but not The Beatles.
yoko wrote Imagine
My all time favorite Steely Dan tune, never knew it spoke of Lennon.
I didn't know that it was about Lennon either I'm surprised!
I doubt it actually is.
@@fed1up But even if it isn't, it's fun to think it could be. Just because it fits.
I don’t know why people can’t use their imagination?
That’s what his point was. Imagine if the things that divide us didn’t exist?
He’s really talking about eliminating the “ things “ in your life that hold you back.
I see it as a personal challenge to rise above selfishness and a narcissistic culture.
Yes, and become a good communist.
When Donald Fagen was still in Jay and the Americans, he must have had some kind of criminal arrest wherefrom he couldn't leave the state of Maryland and couldn't drive. He lived with his grandparents durin that time and all the gigs were around DC.
He went to a community college same as myself, Montgomery Junior College (later Montgomery College) in John Fahey's town Takoma Park Maryland. He used to hitch-hike to his grandparents' house after school, and I picked him up and drove him to there every day.
As formerly reported in Wikipedia (since deleted) all the members jokinly used ficitious names. He told me his name was "Howard Wittenberg". I knew he was in Jay and the Americans, because I saw him outside one of their gigs, wearin a Beatle suit. He replaced the original Bass player, and was younger than the other members of the band.
I always noted that John Lennon was playing "Imagine" on a pricey piano in a beautiful house.
It's satirical.
Apartment
@@terryenglish7132Nope. It was an estate!
@@FrankHerrera-qr1mh I heard it was shot at the Dakota
@@terryenglish7132 Yikes!
Yea, far out man. I appreciate that Steely Dan have written some very witty and cryptic lyrics; the problem that I have with it though, is that you have to wade through so much shlocky pop and cod funk in order to get to them.
Not how I feel. Not many people would agree it is shlocky pop
@@granthurlburt4062 It's ok. We're all allowed to have an opinion. In my own defence though, I did point out that I appreciated their songwriting skill - I have my own preferences. They tend to be the earlier compositions.
Always loved that tune. Love it even more now.
Me too ✌️
Me too. Leave it to Steely Dan to troll John Lennon🤨🤑😴 Imagine if musicians were not allowed to daydream or dream and were relegated to writing cynical songs about other musicians and the occasional joyous song about their coke-dealer buddies. You'd probably end up with Steely Dan.
Thank You Donald Fagen... Your Music is AWESOME... I still hope John made it to Heaven. Even though he imagined it wasn't real...
Now I know why nobody knows what Steely Dan looks like.
It's about music, not looks.
Thats probably why most people cant name any of their songs either then@@SPAZZOID100
are you a girl or just gay
@@SPAZZOID100 Well they damn sure didn't get by on their looks alone!
Beatles weren't much better looking. John Lennon chose to look like an unkempt bum despite his vast wealth.
Uhmmmm he was singing.... IMAGINE.... Lennon was not in any of the worlds he was IMAGINING. For writers that did so much great work, I wonder why they didn't get that.
Too sensible for this crowd.
TBH, I have no problems with either song. Setting John Lennon's foibles aside, "Imagine" is a nice sentiment and something worth working towards, though I can't see it happening as a world event any time soon. I wouldn't want to give up all my possessions, but I wouldn't mind parting with a lot of them.
That's always been true & will always be true...
Love Steely Dan.
Whether it was hypocritical or not Lennon was trying to spread positivity and what he considered to be valid ways for society to improve. All Steely Dan did was drop a diss track without offering any alternatives
he could have spread positivity to his friends, bandmates and family
You are correct and very well said.. Steely Dan just put down and doesn't help so his comments are worthless. I only liked 1 Steely Dan song. I loved and still love Lennon and his music.
Not a Steely Dan Fan, but Theodor Adorno didn't have a hand in writing their music; unlike Commie John's music. Baby boomer Pop Goyim Pablum.
I agree 100%.. he was imagining at outcome not saying it was simple to get there but morons like Steely Dan chose to attack and undermine be negative
@@brmbkl So? Most people could do better at spreading positivity to their family and friends, what’s your point? My comment was about Steely Dan’s lyrics on “Only A Fool Would Say,” and your response was basically, “well, John was a bad guy, so…”
Can't Buy a Thrill is by far their most interesting album. All their stuff is great but the first album is just so quirky, and Do It Again is a great first hit.
It's a stretch to say it's about John Lennon specifically. Like a lot of Dan tracks, it's ambiguous, capable of many interpretations. It comes across as a piece of bitterness, siding with the common man against the iniquity of cheap but convincing-sounding easy solutions. Given their attacks on cults on other tracks, this feels like one of their generalised ironic commentaries on the state of political theatre and the games of the rich compared to the realities faced by most.
If I grew up in Great Neck, I'd be a bit queasy about life too.
Not just John. They all preach a good line: for thee, not for me.
They are all the same, elites all!
"Preach" is the word - rich evangelical mega-church preachers asking the poor to tithe. Then, keeping it all and not using it to do good works for the poor.
In defense of John Lennon:He paid his taxes in America and didn't whine about it (they were high taxes) and those taxes went to support the poor in the U.S..Also some of that tax money went to support the U.S. government.
He moved to America in part to stop paying much higher taxes in England. The song “Taxman” by Harrison sums up their thoughts on taxes.
@@rwhite1357 The rolling stones recorded their famous "Exile on Main Street" LP in France, for same reason - to avoid the onerous UK taxes.
I was never a big jazz fan but somehow, when Steely Dan fused it with Rock they created lightning in a bottle. A great band with a unique sound. I always found John Lennon's Imagine to be a pompous and pretentious song. The fact that Steely Dan mocked it makes me like them even more.
Watching the video of Imagine with Yoko and John in the gigantic mansion always seemed a little ironic to me.
Steely Dan is simply pure unadulterated genius on the highest level. I didn't notice anyone mentioning how they got
their name. Everyone probably already knows.
Frank Zappa ridiculed Lennon with his song Oh No too.
It was also nice of Lennon to steal King Kong from Frank, re name it Jamrag, and not give FZ any credit for the song.
It's a bit obscure favourite of mine, but how about The Forgotten Rebels' "England Keep Your Stars"?
I remember you so many years ago
What I saw in you I don't know
I saw stars when I opened your door
They landed on our fair shores
Their novel accents made them so rich
While I'm stuck playing In a rotting ditch
Now London don't swing like a pendulum do
England keep yer starts
So won't you keep yer stars
England Keep yer stars
Won't you keep yer stars
England keep yer stars
Two days later says she'll be my girl
Think I found my place I wanna be with her
She's got a real classy personality
I wanna hold her tight when she's walkin' with me
Every time I look at her and every time I hold her hand
I wanna tell her things that I'll never tell no one
She's got a neat way of makin' it so fun
Since she's walked in to my life
I don't even need to think twice
The girl I was lookin' for all along
I can't tell her every thing in this song
I'll always be true to her
There ain't nothing I won't do for her
Through Canada and America they played the biggest arena
They took money from our pocket then they got ripped off
I wanna be so bloody rich, I wanna be a snob
And make my wife a bitch
Now London don't swing like a pendulum do
England keep.yer stars
Radio loves the English bands
Radio loves the American bands
Have they censored Canada to get their money from foreign lands?
Rebels like us who have it rough
Canadian radio will not play our stuff
Now New York don't swing like a pendulum do
England keep yer stars
when ask frank says ''well he was a nice guy''
Zappa 4 years earlier did a song, Oh No, critical of All You Need Is Love, with a melody (in 5/4--previously an instrumental segment on the orchestral Lumpy Gravy) and lyric much better than Steely Dan's mockery. Even so John and Yoko later performed in 71 with the Mothers at the Fillmore.
Long live the Maestro.....Mr. Frank Zappa!!!
Thx a lot
🙏agree with you!
Beatles suck regardless
A sharper parody of "Imagine" was buried in Elvis Costello's The Orate Side Of Summer" ... :
Was it a millionaire who said "Imagine no possessions". a poor little schoolboy said "We don't need no lessons"
[ouch]
John praised Costello's 'What's So Funny About Peace, love and Understanding.' He didn't dole cudos to his peers often. Could you imagine to have just read the Playboy interview in which John gave the rare shout-out to him only to be utterly shocked hours later in learning of his violent death by five bullets to the back? Elvis had only the highest regard for the Beatles and John. Besides doing a cover of his song 'Bulldog,' as did the Foo Fighters(Dave Grohl), he believe it or not covered Yoko Ono's song 'Walking On Thin Ice.' Elvis lyric you're referring to probably was a jab at Steely Dan looking at a grownup song like a kid who fights over toys or all jazzed for the new Nike shoes Daddy bought for him.
It seems John had profound childhood losses. Through his youth, he covered his grief and fears with bravado that often came out as bitter sarcasm and cruel anger. As a young man he would mug drunks and, when one resisted, John beat him severely then feared he'd left the man for dead. His moderate poly-substance use disorder was growing at this time, a disease which he'd try in vain to control. His brilliant wit and songwriting talent enabled him to use the Beatles to build a broad support network which enabled his addictive disease. As his disease became severe he became increasingly violent, seeking bar fights as entertainment with his friend Harry Nillson. He once grabbed Peter Lawford by the collar and put his fist to Lawford's face (Lennon sent an explicit apology the next day which confirms the story). Demonstrating hippie values was a feeble best effort to counter his rage and self-hatred; he was powerless over his childhood grief and illness, and his addictions were enabled by so many people, that he didn't stand a chance. -Doug Pratt, Atlanta, Georgia, USA.
I don't think that...For me 'Imagine' is a song about a different world...and not about the world we live in where money is important and peace has to be fought for...so I don't see the hypocrisy in the song that other people seem to do for that very reason...I mean the clue is in the title...surely
SD's take is appropro but as a Lennon fan he was simply describing the perfect nap. ie.,, escape from life's minefield..Make the world go away feeling.. Imagine's been hijacked by many and now has life and meanings of its own. But its nothing to get hung about. John was a basic regular guy, full of our typical contrasting impulses, he liked gadgets, he liked "stuff". The eastern communist philosophies wrestled with the surrounding societal contradictions making our heads want to explode. Johns genius was his ability to blend opposites into ironic harmony. This song is simple escapism. No guru, no method, a bit mad, An artist.
Julian Lennon said Steely Dan is one of his favorite bands.
Paul McCartney attended one of their concerts in England in the early 2000s.
I love Steely Dan. Genius.
I am poor by most standards.....I gladly can IMAGINE the world a better place and Lennon/Oko describe it beautifully... lighten up...
Having only gotten into "The Dan" around the time of Katy Lied, there are several of their older songs I haven't paid much attention to, so it was interesting to hear about this song's reference to Imagine, which is fairly obvious, now that you've pointed it out. I differ with you, though, in terms of how you interpret Becker's and Fagen's attitude as lyric writers. You must have noticed that a lot of their songs are written from the point of view of an imaginary character, whose views are not necessarily the same as their personal opinions. Songs like Don't Take Me Alive, Everything You Did, Kid Charlemagne, and Goucho being obvious examples. So, given that tendency, I think it's risky to presume, based on the lyrics of this song, that they were actually disdainful of Lennon, as distinct from painting a portrait of someone who was. You also state that Lennon "wasn't enamored" of Steely Dan, which seems like an assumption on your part (I'd be interested to know if Lennon ever said something publicly in that regard). I understand that UA-cam is largely driven by the public's love of conflict, but I think you may have cooked up a feud here that never actually existed.
Well said
U got it!
I never realized this number was about "Imagine", but personally I always wondered why so many people were enamored with John Lennon. He to me seemed so fake and contrived, an axe to grind with God for who knows why. Instead of his reasons, we hear his complaints and his downright denial, displaying an utter lack of curiosity for the most important event to have ever occurred, simply to give vent to his apparent self-assured superiority to the creator of everything we see, when I think it should be abundantly clear that he lacked so much. Humility, John had none. Steely Dan shows so much more true musical ability than John Lennon, they hardly belong in the same sentence. A well-done video, likely the best I've see in a long while. I hope you keep at it and work out more of these gems.
how can you have an axe to grind with a fictional character? 🤔
Glad to know I’m not the only one. I’ve always thought Lennon was completely full of himself and easily dismissed.
So agree. Imagine there's no religion (read faith in the creator ) . . . Well the west has largely delivered on Lennon's wish, and consequently it gets uglier, sicker, less safe and more without hope by the day. Lennon didn't have a dream, he had a nightmare.
@@bcssylf you will have your day to regret your words. I could tell you about the day an alien came into my delivery van, but alas, would it have any effect on you?
you seem to resent John because he wasnt overtly religious. SD didnt pen a whole bunch of peans to god, either! lol
It is a bittersweet song without a hint of mockery. And SD were not known for ramming their opinions down people’s throats in their lyrics, but rather, were ironists who wrote in other people’s voices. So there is doubt in my mind about the premise of this video.
Yeah, it could be about a girl he knew that wouldn't just shut up and screw , so Don snapped bad . A lot of his lyrics are sections that inspire each other but aren't a continuation of the preceding section , so the Man on the Street part might have come from an op ed Don read about rich liberals vs working poor . I notice he doesn't quote Fagen anywhere , so this interpretation is just something he thought of .
@@terryenglish7132 I hate to break this to you, Spanky, but liberals, rich or not, aren't the problem.
"Satire should, like a polished razor keen, Wound with a touch that's scarcely felt or seen...." -- Mary Wortley Montagu
Steely Dan's writing style in a nutshell.
@@terryenglish7132 "A lot of his lyrics are sections that inspire each other but aren't a continuation of the preceding section." That's a good way to put it. I'm still confused by the lyrics from the end of Hey 19 and how it relates to the rest of the song: "The Cuervo Gold/The fine Colombian/Make tonight a wonderful thing." I read something somewhere about this is just the song's narrator fantasizing about 19 in a tequila haze after realizing that they can't be together, though where the evidence of that is in those lyrics, I don't know.
@@johnbgood52 Say hi to your son and brother for me
In the 70's we considered Steely Dan as "MOR" music.
I was a huge Beatles fan as a kid, but to me their stuff has not aged well. After “Revolver” it just got sillier and sillier. Steely Dan’s stuff, on the other hand, still sounds fresh and intelligent, even though some of it is over 50 years old.
“Sergeant Peppers” is masterful
That’s a terrible opinion lol. Sgt Pepper, White Album, and Let it Be are among the very best of all time and that’s not even a little bit controversial to say. Steely Dan on the other hand is like a watered down variant of elevator jazz.
@@daffyduck5351 The white album is actually my personal fave of all the Beatles LPs. I do think your assessment of SD is a bit on the extreme side tho. They are basically a rock band with strong jazz influences.
I loved Steely Dan. Good point there about the obscenely rich and famous laying down supposed inspirational ideas for the working classes... while walking hand in hand into fantastic estates... Look at Yoko in this film segment - totally spaced out, detached?
That's why they call it dope!
Yes. Like @megamarkd I always tell my friends that McCartney was driving force of The Beatles. They claim that Lennnon was the one but they I think that their opinions are incorrect. He vital and amazing in the early years but later lost focus and interest while McCartney was still reeling in the years.
Lennon could write more of his feelings, McCartney was weak at that, stronger on tunes. Thankfully we had both of them to give us The Beatles.
@@howie9751 That's true...if by “feelings” you mean “feelings toward his mother and aunt.” Paul certainly was the more romantic Beatle. John’s “feelings” toward women were located more in his pants.
@@Panglos Paul could be very expressive, as in "Penny Lane". But when it came to relationships he went for the so-called romantic stuff or the "granny" tunes, as John called them. He couldn't write things like "Help", "No Reply" or "Run For Your Life", or even "Norwegian Wood", which required more depth of feeling, things people actually felt. They both gave us great music, and I'm not implying Paul was inferior. It took both of them.
“Never trust the artist. Trust the tale” - D.H. Lawrence