The casual way rape, slavery, and abuse is discussed is bizarre. Not dissimilar to when murderers casually talk about their crimes without emotion or awareness of the vileness of their actions.
Totally agree. I find it difficult to understand how the woman interviewer can sit there calmly whilst Shabir confirms non-consent, slavery and abuse. How can she not push back??
That was utterly shocking to me. Usually cults try to coat it all, but these practices are so satanic that they can’t be even twist it to make it sound at least somewhat acceptable.
This is such a great breakdown. It’s very sad watching Muslim women carelessly co-sign these beliefs. I empathize heavily with women who are subjected to these barbaric laws and principles. Until the brutal patriarchal nature of Islam is acknowledged and openly criticized, we will never be able to save those who fall victim too it.
I am always baffled when I see muslim women asking these questions and seemingly being fine with these terrible answers. Feels like Stockholm syndrome to me.
this is so funny and ironic to me, most women are against patriarchal society but they're so defensive about this religion when islam literally promotes that type of society, the Quran is against rebellious women (women who speak and stand up for themselves) but only support women who're obedient. And hey if a woman wants to live her own life style (traditional gender roles and what not) that's her choice but so many people are dishonest when it comes to the Quran and the islamic teaching.
@@FemmeaestheticFear of hell and nothing more. Even the female companions of the prophet felt a certain way. They said they felt uneasy about the fact that they weren't mentioned as much as the men in the Qur'an. Umm Salama (a female companion), I believe, complained that the men get more inheritance than them.
My dad had a few wives, but there was this one wife who he kept divorcing and marrying, divorcing and marrying, they were super toxic for each other and I think they actually divorced like 9 times or something. Anyway they did that whole marrying someone else in order to get back together thing, and it was with one of my dad's friends, I think an important guy from the mosque. I always thought it was weird, but I never thought of it from the perspective of how hypocritical it is of Muslims to be judging "western" relationships when they have this absurd toxic nonsense going on.
That sounds like a love-triangle or open relationship loop-hole waiting to happen. "Honey, I want to go out and have some fun with the boys tonight. Can you quickly divorce me three times?"
The concept of women's rights in Islam is one of the reasons I left Islam. I lived with cognitive dissonance trying to draw similarities between Islam and women's rights. I had to pick one and I picked women's rights and humanity.
The first clip of this guy and to hear this guy casually talk about "the slave status" and "ownership" of the concubine... Just made me physically sick.
Im going through a mortal crisis. Aladin you resonate and remind me of my childhood so much. I felt immensely guilty for asking questions and for not being able to be submissive like others.
What does Islam do to the brain of people? Many of them lose their ability to reason and to discern right from wrong at a basic level. What is going on? It is disconcerting.
0:01:53 CLIP1 0:07:22 What is Islams view on concubines? 0:07:57 How does consent play into this at all...? 0:08:25 end cllip Intro to the full video 0:08:45 start full video 0:09:09 What is Islam's view on concubines? followed by Aladin's comment 0:12:23 Is there a verse in the Koran specifically states what you have said? 0:14:54 What does right hand possession mean? 0:18:03 Does consent play into this at al or...? 0:23:33 WHATABOUTISM 0:26:00 women's consent (cont.) 0:30:51 So it sounds like it is more relatable to previous times. How do we understand this within our context today? 0:34:07 Repeats the question, but explains (fallaciously) why slavery continued so long in the muslim world (remark: where all slaves concubines (sex-slaves in modern times)? 0:40:07 answer: there are nowadays (high ranked and respected) scolars who see having non-muslim slave concubines is a right for moslim men 0:45:28 CLIP2: Is islamic mariage unfair to women? 0:46:40 (critical thinkin) Do you think it is ineeded in the area of mariage? 0:54:10 Do you think men and women are equal in a mariage from islamic perspecrive? 0:54:50 Are you saying it was not equal because of -what the koran said at the time -or of the interpretation -or where is that...? 1:23:33 To bring it back 1:24:33 In what ways are muslim women disadvantaged in the current mariage system from an islamic lens? 1:28:31 So this is an islamic principle? 1:28:41 from datin back from the previously, right? 1:36:31 Do you still think islam views women in a positive light? 1:39:23 CLIP3: Divorce issues 1:40:09 Is it true that to give a divorce os easier for men than for women? Is it easier for women from an islamic perspective to get devorced? 1:40:49 So what are the more general rulings as a process arpund devorce? 1:48:28 So is it true that only men have this exclusive right? And I have also heard that basically all men have to do is, say the word divorce three times and that's it, they are divorced 2:06:06 So it almost positions the woman as someone who is really weak and therefore she needs a man to have these powers to then give her the courage to be like: "Okay, I'm gonna leave." So why. if we say islam is a religion that empowers women, why the situation and why do women not have the same right? 2:15:22 To play the devil's advocate, where is that in the koran? 2:21:40 So what should we do in a situation when a woman is in a relationship and she wants to get out? There is no reference to woman having the ability to do that 2:22:42 What if a woman wants to get out of a relationship, but the guy is not willing to give her a divorce....What is the advice here, if we are looking at taking islam from a positive light that gives women their due right? 2:27:29 ... as you pointed out, we need to change the way we even view divorce and give women their due right. So how can we as a society start to do that? 2:31:46 THE VERSE OF TODAY'S STREAM
Small acts of and statements expressing compassion, empathy, and concern from a man should not feel validating but in fact it fills me with gratitude to hear your heart going out to women, because like many Muslim women I was raised with very little acknowledgement of our basic rights and problems and thus have low standards that can be exceeded with even an infinitesimal show of humanity. Nonetheless, I want to say thank you for taking the time to comment on Dr Shabbirs breakdown of womens rights. I watched this show thinking it illuminated a lot of the issues in Islam but as you have shown, very little commentary is actually an expansion of Islamic teachings and principles and largely generalizations about solutions for current problems.
Ask David Wood why as s Christian apologist he rarely ever speaks about the Bible or Christianity, but instead is hyper-focused on the Quran and Islam.
@@Envi-jm8miWhat? He talks about Christianity all the time. It’s just that most of his live streams are about Islam. His other videos are commonly about Christianity. There are also a LOT of other Christian apologists and teachers that focus on Christianity and the Bible. Christians don’t have to be ashamed of our scriptures because they’re actually good and right. 😊
@@John-lf3xf , your example with point number 2 is not a really good one to be honest. For someone who claims to have studied logic, any basic student would point out that you've conveniently used a false or vague premise to get to an unsound conclusion. The conclusions that are implied by a set of premises is on the *assumption* that they are true. But then in logic, you still need to justify those assumptions. You can't just have any premise if it is not sound. You keep doing this until you reach the axioms (i.e. a set of unprovable elementary statements which are assumed and justified). The reason why Islam is criticised in terms of logic is because even its own premises don't lead to it's logical conclusions. It falls flat by its own standards that it puts on itself.
This was a very informative albeit in many aspects frustrating and infuriating dissection of Islamic apologetics. However, as an exmuslim woman who has female family members effected by many of the issues being discussed here, listening to SAli down play the sexual abuse of enslaved women and defend marital rape and domestic abuse of Muslim made me lose the will to live.
The spectrum of consent is very important in the part about her having to marry and have sex with another man before getting back with her ex. Just because she may be willingly doing it doesn't mean she wants to. We use the spectrum of consent a lot in SW activism as SWers for what consent really is. It's not just as simple as saying yes or no.
Aladdin, I have so much respect for you. It is exhausting to keep hearing this from men that if that somehow women having autonomy is worse because of "sexual promiscuity" than complete subjugation of women in Islamic societies. Giving each human being autonomy is much more important than this fear of Zinna these people have been brainwashed with.
1:46:20. Exactly. Just bc there's a verse that told u to don't do bad things doesn't mean it would made the other verses that has contrast meaning just disappear. Instead, it just shows that there is contradiction in that book
Finally finished watching the whole video, didn't get to sit for the whole live stream. Great analysis Aladdin! Your counter introspection was very well put. It's sad how much leeway there is for unfair abusive circumstances for women. I'm hoping the PR peddling moderate speakers like Shabir and his listeners (and especially the woman host) catch up to these questions and introspect themsleves and the scriptures, deflection doesn't work, it's high time.
If you listen to the UA-cam items of extremists this is what they plan to do to all those who do not follow their version of Islam. So not only are other religions viewed as slaves but they include Muslims as slaves too.
Again, loved the video, keep it up Aladdin! On a slightly different note, I think it'd be really interesting to see your take on Khaled Abou El Fadl - not really an apologist/dawah person and not nearly as popular as these but has a pretty active youtube presence, a solid background in both traditional islamic scholarship and western academia, and appears to engage seriously with such topics
@@batman-sr2px I'm not entirely sure what your point is... How are their respective 'liberal' positions relevant to my comment? Is any Muslim public speaker who comments on controversial issues associated with Islam considered an apologist, or just the ones with a liberal/modernist bent? Re: Ex-Muslims and liberalism - I'm not an Ex-Muslim but, in a general sense, you might even have a point here, and this is an 'issue' how?
@@batman-sr2px Liberalism gives you a choice to choose, you know the free will yall theists try to boast about. Liberalism allows you to pray to whatever God you want and do whatever you want as long as if doesn't harm anyone else. If you feel it's wrong to let people to live how they please without harming anyone, but instead be a slave to an old ideology that we can't ever 100% is real, you all are the problem, as always to any progress in human history, let it be gender equality, ending slavery or ending racism.
well to be fair they don’t “say” he is superior- its just the responsibility of providing n protecting that gives him leadership role (also because he is physically n emotionally stronger). faith remains the same or value given to their actions. however some do believe women are inferior in faith actually (for no fault of her own- my words)
@@hashh2019 Actually, men have more testosterone, which give them more higher rates of emotional rollercoster. Because of that hormonal trait, men tend to have more violent inclinations, they tend to react more impulsively (we can see that by comparing men and women regarding violent crimes: murder, rape, assault, etc. etc. pedophilia, men are at the top!!!). Men are more instictive (animalistically) then women. Women have more EQ then men, and women can be more resilient (pain, emocionally, etc.). And regardin IQ: there's no difference between genders.
@@John-lf3xf Islam has a very serious problem; the problem is “SCHOLARS.” After Mo’s demise, the Islamic scholars had to sell Islam to the new generations; the thought of their prophet being very unsavoury was not a good selling point. Hence Mo needed some good public relations. Mo had already set the stage for this; his Koran is salted with constant references to his excellent moral character. One of the verses recited in the five daily prayers extols Mo’s excellence. The scholars simply built on these so-called good points and embellished them until Mo was perfect, the best man to have ever lived. With the 1000s of scholars working tirelessly for centuries compounding deception upon deception, we now have a religion that firmly floats on a rafter of deception. They cherry-picked only the ahadith that say positive things. Now that we have access to the ahadith, we see the true Mo; this has sent their scholars into a frenzy of covering up, twisting, and bending the truth and sadly, the average Muslim is deceived. The blind fanaticism of Islam continues. Mo’s vices are hidden that deep in the deceit of Islam that they no longer exist. The problem these modern scholars have is that they rely 100% on what former scholars have fabricated, they never think to go back to the authentic sources and do a critical deep dive. Hence Islam is left with the blind leading the blind. rd
49:00 this is an issue with all religions. Their isn't a rigorous methodology where you can update the content. In catholicism there are papal bull's but the underlying problems still exist. Anyways, you really started me thinking, which I truly appreciate.
I think the main problem is that many known religious belief systems is bound by very rigid rules written long ago within different cultures. Many religions started out as small movements with stories told orally together with rituals, traditions and art pieces before the stories were written down. As of today we might not know how these beliefs were exactly followed or how much these stories may have changed throughout the years. The only thing we know for certain is that there are historical traces alongside written records with some contexts. Unfortunately some ancient and harmful laws survive and thrive in certain communities when people in power keep them in practise. Other harmful aspects of some religious beliefs is the constant battle of what belief system is "the right one" and what kind of rituals are needed to participate in worship. These things creates more infighting and a thought pattern of "us vs them." Organized religion to me sounds as if it can stifle individual thinking and bring more fear. But if all religious movements where less about following harmful teachings and more about positive and respectful messages things might be more harmonious.
I watched a documentary about men who sell services to women of marry them sleep with them and divorce them, but sometimes they refuse to divorce at the end and then the woman is trapped with another guy.
Islam starts wars just for the purpose of acquiring slaves. You should read books by Bill Warner and Robert Spencer on the history of Islamic conquest. Or check out Apostate Prophet's video on the Spread of Islam.
@@oishikhasan8500 I agree with you. Islam is a totalitarian imperialistic regime trying to take over the world. There are many books written by tenured professors and peer-reviewed by universities, that uphold your assertion.
@@oishikhasan8500 The PR reason for starting wars is "Spreading religion, self-defense, stopping the bad ka ffirs" to make them feel good about having a larger-than-life purpose, while the real behind the scenes reason is to raid goods/resources (including resources such as slave labour-səxual and physical) and eradicate enemies that would fight for ownership of those resources.
@@John-lf3xf there is no "Good" way to treat a slave i don't care how well islam says to treat them. The mere fact it allows humans to own other humans as property is disgusting in and of itself
Shabir Ally had some role models, I assume, when he grew up... It's a pity he (apparently) had pretty weird role models back in the days. Otherwise he'd have looked at his sister - and said to himself: "I am a human, and so is she." Him never having been introduced to such common sense must have lead to him to all these absurdities, such as seeing women as property, even in the 21th century... So sad.
A 9 year old girl IS NOT A WOMAN! Can 9 year old boys get married? Are they men at that age, like "women"? Why did noone ask that question? Can two 9 year olds get married?
Thank you for speaking on this ❤ Abrahamic religions make it extremely easy to excuse (or advocate for) abuse. I grew up in messianic judaism (a religion that fuses together both judaism and christianity), and I was constantly confused about how a loving god could allow (+encourage) slavery/rape/physical violence. People want to gloss over those details because "it was a different time back then" or "the text is distorted from so many translations". If the Torah/Quran/Bible are directly from God, why would God allow for so much miscommunication? Thank you again!! What you're doing is so important.
Show me where Torah and Bible verses where they encourage violence against women or say that women have half of the men's brain. Show me verses.i want to see
She understands that this version of Islam is what was needed and practiced in past centuries time. That’s how she dissociates from it. She see’s it as a past practice, not applicable to modern times. But like the word of Allah is for all times
She has a privilege to ask these questions in a country where she is given freedom and right. She would be singing a very different tone in iran or afghanistan.
chatGPT: To provide a thorough understanding of Muhammad Shahrour’s explanation of “mulk al-yameen” (مِلْكُ الْيَمِينِ) in the Quran, I will summarize his views based on his Arabic works, particularly “Al-Kitab wa Al-Qur’an: Qira’a Mu’asira” (The Book and the Qur’an: A Contemporary Reading) and other writings. Shahrour’s interpretation is rooted in his broader framework of reinterpreting Islamic texts through a linguistic, historical, and modernist lens. Shahrour’s Explanation of “Mulk al-Yameen”: 1. Literal Meaning and Context: • Shahrour highlights that the term “mulk al-yameen” linguistically means “ownership by right hand” or “possession under one’s authority.” However, he argues that its Quranic usage reflects social and legal relationships rather than literal ownership or slavery. 2. Critique of Traditional Interpretations: • Traditional Islamic scholars often interpreted “mulk al-yameen” as referring to enslaved individuals, especially women captured during war, who could be kept as concubines. Shahrour strongly critiques this understanding, seeing it as tied to historical socio-political contexts rather than a timeless divine command. • He stresses that Islam’s aim is to progressively abolish slavery, and the Quran’s references to “mulk al-yameen” reflect transitional laws addressing pre-existing practices in 7th-century Arabia. 3. Modern Reinterpretation: • According to Shahrour, “mulk al-yameen” in the Quran refers to lawful and consensual relationships outside the framework of formal marriage. He views it as an acknowledgment of relationships where mutual agreement and commitment exist, even if they do not align with traditional marital contracts. • For example, he links “mulk al-yameen” to alternative forms of partnership that respect individual autonomy and societal norms, offering flexibility in human relationships. 4. Focus on Ethical Principles: • Shahrour emphasizes that the Quran’s teachings prioritize justice, mutual consent, and human dignity. In his view, interpreting “mulk al-yameen” as concubinage or ownership contradicts the Quranic ethos of liberation and equality. 5. Key Verses Discussed: • Shahrour analyzes verses like Surah An-Nisa (4:24) and Surah Al-Mu’minun (23:5-6), where “mulk al-yameen” is mentioned. He argues that these verses highlight permissible sexual relations based on mutual agreement and ethical responsibility, whether within marriage or alternative arrangements. Key Arabic Excerpts from Shahrour’s Work: In “Al-Kitab wa Al-Qur’an”, Shahrour writes: “إن مفهوم ملك اليمين لا يعني امتلاك إنسان لإنسان، بل يشير إلى نوع من العلاقات التي كانت موجودة في المجتمع، حيث يعطي القرآن إطارًا أخلاقيًا وقانونيًا لهذه العلاقات.” (“The concept of mulk al-yameen does not mean the ownership of one human by another. Rather, it refers to a type of relationship that existed in society, where the Quran provides an ethical and legal framework for these relationships.”) He also states: “الهدف من النص القرآني هو تحرير الإنسان تدريجيًا من العبودية، وتوجيه المجتمع نحو المساواة والعدالة.” (“The goal of the Quranic text is to gradually liberate humanity from slavery and guide society toward equality and justice.”) Summary of Shahrour’s Approach: • Shahrour reinterprets “mulk al-yameen” as a historically contextual term that aligns with Islam’s trajectory toward abolishing slavery. • He views it as a framework for ethical relationships outside traditional marriage, focusing on consent, responsibility, and societal well-being. • His interpretation challenges classical readings that tie the term exclusively to slavery or concubinage, advocating for a modern understanding rooted in universal Quranic principles.
@ Aside marriage you can have a contractual agreement to live together or just verbally agree to be with each other on the terms you both have set? That’s the mulk-al-yameen.
the video title for the ex muslims channel is absolutely brutal, & it just goes to show that in certain situations putting things imams and scholars say down to their simplest meanings can really help you get over the amount of beating around the bush they do to try and justify messed up verses and hadith
The excuse is that it was part of that time(christians do the same) but this is supposed to be the all loving god's book. Muslims take this book as the truth and cannot be changed.
Literally shabir: Yes Islam allows all these horrible things, but that is for the people of the past. We have new problems that need to extrapolate the meaning and wisdom from the Quran and apply to today’s time using human interpretation. So basically create a whole new islam. The Quran and Allah like: uhh… did he not get the memo?
1:37:26 He can't define his own Islam. I'm sure he would lose his place among the shiekhs he's associated with. Plus, he can't define it because he doesn't seem to have it in the first place. فاقد الشي لا يعطيه. You can't give what you don't have in the first place.
Talking and endorsing slavery and raping thev slaves in 2022... is disgusting, of course it has always been disgusting, but now in the age of enlightenment it is very, very much more disgusting to say that... Shame on you Shabir Ally. I think Muslims have been frozen in time for 1400 years now!
Wowww I've seen so many Muslims say child marriage is a cultural thing not a Islamic thing. lots of big Muslim UA-camrs. And they say "forced marriage" isn't allowed but "arranged marriage" is. I really somehow as a leftist person was seriously considering looking into following Islam at one point bc of some of these spiritual feminist Muslims you see now on the internet and you really show how they just have their own versions of religion. Which isn't a bad thing. But don't pretend harm isn't being done in the name of that religion and don't pretend your way is the only way that's actually right and your religion doesn't cause any harm.
You are so smart. I used to watch Ninja Mommy and Medina TV and think Islam was better then Christianity, as someone who hasn't been exposed deeply to many Muslim people, and I'm glad that I have realized that Muslim people are often very good people, but I'm also glad I've realized Islam is another organized religion that is extremely toxic and violent if it is taken literally. You are so smart and I could listen to you talk about anything tbh. I wish there was someone who made videos like yours but dissecting Christianity bc my father is a born again Christian and I'm a queer woman who struggles w mental illness and he believes extreme things like even that if I prayed enough I wouldn't have mental illness and that teaching my son being gay is okay is "indoctrination". And he is so misguided about Christianity and thinks it's so peaceful , I need to become more educated so I can better refute it. I'd like to not even talk about it with him but he always brings it up even though I ask him not to and ask him to respect my sexuality and spiritual beliefs. Unfortunately he's really the only family I have. My mom died. I don't want to lose my relationship with one of my only family members and I do love him. But I can't just let him keep trying to push his religion on me and my child when we are around him.
Also one time he told me the saddest thing. His ex wife who was his only wife he ever really loved. He said he never loved my mother even though they never got divorced I guess it's because he believed divorce was wrong so they just didn't live together except when she had cancer he did get rent a house for us and take care of her until she died. But anyway this one ex wife is married and her husband verbally abuses her constantly and she is miserable and doesn't love him but my dad even agreed that she has to stay with him unless he cheats on her bc of God and that's the only circumstance God allows divorce. I feel so bad for that woman that she stays in abusive marriage because she believes that God wants her too. My dad says "well people should be more careful who they marry" easy for you to say being married three times... And if God really wanted that then f*ck him lol. But I don't believe a higher power would ever want that as a wiccan.
1:53:45 Never heard of this. A Man divorces his wife, then wants her back and she has to sleep with another guy before she can go back? Did i understand that right?
Not just sleep with a random guy but go on and have a genuine marriage with someone else. In the case where that marriage ends in divorce or death, then she can get back with a man she is irrevocably divorced from.
Attack on Yazidis was not a (war), Yazidis did not fight back, Yazidis were attacked only because they were not Muslims (just like the attack on Beni Quraithas)!
Any atheist can make a moral plan and yes you can judge the past morally. We have to judge the past morally so you know not to repeat it. Why are you defending this he said it’s allowed for men to have slaves. That means if a war breaks out these monsters acting as humans will do that to women. It’s sick and may god have mercy on these sick peoples who these ideas came from. We as humans were not put on earth to be tortured in such a sick way. Your prophet did this stuff and you know it
@@batman-sr2px Any atheist can make a moral plan and yes you can judge the past morally. We have to judge the past morally so you know not to repeat it. Why are you defending this he said it’s allowed for men to have slaves. That means if a war breaks out these monsters acting as humans will do that to women. It’s sick and may god have mercy on these sick peoples who these ideas came from. We as humans were not put on earth to be tortured in such a sick way. Your prophet did this stuff and you know it
”Let the quran speak” as a channel keeps up this same energy in almost all the videos that they post with Shabir Ally, they are somehow more honest and ”good willed” than most of the dawah scene while still not really answering the questions at hand... but for the believer audience they are good at putting their questions at rest by distracting the listener with many opposing views and minor details. By the end of the video there isnt anything firm to go by unless its a really easy topic, it just leaves a listener with the feeling that the problem at hand isnt a problem at all for islam, even when you dont really understand why.
If Daniel is more hateful & more 'by the book' then those are all the more reasons for you to dissect his arguments primarily over other dawahgandists. The mainstream don't take shabbir's pr campaigns seriously because he has diluted many things beyond recognition. Shabbir campaigns for a harmless docile version of Islam whereas Daniel campaigns for a dominating harmful pure Islam. Therefore daniel & his arguments need to be confronted more than anybody else's esp after that harris sultan debacle.
At the end of the day islam, by mahamed's examples, will take over : Stoned women for adultery. (Muslim 4206) "I have been commanded to fight against people till they testify that there is no god but Allah, and that Muhammad is the messenger of Allah" (Muslim 1:33) Permitted stealing from unbelievers. (Bukhari 44:668, Ibn Ishaq 764) Permitted lying. (Sahih Muslim 6303, Bukhari 49:857) Owned and traded slaves. (Sahih Muslim 3901) Beheaded 800 Jewish men and boys. (Abu Dawud 4390) Murdered those who insulted him. (Bukhari 56:369, 4:241) "If then anyone transgresses the prohibition against you, Transgress ye likewise against him" (Quran 2:194) Jihad in the way of Allah elevates one's position in Paradise by a hundred fold. (Muslim 4645) Married 13 wives and kept sex slaves. (Bukhari 5:268, Quran 33:50) Slept with a 9-year-old child. (Sahih Muslim 3309, Bukhari 58:236) Ordered the murder of women. (Ibn Ishaq 819, 995) "O you who believe! Fight those of the unbelievers who are near to you and let them find in you hardness." (Quran 9:123) Ordered 65 military campaigns and raids in his last 10 years. (Ibn Ishaq ) Killed captives taken in battle. (Ibn Ishaq 451) Encouraged his men to rape enslaved women. (Abu Dawood 2150, Quran 4:24) Demanded captured slaves and a fifth of all other loot taken in war. (Quran 8:41) Was never tortured, but tortured others. (Muslim 4131, Ibn Ishaq 436, 595, 734, 764) "And fight them until there is no more persecution and religion is only for Allah" (Quran 8:39) Blessed the brutal murder of a half-blind man (al-Tabari 1440) Ordered a slave to build the very pulpit from which he preached Islam. (Bukhari 47:743) What are the Greatest Commandments? "Belief in Allah and Jihad in His cause" (Muslim 1:149) Demanded the protection of armed bodyguards, even in a house of worship (Quran 4:102) Died fat and wealthy from what was taken from others in war or demanded from others in tribute. Advocated crucifying others. (Quran 5:33, Muslim 16:4131) According to his followers: Had others give their lives for him. (Sahih Muslim 4413)
Interesting dude, and I don’t mean that in a positive way. People like him are socially aware that there are things you cant just outright say in some places. His beliefs seem to lay within what he doesn’t say rather than what he says, as he beats around the push carefully picking his words. Anyways, great video as always man! There is a guy u might find interesting, he is highly controversial. His name is Adnan Ibrahim. I used to watch this dude a lot when i was doubtful and transitioning to a Quaranist as a teen. I got introduced to* the theory of evolution through his videos and he made me correct my misconceptions and believe in it. At that time, I thought he was quite different from all other muslim scholars.
@@stefonpalinic5559 Brainwash to the fullest extend! I know a girl that she’s a muslim very sweet but whenever I bring her the CLEAR errors in the quran and how the quran can’t be a book from the GOD of Abraham she tries to change the topic!!
Did that man made a talk on lgbt+ people ? If so could you react to it ? Cause I would love to see how he justify the treatment of queer people compared to the “old times” especially when if women they are a little obligated to do with them socially, because they have a value to men, it’s not the case for queer people and they are even seen as a danger to society or a non existing part of society all together. And this is a subject where the three religions of the book are pretty hardcore on their views and what to do to queer people especially in the more fundamentalist groups.
The issue here is why did Abraham have a concubine? Abraham had a concubine base on his fear his wife Sara was too old to bear a child, and this wasnt a divine permission by God. Even Abraham was unwilling to have a concubine but he was persuaded by sara his wife.
Abraham and Sara have the same father different mother....so technically they were brother and sister from their father so Isaac have one granddad....keep the blood patrial lineage in the family for the choosen people.
There is no evidence that these characters actually existed. Some (many? most?) non-religious biblical scholars feel Abraham may have represented someone real but the stories are just made up to serve a narrative.
@@dorarie3167 Abraham's grave is near Jerusalem and Sara too. Science can analyze the remains to see if all this biblical narrations are true or just someone's/group imagination so that humanity can be herded like sheep. Religions are design by man for mind control and it began during the early Bronze age when agricultural just started.
@@blossom11114 Again, that is a claim. Until such time as we have stronger or conclusive evidence of Abraham’s existence, we cannot treat it as fact. As well, even supposing that it is shown that Abraham existed, there then has to be evidence presented that the events he is associated with - the sacrifice of Isaac, Ishmael’s birth, etc - are true. THAT is an even bigger stretch.
1:26:55 So from my understanding of Islam, sharia is the highest authority within Muslim countries, while the law of a non-Muslim country has higher authority, then one should take it through Sharia first and then use the highest authority ruling and it should be accepted and tolerated, especially since sharia law has already been tested out, or rather sharia court. I don't comprehend why people should be ostracised because of something like that.
17:52 maybe woman in the Islamic context of polygamy are actually pissed off and are withholding sex for good reasons ie. their husbands having sex with other woman(other wives and concubines etc)
Yeah think about infections/diseases. The chances of catching sex diseases increase the more the man increases partners, doesn't matter if the other party is a virgin. Poor wife.
Look up early civilizations in the Middle East and North Africa women had a lot of power. Ancient Egyptian women had a lot of independence. One of the biggest Muslim lies that I hate is that it’s just the way it was. No it wasn’t.
I don't understand the argument about the the bad situation of women before the time of Islam which Islam was supposed to improve. Why there were the six centuries of christianity going on at the time. There were plenty of arabic Christians at that time. Why couldn't the Arabs learn from their Christian brothers? Why should they invent a new religion islam, which was brutal and barbaric.
We have the perfect divine system that doesn't encompass everything, not even the essentiels like marital rape and other forms of abuse, where men have the upper hand in everything, and it still needs tweeking. Mashallah those are the signs that it's from allah the all powerful the all merciful and the all knowing. An omni god that decreed all this shit while knowing it will turn out this way and would be harmful. I'm beyond shocked.
We had some twitter threads. He gets extremely evasive and then ignores me, and eventually blocked me months before i deactivated twitter I think his content is a waste of time to dissect
48:10 We don't have evidence of women treated harshly in pre-islamic age. But we have Khadiga, Muhammad's first wife. She was such an influencer and public figure in Qurish to the point where Muhammad benefited from her and nobody could say anything to his nonsensical new religion. Now how many historical Khadiga can you find after Islam, None.
Great video! I didn't know Shabir was such a snake... oh, one thing, I think you mentioned you would talk about how a wife and a slave in Islam didn't have much difference. I was waiting for that part, but I don't think you got to it?
They take the money and gold jewellery of the wife by emotionally blackmailing the wife, They create a situation were they need the money and sell the gold if you don't agree your a bad wife who values money more then your husband.
Regarding Christianity, I have two responses to his & your comments. There was sexual slavery in the Bible, but it was never sanctioned. Abraham took Hagar because Sara insisted on it and they lacked faith. God intended Sarah to be the mother. Furthermore, just because Jacob had sex slaves, does not mean that that was OK. Also, you discussed creationism in several religions. If you look at early sermons by Crhysostome, he discusses that the creation texts were not meant to be taken exactly as they were said. He discusses how they symbolized various things. That God did create the world, but using His hands to form man from the dirt was a way to show that he was intimately involved. Chrysostome was from a few centuries after Christ. The Bible was a condescension. We cannot comprehend how God does things. When God communicates with us through scripture, it is in the way that we tell things to toddlers. We cannot possibly comprehend God, so He dumbed it down for us in a way that we can somewhat comprehend.
For those who are not Chrsitians..to give perspective on how we view the Bible and our fathers of the faith (Abraham) 1. The old testiment is the story of the coming of Jesus. We don't believe Abraham or Noah were without sin. They made mistake like the sin Abraham committed of having a child with Hagar. 2. Slavery in today's context did not exist when Abraham was alive for Hebrew people. 3. We don't believe God spoke every word in the Bible. We believe his words are written in the text along with stories written by humans but inspired by Holy Spirit.
The casual way rape, slavery, and abuse is discussed is bizarre.
Not dissimilar to when murderers casually talk about their crimes without emotion or awareness of the vileness of their actions.
Totally agree. I find it difficult to understand how the woman interviewer can sit there calmly whilst Shabir confirms non-consent, slavery and abuse. How can she not push back??
@@emenjay0077 Decades of indoctrination does that to you.
That was utterly shocking to me. Usually cults try to coat it all, but these practices are so satanic that they can’t be even twist it to make it sound at least somewhat acceptable.
The poor yazidi girls come to mind.
@@emenjay0077 I think that’s his daughter
This is such a great breakdown. It’s very sad watching Muslim women carelessly co-sign these beliefs. I empathize heavily with women who are subjected to these barbaric laws and principles. Until the brutal patriarchal nature of Islam is acknowledged and openly criticized, we will never be able to save those who fall victim too it.
I am always baffled when I see muslim women asking these questions and seemingly being fine with these terrible answers. Feels like Stockholm syndrome to me.
this is so funny and ironic to me, most women are against patriarchal society but they're so defensive about this religion when islam literally promotes that type of society, the Quran is against rebellious women (women who speak and stand up for themselves) but only support women who're obedient. And hey if a woman wants to live her own life style (traditional gender roles and what not) that's her choice but so many people are dishonest when it comes to the Quran and the islamic teaching.
@@FemmeaestheticFear of hell and nothing more. Even the female companions of the prophet felt a certain way. They said they felt uneasy about the fact that they weren't mentioned as much as the men in the Qur'an. Umm Salama (a female companion), I believe, complained that the men get more inheritance than them.
My dad had a few wives, but there was this one wife who he kept divorcing and marrying, divorcing and marrying, they were super toxic for each other and I think they actually divorced like 9 times or something. Anyway they did that whole marrying someone else in order to get back together thing, and it was with one of my dad's friends, I think an important guy from the mosque. I always thought it was weird, but I never thought of it from the perspective of how hypocritical it is of Muslims to be judging "western" relationships when they have this absurd toxic nonsense going on.
To be fair, I think not many people have that kind of relationship
Yikes!
That sounds like a love-triangle or open relationship loop-hole waiting to happen. "Honey, I want to go out and have some fun with the boys tonight. Can you quickly divorce me three times?"
I thought that Muslim men were not allowed to marry their wives who they divorced.
@@TheHeavyshadowA polyamoury thing with extra steps :"3
"Think out of the box... Leave!" That nailed it down so perfectly
The concept of women's rights in Islam is one of the reasons I left Islam. I lived with cognitive dissonance trying to draw similarities between Islam and women's rights. I had to pick one and I picked women's rights and humanity.
Same sister I tried really hard to say that God cares about me has empathy for me sees me but I cannot anymore
Me too I just can't with the treatment of women, children and Homosexuals in Islam! 😢
The first clip of this guy and to hear this guy casually talk about "the slave status" and "ownership" of the concubine... Just made me physically sick.
Aren't you grateful to be so blessed as to be free to indulge in these feelings?
@@Sciencegrindswhatever that means
Im going through a mortal crisis. Aladin you resonate and remind me of my childhood so much. I felt immensely guilty for asking questions and for not being able to be submissive like others.
What does Islam do to the brain of people?
Many of them lose their ability to reason and to discern right from wrong at a basic level. What is going on?
It is disconcerting.
0:01:53 CLIP1
0:07:22 What is Islams view on concubines?
0:07:57 How does consent play into this at all...?
0:08:25 end cllip Intro to the full video
0:08:45 start full video
0:09:09 What is Islam's view on concubines? followed by Aladin's comment
0:12:23 Is there a verse in the Koran specifically states what you have said?
0:14:54 What does right hand possession mean?
0:18:03 Does consent play into this at al or...?
0:23:33 WHATABOUTISM
0:26:00 women's consent (cont.)
0:30:51 So it sounds like it is more relatable to previous times. How do we understand this within our context today?
0:34:07 Repeats the question, but explains (fallaciously) why slavery continued so long in the muslim world (remark: where all slaves concubines (sex-slaves in modern times)?
0:40:07 answer: there are nowadays (high ranked and respected) scolars who see having non-muslim slave concubines is a right for moslim men
0:45:28 CLIP2: Is islamic mariage unfair to women?
0:46:40 (critical thinkin) Do you think it is ineeded in the area of mariage?
0:54:10 Do you think men and women are equal in a mariage from islamic perspecrive?
0:54:50 Are you saying it was not equal because of
-what the koran said at the time
-or of the interpretation
-or where is that...?
1:23:33 To bring it back
1:24:33 In what ways are muslim women disadvantaged in the current mariage system from an islamic lens?
1:28:31 So this is an islamic principle?
1:28:41 from datin back from the previously, right?
1:36:31 Do you still think islam views women in a positive light?
1:39:23 CLIP3: Divorce issues
1:40:09 Is it true that to give a divorce os easier for men than for women? Is it easier for women from an islamic perspective to get devorced?
1:40:49 So what are the more general rulings as a process arpund devorce?
1:48:28 So is it true that only men have this exclusive right? And I have also heard that basically all men have to do is, say the word divorce three times and that's it, they are divorced
2:06:06 So it almost positions the woman as someone who is really weak and therefore she needs a man to have these powers to then give her the courage to be like: "Okay, I'm gonna leave." So why. if we say islam is a religion that empowers women, why the situation and why do women not have the same right?
2:15:22 To play the devil's advocate, where is that in the koran?
2:21:40 So what should we do in a situation when a woman is in a relationship and she wants to get out? There is no reference to woman having the ability to do that
2:22:42 What if a woman wants to get out of a relationship, but the guy is not willing to give her a divorce....What is the advice here, if we are looking at taking islam from a positive light that gives women their due right?
2:27:29 ... as you pointed out, we need to change the way we even view divorce and give women their due right. So how can we as a society start to do that?
2:31:46 THE VERSE OF TODAY'S STREAM
@metiusabt2581 thanks
The fact that she even asks about consent when it comes to sexual slavery is dumb as hell. 😂
Small acts of and statements expressing compassion, empathy, and concern from a man should not feel validating but in fact it fills me with gratitude to hear your heart going out to women, because like many Muslim women I was raised with very little acknowledgement of our basic rights and problems and thus have low standards that can be exceeded with even an infinitesimal show of humanity. Nonetheless, I want to say thank you for taking the time to comment on Dr Shabbirs breakdown of womens rights. I watched this show thinking it illuminated a lot of the issues in Islam but as you have shown, very little commentary is actually an expansion of Islamic teachings and principles and largely generalizations about solutions for current problems.
I don’t understand why the Muslim always talk about the bible instead of the quran
Literally though! It’s like we are constantly thrown off truly criticism of Quran.
It is an escape boat that is reason to justify their coran!
Ask David Wood why as s Christian apologist he rarely ever speaks about the Bible or Christianity, but instead is hyper-focused on the Quran and Islam.
Zakir naik
@@Envi-jm8miWhat? He talks about Christianity all the time. It’s just that most of his live streams are about Islam. His other videos are commonly about Christianity. There are also a LOT of other Christian apologists and teachers that focus on Christianity and the Bible. Christians don’t have to be ashamed of our scriptures because they’re actually good and right. 😊
I felt very sorry for Shabir because when it comes logic, Islam is indefensible
Leaving Islam is the greatest and hardest decision I have ever made
@@Nomad_786 Because Islam doesn’t make sense
@@Nomad_786 Yeah, disconnection from friends and family
@@Nomad_786 Thank you, in fact all my siblings have left the faith now., only my father still practises Islam ☪️.
@@John-lf3xf , your example with point number 2 is not a really good one to be honest. For someone who claims to have studied logic, any basic student would point out that you've conveniently used a false or vague premise to get to an unsound conclusion.
The conclusions that are implied by a set of premises is on the *assumption* that they are true. But then in logic, you still need to justify those assumptions. You can't just have any premise if it is not sound. You keep doing this until you reach the axioms (i.e. a set of unprovable elementary statements which are assumed and justified).
The reason why Islam is criticised in terms of logic is because even its own premises don't lead to it's logical conclusions. It falls flat by its own standards that it puts on itself.
Another amazing video ! It’s amazing the diversionary tactics used to get around answering a simple questions
JUST LIKE. ALI DAHWA. DOES ,S . & All Abdools ,
This is exactly how my ex treated me. I wasn't allowed to go out of the house without his permission.
I'm very happy that you said he's an ex.
This was a very informative albeit in many aspects frustrating and infuriating dissection of Islamic apologetics. However, as an exmuslim woman who has female family members effected by many of the issues being discussed here, listening to SAli down play the sexual abuse of enslaved women and defend marital rape and domestic abuse of Muslim made me lose the will to live.
The spectrum of consent is very important in the part about her having to marry and have sex with another man before getting back with her ex. Just because she may be willingly doing it doesn't mean she wants to. We use the spectrum of consent a lot in SW activism as SWers for what consent really is. It's not just as simple as saying yes or no.
If you're starving and need to pay rent and have no other option, then "no" isn't exactly consent. SW isn't work. It's a form of slavery.
Aladdin, I have so much respect for you. It is exhausting to keep hearing this from men that if that somehow women having autonomy is worse because of "sexual promiscuity" than complete subjugation of women in Islamic societies. Giving each human being autonomy is much more important than this fear of Zinna these people have been brainwashed with.
1:46:20. Exactly. Just bc there's a verse that told u to don't do bad things doesn't mean it would made the other verses that has contrast meaning just disappear. Instead, it just shows that there is contradiction in that book
After this video I am left dissappointed snd a bit ashamed as a part of humanity. I dont know how any decent human being is fine with this.
Thank you so much dude you’re amazing with words and damn smart ❤️
Finally finished watching the whole video, didn't get to sit for the whole live stream. Great analysis Aladdin! Your counter introspection was very well put. It's sad how much leeway there is for unfair abusive circumstances for women. I'm hoping the PR peddling moderate speakers like Shabir and his listeners (and especially the woman host) catch up to these questions and introspect themsleves and the scriptures, deflection doesn't work, it's high time.
how is this lady sitting with a straight face
Journalist neutrality or something I assume
A perfect demonstration of how indoctrination stunts the brains of its victims. That and how deceptive most of Islam's pr people are!
🤬
Master , Slave girls have to give themselves to the master , master’s right !
😮
What century is this ?
If you listen to the UA-cam items of extremists this is what they plan to do to all those who do not follow their version of Islam. So not only are other religions viewed as slaves but they include Muslims as slaves too.
Again, loved the video, keep it up Aladdin! On a slightly different note, I think it'd be really interesting to see your take on Khaled Abou El Fadl - not really an apologist/dawah person and not nearly as popular as these but has a pretty active youtube presence, a solid background in both traditional islamic scholarship and western academia, and appears to engage seriously with such topics
@@batman-sr2px I'm not entirely sure what your point is...
How are their respective 'liberal' positions relevant to my comment? Is any Muslim public speaker who comments on controversial issues associated with Islam considered an apologist, or just the ones with a liberal/modernist bent?
Re: Ex-Muslims and liberalism - I'm not an Ex-Muslim but, in a general sense, you might even have a point here, and this is an 'issue' how?
@@batman-sr2px Liberalism gives you a choice to choose, you know the free will yall theists try to boast about. Liberalism allows you to pray to whatever God you want and do whatever you want as long as if doesn't harm anyone else. If you feel it's wrong to let people to live how they please without harming anyone, but instead be a slave to an old ideology that we can't ever 100% is real, you all are the problem, as always to any progress in human history, let it be gender equality, ending slavery or ending racism.
@@misabel8719 pmlo you. H
How far can delusion go?
They say men and women arent equal - the man is superior - but they are equal in faith.
Go figure what that means.....
well to be fair they don’t “say” he is superior- its just the responsibility of providing n protecting that gives him leadership role (also because he is physically n emotionally stronger). faith remains the same or value given to their actions. however some do believe women are inferior in faith actually (for no fault of her own- my words)
@@hashh2019 Actually, men have more testosterone, which give them more higher rates of emotional rollercoster. Because of that hormonal trait, men tend to have more violent inclinations, they tend to react more impulsively (we can see that by comparing men and women regarding violent crimes: murder, rape, assault, etc. etc. pedophilia, men are at the top!!!). Men are more instictive (animalistically) then women. Women have more EQ then men, and women can be more resilient (pain, emocionally, etc.). And regardin IQ: there's no difference between genders.
Men are emotionally stronger?!!!!!!
For a good person to do evil things, it takes religion.
Well said
REALLY APPRECIATE THIS AA!
An Islamic scholar does not tell truth but protects Islam from the truth.
RD
@@John-lf3xf
Islam has a very serious problem; the problem is “SCHOLARS.”
After Mo’s demise, the Islamic scholars had to sell Islam to the new generations; the thought of their prophet being very unsavoury was not a good selling point. Hence Mo needed some good public relations.
Mo had already set the stage for this; his Koran is salted with constant references to his excellent moral character. One of the verses recited in the five daily prayers extols Mo’s excellence.
The scholars simply built on these so-called good points and embellished them until Mo was perfect, the best man to have ever lived.
With the 1000s of scholars working tirelessly for centuries compounding deception upon deception, we now have a religion that firmly floats on a rafter of deception.
They cherry-picked only the ahadith that say positive things.
Now that we have access to the ahadith, we see the true Mo; this has sent their scholars into a frenzy of covering up, twisting, and bending the truth and sadly, the average Muslim is deceived. The blind fanaticism of Islam continues.
Mo’s vices are hidden that deep in the deceit of Islam that they no longer exist.
The problem these modern scholars have is that they rely 100% on what former scholars have fabricated, they never think to go back to the authentic sources and do a critical deep dive.
Hence Islam is left with the blind leading the blind.
rd
True
TRUE
This is so on point 😊
49:00 this is an issue with all religions. Their isn't a rigorous methodology where you can update the content. In catholicism there are papal bull's but the underlying problems still exist.
Anyways, you really started me thinking, which I truly appreciate.
I think the main problem is that many known religious belief systems is bound by very rigid rules written long ago within different cultures.
Many religions started out as small movements with stories told orally together with rituals, traditions and art pieces before the stories were written down. As of today we might not know how these beliefs were exactly followed or how much these stories may have changed throughout the years. The only thing we know for certain is that there are historical traces alongside written records with some contexts. Unfortunately some ancient and harmful laws survive and thrive in certain communities when people in power keep them in practise.
Other harmful aspects of some religious beliefs is the constant battle of what belief system is "the right one" and what kind of rituals are needed to participate in worship. These things creates more infighting and a thought pattern of "us vs them."
Organized religion to me sounds as if it can stifle individual thinking and bring more fear. But if all religious movements where less about following harmful teachings and more about positive and respectful messages things might be more harmonious.
I watched a documentary about men who sell services to women of marry them sleep with them and divorce them, but sometimes they refuse to divorce at the end and then the woman is trapped with another guy.
I wonder what shabir Ally would say if men took his daughters as s-e-x slaves? Would he agree with it?
Possibly he's so alienated from them, or from any female human being, that he'd agree, in the name of religion's sacred rules.....
And this woman takes this without flinching ???? She is still in this religion after this? Slaves are mentioned as though this was just natural.
Islam starts wars just for the purpose of acquiring slaves. You should read books by Bill Warner and Robert Spencer on the history of Islamic conquest. Or check out Apostate Prophet's video on the Spread of Islam.
@@oishikhasan8500 I agree with you. Islam is a totalitarian imperialistic regime trying to take over the world. There are many books written by tenured professors and peer-reviewed by universities, that uphold your assertion.
@@oishikhasan8500 The PR reason for starting wars is "Spreading religion, self-defense, stopping the bad ka ffirs" to make them feel good about having a larger-than-life purpose, while the real behind the scenes reason is to raid goods/resources (including resources such as slave labour-səxual and physical) and eradicate enemies that would fight for ownership of those resources.
@@John-lf3xf there is no "Good" way to treat a slave i don't care how well islam says to treat them. The mere fact it allows humans to own other humans as property is disgusting in and of itself
Shabir Ally had some role models, I assume, when he grew up... It's a pity he (apparently) had pretty weird role models back in the days. Otherwise he'd have looked at his sister - and said to himself:
"I am a human, and so is she."
Him never having been introduced to such common sense must have lead to him to all these absurdities, such as seeing women as property, even in the 21th century... So sad.
You're doing a really good job. Keep it up.
Great stuff. Keep up with it 💯
It’s shocking to me that the horrors Kayla Mueller had to endure are defended by this disgusting man.
Rape is haram, but you also have no choice unless you want to be 'replaced'.
A 9 year old girl IS NOT A WOMAN! Can 9 year old boys get married? Are they men at that age, like "women"? Why did noone ask that question? Can two 9 year olds get married?
Excellent quality content as usual, AA! Good health and much joy to you and your loved ones! ❤❤❤
Thank you for speaking on this ❤ Abrahamic religions make it extremely easy to excuse (or advocate for) abuse. I grew up in messianic judaism (a religion that fuses together both judaism and christianity), and I was constantly confused about how a loving god could allow (+encourage) slavery/rape/physical violence. People want to gloss over those details because "it was a different time back then" or "the text is distorted from so many translations".
If the Torah/Quran/Bible are directly from God, why would God allow for so much miscommunication?
Thank you again!! What you're doing is so important.
Show me where Torah and Bible verses where they encourage violence against women or say that women have half of the men's brain.
Show me verses.i want to see
Why was the hijabi girl who is asking questions very chill about this?
She understands that this version of Islam is what was needed and practiced in past centuries time. That’s how she dissociates from it. She see’s it as a past practice, not applicable to modern times. But like the word of Allah is for all times
@@sistaex7624 so i guess the past slavery and rape was cool and okay for that time. Totally chill for a prophet to rape for that time
She has a privilege to ask these questions in a country where she is given freedom and right. She would be singing a very different tone in iran or afghanistan.
chatGPT: To provide a thorough understanding of Muhammad Shahrour’s explanation of “mulk al-yameen” (مِلْكُ الْيَمِينِ) in the Quran, I will summarize his views based on his Arabic works, particularly “Al-Kitab wa Al-Qur’an: Qira’a Mu’asira” (The Book and the Qur’an: A Contemporary Reading) and other writings. Shahrour’s interpretation is rooted in his broader framework of reinterpreting Islamic texts through a linguistic, historical, and modernist lens.
Shahrour’s Explanation of “Mulk al-Yameen”:
1. Literal Meaning and Context:
• Shahrour highlights that the term “mulk al-yameen” linguistically means “ownership by right hand” or “possession under one’s authority.” However, he argues that its Quranic usage reflects social and legal relationships rather than literal ownership or slavery.
2. Critique of Traditional Interpretations:
• Traditional Islamic scholars often interpreted “mulk al-yameen” as referring to enslaved individuals, especially women captured during war, who could be kept as concubines. Shahrour strongly critiques this understanding, seeing it as tied to historical socio-political contexts rather than a timeless divine command.
• He stresses that Islam’s aim is to progressively abolish slavery, and the Quran’s references to “mulk al-yameen” reflect transitional laws addressing pre-existing practices in 7th-century Arabia.
3. Modern Reinterpretation:
• According to Shahrour, “mulk al-yameen” in the Quran refers to lawful and consensual relationships outside the framework of formal marriage. He views it as an acknowledgment of relationships where mutual agreement and commitment exist, even if they do not align with traditional marital contracts.
• For example, he links “mulk al-yameen” to alternative forms of partnership that respect individual autonomy and societal norms, offering flexibility in human relationships.
4. Focus on Ethical Principles:
• Shahrour emphasizes that the Quran’s teachings prioritize justice, mutual consent, and human dignity. In his view, interpreting “mulk al-yameen” as concubinage or ownership contradicts the Quranic ethos of liberation and equality.
5. Key Verses Discussed:
• Shahrour analyzes verses like Surah An-Nisa (4:24) and Surah Al-Mu’minun (23:5-6), where “mulk al-yameen” is mentioned. He argues that these verses highlight permissible sexual relations based on mutual agreement and ethical responsibility, whether within marriage or alternative arrangements.
Key Arabic Excerpts from Shahrour’s Work:
In “Al-Kitab wa Al-Qur’an”, Shahrour writes:
“إن مفهوم ملك اليمين لا يعني امتلاك إنسان لإنسان، بل يشير إلى نوع من العلاقات التي كانت موجودة في المجتمع، حيث يعطي القرآن إطارًا أخلاقيًا وقانونيًا لهذه العلاقات.”
(“The concept of mulk al-yameen does not mean the ownership of one human by another. Rather, it refers to a type of relationship that existed in society, where the Quran provides an ethical and legal framework for these relationships.”)
He also states:
“الهدف من النص القرآني هو تحرير الإنسان تدريجيًا من العبودية، وتوجيه المجتمع نحو المساواة والعدالة.”
(“The goal of the Quranic text is to gradually liberate humanity from slavery and guide society toward equality and justice.”)
Summary of Shahrour’s Approach:
• Shahrour reinterprets “mulk al-yameen” as a historically contextual term that aligns with Islam’s trajectory toward abolishing slavery.
• He views it as a framework for ethical relationships outside traditional marriage, focusing on consent, responsibility, and societal well-being.
• His interpretation challenges classical readings that tie the term exclusively to slavery or concubinage, advocating for a modern understanding rooted in universal Quranic principles.
That does make sense but is still don’t understand what the other form of marriage or relation is aside from marriage
@ Aside marriage you can have a contractual agreement to live together or just verbally agree to be with each other on the terms you both have set? That’s the mulk-al-yameen.
the video title for the ex muslims channel is absolutely brutal, & it just goes to show that in certain situations putting things imams and scholars say down to their simplest meanings can really help you get over the amount of beating around the bush they do to try and justify messed up verses and hadith
Great livestream. Thanks 😊
The excuse is that it was part of that time(christians do the same) but this is supposed to be the all loving god's book. Muslims take this book as the truth and cannot be changed.
Literally shabir: Yes Islam allows all these horrible things, but that is for the people of the past. We have new problems that need to extrapolate the meaning and wisdom from the Quran and apply to today’s time using human interpretation. So basically create a whole new islam.
The Quran and Allah like: uhh… did he not get the memo?
1:37:26
He can't define his own Islam. I'm sure he would lose his place among the shiekhs he's associated with. Plus, he can't define it because he doesn't seem to have it in the first place.
فاقد الشي لا يعطيه.
You can't give what you don't have in the first place.
it still blows my mind thinking people actually believe in islam
It s interesting how they decided to abandon politeism and idols, but not child marriages or slavery!
Talking and endorsing slavery and raping thev slaves in 2022... is disgusting, of course it has always been disgusting, but now in the age of enlightenment it is very, very much more disgusting to say that... Shame on you Shabir Ally. I think Muslims have been frozen in time for 1400 years now!
Wowww I've seen so many Muslims say child marriage is a cultural thing not a Islamic thing. lots of big Muslim UA-camrs. And they say "forced marriage" isn't allowed but "arranged marriage" is. I really somehow as a leftist person was seriously considering looking into following Islam at one point bc of some of these spiritual feminist Muslims you see now on the internet and you really show how they just have their own versions of religion. Which isn't a bad thing. But don't pretend harm isn't being done in the name of that religion and don't pretend your way is the only way that's actually right and your religion doesn't cause any harm.
You are so smart. I used to watch Ninja Mommy and Medina TV and think Islam was better then Christianity, as someone who hasn't been exposed deeply to many Muslim people, and I'm glad that I have realized that Muslim people are often very good people, but I'm also glad I've realized Islam is another organized religion that is extremely toxic and violent if it is taken literally. You are so smart and I could listen to you talk about anything tbh. I wish there was someone who made videos like yours but dissecting Christianity bc my father is a born again Christian and I'm a queer woman who struggles w mental illness and he believes extreme things like even that if I prayed enough I wouldn't have mental illness and that teaching my son being gay is okay is "indoctrination". And he is so misguided about Christianity and thinks it's so peaceful , I need to become more educated so I can better refute it. I'd like to not even talk about it with him but he always brings it up even though I ask him not to and ask him to respect my sexuality and spiritual beliefs. Unfortunately he's really the only family I have. My mom died. I don't want to lose my relationship with one of my only family members and I do love him. But I can't just let him keep trying to push his religion on me and my child when we are around him.
Also one time he told me the saddest thing. His ex wife who was his only wife he ever really loved. He said he never loved my mother even though they never got divorced I guess it's because he believed divorce was wrong so they just didn't live together except when she had cancer he did get rent a house for us and take care of her until she died. But anyway this one ex wife is married and her husband verbally abuses her constantly and she is miserable and doesn't love him but my dad even agreed that she has to stay with him unless he cheats on her bc of God and that's the only circumstance God allows divorce. I feel so bad for that woman that she stays in abusive marriage because she believes that God wants her too. My dad says "well people should be more careful who they marry" easy for you to say being married three times... And if God really wanted that then f*ck him lol. But I don't believe a higher power would ever want that as a wiccan.
1:53:45
Never heard of this. A Man divorces his wife, then wants her back and she has to sleep with another guy before she can go back?
Did i understand that right?
Not just sleep with a random guy but go on and have a genuine marriage with someone else. In the case where that marriage ends in divorce or death, then she can get back with a man she is irrevocably divorced from.
Yes this is right in Islam
Attack on Yazidis was not a (war), Yazidis did not fight back, Yazidis were attacked only because they were not Muslims (just like the attack on Beni Quraithas)!
Any atheist can make a moral plan and yes you can judge the past morally. We have to judge the past morally so you know not to repeat it. Why are you defending this he said it’s allowed for men to have slaves. That means if a war breaks out these monsters acting as humans will do that to women. It’s sick and may god have mercy on these sick peoples who these ideas came from. We as humans were not put on earth to be tortured in such a sick way. Your prophet did this stuff and you know it
I want to request a dissecting video about Andalusia Project. Specially the ones where this guy defends sharia law
I loved this livestream
Great channel, Thank you.
Commendable work 👍👍👍👍👍
Keep on moving forward,,, we’re Proud of You,,,👏👏🌷🌷🙏🙏
👏😐
Wow. It's difficult to watch Shabir try to justify concubine/slavery in Islam
@@batman-sr2px Any atheist can make a moral plan and yes you can judge the past morally. We have to judge the past morally so you know not to repeat it. Why are you defending this he said it’s allowed for men to have slaves. That means if a war breaks out these monsters acting as humans will do that to women. It’s sick and may god have mercy on these sick peoples who these ideas came from. We as humans were not put on earth to be tortured in such a sick way. Your prophet did this stuff and you know it
3:00:26 It's really bizarre that you have to go through all this bullshit but can't simply get a divorce because you want to.
If anyone claims to be a Muslim feminist, a flying slipper will be coming their way
Very interesting discussion
Excited for the video with noodle :)
”Let the quran speak” as a channel keeps up this same energy in almost all the videos that they post with Shabir Ally, they are somehow more honest and ”good willed” than most of the dawah scene while still not really answering the questions at hand... but for the believer audience they are good at putting their questions at rest by distracting the listener with many opposing views and minor details. By the end of the video there isnt anything firm to go by unless its a really easy topic, it just leaves a listener with the feeling that the problem at hand isnt a problem at all for islam, even when you dont really understand why.
شكرا على الفيديو و اللايف. بس الاحسن لو كان للى فى الشرق الاوسط
I don't think most of the middle east is open minded enough to set through the whole video without reporting it or just spam angry comments
It's good for the whole world to see this. Islam is evil
Do you have a patreon, I'd like to support you
If Daniel is more hateful & more 'by the book' then those are all the more reasons for you to dissect his arguments primarily over other dawahgandists. The mainstream don't take shabbir's pr campaigns seriously because he has diluted many things beyond recognition. Shabbir campaigns for a harmless docile version of Islam whereas Daniel campaigns for a dominating harmful pure Islam. Therefore daniel & his arguments need to be confronted more than anybody else's esp after that harris sultan debacle.
At the end of the day islam, by mahamed's examples, will take over :
Stoned women for adultery.
(Muslim 4206)
"I have been commanded to fight
against people till they testify that there
is no god but Allah, and that Muhammad
is the messenger of Allah"
(Muslim 1:33)
Permitted stealing from unbelievers.
(Bukhari 44:668, Ibn Ishaq 764)
Permitted lying.
(Sahih Muslim 6303, Bukhari 49:857)
Owned and traded slaves.
(Sahih Muslim 3901)
Beheaded 800 Jewish men and boys.
(Abu Dawud 4390)
Murdered those who insulted him.
(Bukhari 56:369, 4:241)
"If then anyone transgresses
the prohibition against you,
Transgress ye likewise against him"
(Quran 2:194)
Jihad in the way of Allah elevates one's position in Paradise by a hundred fold.
(Muslim 4645)
Married 13 wives and kept sex slaves.
(Bukhari 5:268, Quran 33:50)
Slept with a 9-year-old child.
(Sahih Muslim 3309, Bukhari 58:236)
Ordered the murder of women.
(Ibn Ishaq 819, 995)
"O you who believe! Fight those of the
unbelievers who are near to you
and let them find in you hardness."
(Quran 9:123)
Ordered 65 military campaigns
and raids in his last 10 years.
(Ibn Ishaq )
Killed captives taken in battle.
(Ibn Ishaq 451)
Encouraged his men to rape enslaved women.
(Abu Dawood 2150, Quran 4:24)
Demanded captured slaves and
a fifth of all other loot taken in war.
(Quran 8:41)
Was never tortured, but tortured others.
(Muslim 4131, Ibn Ishaq 436, 595, 734, 764)
"And fight them until there is no more persecution and religion is only for Allah"
(Quran 8:39)
Blessed the brutal murder of a half-blind man
(al-Tabari 1440)
Ordered a slave to build the very pulpit
from which he preached Islam.
(Bukhari 47:743)
What are the Greatest Commandments?
"Belief in Allah and Jihad in His cause"
(Muslim 1:149)
Demanded the protection of armed bodyguards, even in a house of worship
(Quran 4:102)
Died fat and wealthy from what was
taken from others in war or
demanded from others in tribute.
Advocated crucifying others.
(Quran 5:33, Muslim 16:4131)
According to his followers:
Had others give their lives for him.
(Sahih Muslim 4413)
Mufti Menk next he is very popular.
Interesting dude, and I don’t mean that in a positive way. People like him are socially aware that there are things you cant just outright say in some places. His beliefs seem to lay within what he doesn’t say rather than what he says, as he beats around the push carefully picking his words.
Anyways, great video as always man! There is a guy u might find interesting, he is highly controversial. His name is Adnan Ibrahim. I used to watch this dude a lot when i was doubtful and transitioning to a Quaranist as a teen. I got introduced to* the theory of evolution through his videos and he made me correct my misconceptions and believe in it. At that time, I thought he was quite different from all other muslim scholars.
Poor girl, she is sitting there and insulting herself.
As a woman I wonder if you can understand why she is doing this.
@@stefonpalinic5559 Brainwash to the fullest extend! I know a girl that she’s a muslim very sweet but whenever I bring her the CLEAR errors in the quran and how the quran can’t be a book from the GOD of Abraham she tries to change the topic!!
@@culizocolonense Well in that case you have to understand she is not trying to hear you out . Unfortunately alot of people do that on many topics.
It's humiliating how women are treated.
Shabir Ally is one of the nicer Islamic apologists.
Did that man made a talk on lgbt+ people ? If so could you react to it ? Cause I would love to see how he justify the treatment of queer people compared to the “old times” especially when if women they are a little obligated to do with them socially, because they have a value to men, it’s not the case for queer people and they are even seen as a danger to society or a non existing part of society all together. And this is a subject where the three religions of the book are pretty hardcore on their views and what to do to queer people especially in the more fundamentalist groups.
The issue here is why did Abraham have a concubine? Abraham had a concubine base on his fear his wife Sara was too old to bear a child, and this wasnt a divine permission by God. Even Abraham was unwilling to have a concubine but he was persuaded by sara his wife.
Abraham and Sara have the same father different mother....so technically they were brother and sister from their father so Isaac have one granddad....keep the blood patrial lineage in the family for the choosen people.
There is no evidence that these characters actually existed. Some (many? most?) non-religious biblical scholars feel Abraham may have represented someone real but the stories are just made up to serve a narrative.
@@dorarie3167 Abraham's grave is near Jerusalem and Sara too. Science can analyze the remains to see if all this biblical narrations are true or just someone's/group imagination so that humanity can be herded like sheep. Religions are design by man for mind control and it began during the early Bronze age when agricultural just started.
@@blossom11114 Again, that is a claim. Until such time as we have stronger or conclusive evidence of Abraham’s existence, we cannot treat it as fact. As well, even supposing that it is shown that Abraham existed, there then has to be evidence presented that the events he is associated with - the sacrifice of Isaac, Ishmael’s birth, etc - are true. THAT is an even bigger stretch.
I've always found him to be somewhat tolerable also... but still, the religion is NOT tolerable.
1:26:55 So from my understanding of Islam, sharia is the highest authority within Muslim countries, while the law of a non-Muslim country has higher authority, then one should take it through Sharia first and then use the highest authority ruling and it should be accepted and tolerated, especially since sharia law has already been tested out, or rather sharia court. I don't comprehend why people should be ostracised because of something like that.
Mufti mink, mufti Abu layth and Dr AC brown please
I wish he lied a little bit just to make himself seem better but he told the truth and I can give him credit for that
❤️Apostate Aladdin ❤️ Love from Iran ❤️
Hey I like the picture in your profile, Reza Shah Bozorg...
I sleep to Aladdin’s voice. It’s like AMSR heaven.
37:20 ever heard of committed Christians like William Wilberforce who campaigned for decades against slavery
17:52 maybe woman in the Islamic context of polygamy are actually pissed off and are withholding sex for good reasons ie. their husbands having sex with other woman(other wives and concubines etc)
Yeah think about infections/diseases. The chances of catching sex diseases increase the more the man increases partners, doesn't matter if the other party is a virgin. Poor wife.
Great show
I love listening to your channel .but would appreciate .it if u cut out the swearing
Look up early civilizations in the Middle East and North Africa women had a lot of power.
Ancient Egyptian women had a lot of independence.
One of the biggest Muslim lies that I hate is that it’s just the way it was.
No it wasn’t.
Same with old viking society
Brilliant!
44:20 Why don't you ask the Sheikhs the questions instead of your audience?
I don't understand the argument about the the bad situation of women before the time of Islam which Islam was supposed to improve. Why there were the six centuries of christianity going on at the time. There were plenty of arabic Christians at that time. Why couldn't the Arabs learn from their Christian brothers? Why should they invent a new religion islam, which was brutal and barbaric.
We have the perfect divine system that doesn't encompass everything, not even the essentiels like marital rape and other forms of abuse, where men have the upper hand in everything, and it still needs tweeking.
Mashallah those are the signs that it's from allah the all powerful the all merciful and the all knowing.
An omni god that decreed all this shit while knowing it will turn out this way and would be harmful. I'm beyond shocked.
Just another idea for dissecting another apologist: Javad Hashmi
We had some twitter threads. He gets extremely evasive and then ignores me, and eventually blocked me months before i deactivated twitter
I think his content is a waste of time to dissect
48:10
We don't have evidence of women treated harshly in pre-islamic age. But we have Khadiga, Muhammad's first wife. She was such an influencer and public figure in Qurish to the point where Muhammad benefited from her and nobody could say anything to his nonsensical new religion. Now how many historical Khadiga can you find after Islam, None.
Great video! I didn't know Shabir was such a snake... oh, one thing, I think you mentioned you would talk about how a wife and a slave in Islam didn't have much difference. I was waiting for that part, but I don't think you got to it?
But the book is for all places and times.
Javed ghamdi and Dr brown pleasei next please.
@dravonishere curious what you think about this gentleman
They take the money and gold jewellery of the wife by emotionally blackmailing the wife, They create a situation were they need the money and sell the gold if you don't agree your a bad wife who values money more then your husband.
Regarding Christianity, I have two responses to his & your comments. There was sexual slavery in the Bible, but it was never sanctioned. Abraham took Hagar because Sara insisted on it and they lacked faith. God intended Sarah to be the mother. Furthermore, just because Jacob had sex slaves, does not mean that that was OK. Also, you discussed creationism in several religions. If you look at early sermons by Crhysostome, he discusses that the creation texts were not meant to be taken exactly as they were said. He discusses how they symbolized various things. That God did create the world, but using His hands to form man from the dirt was a way to show that he was intimately involved. Chrysostome was from a few centuries after Christ. The Bible was a condescension. We cannot comprehend how God does things. When God communicates with us through scripture, it is in the way that we tell things to toddlers. We cannot possibly comprehend God, so He dumbed it down for us in a way that we can somewhat comprehend.
This video is triggering on so many levels. Those are all the phrases I had to hear and were used as justification.
2:00:52 Funny how God never said he hates slavery!
الحج متولي gang 🤣🤣🤣 no wonder marriage always felt like a prison sentence.
For those who are not Chrsitians..to give perspective on how we view the Bible and our fathers of the faith (Abraham)
1. The old testiment is the story of the coming of Jesus. We don't believe Abraham or Noah were without sin. They made mistake like the sin Abraham committed of having a child with Hagar.
2. Slavery in today's context did not exist when Abraham was alive for Hebrew people.
3. We don't believe God spoke every word in the Bible. We believe his words are written in the text along with stories written by humans but inspired by Holy Spirit.
but jacob did have multiple wives n a prophet from the younger later wife making polygamy legal in the OT- wasn’t a sin