That stupid ass trope is just for emo teens who say stupid shit about society then say “ but it’s because people don’t like me “ STFU , nobody will like you for that exact reason
I feel like this is also the same kind of argument for when some villains are just fleshed out in general. It doesn’t even have to only be about trauma necessarily. Just because a villain may have a lot of character development, it doesn’t automatically mean they’re not a villain
The fact that Killmonger tried to incite a war after becoming king rather than use Wakanda's immense resources to help those in poverty (like where he grew up) should tell you everything you need to know about his true priorities.
That's why Jiraiya is King. Ill carry his lessons thru life. "Just because we've experienced pain isn't an excuse to perpetuate it. In fact, it's a reason to do better."
Why would he care if the society basically worship his father as god in all but name (second to only allmight) ?? I wont say that shit he did is right but he does care for something .Just not the world as a whole
@@theoneglorylucky3071 Sure he cares for something but it's inexcusable because of how he acts. If Dabi only killed purely for the mission he'd still be wrong but significantly less so. The moment he kills people basically because it's fun to him is where you can pretty much throw the whole misunderstood angle away
@@theoneglorylucky3071 it's mostly because endeavor never went public about his abuse & how he basically only had his family for a petty reason. kid Touya straight up called his mom a "whore" purchased only for endeavor's dream
@@shadowki5687 dude he has his father basically try to live by proxy with him as a substitute .Combining with the fact that he admiring his father and like every child would do .He try to copy him .He would be viewing his mother as an air at best and a breeding mare at worst base on his father attitude toward her .
A girl told me that Kilmonger was just fighting for civil rights. I was like, “trying to steal advanced tech to kill a bunch of people isn’t fighting for civil rights.”
I mean, how not? If people are willing to fight to keep you deprived of your rights, why shouldn't you also fight to have them? If a fight is serious, people are usually going to die along the way.
Are you talking Tony Stark before he became Ironman? He did not care about anyone but himself. Not even about his close friend Rhody. He was making weapons of mass destruction, and having a great time living it up. Thor was the same way. Just justifing his acts to feed his own ego and grow his fame. Oden says as much.
@@BIGFRANKOL75 Thor is a warrior and was raised by Odin lol he literally raised Three bad kids and luckily saved Thor before he when too far like Hela or Loki
"You think you're entitled to everything just because you've suffered, but suffering isn't enough. You can't just be strong, you have to be smart. You can't just be deserving, you have to be worthy. But all you have ever been is a *BLOODY MIGRAINE!*" -Watts, RWBY Volume 8
Cinder: Had a bad childhood. Became a power stealing nut with a complex. Adam: Abused and branded by humans. Became a terrorist who kills anyone that gets in his way. Salem: Lost her lover and cursed with immortality. Became a manipulative omnicidal witch and the closest thing to the devil. The Brothers: Sees Salem tricked a bunch of humans to kill them. Kills everyone, abandons Remnant and breaks the moon.
“Say it with your chest for the people in the Back Bro” Dabi was ready to murk Men, Women and children with no remorse what so ever even one’s that had nothing to do with him or his ‘cause’
He don't even really care about the league like the other members do either, he's just using them as a means to an end. Literally zero redeeming character traits
He's a psychopath who doesn't care about anyone but himself and would do anything to kill anyone and won't give any shits hell he even kill his entire family if he wanted.
I remember someone said something along the lines of, "Heroes go through trauma, and want to protect everyone so that they don't experience that trauma. Villains go through trauma, and want the whole world to experience their trauma so they can be understood"
Sometimes. Soemtimes villain go trough trauma and also want to protrct everyone from expereince that trauma. Is that their methods are just extremly questionable. For example in one of the Fate series the villain plan want to get rid of human desire. In his mind if humans have no ambition World Peace could be accomplish.
@@SavantPete its us vs them mentality .Which stem from the fact that most people turn a blind eye on the cruelty that occur .Make them complicit in the eyes of the victim .Thus they become one of the enemy.Hell they usually join in too if anything
@@Magnet_Chaos Shirou Tokisada Amakusa. Guy had a point, but his method was stupid. I already came up with about ten other solutions to get a better result for the people while achieving exactly what he wanted.
Dabi is even worse, because when Endeavor and his wife understood that Dabi's flames would kill him, they tried to make him stop. In fact, the trauma from having him burn himself up is probably a good portion of why Endeavor was emotionally distant from the whole family in addition to being abusive.
Exactly, It's an actual plot point That the entire reason endeavor had more kids was to discourage touya Endeavor and rei definitely could have handled it much better But endeavor never abused dabi,infact touya trying to kill shoto is what led to the abused shoto had to face and him being seperated from the other kids
@@kannan07but somehow people spin the narrative that Endeavor abuse towards his children was psychological, and somehow was way way worse than any physical stuff he could have done (for real if you didn’t watch My hero and stumbled upon those haters in forums you would think Endeavor graped his wife and kids on the daily seeing as how he is vilified).
@@togucvinw7 those people are basically the IRL natsu Manipulated by unjustified hate lmfao,like how touya basically manipulated natsu into hating endeavor Like,what endeavor did to shoto is definitely not justified But the way people put is so fvcking wrong and villianising(idk if that's a word) foor no reason
@@togucvinw7 ong. People talking about how dabi needs a hug because the whole family abused him. Here I'm thinking, did we even read the same manga? A person acknowledged this on tumblr and reddit, WITH MANGA PANELS AS EVIDENCE, yet people still insisted endeavor never cared about his family at all. him buying a separate house for his family, sending his wife flowers, and being more concerned for her well-being than his own when she visited him wasn't enough to convince these people. All this while people stan worser fathers in anime because they look like young kpop idols.
@@TSH425 I will never say that people need to not hate Endeavor or even lay off of him because he’s trying to do better, because the thing that finally made him realize he’s a pos is that he thinks he has to be like All Might since he’s taken his Number 1 spot, and only then does he reflect on his behavior. Only when he has to compare himself to a fucking paragon, does he think he’s done something bad.
@@Toshi-vu1hh fr tho the only time he even thinks he did smth wrong is when he gets what he always wanted and that's cause he got it in a way he "didnt want" so he was fine with getting the num 1 spot by abusing his kids but not cause all might retires? Is this guy serious he rather abuse his kids than let all might retire and take his place that shits crazy to me
I love the idea killmonger being the imbodment of if a village rejects a child he will burn it down to feel its warmth... but he did have a god complex still one of my favorites tho
Good characters don't have to good people; in the same vein, just because you like a character doesn't mean they have to be a good person. A lot of people want to humanize villains because they don't want to like the bad guy
More like having a trauma or bad childhood doesn't make you a likeable villain. I mean, take RWBY. Compare the amount of people that like Salem and Neopolitan. Most of these people will like them because there are genuinelly tragic backstories and traumas that, while not justifying them, makes you sympathize on some level or at very least comprehend WHY they're evil/insane. Compare that to the amount of people who like Cinder Fall, who was an abused child slave. Most of people who like Cinder are the "Wow, she's HAWT" or "YAY, gIrL pOwEr", and use the cliché backstory to pretend she's suddenly well-written. Salem's insanity is comprehensible and justified because her origin story is the story of every woman who ever got their lives destroyed by a god in Greek Mythology. Cinder Fall is an edgy, poorly-written Azula expy.
I like tragic characters who don't justify their actions by tragedy and just do their own shit like Able from SCP. The dude was screwed by his brother,the scarlet king, and the daevites yet never let it define ot justify his fucked up actions dude just killed and murdered with a code of honour.
@@DeathMessenger1988 "Salem's insanity is comprehensible and justified because her origin story is the story of every woman who ever got their lives destroyed by a god in Greek Mythology." WHAT?! All her problems are 100% her own damn fault. She was told no. Went behind one God's back to get what she wants. Got caught lying and was punished for it. Actively tried to get the God's killed by the rest of humanity. Then got punished even harder.
@@RJLiams I mean come on though. All she wanted was her boyfriend, the person who saved her from her oppressive father who locked her in a tower, back and was told bringing ONE person back would throw off the “balance”. It’s not like he died of natural causes either, he just got sick. Who wouldn’t be pissed? Not to mention they still brought him back later only to plot against her. Imagine starting a war to destroy the creatures who denied you happiness, they kill everyone but you, and sentence you to walk the world alone for centuries. After all that strife the gods caused over ONE person, they end up bringing him back anyway, only to have him stand against her when all she ever wanted was to see him again. How would you feel?
I actually realised that Dabi wasn't treated that badly. Endeavour realised pretty early on that Dabi was hurting himself, and tried to help him stop. Dabi was just obsessed with it. Much more obsessed than even his father. Endeavour tried to actually protect Dabi, even before Todoroki was born.
The way I see it is that endeavor thought that toya was good enough to become number 1 and the both of them were happy but when endeavor found out toya was hurting himself far worse than he thought from using his quirk he tried constantly to stop toya but he just wouldn’t stop and mixed with his obsession to beat all might with endeavor’s care for Toya’s safety endeavor thought the only way to get Toya to stop was by staying away from him and making shoto but Toya inherited endeavor’s obsessive personality trait that caused the problem if both endeavor and Toya got some counseling to help them deal with their issues it could have helped to prevent what happened
Dabi is honestly worse than Endeavor. At least Endeavor KNOWS he can't make up for what he did, so he tries his best to be a hero regardless. Dabi kills people just because lol
Dude did a great job of explaining the whole point behind Killmonger. Killmonger was clearly designed to be likable on a surface level, but I always felt his actions were meant to be proof of how truly evil and toxic he was.
Exactly but ppl really walked away from that movie with "He's gonna treat them how they treated us" Like bruh it was wrong when they did it why dafaq would it be OK now that he's doing it??????
In all fairness he was trained to kill people. That was the whole point of all of those markings. Of course he was deranged but he was a great representation of a Black American. Black man because of his anger, American for his greed. Black folks related with the anger, no one seemed to acknowledge the American in him.
While Dabi does bad things because of his backstory, at least he had a reason to do these things. BAKUGO ON THE OTHER HAND, will remain one of the most overrated characters. He had no reasoning to do the things he did. He literally suicide baited, bullied and abused Deku for OVER A DECADE AND PEOPLE STILL DEFEND HIM. People will shame endeavour for what he did to Dabi and Todoroki (and the family overall) but no one will shame Bakugo for attacking a quirkless person who couldn’t defend himself at all. Both cases are abuse.
People just shame endeavour cause he hurt todoroki. People only like him for his looks. Bakugo is only popular because of his looks. His personality is literally telling people to die 50% of the time he’s on screen. And then it’s either being cocky or abusive. That is one of the worst and most annoying personalities someone could have. Dabi’s actions aren’t justified but Bakugo should literally be suspended and never be able to be a hero again. (He attacked someone who he knew couldn’t fight back and told them to kill themselves simply because they didnt have a quirk which is something out of control.) If Deku decided to kill himself, he could’ve literally been responsible for a murder. If Deku didn’t try save him, Deku would’ve probably given up on his dreams and killed himself meaning he would be responsible for that. He’s lucky Deku did that. The worse part is, he shouted at Deku instead of saying thanks to him for trying to save his life. Ungrateful, annoying, overrated, hateful and unjustified.
This... it is an explanation not a excuse for bad behavior. U dont get a free pass due to ur bad experiences. Lot of people in the world r suffering as much as u if not more. We understand why u a t like that but we cannot accept it and u should stop is what we should tell everyone.
I love the kind of villain who's just an absurdly evil bastard with a super tragic backstory, but then it's casually revealed they aren't even motivated or even affected by there tragic backstory, they're just insane.
I think they did that with the villain in the second How to Train Your Dragon movie. Dragons killed his village, but he's been a dragon-enslaving raider for so long that he doesn't even dwell on his lost loved ones anymore. He's just doing what he does now for power.
Demon Slayer seem to handle this well. Tanjiro sympathize with the demons, but that doesn't stop him from doing his job and sending them to a not so nice place.
@@zer0_iz_d34d Yeah, after all Guts and his circle of friends and loved ones have been through, he has lost all fs to give. Any villain sob story sounds like petty bs to him.
It's so surprising because Naruto and killer B had almost every right to be villains or destroy the village but they chose to live with that pain and neglect.
Basically every jinchuriki besides Gaara who was literally made to become who he was as genin could have turned into a villain. The mizukage was controlled behind the scenes
Arcane fans be like: Jinx is an anti hero because of her trauma! Jinx's actions: -Committing friendly fire because she mistook an enemy for her sister. -Luring four cops into a burning building and then blowing them up. -Killing a bird. -Suicide Bombing her friend. -Kidnapping her sister's lover. -Tying up her sister and her father figure. -Killing her father figure. -Nuking the capital. Yeah......real anti-hero right here........
Isn’t piltover an elitist, oppressive city that basically thrives on Zauns suffering? I don’t feel bad for them. Hell, I don’t even feel bad for Vi or her girl. I feel bad for Ekko though. Having to fight someone you know you can’t save and who you still love is tragic.
@@deangelosummers7717 Piltover is an elitist oppressive nation, yeah but at the same time, Jinx's actions only increase that elitism. Not stop it. It's like how a police force gets increased when there is more crime.
@@gimmeyourrights8292 I get your reasoning. It’s sound, but at the same time, to those at the lower end of the scale with nothing to lose, it wouldn’t make a difference. They were being policed heavily and disregarded already. What? A few more cops come into your city and create even more hostility between the two parties? At best that leads to more firelights(Except they’re against piltover now) and at worse another Jinx.
People need to realise. Just because a villain have a good point it doesn't mean they are justified. Villains are villains in the first place. They are motivate by selfish desire, and they intetional harming others.
Dio is the prime example, bro was given a second chance to be great and he wasn't satisfied with that. HE WANTED TO ELIMINATE AN ENTIRE BLOODLINE AND EVEN AFTER DYING HE BASICALLY GROOMED SOMEONE TO KILL THEM.
spoilers for part 7: His pettiness also transends time and space, twice. IMO Deigo was a better person overall than DIO, which doesn't say much, but Deigo from another World was just actual cowboy DIO that readers would suspect Scary Monsters Deigo to be.
@@killermothxd4085 yeah sam and miyagi do was wrong for attacking cobra kai at the arcade first but they started that shit by causing trouble and messing with one of their own and tory and cobra kai then break into sams house afterwards and the place ends up trashed
It's because the moment we find sympathy or a good point about a villain, we cling to it. On the other hand, if a good person shows a problem, we can hate on them more.
Hating on a hero for their flaws vs loving a villain despite the horrible things they do I kinda understand it but not necessarily agree with it. It’s because people prefer it (even me sometimes) when the main characters are easy to root for. But they can make a villain as nasty as they want, either their so evil you hate them, or they have some kind of entertaining charm to them
I see this with Batman and his villains. People see Batman as someone who beats on the poor people, and see those mass-murdering villians as just that, poor people. Not just mass murders, corrupt assassins, killers, rapist, people that would sadistically kill you if you ever pulled that “your just misunderstood” talk on them.
@@anotherrandomguy8871 it makes the argument that Batman beats on poor people even dumber when some of his enemies are literally rolling in money for example and honestly the easiest example The Penguin
@dantesparrow9903 you cannot tell me that batman in the video games didn't beat the ever loving fuck outta some poor random henchmen, like I get they did bad stuff but some of them just steal a car and get their entire skeletal system rearranged
To be fair, Dio was a scumbag from the earliest point we've seen him chronologically. No even remotely good person kicks a dog full force and then fries that dog alive.
I don't think anyone sees him as misunderstood, he's just a charismatic, intelligent mad man who delights in the shit he does. If someone *actually* says he's misunderstood they haven't seen all of his appearances in jojo
I feel like this is because writing an ACTUALLY misunderstood villain is really hard. The difference is that the actually misunderstood villain has a point which, when events are viewed from their point of view, explain their actions and make them make sense While the "misunderstood" villain has a sad backstory/motive that makes you feel sorry for them or make you think they have a point, that still doesn't excuse their actions
I personally disagree. I don’t think it’s that hard to write a misunderstood villain. What I think is actually the hard part is when fans or other individuals self insert their own intentions onto the character. It’s as if some people think they know more about the character than the creator(s) themselves
The perfect character is Dracula from Castlevania. He did what he did because religious zealots killed his innocent wife. And even after giving them a full year to make up for what they did, they instead celebrate her death. Even a DEMON going into a church abandoned by God tells the Priest that God never wanted that for that woman. And the Priest only killed her because she threatened his power, not because she was witch.
@@CoOlKyUbI96 Holy shit. That's exactly it. I bet every Dabi stan had an abusive parent and they self insert themselves into Dabi, and their abusive parents into Endeavor.
I just watched a video about that Adult Swim short "Opal", and this quote from it pretty much sums up this kind of "you all need to suffer for what happened to me" mindset: "Our adversaries are in denial. They don't know the wrong that they do. And they never repent how I want them too."
This was is probably why Zuko is a great character. Like yeah his life sucked, but he never got a free pass to be a dick. Even when he wanted to join the Gaang, he had to earn their trust.
Lowkey kinda wish Todoroki said "it's your quirk not his" in his fight with Dabi as he was pushing the blame on Endeavor for everything. For Deku to Todoroki it was "it's your quirk not his, you are free to use it to it's full extent." But from Todoroki to Dabi it would mean "it's your quirk not his, you're the one who used it to harm others and now you need to pay the price."
It’s even worse when movies/shows expect the audience to sympathize with villains who commit genocide and mass murder and every horrible crime imaginable, but when the bully Chad gives a wedgie to the mc he’s beyond redemption.
Nothing made me laugh harder than when it was revealed that Dabi was a horrible sibling, after all the years fans spent gaslighting eachother into believing that he was a caring big brother lmao
@@painvillegaming4119 I know right. And don’t get me started on those theories where all for one is deku dads. Which might bad on its own but now I see people acting like that makes it all ok because “YoU CaN’t cHoOsE YOur FaMiLy” because disown a family member definitely isn’t possible.
@@iamcat1797Those people don't understand that "Blood is thicker than water" is actually "Blood of the covenant is thicker than water of the womb". Aka your family doesn't mean shit compared to the people you CHOOSE to be with.
Same , I hate the whole “ he just misunderstood “ shit , I mean you mightest well apply that to real life people huh, that’s right. You can’t because It doesn’t make sense
"BUt tHeY aR qIuTEeE" idiotic people that defend psychos. And yeah they do it with real life people, look up there is crazy people (mainly girls) defending and sayong how cute serial killers or school shooters were, hell a few years back there was a case like that.
Exactly, this is why Endeavor went up in my opinion, because it's so rare having a hated character go through an actual redemption arc. Honestly, this might be my favorite part of the anime, bc other animes would have him say "sorry" and then everyone would forgive him in under five minutes.
They can have the saddest back story, and I can have the utmost pity for them, but there is a point where it goes from "Yeah, they just messed up cause of they past" to "Nah, this bitch straight evil"
@@maadtee6281 her quirk isn't forcing her to kill people it's not like a vampire situation where she needs to consume blood she literally chooses to do it
It's honestly a great point in writing to make. Have a character with a tragic backstory that's just straight up evil to prove that no matter the circumstances, no matter your past, your actions are utterly and entirely your own
@@Sn0wyChad you always have a choice. Doesn't matter what the circumstances are. You can either choose to be good or to be bad. Even if being good means that unfavorable things will happen. Doesn't mean it's sound logic, but the facts still remain
Actually by far Dabi had it the best he was just desperate to prove to his dad he could handle his own fire. Bro is actually a self made villain cuz Endeavor even tried to stop him didn't put any pressure on him to be the strongest once he realized he couldn't handle his own fire.
Even more so when his actual backstory comes out and his father tried stopping him before Fuyumi was born (possibly after her but before Natsuo), which would mean he was 4 or 5 at the oldest. Then spent the next 8-9 years burning himself despite his family trying to stop him (minus that time he tried to murder his infant brother)
Pet peeve of mine is when someone calls someone else with trauma "broken". Do people understand how it would feel for a person to think that they're "broken" in some way? People who have been through traumatic experiences aren't broken like some toy. They have just been through ordeals.
Of all the children endeavour had I think he treated Dabi the best like he genuinely didn't want Dabi to hurt him self and he wanted Dabi to actually be a child
I mean he kinda doesn’t we see in BP2 white people want to steal and are willing to break laws to get things. And he had a point Wakanda sat back while wars and starving Africans died? And Wakanda couldn’t even offer food as aid not even technology? They are able to cure disease deemed incurable but they choice not to because they’re selfish? No killmonger had a point 1000%
@@storysurgeon5922 he’s more Lawful evil than Neutral. He followed established ideas like rule of law, Justice, and tradition but without compassion. Technically the only two crimes he committed the entire movie was stealing back the museum pieces and of course killing his girlfriend. Everything else was by the book only he had malice in his heart, which I guess a lot of people relate to.
From a character perspective, the general rule is "are the people you're taking your trauma out on the cause of said trauma? If not, you're probably not a good person."
Phrasing allowing for wiggle room for heroes with a Batman/Spiderman esk backstory (though an argument could be made that the target of their trauma release is the victims they are protecting, working through things by attempting to prevent bad things from happening to others, rather than using their criminals as a replacement for the people that took away their loved ones.)
Thing is Endeavor didn’t even throw Dabi away he didn’t really become super abusive until AFTER the accident before he was more trying to keep Dabi from destroying himself and Dabi didn’t listen and it messes Endeavor up so bad he became super abusive and more obsessed with accomplishing his goal(possibly to make up for what he thinks happened to Touya) which makes sense some parents could have whole shifts in who they are after a child passes away
Right? AND (Spoiler) *To willingly proceed in killing his younger brother (Shoto) when he was wildin out due him thinking that he was going to be replaced if he didn't accomplish much as his father processor. NOW THAT SAYS A LOT*
I'm sorry but his reaction to Touyas supposed death is to abuse his wife and son MORE? Yeah no. Dabi doesn't get any excuses for being a mass murderer but neither does Endeavor for being an abuser. He never got any sort of punishment besides learning his son became a villain. He doesn't get a pass. Toga is another example of this. Bitch could literally get a job at a blood bank and she chooses to kill people.
Endeavor gets to much hate because most of MHA fans are girls 😂. Rei was useless and allowed Dabi to hurt himself multiple times. And I’m supposed to be mad at endeavor because after a long day of fighting crime he gets mad his wife can’t do simple basic shit?
This is also realizing that Endeavor didn't even treat Dabi badly if you compare it both emotionally and mentally to his siblings. Endeavor acted because Dabi was obsessed and was hurting himself, he wanted that pain.
Honestly villains backstory never made me give them a pass, it just made understand why they do what they do, I always thought that was the purpose for giving villains backstories like this.
I'm so glad he talked about kill monger I thought I was going crazy when I thought he wasn't deserving of forgiveness and just wanted to hurt people when I first saw him
Yeah, Killmonger is an outright villain. He has always wanted to burn down not only the world but Wakanda as well for sitting in the shadows and not doing anything. He is misguided rage personified. You can like him as a character but never forget he is a villain through and through. The MCU tries to make its villains sympathetic and possibly redeemable too often when sometimes that just isn't true. We felt Killmonger's pain but inside we knew he was wrong yet a sliver of our soul wanted it all to burn just like he did. Yo when we go talk about how they nerfed our boy Sam Wilson? They got him out here with out his avian telepathy from MC-616 and then they didn't even make him as smart as his MC-1610 counterpart.
It's been awhile since I've watched Black Panther but doesn't Killmonger kill his own girlfriend the moment she becomes inconvenient? Did people just forget about that?
@@painvillegaming4119 that at least was under the guise of arming the oppressed and fits under his charade of righteous anger at society. Him killing his girlfriend, a loyal ally, shows that the motivation he presents was never more than a masquerade hiding his truer and more selfish motives. He wanted vengeance for his abandonment and his father's death, any stated goal beyond that was a lie. He claimed to want want to raise black people up but killed a black woman who was loyal to his stated cause for no reason other than he was done with her. People like to say his motives were just and his methods were where he went wrong, but him killing her shows that there is a difference between his stated motivations and his real ones.
Dabi especially kills me because out of ALL those kids he didn’t go through shit yet the others didn’t turn into monsters. He always had that inside him.
True there was always something messed up in his head , I mean who the hell tries to kill his siblings just too make his dad life worst , that didn't end up in just todoroki he also targeted natzo. I never liked Dabi anyways I just wanted him to be dead, that gives to almost everybody in the league of villians. Toga legitimately just want a world where she can just kill people and no one would judge her for that , and people empathize with her because she's born that way. (When in reality the show doesn't give you any sigh of her being addicted to blood , she just think love is drinking blood , so killing people was optional.) There is someone you can feel bad for like Tomura who legitimately didn't have a choice in life at all , his whole existence was planed by another massive ashole. But still he needed to go because in the end of the day , victim or not you still killed people. I mean when would we stop letting our personal feelings control our sense of logic.
@@taurex7939 no there's plenty of examples, especially these days, of writers who misunderstand this point. But yes there's also a major problem with the fans as well.
These tragic backstories for these types of characters are supposed to make you feel sad for them coming to this point & realise that the world can tend to make their own monsters & regret the circumstances that brought them to this point you should want to change them, redeem them not try to justify their means you should feel for why they got to this point not outright ignore horrible acts they make (but also you can just enjoy them for being well written characters too if ya want)
This. Another good example from MHA is Shigaraki. Its easy to understand why he turned into a villain, cause his family was seriously abusive to him. His father regularly beat him, his mother just sat back and let it happened, and his sister was even willing to throw him under the damn bus when she got busted showing Shigaraki hero stuff, when she knew full well what was about to happen. On top of that, his Quirk is extremely destructive and manifested at the worst time, when he was having an emotion break down and hugging his dog for comfort. Buddy disintegrated his dog, then the rest of his family, as he didn't know what was happening until it was just him and his father left. Despite fully realizing he was the one disintegrating everything around him, Shigaraki chose having no family left, over only having the cunt of a father left over. We can see why he became a villain. But that still doesn't justify the potential hundreds of people he has Decayed over the years, and I wish people stopped trying to justify him, along with Dabi.
@@duskgaming18 yea when I found that out it was technically a spoiler for me since I'm way behind on My Hero hell everything in this video was stuff I haven't caught up on so it was all spoilers lol but it made me wanna start MHA over again cuz holy hell I never expected Shigaraki to have such a compelling backstory it almost brought Mr to tears I think lots of peeps just misunderstand it's not supposed to make you believe there is justification for their actions but rather to realise what made them this way & feel for them maybe hope for redemption I know I always wish those fallen from grace to have that but that idea itself is subjective because it's all a case by case basis whether someone can be redeemed or even what is down right irredeemable but at the end of this all only character like this are complete & well written cuz humans don't do bad things for no reason they do it because bad things happened to them there's always a cause for the effect this is no different
@@monsieur917 that just ain't true what you should be saying is they're just messed up in the head that's the cause for their twisted way I don't care what people say there's no such thing as true evil sure they don't have good reason for what they do but it's usually cuz they're deranged in some way that simply wasn't possible to stop & there's only so much we can do in our lifespans to try & fix others sometimes it just was never in the cards to change or help people like that or they just don't want the help at all or both
I watched what if for Killmonger, I called my sister up and was like "I told you Killmonger was a bad guy through and through". Felt so vindicated. So many people have tragic backgrounds but they don't rage against the world. Humanity means overcoming your own self, your background, your hurt, your hate, heal and then heal others. That's why we are here.
Bro thank you for having this perspective on killmonger. Too many people put this character on a pedestal and totally miss the point that he was the bad guy!
Preach, this applies to ALL of the members of The League of Villains, they act as if they're misunderstood victims in an Unjust world. But in reality, they're just a bunch of selfish idiots who use their backstories and fucked up logic to justify their awful actions. That's how you know a story is good, when you hate a character as was intended and it doesn't come off as overbearing
I just find it weird how some people act as it’s impossible to be sympathetic towards a character, but still acknowledge that they’re in the wrong and are indeed villains
Yeah I agree completely. Toga liked blood and liked the need to kill for it. Twice was already a most wanted villain Dabi was just psycho because his brother went through worse and he isn’t a villain
@@AndresHernandez-yk5im tbf its debatable whether todaroki went through worse the worse todaroki got was getting beat up which prob happened to dani as well PLUS the fact when he uses his quirk he gets burnt by it the worse worse todaroki got was from his mother throwing hot water on him which is basically what endeavor did to dabi everytime he forced him to use his quirk
I mean, I remember some guy who did some pretty bad stuff after not getting into the art school of his dreams, but he might've been just misunderstood.
@Balmug Hitler was still selling art because his dad convinced his rich buddies to buy it. Hitler still would've come off as an entitled ass if you played his story completely straight but changing the names.
@@muntu1221 There was a part where he was essentially homeless. And the fact he learned all the nations shit from his literally insane Town mayor. Who he only listened to cause he was homeless. Hitler is an evil person, but honestly without his involvement the same would have happened, to many contributing factors
I'm realizing this more and more as I'm getting older. I understand that giving the villain a backstory not only allows writers to revive a film/series/character and build off of an interesting platform, and it does give interesting stories and interesting perspectives because it makes you think. But you are correct, in that, in the long run, it's going to do more damage than good, and only give children an excuse to act a fool. I loved maleficent, I thought it was a very visually beautiful movie, and I love anything that has a good story about fairies, but at the end of the day, she cursed a newborn baby. Seriously.
Villain backstories are there to add layers and depth to characters. Doesn’t have to justify what they do, but it does make things interesting at the end of the day
I feel Kung Fu Panda tackles this subject perfectly. Tai Lung grew up prideful because of Shifu. He even made Shifu face his mistakes in a painful way, yet he wasn't redeemed because no matter what, he still hurt a lot of people and got punished for it.
THANK YOU!!! i will never NEVER understand why ppl sided, or even liked killmonger as a villian. he was just another villian! theres was no good in his intentions
Everyone deserves love, even those with horrible origins and pasts. But the moment people start hurting others, that’s when someone needs to step in and stop the whole thing.
Pink diamond is not misunderstood, but she is not evil. She gave up everything she had and spent thousands of years trying to fix the damage she did while she was a young, immature tyrant under the guidance of other, older, more experienced tyrants.
This. Not saying she did everything right. But what set her apart from the others here was that she recognized that what she was doing was wrong and she took steps to make up for it. The real problem is that she underestimated the Diamonds’ reaction to her “death” and how long they would hold a grudge. Her biggest flaw is that she’s terrible at recognizing how others feel/may feel. She tries to do good and that’s what separates her from the other so-called misunderstood villains.
@@Vortex-jc7fw I see what you're saying but there's 2 reasons why this usually must happen; 1) plain and simple reusing the villain without needed some resurrection arc so to put simple... Irl Money. 2) if the hero just decided to kill every villain they come across that can kill a lot of people... The the hero is no longer a hero, just at best, an antihero.
@@detectiveghost8856 sometimes they are not the ones that have to kill them, the hero goes out od their way to save the villan (yeah that enters in the first one) so it is not them choosing to kill all the villans, just letting karma deal with them or maybe some other criminal, why does the hero have to save the villan in a situation like that? Saving someone that does not take the 2° chance is stupid, I can accept not killing if your morals are like that but if your hand is not "pulling the triger" you did no wrong.
As someone who loves Scarlet Witch, thank you! I am not at all defending her actions, more so I am enjoying the very believable and relatable transition to full fledged villain She was fucked over, but she did everything to fix her life so so wrong Say what you will about Wandavision and Dr. Strange MoM, it got Wanda as a villain right!
Some people simply her actions by saying “she just wants her kids back, she’s doing what any mother would do” yet she wasn’t a mother to begin with. I don’t think any wish-to-be-mother would just murder innocent people, including attempting to murder a child, attempting to murder a innocent mother, murdering a whole army because said army tried to defend the already mentioned child and also defend a evil book, and straight up murdering a father right after the father says that he has a family. Also didn’t Wanda murder Monica’s mother from another universe (capt marvel from the other universe)? There is still the Darkhold that you can still fault, even tho she was already aware that the book was evil In Wandavision when Agatha told her so and how the book works.
@@thatweirdbwah_ Reasonable is imprisonment of a city, threatening and attempting to kill a child, a mother, a group of people defending themselves, an established hero, trying to gain power from a clearly evil source, ect. Again, she’s an awesome evil villain with a good reason for being evil However, she is evil because at no point did she need to do ANY of that Proper mental health prioritization and self care and then simply using her reality warping abilities to JUST make her family, and she’d be a tragic hero It’s not for good storytelling, not at all, but it is the non evil way
Killing is not something majority experiences due to obvious reasons. But Abuse is generally common, I guess Endeavour might have triggered the people who are abused reminding them about it. So, Even though Dabi is a merciless killer no one cares but Endeavour though, oh boy he got so much hate fandom that some people even issued death threats to the writer when he gave him a redemption arc.
@@warlock8593 thats the thing .give endeavor redemption arc which make dabi and rei just simply nuts did not make sense .It prop enji up and make dabi look like a baby throwing tantrum .hori try to shift the blame as much as possible cos he cant have number 1 hero be evil .
@@theoneglorylucky3071 Enji has not been forgiven even in the current manga. ALL FOR ONE HIMSELF, literally the devil of the show, says he would know a thing about ruining lives. And Enji agrees he would. Enji has not been forgiven or excused of his sins you just can't grasp something that isn't shoved down your throat.
Yeah most heros choose to be better people than to just murder innocent people around them, even after they go through horrendous trauma similarly to the villain.
Wanda isn't that. She was a broken woman who had way too much power. She also actively trying to fix her wrongs and in most casses has. She just needs a good therapy and thats it. Early Mags is more this trope than Wanda. If talking movie Wanda i don't know shit about her.
Count Olaf from A series of unfortunate events (the books, not the movie) is anothwr good example. He did too much without remorse, and they expected us to feel bad for him at the end. At least in the movie, they stuck with the pure evil route, which was one of the few things they did right
YES FINALLY YES PREACH IT LOUDER FOR THE BACK Edit: i hate that trope where a characther whos is the living definition of an asshole gets a slide because they have a bad past
So here’s the things: I feel sympathy for characters like Dabi, or Pink Diamond, who were in shitty situations but could’ve made better choices. I EMPATHISE with Twice, and Toga, and Spinner, who truly didn’t have a choice, who were truly only allowed to become villains.
@user-og8jy1ib7f Yh, that shit was horrid. And the worst part is people love Itachi whilst hating Sasuke, similar to the Dabi/Endeavour relationship, just flipped on it's head.
I always said this, understandable and excusable are two different things, a person can have a sad backstory and I can can understand why they doing something, but that doesn’t justify the death of innocent people
People forgot that Harley enjoys killing and torturing people with joker. They only pay attention to the “she was abused/manipulated!” part of her as an excuse, and to ignore how she clearly will enjoy doing crime with the joker, she’s manipulative to see joker as misunderstood, not into thinking it’s ok to murder people, she knows right from wrong.
@@anotherrandomguy8871THANK YOU!!!! PEOPLE BE FORGETTING SHE LOVED KILLING PEOPLE AND SOMETIMES JOKER DIDN’T EVEN TELL HER TO DO IT SHE DID IT BECAUSE SHE WANTED TO!!! SHE KILLED A WHOLE ORPHANAGE ALL BECAUSE JOKER BROKE UP WITH HER
@@spectraphantom5870 I can bet you, you can tell people about how she blew up an orphanage, and people will still find a way to make Harley out to be innocent somehow. Unrelated, but I’ve went on a video before that went over the details of how Jokwr and Harley tortured Jason in the Arkam series, including allowing goons to SA him, and I still saw a thread talking about his Harley would never do this, and would instead if she knew about the SA, would try to help Jason, because it would somehow trigger her therapist side of her….even though she literally tortured the kid in the first place and has brutalized many kids before, but ok.
@@anotherrandomguy8871 if I ever see anyone try to justify fuckin Arkhamverse Harley then their opinion isn’t worth shit then because how do you try to justify a psychopath especially that version of Harley
Master Xehanort from Kingdom Hearts. After KH3, everyone thinks he’s doing good things through bad means. The man literally committed human experiments on innocent people, stole Terra’s body, and ruined the lives of countless people because he could.
I think he got off Scott free, but I’ve talked with a good number of people who believe that she Xehanort is a tragic hero, which has increased after the conclusion of Dark Road
I think Master Xehanort is a weird reversal of this where people *think* the ending was trying to redeem him when it wasn’t, he just admitted he lost and gave up, not a single character in the cast forgave him for what he did except Eraqus lmao, then in Remind they fucking family kamehameha his ass to oblivion as well lol
“Just because you’ve suffered, doesn’t mean you’re right”
That stupid ass trope is just for emo teens who say stupid shit about society then say “ but it’s because people don’t like me “ STFU , nobody will like you for that exact reason
Who said that?
@@JonSho9829 He did
@@Monkeybashplush nah but some annoying emo kid at school said that
I feel like this is also the same kind of argument for when some villains are just fleshed out in general. It doesn’t even have to only be about trauma necessarily. Just because a villain may have a lot of character development, it doesn’t automatically mean they’re not a villain
The fact that Killmonger tried to incite a war after becoming king rather than use Wakanda's immense resources to help those in poverty (like where he grew up) should tell you everything you need to know about his true priorities.
Reminds me of that resistance leader from the Last of Us. The one who tried to kill Henry?
War to END poverty
@@rawfermews4186 War could never end poverty
@@jangpokemar3449i think maybe that was a revengeance reference
@@itsjustvin7630 No in revengeance he's trying to start a war to completely wipes the slate clean not to end poverty
That's why Jiraiya is King. Ill carry his lessons thru life. "Just because we've experienced pain isn't an excuse to perpetuate it. In fact, it's a reason to do better."
You just reminded me to rewatch Naruto again.
the cycle of hatred must be ended somehow
So true
Thats such a good quote
Jiraiya was the goat🔥🔥
RIP pervy sage 😔😔
“Just because someone has past trauma does not mean they get to do horrible shit!” Is something a LOT of people need to hear these days tbh
Sadly your 100% right.
And for those that disagree, Two words:
Adolf Hitler
THANK YOU!!!!
But it doesn't not mean that as well
@@austinjeffries5741 what ?
it really brings the point home when Dabi straight up *admits* he knows what he's doing is wrong...he just doesn't care.
Why would he care if the society basically worship his father as god in all but name (second to only allmight) ?? I wont say that shit he did is right but he does care for something .Just not the world as a whole
@@theoneglorylucky3071 Sure he cares for something but it's inexcusable because of how he acts.
If Dabi only killed purely for the mission he'd still be wrong but significantly less so. The moment he kills people basically because it's fun to him is where you can pretty much throw the whole misunderstood angle away
@@tanaka173 i wouldnt say he is misunderstood .You can empathize with him yes but he is undeniably a horrible person .
@@theoneglorylucky3071 it's mostly because endeavor never went public about his abuse & how he basically only had his family for a petty reason.
kid Touya straight up called his mom a "whore" purchased only for endeavor's dream
@@shadowki5687 dude he has his father basically try to live by proxy with him as a substitute .Combining with the fact that he admiring his father and like every child would do .He try to copy him .He would be viewing his mother as an air at best and a breeding mare at worst base on his father attitude toward her .
A girl told me that Kilmonger was just fighting for civil rights. I was like, “trying to steal advanced tech to kill a bunch of people isn’t fighting for civil rights.”
Thank you!
Nah. Killmonger did nothing wrong.
I'm late, but how else could he fight?
I mean, how not? If people are willing to fight to keep you deprived of your rights, why shouldn't you also fight to have them? If a fight is serious, people are usually going to die along the way.
Yeah it's strange😂
"cool motive, still murder" brooklyn 99
9-9!
9!9!
9-9!!!!!
Nine nine!!!!!!!!- Terry
NINE NINE
“My parents don’t like me so I decided to destroy the world”🤡
that not cap
Sounds like the perfect villain for Amazing Spiderman 3.
Agree cap
Are you talking Tony Stark before he became Ironman?
He did not care about anyone but himself. Not even about his close friend Rhody. He was making weapons of mass destruction, and having a great time living it up.
Thor was the same way. Just justifing his acts to feed his own ego and grow his fame. Oden says as much.
@@BIGFRANKOL75 Thor is a warrior and was raised by Odin lol he literally raised Three bad kids and luckily saved Thor before he when too far like Hela or Loki
"You think you're entitled to everything just because you've suffered, but suffering isn't enough. You can't just be strong, you have to be smart. You can't just be deserving, you have to be worthy. But all you have ever been is a *BLOODY MIGRAINE!*"
-Watts, RWBY Volume 8
Spoiler;
😔 The show that only kills off the good villains. RIP Roman Torchwick
One of the only good moments of that volume
The only wonderful monologue from the series
Bro was the only good villain.
Cinder out here crying like she didn’t just murder 10k+ people 😂✋🏽
Cinder: Had a bad childhood. Became a power stealing nut with a complex.
Adam: Abused and branded by humans. Became a terrorist who kills anyone that gets in his way.
Salem: Lost her lover and cursed with immortality. Became a manipulative omnicidal witch and the closest thing to the devil.
The Brothers: Sees Salem tricked a bunch of humans to kill them. Kills everyone, abandons Remnant and breaks the moon.
“Say it with your chest for the people in the Back Bro”
Dabi was ready to murk Men, Women and children with no remorse what so ever even one’s that had nothing to do with him or his ‘cause’
If he just went after abusive people then we could let it slide because it would've made sense
He don't even really care about the league like the other members do either, he's just using them as a means to an end. Literally zero redeeming character traits
@@kis4kasper he does care .he just prefer to go do his own thing instead of being a team player .
@@theoneglorylucky3071 he would’ve been the one to kill twice if hawks didn’t move him from the first fire blast
He's a psychopath who doesn't care about anyone but himself and would do anything to kill anyone and won't give any shits hell he even kill his entire family if he wanted.
I remember someone said something along the lines of, "Heroes go through trauma, and want to protect everyone so that they don't experience that trauma. Villains go through trauma, and want the whole world to experience their trauma so they can be understood"
Sometimes. Soemtimes villain go trough trauma and also want to protrct everyone from expereince that trauma.
Is that their methods are just extremly questionable. For example in one of the Fate series the villain plan want to get rid of human desire. In his mind if humans have no ambition World Peace could be accomplish.
I mean with the world that is cruel as mha ,can you really blame them for hitting back?
@@theoneglorylucky3071 They do got a point. But some villains killed innocent people for no reason. Like in the World Mission movie
@@SavantPete its us vs them mentality .Which stem from the fact that most people turn a blind eye on the cruelty that occur .Make them complicit in the eyes of the victim .Thus they become one of the enemy.Hell they usually join in too if anything
@@Magnet_Chaos Shirou Tokisada Amakusa. Guy had a point, but his method was stupid. I already came up with about ten other solutions to get a better result for the people while achieving exactly what he wanted.
Dabi is even worse, because when Endeavor and his wife understood that Dabi's flames would kill him, they tried to make him stop. In fact, the trauma from having him burn himself up is probably a good portion of why Endeavor was emotionally distant from the whole family in addition to being abusive.
Exactly,
It's an actual plot point
That the entire reason endeavor had more kids was to discourage touya
Endeavor and rei definitely could have handled it much better
But endeavor never abused dabi,infact touya trying to kill shoto is what led to the abused shoto had to face and him being seperated from the other kids
@@kannan07but somehow people spin the narrative that Endeavor abuse towards his children was psychological, and somehow was way way worse than any physical stuff he could have done (for real if you didn’t watch My hero and stumbled upon those haters in forums you would think Endeavor graped his wife and kids on the daily seeing as how he is vilified).
@@togucvinw7 those people are basically the IRL natsu
Manipulated by unjustified hate lmfao,like how touya basically manipulated natsu into hating endeavor
Like,what endeavor did to shoto is definitely not justified
But the way people put is so fvcking wrong and villianising(idk if that's a word) foor no reason
@@togucvinw7 ong. People talking about how dabi needs a hug because the whole family abused him. Here I'm thinking, did we even read the same manga?
A person acknowledged this on tumblr and reddit, WITH MANGA PANELS AS EVIDENCE, yet people still insisted endeavor never cared about his family at all. him buying a separate house for his family, sending his wife flowers, and being more concerned for her well-being than his own when she visited him wasn't enough to convince these people. All this while people stan worser fathers in anime because they look like young kpop idols.
@@kannan07 finally someone says it
fucking finally, the hate endeavor gets while girls are too busy shipping dabi with other characters while calling him ''baby boy'' has me fuming
U can hate both uk endeavor should be in jail and so should dabi
Let's not talk about the shippers because there's fanart of Mirko and Shigaraki going shopping with their toddler
@@olu550" *UH* "
*runs away*
@@TSH425 I will never say that people need to not hate Endeavor or even lay off of him because he’s trying to do better, because the thing that finally made him realize he’s a pos is that he thinks he has to be like All Might since he’s taken his Number 1 spot, and only then does he reflect on his behavior. Only when he has to compare himself to a fucking paragon, does he think he’s done something bad.
@@Toshi-vu1hh fr tho the only time he even thinks he did smth wrong is when he gets what he always wanted and that's cause he got it in a way he "didnt want" so he was fine with getting the num 1 spot by abusing his kids but not cause all might retires? Is this guy serious he rather abuse his kids than let all might retire and take his place that shits crazy to me
I love the idea killmonger being the imbodment of if a village rejects a child he will burn it down to feel its warmth... but he did have a god complex still one of my favorites tho
Good characters don't have to good people; in the same vein, just because you like a character doesn't mean they have to be a good person. A lot of people want to humanize villains because they don't want to like the bad guy
no.
No
A sympathetic villain doesn't make a morally right villain
More like having a trauma or bad childhood doesn't make you a likeable villain.
I mean, take RWBY. Compare the amount of people that like Salem and Neopolitan. Most of these people will like them because there are genuinelly tragic backstories and traumas that, while not justifying them, makes you sympathize on some level or at very least comprehend WHY they're evil/insane.
Compare that to the amount of people who like Cinder Fall, who was an abused child slave. Most of people who like Cinder are the "Wow, she's HAWT" or "YAY, gIrL pOwEr", and use the cliché backstory to pretend she's suddenly well-written.
Salem's insanity is comprehensible and justified because her origin story is the story of every woman who ever got their lives destroyed by a god in Greek Mythology.
Cinder Fall is an edgy, poorly-written Azula expy.
I like tragic characters who don't justify their actions by tragedy and just do their own shit like Able from SCP. The dude was screwed by his brother,the scarlet king, and the daevites yet never let it define ot justify his fucked up actions dude just killed and murdered with a code of honour.
@@DeathMessenger1988 "Salem's insanity is comprehensible and justified because her origin story is the story of every woman who ever got their lives destroyed by a god in Greek Mythology."
WHAT?! All her problems are 100% her own damn fault. She was told no. Went behind one God's back to get what she wants. Got caught lying and was punished for it. Actively tried to get the God's killed by the rest of humanity. Then got punished even harder.
@@RJLiams I mean come on though. All she wanted was her boyfriend, the person who saved her from her oppressive father who locked her in a tower, back and was told bringing ONE person back would throw off the “balance”. It’s not like he died of natural causes either, he just got sick. Who wouldn’t be pissed?
Not to mention they still brought him back later only to plot against her. Imagine starting a war to destroy the creatures who denied you happiness, they kill everyone but you, and sentence you to walk the world alone for centuries. After all that strife the gods caused over ONE person, they end up bringing him back anyway, only to have him stand against her when all she ever wanted was to see him again. How would you feel?
Tell that to Attack on Titan fans, they’d LOSE it
I actually realised that Dabi wasn't treated that badly. Endeavour realised pretty early on that Dabi was hurting himself, and tried to help him stop. Dabi was just obsessed with it. Much more obsessed than even his father. Endeavour tried to actually protect Dabi, even before Todoroki was born.
Finally someone gets it
That's what I'm saying.
Todoroki is the the family last name.
Finally some people who has the same thoughts as I did.
The way I see it is that endeavor thought that toya was good enough to become number 1 and the both of them were happy but when endeavor found out toya was hurting himself far worse than he thought from using his quirk he tried constantly to stop toya but he just wouldn’t stop and mixed with his obsession to beat all might with endeavor’s care for Toya’s safety endeavor thought the only way to get Toya to stop was by staying away from him and making shoto but Toya inherited endeavor’s obsessive personality trait that caused the problem if both endeavor and Toya got some counseling to help them deal with their issues it could have helped to prevent what happened
“I hate him because he’s abusive” “awww he’s so cute even though he’s murdering innocent people and even children😍”
Sounds like Anakin Skywalker
@@StephDLegend "fuc* them kids" -Anakin on his way to murder youngling
Jeffrey Dahmer stans
You got people kno the monster Jeffrey Dahmer was and still like him.
Dabi is honestly worse than Endeavor. At least Endeavor KNOWS he can't make up for what he did, so he tries his best to be a hero regardless. Dabi kills people just because lol
And then on the other side of the villain spectrum you got Doofenschmirtz.
Na if doof became a true villain I would've supported him
@@AghoginOritsetsemaye-vr2ls Doof has enough reason to become a true a villain but he doesn’t
he is just a goofy villain for proof he talk with platypus like you with a old friend
And on the opposite, you have 2D Doof who became a villain because he lost his toy train.
@@myeeeeehEnslavement over a toy train will forever be crazy
Dude did a great job of explaining the whole point behind Killmonger. Killmonger was clearly designed to be likable on a surface level, but I always felt his actions were meant to be proof of how truly evil and toxic he was.
Exactly but ppl really walked away from that movie with "He's gonna treat them how they treated us"
Like bruh it was wrong when they did it why dafaq would it be OK now that he's doing it??????
@@theVictor-isVonDoom Yeh and he killed innocent people when he didn't have to. The movie made it clear that Killmonger did not value human life.
He was a bad guy and what if confirmed it. He couldn’t let go of his need to hurt and control others.
I find it scary that people found him likable in the first place.
In all fairness he was trained to kill people. That was the whole point of all of those markings. Of course he was deranged but he was a great representation of a Black American. Black man because of his anger, American for his greed. Black folks related with the anger, no one seemed to acknowledge the American in him.
Killmonger burning the heart shaped herbs just showed that he was all too willing to pull up the ladder once he made it to the top
Oh shit I didn't even think about that
And people think he should be king lol
That's probably the ONLY thing he did wrong during that movie. Black Panthers are supposed to come and go. He wanted to be the last.
@@Lowtan the ONLY thing? I don't see how you could watch that movie and think that burning the flowers was the only thing he did wrong...
@@Lowtan and you think it was a good thing? Dude was about to start world War 3. He wants power
Dabi wasn’t even really abused. He was upset that he wasn’t daddy’s special prodigy anymore
I mean he totally was but doesn’t justify anything.
@@mei7495 he totally wasn’t. As a matter of fact, they were a happy little family until Dabi “died” and endeavor lost his shit.
@@mei7495 no he wasn't. At most, just neglected and only after both Shoto was born and especially after he almost turned Shoto into baby barbeque
@@mei7495 only shoto and rei were ever actually abused
@@umbreonixhe was abused neglect is still a form of abuse
Trauma can explain why your being a horrible person, but it absolutely does NOT and NEVER will excuse those actions.
While Dabi does bad things because of his backstory, at least he had a reason to do these things. BAKUGO ON THE OTHER HAND, will remain one of the most overrated characters. He had no reasoning to do the things he did. He literally suicide baited, bullied and abused Deku for OVER A DECADE AND PEOPLE STILL DEFEND HIM. People will shame endeavour for what he did to Dabi and Todoroki (and the family overall) but no one will shame Bakugo for attacking a quirkless person who couldn’t defend himself at all. Both cases are abuse.
People just shame endeavour cause he hurt todoroki. People only like him for his looks. Bakugo is only popular because of his looks. His personality is literally telling people to die 50% of the time he’s on screen. And then it’s either being cocky or abusive. That is one of the worst and most annoying personalities someone could have. Dabi’s actions aren’t justified but Bakugo should literally be suspended and never be able to be a hero again. (He attacked someone who he knew couldn’t fight back and told them to kill themselves simply because they didnt have a quirk which is something out of control.) If Deku decided to kill himself, he could’ve literally been responsible for a murder. If Deku didn’t try save him, Deku would’ve probably given up on his dreams and killed himself meaning he would be responsible for that. He’s lucky Deku did that. The worse part is, he shouted at Deku instead of saying thanks to him for trying to save his life. Ungrateful, annoying, overrated, hateful and unjustified.
This... it is an explanation not a excuse for bad behavior. U dont get a free pass due to ur bad experiences. Lot of people in the world r suffering as much as u if not more. We understand why u a t like that but we cannot accept it and u should stop is what we should tell everyone.
@@StealzSFX I mean dabi is the one killing people not bakugo lol
@@tobsonasanya4765 yeah true. Like I said, Dabi is not justified for his actions
I love the kind of villain who's just an absurdly evil bastard with a super tragic backstory, but then it's casually revealed they aren't even motivated or even affected by there tragic backstory, they're just insane.
Kingpin in Netflix’s Daredevil. Beautiful scene
I think they did that with the villain in the second How to Train Your Dragon movie. Dragons killed his village, but he's been a dragon-enslaving raider for so long that he doesn't even dwell on his lost loved ones anymore. He's just doing what he does now for power.
Like Doflamingo?
@@KaijuGal-rb9ek Yall gonna hate me, but I've never seen one piece.
Its alright no one will hate you for that
Demon Slayer seem to handle this well. Tanjiro sympathize with the demons, but that doesn't stop him from doing his job and sending them to a not so nice place.
Tanjiro: omg that’s so sad nobody should have to go through that
Guts: oh boo hoo, let me play you a song on the worlds smallest violin
@@zer0_iz_d34d Yeah, after all Guts and his circle of friends and loved ones have been through, he has lost all fs to give. Any villain sob story sounds like petty bs to him.
Guts definitely takes it.
It's so surprising because Naruto and killer B had almost every right to be villains or destroy the village but they chose to live with that pain and neglect.
That's why I'll pick Naruto over Sasuke any day of the week.
@@markey412 But for I pick Sasuke just for his cool moments. I still like Naruto though.
@@sagemaster1357 I get it. But Sasuke's a glorified F-Boy.
Basically every jinchuriki besides Gaara who was literally made to become who he was as genin could have turned into a villain. The mizukage was controlled behind the scenes
@@maadtee6281 didn’t some of them have good reputation?
People want sympathetic villains, but never learned that just because someone has a justification it doesn’t mean that they are just.
People forget how casually killmonger betrayed and murdered his girl. He's not loyal to anyone but himself.
Yep. Showed her plenty of affection but the moment she became inconvenient, he shot her himself.
You are so right because I literally never think of that lol
How do people ignore that scene, come on this guy is straight evil manipulative psychopath
Bros 1 step away from becoming Makarov 💀
I actually like it when the villain just wants to see shit explode, no ulterior motive, no wanting to rule the world. They just want to be evil.
So Joker Batman Dark Knight.
Carnage basically
*Cough* Sundowner *Cough*
Basically carnage.
Frieza
Arcane fans be like: Jinx is an anti hero because of her trauma!
Jinx's actions:
-Committing friendly fire because she mistook an enemy for her sister.
-Luring four cops into a burning building and then blowing them up.
-Killing a bird.
-Suicide Bombing her friend.
-Kidnapping her sister's lover.
-Tying up her sister and her father figure.
-Killing her father figure.
-Nuking the capital.
Yeah......real anti-hero right here........
I’m really glad to know that you disapproved the bird murder
Isn’t piltover an elitist, oppressive city that basically thrives on Zauns suffering? I don’t feel bad for them. Hell, I don’t even feel bad for Vi or her girl. I feel bad for Ekko though. Having to fight someone you know you can’t save and who you still love is tragic.
@@deangelosummers7717 Piltover is an elitist oppressive nation, yeah but at the same time, Jinx's actions only increase that elitism. Not stop it. It's like how a police force gets increased when there is more crime.
@@deangelosummers7717 Also she nuked the capital right when Zaun was gonna be independent. Now she killed all chances of that happening.
@@gimmeyourrights8292 I get your reasoning. It’s sound, but at the same time, to those at the lower end of the scale with nothing to lose, it wouldn’t make a difference. They were being policed heavily and disregarded already. What? A few more cops come into your city and create even more hostility between the two parties? At best that leads to more firelights(Except they’re against piltover now) and at worse another Jinx.
People need to realise.
Just because a villain have a good point it doesn't mean they are justified. Villains are villains in the first place. They are motivate by selfish desire, and they intetional harming others.
Villain: "Racism bad!"
Also villain: Attacking a hospital with full intent of killing everyone he comes across there.
“You can spin it, ride it, deny it, and justify it.”
Man was spittin pure fire.
Dio is the prime example, bro was given a second chance to be great and he wasn't satisfied with that. HE WANTED TO ELIMINATE AN ENTIRE BLOODLINE AND EVEN AFTER DYING HE BASICALLY GROOMED SOMEONE TO KILL THEM.
spoilers for part 7:
His pettiness also transends time and space, twice. IMO Deigo was a better person overall than DIO, which doesn't say much, but Deigo from another World was just actual cowboy DIO that readers would suspect Scary Monsters Deigo to be.
People sympathize with Dio?
@@muffinboi4134 bo one sympathizes with dio. He was a bastard all the way through
@@muffinboi4134 you wouldn't believe it
@@gyroseedwagone7306 I've read part 7
and let me say that him deciding to help Johnny is a W
I always say:
"That was your reason. That is not your excuse."
“Everyone has a sob story, that doesn’t give you the right to be a jerk”
-Sam larusso
LMFAO the irony because a jerk and uses Tory and cobra kais bad actions to defend her own at least those people had a sob story
@@killermothxd4085 yeah sam and miyagi do was wrong for attacking cobra kai at the arcade first but they started that shit by causing trouble and messing with one of their own and tory and cobra kai then break into sams house afterwards and the place ends up trashed
I can't wait for the new season to come.
LeBron that is all false
Not true
Gives a whole new meaning to "Just because you're correct, doesn't mean you're right."
We laugh at Shirou but he had it right all along.
No
It's because the moment we find sympathy or a good point about a villain, we cling to it.
On the other hand, if a good person shows a problem, we can hate on them more.
That doesn't really help the case. If anything, that's just more fucked up and wrong on both the long and short term
Hating on a hero for their flaws vs loving a villain despite the horrible things they do
I kinda understand it but not necessarily agree with it. It’s because people prefer it (even me sometimes) when the main characters are easy to root for. But they can make a villain as nasty as they want, either their so evil you hate them, or they have some kind of entertaining charm to them
I see this with Batman and his villains. People see Batman as someone who beats on the poor people, and see those mass-murdering villians as just that, poor people. Not just mass murders, corrupt assassins, killers, rapist, people that would sadistically kill you if you ever pulled that “your just misunderstood” talk on them.
@@anotherrandomguy8871 it makes the argument that Batman beats on poor people even dumber when some of his enemies are literally rolling in money for example and honestly the easiest example The Penguin
@dantesparrow9903 you cannot tell me that batman in the video games didn't beat the ever loving fuck outta some poor random henchmen, like I get they did bad stuff but some of them just steal a car and get their entire skeletal system rearranged
"I had a bad dad so now I'll destroy an entire bloodline using my vampire abilities and gay priest 'friend' "
Dio then proceeded to get killed by Said bloodline.
To be fair, Dio was a scumbag from the earliest point we've seen him chronologically. No even remotely good person kicks a dog full force and then fries that dog alive.
I don't think anyone sees him as misunderstood, he's just a charismatic, intelligent mad man who delights in the shit he does.
If someone *actually* says he's misunderstood they haven't seen all of his appearances in jojo
@@MugenEclipse*any*
dio was a menace from the beginning to the end for no reason. he just wanted the smoke🤷🏽♀️😭
I feel like this is because writing an ACTUALLY misunderstood villain is really hard.
The difference is that the actually misunderstood villain has a point which, when events are viewed from their point of view, explain their actions and make them make sense
While the "misunderstood" villain has a sad backstory/motive that makes you feel sorry for them or make you think they have a point, that still doesn't excuse their actions
I think a perfect example of a misunderstood villian is Bondrewd from made in abyss if you’re aware of that anime
I personally disagree. I don’t think it’s that hard to write a misunderstood villain. What I think is actually the hard part is when fans or other individuals self insert their own intentions onto the character. It’s as if some people think they know more about the character than the creator(s) themselves
The perfect character is Dracula from Castlevania. He did what he did because religious zealots killed his innocent wife. And even after giving them a full year to make up for what they did, they instead celebrate her death. Even a DEMON going into a church abandoned by God tells the Priest that God never wanted that for that woman. And the Priest only killed her because she threatened his power, not because she was witch.
@@AndresHernandez-yk5im And Dracula was still grossly out of line.
@@CoOlKyUbI96 Holy shit. That's exactly it.
I bet every Dabi stan had an abusive parent and they self insert themselves into Dabi, and their abusive parents into Endeavor.
I just watched a video about that Adult Swim short "Opal", and this quote from it pretty much sums up this kind of "you all need to suffer for what happened to me" mindset:
"Our adversaries are in denial. They don't know the wrong that they do. And they never repent how I want them too."
This was is probably why Zuko is a great character. Like yeah his life sucked, but he never got a free pass to be a dick. Even when he wanted to join the Gaang, he had to earn their trust.
Lowkey kinda wish Todoroki said "it's your quirk not his" in his fight with Dabi as he was pushing the blame on Endeavor for everything.
For Deku to Todoroki it was "it's your quirk not his, you are free to use it to it's full extent."
But from Todoroki to Dabi it would mean "it's your quirk not his, you're the one who used it to harm others and now you need to pay the price."
Yeah but then again Dabi is so deep in his twisted sence of making things even that he would not care he is too far gone
@@AugustoEL it's less to get through to him and more so for thematics
@@cool23819 Well thematically it would have been really good actually, can`t desagree there.
Didn't he say that tho? Maybe not word for word but, he did.
Didn’t Deku actually say that shit? Bro was wiped out on the ground but I coulda sworn he said something in Endeavor’s defense
I half wanted Endeavor to say f*ck you and attack Dabi. Son or not he’s a murderer and no past justifies the murder of innocence.
Judging from the manga he's about to do that.
It’s even worse when movies/shows expect the audience to sympathize with villains who commit genocide and mass murder and every horrible crime imaginable, but when the bully Chad gives a wedgie to the mc he’s beyond redemption.
I dont it is only a wedgie tbh
*gets reminded by miraculous ladybug*
@@marygraceoyangorin8918 nah
Like what
Literally Steven Universe.
Diamonds: Zzzzz
Kevin: REEEEE!
Nothing made me laugh harder than when it was revealed that Dabi was a horrible sibling, after all the years fans spent gaslighting eachother into believing that he was a caring big brother lmao
It's honestly kinda hilarious.
It's quite ironic, ain't it?
Bro, not even Azula tried to smoke Zuko as soon as he came out the womb!
Honestly I’m convinced that the only reason why people like the mha villains are because they’re kind of attractive.
Have you seen that fanbase? That exactly why
That's the sole reason actually. And honestly some of these villains ain't that cute, I'm thinking about Tomura and his ashy ahh.
@@painvillegaming4119 I know right. And don’t get me started on those theories where all for one is deku dads. Which might bad on its own but now I see people acting like that makes it all ok because “YoU CaN’t cHoOsE YOur FaMiLy” because disown a family member definitely isn’t possible.
@@iamcat1797Those people don't understand that "Blood is thicker than water" is actually "Blood of the covenant is thicker than water of the womb". Aka your family doesn't mean shit compared to the people you CHOOSE to be with.
@@painvillegaming4119look another idiot that lets the bad 10% of the community speak for everyone else who enjoys the series
Same , I hate the whole “ he just misunderstood “ shit , I mean you mightest well apply that to real life people huh, that’s right. You can’t because It doesn’t make sense
I need to remond you that there are living being who use the word misunderstood for serial killers
Might as* not mightest
@@gramolapietro2491 literally hitler, oH i WaSnT aCcEpTeD tO aRt ScHoOl, kIlLiNg SpReE tImE
"BUt tHeY aR qIuTEeE" idiotic people that defend psychos. And yeah they do it with real life people, look up there is crazy people (mainly girls) defending and sayong how cute serial killers or school shooters were, hell a few years back there was a case like that.
@@AugustoEL THE FUCK
“My bunny died, so I violated all of hell”
Seems reasonable for a villain backstory
Weird way to spell heros backstory
@@jackmakila3776 my bad
My boy spelt out doomguys backstory
What do you mean "violated" 😟
An entire multi-million dollar video game franchise in a single sentence.
Killmonger had the intellect maturity and ability to do better there is no pass when you know your actions are wrong.
Exactly, this is why Endeavor went up in my opinion, because it's so rare having a hated character go through an actual redemption arc. Honestly, this might be my favorite part of the anime, bc other animes would have him say "sorry" and then everyone would forgive him in under five minutes.
They can have the saddest back story, and I can have the utmost pity for them, but there is a point where it goes from "Yeah, they just messed up cause of they past" to "Nah, this bitch straight evil"
Rocket: Everybody has dead people, that’s no excuse to get everyone kill the way.
And Toga could literally snap a baby in half and eat it’s guts like spaghetti and people will still be saying
“hEr PaReNtS wErE mEaN tO hEr!!”
She'd get a pass because internet is horny.
I'm pretty sure now they say she is a victim of her quirk. If only she was trained by Stain
@@maadtee6281 her quirk isn't forcing her to kill people it's not like a vampire situation where she needs to consume blood she literally chooses to do it
@@jfoster8624 she is insane and I feel like people overlook that because of her past.
@@jfoster8624 her quirk makes her seek blood hence her canine teeth. Just like shiggy quirk makes him want to destroy things
People just struggle to understand nuance in a lotta areas. Having a hard time doesn't justify being evil
It's honestly a great point in writing to make. Have a character with a tragic backstory that's just straight up evil to prove that no matter the circumstances, no matter your past, your actions are utterly and entirely your own
@@zakbrooks7354 just because a person actions are there own doesn't mean that they entirely wanted that or wanted to do that action
@@Sn0wyChad you always have a choice. Doesn't matter what the circumstances are. You can either choose to be good or to be bad. Even if being good means that unfavorable things will happen. Doesn't mean it's sound logic, but the facts still remain
This is true way too many people confuse sympathetic with not evil.
@@doesntmatter2467 twitter
Actually by far Dabi had it the best he was just desperate to prove to his dad he could handle his own fire. Bro is actually a self made villain cuz Endeavor even tried to stop him didn't put any pressure on him to be the strongest once he realized he couldn't handle his own fire.
Even more so when his actual backstory comes out and his father tried stopping him before Fuyumi was born (possibly after her but before Natsuo), which would mean he was 4 or 5 at the oldest. Then spent the next 8-9 years burning himself despite his family trying to stop him (minus that time he tried to murder his infant brother)
True after all there’s a fine line between “being broken” and down right becoming a sociopath
Pet peeve of mine is when someone calls someone else with trauma "broken". Do people understand how it would feel for a person to think that they're "broken" in some way? People who have been through traumatic experiences aren't broken like some toy. They have just been through ordeals.
@@machinaowl910 you're the one thinking of them as toys but ok
Of all the children endeavour had I think he treated Dabi the best like he genuinely didn't want Dabi to hurt him self and he wanted Dabi to actually be a child
Just because John Wayne Gacy had an abusive father, didn't give him the right to become a serial killer.
Or to sexually violate young boys either
"I know he is a representation of black anger but he just does more harm to the black community than good"
👏 👏 👏 I BELIEVE that was the point.
I mean he kinda doesn’t we see in BP2 white people want to steal and are willing to break laws to get things. And he had a point Wakanda sat back while wars and starving Africans died? And Wakanda couldn’t even offer food as aid not even technology? They are able to cure disease deemed incurable but they choice not to because they’re selfish? No killmonger had a point 1000%
No. The point was to say "black man good, white man bad".
What? The villains are bad guys?! 🤯
I wish, but you've got people (including the actor who played him) saying he's a neutral or Grey anti-hero instead of a straight up villain
@@storysurgeon5922 he’s more Lawful evil than Neutral. He followed established ideas like rule of law, Justice, and tradition but without compassion. Technically the only two crimes he committed the entire movie was stealing back the museum pieces and of course killing his girlfriend. Everything else was by the book only he had malice in his heart, which I guess a lot of people relate to.
From a character perspective, the general rule is "are the people you're taking your trauma out on the cause of said trauma? If not, you're probably not a good person."
Phrasing allowing for wiggle room for heroes with a Batman/Spiderman esk backstory (though an argument could be made that the target of their trauma release is the victims they are protecting, working through things by attempting to prevent bad things from happening to others, rather than using their criminals as a replacement for the people that took away their loved ones.)
Being a sympathetic villain doesn't make them any less of a villain. They're still butchering people and making the wrong decisions on the end.
"You know, you're not entirely wrong. You just didn't need to be such an asshole about it."
Hellsing Ultimate Abridged
Thing is Endeavor didn’t even throw Dabi away he didn’t really become super abusive until AFTER the accident before he was more trying to keep Dabi from destroying himself and Dabi didn’t listen and it messes Endeavor up so bad he became super abusive and more obsessed with accomplishing his goal(possibly to make up for what he thinks happened to Touya) which makes sense some parents could have whole shifts in who they are after a child passes away
Right? AND (Spoiler)
*To willingly proceed in killing his younger brother (Shoto) when he was wildin out due him thinking that he was going to be replaced if he didn't accomplish much as his father processor. NOW THAT SAYS A LOT*
I'm sorry but his reaction to Touyas supposed death is to abuse his wife and son MORE?
Yeah no. Dabi doesn't get any excuses for being a mass murderer but neither does Endeavor for being an abuser. He never got any sort of punishment besides learning his son became a villain. He doesn't get a pass.
Toga is another example of this. Bitch could literally get a job at a blood bank and she chooses to kill people.
Endeavor gets to much hate because most of MHA fans are girls 😂. Rei was useless and allowed Dabi to hurt himself multiple times. And I’m supposed to be mad at endeavor because after a long day of fighting crime he gets mad his wife can’t do simple basic shit?
@@aaronnilestoussaint5672 this some incel ass energy.
@@user-wb3qe6pv1u I can Imagine his wife cooking a dinner that this asshat hates then he starts swinging. Lol
This is also realizing that Endeavor didn't even treat Dabi badly if you compare it both emotionally and mentally to his siblings. Endeavor acted because Dabi was obsessed and was hurting himself, he wanted that pain.
Endeavor family gone to shit after dabi "died"
Honestly villains backstory never made me give them a pass, it just made understand why they do what they do, I always thought that was the purpose for giving villains backstories like this.
I'm so glad he talked about kill monger I thought I was going crazy when I thought he wasn't deserving of forgiveness and just wanted to hurt people when I first saw him
I had the same feeling.
Yeah, Killmonger is an outright villain. He has always wanted to burn down not only the world but Wakanda as well for sitting in the shadows and not doing anything. He is misguided rage personified. You can like him as a character but never forget he is a villain through and through.
The MCU tries to make its villains sympathetic and possibly redeemable too often when sometimes that just isn't true.
We felt Killmonger's pain but inside we knew he was wrong yet a sliver of our soul wanted it all to burn just like he did.
Yo when we go talk about how they nerfed our boy Sam Wilson? They got him out here with out his avian telepathy from MC-616 and then they didn't even make him as smart as his MC-1610 counterpart.
It's been awhile since I've watched Black Panther but doesn't Killmonger kill his own girlfriend the moment she becomes inconvenient? Did people just forget about that?
@@theunskilledshinigami7623 no he does
Also don’t forget about him trying to start world war 3
@@painvillegaming4119 that at least was under the guise of arming the oppressed and fits under his charade of righteous anger at society. Him killing his girlfriend, a loyal ally, shows that the motivation he presents was never more than a masquerade hiding his truer and more selfish motives. He wanted vengeance for his abandonment and his father's death, any stated goal beyond that was a lie.
He claimed to want want to raise black people up but killed a black woman who was loyal to his stated cause for no reason other than he was done with her.
People like to say his motives were just and his methods were where he went wrong, but him killing her shows that there is a difference between his stated motivations and his real ones.
Dabi especially kills me because out of ALL those kids he didn’t go through shit yet the others didn’t turn into monsters. He always had that inside him.
True there was always something messed up in his head , I mean who the hell tries to kill his siblings just too make his dad life worst , that didn't end up in just todoroki he also targeted natzo.
I never liked Dabi anyways I just wanted him to be dead, that gives to almost everybody in the league of villians.
Toga legitimately just want a world where she can just kill people and no one would judge her for that , and people empathize with her because she's born that way. (When in reality the show doesn't give you any sigh of her being addicted to blood , she just think love is drinking blood , so killing people was optional.)
There is someone you can feel bad for like Tomura who legitimately didn't have a choice in life at all , his whole existence was planed by another massive ashole.
But still he needed to go because in the end of the day , victim or not you still killed people.
I mean when would we stop letting our personal feelings control our sense of logic.
Writers need to remember the difference between having a sympathetic backstory versus *being* sympathetic.
You means fans. Ain’t the writers fault they are that good.
@@taurex7939 no there's plenty of examples, especially these days, of writers who misunderstand this point.
But yes there's also a major problem with the fans as well.
These tragic backstories for these types of characters are supposed to make you feel sad for them coming to this point & realise that the world can tend to make their own monsters & regret the circumstances that brought them to this point you should want to change them, redeem them not try to justify their means you should feel for why they got to this point not outright ignore horrible acts they make (but also you can just enjoy them for being well written characters too if ya want)
This. Another good example from MHA is Shigaraki. Its easy to understand why he turned into a villain, cause his family was seriously abusive to him. His father regularly beat him, his mother just sat back and let it happened, and his sister was even willing to throw him under the damn bus when she got busted showing Shigaraki hero stuff, when she knew full well what was about to happen. On top of that, his Quirk is extremely destructive and manifested at the worst time, when he was having an emotion break down and hugging his dog for comfort. Buddy disintegrated his dog, then the rest of his family, as he didn't know what was happening until it was just him and his father left. Despite fully realizing he was the one disintegrating everything around him, Shigaraki chose having no family left, over only having the cunt of a father left over.
We can see why he became a villain. But that still doesn't justify the potential hundreds of people he has Decayed over the years, and I wish people stopped trying to justify him, along with Dabi.
@@duskgaming18 yea when I found that out it was technically a spoiler for me since I'm way behind on My Hero hell everything in this video was stuff I haven't caught up on so it was all spoilers lol but it made me wanna start MHA over again cuz holy hell I never expected Shigaraki to have such a compelling backstory it almost brought Mr to tears
I think lots of peeps just misunderstand it's not supposed to make you believe there is justification for their actions but rather to realise what made them this way & feel for them maybe hope for redemption I know I always wish those fallen from grace to have that but that idea itself is subjective because it's all a case by case basis whether someone can be redeemed or even what is down right irredeemable but at the end of this all only character like this are complete & well written cuz humans don't do bad things for no reason they do it because bad things happened to them there's always a cause for the effect this is no different
@@cronasan6931 yes but some are just born down right evil
Not every serial killer had a bad childhood or was touched as a child some just kill to kill
@@monsieur917 that just ain't true what you should be saying is they're just messed up in the head that's the cause for their twisted way I don't care what people say there's no such thing as true evil sure they don't have good reason for what they do but it's usually cuz they're deranged in some way that simply wasn't possible to stop & there's only so much we can do in our lifespans to try & fix others sometimes it just was never in the cards to change or help people like that or they just don't want the help at all or both
@@cronasan6931 Yep
I'm counting those people too
I watched what if for Killmonger, I called my sister up and was like "I told you Killmonger was a bad guy through and through". Felt so vindicated. So many people have tragic backgrounds but they don't rage against the world. Humanity means overcoming your own self, your background, your hurt, your hate, heal and then heal others. That's why we are here.
Bro thank you for having this perspective on killmonger. Too many people put this character on a pedestal and totally miss the point that he was the bad guy!
The "bad" guy that should have won. I'm on his side start to finish.
@@Lowtan bruh
@@Lowtan you want to start a race war on a global scales?
Preach, this applies to ALL of the members of The League of Villains, they act as if they're misunderstood victims in an Unjust world. But in reality, they're just a bunch of selfish idiots who use their backstories and fucked up logic to justify their awful actions.
That's how you know a story is good, when you hate a character as was intended and it doesn't come off as overbearing
I just find it weird how some people act as it’s impossible to be sympathetic towards a character, but still acknowledge that they’re in the wrong and are indeed villains
Yeah I agree completely.
Toga liked blood and liked the need to kill for it.
Twice was already a most wanted villain
Dabi was just psycho because his brother went through worse and he isn’t a villain
@@AndresHernandez-yk5im tbf its debatable whether todaroki went through worse the worse todaroki got was getting beat up which prob happened to dani as well PLUS the fact when he uses his quirk he gets burnt by it the worse worse todaroki got was from his mother throwing hot water on him which is basically what endeavor did to dabi everytime he forced him to use his quirk
@@TSH425 also fair, but he still went through traumatic and abusivo events and he wants to be a hero, unlike Dabi who actively kills
@@TSH425 bro have you read manga Dabi in really no way was forced to use his quirk at all
“What if” really opened to my mind to how Killmonger is not just an asshole by circumstances. He truly is shitty
People would rather idolize murderers their age than appreciate a father who is trying to be better despite his many mistakes.
I mean, I remember some guy who did some pretty bad stuff after not getting into the art school of his dreams, but he might've been just misunderstood.
lol prime example
@Balmug Hitler was still selling art because his dad convinced his rich buddies to buy it. Hitler still would've come off as an entitled ass if you played his story completely straight but changing the names.
@@muntu1221
There was a part where he was essentially homeless.
And the fact he learned all the nations shit from his literally insane Town mayor. Who he only listened to cause he was homeless.
Hitler is an evil person, but honestly without his involvement the same would have happened, to many contributing factors
@@muntu1221 So he was a rich asshole? I can already see the teenage girls eating this story up.
@@tulin_enjoyer My Mom sold me to (Hitler) to pay off her Debts?!?!?
I'm realizing this more and more as I'm getting older. I understand that giving the villain a backstory not only allows writers to revive a film/series/character and build off of an interesting platform, and it does give interesting stories and interesting perspectives because it makes you think. But you are correct, in that, in the long run, it's going to do more damage than good, and only give children an excuse to act a fool. I loved maleficent, I thought it was a very visually beautiful movie, and I love anything that has a good story about fairies, but at the end of the day, she cursed a newborn baby. Seriously.
Villain backstories are there to add layers and depth to characters. Doesn’t have to justify what they do, but it does make things interesting at the end of the day
For me, it's more of "I can understand why but doesn't change what it is"
I feel Kung Fu Panda tackles this subject perfectly. Tai Lung grew up prideful because of Shifu. He even made Shifu face his mistakes in a painful way, yet he wasn't redeemed because no matter what, he still hurt a lot of people and got punished for it.
20 years in prison over a blank paper. That's rough.
THANK YOU!!! i will never NEVER understand why ppl sided, or even liked killmonger as a villian. he was just another villian! theres was no good in his intentions
"The fact that you suffered does not mean you have a free-pass to make other people suffer."
THANK YOUUUU, Trauma can not be an excuse Dabi chose to kill people and admitted that he knew what he was doing was wrong and he liked it
And that's why we like him
Everyone deserves love, even those with horrible origins and pasts. But the moment people start hurting others, that’s when someone needs to step in and stop the whole thing.
Pink diamond is not misunderstood, but she is not evil. She gave up everything she had and spent thousands of years trying to fix the damage she did while she was a young, immature tyrant under the guidance of other, older, more experienced tyrants.
Ya rose was never the villen.
This.
Not saying she did everything right. But what set her apart from the others here was that she recognized that what she was doing was wrong and she took steps to make up for it. The real problem is that she underestimated the Diamonds’ reaction to her “death” and how long they would hold a grudge. Her biggest flaw is that she’s terrible at recognizing how others feel/may feel.
She tries to do good and that’s what separates her from the other so-called misunderstood villains.
Exactly, I'm tired of villains and anti heroes getting away with murder just because they have a sad backstory
I honestly think it's worse when the hero saves the villain only for them to continue to kill more people
@@Vortex-jc7fw I see what you're saying but there's 2 reasons why this usually must happen;
1) plain and simple reusing the villain without needed some resurrection arc so to put simple... Irl Money.
2) if the hero just decided to kill every villain they come across that can kill a lot of people... The the hero is no longer a hero, just at best, an antihero.
Meanwhile Azula still a villain at the end. Wish they did that to Catra and Hordak
@@maadtee6281 both of them just got weak ass "redemption arcs" and don't get me started on evil Lynn in masters of the universe
@@detectiveghost8856 sometimes they are not the ones that have to kill them, the hero goes out od their way to save the villan (yeah that enters in the first one) so it is not them choosing to kill all the villans, just letting karma deal with them or maybe some other criminal, why does the hero have to save the villan in a situation like that? Saving someone that does not take the 2° chance is stupid, I can accept not killing if your morals are like that but if your hand is not "pulling the triger" you did no wrong.
I LOVE Endeavor!! 🔥 He owns his past & doesn’t want forgiveness, only to move forward with changed actions.
Thank you! Same goes for Wanda/Scarlett Witch as well!
As someone who loves Scarlet Witch, thank you!
I am not at all defending her actions, more so I am enjoying the very believable and relatable transition to full fledged villain
She was fucked over, but she did everything to fix her life so so wrong
Say what you will about Wandavision and Dr. Strange MoM, it got Wanda as a villain right!
Some people simply her actions by saying “she just wants her kids back, she’s doing what any mother would do” yet she wasn’t a mother to begin with. I don’t think any wish-to-be-mother would just murder innocent people, including attempting to murder a child, attempting to murder a innocent mother, murdering a whole army because said army tried to defend the already mentioned child and also defend a evil book, and straight up murdering a father right after the father says that he has a family. Also didn’t Wanda murder Monica’s mother from another universe (capt marvel from the other universe)?
There is still the Darkhold that you can still fault, even tho she was already aware that the book was evil In Wandavision when Agatha told her so and how the book works.
If wanda as truly evil, she would've just taken over the universe, as she was destined to do. She wasn't lying when she said she was being reasonable.
@@thatweirdbwah_ Reasonable is imprisonment of a city, threatening and attempting to kill a child, a mother, a group of people defending themselves, an established hero, trying to gain power from a clearly evil source, ect.
Again, she’s an awesome evil villain with a good reason for being evil
However, she is evil because at no point did she need to do ANY of that
Proper mental health prioritization and self care and then simply using her reality warping abilities to JUST make her family, and she’d be a tragic hero
It’s not for good storytelling, not at all, but it is the non evil way
Literally applies with every single villain tbh
People still justify loki's acts bcz ✨✨Odin was a bad father✨✨
It's better to break the cycle of trauma than to become the trauma.
Just because someone has a horrible past does not give them a free pass to be a absolute asshole🤦🏾♂️ they're not misunderstood THEY'RE CRAZY 😭
Dabi kills people
Fans: why would Endeavor do this?
Killing is not something majority experiences due to obvious reasons.
But Abuse is generally common, I guess Endeavour might have triggered the people who are abused reminding them about it.
So, Even though Dabi is a merciless killer no one cares but Endeavour though, oh boy he got so much hate fandom that some people even issued death threats to the writer when he gave him a redemption arc.
@@warlock8593 thats the thing .give endeavor redemption arc which make dabi and rei just simply nuts did not make sense .It prop enji up and make dabi look like a baby throwing tantrum .hori try to shift the blame as much as possible cos he cant have number 1 hero be evil .
@@theoneglorylucky3071 You lack so much basic understanding it's insane.
@@Tainted_Human sure sure
@@theoneglorylucky3071 Enji has not been forgiven even in the current manga. ALL FOR ONE HIMSELF, literally the devil of the show, says he would know a thing about ruining lives. And Enji agrees he would. Enji has not been forgiven or excused of his sins you just can't grasp something that isn't shoved down your throat.
Let's just keep in mind that Batman had both is parents taken from him, and has enough money and brains to be the most terrifying villain
Can say that for a lot of superheroes TBH
Metal says hi
Non-Bald Lex Luthor
Yeah most heros choose to be better people than to just murder innocent people around them, even after they go through horrendous trauma similarly to the villain.
“B-but secky emo boy 🥺 I can change him.” Emily you can’t even change your drawls ☠️
LMAO 😂💀😂
💀💀💀💀
Basically the argument of everyone who defends Wanda Maximoff.
Wanda isn't that. She was a broken woman who had way too much power. She also actively trying to fix her wrongs and in most casses has. She just needs a good therapy and thats it. Early Mags is more this trope than Wanda.
If talking movie Wanda i don't know shit about her.
@@hellblaze10 i'm talking about live action too, what you gave here is just her backstory she is a villain
@@sgcastle8389 Comic Wanda is a full blown hero who's done bad things.
@@hellblaze10 What's your point? i'm not talking about comics Wanda here.
@@sgcastle8389 That back story was comic wanda.
Thank you...someone who actually understands..they chose to become villains all by themselves
Count Olaf from A series of unfortunate events (the books, not the movie) is anothwr good example. He did too much without remorse, and they expected us to feel bad for him at the end. At least in the movie, they stuck with the pure evil route, which was one of the few things they did right
YES FINALLY YES PREACH IT LOUDER FOR THE BACK
Edit: i hate that trope where a characther whos is the living definition of an asshole gets a slide because they have a bad past
In real life, we’ve got people making fan clubs for serial killers.
“Oh, I wish he killed me like that 😍”
@@taurex7939 and send them love letters
So here’s the things:
I feel sympathy for characters like Dabi, or Pink Diamond, who were in shitty situations but could’ve made better choices.
I EMPATHISE with Twice, and Toga, and Spinner, who truly didn’t have a choice, who were truly only allowed to become villains.
I never thought any of these villains were "misunderstood" just good/not bad aspirations/motivations but often truly heinous methods and corruption.
Animes :"wait till we redeem them after killing thousands in a brutal way."
The only character that did it well is vegeta in my opinion and that mostly cause man knows he can't be redeemed
Sasuke: Becomes a terrorist by trying to kill the World Leaders, Commit war crimes, and killed a whole lot of people. Forgiven with the Talk-no-Justu.
@@HouYi-b6g people really dislike sasuke
@user-og8jy1ib7f Yh, that shit was horrid. And the worst part is people love Itachi whilst hating Sasuke, similar to the Dabi/Endeavour relationship, just flipped on it's head.
@@joshuaagbettor5610 yeah because Itachi was selfless
I always said this, understandable and excusable are two different things, a person can have a sad backstory and I can can understand why they doing something, but that doesn’t justify the death of innocent people
I’m gonna say this every time someone tries to defend Harley Quinn
People forgot that Harley enjoys killing and torturing people with joker. They only pay attention to the “she was abused/manipulated!” part of her as an excuse, and to ignore how she clearly will enjoy doing crime with the joker, she’s manipulative to see joker as misunderstood, not into thinking it’s ok to murder people, she knows right from wrong.
@@anotherrandomguy8871THANK YOU!!!! PEOPLE BE FORGETTING SHE LOVED KILLING PEOPLE AND SOMETIMES JOKER DIDN’T EVEN TELL HER TO DO IT
SHE DID IT BECAUSE SHE WANTED TO!!! SHE KILLED A WHOLE ORPHANAGE ALL BECAUSE JOKER BROKE UP WITH HER
@@spectraphantom5870 I can bet you, you can tell people about how she blew up an orphanage, and people will still find a way to make Harley out to be innocent somehow.
Unrelated, but I’ve went on a video before that went over the details of how Jokwr and Harley tortured Jason in the Arkam series, including allowing goons to SA him, and I still saw a thread talking about his Harley would never do this, and would instead if she knew about the SA, would try to help Jason, because it would somehow trigger her therapist side of her….even though she literally tortured the kid in the first place and has brutalized many kids before, but ok.
@@anotherrandomguy8871 if I ever see anyone try to justify fuckin Arkhamverse Harley then their opinion isn’t worth shit then because how do you try to justify a psychopath especially that version of Harley
At least sometimes she tries to redeem herself.
Master Xehanort from Kingdom Hearts. After KH3, everyone thinks he’s doing good things through bad means. The man literally committed human experiments on innocent people, stole Terra’s body, and ruined the lives of countless people because he could.
Did they really? I thought the majority consent was that Xehanort was an evil son of a gun, and that KH3's ending was too light for him.
I think he got off Scott free, but I’ve talked with a good number of people who believe that she Xehanort is a tragic hero, which has increased after the conclusion of Dark Road
I think Master Xehanort is a weird reversal of this where people *think* the ending was trying to redeem him when it wasn’t, he just admitted he lost and gave up, not a single character in the cast forgave him for what he did except Eraqus lmao, then in Remind they fucking family kamehameha his ass to oblivion as well lol