Look mom, I'm on TV! It was such a joy watching you guys enjoy the mode so much after working on it! While I wasn't able to play it with you all, I was still so excited watching the matches. Shoutout to Cactus for working with me to make the mode the best we could. Fun fact: I had started working on this same idea before Cactus approached me, so I guess 5head Sombra mains think alike 😎
@@lyzder7298 okay, I will have to look into it. I want to test my own idea but it may take a lot of work. I do have coding experience so that will help. Thank for the info.
Everyone that was saing that about the last three re-works have been proven to be imbeciles that don't know a damn thing. That is exactly what is going to happen with this one. Sombra's kit isn't the problem. It's bad players.
@@Questron01 It might have something to do with the fact that every time they do a re-work on Sombra and people say it's an improvement it's objectively not and they have to try again a few months later because they screwed it up.
Not only that but it allows for more ideal strategies rather than having to worry after the invisibility goes out and wait two whole seconds just to get your translocater back. It’s been harder for me to get picks with this update I swear 😭
As much as I actually liked fighting Sombra before her re-rework, I feel like this patch would be really nice if this change was implemented, it gives her smoother flow in and out of fights and rewards being smart without just giving her the keys to the map.
To be fair, I don't think they intended for her to be balanced. And to be fair, I don't think the balance team is paid multimillions of dollars lol. They're just programmers
I don't think it's that crazy there's probably what 10 or dozens of people in that tean whilst the community has hundreds and thousands. To me the testers not complaining about how sombra played with basically having to wait out the time is kind of a red flag but if they make this change it could be a lot better I wonder if the devs see these videos
Thank God. I've been waiting for this video. Really want to see how she feels with the cool down changes. Edit: Glad to see Questron was right. And I do think 20% more dmg on a hacked target might be too strong with this cool down change. Hope Blizz sees and tries this.
My 2 cents. I would have stealth be back on shift, combine virus and hack into one ability, and make her stealth on a resource meter. These changes solve a few pain points. There will be no perma invis, but it will allow her to extend her invis by using terrain LOS to conserve her meter, this makes using your stealth a constant decision and trade off for your setup. Maybe even allow her to retain her speed boost for a bit while leaving stealth to make stealthing and unstealth smoother. Then by combining hack and virus, it makes her hack a skill shot and on a longer cooldown. I am not sure how you would add in healthpack hacking into it or if you can, but I think that would be an overall improvement.
I think this is the more interesting way to solve a bigger problem with hack. Hack feels so weak when it’s so core to her identity. They could make it more impactful with a skill shot similar to Ana’s sleep dart. Although I still miss having the gameplay loop around using translocator for more interesting repositions. I would love to see old translocator with a distance limit. Like X meters until the translocator is canceled. I don’t think they’ll ever go back to that play loop though.
Looks better than the actual Sombra(what isn't hard), but Transolocator and stealth in the same skill is still bad... IMO they should make a "Stealth meter"(like pharah fuel or Hog healing) it should be activated if you crouch or the "old translocator destroy" button, so if you want just a quick stealth you won't waste your entire CD since is a "meter". That leaves your translocator for mobility and cleanse only, and i would say it should be around 7~12 seconds this "Stealth meter" PS: Translocator+Stealth for me at least fell bad as if idk, they rework Kiriko and make Swiftstep+Suzu in the same skill, USABLE but bad...
I don't think blizzard wants sombra to just zoom around and do her own thing. But the current playstyle is just wait 4 seconds and then engage to not get fucked by the translocator cd
As another sombra player I do like the rework and think it fits the character more than the perm invis? It feels like the invis for repositioning suits the stealth thing she has in her story more than just always invisible. Also helps solo sombra stick and help the team more lol
This looks insanely good! All the praises to cactus puppy lyzder for making this for you! I would say there should be slight balance tweeks if this was implemented to tone it down a bit, but you say so yourself in the video as well. Great video Mr. Ron of the Quest!
He told his chat that he put theses changes in the creator discord community that the overwatch team have, and that Alec Dawson, lead hero designer, thumbs-upped it. they also thumbs up his rant about putting timer on stealth and 2 weeks later it happened, so there is precedent...
i know this is gonna bring back that flow but it feels like the same old perma stealth except you have to be smarter with the cooldown. i dunno just feels like the old sombra tbh. good work though
That's cuz he specifically is a high rank player who knows what he's doing Low ranks who rely on her to cover for their bad positioning still will have to pick up the slack
You’d still have to teleport once every 7 seconds with a 2 second non-stealthed gap and the enemy would hear you coming if you’re close by. It’s strong, but with way more counterplay.
I think it’s also because of his play style too. He’s always engaged in the fight so that’s why it kinda seems like old sombra. he’s never sitting around waiting for a big moment
Are you referring to the people who complained about the rework? Because if implementing this change improved the situation then they would be right lol
@bisterkding9249 this is such a minor change it's almost just a quality of life change. If this is the change they make and everyone thinks she fixed and fine then she wasn't ever ruined in the first place. She is just new and different she isn't bad just a bit clunky rn.
Extra fixes: 1) remove stealth fade in after translocator 2) decrease hack activation time 3) remove ability disable time, but still cancel currently active abilities
also, if you're going to force our decloacking, at least make it so that sombra doesn't announce herself to the entire backline when she becomes visible again
1 and 3 maybe i dont care BUT 2? No. Its even now to low and players still need to be able to cancel it. we still need some way of counterplaying by not counterswapping so making it lower will make her playstile uncounterble. So with that change you willingly force counterwatch even more so PLS NO
@@maxmoch6044 2 and 3 go hand in hand. 3 makes her less annoying to go against, but is a flat out mega super nerf. 2 is a buff that negates the nerf. This would make her more of a bruiser and less of a sneaky flanker
Actually had the same change in mind, kudos to you guys for that! Looks like it’s a solid change in practice as well as theory to me! 🎉 (Now let’s hope Blizz does something to help her like this)
You fixed my main complaint with this "rework". I still think the temporary invis alone was enough of a change and we could have kept them on separate cooldowns, but this definitely fixes the problem of her cooldown punishing her every time you try to use your abilities proactively.
waiting for the cooldown always felt like the downtime the changes wanted to remove cause i would be afk for a few seconds just so i could fail an engage
Can we please share this build with other content creators. The Game play loop is so much better great job with the changes Blizzard listen to your community or hire these guys you need to get the players that have way more hours on the heros for testing for better feed back and changes
Or just give her a second charge of translocator ? Seems simple enough and you can chain it if you really need to up to 15s stealth (because the first one will recharge).
Honestly this looks just about perfect. QoL improvement from the Dev's with this would be for inviz to proc immediately on exiting translocator. Another cool one would be pressing translocator again lets you engage it early in the throw. Adds a skill in the timing to do short or measured throws. Time it just as you get over the ledge for the high ground instead of all the way in the air above it. Time it just over a health pack instead of into the wall or past it. I like this way more the idea of combining Hack and Virus.
One thing that feels really clunky is they made the “hack->virus->shoot-> TP” pattern THE way to play sombra. Now that you have to do an input to remove invis, I find that double tapping my virus throws off my timing for the skill shot.
Looks smoother than I thought it would. My only issue with this is not seeing how the enemy team could keep track of the CD. I don't think we've ever had dynamic cooldowns before but I could be wrong.
Only one I can think of the top of my head is genjis dash but it isn't exactly lowering the cooldown it just refreshes it Edit: ventures dash when going underground works a little bit like that
my question is, why make it dynamic at all? I thought the dev team's idea of forcing sombra to be visible for at least 2 seconds was fine, so why not just make the translocator cooldown bump down to 2 seconds when sombra decloaks. I'd even be fine with 3 seconds, similar to tracer's blink cooldown
I still feel with the amount of freedom she has with speed and repositioning that there should be interactions that put her on a cooldown. Getting hard CC does work with being stunned, pinned, and slept. But as someone who wants to punish Sombra I want there to be a reward on my end as well such as damaging her in stealth takes her of of it and forces the cool down or at least a partial one base on how long she was in stealth. There should always be fun in playing her as well playing against her that if you are able to catch her that you get time to punish her. My take would still be to not allow cooldown to start until stealth is deactivated. Existing stealth due to what the player does can refund some of the timer, but if you let it run the whole stealth time or get damaged out of it she gets the full timer. Or even getting refunded time for finishing off a hacked or virus effected target. A risk reward play style that makes the player have use resource in the attempt to get her escape recharged.
This is pretty similar to an idea I had which was to give Sombra her 5s translocation CD back BUT the cooldown doesn't go below 2s while in stealth. Essentially keeping the feel of the previous translocator, while still keeping that 2s window of vulnerability that they want to have in her kit. Also maybe increase her base movement speed when unstealthed, kinda like Tracer or Genji. My main issue with the rework is how clunky it feels to just navigate the map You feel super slow when unstealthed, but if you wanna get into position quickly, you need to use her only vertical mobility tool. It just feels awful to stare at a wall and be like "oh I already used tp for increased speed and now I can't get up there for a while". I've seen people mention the idea of combining Hack and Virus, rather than Translocator and Stealth, and I'd honestly be curious to see how it feels. Though I wonder how hacking healthpacks would even work if those two abilities were combined.
This for sure makes her infinitely more interesting to play. I haven't played OW in over a year, but I'd come back for this kind of change because it looks fun and cool.
It's not in game. The change that is actually in game is they essentially removed stealth because you can no longer use it to get in position because it is attached to her escape button. If you use stealth to get in position, you can't escape. If you save it to escape, you have to stay with your team and play like soldier.
I never liked waiting in stealth and play Sombra like this anyway. So this change, alongside the rework would actually be a buff for me. The current rework actually makes me hang around in stealth longer than I normally would. I do think I would prefer just a set translocator cool down on stealth cancel though.
I think this line of buff is the way to go. However, I would want stealth increased by 1 extra second and the cd being reduced to 3s that decreases to 1.5s after 2 seconds passes
With this proposed change, compared to Venture's underground drilldash cooldown reduction, it just seems entirely inline with sensible and consistent game design.
no cause then you'd have too much control as a sombra and you'd have to implement spy checking. using translocator makes you lose both mobility options as the risk, but the reward is guaranteed mobility options while the fight or duel takes place. honestly i prefer it that way too after trying her out long enough
@@Questron01 Do you need to implement spy checking if she can only be in stealth for a few seconds? i don't think 6-10 seconds on a decent cooldown is that broken
stealth and translocator still need to be on different buttons. They were on the same button because of perma stealth. Now that there is no perma stealth we don't need translocator and stealth to be tied to the same button. It is what is making her current rework feel extremely clunky. As long as they remain on the same button she will feel clunky. Right now you are forcing her to work when you might as well just pick soldier 76 or Tracer. We have been brute forcing sombra as sombra mains each and every time she was changed. I for one am growing tired of brute forcing her especially after this most recent extreme nerf to her. I have started playing more tracer and genji despite maining sombra since 2016. She just feels too clunky right now due to her escape and stealth being tied to the same button after this nerf.
The current rework is what happens when they ignore the people who actually play Sombra. If you go back to look at the forums during the last two Sombra re-works, us actual Sombra players were 100% right about everything we said about them. And because they ignored us, they have had to do more re-works. And we're 100% right every time. The people who actually think any of this is functional aren't Sombra players and don't know a goddamn thing about her.
So she was reworked to be less oppressive on lower ranks but she’s literally made to only have 2 seconds of downtime for her to get punished which usually is not enough for lower ranks but more than enough for higher ranks to kill her , wild
this makes her so much better, the only few things i would still change is reduce hack cast time just a tiny bit and maaaybe remove oportunist bc she would do too much dmg lmao
They gave her back opportunist because now without her stealth it's pretty impossible to actually kill quickly. And they took opportunist away originally because they gave us virus. Basically, the people working on Sombra are just bad.
I think people would get very annoyed by the fact sombra would literally disorientate them or get element of suprise back every like 4 sec. She would be unkillable. Like tracer but with virus and stealth untill she starts firing.
I completely understand. It's like how clunky Lifeweaver was on release. Then they removed the clunk and he felt so much better. He's not S tier, but he's fun to play, IMO
It doesn’t seem like a bad buff for trans-locator, but this may result in having them taking something away like damage or leaving her at 225 health. This is assuming that Blizzard fix her mid-season patch. 🤷🏻♂️
I would change sombra to be a support type-like dps. Less like an invisible Tracer and more like a Symmetra where she coordinates with the team and doesn't survive on 1v1s. 1) Have Stealth as a button again 2) Change Virus to be a projectile Hack. It doesn't damage unless the opponent has the hacked status. If you use Virus while they are hacked, it doesn't hack. 3) Reduce Hack range to 10m
A cleaner implementation may be to copy-paste dva's defence matrix cooldown UI to achieve the same goal. this "what number will it be" thing requires too much head math.
This seems like it flows very nicely. And if it was implemented by Blizzard instead of the workshop so that it works* 100% of the time, and is consistent with how it works? Beautiful. * Blizzard Entertainment may or may not implement a functional feature.
You don’t even have to bother with complicated calculations, just reduce translocator CD to 2-4 seconds and only start the countdown when you exit stealth.
One other fix that may be viable is either speed up the hack animation since it's been reduced to a 1 sec lockout, or have it to where you can hack through dmg. Therefore, the last two secs wouldn't feel like you're hopeless! The problem i have with maining Sombra right now is that hack gets disrupted WAAAY too easy! Trying to hack is a risk. I wouldn't mind the extra 2 secs if i can hack without being disrupted. It can give you that small window to escape if being chased by tank. It can be an AMAZING peel tool, since thats what they converted sombra into, and it may be able to verify a kill. Her assasination aspect wouldnt be dead at all! As of right now you HAVE to hack in order to use the opportunist passive, but i guess thats why it shoukd be disrupted easily? Maybe 10% instead of 20 if you can hack through dmg. Let me know what you think?!
I feel like they could even give her two charges of translocator, maybe tweak the CD a bit in accordance, to give her some more versatility. Like the two junkrat mines. That way you can have one TL to engage, one to disengage or double down.
Another thing with Sombra right now is that you can't cancel stealth manually when hacking. The combo right now is to cancel stealth, hack, throw virus and shoot. If you don't cancel stealth, you're then stuck in the unstealthing animation during which you can't do anything, which feels very clunky.
Bro I knew something felt different. Before I could hack then throw virus right after. Now there's like this little pause in between the hack and throwing virus. Feels bad
Is there any chance of the Overwatch devs seeing this and actually implementing it? i.e. does Questron have any direct contacts or communication with them or are we just hoping they watch this?
@@Questron01 That's great to hear, I'm also hopeful. I felt like one of the few people who saw the Sombra changes and didn't totally despair, thinking she seemed situationally stronger in certain ways. It feels like a step in the right direction but your suggestion on refunding CD would be a nice, simple fix for a lot of the clunkiness, and I think something like Spilo's suggestion of combining virus with hack would be an even more impactful rework
This version of tp makes it very similar to the its previous version, or at least how i personally used translocator to go into stealth immediately. I really like it, but i do wish there was a way to just outright cancel the stealth part (especially when tp is used a cleanse/repositioning tool). Doing that would refund a bit of cd, maybe by shooting or virusing during the buffer? Ill miss perma stealth, but its not the end of the world. While i would love a longer duration to set up fights easier, id also love for them to revert the hack nerf. Im surprised to how much of a difference a .5 nerf to the lockout duration is. I hope the devs take the tp refund into consideration; making sombra less clunky is whats really necessary, because in every other aspect, she shreds people, especially tanks
I do like this proposition. I recently been way to much forced to wait out stealth and baiscally stand in corner waiting and doing nothing, this would help the dynamic gameplay for sure. I have a second thing that has been bugging me out with this change. It is the fact that you can Hack, Virus and shoot when engaging and maximizing dps. I feel it is too much and too punishable to use everything ( which might be skill issue on my part ) I was wondering what you would think about puting hack on the virus, making it an skill shot that does hack + ticks. Now that hacks is less and less a utility tool and more and more an aggressive tool I wonder if this would ease up some frustration on the enemy, augment skill ceiling and make us press two button for maximum dps ( Virus + shoot )
Overwatch Devs watching this be like: "Hey, this is a pretty good idea to make sombra fun again... Which is exactly why we're not gonna implement this into the game😀"
for me as a countered player by sombra i miss the shoot out of invis. now makes it a bit harder to track sombra at close range and kill her when she goes for an escape TP. With that change i would like to see a slightly higher cooldown on translocater in generel like 8s. But otherwise a great experiment and something they should realy think about. When it changes then in like 5 month but it would be nice for the sombra player
this right here the testing is what gaming companies SHOULD DO, but it feels more corporate based. Whatever will make the game money jus throw it iin. But this video was awesome, shoutout to the modders fr
Answer: stupid question; Invisibility is part of sombra's kit and her identity. If you think it can't be fixed because you can't handle someone using even 5 seconds of invis against you, I'm afraid you're having an issue of the skill variety.
I think it would be fun but it doesnt really fix her current issue much, like, a lot of the times you NEED translocater is when youre in a fight, you tend to need it before you get the kill, so it reseting after the kill(although nice if u manage to GET the kill) doesnt really help her disengage
Don't worry. Blizzard won't listen and they'll somehow make it worse or just leave things unchanged for several seasons. Brighter days are ahead of us, kids!
maybe it is a healthier game without perma stealth, but there was a reason everyone played her so much - bc she was one of the last DPS that gets value on their own terms and can hard carry. now widows are just wrecking every lobby and Im seeing people swapping to and then off Sombra bc she actually isnt that great against Widow now. dont get me wrong you should still be winning against Widow but its way too easy for Widows now i think they shouldve just added to older abilities to make them more like Hanzos locator arrow or Widows ult, showing the invis Sombra
i said this day 1 of new sombra s13 update, and i will say it again. The 7 secs coldown is the worst part of the changes, hands down unplayable cuz of it
@@Questron01 i like what u got here looks very fun regardless, I just don't think it will change the view of how ppl see sombra. Blizzard will see that and make radical changes down the line. Also think low rank will have a very hard time using her.
You know what actually its "SO NICE"?!! To put Sombra the way it was! Hell, I'll take Sombra from Overwatch 1 right now!!! We shouldn't have to make sacrifices for a character to play decent. If its not broken don't fix it BLIZZARD!
Look mom, I'm on TV!
It was such a joy watching you guys enjoy the mode so much after working on it!
While I wasn't able to play it with you all, I was still so excited watching the matches.
Shoutout to Cactus for working with me to make the mode the best we could.
Fun fact: I had started working on this same idea before Cactus approached me, so I guess 5head Sombra mains think alike 😎
Out of curiosity how hard is it to learn as use the workshop?
Solid work, much respect! 🫡
@@Ontarianmm it's programming but made accessible. It's mostly logical thinking, so if you're good with problem solving then it should be fine
@@Ontarianmmif I understand it right, you still need a pretty solid foundation of how coding works. But theoretically anyone can do it.
@@lyzder7298 okay, I will have to look into it. I want to test my own idea but it may take a lot of work. I do have coding experience so that will help. Thank for the info.
the in & out constant action playstyle looks really fun
Did...did a doomfist player just say that sombra looks fun? Guys the world is healing.
Doom needs a rewotk in fluidity like that. I want a proper rhythm to combos
And people say I'm crazy when I say this rework sets a good groundwork for Sombra.
@@starmoral5456no sombra sucks now there’s no point in playing sombra just go smth else that’s stronger
@@pac3930 who asked?
This change might make it the best version of sombra so far, the fluidity of pre rework with the playstyle of post
every instinct tells me to disagree yet here i am agreeing
Everyone that was saing that about the last three re-works have been proven to be imbeciles that don't know a damn thing. That is exactly what is going to happen with this one.
Sombra's kit isn't the problem. It's bad players.
@@Questron01 It might have something to do with the fact that every time they do a re-work on Sombra and people say it's an improvement it's objectively not and they have to try again a few months later because they screwed it up.
Not only that but it allows for more ideal strategies rather than having to worry after the invisibility goes out and wait two whole seconds just to get your translocater back. It’s been harder for me to get picks with this update I swear 😭
Cactus and Lyzder the goats for making this!
As much as I actually liked fighting Sombra before her re-rework, I feel like this patch would be really nice if this change was implemented, it gives her smoother flow in and out of fights and rewards being smart without just giving her the keys to the map.
Community members being better at balancing than a multimillion dollar company
Funny because they would probably do this due to probably JUST DROPPING IT, but idk
To be fair, I don't think they intended for her to be balanced. And to be fair, I don't think the balance team is paid multimillions of dollars lol. They're just programmers
They listen to silver players. Why else would they buff Bap?
I don't think it's that crazy there's probably what 10 or dozens of people in that tean whilst the community has hundreds and thousands. To me the testers not complaining about how sombra played with basically having to wait out the time is kind of a red flag but if they make this change it could be a lot better I wonder if the devs see these videos
Billion
The 3 seconds of panic I relate to so hard
Thank God. I've been waiting for this video. Really want to see how she feels with the cool down changes.
Edit: Glad to see Questron was right. And I do think 20% more dmg on a hacked target might be too strong with this cool down change. Hope Blizz sees and tries this.
My 2 cents. I would have stealth be back on shift, combine virus and hack into one ability, and make her stealth on a resource meter. These changes solve a few pain points. There will be no perma invis, but it will allow her to extend her invis by using terrain LOS to conserve her meter, this makes using your stealth a constant decision and trade off for your setup. Maybe even allow her to retain her speed boost for a bit while leaving stealth to make stealthing and unstealth smoother. Then by combining hack and virus, it makes her hack a skill shot and on a longer cooldown. I am not sure how you would add in healthpack hacking into it or if you can, but I think that would be an overall improvement.
I think this is the more interesting way to solve a bigger problem with hack. Hack feels so weak when it’s so core to her identity. They could make it more impactful with a skill shot similar to Ana’s sleep dart. Although I still miss having the gameplay loop around using translocator for more interesting repositions. I would love to see old translocator with a distance limit. Like X meters until the translocator is canceled. I don’t think they’ll ever go back to that play loop though.
Looks better than the actual Sombra(what isn't hard), but Transolocator and stealth in the same skill is still bad...
IMO they should make a "Stealth meter"(like pharah fuel or Hog healing) it should be activated if you crouch or the "old translocator destroy" button, so if you want just a quick stealth you won't waste your entire CD since is a "meter".
That leaves your translocator for mobility and cleanse only, and i would say it should be around 7~12 seconds this "Stealth meter"
PS: Translocator+Stealth for me at least fell bad as if idk, they rework Kiriko and make Swiftstep+Suzu in the same skill, USABLE but bad...
I don't think blizzard wants sombra to just zoom around and do her own thing.
But the current playstyle is just wait 4 seconds and then engage to not get fucked by the translocator cd
"current playstyle is wait 4 seconds" KMS
As another sombra player I do like the rework and think it fits the character more than the perm invis? It feels like the invis for repositioning suits the stealth thing she has in her story more than just always invisible. Also helps solo sombra stick and help the team more lol
Which rework? This is the 5th version of her in overwatch 2 because all of them have been bad because they ignored the actual sombra players.
This looks insanely good! All the praises to cactus puppy lyzder for making this for you! I would say there should be slight balance tweeks if this was implemented to tone it down a bit, but you say so yourself in the video as well. Great video Mr. Ron of the Quest!
0:24 PagMan THAT'S ME (I died)
Blizzard NEEDS to see this.
He told his chat that he put theses changes in the creator discord community that the overwatch team have, and that Alec Dawson, lead hero designer, thumbs-upped it. they also thumbs up his rant about putting timer on stealth and 2 weeks later it happened, so there is precedent...
omg this is such a good take!!!!
i know this is gonna bring back that flow but it feels like the same old perma stealth except you have to be smarter with the cooldown. i dunno just feels like the old sombra tbh. good work though
That's cuz he specifically is a high rank player who knows what he's doing
Low ranks who rely on her to cover for their bad positioning still will have to pick up the slack
You’d still have to teleport once every 7 seconds with a 2 second non-stealthed gap and the enemy would hear you coming if you’re close by. It’s strong, but with way more counterplay.
I think it’s also because of his play style too. He’s always engaged in the fight so that’s why it kinda seems like old sombra. he’s never sitting around waiting for a big moment
I've been playing Sombra since season 4 or 5 of the original overwatch. What the fuck version of sombra are you pretending existed that never existed?
This is a fantastic idea! We need the devs to see this! Maybe try this with a nerf to Virus, and see how it plays with that sacrifice?
maybe not virus but the hack yes
It took me the entire first game to understand what was the change LMFAO
Excellent video, now we just have to wait for the "I was wrong about Sombra videos" for full vindication.
Are you referring to the people who complained about the rework? Because if implementing this change improved the situation then they would be right lol
@bisterkding9249 this is such a minor change it's almost just a quality of life change. If this is the change they make and everyone thinks she fixed and fine then she wasn't ever ruined in the first place. She is just new and different she isn't bad just a bit clunky rn.
@@Psuedopsyde You've apparently never actually played this game. Or you're on the low end of the IQ spectrum.
Extra fixes:
1) remove stealth fade in after translocator
2) decrease hack activation time
3) remove ability disable time, but still cancel currently active abilities
also, if you're going to force our decloacking, at least make it so that sombra doesn't announce herself to the entire backline when she becomes visible again
1 and 3 maybe i dont care BUT 2? No. Its even now to low and players still need to be able to cancel it. we still need some way of counterplaying by not counterswapping so making it lower will make her playstile uncounterble. So with that change you willingly force counterwatch even more so PLS NO
@@maxmoch6044 2 and 3 go hand in hand. 3 makes her less annoying to go against, but is a flat out mega super nerf. 2 is a buff that negates the nerf. This would make her more of a bruiser and less of a sneaky flanker
So basically you want to see hack removed.
Actually had the same change in mind, kudos to you guys for that! Looks like it’s a solid change in practice as well as theory to me! 🎉 (Now let’s hope Blizz does something to help her like this)
You fixed my main complaint with this "rework". I still think the temporary invis alone was enough of a change and we could have kept them on separate cooldowns, but this definitely fixes the problem of her cooldown punishing her every time you try to use your abilities proactively.
waiting for the cooldown always felt like the downtime the changes wanted to remove cause i would be afk for a few seconds just so i could fail an engage
Can we please share this build with other content creators. The Game play loop is so much better great job with the changes Blizzard listen to your community or hire these guys you need to get the players that have way more hours on the heros for testing for better feed back and changes
i gave the code to fitzy and ruben, idk if they're gonna try it out tho
@@Questron01 can i kiss you no diddy
🤣
Or just give her a second charge of translocator ? Seems simple enough and you can chain it if you really need to up to 15s stealth (because the first one will recharge).
she'd never beat the tracer allegations lmao
Honestly this looks just about perfect.
QoL improvement from the Dev's with this would be for inviz to proc immediately on exiting translocator. Another cool one would be pressing translocator again lets you engage it early in the throw. Adds a skill in the timing to do short or measured throws. Time it just as you get over the ledge for the high ground instead of all the way in the air above it. Time it just over a health pack instead of into the wall or past it.
I like this way more the idea of combining Hack and Virus.
You shouldn’t be punished for choosing to go out of stealth but this feels a tiny bit too strong but it’s a good idea for sure
One thing that feels really clunky is they made the “hack->virus->shoot-> TP” pattern THE way to play sombra. Now that you have to do an input to remove invis, I find that double tapping my virus throws off my timing for the skill shot.
Looks smoother than I thought it would. My only issue with this is not seeing how the enemy team could keep track of the CD. I don't think we've ever had dynamic cooldowns before but I could be wrong.
Only one I can think of the top of my head is genjis dash but it isn't exactly lowering the cooldown it just refreshes it
Edit: ventures dash when going underground works a little bit like that
@@MetalBalu01 I'll look into that then, since I haven't really played her. Thanks for the heads up!
my question is, why make it dynamic at all? I thought the dev team's idea of forcing sombra to be visible for at least 2 seconds was fine, so why not just make the translocator cooldown bump down to 2 seconds when sombra decloaks. I'd even be fine with 3 seconds, similar to tracer's blink cooldown
I can live with the new stealth changes if they reduce the cooldown of translocator when cancelling stealth early.
I still feel with the amount of freedom she has with speed and repositioning that there should be interactions that put her on a cooldown. Getting hard CC does work with being stunned, pinned, and slept. But as someone who wants to punish Sombra I want there to be a reward on my end as well such as damaging her in stealth takes her of of it and forces the cool down or at least a partial one base on how long she was in stealth.
There should always be fun in playing her as well playing against her that if you are able to catch her that you get time to punish her.
My take would still be to not allow cooldown to start until stealth is deactivated. Existing stealth due to what the player does can refund some of the timer, but if you let it run the whole stealth time or get damaged out of it she gets the full timer. Or even getting refunded time for finishing off a hacked or virus effected target. A risk reward play style that makes the player have use resource in the attempt to get her escape recharged.
Looks really good, cd depends on your skill. But still rather have stealth on command with a button instead of a translocator combo
600k views in -8 minutes? Bro fell off.
This is pretty similar to an idea I had which was to give Sombra her 5s translocation CD back BUT the cooldown doesn't go below 2s while in stealth. Essentially keeping the feel of the previous translocator, while still keeping that 2s window of vulnerability that they want to have in her kit.
Also maybe increase her base movement speed when unstealthed, kinda like Tracer or Genji.
My main issue with the rework is how clunky it feels to just navigate the map
You feel super slow when unstealthed, but if you wanna get into position quickly, you need to use her only vertical mobility tool. It just feels awful to stare at a wall and be like "oh I already used tp for increased speed and now I can't get up there for a while".
I've seen people mention the idea of combining Hack and Virus, rather than Translocator and Stealth, and I'd honestly be curious to see how it feels. Though I wonder how hacking healthpacks would even work if those two abilities were combined.
This for sure makes her infinitely more interesting to play. I haven't played OW in over a year, but I'd come back for this kind of change because it looks fun and cool.
It's not in game. The change that is actually in game is they essentially removed stealth because you can no longer use it to get in position because it is attached to her escape button. If you use stealth to get in position, you can't escape. If you save it to escape, you have to stay with your team and play like soldier.
@@thegolem9325 yea I know it's not in the game, that's why I said I would play again if it was.
I never liked waiting in stealth and play Sombra like this anyway. So this change, alongside the rework would actually be a buff for me. The current rework actually makes me hang around in stealth longer than I normally would.
I do think I would prefer just a set translocator cool down on stealth cancel though.
My issue was, that like this, it’s almost like having perma tracer blinks, with the ability to control high ground.
A damage nerf might be a good idea
I think this line of buff is the way to go. However, I would want stealth increased by 1 extra second and the cd being reduced to 3s that decreases to 1.5s after 2 seconds passes
minor number tweaks is up to big top blizzy G's, but the core idea honestly flows too well to not be on my hands and knees for
With this proposed change, compared to Venture's underground drilldash cooldown reduction, it just seems entirely inline with sensible and consistent game design.
At this point why wouldn't they just put stealth as an separate ability again?
no cause then you'd have too much control as a sombra and you'd have to implement spy checking. using translocator makes you lose both mobility options as the risk, but the reward is guaranteed mobility options while the fight or duel takes place. honestly i prefer it that way too after trying her out long enough
@@Questron01 Do you need to implement spy checking if she can only be in stealth for a few seconds? i don't think 6-10 seconds on a decent cooldown is that broken
stealth and translocator still need to be on different buttons. They were on the same button because of perma stealth. Now that there is no perma stealth we don't need translocator and stealth to be tied to the same button. It is what is making her current rework feel extremely clunky. As long as they remain on the same button she will feel clunky. Right now you are forcing her to work when you might as well just pick soldier 76 or Tracer. We have been brute forcing sombra as sombra mains each and every time she was changed. I for one am growing tired of brute forcing her especially after this most recent extreme nerf to her. I have started playing more tracer and genji despite maining sombra since 2016. She just feels too clunky right now due to her escape and stealth being tied to the same button after this nerf.
huh what are you saying?
do you mean you want to remove virus?
The current rework is what happens when they ignore the people who actually play Sombra. If you go back to look at the forums during the last two Sombra re-works, us actual Sombra players were 100% right about everything we said about them. And because they ignored us, they have had to do more re-works. And we're 100% right every time.
The people who actually think any of this is functional aren't Sombra players and don't know a goddamn thing about her.
@imperialdra-mon5907 you wouldn't have to remove virus to add a separate button for stealth
I hope the devs see and implement this. This is amazing!
So she was reworked to be less oppressive on lower ranks but she’s literally made to only have 2 seconds of downtime for her to get punished which usually is not enough for lower ranks but more than enough for higher ranks to kill her , wild
this makes her so much better, the only few things i would still change is reduce hack cast time just a tiny bit and maaaybe remove oportunist bc she would do too much dmg lmao
i think opportunist is half the fun this kit, but 20% damage boost might be too much-- 10% would be ok or just taking out the damage boost
They gave her back opportunist because now without her stealth it's pretty impossible to actually kill quickly. And they took opportunist away originally because they gave us virus.
Basically, the people working on Sombra are just bad.
I'd be interested to see how this plays vs 2 charges of transloactor which is another popular change I have seen floating around.
I think people would get very annoyed by the fact sombra would literally disorientate them or get element of suprise back every like 4 sec. She would be unkillable. Like tracer but with virus and stealth untill she starts firing.
I completely understand. It's like how clunky Lifeweaver was on release. Then they removed the clunk and he felt so much better. He's not S tier, but he's fun to play, IMO
This actually looks good. The main problem seemed to be the heaps of downtime. This would fix that
It doesn’t seem like a bad buff for trans-locator, but this may result in having them taking something away like damage or leaving her at 225 health. This is assuming that Blizzard fix her mid-season patch. 🤷🏻♂️
I would change sombra to be a support type-like dps. Less like an invisible Tracer and more like a Symmetra where she coordinates with the team and doesn't survive on 1v1s.
1) Have Stealth as a button again
2) Change Virus to be a projectile Hack. It doesn't damage unless the opponent has the hacked status. If you use Virus while they are hacked, it doesn't hack.
3) Reduce Hack range to 10m
A cleaner implementation may be to copy-paste dva's defence matrix cooldown UI to achieve the same goal. this "what number will it be" thing requires too much head math.
This seems like it flows very nicely. And if it was implemented by Blizzard instead of the workshop so that it works* 100% of the time, and is consistent with how it works? Beautiful.
* Blizzard Entertainment may or may not implement a functional feature.
babe wake up new questron movie
this is a very nice change I wish blizzard would implement it
You know you’re in trouble when the community does a better job at balancing a character better than the devs.
You don’t even have to bother with complicated calculations, just reduce translocator CD to 2-4 seconds and only start the countdown when you exit stealth.
2 second translocator is crazy
@@Questron01 hey I said 2 to 4
One other fix that may be viable is either speed up the hack animation since it's been reduced to a 1 sec lockout, or have it to where you can hack through dmg. Therefore, the last two secs wouldn't feel like you're hopeless!
The problem i have with maining Sombra right now is that hack gets disrupted WAAAY too easy! Trying to hack is a risk. I wouldn't mind the extra 2 secs if i can hack without being disrupted.
It can give you that small window to escape if being chased by tank. It can be an AMAZING peel tool, since thats what they converted sombra into, and it may be able to verify a kill. Her assasination aspect wouldnt be dead at all!
As of right now you HAVE to hack in order to use the opportunist passive, but i guess thats why it shoukd be disrupted easily? Maybe 10% instead of 20 if you can hack through dmg.
Let me know what you think?!
i think she needs:
1. a longer stealth period, say 10 seconds
2. a second translocator
3. faster base movement
she feels so awkward to play.
They need this change
8:25 - THIS is how I learn they added an elevator to that rooftop???
I would play her if this was a thing tbh
I feel like they could even give her two charges of translocator, maybe tweak the CD a bit in accordance, to give her some more versatility. Like the two junkrat mines. That way you can have one TL to engage, one to disengage or double down.
sombra would never beat the tracer clone allegations
The speed buff from stealth sould be on all the time as a passive if they want to remove Infinite stealth.
Another thing with Sombra right now is that you can't cancel stealth manually when hacking.
The combo right now is to cancel stealth, hack, throw virus and shoot. If you don't cancel stealth, you're then stuck in the unstealthing animation during which you can't do anything, which feels very clunky.
@@ScoutOnly you can actually, just not with primary fire. Both melee and virus of it's off cooldown work
Bro I knew something felt different. Before I could hack then throw virus right after. Now there's like this little pause in between the hack and throwing virus. Feels bad
with some experimentation, its just bugged. you can destealth mid-hack if you use your virus button if you have virus up
praying blizzard watches your videos for this update
Unrelated, but Cactuspuppy is an wholesome and adorable username.
Is there any chance of the Overwatch devs seeing this and actually implementing it? i.e. does Questron have any direct contacts or communication with them or are we just hoping they watch this?
i indeed am in the developer discord and have given my feedback, including references to having tried it out n stuff so im hopeful
@@Questron01 That's great to hear, I'm also hopeful. I felt like one of the few people who saw the Sombra changes and didn't totally despair, thinking she seemed situationally stronger in certain ways. It feels like a step in the right direction but your suggestion on refunding CD would be a nice, simple fix for a lot of the clunkiness, and I think something like Spilo's suggestion of combining virus with hack would be an even more impactful rework
This version of tp makes it very similar to the its previous version, or at least how i personally used translocator to go into stealth immediately.
I really like it, but i do wish there was a way to just outright cancel the stealth part (especially when tp is used a cleanse/repositioning tool). Doing that would refund a bit of cd, maybe by shooting or virusing during the buffer?
Ill miss perma stealth, but its not the end of the world. While i would love a longer duration to set up fights easier, id also love for them to revert the hack nerf. Im surprised to how much of a difference a .5 nerf to the lockout duration is.
I hope the devs take the tp refund into consideration; making sombra less clunky is whats really necessary, because in every other aspect, she shreds people, especially tanks
I mean I had the idea of just making the translocator a 3 second cooldown that starts when you exit stealth but this is almost the same thing so
I do like this proposition. I recently been way to much forced to wait out stealth and baiscally stand in corner waiting and doing nothing, this would help the dynamic gameplay for sure.
I have a second thing that has been bugging me out with this change. It is the fact that you can Hack, Virus and shoot when engaging and maximizing dps. I feel it is too much and too punishable to use everything ( which might be skill issue on my part )
I was wondering what you would think about puting hack on the virus, making it an skill shot that does hack + ticks. Now that hacks is less and less a utility tool and more and more an aggressive tool I wonder if this would ease up some frustration on the enemy, augment skill ceiling and make us press two button for maximum dps ( Virus + shoot )
Overwatch Devs watching this be like: "Hey, this is a pretty good idea to make sombra fun again... Which is exactly why we're not gonna implement this into the game😀"
Someone send this to blizzard
Blizzard has to see this and implement this
It will make playing her so much more engaging for both the enemy and player. PLEASE BLIZZARD LISTEN
Yes questroon plz get this to the devs, save the sombra comunity
Ok you've won me round silly purple man.
I'm sure even the bad community will enjoy this, their biggest problem with her was the stealth
Blizzard if you're watching this I suggest you take some notes
would love to see this on live
i think they should buff sombra moovespeed while invis, it just feels realy slow for like onyl 5secs where would u go in 5secs
Player agency > passively waiting for cooldowns to count down
I hope blizzard sees this and actually do something........
for me as a countered player by sombra i miss the shoot out of invis. now makes it a bit harder to track sombra at close range and kill her when she goes for an escape TP. With that change i would like to see a slightly higher cooldown on translocater in generel like 8s.
But otherwise a great experiment and something they should realy think about. When it changes then in like 5 month but it would be nice for the sombra player
this right here the testing is what gaming companies SHOULD DO, but it feels more corporate based. Whatever will make the game money jus throw it iin. But this video was awesome, shoutout to the modders fr
Question: what if they 100% removed invis but put her tp on a 4 seconds cooldown?
Answer: stupid question; Invisibility is part of sombra's kit and her identity. If you think it can't be fixed because you can't handle someone using even 5 seconds of invis against you, I'm afraid you're having an issue of the skill variety.
Mmmh I think a reset translocator after kill will be more fun
I think it would be fun but it doesnt really fix her current issue much, like, a lot of the times you NEED translocater is when youre in a fight, you tend to need it before you get the kill, so it reseting after the kill(although nice if u manage to GET the kill) doesnt really help her disengage
you'd only get another translocator when you dont need one anymore-- after the kill
@@Questron01 i mean in that way u can kill and go away or relocate
Don't worry. Blizzard won't listen and they'll somehow make it worse or just leave things unchanged for several seasons. Brighter days are ahead of us, kids!
why not put stealth on crouch? like make it so if you're holding crouch for like a second you activate the stealth and divorce it from translocator
too many buttons
@@Questron01 four is too many? ball has 4 ability slots, you don't need to give her a new button. I feel like holding crouch just makes sense
maybe it is a healthier game without perma stealth, but there was a reason everyone played her so much - bc she was one of the last DPS that gets value on their own terms and can hard carry. now widows are just wrecking every lobby and Im seeing people swapping to and then off Sombra bc she actually isnt that great against Widow now. dont get me wrong you should still be winning against Widow but its way too easy for Widows now
i think they shouldve just added to older abilities to make them more like Hanzos locator arrow or Widows ult, showing the invis Sombra
This makes Sombra OP again
Yeah this is only slight buff she needs the gameplay now is cool.
7 seconds cool down need to go- is so awkward
this rework looks much better, even to someone who doesn't play sombra
i said this day 1 of new sombra s13 update, and i will say it again. The 7 secs coldown is the worst part of the changes, hands down unplayable cuz of it
Wouldn’t it be simpler to just straight up lower the cooldown that would probably be the change made
nah cause then you're back to just having perma stealth with extra steps or a stealth that's worthless
This autoplayed. I legit thought I heard DSP.
Let's all pray that this get added 🙏
Idk man, feels like ppl will still complain about sombra. Constant popping in
its already substantially better than last 12 seasons combined lmao
@@Questron01 i like what u got here looks very fun regardless, I just don't think it will change the view of how ppl see sombra. Blizzard will see that and make radical changes down the line.
Also think low rank will have a very hard time using her.
You know what actually its "SO NICE"?!! To put Sombra the way it was! Hell, I'll take Sombra from Overwatch 1 right now!!! We shouldn't have to make sacrifices for a character to play decent. If its not broken don't fix it BLIZZARD!
I do have to say the damage is insane.
yeah hack damage boost might need a little nerf