Why I Don't Like Franziska von Karma (in Justice for All)
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- Опубліковано 14 січ 2022
- Franziska von Karma sucks. In Justice for All. She’s really not that good in this game, and is one of the reasons the game is looked down upon in comparison. Like look, I don’t hate Franziska von Karma. I don’t really hate any Ace Attorney character, she does her role fine I guess but like if you look at the two people that she is sandwiched between in her role she does it worse then both of them.
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One thing I did like about her character is how she basically starts out by telling phoenix that she wants revenge on him, and you assume it's for her father, but then later you realize it's actually revenge for Edgeworth quitting being a prosecutor. She's still amoral and obsessed with victory, but it did manage to show a more likeable side in that she didn't try to blindly defend her father's actions and that she really cared about her adoptive brother.
Adoptive brother? You have quite an imagination don't you.
@@futuregenesis97I mean he isnt really wrong tho. He isnt 100% right but he isnt 100% wrong
@@futuregenesis97well von Karma, the father, practically raised Edgeworth after the elevator incident so surrogate may be more of an apt term
@@futuregenesis97It’s not canon but the anime shows von Karma as essentially being a foster father to Edgeworth, so it’s probably what they intended. And Franziska calls Edgeworth her little brother
I think Franziska is just caught in a bad situation because of JFA's rushed development cycle. If JFA had more time to stew she would've been better.
She only got more interesting in Edgeworth's games though.
"Whipping people for no good reason is literally illegal and she faces no repercussions for it."
For some reason, this line *_immediately_* reminded me of the time when Franziska showed the court a picture of Mia that she took *_illegally_* during case 2-2 and the only reason she didn't get held in contempt or arrested for it was because she didn't *_technically_* submit it as evidence.
Every single person in a saturnic should be in jail Phoenix And Edgeworth both take evidence Which they don't share which is very illegal The prosecution and the defense have to share evidence
For whatever reason I always imagined Franziska in that scene crawling across the floor and trying her best to take a photo of mia right in front of her eyes
I stg that annoyed me so badly lol because I never really liked her as much
Doesn’t Phoenix do a similar thing in 2-3? Not with illegal pictures but with evidence he shouldn’t have, which he only showed to “prove the existence” of something
@@plantainsame2049 In Japan, they don't have to share evidence, that's what I heard. After all, this game uses an exaggerated version of Japanese law. Gambling is illegal in Japan but not in America, however in AJ it is said that gambling is illegal in the first case. That is one of the examples as to how the laws are different.
I kinda agree with this. I think one can make a point about her being young and encouraged for a long time to become as arrogant and win-focused as she is, much like her father. That I think certainly explains why she's very static as a character, but at the same time, every other prosecutor (with probably one exception) are much more compelling and interesting, and if not, more entertaining and charismatic.
I really do like her in 2-4 though. Seeing her cope with Edgeworth's change of heart and Phoenix genuinely caring more about pursuing the truth than winning a case, is honestly a very entertaining character interaction.
She's definitely a character that needs more exploration. She's basically considered part of the main cast, or she's at least a supporting role in the series, and you really can't tell that sometimes, due to underdevelopment.
The only fact Manfred had only one case while she got tons of screen time and we hardly can tell what she’s like aside from her inherited traits from the father and foolish and whip while Manfred is a legendary character with a dynamite introduction and a few trait we can instantly associate with him speaks volumes about the difference in quality between the two.
I think the writer still made her a decent antagonist by recycling turnabout sisters Edgeworth and giving her a sort of dominatrix aura. Still I would rather play a version of JFA with Miles Edgeworth as the prosecutor.
I believe Franziska's character peaked in Miles Edgeworth Investigations 2, in that game she reflects on herself after seeing Edgeworth's actions throughout the last cases, specially considering the parental themes, and the fact that she doesn't have to follow the path of her father anymore and is free to follow her own.
Unfortunately that development took place in a game that wasn't localized.
Even then her arc is still too similar to Edgeworth, but without any kind of emotional attachment from the player. She is one of the worst part of Investigation 2 imo, I don't know why they insisted on bringing her back.
@@hoangkienvu7572 I have to agree with you, and I still find her character insufferable because she still whips people. Sebastian being stupid is not an excuse to whip him, he's still a 17 year old kid
I think part of the reason why Franziska DOES work well in Bridge to Turnabout is because defeating Phoenix was always secondary to her, really. I always get the feeling it's not about defeating him, it's about defeating Edgeworth by proxy.
I feel that even more than wanting to win and all, she always comes up as being completely obsessed with Edgeworth, more so than even the legacy of her father. Heck, if you play Ace Attorney Investigations, in the last case she gets to boss Edgeworth around and it's the happiest day in this woman's life. She is, then, complete.
But I agree that she never gets a proper arc and it weakens her quite a bit. I'm playing Investigations 2 now and they DID pass up an opportunity to bring her in. The true arch nemesis of the game, Justine, is a way better foil (especially with how Franziska is often infantilised so much and made to draw the silliest conclusions for no reason because of that) but since that case, Inherited Turnabout, is all about an old case between Gregory and Manfred playing out again, I'm surprised Franziska wasn't randomly roped in to sub for her imprisoned father. Heck, even having her around and declining to get invested in the whole deal would've been an interesting character moment with her letting go of the fixation on her family legacy.
I’m surprised you mentioned the fact that Von Karma wasn’t even supposed to be in the game without mentioning the REASON why she was.
They thought making edgeworth, a character people really liked, would not be fit to keep losing over and over again to wright, hence the last minute character. Hence why her character seems…kinda blank slate.
Also, it's absurd to me that she never faces any charges for witness badgering and contempt of court with all the whipping, something that should happen even in the law of the AA universe
I like the whip because it shows us how much she wants to be as good as her father, but at the same time just isn’t. Manfred had control over the courts because his very presence was intimidating, he got his way with words alone. Fransisca on the other hand doesn’t have this presences and has to rely on physical force. This is partly why I love the scene in which Pearl calls her out on all of her BS, Fransica doesn’t say anything to Pearl because she realizes it’s true and that the man she’s been emulating is a bad man.
Damn
I just like the whip because I'm a degenerate
Wow that's deep, I never even realized that.
Not to mention she is like the youngest prosecutor on the trilogy, so of course she would want to find a way to appear more intimidating, so people wouldn't disregard her due to her age
I didn't mind Franziska not changing too much in her game nor her off-screen development - if anything it shows how deeply her father influenced her compared to Edgeworth. But I'll admit it's a shame that she isn't involved in the game's main conflict (which now that I think about it is what, exactly?) and that she never shows up afterwards, there was some real potential there even without having her be Edgeworth 2: electric boogaloo.
In my opinion I think the games main conflict is how unfortunately you can’t get justice for “all” and how you live with yourself when justice doesn’t get attained I know it sounds dark but look at every case and it’s connection to suicide.
Mimi miney got overworked drugged and violated by her boss, and when she drove home she got in a flaming car accident. At that moment she chose to “kill herself” and become someone else.
Acro contemplated suicide after he realized that he didn’t kill Regina after his brother became comatose. it was actually someone he loved.
And in the final case Adrian Andrews was always troubled, her mentor killed herself, and she almost did too because of how cruel those 2 celebrities are.
I personally love the theme justice for all talks about because it’s real but it can be depressing. Case 2 is my favorite.
@@FlowMoon__3 I agree that this is the _theme_ of the game and that it's very interesting and well executed. I was considering "conflict" more as the overarching narrative across cases - think Edgeworth's arc in AA or Mia's past in T&T - which I feel is absent in JFA and is, perhaps, one of the reasons it's considered a weaker entry
@@cookedghost isn’t that everyone thinking miles edgeworth committed suicide? That was talked about in multiple cases until the end when he came back. And it fits perfectly with what I said before. JFA is so underrated. Imo it’s better than the 1st game.
@@FlowMoon__3 I thought it was DL-6?
The main conflict of JFA is Phoenix' doubts about what's an attorney. The game is a series of disjointed cases with the common theme of trusting your client no matter what, a lesson that Phoenix learned from Mia, and that is tested through the whole game. Look at how the only time he actually doubts his client is at the tutorial case while being amnesic, that alone speaks volumes.
There isn't a case like DL-6 or a villain like Dahlia that are the center of a years long conflict, it's Phoenix' personal conflict, that's why the main prosecutor can't be part of it.
In my view, Franziska was used as a foil to further help Edgeworth's character arc, and showing that losing a trial is not unacceptable if the truth comes to light. After winning the final case, Edgeworth states that in the past that he only ever had his eyes set on victory, that is until Phoenix came along and defeated him in court. Franziska's character continued to hit the nail on the head that the truth trumps all else. In cases 2 and 3, she loses due to the truth of the cases coming to light. In 2-4, after Phoenix loses, she doesn't understand why he is happy, because in actuality, he won. Everything begins with the truth
She really should have appeared in SOJ as the prosecutor for the america trials.
Yeah, instead we got the religious asshole
You wanna know the depressing part? *She’s supposed to suck.* And no this isn’t a “character learns their limitations thing” the reason they made her so bad was so Phoenix could have a mid tier prosecutor to dunk on because Payne is too incompetent to be a real threat for middle cases and they didn’t want to make edgeworth that incompetent by having Phoenix dunk on him constantly so he would be reserved for the big boy cases. Franziska is such a bad character because she only exists to give Nick someone to beat while letting everyone but her be cool.
"Justice for All," eh? 😝
Uhhh no, that's simply your opinion.
Seriously I've been saying this for years. Franziska could have been a geat character if they leaned more into the aspect of her emotional immaturity and how even if she's still basically a kid, she keeps acting like she's older and better than everyone to cope with growing up on Edgeworth's shadow. And I did think they'd go there with that final scene. But instead of that what we got is a mismatch between early game Edgeworth and Manfred Von Karma
Something thats always bugged me is that at the end of JFA Franziska says that the next time she meets Phoenix, she'll give him the missing evidence from farewell my turnabout. I thought they would do something really cool in bridge to turnabout where that evidence (somehow) helps with the current case, but its never even mentioned.
I’m only glad she’s there so edgeworth isn’t just getting wrecked by phoenix every case unlike my poor man Barok
Franziska von Karma is a character that lived on her father's shadow for a long time. It's completely reasonable why she is the way she is in that game, she even said it on the game, she wants to do what her father couldn't, defeat Wright. Her whole character motivation was to be perfect, by any means necessary. In the first game it was brought up that Edgeworth also did scummy things to get the guilty veredict, until it was later retconned as him being framed for that (which honestly, i feel it should had been left unretconned, and he has to fix up his own mess to make his redemption arc all the more important). And all of this because Manfred did those things, he teached them to be that way. Edgeworth managed to get out of that mentality, but Franziska couldn't, at least not in the second game, until at the very end, she saw Wright lose his first case, and realized that winning isn't that much more important, as it was to do the right thing. And i believe the reason why she never faced Wright in court again, is because it wasn't necessary, she saw what Edgeworth was trying to say to her. You pretty much praise Godot for his character traits, when Godot was just as awful, he was bent on revenge, and didn't care about who would end up paying for it, as long as Wright suffers. Godot is a selfish character, and he admits to it. Sure, his pain is understandable and relatable, even. But that doesn't justify his actions.
"Whipping people is illegal" oh cmon, you're saying that as if the other characters didn't do something similar, you even pointed out that Godot throwing coffee is funny, despite being illegal as well. Since that also is counted as assault.
I think people are too biased when it comes to Godot. Yes, he’s definitely a good character. But you can’t make the point that Franziska should be arrested for assault, without I don’t know- THINKING ABOUT EVERY OTHER CHARACTER! Like Franziska has whipped us (assault), Godot gives us first-degree burns (assult), Manfred has tazed us (at that point, it should be counted as attempted murder), Blackquill sends a FREAKING EAGLE AFTER US (assault), and Nayhuta tortures us with beads (assault). Saying Franziska should go to jail for whipping us doesn’t really make sense in the Ace Attorney universe. If we used that standard, then shouldn’t literally everybody other than Klavier go to jail. (Sorry I forgot Blackquill is already an inmate.) Also he said “Godot actually cared about justice”, like no he didn’t. The whole reason he became a prosecutor was to toy with Phoenix, if that’s not petty than I don’t know what is. He MAY have cared for justice when he was Diego Armando and a defense attorney, but he didn’t really seem to care about justice as a prosecutor.
Again Godot is a good character, but I just think some people are just too biased over him and the original trilogy (which is understandable but also kind of annoying). But I think JFA Franziska still isn’t really the best, she’s better in T&T and the Investigation games in my opinion. And I do kind of agree with her not really having an arc of her own, but I guess that makes sense since she’s a fill-in for Edgeworth. However, she definitely does have her good traits.
@@ladybentley1563 Ironically, Manfred is the only one to get away with it logically because the point is that he not only IS secretly a criminal all along, but he also never did it in public.(Him tazing Phoenix to rob us of the evidence had no witnesses because the police was understaffed at the time trying to get ahold of Yanni)
Do you still plan to play investingations 2 or continue the great ace attorney? Ik my comment isn't that related to the video, but Im just curious
My guess as to why Franziska is so similar to Edgeworth is that in JFA, Edgeworth was going to be the prosecutor, so I think they just wanted to change a character without having to change much of the story
I think that Franziska is a good character in Justice For All. Yeah she is similar to Edgeworth and I think that’s the reason that she doesn’t develop as much as him because if she did than we would have two of the same character. I also agree that the foolish fools and the whipping are annoying. But on the other hand I feel like when she sees Phoenix not upset about losing and she can’t understand it she really has on the inside and is just being defensive on the outside by saying things like I swear I will defeat you and all that. I wish that Trials and Tribulations had developed her offscreen kinda like how Justice For All did for Edgeworth but unfortunately she stayed the same.
I feel she'd be better in the detective/police role in the series now. Say, she gives up following after her father to "win" against phoenix wright, and instead learns forensic science where that truth can more clearly get the upper hand for her. The silly antics make more sense in investigation sections since its the downtime between trials.
She could still be a prosecutor, however she just doesn't slot in very well. She would make a great foil for Athena seeing as she's been trained under Phoenix but I believe they might as well give the role to a new prosecutor to test her. If anything she' basically doomed to be an easter egg/dlc character.
That's why I think it was a clever idea to make her join interpol in investigations, that way she can excel at the crime scenes and has relevance for complex cases, helping (or not) the main cast if they need her. She is also starting to develop her own sense of justice (helping Kay in AAI2) and I think it concludes her character arc unless a new interpol case breaks out to Phoenix and co, I would like to see her again
god JFA would have benefited of a clever 5th case (and move 2-4 to 2-5), more Franziska screentime, too, developing her more
(un)related but i am replaying the series because i miss actually good written characters and the great stuff only AA can offer, and because i am feeling nostalgic (currently in RFTA) lol i only played each game once, from 2016 up to early/mid 2017 (last game being AAI2) and only completed DD and SoJ last year
i have yet to play the GAA duology but i know everything that happens, as i spoiled myself on purpose tbh
Tho i do love her and edgeworth's relationship and her scenes in investigations but yeah in the original trilogy she's very flawed.
Tbh, i feel Franziska was better handled in the anime than in Justice for All. In the anime, she's not nearly as annoying,she's slightly less arrogant, she doesn't actually use illegal evidence and her reasons for being a prosecutor feel more freshed out. She actually thought that her dad was prosecutor that cared for justice, and she wanted to follow in his footsteps, which makes her breakdown at end more understandable.
it took me till Bridge to the Turnabout to tolerate Fransiska. The role of uncooperative buddy cop worked great with her. Behind the bench, however, she's incredibly whiny and throwing a tantrum like a petulant child, going "la, la, la, I can't hear you" from the second Phoenix beats her to her big crying scene at the end. Her prosecutorial traps were also much more obvious, though this might just be the fault of JfA, but unlike Edgeworth, Manfred, or Godot, I was never intimidated by her, perhaps due to her over reliance on physical threats. I'd really like to see what they could do with her in the modern era, however.
Yeah, Franziska isn't easy to like. I didn't like her myself until the end of the game. But in retrospect, I'd say her way of acting, especially as an opponent in court, is very realistic - if exaggerated for artistic/entertainment purposes. Of course, she hasn't got the same presence as her father or brother. She's an 18-year-old girl full of inferiorty complexes. She's spent her childhood practically overlooked and overshadowed. She says it herself at the end: she knows she's not the person people expect/want her to be, but she feels she *has* to be that person nonetheless. And that's how she comes off: like pretending, like "trying too hard". As to her behaviour outside of court: yeah, not pleasant as well. But we basically meet her at her worst. She's just lost her entire family in a very short span of time; of course she's going to be emotionally all over the place and looking for someone to blame. Godot acts like an a** too, for that same reason. Both are after Phoenix because they hold him responsible for the death/disappearance of a loved one.
She really would have needed that fourth case for herself. Involving her in the same moral dilemma that Phoenix had to face could have given her so much room to grow. At the same time, you simply cannot strip off the effects of deeply ingrained perfectionism in just a day, or even a year. I grew up very similarly to Franziska - with a strict, perfectionist parent and an older sibling who was always too many steps ahead of me - and I'm now 26 and still struggling with the remaining issues of it. It's a long, painful process to let go of principles that have guided your whole life, and it's filled with many "relapses". So, I also liked the small, subtle changes we got with her instead. Statements like "Pride is simply another trap that hinders us in our lives" show that she *is* in the process of questioning herself by the time of TaT. She's just not as outspoken and eloquent about it as Edgeworth.
Edgeworth being constantly defeated would look bad for his character though. I don’t blame the creators for making a new prosecutor, even if she’s less involved.
Can we all agree that Franziska getting chewed out by Pearl is the funniest thing ever?😂
I like her as a character, however, I don't like how she's hyped to be a prodigy and to have learned from Manfred von Karma, so she should be harder than Edgeworth, but she's so easy to defeat! She should be somewhat close to Manfred's difficulty, which would make JFA a more challenging game, and one that would require you to think more creatively, however not as difficult as Manfred because she's the prosecutor for the whole game except case 1, and that means she can't be boss level. Ace Attorney has such great concepts for characters, but so many of them aren't executed well
Honestly though, like I thought that Phoenix didn't pass law school because of the amount of dumb shit he does, but I don't even think Franziska went to a single class!
Like how is it that you became a prosecutor at such a young age, but still suck at it?
Not to mention that she has no intimidation factor whatsoever.
Both Edgeworth and Manfred are scary in their own ways, and many times when they were prosecuting the case I felt a bit scared or intimidated.
But when it was Franziska, I might as well have been fighting against Me Payne.
@@bluebird1914 Franziska doesn't have a fear factor because she's just Edgeworth rehashed. Undefeated prodigy prosecutor who started their career super young and was trained by the legendary Manfred von Karma who had a win streak of 40 years. With Edgeworth, the stakes were higher, because we were on our 2nd ever case, just lost our mentor, and were now facing off against an undefeated prosecutor. With Franziska, we defeated her father already and have experience, plus if we need to we can bring back Mia anyway. The stakes are lower.
I think that's the point of franziska, a character dosent need to have a whole bunch of backstory and her motives work with revenge from her brother's death.
Franziska is my favorite character tho.
I think the perfect way to develop Franziska without interfering with the current AA main plot would be bringing her back as a prosecutor in a future DLC case.
The ideal would be a case taking place in an overseas location, as to highlight her career as an international prosecutor,
Francheska is the most funny prosecutor at least. But yes story wise they were lazy. They just made her a shadow of edgeworth. But she made JFA fun and lots of laughs. JFA is better than ppl think!
I personally never found Franziska funny, i found to be obnoxious and annoying throughout the entire game. JFA also has some of the weakest cases and soundtrack in my opinion...
@@inactivehorse9753 case 2 and case 4 are the best cases in the series cmon now, they are both top tier. And if francheska is obnoxious the same goes for almost every prosecutor. At least francheska whipped people and had funny quotes
I almost fully disagree with you but can't really be upset bc you brought up really valid points! I'll leave my opinions below but don't feel obliged to interact with this comment (talking to your viewers as well here) if it doesn't make much sense to you. Diverse opinions are good!
- The whipping issue: it's brought up by a lot of people who are first introduced to her character and I get it, bc according to our societies' standards it's quite shocking and unlikable. In Japanese culture however, shock value is brought as a comical effect, especially in the early 2000s. Godot throwing hot coffee at Phoenix, Nahyuta hurting the main lawyer with beads (I leave Blackquill out of the equation here bc he's meant to be intimidating rather than funny when he tries to stab you)... They're jokes (I'm basing myself on a great Twitter thread I've read ages ago that explained this better than I do), and that's why it's never looked upon as an actual agression in the games. As the player, you'd tend to react like Phoenix, shocked that she doesn't face consequences, but the other characters' reactions show it's just for comedy. When Phoenix actually get hurts, the game treats it as such (falling off a bridge, getting hit by an extintor, getting hit by a car) and adds consequences to it. The rest isn't supposed to be too serious. Aaaand as a fan of Franziska, it's a subjective point, but beginning here and even more in later games she appears in, I'd argue than Franziska's whip is the materialization of her will to keep everything under her control. She's a very manic character, with obvious, deep flaws. We already see in JfA how important it is for her to be perfect (due to her origins/background), and for that she tends to control facts, manipulate proofs (though never enough to make her irredeemable in my eyes), and even control people (Gumshoe, Adrian Andrews). I am overanalyzing based on what we know of her in the Investigations games but being a very young woman promised to do exceptionally well with her job is a huge pressure for her. Her whip makes her look stronger and more confident, and that's why I find it really interesting and adding to her character.
- Foolish foolery: obviously, she says it a bit too much but I'll admit, it made me giggle at first. Also, it's a way to show that she's not a native speaker instead of telling it directly (to me, once again). By making her use a repetitive phrase or word, it seems like she doesn't always have the words to express disdain or mockery as she'd like. Instead, she learnt a very academic, scholar English. I also noticed, while replaying the first game and since the Von Karmas' get some of my favorite origins in the series, that "fool" is the first word Manfred ever pronounces in the English version.
- Her plotline in JfA, is, however, super weak and I'll agree with you on that. I'd still like to argue that she reveals herself to be a bit more likeable when the player learns that she never faced Phoenix to avenge her father but rather in reaction to her brother's "death". The fact that she's acting out of anger and grief towards a good character make her far different from our initial impression of her. I'd go as far to say that she seems to disagree with her father's actions by not acknowledging him in her quest of revenge, and yet she unmistakably looks and acts like him, except for his criminal side. That makes her an ambiguous character, that had a lot of room for growth, just like you said. She is lacking a lot of relations to the main plot of this game though, you're absolutely right.
- About her appearance in a potential AA7: I really think she'd be a great fit in a new game but I also don't know if I actually want to see her in one. I'll elaborate.
She'd be a great fit to me bc: she has grown, she could face Phoenix, but also!!! she would be a great rival for Athena. In both DD and SoJ, Athena faces prosecutors who belittle her. And I don't mean "mock" or "hate" her, like other prosecutors did with Phoenix while also recognizing his talent. Blackquill, Nahyuta, the judge and even some witnesses deem her immature or too weak to lead the defence. Now that's she's her own lawyer and can defend herself, I'd really love seeing her facing Franziska, who had to face the same problems (becoming a prosecutor really young and feeling less talented than Miles, never good enough, losing a parent...). They would make a great rivalry, and I also picture older Franziska as a mentor-ish figure, like Phoenix and Miles already are. It would be fascinating to see her evolve this way.
HOWEVER. I won't fight for her to come back because I really hate what the directors of the latest games (namely DD and SoJ) have done with female characters. That's a whole other issue, so I won't explain it in details, but Athena only has a 2h case in SoJ, where she needs to be helped and even shaken agressively by her rival prosecutor, and has to face comments about the witness's boobs (basically). Maya came back, and became really lackluster, missing all her funniness and fantasy from the Trilogy. Trucy also feels to be in her own AA4's shadow in the 3d games. In a lot of ways, Susato from TGAA (who lives like, more than a 100 years past from all these characters) feels more realistic and powerful than these women characters. I think the main scenarist for SoJ even said women in AA were better as sidekicks and that he didn't want Athena to be a leading character. So I'm at peace with the idea that Franziska will never return in the newest games. She deserves a good writing and I'm not sure she'd get it for now.
Basically, you had some really strong points and I only share different views, partly because I've played Investigations 1 and 2 since JfA (so, i don't remember if I loved her as much at first!). Ty for reading btw, this was long to type!
Fair points in your comment tbh.
@@tbone415 Thanks! Being an overthinker helps
2:40 idk what it is, it is the png of godot, the silence outside outside of the music, the fact that every single thing is like “wasn’t raised by Manfred von Karma”. Or maybe it’s all of them but man this made me laugh
Name of the song in the comparison slides. Now.
Maaaaan, Franzeska got shafted as hell. Her final major contributions in Justice for All gave me hope she’d have a good follow-up in the third game, but we don’t really get it. I wanna see her toss aside her whip entirely, I wanna see her still be harsh, but more level-headed. She does help out with the case a little, but she just didn’t do enough, which makes me sad. Of the three gams, she’s the only female prosecutor, but she’s easily the weakest character of the three.
I remember hearing that JFA did originally feature Edgeworth the entire way through but then they decided that it would be weird to have him Edgeworth lose every case after being called a prodigy in the first game. So they had to retroactively change some of the writing to account for a new character.
This actually explains every problem with Franziska. She is the same character because that's what she was when the game was still being written. She is not involved in the plot because Edgeworth already had his plot in the first game.
Spoiler for JFA ahead:
Also, they have Edgeworth take the stand in the last case which he technically wins. So they redeem the problem that Edgeworth would seemingly lose every case by only having Edgeworth prosecute the one case which Phoenix loses.
Great insight
We never see anything about the shelly card either which is a shame
After playing Spirit of Justice, I honestly couldn’t care less if we see Apollo Justice ever again.
I would much rather see more of Phoenix Wright than Apollo or Athena.
They aren’t bad characters, but Phoenix is a special character to the series while the other two are merely supplementary.
I've only played the first and second game, and a few trials in the third. My hatred for her is immense, and I'm not sure whatever people saw in other games with her would change that. When I first met Edgeworth in his first trial, I still liked him, if not, was indifferent. Day 1 of my first trial with Franziska made me LOATHE her.
I completely agree with you, and being a new fan (started the first game a couple of years ago and now being done with the trilogy) I was surprised with how popular she was with the fans. Like, her design is pretty cool but aside from that, she is easily the worst character that isn't a perverted pedophile. I hate her "foolish fools" schtick and her violence as comedy thing makes my blood boil, especially on innocent guys like Gumshoe or the judge and not getting thrown in jail.
@@Cenriquezm
Exactly. Leave poor Gumshoe alone. Man's trying his darndest each day with a smile. I'm also not exactly a new fan. First started the first game 4-ish years ago? Finished the first and second game year and a half ago maybe. And picking up where I left off on the third game now. Playing ace attorney kinda takes a lot out of me.
Honestly though.
Like Edgeworth was a dick, but you could look past it because there was a lot of mystery surrounding him. Plus I can't count a single time where Edgeworth's objections to the players point haven't made sense, so it's not like he's just making stuff up, he does have a point.
Plus I'd argue that Gumshoes idolization of Edgeworth, and Phoenix's apparent like of him, helps show that Edgeworth is more than just an asshole.
Meanwhile Franziska doesn't have that same background and we aren't given any reason to like her. Plus all of her behavior in the courtroom just feels like a parent giving in to a kid that's shouting in the supermarket.
Yeah Von Karma also did some actually dumb shit, but to his defense he's fucking scary and has been a prosecutor for what, like 40 years? It's at least semi believable for him to get away with doing what he does in the courtroom.
While Franziska just doesn't have that same presence. It's kind of sad how despite being a Von Karma, she doesn't have that.
Like everytime Manfred or Edgeworth were prosecuting and they brought up a valid point or dished out a penalty if you got something wrong I was like "Oh shit what am I gonna do?!"
But sith Franziska it's like "Alright then."
I feel like what they wanted to do with her was to make basically Manfred von karma 2 since, you know, they sent him to prison in AA1, but they fucked up the execution and we got a manfred with a whip, and no intimidation factor
I think they should've let her have her own development kinda like edgeworth on case 3 aa1. They should've let her still be the prosecutor on case 4 and kinda apply the same development that they were putting phoenix through, but in the pov of a prosecutor.
I think that would've made a great parallel and a much better story for her. Too bad that they did what they did
I hope to see your views on the 2 miles edgeworth games
"was I supposed to laugh? because I didn't" i laughed at this
I feel like Franziska has a lot of missed potential. The options for proper character development, for internal conflict, were right there, but they didn't really get utilized (though, I haven't played Investigations). I also feel like people who really like Franziska a lot like her for that potential, than for what we've actually seen in canon.
I think francisca was a great character. I like how she ended up being different than her father even if she acted just as bad or wanted to be seen like him. Her character was more subtly done overall though which I can see why that can be seen as poorly done. I think however it makes more sense to have a subtle character change instead of announcing her weakness and development aloud. I do wish she wasn't shoved more & more into obscurity after jfa though which I think was the biggest mistake when it comes to the character.
You're talking "Legal" in Ace Attorney?
Because lawyers can totally rummage through crime scenes, submit evidence mid-trial, and witnesses can just barge in after the verdict is already handed down.
In Japan, you can present evidence mid trail .
@@Sailed_away Aaah, that explains it. But do Lawyers double as detectives in Japan?
They straight up let a parrot be a witnesses in this game, so i really don't think that people should take this game as a accurate representation of the legal system lmao
@@a_naotenhonome780 Exactly my point.
@@tonystank3091 jjst highlighting because i think its funny how some people take these game too seriously lol, like a bunch of wack shit happens but they draw the line at a woman with a whip
Well i wanted her to be a likeable character , genuinely , well just because her character design reminded me of my crush at that time .
Common traits being a similar hair style , skin colour and also that black mole / mark on her face ( though unlike Franziska, my crush had hers on the chin )
The frist time I saw hee in court it reminded me of her xD but then I found that this character is just a masochist . Quite contrary
Opposite term, actually. Sadists like hitting, while masochists like getting hit.
It's weird that the game sort of pretends that it's a twist that she's a woman, by Gumshoe keeping her gender vague when first describing her.
Like why is that supposed to be surprising?
Does the game expect the audience to think that women can't be competent, despite Mia literally being arguably one of the smartest characters in the original trilogy?
Or that women can't be threatening, despite the mafia lady in 1-3 being one of the most threatening villains of the series (while also being one of the most poorly written villains of the series)?
Yeah I don't get it and honestly it comes across as a bit sexist to me, a character being a gender you don't expect them to be probably shouldn't be a twist in general unless it's done in a clever way like in the Layton crossover since otherwise it usually devolves into stereotypes (also seen in 5-3 with Robin Newman, although I actually quite like her even if I can see why some people might find her character a bit problematic haha)
I like to headcanon that Franziska has faced misogyny before which is why she thought she'd be underestimated despite being a von Karma
they probably did it this way because of the contrast in the character design of Manfred and Franziska. when you think of Manfred, he's an older, scary looking guy. so to go from that von Karma to Franziska is a surprise in that regard I suppose. maybe the writers thought that people would assume that the child of Manfred would look as intimidating as he was
sounds like toxic femininity
Agree. I love myself some strong female characters (Mia is a prime example amongst others) but when stories pull shit like 'oh you didn't think a woman is capable of this feat did you, you misogynistic man?' it makes me roll my eyes so hard. Which is why it's so disappointing to see the trope in AA since I know that the games are way better than this.
I would like to see her come back, but as a changed woman. And I think a good line for that explanation could be:
“Oh, that? That, foolish woman is gone now. She was too hellbent on perfection, when such a thing is impossible for a human!”
“So, I left her behind. I’m not living in the shadow of Manfred von Karma any longer! It’s time I became my own Prosecutor!”
I actually like her precisely because she's pre-Turnabout Samurai's Edgeworth, but has never experienced the growth he did. That's something i guessed once i saw she was a Von Karma, and her backstory. She was abroad and was clearly obsessed with the Von Karmas' idea of perfection, but was sloppy, short tempered and obsessed with winning. It all makes sense in her final scene with Miles in JFA.
For being a rushed character, she turns up to be pretty well built, all things considered. The only issue is that she never experiences a real growth in JFA until the final scene, when she's still being stubborn, but finally cracks. On that note, her cracking down in front of Miles speaks volumes of her connection with him.
Also, had Edgeworth been the main prosecutor, either he would have to be regressed to pre-Turnabout Samurai's Miles or we would have played a very different game.
I dunno, i'm watching the video and thinking that you're not looking beyond the surface.
I love franziska because she is amazing as a foil. Her story may be mid, but seeing her next to edgeworth makes me appreciate him
She's cute though. Built good.
I doubt further games will focus on apollo
Only after meeting Godot I realised that Franziska is just Edgeworth again, pre character arc. So that mean we had 3 Edgeworth like prosucutors in the Trilogy!
something i appreciated about her was in the last case of TAT when there was an earthquake and she told phoenix they wouldn’t keep him from going to the inner temple as long as she was with him. i think she realized how worried he was about maya, and she was probably worried about edgeworth too
I think almost everyone misses the point with Franziska, either just "oh wow hot blue dominating mommy" or just "annoying violent whip dumb brat". She is the character that is seemingly never good enough which is part of why I prefer her over Edgeworth or Godot, who as praised as they may be, have no flaws in terms of skill, only in character, and then they're redeemed and seem basically perfect to the point people jump to sympathize or even empathize with them; Franziska on the other hand desires so strongly to be perfect yet she is never good enough, her character is blatantly prideful, and her skill doesn't match to that of people around her, almost no one wants to empathize with her. Then in Investigations she decides to work in a different field from her father and Edgeworth so she can start being less harsh on herself and others, this being particularly pronounced in the sequel (which is part of why it is easily my favourite game in the series). I think if that game were more popular, she would be perceived in a better light, but she would remain a controversial character no matter what, that's the point, which feels particularly jarring in a series that is mostly filled with uncontroversial characters.
Always liked Franziska way more than Edgeworth (who I never felt hype for), I remember thinking "oh no" when Edgeworth inevitably came back and took the role of prosecutor. That I like her so much is why I'm even more annoyed her relation with Wright was never further elaborated on. I'll say her quirks are bit too over the top but in the world of Ace Attorney I don't really care; the whip can be a bit too much even for me at times, but the "fool" thing I find endearing. It's true that in JfA she remained mostly the same but I think her character would not work had she developed as fast as Edgeworth, her resentment and deep seated frustration are crucial, her similarities to him are as well, they're meant to contrast with each other.
This its kinda annoying how franziska is basically reduced to just a "petty ruthless woman with a whip", when she is a lot more than that.
Honestly from what I seem she is really a underrated character on the fandom
bc ur saying oh franziska only whips ppl im assuming ur disregarding her entire character + almost all of her motives. but before we actually get into her arc, i wanna talk about how you downright say "oh, she doesnt care for justice". franziska is a polar opposite to her father. sure, she likes to have quick cases and nice win records, but she is not doing that without a sense of justice. the first time you meet her she lets you plea for "a self defense bargain" because that is all she believed that case was. she saw it through and through with witness testimony and pretty damning evidence and deduced that it was a simple self defense case. but unlike manfred or early game edgeworth, she lets you plea for a self defense bargain because she knows thats the just solution in HER mind.
you also say "omg her whip is just a gag" no it is not :(((. her whole life she has had to live in the shadow of her father, but she is not her father. her father has quick wins, is controlling of everything and can easily manipulate cases. the role serves as one key point for her character, to try to be like manfred and keep CONTROL over situations. it was never a complete gag.
franziska as a character is so well thought out in justice for all its just hard to see it bc of jfas rushed writing. when you meet her you assume "shes obviously doing this for revenge over her father and how phoenix beat him" but its not, she only pursued phoenix because she believed he was tied in with edgeworths disappearance. in farewell, my turnabout she was supposed to be the prosecution, where she would finally be able to beat phoenix. but, just like her father, she gets shot in her RIGHT shoulder. i absolutely love parallels and shit like this. the trials and investigations happen and then she actively FIGHTS for justice, procuring evidence from a car crash with her arm in a literal cast after being shot just a bit before. a common sentiment throughout fans is "oh shes like manfred and hates ppl and hates justice and only cares for win records" when she is anything BUT manfred. this is symbolized earlier, where manfred kept the bullet in his arm where franziska doesnt. franziska is an active fighter for justice, and ofc people will probably say "but oh she wants to convict this person so bad" like u need to think of it from her and phoenixs perspective. phoenix is so determined to protect his client, he will stop at nothing to protect them. franziska does the exact same thing but actively fights to convict someone because she believes that people who are guilty of crimes must be bought to justice. these two clashing themes are touched on so much in farwell my turnabout but it is completely diregarded by fans.
while ofc its fine for u to hate her for being an ass hle i feel that completely disregarding all the growth and emotional turmoil she was put through is not a correct way to judge her character. this wasnt rlly well written so if u need me to clarify anything i can
The thing about the coffee is that it's an actual genuine hobby that Godot enjoys. While he enjoys it, he interrupts the courtroom with metaphors and philosophy. The same can obviously not be said about Von Karma.
disagree. franziska and her motivation to be perfect just like her dad while then realizing that she can never be perfect and that that level of perfection is only achieved by doing horrible things meant a lot to me. it’s like she has a breakdown because she doesn’t want to accept she can’t follow in her dads footsteps without also becoming a monster in the process. i think seeing her as just an “asshole” is a shallow way to look at her character and ignores all of the subtext. she’s not an asshole, she just fears showing emotion because she was raised to see that as weakness
p.s: when u said “i can’t think of any bad ace attorney characters” i just thought of the pink haired guy at hotti clinic or the fact that in turnabout big top two very much adult men were fighting each other to get with a 16 yr old little girl
i need her to come back..... fanon franziska content has made me think she's more well written in the game but alas. they need to bring her back for better development
like shes got SO MUCH POTENTIAL... SO MUCH POTENTIAL TO EXPLORE HER IDENTITY AFTER MANFRED IS EXECUTED.......
I do really like her but yah I didn't really like her saying fool a lot. I ended up skipping her fool monologue to get back to the trial faster lol.
She's also a very loathsome and an unlikable character at best in JFA, in T&T she got some improvements...
I have to say I agree with you, because seeing this made me realize she was a major part of why I almost gave up on Ace Attorney. I just decided on a whim to give Trials and Tribulations a chance, and was I glad I did, because I love Godot.
i wouldve loved to hear an actually thought out opinion but the background noise from that mic made it impossible to finish this video lol..however, shes way better in the anime, the anime gives the characters more development, and she actually is funny in that (imo) but i don't feel like what i heard from your analysis makes sense because.. shes supposed to be obnoxious, its why she says fool like 18 times in a sentence, her character is meant to be ridiculous to emphasize the protagonist(Phoenix), she also gets a really good arc at the end of the game, im not there in the anime yet but i assume she does there as well since it is so close to the game
So sorry that the free content you watched that I produce on my own time getting little money in return was not recorded with an expensive microphone 🙏🙏🙏
p.s I've since upgraded.
1:12 this being an actual line in the game baffles me. I guess the objection.lol videos weren’t overexaggerated. XD
In a way, the fact that Franz is a tad bland makes Edgeworth and Godot even better then they would already be. That blandness also might play a role in developing the story more. She stands in every time the story needs a prosecutor more challenging than Payne, but also not Edgeworth, Mr. von Karma or Godot. Also, the way the wrote JFA, they needed some buildup for the return of Edgeworth, and having a character who had it in for Phoenix because of Edgeworth leaving helped to set that up better.
When i played the first ace attorney i was lookinf forward to JFA and i was just anscious to see Franziska, but when i ended the first case with her... Omg... I missed Edgeworth so much
I learned to like her better, she is a good character in the end of the day, but oh boy, the first impression was nasty
I like they used her instead of Edgeworth, Edgeworth did a good job, but I'm glad the world doesn't have only 3 prosecutors.
It has 4, one is other's daughter, and another is that same other's student.
I would like to point out something out. In trail 3 of case 4 in the 1st AA game, when Phoenix points out that the boat care taker's parrot has the same name as Yani Yogi's dead wife, Manfred tries to discredit him by telling everyone that her grand daughter owns a dog that is named Phoenix. Franziska is Manfred's only child and 17 when Manfred made this comment. This just go's to show that nothing about this trilogy was planned out from the start before it entered production. I mean, unless you're trying to claim that Franziska was raped a couple years back, didn't abort the fertilised egg, but instead waited ontill she could give birth to it, survived giving birth and found a family that was willing to adopt the girl and that Manfred has been keeping in touch with his Grand daughter all these years, than their is no way can convince me that trilogy was planned out from the start unless you have evidence to support that wild theory.
you forgot the possibility of manfred having more than one kid
@@supersquirrel7340 than where is/are the other kid(s). You'ld think that's the case would actively mention it. Keep in mind that we are talking about a prossocuter who has never lost a case in 40 years. Also the wiki aserts my statement that Franziska is his only biological child.
@@spouwnerring yk, the kid(s) just never became prosecutors. so they weren't mentioned. also remember that the wiki is never 100% accurate and gets updated when new info is confirmed. this includes theories. also manfred appears in 1 case in the mainline games, so it makes sense for him to not mention it.
@@supersquirrel7340 the very fact these other kids are never eluded to in the francise should naturaly lead to the conclusion that Franziska is his only biological child. The animai even backs me up. I'm really that you're just ignorant on the subject and aren't trolling me. If you are, stop it or I'll block you.
@@spouwnerring the grandaughter IS alluded to, and apparently she doesn't exist? also the anime isn't canon, it's a retelling of the games. but it has a lot of differences in pacing, and dialogue.
Ace Attorney: Justice for All
She was a poor follow up to her dad. Manfred was an easy S tier prosecutor. He was intimidating and always in total control. He made practically everyone in the court scared of him in a way that didn’t feel forced or anything. He made the trial seem impossibly difficult not because of arbitrary penalties for stupid things but because the way he ran the trials and prepared everything in advance meant that the only way to beat him was to find something tiny he didn’t prepare for.
Franziska didn’t command the same presence and intimidation factor at all. Maybe she did for the in-game characters, but almost never with the actual player. And that’s the key distinction that I think truly separated her from her dad
Am actually really interesting way I think they could include Franziska in 7 is if they killed off Phoenix Wright and then had her face Appolo because
A. He was Phoenix's apprentice and is therefore the closest thing she can get to facing Phoenix
And
B. She has to see if this kid is truly worthy to follow in the footsteps of the man who destroyed her win streak
There's most likely no way Capcom would ever kill of Phoenix since clearly they're still even hesitant about letting Appolo just have his own game (I mean, before I played six I couldn't even really tell whether Appolo was in the game or not)
I actually do think she should come back
I don’t think ace attorney 7 should have a new prosecutor so if she came back and they developed her since it’s been 7 years then that would be pretty cool
Also I disagree gumshoe should come back
The series doesn’t seem to have a main stay fun loving detective character
I haven’t finished duel Destinys but I know what happens to fullbright…and I don’t think there’s a detective in Spirit of justice,
Even if it’s just for one case mabye you need to defend him in court I don’t care I just miss my boy
Spoiler but Ema Skye is the detective for spirit of justice
My problem with her, aside from no growth, is any development she could've had (her father being guilty in the DL-6 incident) was totally squandered. She could've easily been written with a desire to absolutely crush Wright because he put her father in jail but they did absolutely nothing with her already developed plot threads before she even made an appearance
People throw shade at Klavier and Nahyuta but even if you don't like them, you can't deny that they did have a large role in their respective stories, have character arcs and are necessary to the narrative. JFA is one of the most flawed Ace Attorney Games for having neither the new Prosecutor or the new Assistant (Pearl Fey) have a huge character conclusion in the final case.
I feel like a fool. Franziska is my favorite ace attorney Character.
I mean she wasn’t intended to be a great character, her purpose was to be there so edgworth doesn’t keep losing.. plus she was just 18 like basically a kid so I don’t expect her to be complex or have good morals especially when the man who raised her is the scariest villain of this game. She’s popular with the lesbians I’ll give her that. If she wasn’t a last minute addition i think she would’ve been a good character but I don’t mind her as she is
Franziska is the best
I love her though :(
Bro, I think you are seeing Franziska von Karma in a very superficial light, exactly for the reason she is the way she is. You are putting her on the shadow of Edgeworth and Godot and just saying she is worst than them, but comparing her to them will not show who she truly is.
Franziska is a tsundere, in all the possible meanings. She will never show her true nature without being forced to this (what Edgeworth needed to do to make her don't give up on her dreams). Everyone here says she is obsessed with her family legacy or with defeating Wright and Edgeworth and it is just bullshit. Proof of that? Well, she ended up becoming an Interpol agent and travelling all the world investigating large scale criminal activities. She doesn't truly cares with Von Karma's legacy or defeating her little brother, she have her own life and goals, she doesn't need to limit herself for their sake, and she doesn't want to. What you see of Franziska in Ace Attorney need to be taken with a grain of salt, because it is just a facade. You have to interpret her words and actions carefully.
This means that Franziska doesn't care about her brother? Of course not! She cares about him, and a lot! The very reason for her to fight Wright in AA2 is for her brother, the reason she persists in following her dreams and goals is thanks to her brother, to prove herself to him and to herself. It was never about Manfred, it was all about Edgeworth.
Franziska's growth is subtle, hidden in the details, and is shown when her facade is exposed and she is cornered. When you see her growth? When she becomes friend with Andrian Andrews and tries to improve her self-confidence and her self-esteem, what she actually sucessfully does in AA3. When she tells Wright that Gumshoe is okay and will not die. When she reveals her true self to Edgeworth at the end game. Franziska in AA3 is a lot better and different from her in AA2.
"Oh, Gumshoe is being abused by Franziska". This is bullshit, Edgeworth is an "asshole" with Gumshoe all the time, reduced his salary to dust, and both are friends and investigation partners. As well no one in the series takes Edgeworth's bullshit seriously, neither they do with Franziska. She is their friend and partner all the same. The difference is that Franziska will need more pressure to admit she likes them all.
The fans are making a fuss about someone that even the characters know that is a friend they can trust and care as they do with Edgeworth.
My hot take is that the all the hate against Franziska von Karma only truly exists because of NaruMitsu bullshit. The fans overestimate Wright and Edgeworth, at the expense of the minor characters that doesn't have the chance to bright as much as this fake couple. This video proves that, it talks more about Edgeworth in a video that should be about Franziska. The fans did the mistake Wright was whipped for: Franziska is Franziska, she is not Edgeworth or Godot, and she is not on their shadows. They aren't comparable at all, her social gimmick is totally different from them. The series cast knows that and treats her adequately, why can't you?
i think you hammered it home pretty well on why franziska is the weakest prosecutor in the main series. i wouldn’t say bad, but the other ones have so much more to offer:
edgeworth: conflict with himself and phoenix. described to be part of the reason phoenix became a lawyer in the first place. later goes on to realize the truth is far more important than winning.
godot: fresh prosecutor. wants to defeat phoenix to prove his worth to mia. later understand that phoenix is a true defender of people and accepts his fate.
klavier: only prosecutor to truly tarnish phoenix’s legacy (for seven years). despite his brother’s fate, he’s incredibly friendly to apollo and the people around him. also he loves rock.
simon: prisoner inmate. did what he had to protect athena, whom would later try to save him from execution.
nahyuta: goes against the revolution to protect rayfa from “the sins of the father.” learns about the truth and helps restore law in khura’in to it’s former ways.
franziska: haha look at my whip!
Klavier also had always valued the truth and even goes against his brother which is hard for him to do for the truth
I see you're forgetting about Winston and Gaspen Payne.
I wish I was in the sucked end
nah, she's bae fr
Franzika is my favorite lol 👍
i disagree
Franziska imo is just the least spicy Von Karma.
Like first we had Edgeworth who yeah is a bit of an ass at the best of times, but damn are his roasts on point.
Then we have Manfred who is just plain intimidating which gives him that extra spice.
Meanwhile Franziska has neither the presence of her father, or the wit of her adopted brother so she's just kinda boring. Idk, I just find it kinda weird that she isn't at least a bit witty since it seems to run in the family.
It'd probably make more sense if we knew who her mom was and what she was like.
Or what her relationship with her nannies/governesses were like. Frankly, it helped me a _lot_ with understanding Paris Geller.
I definitely agree that she utilizes whipping people and saying "fool" too much to the point where it either gets annoying or you think "oh this again". I think it would've been better if those were used less because i did actually laugh the first time it appeared in the game
cope
0:16 I do. I hate her with a burning passion. I damn near quit playing JFA because of her. Manfred, you hate in a way that the devs intend you to. He's a despicable, scheming and mannipulative man who ruined the life of many characters within the series directly or indirectly. Franziska, I hate due to her being nothing more than an arrogant, spoiled little brat who throws temper tantrums and hissy fits whenever she faces any mild inconvenience.
What a foolishly foolish thing to say
This sounds like what a foolish fool who foolishly speak as a fool would say
also pls dont say stuff like "She got triggered" when talking about someone being mad its disrespectful to people who can be triggered from traumatic stuff
She didn’t make a reappearance in the new games, so it’s probably because nobody likes her so they dropped her. If the next AA game comes sometime in the future, one way I would reintroduce her would be:
Phoenix and the others wonder where Franziska is and Edgeworth coldly remarks, “Franziska Von Karma, is no longer a part of our lives.” And he explains that a long time ago, she was involved in a criminal case where she was defeated miserably. And that was when she snapped under extreme anger and dishonorment that she attacked the guilty party. Ashamed she ran out of the courtroom never to be seen again. “That day,” Edgeworth says. “She lost her badge along with her honor and dignity. I haven’t seen or heard from her since.” Later, Phoenix and the others discover Franziska in a bar a shell of her former self, drinking herself to misery and still wielding that whip of hers. Phoenix gives her a chance to redeem herself and get back on her feet by helping her win the case she failed years ago. She does but is reluctant working with Phoenix at first. Eventually, Phoenix manages to finally melt her bitter frozen heart and she sees him as her friend. She also eventually makes amends with Edgeworth as well.