Linux Browser wars - Performance isn't everything...
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- Опубліковано 12 лис 2020
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Personal computing is increasingly dependent on web applications, for better or worse. A lot of stuff is now available in web form, instead of native apps, or as electron applications. While I'm not a big fan of this transition, it does mean that more apps are available on Linux everyday, and for that, you need a web browser. But not all browsers are created equal, and some offer more than others.
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Performance
In terms of speed, with the speedometer test, we see these results:
Firefox: 87.9 runs / minute
Epiphany: 92.0
Chromium: 99.6
In terms of Javascript and webassembly, with the jetstream 2 benchmark:
Firefox: 85.224
Epiphany: can't complete, crashes
Chromium: 115.504
For graphics performance, using the MotionMark test
Firefox: 51.16
Epiphany: 160.42
Chromium: 418.17
Let me know if your results are any different, because this baffles me, especially since in use, Firefox only felt marginally slower than Chromium, and definitely faster than Epiphany, which still got better benchmark results. In one last fanboy effort, I ran Mozilla's own Javascript benchmark, Kraken. Lower is better.
Firefox: 972.2ms
Chromium: 947.6ms
Epiphany: 872.7ms
Now, to round this up, and look at standards compatibility, I ran the HTML5 test on each browser, here are the results:
Firefox: 466
Epiphany: 427
CHromium: 474
Features
Let's start with Epiphany. As a native GTK web browser, Epiphany isn't the most loaded browser ever. You get the obvious: tabs, bookmarks, search engine selection, an integrated ad and popup blocker, intelligent tracking prevention, and syncing with a Firefox account if you want to carry all of your browser data, and passwords to another computer that can't run epiphany, or on your phone. You also get the obligatory incognito mode.
Firefox is more of a middle ground. On top of the basics, it adds a Protections dashboard, letting you know what the various blockers have actually, well, blocked, but it can also show you if some of your passwords have been hacked, it has a big library of extensions that you can use, including way more powerful ad blockers than what Epiphany offers, and full theming capabilities.
Chromium, in the other hand, is just a de-branded version of Chrome, so basically, it's the exact same browser, complete with Google account login, and all the bells and whistles. The only differences are that it lacks some codec support, and doesn't restrict users to the CHrome Web Store extensions. Speaking of extensions, CHromium has the biggest library out there, thanks to the aforementioned chrome web store. It's also not very well integrated with Linux desktops, although it can also be themed.
Brave is the most interesting: it's touted as a privacy focused browser, and it ships with its own custom ad and tracker blockers. Its private browsing mode actually uses TOR instead of just not saving your browsing history and cookies locally. It also includes something called Brave rewards, which basically gives you crypto tokens if you accept to watch ads, and these tokens can be used to reward various creators. In theory, it's a good idea, but the fact that Brave blocks the ads on these creator websites by default, and leaves the user to decide if their content is worth it might make some of you uncomfortable. I personally am, especially since not everyone can receive Brave Tokens. Brave touts faster speeds, but in my experience, it's only due to the default ad blocker. Add one to CHromium, and you get the same speeds.
Now, we also have Vivaldi, which also has tracking and ad blocking out of the box, user account syncing, but also goes crazier with the features. You can stack tabs, or open tabs side by side, although I don't see how that's more convenient than jus thaving 2 browser windows side by side, and it also uses a sidebar that lets you access some features, like the download manager, bookmarks, history, a note taking application, and some website shortcuts. As all chromium based browsers, it supports the extensions from the chrome web store, and it even lets you tweak the keyboard shortcuts. Vivaldi is basically the browser you want if you spend your whole day inside of it, and if you really want to tailor the experience as much as possible. - Наука та технологія
Firefox in war against the Chromiumization of the internet.
Let’s hope it wins
@@TheLinuxEXP If you look at the market share it's obvious they won't... I'm pretty sure Firefox is only still around because Google pays them
@@TheLinuxEXP Let's help it by installing it
They'd better step up they game.
For the past 9 months every time i tried to use firefox, its hideous ram management always let me down. Its not that their rendering engine is written in rust (RIP Servo, the Aborted infant) or is using some military grade memory safety tactic, its because its poorly written. Heck, i even had to download a .dll file manually to make it work because it was not included in the package.
No one is going to save Firefox except it's dev's Leadership,
And no one is going to save internet if we all didn't develop a fully community written rendering engine and browser, developed by community and not a corporate hack like Google or joke that is Mozilla in its Current form.
If you think Current form Mozilla is going to "Save the internet from them devil boogle", you are on some high quality shit.
@@UnworthyUnbeliever Using Firefox for last 10 years never had to download any .dll file lol.
I've recently switched to using Firefox instead of Chrome and I legitimately can't tell any difference in performance.
Yeah, benchmarks don’t tell the whole story, as I said, in use, you don’t notice that much of a gap
I hate the firefox UI.
@@ishanagarwal475 Firefox UI looks much better on Linux than other browsers.
@@s9209122222 Yeah I hate the new Chrome/Chromium UI on all operating systems) and on Windows FireFox looks ok but on Linux it looks great.
my home page is set to google on all browsers, firefox takes twice as long as chrome to fully load the page, mind you its only a couple of seconds so l can live with it
Google monopolized internet. Most sites are developed around chrome. That's the reason chrome wins everywhere. Coz most web techs are made for chrome or by Google themselves. Even some of those which Firefox uses.
So the benchmarks are in a way, biased.
You said it yourself Google monopolized the internet. When everything outside the benchmarks is in favour of Google Firefox has to try harder, the product has to compete in the real world.
@@respiii that's not a real world. That's a biased one. Monopoly is never good. Web should be open non centralised
I was about to comment the same thing. Glad to see it being mentioned as right now this is feeling like Chrome being the new IE in terms of a browser monopoly with Firefox being like it's Netscape ancestor of trying to compete to make for a better web for everyone with competition. That's why when I code I code for both, not just Chrome for webdev
Well, not biased, theyre a good representation of real world browser performance, thus accurate. How we got here really doesn't matter in this context
Same goes for Epiphany. The real reason it did good in benchmarks is because of Webkit and Apple
LOL LTT Transistion enabled, I actually like it
Haha that’s a good way to make these sponsored mentions more fun :)
It only apeared for a split second,and when i went back to check what it wa i burst out laughing 🤣 good one
It made me laugh too xD
In my experience Firefox loads websites slower, but uses less RAM, CPU and over all works much better when you have a lot of tabs open. So it can be a much better experience performance-wise if you use way too many tabs like me.
I usually run about 10 UA-cam tabs to watch later... And then 3 or 4 tabs of other stuff
@@EddoWagt meanwhile I have 217 tabs open
i never feel it after going from chrome to firefox i edit use 5 extensions and normally 2 tabs open
Am I the only NORMAL person who has at most 5, but usually 1 or 2 tabs open.
That!
I tried other browsers, but Firefox is the most enjoyable for me so it's my main browser.
@@mirshahjahan01 By what metric?
@@mirshahjahan01 Yeah, could you expand on those? Are there particular security issues with Firefox that don't apply to Brave/Chrome/Chromium etc?
Also, in what way is Brave more usable than Firefox, they're both browsers with very similar functionality?
@@mirshahjahan01 Will do, thanks for the info! :)
5:37 Ohh god that scrolling is horrible.
On my machine, Firefox beats Chrome in MotionMark 1.1
Firefox: 776.98
Chrome: 573.25
Firefox wins in Canvas Arcs, Leaves, Paths (+104% more points than Chrome), Focus (+182% more), Images, Design and Suits (+120%)
Chrome wins in multiply and Canvas Lines (+97%)
I have WebRender enabled. AMD GPU on Arch Linux
Yeah webrender isn’t enabled by default, that’s why I left it out, especially since it doesn’t work with Nvidia GPus
Firefox by default doesn't include hardware acceleration on Linux, so you are going to always have poor scores in that regard unless you enable it. Fedora added VA-API support with Wayland. and on my machine, it doesn't BEAT chrome, but the difference is less than 20 points
i find privacy is also a importent thing and thats why i never would use chrome, or other closed source browsers
And i find the new functions of firefox amazing like the firefox acount etc :)
Yeah, Firefox has a lot of advantages there
Same here.
@Zacman X Then I would use Brave, is my second browser (with chromium base and its opensource)
@Zacman X no, there are test and if you click to dont send statistics, you have no telemetry, google chrome has the most data and they take also your personal data to manipulate you (like trump elections)
But the point here is how good chromium is, so you can go for other foss chromium browsers like brave and chromium.
I like the "Multi-Account Container" add-on for Firefox, it sand box the cookies and cash of open tabs.
firefox is my favorite, and on second place i use brave
Same
Same
For me it's the opposite.
Shame on you all. You basters use firefox profiles if you need different setup for work or need different set of extensive for different purposes.
Mozilla is in financial crysis and you sick people don't show enough love to firefox and use chromium based browse. You cheap basterds won't donate to Mozilla the least you can do is use firefox
@@nibirray1877 ............chill out bro
I'm concerned as well with Google's monopoly on the web engine and moved to Firefox about two years ago and it works just fine
Used brave and never looked back.
There's a tweak in the advanced Chromium settings that turns off Chromium running in the background when you're not logged in. So even when Chromium is off, it can still run in the background and track everything you're doing if you allow it to.
Thank you so much !! Just what I was looking for.
I have a PC that has dual boot Windows 10 and Fedora 33.
On Windows 10, I use Brave, and on Fedora 33, I use Firefox, which I used to write this comment.
Also,
Good video! Keep it up, your videos are awesome :-) And your channel is growing SO FAST!!! So, keep it up, and let bring more people to Linux! Let more people know about the Linux! (the right way). Help more people learn Linux, and let more use Linux! Keep it up! you are awesome! :-)
I've been using Vivaldi for years now due to it's excellent sync and now even built in (per page toggleable) ad blocking even on android and the Tab stacks and Notes (also synced with my Tablet for reading on the go) are a blessing when researching topics (for example as a student or otherwise interested person). The variability of it's built in interface has significantly cut down on my exptension use so now I'm down to just ublock, darkreader, the gnome extension management and KDE-/GSconnect... and it even supports widevine which sadly is required for some content. (Using Manjaro Gnome and it was not in the standard repos, but luckily there's the AUR)
And one can even change Vivaldi's window theming simply in it's settings if you prefer it to respect your OS default, since you mentioned being bothered by that... though it then needs some more screen space to then still handle tab stacks etc. Same goes for at least some google related features that can be disabled there.
The only thing left I'd wish it could toggle between is chromium and firefox's backend though assume that would be too mucn to ask...
can you sync the keybindings though,I had to do it by manually backing up some files related to keybindings from .config/vivaldi
@@marufrudhra2712 I'm mostly using standard keybindings and mouse gestures, but you're right adding Keybinds (and mouse gestures) to sync would be a neat addition.
Vivaldi has a Feature Request page, time to upvote Keybind-sync.
PS: I forgot to mention the whole website snapshot tool built into the Browser, (and even it's Mobile version) also is a frequently used utility for me, or how nice it is to toggle all animations on a page on/off when reading stuff etc.
if vivaldi had the workspace feature like opera has , it would be the perfect browser for me
I wonder why no browser is adding these feature
@@marufrudhra2712 I just use the Workspaces in Gnome... and/or Vivaldi's Tab stacks... and only on some occasions saving/loading sessions if there's a harder break in what I'm doing (personally mainly for Pen and Paper with all related materials/references and afterwards switching back to the previous Tabs/normal use again), but the more options the merrier. I'm not sure how the Workspaces work in Opera, but assume you could bind the session-functions in Vivaldi to hotkeys and use those to approximate that functionality/accessibility.
@@marufrudhra2712 no, custom search engines are also not synced.
Dumped firefox long ago in favor of Vivaldi, never looked back.
Same here except I spent time in Brave then Waterfox before switching to Vivaldi. Vivaldi was actually really rough to use on Linux, but I loved it so much I stuck it out and the last couple of updates have basically fixed every issue I had with it. I only have LibreWolf as the only alternate browser on my system.
@@g0dm4st3r cool! I tried to install librewolf bin, but asked me to trust a gpg key before I proceed. I'm a little skeptical of this....how did you install?
@@gemsstr7933 I did the same although I use the AUR. I don't know if your distribution of Linux is using the same method.
@@g0dm4st3r yeah I did it through aur as well. You didn't get that message to verify the key?
@@gemsstr7933 Yes, I did that. If you are so concerned, create a VM running your distribution and try it out there.
Loved the LTT transition man, keep it going
Haha thanks ;)
When benchmarking it is critical to disclose the versions of the software builds tested. There can be regressions in particular releases fixed in an update. These comparisons can't easily be reproduced due to this missing information to check which factors are the issue. Methods matter in reliable and reproducible benchmarking.
All the latest versions available at the time of testing, kinda goes without saying :)
@@TheLinuxEXP no it doesn't
Edit: To clarify, actually debugging or doing any sort of analysis would require the *exact* version of everything you're using. For example, are you using the version from the distro's package manager, or Firefox nightly, or a development build? Or even a custom compiled version, in which case, which compiler (gcc or clang?), compiler/linked flags (LTO? PGO? (if so, what was the profile collected on?) did you allow for cpu-specific optimizations with -march=native or even -mtune? was -O3 enabled, or any other optimization flags?), and exact version of everything (including compiler, whether it's a nightly build, git commit hash number if it's a git version, etc.) needs to be specified. Otherwise, debugging/fixing the problem is kind of impossible, because the behavior will be slightly different (or even massively different) between each versions of everything, or even between different compiler flags (for example). Also very important is to specify whether WebRender is enabled on Firefox because it's not necessarily enabled by default.
Phoronix (which does very extensive testing) specifies all of these things (and actually more), like in here: www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=chrome83-firefox77-linux&num=1. In fact, the basic versions are literally specified in the name of the article and are not abstracted away to say "Firefox is just faster/slower than Chromium". As you can see in the article, there are *significant* differences in performance even between different (recent) versions of firefox.
IMO, it's only resonable to test them at their latest "stable" version anyway. That goes without saying to me.
Why would I care at all about the beta or nightly performance? They are not considered a completed product yet, and some modifications in the beta or nightly are not always come straight to the next stable also.
I get what you’re saying, but it has never been my goal to benchmark that extensively. I honestly don’t think many people would want to see a video where I spend 10 minutes giving every version of every piece of software used to compile and run 3 web browsers ;)
@@TheLinuxEXP Of course testing with the latest version of the browser would be the expectation, but given a benchmark is a snapshot in time, but videos can be watched at any point in time disclosing what the latest version at the time of filming matters to provide relevance to what the versions are the current versions in the testing. Its just a matter of providing detail for clear communication in the videos, basic things to interpret a graph and results are critical to clear communication of graphs, charts, etc. I'm not looking for debugging detail, but at the very least the browser version number.
I use Vivaldi
I got hooked on customizing it. I have it throw my tabs and bookmark bar along the bottom then tweaked it so they interface a lot like my panel along the bottom. It's a great work flow.
I don't really use the stacked tabs, but I would push back on what you said in the video...
Having dedicated tabs for split pages could be useful in some workflows.
I think that if you were using different browsers (at least for testing), and you did not notice some big performance differences, it is worth sticking to browser based on personal reasons. Performance is in my opinion secondary to security and pushing for foss.
Love your videos my man!!! :)
Thanks ;)
I've gone from installing my first ever Linux distro to watching your entire back catalogue in less than a week... I'm hooked on Elementary!
Wow nice !!
Memory footprint would have been a good addition. Vivaldi, Brave, Firefox, & sometimes Chromium. In that order. Mandatory extensions: tab unloader, session manager, ublock origin.
Using Brave, nothing to complain about.
If you use it on two different laptops, it won't sync, so whatever you do one one laptop you have to do the exact same thing on the other to keep it updated.
@@johnbockman6078 sync codes exist
@@BlueRayofLight then they should be made known to users.
@@johnbockman6078 it's literally in the settings of the browser
This beautiful LTT transition makes me really enjoy advertising. Thanks!
Haha thank you :)
Brave on Linux does have the option to use the Gtk theme, which when used significantly improves platform look & feel integration. When using the theme the mouse pointer size is respected, text is scaled at the correct size (if using the Cinnamon desktop), proper window buttons are used, and menus are themed much better (closer to the native theme). What is missing in Brave (incl other Web Browsers) is a GUI option in Preferences to manually set the UI scale as a percentage. Web applications are the biggest offenders when it comes to UI scaling, especially Electron apps which I HATE with a passion!
Vivaldi has full customization, and you can change where the buttons are. I love Vivaldi. I use it on Mobile as well. I use Brave as an entirely amnesiac browser, and have Firefox on mobile due to it's ability to install extensions just like on desktop.
Firefoxers where are you? ❤️
*Hello there*
👋😊👍
Besides everyday Firefox, I'm using Gnome Epiphany for a two-click-creating of web apps in a separate window. Eolie because of the cool multifunctional address bar and the interesting approach to tab management. And the chromium based Naver Whale for research: It can open two pages side by side, but other than Vivaldi it can open links you click on the left page on the right page. That is extremely convenient.
(Frequent Vivaldi user here)
I use Tab Tiling when I need to open three or four websites for my own little dashboard. If you have multiple rows of tabs it saves space by not having repeated address bars.
In the Window Appearance settings you can move the close button to the left, or open Vivaldi in a native window.
Daily, I use Vivaldi for its features and for simpler browsing I use Firefox. Vivaldi makes my computer's fan scream regardless of the number of tabs open.
Firefox+DuckDuckGo rocks for me
That’s my setup as well!
@@TheLinuxEXP DuckDuckGo has the best Image search results
Firefox first (I also recommended to everybody including my other family members), then Chrome a second. Your browser benchmarks were quite a shock to me because I find Firefox and Chrome perform almost identical for me using the exact same extensions installed. I'm sure that has something to do with it. But I don't feel left behind at all using Firefox when it comes to performance.
Wow... a year and a half later and your videos will look so much nicer.
You really missed a lot when reviewing vivaldi. Completly forgotten about the F2 command line which enables navigation between tabs with keyboard, quickly accessing history and so on. Plus the tiling feature is extremly good for people who like tiling. You get more screen estate by not adding another windows and borders, tab panels and so on. You can comfortably tile up to 4 tabs and choose, if you would like horizontal or vertical tiling.
You also missed the mouse gestures, which are amazing.
Vivaldi is by far the best browser for pc superusers.
Vivaldi is the most complex to review cause of the crazy amount of customisation it allows you. It can't be explained in few words. That's why I love it. I can have a totally custom browser.
I use firefox because i feel more comfortable using it than chrome/chromium browsers, i has more interesting features IMO, e. g: the built-in screenshot tool, privacy-focus, etc...
firefox has a leftard focus... not privacy
well,
i prefer to use Brave cause i hate an unfriendly ads.
To be fair it would be better to use A Pi Hole.
I used to get lots of Brave ads in Chromium.
Firefox has been my primary browser since version 0.8 on my Linux and Windows platforms. I remember when it was really memory hog and slower to others, still I preferred it. Now a days Firefox is stable and fast. Have been also using it on my android phones and boxes.
I use Vivaldi and would just like to add that you can use native window decorations, but it's not set by default. You can chose it in the settings and after reboot you have native windows and can you the native window operations available in your desktop environment. I also think it looks better native! :)
Was WebRender enabled for Firefox?
No, because of nvidia drivers :/ I’ll revisit this when it’s not an experimental feature ;)
@@TheLinuxEXP I think it should be stated in the video since it's enabled by default everywhere but with Nvidia drivers, I have ran MotionMark on a laptop with a Ryzen 4500U and integrated graphics and I got 136.68 +-29.64%
Chromium got 185.99 +-48.71%
Ok, second edit, nevermind, It's not enabled by default, but it's beta, I had enabled it manually and forgot, still I believe it should be at least mentioned, since the performance difference is massive and I've been running it (as have many others) without any problem on intel and amd integrated graphics
It never worked for me, the webpages render with all sort of issues and video playback is broken
@@dema3112 that makes sense, i was getting ~226 in firefox and ~330 in chrome and was wondering how i was getting better performance. I had webrender turned on long ago and forgot about it. Btw i'm on r5 1600 and gtx 1070.
@@TheLinuxEXP I have it enabled for about a year now on all my computers that is one laptop with Intel iGPU, one with AMD iGPU a and desktop with AMD GPU and had no problem with it.
Personally I like Brave a lot. A perfect balance between fast and secure.
Although FireFox is my go to, I have found that with certain things like Running Facebook Live, Chromium must be used. It is good to have both installed, thanks for the time explaining the benchmarks, pros, and cons.
Great video!
Thanks :)
I personally use Firefox and Vivaldi
I use Firefox, but I’m tempted to try something else
@@TheLinuxEXP Vivaldi
Firefox Forever ! ❤️ Google can go in hell !!!
It's several years I use Opera, first on Windows, and now on Linux.
One good thing it has is a power saving mode, useful if you are on batteries.
Interesting comparison. I’m pretty agnostic when it comes to browsers, but Firefox is definitely my favorite. I have used it since the olden days when I moved from Lynx to Netscape 1.0 at work, and thru all its iterations since. Now it is my default browser when a new machine is added at home, but I also run Safari on the Apple boxen & devices, IE on the Win7 bax, and DuckDuckGo on my newer iPad (just to keep some of my ‘surfing’ invisible to the family, eh?). I have generally found that performance seems to be more by website or application vs by browser. Oh, and on Linuxes I have experimented on, FF has been fine.
FireFox all the day :)
From your friend 93 Km from the Great Pyramids.
I'm too deep into firefox to switch. Passwords, bookmarks, extensions, themes and privacy settings are too much to setup in a new browser.
Yeah, that's also exactly why so many people too lazy to switching to firefox. Including me
I have g-mail, a work Google Site that links with Google Drive, and there is a ton of bookmarks. A school where I used to work set up the g-mail for us, so using it became second nature, and I see no reason to switch.
Will you keep the LTT transition or is it experimental? BTW great vid
Experimental, but might stick for more videos ^^ thanks for watching!
firefox on the last update added multimedia control via using the buttons on the keyboard.. that was the only thing missing for me.. Other than that, love using firefox, especially the sync credentials feature.
There is still a performance issue on Firefox but for me is enough.
Great video, the only thing i would have added is the version of every web browser you used.
Brave. End of story.
Vivaldi has best UI.
Brave is the fastest.
Epiphany is corporate/document/study/legal friendly.
The others are sleeping minkeys.
Best UI? Not on my system, it looks completely alien ^^
Vivaldi is immediately discarded due to extremely poor performance. The UI uses web technologies.
@@TheLinuxEXP Vivaldi looks very bad, dont get how ppl like it honestly.
I really didn’t like the interface
But Vivaldi's interface can be what you want it to be..
haha "LTT Transition Enabled" nice lmao
Hardware Accerlation and internal translation are factor to pick a browser, thus I use chromium or yandex for normal browsing and firefox when privacy is needed
I will come back to Firefox, once they start supporting XDG Base Directory.
Total disagree about Opera browser. It's blazing fast, well integrated in Linux in terms of performance (zero crashes, blazing fast responses) but aesthetically too in terms of bloatless UI. Most important though IMO is that it offers the sidebar plugins messengers (you can even add your own like Discord which is nice for gamers) and workspaces feature which enhances productivity and in comparison with Firefox for example. VPN is great feature too. I've used it in many distros and works like a charm.
I always have 2 browsers installed, just in case. Firefox has been my main browser for years. It works really well, is quick, has a large amount of addons and respects privacy (althought some privacy related addons are recommended).
As a second browser, I'm really liking QuteBrowser right now. This is a browser designed to be fully operatable with just your keyboard. This makes it really nice to use on Linux, esspecially if you have a tiling WM and use keyboard shortcuts for most things. It takes a little time to get used to, but it's really not that bad. And because it's keyboard based you can quickly use certain shortcuts to improve workflow.
The only downside I have found so far, is that it doesn't seem to support addons. You might want to look into it :)
Thank you great!
TOR Browser should also be mentioned.
TOR browser is just modified Firefox, so I would assume everything that applies to firefox would apply to it. Though using TOR browser for regular web based activities sounds very impractical to me.
Damn, Mozilla needs to improve performance
If you enable webrender, you get better performance, but it doesn’t work on nvidia GPUs
it works on nvidia gpu just fine. I have it enabled + forced hw acceleration for almost 2 years now
@@TheLinuxEXP it seems to work on my nvidia device (and I googled it),
Where did you hear this?
I tried it on 2 different PCs and didn’t work,
I use Opera on the left screen, Firefox on the middle and Vivaldi on the right.
The WhatsApp integration in Opera I love it.
Vivaldi gives me the old Opera feel. Many things I prefer.
With KDE integration Firefox works nicely.
As heavy Gdocs user, I go with the browser that works best here.
For special environment cases there is Falkon.
My reason for not using Blink based browsers is that your browser is no longer JUST a browser. It's now an application platform which makes it just as important as your operating system. So even though Chromium is open source, it can be used to run code that isn't open source - for example, when Google decided to push the binary for voice recognition to Chrome and Chromium - and may be installed without your knowledge.
In short, I trust the Mozilla foundation way more than I trust Google.
I agree
In a bit of irony, Microsoft, moving Edge to Blink, is forcing some changes on Chrome, as Microsoft is willing and able to do their own thing on top of Blink. Sadly, I've switched to Edge on both my Macs and on Windows. I only wish it were available on ARM so I could run it on my Raspberry Pi as well. I've long struggled with Firefox. I love its interface, etc. but it is slow, uses one memory space for all tabs (which is both a security and stability risk), and tends to bring my whole computer to a crawl when it suffers. (This is true on my Macs and my Pi. Don't know if it would do it on Windows)
I will say that it is frustrating to be bound to the likes of Google and Microsoft for such an important app as one's browser. I keep telling myself I'll go back to Firefox, but then I use a ChromeCast. If not a ChromeCast, then what? Apple TV? Firestick? Options are limited. argh.
Please make video on ubuntu dde sir.
Firefox best 2 extensions are the containers and side view. It easy surpasses what google chrome can do for me. Multiple accounts, got you covered; side view for small screams and simultaneous viewing of tabs to take notes or stuff, heck ya. Looks much better than chrome definitely. (I like its block tabs instead of googles curved ones)
I loved and used FF from the very beginning, something like 2003 or so. I have the same ethical point of view as Nick and I struggled a lot and for an extended period of time, but I think I'm finally done with FF in favor of Vivaldi, for a couple of reasons: firstly, because of bugs that came and went from year to year (in conjunction with nvidia cards), but most importantly the deal breaker was the ditching of the group tabs feature. Since, Vivaldi supports stacked tabs, it's the closest it got for me to group my work into areas (since I have almost always 100+ pages open).
The solution is a Chromiumfox, cmon
Edge is a "alpha" version yet on Linux. I'm using Brave browser for last two years(including on my Android). For me works very well and I don't have the memory problems in the same level I had previously with Chrome or even Firefox.
As a web developer I've tried to switch to firefox several times. Because of the issues you found with motion mark I have never been able to. I was developing a personal site that was all svgs with css transforms. Another issue I ran into with firefox was that it couldn't even position elements properly. I had tons of svg turning gears and screws and they would all come out of alignment on firefox when I moved them but on other browsers they would position properly. It was extremely annoying
A lot of the time I use my old Athlon machine running Puppy and Win 2000, using Pale Moon 26 (Firefox derivative), and just use a clip converter website to watch YT vids whenever I want that. Somtimes Opera 12's old Presto engine does the trick when Pale Moon will not. Winamp (Xine and XMMS in Puppy) still works great for internet radio and podcasts, although I sometimes need to hunt around for URL's. OpenOffice and Abiword for document stuff. Funny enough, I find the whole experience 'snappier' than all this new gunk.
Brave is just as customizable as vivaldi. You get all of the extensions that are in the chrome web store. Brave's speed comes from the fact that it's adblocker is built-in, instead of a tacked on addon. Brave is incredible with it's literal free tokens. I don't understand how you think it's a scummy practice. Turn on ads that aren't intrusive, save tokens, then you can actually sell them. I don't issue out my tokens, they go to my bank.
LTT transition enabled- LOL 😂
It's far more important that a browser looks and feels the same on any platform than that it somehow matches the specific desktop.
I enabled webrender on firefox and then did the motion mark test, and firefox got 2/3 of chromium's score. My testing conditions were not nearly as ideal, as firefox was loaded with extensions, and I was using chromium-vaapi which might give chromium a slight advantage, but to anyone reading this, enable webrender on firefox, as it seems to be the key to get way better web performance.
Oh hey, so you're using DaVinci Resolve? Did you have any trouble getting it to work? I hear the Linux version can be finnicky if you're not using the specific CentOS image they develop it for.
I have a terrible habit of leaving WAY too many Firefox tabs open if I just use a single browser, so I try to segment things between multiple browsers so I always know where things are and don't have to scroll and inspect each tab to find something. Firefox is my primary where I do things involving my personal information and my general browsing, Brave is where I keep my social media and UA-cam tabs, and Vivaldi is for when I need to research things, since the tab stacking is incredibly useful when I have a lot open or multiple projects.
I also like Waterfox Classic and Pale Moon, since I'm a big fan of the way things used to look before all of this flat garbage became the norm in UI design. (Still hoping we can go back to Aero and skeuomorphism someday. I'm just glad it's possible to keep it alive on Linux, and I love my custom Vista+Mavericks-style Cinnamon desktop.)
I currently use brave and tor, but ive been thinking of switching to firefox as brave is getting kinda scummy with their rewadds popping up all the time. As for tor something on my pc wont let tor launch (Microsoft family monitor just started and idk why or how) and obviously speed on the tor circuit is non existent. Is there a way to make firefox mobile as good as a customized desktop version? Or should i leave brave on my phone and use firefox on pc?
Jumped ship from Firefox to Vivaldi about a year ago. It is as configurable as the old Opera 12, which I still use for my mail client.
Excellente analyse. J'utilise Palemoon, un slimmed down de Firefox et jusqu'à date, aucun problème et je le trouve rapide sur l'exécution (rendering). J'ai longtemps utilisé Links2, mais seulement pour lire les nouvelles.
I use a variety of browsers everyday which stems from me needing to use a variety of google accounts. (on win btw)
I use Edge for basic PDF reading, webapps, and school related stuff, I use Vivaldi as my main browser, I use Brave for websites that have more ads than a MMO boss battle and shopping, and Chrome for Protorio.
I have Tor and Firefox when I need their functionality.
I'm a new viewer but long-time Linux user and kernel tinkerer. I also use Firefox for the same reasons you list. Unfortunately I think we're all going to be forced onto Chromium soon, as Mozilla management are running the company into the ground. When that happens I'll really restrict my web usage. Hopefully newer "alternative internet" projects like Gemini or federated services like Urbit start to pick up more users and become useful.
Vivaldi user here, used to be an Opera user (my main browser was Opera 12 for way too long).
Firefox and Chrome UI looks weird to me, and there's no mouse shortcut by default, and no tab stack.... Guess I was enslaved by the default feature.
Viewing tabs in separate windows inside the browser sounds amazing. Saves precious vertical space
It... doesn’t? If you tile 2 browsing windows side by side using your window manager, they use the exact same height as if you’re filing 2 tabs in the same browsing window?
@@TheLinuxEXP I'm thinking 2 windows on top of one another, vertically aligned. the tabs & address bar tend to take up so much space in that context
Ethical, security, speed. I used firefox for years and suggested it to friends as well. However due to poor management of the project, and one of the suits even saying that he doesn’t care what the users wan, I’m referring to the ff changes that moves close tabs to the right and close other tabs under some confusing menu. Im choosing the only alternative, chromium-based bowser. Now Firefox for android is fantastic and I’ve seen the lead devs ask for user feedback in Reddit. Ios and ipados, I’m forced to use safari due to non extensions.
I remember luke from LTT saying it feels Firefox for desktop takes 2 steps forward and 1 step backwards. I agree. When they fix that close tabs to right menu, My pacman will be there for them
I use Vivaldi everywhere, except on my phone. Tab stacking is super useful. More built-in features means less extensions I need to install.
I am kind of switching between browsers depending on the task - firefox, chromium, brave, sometimes falkon. Though my default browser is Firefox, since I cannot customise a chrome based browser the way I need to.
I guess the amazing benchmark performance of chromium, especially regarding graphics, is the reason, why it is the default browser on the raspberry pi. You really need every performance increase you can get to achieve a decent browser experience ;)
Note: Falkon is not using the same rendering engine as Epiphany (WebKit). It's using QtWebEngine (wiki.qt.io/QtWebEngine), which is based on Chromium (surprise?) but without binary blobs or Google services, and can make use of system libraries, such as OpenSSL.
From my experience, Falkon works everywhere Chromium works and with similar performance.
My favorites are Firefox and ungoogled-chromium. The performance hit from running Firefox is noticeable, but I can live with it. The reason we ship Firefox by default in Manjaro is precisely because we wish to avoid the chromium monopoly. We can't do much, but it's something at least.
And that’s a very good thing, keep up the good work :)
As a web developer, I don't mind many engines if everyone kept up to date/standard, which is why I don't mind the way things are right now, at the same time it is terrible that Google can push they're own agenda regarding the web.
And then there is Apple who literally has full browser engine monopoly on the iPhone (only WebKit allowed), that alone has been the source of much pain.
Yeah, especially since they don’t support most modern web features. Safari on mobile is a plague
I like the CSS tweaks on your firefox
Go to Zonnev’s GitHub page to find them :)
Firefox, Brave, Opera, Chromium - I use all of these on my Linux desktop to test my work; all of these integrate well with OpenSUSE Tumbleweed + KDE.
chrome benchmark here was just 1.5x the speed of firefox on MotionMark, so i guess its an gpu related issue, since i dont have any (besides the gpu embed to the cpu)
what is your gpu? or even better, what is the full spec of your computer?
It’s the nvidia GPu, Firefox doesn’t use hardware acceleration with that kind of hardware
@@TheLinuxEXP most likely because mozila would have to waste time twice, one for amd with the open standard, openCL, and another one with nvida cuda cores...
The strange thing is: on some real world websites with heavy use of JavaScript, I found FF to perform considerably better than Chromium based browsers, thing which I really didn't expect but the result were consistent on different hardware and different OS.
The score of Motionmark really says it: rendering (and even media decoding) in Firefox is the worst. I'm trying to implement a cross-platform media player (plays local files) in the browser (early alpha), and unlike in Chromium, Firefox always lags and sometimes even crashes when decoding media and rendering it (or canvas as a visualizer). Firefox should really improve their media decoding and rendering performance!
In the mean time, all Chromium-based browsers decodes and renders them very smoothly...
No mention of containers in FF! Absolutely essential for privacy on the web.
What annoys me is how none of the browsers fit in with the rest of my system theme.
I don't mind what Vivaldi looks like in terms of it looking "alien" under Linux. Its interface is generally fine and on top of being a fast browser, it is full of nice and useful features right out-of-the-box that the other browsers lack entirely, unless you install some extension. Plus, in terms of themes, Vivaldi allows you to pretty much "create" your own as you please with just a few clicks, while most of the others will have you either learning how to do some coding to make your own or downloading some theme from a store that someone else made. Now, obviously, these and other reasons that make Vivaldi be my browser of choice may not apply to other people, as each one of us has their own preferences, which is completely fine (heck, there's people who still prefer Opera lol), but for me in particular, Vivaldi is the way to go, in both Linux and Windows. And as of recently, Android, also.
I'm not a fan of web-based apps either, but for a different reason than you stated. Moving software to web-based takes people down a road to a point where corporations have all the computers and home users will only have thin clients to use those corporate computers at the corporate owners' discretion.
I want to use my own computer without any corporate control of what I can do with it.