Putin Has Been Good For Russia
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- Опубліковано 2 чер 2013
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Filmed at the Royal Geographical Society on 23rd May 2013.
There's not a lot to like about Vladimir Putin: he's autocratic, vain and runs a corrupt government. And he doesn't give a fig for human rights. The repression in Chechnya, the jailing of the businessman Mikhail Khodorkovsky and the Pussy Riot protestors, the murders of journalist Anna Politkovskaya and of Alexander Litvinenko, the former spy -- all this happened on Putin's watch. Who would not be on the side of the 100,000 people who turned out on Moscow's streets last winter to protest against Putin's election to a third term as president and to demand fair elections and an honest government? Russia would be better off without Putin -- who would argue otherwise?
As a matter of fact, millions would. Talk to many Russians and they'll tell you that life under Putin is vastly better than under Boris Yeltsin. Yeltsin let a handful of oligarchs hoover up Russia's wealth while ordinary Russians were reduced to selling their possessions on the street. Putin, by contrast, has quelled the economic mayhem -- inflation is down, pensions have increased. Even more importantly he has restored Russia's sense of self-worth -- crushing the Chechen revolt, refusing to play along with the West over Syria. Living in Notting Hill you might not find Putin to your taste, but for those facing the realities of contemporary Russia he is a godsend, the strong leader that the country needs at this crucial time of transition and uncertainty.
This aged well.
This was supposed to be my comment. Dah..
Not gonna look at it, but amazed that it would argue that pig-putin would've been considered good for russia at ten years ago... 😮
The autocratic turn was pretty bad by that time.
@@Zoroff74 Why do you assume that average Russians worry about autocracy?
The American guy's opening remarks was an absolute slam dunk, he pretty much won the debate right there.
aged like fine wine
Syria: Putin -1, Obama-0
Krim: Putin -1, Obama-0
Ukraine: Putin -1, Obama-0
Gas-Pipelines: Putin -3, Obama-0
Forbes: Putin -2, Obama-0
Iraq; America -10,
Afghanistan: America -10,
Saudi: America -10,
Vietnam: America -10,
And the list goes on and on and on.... Get your biased self in order man.
Siddharth Sharma list goes on aka you don't have anything more to say(you are problably going to check wiki)
i can't really tell you too come up with more becuse you will problably check wiki.
Dude!! Stop being a creep and leave me alone. In the mean while go watch some AlJazeera world, Vice news, Times now and do your own research work for gods sake instead of asking me to check wiki again. Fuck!! some people just don't wanna get it. Also look up the term "cognitive dissonance". I swear it will do you a lot of good.
how did you know i liked Vice News? i like watching weird things around the world
So this debate was in 2013:
- a year later, Putin annexes Crimea
- two years later, Putin occupies part of the Donbass and assasinatea his main political opponent
- five years later, Putin poisons his emigrated dissidents
- nine years later, Putin invades the whole of Ukraine and claims annexation of a quarter of the country
I wish we could invite the same panelists again!
AND it was 5 years after Russiaa-Georgia war. West was BLIND.
Wiki: Gessen was born into an Ashkenazi Jewish family in Moscow.Gessen is openly gay and an activist for the rights of sexual minorities. In September 2012, Gessen was appointed as director of the Russian Service for Radio Liberty, a US government funded broadcaster based in Prague
Exactly! I guessed something really fishy about it : couldnt even watch or listen her zio-BS ... lol : ::: Masha Gessen such an ugly shemale Zio-Chechen!- enemy of Russia -- every enemy of a nation will start saying that the best of that nation is "A MYTH" Thanks Boris Jordan - give them a lesson! And that journalist is really psycho lol. never heard a grownup doing such grimaces ...
It was easy to tell she wasn't a real Russian. S(he) is a puppet for Zionist interests in Russia.
Indeed! - if you want to listen Webster Tarpley, one of the the greatest historian *alive* about Russia, Ukraine and more :) Have a great day and spread the truth!
watch?v=qAynD4lzsZI .
Yeah - I still hope PUTIN try to do more for his people! I am sure is not easy for anyone to fight the zio-puppets and all ashkenazim oligarchs. Wanna listen to a really great historian? watch?v=8YUabqlxuPo
Too much time given to the Guardian guy.
The whole "democracy" issue is a non-issue in regards to Russia. If democracy means selling off all your wealth generating assets at bargain basement prices to Western interests/corporations, then the Russians are better off without it. Putin's biggest crime, in the eyes of The West, was re-nationalizing energy companies for the benefit of Russian citizens.
i can finally answer quicker few words.... you are complete b.s. i think,
it appears so, but sadly what i hear its not true...just diff top ppl
yo I see cause the average russian citizen is living so well right now
@@hehno1 The average Western citizen is living so well right now?
@Alexander Romero except happiness
@@blu3_enjoy uhh no they aren’t
An ex-KGB secret policeman as dictator of Russia? What's the worst that could happen?
Why is this debate nonsensical? Because it does not include an exposition of the policy on money creation. A nation is truly sovereign if the government manages the creation of money for the benefit of everyone. Well in the USA most of the money is created by private commercial banks. The federal Reserve only introduces 3% of the money stock. The other 97% is created by private commercial banks. These private commercial banks use schemes to transfer wealth from the working class to the financiers. These financiers have gotten so powerful that they have captured our government and info including the media. Does that exist in Russia? What if Putin is trying to battle these financiers from taking over the money creation process in his country? What if these financiers already control the money stock in Russia? These are the most vital questions and THEY WERE NOT DISCUSSED HERE. Its the pink elephant in the room that no one acknowledges
+se7ensnakes , I;m glad some one explained the facts.
vagrant wanderer I did not explained the facts. I merely called attention to the problem
pedant.
vagrant wanderer Thats the problem people think that money is trivial.
***** The purpose of the federal reserve is to extract money from the public by using taxes to pay for the interest on the bonds which were purchased with counterfeit money.
The private commercial banks, on the other hand receive the Federal Income tax revenues and the interest on counterfeit money they lend.
The Federal Reserve is merely one of the many tools that the bankers use to extract money from the public. You end the fed and it wont mean much because the bankers are still creating 88% of the money in circulation.
the anti putin party debated on emotional grounds not on factual grounds and so did the 57% vote turn out to be of mostly emotional nature. there is no debate when facts are clear, which is that Putin is indeed good for Russia.
+Les Deplorables (ProjectVolatile) i also agree he a leader for his people, he not a nice person but he's respected across the globe from uk
Agreed, i didnt see any argument against what Putin has achieved for his people! He got rid of alot of corruption,broke up the Oligarchy rule! Nothing of what the opposition said has no basis.
Daniel McConnell he’s a nice person. What’s he done that’s not nice lol
Why are there so many stupid pro-Putin comments?
It’s funny how people get emotional about corruption, poverty and oppression. Totally irrational
The guy with guardian is a joke...can u imagine a secret service making a noticeable sound while listening to you?
Regardless? His people are happy...he shows more dignity than our loud mouth politicians!
He also uses political repression to shut up his critics, he's illegally occupied Crimea, he's occupied Abkhazia unlawfully, He's illegally occupied South Ossetia, and has contributed the rather egregious war crimes of Assad against his own people, but hey some chauvinistic Russians are happy so who cares right?
Everybody should note the fascist tactics. Even the position of both republicans and democrats by repeating until death what is their crime. Lying, stealing, selling at little to nothing other than topping the next headline our government which was created to secure our rights not endlessly stoke racist hate and fear. Moscow mitch isn't a loudmouth he's a foul, vile demon hugger. Leader pelosi had better consider how little the next election matters to US but loud mouth, no. Drumpf oh ya target destroyed. They also like Traitors, Corrupt, Anti-semites, racist fearmongers are the most vile, lazy of God's creation. The subtle, sneaky serpent who like republicans still has only one scam pride....republicans..voodoo economics and reassuring especially white men that they are tops then robbing them, their ancestors and their descendents endlessly.
Putin and Xi have the balls the West wishes their politicians have
The guys who were against Putin, no facts, nothing, some personal experience, just wow, weak debate.
I find interesting the following mentions by the first lady in the video:
Mihail Khodorkovski, "he's trajectory is pretty tipical, he took what he could without any moral qualms" by which she means that he bribed, exploited and blackmailed his way to obtaining state owned assets for his personal gain, typical for most russian oligharchs in the 90's.
One minute later however, she goes to say that in '98 he had a change of heart and became a good man, but he was arrested by evil Putin on charges of corruption
How does this work? Isn't the law supposed to punish by imprisonment the people who are guilty of corruption (which she herself admits, although covertly)?
Is the fact that he found jesus supposed to mean he is no longer guilty, and 8 years of catastrophic impact on russian economy should just be forgotten? Is that how judicial systems work in her mind? Why doesn't she suggest realese of regular criminals from prisons on the same basis?
Except for a few oligarchs he made every other Russian family was stolen from by Khodorkovski. He is hailed as a freedom fighter by the western business newspapers and that image was picked up by main stream media so his case is used as proof of political prisoners in Russia. He made Madoff like like a girl scout. He was a criminal in a highly violent criminal time, and was top dog criminal. If the west really wants to create heroes for propaganda purposes they sure picked a bad example. How does anyone with nothing, not even much education become a billionaire before 30 and the richest person in the world by 34 in a criminal dominated environment where there was no capital market for growing an investment? By being a good businessman? By having a good heart? All business in the early 90s was a criminal activity, it had to be since there was no banking or investment system to get money in any other way then stealing it. I guess the Khodorkovski worshipers just did not learn about life just after the USSR collapse. By going after the biggest crook, Putin drew a bright line in the sand "oligarchs, you can keep your ill-gotten gains since it would be too disruptive to the country to take it all away, but you cross the line from now on, this is how you will be treated" Suddenly the UK has a glut of former Russian gangsters living in London and Putin had the slack to right the ship. The prosecution of Khodorkovski was very popular with Russians who lived through that period. The people felt they finally had someone standing up for them. In many ways they were right.
Stan Jacox It always blows my mind how people suddently have tons of pity for some corrupt oligarch who got arrested. These kind of thieves and assholes shouldn't even get a trial.
Everyone in a communist state had income of roughly 100$/month. If you were caught with more it meant that you abused the law and you'd get thrown in jail. How can people who got 100$ become multi-billionares in the space of a few months being completely legal?
It gives me great joy to see these criminals in jail even if it's for political purposes. Why would you want these assholes in the oposition in the first place?
What really puzzled me is when I saw Garry Kasparov (whom I truly respect for his chess performance) being worried about Khodorkovsky's fate, and opposing his imprisonment.
Actually, the average income was about 400 Rubles a month just before the formation of the RF. The ruble was a non-convertable currency and was pegged roughly at the US dollar so for comparison, a typical mechanic and university professor earned about the same, about $400/month. It is hard to understand based on today's money value but $400 was solidly middle class which allowed savings, and financial security since costs of living were highly subsidized. A flight from Moscow to a Black Sea resort, some 2000 miles was about 6 rubles. A liter of gas for the car was about $0.06 in dollars of the time. The biggest complaint from the people was lack of choice in consumer products. The products that were offered were generally of lower quality than what was available from Japan or Germany at the time and the choices were limited to few models. Having the money to buy was not the problem, it was having something they wanted available for purchase.
Regarding the oligarchs, they were almost all, truly bad people who out bad-ass'ed everyone else in a very crime driven society that existed in the early Yeltsin years. Think Chicago late 1920s.....but much bigger with higher stakes.
By now, most of that money has been made legal by turning it over many times into progressively more legal business and foreign banks. So now, the majority of very wealthy in Russia are considered respectable by western observers who primarily measure the quality of a person by their wealth. So they can go anywhere and fit in with the elite in any society, since they share the same belief in money translates to entitlement and trumps all other human characteristics. Today, unless he got caught sleeping with under-aged boys, Al Capone would be welcome members of any Wall Street club or the 1%'ers based on wealth alone. Same with the pass given to the oligarchs who bought up much of London EU, UK and US corporations and sports teams. Putin is castigated for being the only leader to go after them even if in just a limited way. Each of those oligarchs have more influence over US foreign and domestic policy than all the mere citizens do. Yet half the posters are siding with the oligarchs who are doing real harm to them and the country.
***** You are right, just ask any older college professor or doctor, they made less but ones worth was based on level of education and accomplishment, not income. An artists or professor was esteemed by the community like rock stars are in the US. I have met few over 55 who would not want to return to the life they had in the Soviet era. They might be affected by nostalgia but looking at the lack of stress, how much time was spent on leisure and travel and month long holidays, it is hard to call them ignorant and misinformed.
There are all sorts of freedoms and the ones you have are usually taken for granted and the clamour is for those believed to be withheld. For the USSR there it was just assumed that everyone had freedom from unemployment, homelessness, lack of medical care or lack of funds to attend university. Those were a given but having 12 brands of refrigerators to choose from instead of 2, not being able to explore the world(most in the west assume it was due to Soviets being trapped in the USSR but in reality, few if any countries would give them a visa, the US sure would not until later when it was based on religion...Lautenberg Amendment). Yet in much of the world free higher education, medical care, full employment and lack of homelessness was only a dream that could be expected only after death and going somewhere religions promised was waiting for them. The countries in Europe and Scandinavia and parts of Asia which have long eclipsed American worker quality of life, borrowed more "freedom" concepts from the USSR than the USA. Those countries believe in fundamental worth of being a human is based on things other than how much money they control. For a Finn for example, the idea of not having access to high quality education because of poverty is unacceptable so they pay a bit more in taxes and assure that all have access, limited solely by ability. Same with medical care and retirement and strong, well maintained "commons". Life is just better in those countries regardless of their wealth. The concept of minimum wage is taken seriously as the amount needed to live modestly, comfortably and securely with only one job. Parents do not lay awake at night worrying what they would do if their lost their job or someone in the family got sick. Stress levels are MUCH lower in those highly civilized societies. No one asks the poor working mother of 3 kids in a US inner city what system she would prefer....
how benevolence of him to make a u-turn after his decades of rampant mercantilism ravaged countless f
homes. he's such a moral authority ....
The Putin guys appealed to logic and hard facts. The anti-Putin guys appealed to emotions and sad stories.
That's why anti-Putin won.
MrSakninsh
yeah and that is also why the Western civilisation will fall....we have become so immersed in our idealistic utopian view of thinking that we are not able to see the reality any more....but my dears, there are and will be nations, where people do not want our kind of democracy, because they know, it would only bring them destruction and suffering....Say, if democracy is the absolute good, why dont we go to China and force them to be democratic??? I wonder who would dare to do that...people are now happy in China even without democracy. Why? Its very simple, because they are taken care of, their middle class is growing, they are wealthier every day, their living standard is becoming quite comfortable and franky, it will be very soon BETTER than ours combined. The China's GDP is already catching up with the USA! And yea, even without democracy. They have wealth, growth, stability....they obviously dont want anything else, because they are afraid it would not become a democracy, but chaos.....and in fact, you will see very soon, what will happen with "democratic" Ukraine, you will have extreme poverty, chaos, mafia, rule of the oligarchs....Perhaps we should understand that not all people are the same and that democracy is not something that can be taught from outside. ....The very same is true for Russia. A great majority of Russians simply cannot handle democracy, it would destroy them. They are happy as they are - after all Putin was elected in a democratic elections, which means the majority of people simply want him to be their ruler. So are we now to dictate the majority of Russians that they cannot vote for a dictator, only because we dont find it right???? Isnt that simply stupid...BTW, even now Russia, China and BRICS are setting up their own rules, they are tired of the Western supremacy, they are tired of us forcing our ideas on them, they just want to develop in their own way and if they do not want western ideas like democracy, who are we really to force them to anything? I think the West will be surprised in the near future. Because the rest of the world is rising up against our monolithic view on their affairs. The West will be cornered and laughed at, because we are failing miserably with our democracy, while they (the East) will keep rising and growing even without it.... But it seems to me that the Western people were always like that, we always had to put our nose into other peoples affairs....in the times of the British empire, children in the Carribean were learning about the British history and complaining that it is not their history but the history of their colonisers....well and now we want to "colonise" other countries again, this time with our monopoly ideas and culture....well, sorry, they dont want it and soon they will show it to the stupid egoistic West, who still thinks it is a centre of the universe and has the only right for absolute truths.....sometimes I am really ashamed to be a Westerner...
The voting result has been rigged. That's why. The audience is no idiot.
Also the bullshit that there is no civil society or Ngo's ... he changed the law about their funding should be highlighted... i would say that's transparency .. every country has right to protect it's soverign democracy from fifth colulmn
so all the facts about the suppression of journalists and the fact that the Russian intelligence agency may have killed 200 people means nothing to you?
'fact' and 'may' don't really go together.
131.000.000.000 dollars have so far escaped from Russia since beginning of 2013.That's an advance payment of Crimea. Quite expensive for such a developing country. That nation can't stand this. 2017 will happen what happened 1917, hopefully peacefully this time.
The fact that they held a debate with journalists is laughable...sorry IQsquared but this was a poor debate
It was a great debate, however I wouldn't put any validation on the audience votes due to the setting being in the UK. It is no secret that the first thing comes to the mind in UK or in the USA when they hear of Russia...they think of Cold, Stalin, and Communism. These are 50s ERA propaganda that is constantly repeated in the Western Media about Russia. For those who moved beyond Cold War ideology, they will clearly see Russia has changed for the better from their tragic past.
Even the UK also benefit from the wealth of V. Putin leadership in Russia. Now the Question is, "Is Putin good for Russia?". Absolutely he is based on the raw numbers and stats provided by one of the speakers Boris. It is Ironic that those who have an issue with Russia are those who work in the media. Well, let's be fair. You have the right to contest V. Putin, however, Putin supporters also have a right to contest those who opposes him. Unless there is a clear evidence that V. Putin himself sent out people to harass his opponents and not private people who support Putin....then you have no claim to allege Putin for any acts. V. Putin also enforce the laws of Russia and under his Presidency, we see the accuser have their say in the court of law with a jury and a Judge who is either appointed by an elected legislator, or elected by the constituents of the region.
The question is not, "Do you like Putin or not", it is, "Is he good for Russia?". We can only see the progress and the views of Russian locals. They will say YES by a majority. I believe, those who still wear shades of 1950s Cold War will never forgive Russia and anyone who's in power. V. Putin should not be blamed for Russia history like we can not blame B. Obama for slaughtering of Native Americans. I think Russia will never forget it's history, but V. Putin wants to be his country #1, even if it doesn't fit with Nato, EU, or USA special interest.
he was undeniably good for russia I dont like him I dont like his curbing of freedoms but he has been good for russia
People come to listen to a debate, believe it or not. It’s a quaint custom they have in open, democratic countries
this Putin is like a badguy in the beginning but turns out to be a good guy at the end..respect for Putin
actually Putin is the badguy period. Hes sort of like Scaramanga but without charisma and an AK instead of a golden gun.
***** good thing there are billions in the world. Putin was like a piss in the ocean, disgusting but insignificant. Over the past 10 years however he has become the turd in the bathtub and must be dealt with before he fucks up anybody else's day.
***** but Putin is no better lol hes not getting rid of them hes just quietly bringing them onto his side. he made deals with a lot of the oligarchs so that they could keep their power exchange for support in his government. Not to mention that some people have become very wealthy businessmen in their own rite due to friendships with Putin. The only ones he seems to go after are those who wont strike a deal and then comes up with some bullshit excuse for going after them. Its a faked punch to convince the masses hes working against the oligarchs but really hes not. Do you really think that the oligarchs would just stand by while Putin took them down? they would have him killed lol the one group of people you really dont want to piss of if you run a country are the big businessmen and he hasn't hes just asked them to be quiet for a bit. If Putin is still alive in 10 years, Russia will be a dictatorship u can count on that one.
***** Actually i researched everything in my comment. But given this is the youtube comments section I did not realize u required oxford referencing -_- Its not like your comment contains any references to back up what your saying! Also it is INCREDIBLY naive to assume Putin (A politician) does not lie, hes just better at it is all. Finally I agree that dictatorship is a valid form of government (and assuming perfect leadership is probably the more efficient) but as with any government type its only as good as the people in power and Putin in power in a dictatorship would be a disaster for everyone. You claim bigotry and brainwashing but given that its mostly speculation on both sides and neither of us have provided references I could just as easily make the same claim about you.
Also on a side not your use of the Romans as an example is a terrible one, the Roman Republic lasted around 500 years from around 500BC to about 25BC it then became the Roman Empire (which was ruled by an Emperor) and when it was split it became the Western Roman Empire and the Eastern Roman Empire. The Western Empire fell and the Eastern didn't not because one was a "Roman Republic" but because factors such as religion and external enemies were having a bigger impact in the Western Empire than the Eastern add this together with flagging leadership and the collapse was almost unavoidable. It had nothing to do with government type.
***** Your history is messed up i wud have thought u wud have used Google before replying, all u have to type in is "Split of the Roman Empire" or "Fall of the Roman Empire" rome.mrdonn.org/twoempires.html, www.historylearningsite.co.uk/fall_of_ancient_rome.htm, The HRE was formed some 400 years after the Western Empire fell. Yes religion there was more objection to Christianity in the Western half of the Empire this causes civil unrest coupled with attacks from the Huns and Goths and agricultural downturns. Both the Western and the Eastern Empires had an Augustus. The main point is Western Rome was an autocracy at the time of its downfall not a Republic. So no your example of Western Rome falling to demonstrate the futility of democracy is not a good one.
Yes actually they can. "Too many people fighting for power is destabilizing and wherever a ruller dies - another war was waiting" You are aware this basically describes nearly every Autocracy ever right?
As an american I dont care about foreign policy, if we had a president that gave us those numbers I would change the rules for him to stay in office too.
gtfo
Fuckoff peasant
Damn straight. Totally agree. Right now, we have the worst of both worlds. It's simply the illusion of freedom. 1/4 of all the prisoners in the world are in the US. We know how much of a Police State we have simply from watching videos on UA-cam of police officers executing people and then getting paid vacations, while they are "investigated." (Found innocent of all wrong-doing of course.)
These guys who are cursing at you are completely delusional. At least the Russian system is honest. They don't BS themselves into thinking they have freedoms they don't, nor do they think someone like Sarah Palin, the half term governor of Alaska, would make a "great" president. Truly insane.
Donald Miller Sarah Palin for president was a joke right? ha ha ha! that woman is hilarious... like the one without brains, Hillary...
***** Palin was not without brains. Personally, I can't stand her. But she's a brilliant opportunist. In way over her head when it comes to national or international politics, but not stupid--unless you consider someone getting herself in over her head stupid, which very well could be.
Hilary is the smartest person we have going for us. If anyone can't see that, they're simply blinded by partisanship.
Hilary "we came, we saw, he died" Clinton is, however, a cold-blooded killer, and we've had enough of that sort.
"Corrupt"? Propaganda! Putin is awesome. Long Live Vladimir Putin.
20th Century ikr. Helping poor Palestinians against the bullies. He’s done literally nothing either to provoke war. Just news exaggerating
The minute they bought on Masha Gessen , I switched it off . And then I read the notes below .OMG ... National Geographic ahs lost all its credibility as far as I'm concerned ..
Agreed on Masha Gessenn but the first chap was even worse. No debate worthy of the name. The second person pro the proposition at least gains some traction. Waste of my time and anyone else’s too.
about "raiding of NGOs" and "independent media":
sept 2012 Gessen became director of the Russian service of the US funded Radio Liberty. later that month, 35 journalists were fired with immediate effect. Several others resigned in protest, and the events were heavily criticized by NGOs. Gessen's associates were hired to replace some of those fired. In dec 2012 RL president Steven Korn resigned. Gessen, said then that "her dismissal was impossible"; she resigned (was fired?) 4 months later...
Vladimir Putin is a phenomenon, a charismatic politician, one can not find his equal, whether you're looking to the left or right, up or down, forward or reverse!
All hail the God on earth! When will I get my cheque?
hahahahha 2023
As of 05/21/23, the arguments favoring Putin, did not age well at all.
The fourth guy is really funny. I wonder who would ever take him for serious with this kind of talking.
He is grate for Russia! While Mr.Putin is alive and well Russia is in good hands.
I agree and the sooner he invades Ukraine to restore normal levels of poverty, oppression, racism and homophobia the better. I don’t know why people take against him- especially when they find out how he responds to criticism
@@jontalbot1 lol
@@jontalbot1 omg 😂😂 on point
The first guy just bullshits until the 13th minute. And then he just sits down!
So he improve the standard of living and that's bad? Bad guy.
so the whole suppression of journalists and enriching his cronies means nothing to you?
Stephen Amorino At least they have journalists.
Now, almost two years later, after so many 'bad things' happened, and so many people were killed, lost their property etc. it is quite interesting to look at both parties faces. It is like a lesson of understanding who is a liar and who is an honest person.
Now even more so
Political prisoners How about Julian Assange?
Haha, wtf was that random Italian Guy! haha!!
LONG LIVE MR: PUTIN!!!
Give that man a job in the Mafia/Government/FSB. It’s all the same so it doesn’t matter
Need a 2.0 version of this debate
Need a 3.0 !!
I'm anti-Putin and I still would vote for the proposition...
This aged like an open sardine can.
Know the truth comes from those who have benefited from his actions.
There is the Russian citizen are best qualified to judge his actions..
I lived in Russia 1993 -1997 then 2006 -2011. I have many stories. I lived in USA for 21 yrs. I have 8 yrs in Active Military Service. I have greater FEAR OF USA/UK THAN I OF RUSSIA. That fear is for my Children. I am afraid of the Western world. I believe Putin is good for Russia!!
Do you really? Like millions of others l guess. I bet those people in Eastern Ukraine are terrified of a US invasion
How about now Douglas?
@@JV79786 lol. He writes like english is his 3rd language or something.
Putin's way is the only option for Russia if it doesn't want to become a US-colony. Cooperation with Russia and Putin makes much more sense (economically and politically) for Europe than allow USA to involve Europe in various (US-produced) conflicts in the former CIS-countries.
Either way, I think it's about time he goes..
Now Putin's Russia is an example of how to run a successful capitalist country! Thank you Putin.
Now Putin’s Russia is an example of how to wreck your military and your economy in just a few short months!
I'm getting turned off by the opening speaker. (Glib, affected and talking too fast though also long-winded). I'm hanging on grimly hoping the next speaker will be more compelling.
ohh, she lost her job, big deal, statistics says otherwise..
As if in america people don't loose job on basis of political views ... she's alive and raging like lunatic against putin is testement to freedom in russia
vikeyz1 Russia, where blind allegiance is the strongest factor in obtaining and retaining employment.
@@paidrussiantroll1305 it is the same in the US
The ones against were very irrelevant
FROM 28:20 COMES THE BEST, THE MOST DECENT AND HONEST SPEECH...
the USSR was poorer because they had to spend budget on military because allies were a threat
Whenever the lady stutters she lying lol
Pitiful how "Small" a scale people think.
The lady who is a presenter in radio station of Moscow talking abt not having free speech says it all.
Yea, so, even 10 years ago when this was done, they must have re-defined the connotations of "good." Socrates should have been there and turned this into an exercise in epistemology.
Each country gets what it deserves!
No one deserves Tony Blair. How did he get in power?
Not true. No one ‘deserves’ to experience what goes on in Myannmar for example. If you think it for more than 10 seconds you will realise what a horrible thing this is to say
@@jontalbot1 That may not always be the case, but very often it is.
I remember exactly what Boris is describing!!!
This hasn't aged well😅
About phone "bugging" you know what's worst? NSA watching your every move. Phone, internet and you name it.
At 1:07, one of the guests tells exactly why you and many others are drawing the wrong conclusion imo. I'm also no fan of Putin's regime, and definitely not of his person, but Russia has faired well under them.
Furthermore, "for the motion" shows facts and numbers, while "against the motion" mostly plays on emotions with stereotypical stories and fails to adress the points made by the other side.
I think it was a clear victory for for the motion.
she has completely taken leave from her sense
Where is the question mark on the title ?
Good debate. I knew virtually nothing about issues related to Russia and Putin.
Sad and gloomy days awaits us all when someone like Putin is praised in this manner.
These "inelligent" debates are joke xD
Putin the Great!!!
nice unbiased description.
This really turned into a poll of the audience to see which they value more - economic prosperity or political freedom. Interesting thing though... people who are economically comfortable don't typically rise up for political reforms.
I wonder if there's a Russian NSA recording every email, text, chat, phone call etc, and storing them forever
Moderator got a little testy after first opening statements...
Luke Harding - Yes; Boris Jordan - No
All I hear is facts on one side, feelings on the other. Anecdotes aside, having spent time living in Moscow, most Russians I talked to either approve or are indifferent of Putin. We tend to see this quite a bit on these intelligence squared debates, unfortunately, sob stories by one side and factual/rigorous arguments from the other.
The part about most Russians approving of Putin is a lie.
You clearly either didn’t listen or understand the debate if you just heard “feelings” on one side. In which case your opinion doesn’t matter.
@@andrewwells6323 I also wonder if that dude that still thinks Putin is a force for good in the world now...
both are right and it's impossible to reconcile
I am for him myself
I agree!
Two great arguments for and two poor ones against. In fact both sides should discuss most vital social, geopolitical and economic issues, not petty ones. Peace!
When Gessen says "Independent" media......wink wink....you KNOW what she means...right ?
The voting is lovely
Reminds me of a joke:
If you are voting for, put a checkmark next to your name, if against, put an x.
People with no gratitude deserve to be fired.
45:31 haha, how many films is he going to cite?...
lol this aged like milk
The otcome of the vote has already been manipulated from the very beginning by anouncing the polls before the discussion started.
People tend to believe what the majority believes because what the majority believes must be right.
So the vote of the voters was already biased by that announcement.
No the idea is to see if, having heard the arguments, people change their minds. I realise openness and debate are rare commodities in some places but try to understand
Oh, how I loathe 'The Dancing Bear' ! (metaphorically speaking, of course)
It's an interesting video.
I’m pleased to read so many intelligent views, common sense views. There is hope.
Really an evaluation of what is good for a community or country should be based upon the values of those in the country, thus it needed to establish what many or most Russians want of the country and if he has delivered it.
My fav part is when the Putin supports say. The peoples most basic needs must be taken care of first even before politics and I agree. They were starving, being oppressed and it seems Putin has helped usher in a age of middleclass. In the USA our middle class is diminishing and small businesses are punished through heavy taxes and there is always a law suit or civil rights zombie around every corner to tell you how or when you can run a business and whom you must conduct business with. I like the emotion I hear in the male speakers voice after that creature female traitor left. And yet the man came with facts not just his emotions. The woman mentioned how you can't protest and yet in the USa people can run feral and lawless and call it a protest when it's a ruthless dangerous riot. I think we could use a little law and order here in the USA to make it illegal to destroy a person's business and say it's a political protest. But here non European Americans get more legal leeway when it comes to harming citizens, their businesses and their children under the guise of "protest". I don't understand how is that a legal protest? And what I say is facts that can be proven, it's not just opinion. But in a age of less free speech in the USA I still may get backlash.
This is the most incredible debate of one of my favorite subjects I regard highly important I have yet seen. I do thank the uploader for sharing this with the UA-cam community :)
My God, I've just read Masha Gessen's biography. All I can say is thank God she moved to the US. It seems that the US has become a magnet for the trash of the world.
Sez the LAK????, The Usurper????, The Lake Erie Sneak????, Aaron Rdgers????.
The FACTS are simple and clear - Putin is the BEST thing that has happened to Russia EVER. However,what is good for Russia is not necessarily good for Britain and these is a British crowd actually voting for what is good for Britain - and definitely a successful,Independent and strong Russia - which is what Russia has beecome since Putin - is not considered good for Britain and the West
gerald geaf Putler has made a mess of Russia - I am afraid to walk in town at night now.
PaidRussianTroll I am afraid to walk in London at night,blacks are terrified to even go into their local shop all across America,etc. Whats your point?
gerald geaf Why are you afraid to walk in London at night? Why do you live there? What is wrong with you? Either clean the place up or move. Don't you have a brain? And who told you millions of Americans are afraid to walk to their local shop? Did anyone tell the movie theatres, the bowling alleys, the concert arenas and dance clubs, the evening Churches the shopping malls, etc, that the people patronizing their establishments are zombie ghosts? Please, have RT produce another segment; the word hasn't gotten out.
PaidRussianTroll
Treyvon Martin who wasnt afraid to walk to his local,see what happened to him?
+gerald geaf Treyon Martin was shot by an idiot. What that has to do with Putler invading Ukraine only a fool would know. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Trayvon_Martin
Why the hell would she reject it anyway. What did she expect lol
Very poor debate. The main proposers for and against should not be asked to speak again, useless.
The two pro Putin both gave away the real truth in thier final some up. They admitted Russia was a young democracy.And hinted mistakes have been made.Both became a little bit more honest and realistic about the Putin years. And thier body language tells you they knew they were wrong.
Russian/American lesbian Jew is being asked to be objective about anything Russian What a joke.!
+Thomas Mann Russia = always jealous of West.
+PaidRussianTroll Russia has always detested the west. The West can not be trusted to adhere to any political or economic agreement as history shows.Concomitant with our unreliable behavior we always managed to elect unwholesome and deviant people as our leaders.In the West men are marrying men , doctors perform late term and partial term abortions ,young people are being taught " situational ethics" i.e. nothing is right or wrong -it all depends on a situation. To top it all off our blood lines are being diluted by North Africans , Mexicans and Middle Easterners destroying what remains of Western culture in the process.What is there to be envious of ?
antisemetic, antiamerican, homophobic, and close minded all in one, even if rather run-on, sentence!
Such sophisticated writing ability inded...
Proud of it.
third guy has a fear of public speaking. i can relate, even if i know everything im going to say super well and know logically there is no reason to have nerves, even in front of a small audience ill start kinda shaking in my voice and hands slightly and my voice gets higher like i need a drink of water, exactly on the level of that guy.
i didn't recognise that at all from Boris Jordan. He looked pretty confident to me. Perhaps you're projecting?
Jonathan Freedland has said "Er" about 50 times in the first couple of minutes introduction.
Putin did save Russia from falling apart like him or not hes got some balls
Check ruble rate
Check inflation rate
Check growth of Russian economy
Check level of salaries and pensions
Check media freedom rate
Check corruption rate
Check unequality
Check level of justice system
And shame as a world gratest underacchiever.
u must be an average American
who eats a lot of propaganda!
Acording of peace : let s be friends ?:
An interesting debate tainted by personal vendetta.
So what do you think?
Boris is 100% Correct!!
1. Russia’s sovereign Reserve Fund dries up after several years of budget deficit
What happened:
Russia’s sovereign Reserve Fund, which was built up over the years with profits from oil exports, is empty and has ceased to exist, the Finance Ministry announced on Tuesday. The Russian government still has $65 billion in a second sovereign fund to cover planned budget shortfalls, but it might not last long.
Russia started saving money in the period when oil prices were high, between 2000 and 2011, on the initiative of Alexei Kudrin, Putin’s most trusted liberal economist and Finance Minister. At its high point in September 2008, the Reserve Fund held $142 billion.
By 2014, when oil prices had plummeted and Western sanctions had put an end to economic growth, there was only $87 billion left. Budget shortfalls grew from 0.5 percent of GDP in 2014 to 3.5 percent in 2016 and ate up the remaining reserves.
Russia still has $65 billion in the National Wealth Fund (NWF). It was established in 2008 to help finance Russian pensions, but was actually used to fund government-backed investment projects. Now this $65 billion is the only fund left to cover budget deficits, estimated at $21.8 billion in 2018.
Oil prices are rising again. On Thursday, Brent broke through $70 for the first time since 2014. This gives reserves a chance to recover. In 2018, the Finance Ministry is planning to purchase $35 billion of foreign currency reserves, which could go to the NWF.
Spending, however, is also increasing, as the government is coming up with costly projects in the run-up to the presidential election.
Why the world should care:
The reserve funds are a backup for the riskier parts of state budget spending, like international military operations.
I thought this debate was terrible. I came in "slightly" on Putins side, but I really didn't know if he was good or bad. After watching this video I still have this question.