Honda Odyssey Misfire! (Part 1 -Diagnosis)
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- Опубліковано 2 тра 2019
- Hey it's another HONDA!
This 2003 Odyssey is running on 5 out of 6 cylinders. The owner already threw plugs and coils at it, to no avail.
Let's dive in and figure out what's wrong with this Honda!
LaunchX431 Diagun IV: bit.ly/2GvxGlM
Launch Product catalog: bit.ly/2Dm1gYG
Enjoy!
Ivan - Авто та транспорт
You helped me big time get to the bottom of my Odyssey problems, THANK YOU VERY MUCH! It was a series of issues, including broken motor mounts, dirty throttle body and a serious cleaning of the intake manifold caked in years of crud.....but the ignition coil and injector diagnosis in Parts 1 & 2 that you put out made the whole vehicle servicing complete!!! Awesome job, I like your style of repair work....cheers and I will be a loyal follower!!!!
Ivan, Great video. Seeing as I have a 07 Honda Odyssey I found this video to be excellent. Like the old school way of testing. Also enjoyed seeing what my launch will not do. Between yourself, Keith Eric O and Paul and his book and classes you guys are the best and im just not saying that you really are. Thanks much ❤️️ Hope you show part 2
Gotta love the way you thought this one through, very much like Paul, the way you consider various options. While watching i try to pause and think it through myself, then resume.
That's awesome! Yes the thought process is always key; worth to pause and step back, make a hypothesis and experiment, and only then conduct the experiment and analyze the results :)
Ivan to make the diagnose of the injector with the scope even more complete, you should do a 2 channel measurement. On channel 2 you can measure the current with a amp clamp. Compere that to a good injector and you will also see a difference in the current.
I just went through this on my son's 2000 Silverado. Cyl. #7 misfire. Coil / wire showed good (swapped with #5 coil). Had power to injector and you could hear injector pulse through the old screwdriver trick. I figured possible slight clog. Pulled injector and it was gunked up pretty bad. Replaced with new one. Works great!
Thanks, Ivan for helping me be a bit of a "parts sniper" instead of throwing everything at it and hoping I fix it.
You’re the absolute best, Ivan!
Been looking forward to a misfire series
Great diagnosis Ivan. I enjoy watching your videos and learning.
A vacuum leak will cause a dead cylinder if it is large enough and/or on the intake to one cylinder vacuum leaks can also cause burnt valves, vacuum leaks can also cause multiple cylinder misfires, you won't always pick up listening for a cylinder that is low on compression caused by a burnt valve (a comp or relative comp test would be much more accurate). I wouldn't have bothered looking at fuel trims until the vacuum leak was fixed as the readings would be already skewed to the positive. Just some thoughts that would be in my mind during a diagnosis on this case. Good use of a scope on this, Ivan, you didn't have to plug in a fuel gauge or mess around with a balance test 👍, maybe using 2 channels and overlaying the injector pattern between the good and bad cylinder would be a better visualization? Thanks for the vid mate!
Honda J-35 .. with 150k plus miles .. w/o even watching the video .. adjust the exhaust valves .. they get tighter over time and get you misfires! .. AND ask them when they last changed the timing belt.
I just started having this problem intermittently, she ticked over 290k about a week ago, and the engine has never been opened. At this point I'd be scared to bother her with a valve job.
I have an 02 Accord, a few years ago the key was sticking, not turning, sprayed some powdered graphite on it, and have not had the problem since.
How awesome is that! The scope is the tool I've dreamt about for YEARS. I keep putting off the purchase, since I haven't had any drivability diags in here for a while. This year it WILL happen at some point, though.
Anyway, nice work Ivan! I was expecting valve problems on an Odyssey. 😉
Thank you Ivan. Good job. I appreciate your videos. Have a blessed and safe week.
Beautiful capture Ivan. Looking forward to the fix!
Ivan,
Great video and diag! Im always learning from you and love your thought process on these case studies - thank you. Looking forward to part 2 repair.
God bless
Paul
Woot, good catch with the scope, there!
Be cautious of vacuum leaks. It's always worthwhile to trace them back to where they meet the manifold, 'cause positioning can cause all sorts of strange misfire events.
I recently had a customer with a misfire on 1, 3, and 5. "Spark plugs had been changed at 90k" Vehicle has 125k. 1, 3, and 5 are under the intake manifold. HMM... Pull the manifold to look at the plugs, kudos to the shop that did them, they pulled the manifold AND replaced the gaskets to do the job right! Meanwhile, a grommet on the very back of the manifold had been compromised, and it lived right next to the variable intake flapper. Manually actuating the flapper made the misfire go away, and fuel trims adjusted to both banks, instead of bank one.
Obviously not the issue with this van, but interesting enough to be worth noting! :)
Nice diag!
I always have a letdown when I see “part 1”. I am too anxious to see the fix.
As do I, grasshopper!!!
Hi Ivan, first of all greetings from Germany. I'm watching you quite a while as well as your buddies, Eric O. and DiagnoseDan. I got a 2002 Honda Odyssey, I bought it in Canada 20 years ago. I do all major work on it, valve adjustment, Timing belt and other stuff to it, because you have to when you own a Ody, because it was never available in whole europe officially. Because you got russian roots maybe you are not that afraid of, compare to some shops here in Germany. Most of them can't scan the Ody, Honda can but they mislead in the diagnose. My original profession is electrician so I can read electrical path/plans, I work on bikes and cars since I'm 15. Anyways, I decided to swap my Ody to LPG (still not afraid I guess), most of the shops I asked are afraid of LPG and have no knowledge about it. We run a Gas Station and with a LPG pump, so I started studying and researching asking customers about their experience of the LPG. And because my wife is spanish we travel several times per year to Spain, with LPG I just pay a third to a half of the fuel costs compare to Regular Gas. After the swap, the LPG Tank was still not installed, the Ody got a random misfire. I did as always all 3 to 4 years a major tune up, means valve adjustment and Intake and EGR passage cleaning, new plugs are in etc. The misfire starts with temperature from 65°C up, only when the car drives and mostly under 70% load, in neutral and park it's fine and over 70% load too. Because I am not well fitted with OBD Scanners I bought a cheap one from Autel the AP200 to check live data. I suspect one of the O2 sensors, but I really wanna learn here something, and not throwing parts at it. The upstream sensor I changed in the last years already a couple of times, maybe three times. Could it be the Upstream sensor again? I already changed the MAP sensor, after cleaning it won't work again, so I bought a Delphi from Rockauto. Since I'm in Germany, how about I upload a video from the screen of the Autel with the Live Data? You can look over it and confirm it or not. What I've learned from Diagnose Dan, the upstream sensor should detect the richer fuel when I spray break cleaner intot the manifold, but it won't and the angine stalls too not reving up like it used to. I have no clue this time, the O2 sensor is two years old. Thanks in advance so far, Carsten from Germany
When it was showing misfire across the board on all cylinders, was that because you pulled each coil feed to isolate which cylinder was misfiring?
Very often on Honda or Acura
Hello Hollow, great job, I have an 06 odyssey same problem, I will check my F-I, thank you for taking your time to make this video and explain it very well. have a great day
Put a can of injector cleaner in your tank
Did the engine actually have a vacuum leak while you were checking fuel trims? I have learned a lot from your video's and Eric O's, thanks.
You da man Ivan. Nice quick diagnosis. Don’t ya wish they all where like this one? On to the next one. Could it be as easy as this one was?
Outstanding tutorial on a well thought out diagnostic plan.
I believe you set the misfire codes when you unplugged all the coils 1 by 1. But the counter was of before also.👍
Great job Ivan, persistence (judging by daylight). Love the channel.
Refreshed my browser twice because I saw the rotating circle on his tablet tool. It's early. I haven't had my coffee.
Ivan, would an ultrosonic clean help that injector or do you think it's gone past that point?
The Valet Key! Good Job as always. Thank You
Ivan, maybe I am wrong, but a O2 Sensor detects the difference of inside oxygen to outside oxygen. If that cylinder isn't getting any fuel is wouldn't affect the 02 levels one way or the other, because it has the exact same amount of oxygen as the outside air.
They will need all 6 injectors or else they will be back with another misfire and please fix that vacuum leak and they need some new Orings in that power steering pump.
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics did that single injector really fixed the lean misfire ?
I'm curious as to why the fuel trims weren't affected as much as you'd normally see with a fuel delivery issue. Am I understanding it correctly that the injector was still delivering fuel, but the pintle was sticking so the fuel was late?
gr8 vid, my friend had a 2012 odyssey, they called me when they saw it was blinking checking engine light. I advised them to stop driving right away. they were near by and I when over and took my scanner. it was p0303. I advised her that driving it as it is could damage things. she had it towed to a local shop in which the found it was the coil, and proceeded to change all the coils, since it had about 110K miles I also told them to change the PCV. which should help engine oil consumption issue they were having. Basic rule of thumb change the PCV every 100K. my 2007 odyssey 220K changed the PCV valve and the oil consumption was reduced by at least 50% so now maybe 3/4 qt every 3k miles, rather than the nearly 3qts every 3k miles.
Thanks Ivan another great video.
What is your app that's your using for OBD diagnostics? And what adapter you're using?
Mohammed Hnoosh launch X431
my guess the screen is clogged no inline fuel filter on this model [original t belt i bet easy money] is the ck. engine flashing?
Nice to see some old school methods to be used at the start of the diag. Scope was needed to be sure.
excellent logic and TS steps. Thanks for sharing
Could it be that it needs a valve lash adjustment? The exhaust valve might be tightening up! Just my two cents based on the issues I've been experiencing with my 07 Odyssey Touring Ed with 150k mi.
Nice! I'll be diagnosing a hard miss today too! Bringing the scope, to hopefully pinpoint the culprit. The scope for the WIN, once again! Excellent Ivan! Part 2 soon. Injector install & verification. . 😁😁😁
Hi Cuba. Did you get my email
Good luck with your misfire diag, Cuba! Don't forget to bring your camera too and press RECORD :)))
@@jeremyanthony9300 yes Jeremy.. just haven't had the time to respond to emails. I apologize. It's been almost nonstop
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics heck yeah! Got some great pico scope captures too. Tried again today with the uScope, but darn coil didn't want to act up again. Job is all done now...
FYI you should wear rings while working on cars! can't wait for part2!
I do!
You da man!! I am having same issue on Honda Pilot! You saved me!! Good work dude!!
Awesome diag skills Ivan,thank u sir
Thanks George!
When you had the spark plug out, did you see fuel spraying out of the spark plug hole?
No lol
Hi I need help I got a 2010 Honda Odyssey and the code is popping up as po304 and I changed the spark plugs I checked the coils are brand new and I put in a fuel cleaner and every time I accelerate hard my car will start jerking and the code is still shown as po304 what is going on with my vehicle?? someone please help.
Ivan, did you see the video series Eric o did on a honda ridgeline ? This reminds me of that.
Thanks for your time never miss your videos the best on the web Bill N LI NY
Thanks for being here Bill!
Great fix sometimes it's just as easy to go old school. Use the computer on your shoulder. I'd love test your prototype pressure transducer.
What are your thoughts on that BAFX OBDII scanner dongle the owner left in the van?
Why not do a relative compression test? And see the waves if there's a loss of compression?
Hi Ivan your awesome.i have low compression all misfire codes with p1399 and p1456 I bought a replacement engine and the place lied it was a bad engine I found out it took late after warranty deadline.where do I start with fixing my engine.i replaced all spark plugs and valve seals that's where the problem started the seals blew on the highway.
Same problem with my odyssey, for some time it a winning noise that it was gradualy getting lapiden, then key wouldn’t turn so I replaced switch, one week later i have rough idle and strong bad gasoline smell.
Very nice diagnostic thinking way, and attacking strategy Ivan !!! thank you for sharing :)
Thanks Andreas!
What tool you use for check it Andy where you buy?pleased inform me..thanks
Wonder if you have one on a transaxle leak fix? thanks
Great diagnostic video . Thumbs up
What kind of reader are you using and where can I buy one I'm using a cheap $25 Walmart reader?
Will watch part 2.
When did you get a Dustbuster Olds van. Those are classics!
Locksmith opinion.
There is a design problem on Honda. As the keys wear, the thin tabs on the lock tumblers get bent and jam.
The fix is to find a good automotive locksmith. Step 1 is typically to cit a good key with good square edges.
Often, the locksmith can replace just the tumblers and clean and lubricate the lock.
Just spraying in some sort of lube does not address the problem so it is not going to be a good solution.
Yeah Ivan, I have the pro mini and its slow on Honda as well.
antic obd2 bus was slower communication speed.
Ivan, you sure that was not a Chevy? I mean with ignition key problems, ABS codes and an injector problem.
Wow, good work, man, respect
Hi Ivan, can you tell me are there any differences in the scope functionality between the original verus and the verus pro, from what I can see the scopes look the same, any software differences?
Nope scopes are identical.
Excellent work!
the launch I don't know today but the snappy hooked up was that a vac leak with the good trims it sounded like one and slap an o ring at that ps pump
might be sucking air inlet oring
Just curious how long that took you to diag and film. I know bringing us along adds time, but all I could notice was how much darker it was getting in each shot.
Will discuss in Part 2 👍
I did place my bet,but will wait for part2 for confirmation....
Too bad most of the injectors are buried on that engine, you could play swap around between two cylinders and see if the misfire moves. Next he will need valve adjustment. That's one thing I don't like about those engines is the adjustable rocker arms, Honda needs to get with the times, hydraulic lifters have been around for how many years now?
I use an old spark plug wire to create a cop adapter for my scope, watch secondary waveform and look for lean out.
Works great.
Is this Pine Hollow Auto Diagnostics or “Anytime, Anywhere Auto Diagnostics”?
Hey Ivan, I just keep thinking about what if Keith had this car!! W.W.K.D.
WHAT WOULD KEITH DO!!
Well, he would hook up an only 1 existing in the world, manufacturers computer scanner, and prove beyond a shadow of a doubt, that the guy on the injector assembly line, Charles Jackson, had greasy hamburgers for lunch, and when he came back, this was the first injector he made, and his greasy fingers caused him to slip and only wrap the injector core with one too little wire wraps, causing a breakdown in transference of electrical energy, which after 18 years and 154k miles made the injector slightly malfunction, but only enough to hear a misfire, but not enough for the ECM to detect! This causes the injector to draw 2.37152 amps, instead of the mandatory 2.375 amps, and therefore only inject enough fuel to make the spark plug smell like gas, but not enough to contribute to an even firing rotation of the crankshaft!
PLUS, he figured all of that out, without getting out in the rain!!!
The fix: replace the faulty injector with one that does the correct job, and make Charles Jackson wash his hands, before returning to work on the fuel injector assembly line!! ESPECIALLY, if he has greasy hamburgers for lunch!!
I can't wait for part two, to see if my deductions were close!!
Haha that's quite the hypothesis!
Sorry, it was the best I could do. I was eating lunch! Lol
🤣😂👍
Подскажи , а второй датчик кислородный отключить можно этой приблудой . И егр отключить .???
Yvan, if you check out the 2nd test (injector waveform) of my DIY stethoscope GADGETS#51 video, you'll find that it ties in very well with this situation...
Great Diags. I can't wait for the replacement.
Great video, thx for sharing.
Me gusta mucho tus videos, Hello from Spain
A scope is worth learning I’m just starting my journey with a uscope
thanks for the scanner usage.,was debating buying one but now not so sure how useful it will be.
Scanner was just fine! It's Honda that was slow to catch an obvious misfire :)
I was thinking maybe it was the scanner ,have you tryed the snap on in comparison?
Honda Odyssey misfire! (Part 3 - Transmission)
lol!
You could have used mode 6 in obd generic mode it has PIDS FOR misfire counter
Cracking diagnostic ivan :-D.
The question is, could injector cleaner fix the problem or is it a stripdown to get to the little sods lol :-D
Injector cleaner might do something, unlikely however. Those gasoline injectors can't really be opened nowadays, at least the ones I've looked at look like they've been coated in some kind of plastic to prevent you from reaching the internals. Could be wrong, I absolutely hate petrol engines.
Owner already tried that haha
I wanna see secondary!
Hi Ivan, I have a Diagnostic question. How do I go about diagnosing a 2001 Ford Taurus that the Engine starts to break up at around 3800, no codes I have the Launch Pro Mini.
It's probably your cam sensor drive assembly. Replace the whole assembly.
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics
I wonder if it is the Harmonic balancer. I did a timing cover replacement. maybe its not on all the way. I did have a problem with belt noise???
Nice... I've never seen a faulty injector on a Honda. I wonder if it got some bad fuel?
No, they got some bad air from Eric O. At SMA.....
or dirty fuel caused a bad spray pattern after 150Kmiles.
The injector coil is not bad or the wave shape would be different in voltage hight... need good cleaning teckron additives...
Please correct if I'm wrong but on the cylinder drop test aren't you supposed to use a test light to direct the current to ground? Or is this not enough time open to hurt them?
No spark when I unplugged the coil :) On regular plug wires yes.
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics Thankyou!
Nice scenery! Where's it that?
You unplugged every coil one by one and then said Honda's computer detected a misfire in every cylinder. Well what did you expect?
74 comments in the comment section, just to see if anyone was paying attention, and not looking at Facebook while he was doing all of this important work in the background!!
This guy isnt worth a fuck
Jimmy Spitz. l think you must be the best tech on the planet, but if you were, therefore you would understand Ivan is incredibly smart. I myself am a master tech and still learn stuff from Ivan. my final comment is thank you again Ivan don't listen to these useless think they know it alls.
I wished you could work on my 2004 Honda odyssey i have a misfire as well what part of the country are you from by chance I'm in Ohio ?
It sounds SO BAD on camera around 17:00 (unplugging the injector). Was it that bad in person??
A few other issues beside the misfire by the sound of it!
Good job
I don't know how you managed to ignore the vacuum leak the whole time. I'd have started there!
It sounded bad, but fuel trims were fine. Some throttle bodies make a lot of noise lol
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics It's a speed density system. A vacuum leak will not affect the fuel trim.
@RemingtonBaker a vaccum leak will mostly certainly affect trims on a speed density system. Introduce a vaccum leak an the vaccum will drop in the intake as the MAP goes closer too atmospheric which will totally affect trims.
@@calebmohler3082 Yes the vacuum will drop and the map will sense it and add fuel. Just like slightly opening the throttle. Unless the leak is too large for the IACV to maintain the proper idle nothing will happen. Except of course ingesting unfiltered air and possibly some vacuum controlled system not working properly.
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics Maybe this would be something interesting to demonstrate while you have the odyssey.
It picked up misfiring on all because you were unplugging coils remember..lol
I thought the same thing unless he cleared that off camera
I would have figured there would have also been coil circuit codes
What about the codes when I just started the diag?
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics those should be when the owner was playing swaptronics whith them coil sitting on the floor whi knows what they were doing lol. That's my guess I might be wrong your the man lol. I'm a rookie next to you.
Only 154,700 on the odometer...lack of maintenance issue
Faulty injectors/coils can take down even the most well maintained engine.
John Rickard
I have to disagree, for 32 years I have never had a bad injector and only 1 bad coil after 19 years and 278,000 miles on that van. There is maintenance that can prevent even injectors from going bad. It is called Motorkote. Never replaced a starter in any of my cars in 32 years and only 1 alternator. Have kept all cars for at least 16 years. All Toyotas and Lexus (Toyota make). I am extreme with fluid and filter maintenance. All fluids. Every fluid on car.
Not necessarily. I have seen the occasional bad injector on many cars.
Pine Hollow Auto Diagnostics
I guess my maintenance is the best.
@@sirsweetness8332 No matter what maintenance u do on your fluids, ur not cleaning the gas that you buy from the gas station. Most cars have a fuel filter. Not sure this has one.
Well, without a scope, you could swap fuel injectors to see if the misfire follows.
Great job ! Keep it up
Have you ever done general engine condition trouble shooting with a vacuum gage.
Not often.
Safety third, I would have put another plug in the cylinder to prevent the escape of the gas mixture from igniting with the spark from the spark plug you have on the coil. Ask me why I do this.
Why do you do that?
wear safety glasses around HVAC freon high pressure... frost bite
@ 13:36, I would have checked for a open circuit across the injector, I have seen these fail, but normally fine when cold then as engine heats up the coil windings inside inj fail and go open circuit. Also could have checked for high HC in ex to determine fuel or spark issue, so many possibilities to approach a problem, that’s why this job isn’t easy.
Lol @13:45 that’s exactly what you did! Haha. Note to self watch whole vid before commenting. Lol. 👊.
Haha just 10 seconds later!
Ad some injector cleaner in the tank, i do it once a year costs are peanuts and good as a prevention for low mileage driven cars.
yep, exactly!!! Injector is just dirty partially plugged
i.m not convinced waiting on part 2
I’ve seen misfires on those engines if the 100,000 mile valve adjustment isn’t done. Although not a hard misfire like that.
My backyard mechanic took my ignition out in 10 minutes. I took the ignition to a locksmith who RE-WAFERED the key assembly for 90 dollars and everything has been perfect since.