GASLIGHTING IN CHILDHOOD
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- Опубліковано 17 лют 2021
- Gaslighting by parents reinforces the idea that our truths and stories don't matter, aren't real, never happened, and/or that we are somehow wrong or crazy for expressing the reality of our experiences.
This video explores some of the most common gaslighting/criticizing/blaming phrases that parents may use with children, and adult children.
In so many cases, parents who gaslight clearly have their own struggles, and do deserve compassion, but this video is to help those who are their children - to know that they deserve to be heard, and that they deserve to know their stories and truths matter.
xo
http:www.drkimsage.com
@drkimsage
Dr. Kim Sage
" but you were a difficult child" " why do we have to talk about this again, this is the past" " I never saw anything" " I can never do it right for you, you are too sensitive"
Thank you for this! I think another common one is the parent pushing a "my childhood was bad, yours is perfect, you have nothing to complain about" narrative
True. 😭
Ooh yes this is a thing!
Yes! And now it’s “I did the best I could, why do you live in the past! Let it go”. Meanwhile there has never been a genuine im so sorry to anyone. I’ve had exes do this too as they repeat behavior and you bring it up they act like you’re living in the past when you’re living in it NOW
Oh my parents push that :/
This is a common one with my mom. Ironically, it just shows how completely blind she is to her own behavior, since she became a chronic alcoholic just like her abusive father and took her drunken rage out on her own kids daily/nightly. 😮💨😓
"you can't get over anything". "Why do you keep brining up the past?" It's never really past, there will always be the next insult.
I totally understand this, I get told ‘but it’s all in the past’ like I’m supposed to just get over it because I’m not physically living it anymore... when the truth is it effects my work, friendships, relationship, my self-ship, every aspect of my life! Xxx
I get that from my sister ALL THE TIME! What she doesn't realize her development was completely influenced differently. But she has her own mental illness that she is in denial of.
The past is still the present for BPD sufferers no matter how effectively we've dealt with and forgiven our parents. This insidious disorder still persists because our brains were rewired a long, long, long time ago.
This is so accurate.
"It's all in the past." Yes, but then SHE would be the one repeating the same behaviors.
I could get over it when they stop doing the same crap over and over.
The worst / most frustrating part is my mother always trying to play the victim. She goes to family members and paints this picture of me being such a horrible irrational person, but doesn’t include the part about what she did that made me so upset.
100% can relate. My mom will twist a situation and include just enough truth that it's not completely inaccurate but will completely leave out her behavior. It's the oddest thing and messes with my mind because I am not that vindictive. I'll think we had a totally fine day and then overhear her telling a family member how awful I was to her. Anything for attention. She's always the victim and nothing anyone does is ever good enough.
The thing to remember is that this is not an EQUAL dynamic. This is something narcissistic parents do all the time, they want you to believe you're on equal footing with them and it's a competition (hence "my childhood was worse"), and that's how they convince you to accept their criticisms of your behavior.
But if this occurred when you were a child especially, It is 100, 1000% on them. They were the responsible adult, they fucked up, and their own pain is IRRELEVANT to that conversation.
Can sooooo relate!!!!
I so resonate with you on this … that’s exactly what my mother has done 😢
So true
‘After ALL I’ve done for you’
‘Oh so now I must be a bad mother?’
And after telling her she doesn’t allow me to have boundaries:
‘You have crossed my boundaries over and over again, you simply don’t care!’
‘You can’t expect respect while disrespecting someone else’
Wow, thank you so much so posting this.
I didn't realize just how effected I was until I read those two quotes.
Word. for. W O R D.
Then I learned not to take it personally when I overheard her ask the family dog "Why do I have to be a part of your boundaries?" after the dog rejected her hug. For so long I made excuses for her, but now I see how selfaware she is/was. The sense of betrayal is deafening.
thx. so much :]
my gosh i really cant take it anymore it's so frustrating. my mother would never try to communicate but expects me to give everything financially to her, if i stop she tells everybody that i am the rebel.
My mom's favorite thing to say is "You always hated me! You never loved me! I was the only one that ever cared for you and you treat me like trash. You're a terrible person and should be ashamed of the way you treat me".
Then it'll flip and the next time I talk to her, she says I'm such a great mom, I'm smart, she's so proud of me, blah blah blah.
Very confusing, very damaging. You never know what you'll get with her. It's exhausting.
I am sorry - so hurtful and so freaking confusing! This splitting type of behavior is the reason I think so many people are walking around confused about their parent's love and behavior - when it's good it's so good and when it's bad, it's so hurtful. It is exhausting and damaging and hope you can receive some support and know you are worthy of self protection and not being stuck in this cycle....
I relate so much to that. My mother in law is like that. One second I'm an amazing Mom doing a great job, the next my husband and I are the reason for their problems.
“You twist everything I say” “It was a joke” “I didn’t mean it like that, you’re always taking things the wrong way” “I can’t say anything without you getting defensive” “It would be nice to get a little appreciation every now and then”
My mom uses "I was joking" ALL THE TIME. So irritating.
This describes my mother.
A person that has mental problems like your parents shouldn't give you hints.
My favorite is ur so aggressive u always get defensive
My mother's favorite phrase is, "You always want to make me out to be the enemy. I'm not the enemy, you are!"
Did he really say that? Not that I'm not believing you, but that sounds so ironic... :)
Thanks for this. My mom just told me in a sarcastic voice, “You’re right, I am a terrible mother. I ruined your life.” This was after I told her that she made my depressive episode worse by insulting me.
Ugh, so invalidating - I am so sorry. Sending you so much support:)
So frustrating!!! My mother says this type of thing all of the time.
I walked away from my mom, and she was a lot like yours. I figured I'd never fix her and trying would just bring me down as well.
I hear it same
Omg. My mother says the same any time you want to talk about any issues!
I love them but I’ve given up trying to get my parents to see what they’re doing is harmful. It’s up to me now to break this cycle and make sure I don’t do this to my future children.
I don’t love my mother for gaslighting me. I just send her information about gaslighting and who she really is and how it has destroyed my life
One common phrase my mom says consistently is “you’re not mad at me, you’re mad at yourself” and it drives me insane because I’m like no, I’m actually mad at you for doing a,b, or c.
My mil says this to my husband. Drives me nuts. 😑
My mom says something similar to that, she says, "You should be mad at yourself, not me." Like, what?
Here’s one I got last week: “that didn’t happen” “your anxiety and panic is not my fault” “I’m chalking this all up to your panic and anxiety problems because you’ve totally made this up in your head”. I experienced anxiety problems about a year ago which I’ve since gottten under control. My mom now uses it to gaslight me anytime I state my needs or boundaries.
My mom’s favorite lines are:
“I don’t see why you feel this way. You have all these things. You should be grateful”
“I didn’t say that, Jay. You must’ve dreamt that”
“You’re really going crazy. I never said such a thing to you.”
These are the classics - I am so sorry. It is crazy making for us!
I told my dad I'd take away all that he gave me financially and materialistically for him to be emotionally available to me
@@davidcampanella7846 i feel you so much, i can relate so bad
My mother's favorite tactic was, "You never think about my feelings"
Exactly, my mother used to say: "And what about MY feelings? Aren't they important to you?"
“Have I been that terrible of a parent to you?” followed shortly there after by:
“Have I failed you as a parent?”
Ahhhh… the classic 1-2 combo 🥊
OMG, my dad does that every time he's angry at me and it makes me feel so lost and confused
My heart started pounding the moment you began listing those statements. I could feel that familiar choking rage and helplessness, and the urge to fine-tune my communication skills in the hopes of finally being understood. All of those statements you mentioned were exactly what I heard as a kid. Thank you Dr. Sage for creating a space for us to be understood.
I relate to this so much. I've even told my mom "I don't know what it is I'm doing wrong that I can't seem to communicate in the way you want" like, I've spent years trying to be better or more understanding of her so I can fix whatever I'M doing wrong, but inevitably, she always tells me " why are you trying to change me??" Which crushes me because the only one Ive ever tried to change is ME for HER benefit.
Wow this hit me. You put into words exactly what I’ve felt for most of my life dealing with my mother.
My mother's favorite thing was the silent treatment. She would sometimes not talk to me for days. I can't even express how much I felt unloved, like such a terrible daughter or person. Any of the other phrases were also used. I never totally blamed her, I just kept hating myself more and more for not being good enough. At 57, I am now learning to heal. I'm left with severe rejection dysphoria that has effected every aspect of my life. But, thanks to these videos and insight, I'm mending these. I shuttered when I would hear her in my words to my older children and now to my 8 year old. I have had to apologize often and still do. I've always been open with them, and that has been their saving grace. I was never afraid to tell them I was wrong and I'm sorry.
I applaud you for recognizing when to apologize. My mom NEVER apologized and still does not. I don't think she even realizes she's the problem so why would she apologize. I apologize to my kids, it's so important for us adults to show our babies that we aren't perfect or final, that we make mistakes and can admit them and change.
My mom gives me the silent treatment as well. For a codependent person it's torture (for me anyways) and I always end up apologizing because I can't handle the rejection. It's toxic and I'm just now learning this behavior isn't normal. As a child it was just "Because I said so!!! Then silent treatment." But again, because I'm codependent I needed answers desperately to know her and I were ok. Now as adults, if I ask a direct question that she doesn't want to discuss, she just looks blankly at me and doesn't say a word. "Mom, I need you to have a conversation with me about this... *silence, as she stares at me and defiantly checks out. Or just silence and leaves the room. It's so toxic.
"You always took life too personally"
"Your sister is just mad at you because she can't be mad at who she's really mad at"
"You don't think AS YOUR MOTHER I don't understand you"
"You've always just been wound really tightly"
"You were always so sad and there was nothing I could ever do to comfort you"
I don't know if this counts as gaslighting or not, but my mother (and father and siblings) go on and on about how "bad" I was an adolescent. I was such "a terror," an absolute bitch, I drove my mother crazy, etc. But now, looking back, I'm starting to realize that I wasn't a particularly rebellious teenager. I didn't do drugs, didn't have sex, didn't get pregnant, didn't sneak out, didn't run away, didn't party. The only thing that I ever did was be really moody, wear stupid clothes sometimes, and share the same mental health issues my mother has always struggled with. That seems pretty par for the course for all teenagers. So why do they make me out like I was bad in some egregious way?
Scapegoat
I will admit when I hear have compassion for the abuser, it triggers me. No, I will not have compassion for a narcissist/abuser. I did that for 32yrs and all it did was hurt me, my girls, and still in the healing stage because he is doing it to our daughter and thank God she is a smart girl and doesn't fall for his gaslighting/manipulating Bs. I will always validate her/their feelings, they matter way more than having compassion for a very toxic individual.
I feel exactly the same. I'm like, I've had compassion since I was born. I am literally compassion embodied, and I'm so damn tired. My body is exhausted/burnt out/ and sick from caring so much. And then of course, comes the enormous guilt for feeling that way.
Ugh yes, the guilt. Feeling anything negative towards my parents causes cascades of guilt to wash over me.
My mom always says to me I never like to accept the truth and think I'm always right and apparently I'm always wrong.
And cause she's my mom I started to believe that I'm actually a narcissist. And recently because I heard someone's point of view other than my point of view I realized they also think what my mom is doing is wrong. keep in mind the person I asked was in his 50's so he should be wise, meaning maybe I'm not a narcissist, I also searched up things narcissist do and compared them to myself, I even asked my friends if they think I'm a narcissist, which they denied so I'm starting to think if my mom had gaslighted me into thinking I'm a narcissist so she could always win arguments, especially when I start to prove my point and make sense she shuts me up by saying I would never understand because I'm a narcissist and always think I'm right so I should listen and shut up :( which always made me sad but at that time I thought I felt sad cause I had lost to the argument because when I try to tell her I don't appreciate what she said to me should would say I'm delusional or too sensitive or I'm just mad I lost to the argument or It's just my personality which makes me think these things, which then completely changes the topic of how she treated me me to how I just think badly or think too much into it or that my personality is just bad. now I understand I'd always feel sad because she belittled what I said and acted as if I'm dumb and wouldn't understand and she'd tell my aunts how I'm a narcissist and laugh about me which obviously led me to distance myself from my aunts or dislike them. Even now if she reads this she would laugh and say I'm delusional and somehow make it out as if I'm a dumb kid who doesn't wants to listen and overthinks too much. I pressed on this video because I was feeling extremely sad about it and I thought about how maybe I might of actually did something wrong but I still think she should of not brushed me off and said I'm too sensitive and criticized me. I am too humiliated and upset to talk about it to my family because she probs already told them how stupid, selfish or a bad child I am :( which is why I will never say this to her face cause I know she will never take it seriously and laugh about it with my relatives and privately speak to me like I'm mentally unstable or something Either way I just wanted to get this off my chest because I feel like nobody will listen to a narcissistic, dumb, delusional, ungrateful, sensitive child :( or so my mom told them. Either way she's still my mother and she is the one who raised me until now so I don't hope anything bad upon her, especially since her child hood was rough growing up with an unloving abusive father with a weak mother who couldn't do anything about it, which she probably developed narcissism from. I hope and wish she would change the way she treats me but I doubt it. if she sees I watched this she'd probably claim that kids these days believe anything on the internet and get delusional ideas. as she always does. However I'm extremely grateful for this because I feel like I have some validation :)
PS - can you answer this so I can feel like someone is listening to my complaints 🥲
my moms most common ones were :
"why are you so angry all the time?, there is no reason, something is wrong with you" when i wasnt an angry child at all, i was afraid and sad.
"you just lie about EVERYTHING" whenever i bring up something that has hurt me and she denies it .
"you have always treated me like dirt"
and just generally telling me i am a bad person when i make a mistake
“I’m just trying to help” “it’s just a joke” always minimizing statements and twist and confuse
Yes - so common! And you're right, it can be so confusing and hurtful...
The memory thing, yes. My mom always talks about all our great memories and I'm just like "when I was a baby???" I have no good memories of her from my childhood. In fact I would have nightmares daily that she either abandoned me or turned into a literal monster....and your dreams are a reflection of your subconscious so...
I can't help but giggle over this comment. My mom does the same "remember when... what you don't remember?! I used to take you here and there alllllll the time. How can you not remember?!" Um, I literally don't think that happened because if it was all the time then why wouldn't I remember it?
Thank you for this video. I have been trying to repair a relationship after decades of NC and keep getting many of these.
And: I didn't mean it that way. You don't understand me. All I said was [modified or completely different statement]. I would never hurt you. You're taking it the wrong way.
Literally every disagreement ends in a spiral out of these. Sometimes there is a brief moment of apology followed by another round of denial for the same event.
I am at the end of my tolerance and feeling some grief. I am so tired of trying to point out the gaslighting while it's happening.
Not just parents say these things to their children, but friends, collegues, associates, co-workers, pastors, ministers, lawyers, doctors,etc,.. also say these to frown up adults. These are manipulation tactics that aim to distort your perception of reality.
I especially can relate to when someone says 'you are a crybaby' meaning that you are over sensitive. They are shifting the blame on to you.This is definitely a form of gas iighting.
My mother always describes situations in a completely different way that what actually happened, always making me look abusive towards her and when i confront her about that she plays the victim card again saying that she should be recording everything to prove that she is right and that i'm altering the story.... The woman needs serious help, i'm seeing a therapist to free myself from guilt towards her and although everyone thinks she needs some serious help she keeps saying that she should only see a therapist in order to help her help me with my anger -.- i do love her but the woman is a lunatic
I get you😢
My parents and teachers were major gaslighters. The teachers would gaslight me in front of the class which caused me to be bullied for 8 years. My mom was probably the worst one. It was a hot mess.
My mom would deny being abusive claiming she was a great mom and it was outsiders fault her other kids dropped her. The teachers would accuse me of crap I didn't do, but would punish the class when they would bully me.
I experienced the complete fabrication of stories about something I did and would be punished for it. Dad always believed her even though I would be crying that I didn’t do anything. He always took her side as if she was always more important than us
I am so sorry - it sounds like so much to endure. You deserved to be heard and seen.
My dad did a similar thing but he didn't care if it happened or not. He just told me to apologize and fix it because he didn't want to have to deal with her.
I'm in my 30's and this still happens but I've stopped doing things to "make her happy" (an unobtainable goal) and now I'm just considered "ungrateful".
Same, my dad always took my mom’s side even though she hurls tirades of insults at me
My mom's favorite phrase is " i didnt do/say that " / " you are overreacting ", i feel like if she doesnt gaslight me in some way daily its like something explodes in her brain... like today for example im pretty sick due to catching covid last minute, she sort out the medication because i was in bed and barely could speak, i went to the hall and asked her wich ones was i supposed to take, she grabs the one for allergies and the one for the fever, and tells me its those 2 she literally puls them apart from the rest , i take them and go about my day.
Earlier i went to eat a few cookies and drink tea to take the second dose of medication, so i proceed to get the fever one ( wich is the 8h /8h one ) , and she turns to me and is like : you need to take the allergy one, and i tell her that i took it earlier, and shes like " why did u take that one? its supposed to be at night or afternoon" ( to wich i also didnt know ), so i reply calmy " oh but you told me to --" i didnt even finish my sentance she went on yelling at me " I TOLD YOU NO SUCH THING, WHY YOU SAYING THAT, I DIDNT TELL YOU THAT, WHY DID U TAKE THE MEDICINE BEFORE HAND???" , to wich... again i try to tell her that she told me to and she goes on interrupting me non stop and just yelling... Seeing all this yelling and with my huge headache i calmly just tell her " ok it was a mistake then " and at this point shes still yelling at me, so i turn away to go to my room and she goes like " ITS IMPOSSIBLE TO TALK TO YOU , ALWAYS SO MOODY " ... like even if i give in and giver her the " win " she stills comes after me and talks shit to me, its like a sick game or smthing...the only way she wins is if i scream back when i no longer can take the yelling in my face she does, when that happends shes suddently the victim as always...
Sometimes i think to myself , maybe she has like an early form of alzeihmer or something? but sadly the reality she just gaslights... she needs to...
This happends with every little thing and even major ones, its a daily thing, sometimes i give up and agree with her but even that is not enought for her to stop yelling or going after me, other times im really tired of her trying to make me crazy and it goes as far as me yelling back after a few minutes of all the screaming or insults... theres no " stop " to it...
This was everyday of my life & got worse after puberty.
I am so sorry - such a painful way to live...
I absolutely love listening to you Dr Sage. I am 51 and have an NPD mother. Been no contact for 3 yrs but have been on my healing journey since 2011. One thing I heard a lot as a child was that I was incorrigible.
Thank you for making these videos. They are beyond validating for me. I’m so glad I discovered you on here❤️
I am so happy you are here with me!!
for me, the word was "beligerent"
Just had a conversation with my mom where she (1) denies what I’m saying, (2) calls me a spoilt ungrateful brat who doesn’t appreciate her (3) acts like she doesn’t want any conflict, but it’s all because of me (4) her behaviour is just a reaction to what I’m doing. Felt like I’m losing my mind, and then this video pops up. I was literally sitting here thinking why can’t she see how irrational she’s being?! Thanks so much for this, I believe she has BPD, just can’t deal with her in a way that gets a different healthier outcome despite changing my approach constantly. And since I’m the problem, I can’t convince her that therapy may be beneficial for her. So maddening.
I hope this reaches people earlier in life than it did me.
I'm almost 40 and just learning about this. It's really messed with my head my entire life. Her explanation was practically word for word how my mom is.
Within the span of one phone call with my homophobic and gaslighting mom, I heard how my boundary setting by not sending photos of my wife and I kissing at my wedding with her was the consequence of my dad brainwashing me to hate her, how she did so much more than anyone else for my wedding and I’ve never been grateful for all she does, how no parent would ever be okay not getting those photos, and also how she’s gotten over the it a week ago and gosh, why are you still so upset about this still, kiddo? I am so fucking exhausted. Thank you for this video, Dr. Kim!
Lately my parents talk to each sibling and talk trash about the others to break our bond. Just over it.
This video really hit it on the head for me. I am estranged from my mother due to her gas-lighting at every possible opportunity. "I should have sent you to live with your dad, then maybe you'd have some gratitude for all I've done!" and "you are such an ungrateful spoiled brat" and "your childhood is a dream compared to mine! I suffered! You are just ungrateful and selfish." I was also told things like "I should have listened to my friends and had an abortion." The first time she told me this, she then went on to explain to me what an abortion was. I think I was about 7 years old. She also blamed me for her not going to college, and for her drinking: "Well lord knows I can't be sober when everyone hates me anyway!" She would say things like "where is your father? why does he get off scott free?" I called my mother by her name beginning around age 4-5 because I was being "a whiney brat" one day. She got fed up and told me "don't call me mommy! How would you like it if I called you daughter?" I remember it clear as day, and never called her mom-mommy-mama or mother again. I called her by her name, like she told me to. She denies this, and swears that it never happened. I put myself into DHS services, and into a foster home at 15. My mother claims that I "left her, because I was a selfish, rebellious, pissed off teen." I mean she was not wrong, about me being pissed off, but for me it was ultimately about self preservation. Finally, in my late 40's I just decided I was done. I know I am judged for it and I also know it is painful for her, but I have never been happier and less stressed in my life. It is still painful, as the memories are there, but I made a choice to avoid exposing myself to no fresh wounds with her. My boundaries were made clear, her options for staying in my life where clearly stated. She would rather be right, angry and drunk all by herself. I keep healthy, compassionate people in my life, who are always working on being better human beings, and I am free from constant attempts at guilt trips, mean and hateful words, misdirected anger, manipulation, and blame. It is helpful to get some validation through your videos, and my one on one therapy. Thanks!
Oh honey, I just want to hug your inner child. You didn't deserve any of that and I am so sorry. You are stronger than you ever should have had to be. I hope this next stage in life is full and happy.
I feel bad for you and I totally understand you I also had a mom like yours.
“Sounds like you needed to communicate more.” *gets mad every time I communicate a differing preference*
My mother doesn't have an official diagnosis of anything that I'm aware of, but I heard so, *so* many of these growing up. Each one is a reminder of why I did go no contact, and why I don't regret it.
My stepmom sent me to your channel, and I'm so glad she did. Thank you for these videos - they're informative and validating all at once.
I’ve never forgotten ‘you could have done better than that’ when I got exam results (one A, 5 Bs, 3 Cs)
my parents! one thing that stuck with me growing up from my father was, "... Angela, what's wrong with your head?!!!"
I must have been over 40 before I got the courage to say there is nothing wrong with my head!
still I hear that stern angry dad voice in my head and say there's nothing wrong
you see I was the oldest child/parent if you will, made drastically responsible for siblings, household, father etc.
now in my late 50s found that dynamic robbed me of fun, play, joy. yeah, childhood
"what you say isn't real. I can't change something that isn't real"
yes, very common! thank you for sharing!
Love to you Ashley. I believe you.
I usually get a list of things from my mother that she has done for me since childhood because if she did those things for me and I am treating her in such a way, it should be obvious that I am just being ungrateful and disrespectful when I express my emotions.
It always amazes me how we are asked to be grateful for what parents are supposed to do as parents...any emotion can feel like a threat to highly defended parents. Sending you strength and support today in your healing journey:)
I was raised by a Vietnam veteran who was raised by mentally abusive parents and a mother who’s mom & siblings were abandoned by their father only to be sexually abused for years by her step father. I believe the majority of us were raised or are being raised by parents who suffered trauma. Then we have children and history repeats itself. But it’s NEVER to late to get help and hopefully reduce the generational pattern. I didn’t get the help I needed until my 40’s. AFTER raising an only child by myself, a daughter with her own trauma from an absent father who died of an overdose when she was 14. I see her struggling in her own marriage and raising their children. Her husband has significant childhood trauma as well. I’m thankful they are taking the steps to be better than their parents before them but destructive patterns are truly challenging to break. I cry and pray daily for them AND their children. My husband and I have found so much peace in the past 6 yrs after working hard to unravel our own childhood traumas and have the most beautiful relationship . There is hope!!
I've experienced ALL of these my entire life. My father was/is a Narcissist & Pyschopath
Story time: i never knew this was gaslighting. When i was 12 i used to tell my dad how much i wanted to go to college. He would often tell me that once i graduated highschool we could move to a school in nevada and i could go to school. My mother was a narcissist my dad was heavily abused by her. I think this was just his fantasy of leaving her and starting a new life. One day my aunt and i were talking and she asked me about eventually going to college and i casually mentioned my dads plan to move. She let my mother know. My mother got my sister and my two aunts they took me to the starbucks down the street from my house and theh all yelled at me telling me it was my fault, that i was breaking up the family, thag i was wicked and turning my father against my mom and that i am a terrible person for convincing my father to leave. I was simpley a child. I stood my ground then and allways denied her and said that my truth is my truth.
I hope you know it is not your fault. ♥♥♥♥ Both my parents were narcissists as well. It sounds like your sister and aunts are proxies/enablers of your mother's abuse. I've been told that everything was my fault too - but it wasn't either of our faults because we were kids. Unfortunately, our families wanted scapegoats and they chose us.
@@lordfreerealestate8302 yeah after reading some great books and doing therapy i know that now ❤️
“You always want more. Why isn’t anything good enough for you?” After making a reasonable request
I'm 34 now and just learning what it means to be raised by a narcissis. I knew childhood was not full of love and out of my control but never did I know that is fundamentally shaped who I am today. Definitely codependent and anxious attached. All new to me but it helped to give what was "my flaws" and internal conflict a name. This isn't my fault, I am wounded and continuing to search for that mother/daughter relationship and validation that I don't have and won't have is heartbreaking but also therapeutic. Knowing I won't get that ideal relationship but learning how to pivot and accept, heal and grieve.
My parent now totally invalidates how I feel when I bring the trauma to light.
"You don't have trauma from my gambling. It never affected you growing up." Yes Mom, it did, you wouldn't listen. "You're just being mean to me." Or the "You're lying. That never happened. You made that up." The last couple of years I honestly thought she had dementia because she was suddenly "forgetting" events or conversations that most definitely happened. And calling me crazy (making me really question my own sanity) or trying to convince me conversations between her and I happened that did not happen, just to get her way and convince me that I committed to things I never did.
Another favorite line of hers when she isn't getting her way is, "I matter too. I'm a person too." Mom, you always matter, you always come first. It's so toxic but at least I see it now.
i just moved out of my moms and into my dads house (first time i get to live with him in 18 years) my moms recent favorites are, “you put your dad on a pedestal”. “i like how you come to me for the things you need, but your dad is just the fun parent. i mean it’s fine, just hurts a little”. “your little sister misses you and wants you to come over this weekend, but i told her you’re probably busy so it’s fine.” “you should watch how you talk about your new life at your dad’s, some people are feeling forgotten or like you don’t care anymore, not me but your little sister and stepdad”. but anyway, that being said, i love my mom, but being moved out has made me realize a lot of the gaslighting, or manipulative words my mom will use. i understand her having a hard time with me moving out, especially the fact that i chose to live with my dad when my older brother always chose her. but the things she says to my little sister (who i helped raise since i was 11) hurts a lot. it’s like she’s making her feel like i don’t care about her as much, the same way she made me feel like my dad didn’t care about me when i was younger. i’m trying to put myself first and live for myself now, because i’m in an environment where i can be my priority, but my mom is making that extremely difficult. healing your inner child is a LOT of work and it’s definitely exhausting 😂
My mother was a spoiled brat...
she deserved NO compassion...but I was trapped ..I had compassion on my siblings and took over to make life as decent as it could be with the insanity around us...
THREE of them became just like her...
MY COMPASSION ENDED WHEN THEY ABUSED ME FOR A FEW YEARS...AND I SAW THIS WOULD BE MY LIFE ....
I started getting sweet feed back from strangers I helped..."the family" did not like my new friends..."CHARITY BEGINS AT HOME"🤣🤣🤣🤣
It woke me up...
They were jealous of an impoverished sweet old lady in her 70's who had no one...
had heart disease and emphysema when EVEN THOUGH I NO LONGER LIVED WITH THEM...THEY FELT I WAS "CUTTING THEIR TIME"🤣🤣🤣🤣.
I can laugh now but they REALLY hammered me about not treating THEM right.
As soon as I could bring myself to do it...I walked away ..one by one...and FINALLY after a shocking revelation by my last sister I was trying to remain friends with..I DUMPED THEM ALL...
The first holiday season was rough ...
and then one day I realized I had not thought of ANY of them in over a year..
Unfortunately..I thought I was "over it"...
But I have found out about inheritance theft by REAL criminal behavior...
and recently I have been thinking about how unfair a life I have had...
And my anger is finally raging...but I am still glad I have no feelings for any of the abusers but disgust...and am SO glad I finally started to tell what really happened and how horrible they are...
When my "mother " died I felt nothing but relief and ABSOLUTELY REFUSED TO GO TO HER FUNERAL.
Your videos have been so helpful for me as someone who struggles with c-ptsd. I would really love to see a video on adult children of BPD parents/mothers, specifically as it relates to the adult child’s inability to deal with anger in others (friends, spouse, partner). This has been a great struggle of mine. I find I really shut down at the slightest bit of anger / frustration. Are there any solutions to this?
I’m going threw the same thing … for all the years people have made me push my feelings to the side I now blow up when I’m angry or just don’t know how to process my feelings . I never know when I’m right or wrong for putting up boundaries or for just not wanting to deal with people . I literally rather push everyone away because I don’t know how to handle what comes with relationships
Dr Sage I just wanted to let you know how grateful I am for this channel. I was in a relationship with a BPD for 20 years and have a daughter with this parent. Finding a counselor to help deal with some of the issues has been a struggle to say the least. I had not even heard the term BPD until a few years ago. When I listen to you, I so very much relate to what you say. I feel validated and understood and your videos have helped me so much. I wish you where in my area my daughter as could use your expertise! please keep the videos coming and yes you have an impact!!!!!
What I think is especially infuriating is when you just wanna vent or rant to your mother about something that has absolutely nothing to do with them and they still feel the need to tell you how it's always your fault. Everything damned little thing.
Recently when I told my dad that some of his actions made me feel unloved - he said that he thinks that "I'm just saying that" which was completely invalidating. His other favorite thing to do, is to call me a hypocrite and tell me that he has the same exact issues with me as I have with him - but I know he is just deflecting because he only brings it up after I say the issue first.
What's crazy is my dad will say "You are a psycho. I'm always wrong!! I'm always at fault!!"
And then I start thinking am I really a psycho??? Like I don't even say anything back because I start questioning reality...
I strongly believe that these tactics are due to the fact that these types refuse to "struggle" and project their complete unwillingness to suffer, instead to abuse and exploit the vulnerable, the defenseless, and those they have power over. I have lost all empathy for all three of my caregivers. I now have a zero tolerance and if they could be convicted of emotional, psychological, verbal, spiritual and mental abuse I would be glad to take them to court.
There is something called a "rebrobate mind" and I have seen it and lived it. These people are unconscionable and need to be held accountable.
My mom now has the ultimate get out of jail free card for abusers. She spent decades on benzos and has dementia. And now society thinks I'm responsible for her care now. Nope! She has all her money she refused to spend on me as a child to keep her now.
"You always misunderstand what I'm saying."
"You over react to everything I say."
"I was joking."
"It really isn't that big of a deal."
"That really had nothing to do with you." (Said after I told her that not telling her 2nd husband's parents that I existed to make herself seem younger due to their 16 year age difference hurt be. )
‘Oh I have to apologise… again? I always have to apologise. You never apologise to me.’ ….after most of her irrational, rageful episodes where I never knew what had triggered it. And then she wouldn’t apologise.
This really did help, thank you. One that I just got while attempting to express my preference on something that was against what my mom wanted, she argued back with me that I should do the thing she wanted and then told me, "You don't know what you want" ... is this considered gaslighting?
The only real solution is to cut contact, carve out our own paths, and don’t look back. Nothing else really works in the long run IMHO.
It amazes me how MUCH you get this. 🙏🏼
This video, i believe, was spot on. One thing i truly struggle with is peoples denial of the validity of clinical psychology. Its not the 1800's. The data is clear. Psychology is a science. Like all disciplines in the sciences/STEM fields, psychology isnt perfect. There are some things that change over time, some that improve over time. Just like physics and some rare instances in mathematics. But we cannot throw the baby out with the bathwater here just because our grasp of psychology is not one of absolute perfection. Psychology is valid. When people argue and you prove that their perspective is incorrect using psychological fact, they often deny the validity of psychology as a whole in a paltry attempt to "win". I see so many psychology deniers who make negative and derogatory comments on Psychology videos on UA-cam. For anyone whose interests were piqued by this video and have a genuine interest in psychology but little to no knowledge on the subject, all i can do is agree with Kim and her perspectives expressed within this video. I just happened to come across this video while looking for videos to link to someone who is struggling with some issues. I have never heard of Kim Sage before, nor seen her videos. But i can assure you that i will be watching all of her content when i find the spare time to do so. Great video Dr Sage. Keep them coming!
I love and appreciate you so much for making this video. I was on a UA-cam search for something to help me with feelings and things happening in my life that I thought were so rare and most likely my own creation, my fault. Although I know I would easily tell a friend that they are in a toxic relationship, I can’t see it for myself. I will try endlessly to do or say something different, every day; only to stay where I started. A small child, with a voice that means nothing. It means the world to me that you are speaking your wise words to help others. Thank you ❤️
Here's one "Who do you think you are that you think you deserve new pair of shoes that you like and all of your friends are wearing??" For me it meant I was not worthy of anything nice. I ended us working very hard for the things I wanted which is good but being told I was not worthy of nice things really hurt while my mother spared nothing to have the finest for herself. I could go on but she is dead now.
These people are masters of projection, which we’re all guilty of to some extent, but really listen to what they say. The truth sneaks out of them almost every time they talk
Thank you for this and relatable in a lot of ways. You start to think if your feelings are valid or over exaggerated. My father isn’t the nicest man. When my mum doesn’t get her own way or she knows she’s not right in an argument she says, “you’re just like your father’ the context in which she says it is negative and really upsets me. Like there’s something wrong with me because I’m his offspring. She never apologises for it, even though I’ve told her it hurts me. Doesn’t do this to my other siblings either. I love my Mum and pray for her everyday, but I have had mental struggles recently which she doesn’t even know about. We need to take care of ourselves 1st & foremost. ❤
I started noticing how my mom would tell me to do something and then when I do it she gets mad and says "I never told you to do it"
Or "didn't I tell you to do it?" And when I stand my ground and say "No you didn't" she starts making it sound like I'm just forgetful or I'm being disrespectful.
This is so helpful - thank you! I am a child and adolescent counsellor, and this exactly describes the experience of a young client with whom I am working, who has become estranged from her father because of the pain and confusion caused by these behaviours.
I really appreciate your videos, my BPD alcoholic mother who I’ve been hurt by for the past nearly 29 years, it’s so validating. Perhaps you could make a video about relationships with BPD mother struggling with alcoholism? Or a father figure that are with these mothers and refuse to leave? Also i have profound hearing loss and would love to see your other videos (like the different types of BPD for example)but they don’t have captions. Sorry for all of the requests! Your videos really resonate with me in a special way that all of the other videos I watch haven’t been able to. I really appreciate how you make me feel less alone, thank you so much. I would love to have you for a therapist seriously.
Again, sorry for all the demands, you’ve been able to describe my experiences in such a profound way Ive been unable to find with other (very qualified and brilliant) psychologists and psychiatrists, thank you so much for taking the time to share this with us
My mother once told me she knew something about me that was very shameful and that she might tell someone if I didn't do as I was told. I waited until we had a big family gathering and at one point when everyone was in the house I told all present that I had an announcement to make. I told everyone that my mom says she knows some deep dark secret about me, and she's using it to threaten me into doing as she says. So I thought I'd give her a chance to let everyone know what this deep dark secret is, so go right ahead, mom, please tell all of us what the big secret is...mom?....oh, and after you're done, let's see who comes off looking better, you or me...... Mom...? She never said a word.
Yup yup my mom bullshits me by saying it’s always 90 percent my bloody fault
100% yet again. This is so helpful for compassionate acceptance. Thank you.
My narcissistic BPD mother used many of these gaslight phrases along with a disturbing variety of her own… “I woke up in a good mood till I saw you.”…”I never loved your father but if I hadn’t married him you would not even be here.”…”You will never have friends because there is nothing about you anyone could like.”…”You will never get married because no man could stand to be with you.”… “If I kill myself it will be because of something you said.”…etc.
My mom favorite " You are very sensitive" and I am 46 years old , how hilarious and yes..painfull at the same time, I started to communicate with her less and less, and I feel much better.
That is exactly what my mum used to tell me. "You are very sensitive". And she used to say it in a very calm, kind of superior way. And my sensitivity would of course explain all our problems. Then she would also point out to me that my siblings didn't have a problem with her. So I really would comprehend that she in no way was the problem. It really is crazymaking. A part of me can't stop believing her and I feel a lot of guilt at times because I went no contact. She could be very loving and fun but I couldn't live with her way of treating me like an enemy when I set boundaries with her.
I have never subscribed so fast. I feel understood watching this channel and gives me insight.
My narcissistic dad punished me for the way he grew up. I didn't deserve it!
This! We live with my in laws and they are like this. My husband has TBI so this is a daily thing. We are almost to the point we can move out thankfully.
Thank you so much for this video, It cleared up a lot of self doubt I had. While I was watching this I was just thinking "omg she does that"
gaslighting examples from my parents:
-If you can't give me a detailed example of when I did this to you then it must of not been that bad
-youre not acting like my son. come back when my son is back.
-the devil's in you (my mom was a jesus freak)
-threatening to call the police just from expressing my hurt
-kicks me out of her room when I call her out on her wrongs and it makes her feel uncomfortable
-when youre older you'll realize that youre wrong (im 27)
-shifts the conversation to her
-making up unnecessary chores and tasks to punish me when I call her out on her bs. and also a way to be passive aggressive
-always having a last word jab or microaggression
-my mother and sister having a bonding moment that's fueled by condemning me.
-saying "youre gonna be just like me"
there is a difference between gaslighting and criticizing child for their work by their parent . First one is done to achieve something from the victim ( has a bad purpose, the Movie "gaslight"). However parent criticize their child to make improvement in their work which is not an effective way to make child do something good.
I brought up a situation to my mom about a broken promise and instead of her acknowledging my feelings she pointed out all the things I’ve done wrong and said that my reasons for being upset were petty. I still live with my mom I go to college this august how do I combat a situation like this as a Neurodivergent
I’m going into psychology as my major so I was able to recognize that it was wrong but it still hurts a lot and I don’t have very many tools
Get out on your own as soon as you are reasonably able to. Set up a plan, try to find like-minded people in college who could be good roommates. The sooner you can get away from a home life like this, the sooner you can start to figure out who you really are and untangle the negative beliefs that have been programmed into you. In the meantime, I hope you can find a good therapist and can see them regularly.
"You're never on my side" , "why can't you just appease me?" , " Oh, you're really stuck on (a word/phrase, that was mean and hurtful) "You're annoying" .,.
“We did the best we could” Never apologizing. I just don’t talk to my Gaslighting family anymore. I have a family of choice
My father told that there is nothing for me to be resentful about because he gave me a good life. Is this gaslighting or something else?
Everytime i'm talking about thèse of my problems she cause (including push make my depression worst and made me talk to much sometimes because I'VE this strange feelings if I get silent , I will not be able to talk anymore...) because of her nasty behavior, my mother says "it's always about your problems, you're not thé only one having problems! And what about my problems, WHO IS Caring about my problems !"
"you're so ungrateful and unappreciative , I've just done too much for you." .. Good Lord, that rung a bell... I'm 3 yrs and 4 months clean and sober though. So F her!!
THANK YOU!!!!!!
My mother: You remember what you want to remember.
So relatable
I was telling my mom how she makes me feel sometimes she had the nerve to ask me when did i become so emotional... And I'm 49... I been emotional i just wouldn't say anything and I've started saying something..
Wow thank you for this ❤❤
omg I heard all of it! and i cant take it anymore
“You are crazy”
The best thing I ever did was cut all ties from my parents. Their constant gaslighting, shaming, and narcissistic behavior was toxic and ended up with me resorting to substance abuse as coping mechanism.
I feel like both my mother & my husband of 17 years equide these same character responses
Another great video!
You should do a vid on bpd gaslighting! Pure evil! X
my mother would call everyone a narc, she'd watch YT videos on it, she'd call out all the signs, proclaiming how this person and that are narcs, even her own husband, come to find out SHE has been the true narc this entire time! Hidden in plain sight! couldnt believe it, gosh, so how did she take it when she got into my dads emails seeing me calling her a narc? I exposed her, so now im a crazy addict, probably hookin on the street corner....i knew we couldnt say it to them directly, but i thought maybe i could email my dad from one of his secret emails, but of course she forced him to give her all his emails and passwords so there'd be no secrets between them at all..
i always listened to and validated her wounds, but she cant with mine. it offends her.
I am both
• victim of a BPD mother and father
• and the perpetrator as a BPD mom to my children
I just discovered this about myself and my therapy can't happen soon enough enough. My 1st appointment is July 12th.
However, being both victim and perpetrator, like everything else BPD throws at you, this is a paradox that leaves me paralyzed, unable to decide who to put first. I'm guilty! I now know what I've done to my children. I take full responsibility. How do I help them to realize I am both... I am them while at the same time dealing with both fallouts.
Where do I begin! Let's talk about frantic X's 1,000❗
I'm trying to save me while, at the same time, saving my relationship with them. Can you please offer any advice to help me cope with the fact I'm getting it from both sides❓❗
First things first. I have to put on my own oxygen mask before I can help anyone else with theirs when the plane is going down.
How do you handle implied gaslighting after when you are an adult?