The handling pack is the only way to go, that was your mistake. Drive one and you’ll recognize the stiffer suspension, aero, and Trofeos make all the difference in high speed turns
The Dark Horse is special, period. How special? Well let’s see… For starters it recently won NASCAR Cup (1st and 2nd place). It also ran into the 8’s in the quarter mile. No GT’s to be seen anywhere doing that. Zero regrets here. Oh and I plan to “go fast” with it too with a little help from Roush. 😉
@@timothygray4643 Nope. The serial number alone makes it special. Whether you or anyone else agrees with it or not is irrelevant. As for fast the Dark Horse is leading the pack and the higher price tag includes more than just the go fast button. Shit, a Tesla can go fast but it can't handle with a damn. 🙄
You can argue about this spec or that or fractions of a second from the factory. Coming up on one year with mine and i still grow more in love daily. Was into mine very heavy out the door (I live in an area where a dealer premium to be one of the first guys on the road with one is unavoidable). Seemed outrageous at the time but as someone who has owned and driven a lot of the sport/track cars in this range dh compares very highly. Less than ten years ago you could get into a new Carrera for about that or m4. now a competition goes well into six figures and base carreras start at 130. I traded and e53 amg for it and ftype, sl550 before that. The horsy belongs and although those cars have luxury and sport features Ford will never have. I can honestly say the dark horse is probably the most thrilling and enjoyable daily driver of the bunch.
My 2010 IS F hangs with these mustangs 0 - 90 MPH. I paid 23.5k for it 5 years ago. Simply not interested going faster 0 - 60. If I did care about speed I'd definitely would've bought a corvette or CTS V. Out of my 4 vehicles - I still drive my 90's cars more. My newest being a '24 WRX. Mustangs are everywhere & most new owners are very cocky. Definitely had the pleasure of doing 3 pulls against a 2022 in my IS F at work. They were shocked to say the least 😊
I really like the interiors on those. Good car for the money. The aftermarket/tuning aspect hasn't caught up to the previous gen though. That'll change with time!
It's a Gen 3 with GT 500 Rod's.. I told everyone from the start it was a Gimmick and to just get a GT PP if you absolutely had to have an S650. But Honestly the best buy out there to this day is the S550.. It's the same car with 2 air boxes and a different Intake. Not trying to knock what anyone has but it's better to just do a Base Performance Pack..
I agree kind of agree. Its not that fast or special of a car which is why I didn't buy it. And I really hate the front eyeliner look. I think if you buy a handling pack car in manual, keep the miles down and don't modify it, then it might be worth a little something someday. In my opinion, they need a new GT350. If you are going to modify a Mustang, your better off with the GT base car.
Good video, I opted for the same thing. I bought a 14 GT, I opted for that one because I really don't like the idea of independent rear suspension in the back. I'll keep my solid axles, no one can argue that the coyote is at one of the best v8s ever made though.
I just sold my 2021 gt500, I've owned 2 now and they just don't do much for Me and they do not put the power down very good at all. Much prefer driving my hellcat.
Smart move.. They are already dropping in Value now that people are realizing they can just get a GT and be happy.. Most people end up Mod'ing the hell out of these cars anyway and if you know you are that type of person just get a Base GT with some options.. And if you aren't into Mod'ing I would still get a GT and option it out how you want..
One of the best new muscle cars on the market. And i have to respectfully disagree with you that these cars are not special, Right now you're looking at one of the biggest droughts in car sales since the collapse of the auto industry in 2008. As you know there's $100,000 vehicle sitting on lots getting lot rot. That's why you're seeing prices on everything not just a dark horse go down especially on trade-in value. No one's buying real expensive vehicles right now It's just a simple as that. My uncle has been the top salesman at Dodge in my area for over 40 years. He's actually 80 something and still working lol. That being said I'll respectfully disagree and I think that when you go to try to buy this car in 15 years you're going to see the price up like crazy when there's no more V8s being manufactured and hasn't been in over a decade I have a feeling you're going to regret this. I could be totally wrong but that's just my opinion. I also see people making massive power out of the lesser GT engine which, again I'm going to disagree with you and say that the dark horse engine is a lot more well built than the GT engine when it comes to forged parts different camshafts etc. Not to mention the better transmission. You're saying 7th gear is grenading on people but that's not entirely the case you've had people that have had this happen and when there was some back research done on it They had people working on the car that shouldn't have been to begin with! If we are talking about the same people. Anyways I likely won't watch this channel too much more because I'm a Mustang guy hands down unless you of course go through with what you said and build a GT up I'll definitely check in. But I'm going to set a reminder in my phone for a years time lol. So you better have two damn awesome cars built to the nine when I come back here in December 2025 lol! Be well man and God bless
I'm always moving on to new cars, so you must be new here lol. I'm a car enthusiast. More so for making fast cars and racing them. But, I'm not tied down to one specific brand. Life is too short to not experience as much as humanly possible. It's all good to disagree! No hate here!
@FitzCityGarage for sure I am new here. I am in the same Mustang group you are, I went and checked your subscribers and there's 3,000 most of the channels I watch are 100,000 plus. But like I said man all the best in your new endeavor. I also enjoy tons of cars I have an old Mark 4 Toyota Supra that you could comb your hair in the paint I keep it immaculate. As well as a new Acura Integra type S, I'm also very into motorcycles and off-road side by side and ATVs. Anything with an engine and I'm down to learn about it! Take care
there are more options than just Whipple, how come only the Whipple was discussed here? I'm going with a custom tuned stage II Procharger on my 2019 Challenger; doing forged internals and a cam, upgraded fuel system, upgraded drive train, etc. My mechanic tells me I'll be near or at 1000 WHP when it's done. Check my progress here: www.youtube.com/@1000HpScatPack
Whipple and Roush are the only ones that have a "Tune" for the superchargers on the 2024+ Mustangs. The ECUs are still locked unfortunately. That would be the route I take if I decide to. Good luck on your car! Going to be badass!
@@FitzCityGarage thanks man! Here in Europe there is no monopoly on unlocking the ECU like in the States; my understanding is that in the US you have to send Dodge ECU's to a specific firm to get them unlocked. Over here the guys doing custom builds unlock it themselves in house. My mechanic does it with his laptop and does the whole custom tune in-house as well. We have to, as it's too expensive to courier the ECU to the States every time you need to put a super charger in your ride. I'll do a video about that part of it when we get to that stage of the build. Right now we are putting in the forged internals, there is some videos up on my above second channel about where we are at right now. Planning to document the whole process on UA-cam. Note: if you get a stage I procharger that comes with a ready tune as well; it's the stage II ones that need a custom tune but that then allow you to mess around with nitrous and alcohol fuels and stuff (which is what I plan to do)
Unfortunately, the Dark Horse was just a rebadged Mach 1 for significantly more money. It's still a good car, but it's just a mach 1 that Ford's been gaslighting us about.
This is such an ignorant statement. The Dark Horse is not "just" a rebadge. A lot of R&D went into improving aero and handling among other notables like the engine and interior and exterior design elements which I find better and prefer. The Dark Horse makes refinements (not a complete overhaul) over the Mach 1 which is a good thing. Is it worth it? That's an individual choice but regardless the Dark Horse is a better car but perhaps not a lot better to appeal to everyone. That would be the GTD but then you're going to REALLY pay for it.
@BULZAYE maybe some R&D went into aero but handling!? The only difference between the DH and Mach 1 in the handling department is the steering knuckle, which many say is worse, and the new generation of magneride. Engine is nearly identical to the GT which is a gen3 coyote with dual throttle bodies. Watch this CCs other videos. Sure the dashboard is new. I personally cant stand the tacked on screen but thats just a personal preference. The GTD isnt even in the same universe since its $325k and nobody who traditionally shops for a mustang can afford that. Thats just Jim Farleys pet project. Its not ignorant to say the DH is a rebadged Mach 1 because thats exactly what it is. It's a mach 1 with a different name and graphics. It's kind of a waste of a nameplate. Couldve been an NA cross plane crank 5.2 or something truly different but instead Ford just phoned it in.
@@House_of_Schmidt Very few have said the steering was a little questionable, but the vast majority said it was an improvement. The Gen4 engine has more similarities than differences with the Gen3, but the changes are made in key areas. Fitz glossed over or misunderstood the some of the statements made by AED (cams for instance). This could be seen as a testament of the Gen3 block rather than a ding on Ford's decision making. Remember this is an S650 car incrementally up (in nomenclature) from an S550 car so it stands to reason similarities will exist. It's not like we went from an S95 to an S197 that some think should have been. The point of the GTD was in reference to delusional minds thinking that there should have been more. If you compared the price points (like I did) of a similarly equipped GT the price delta was around $5K-$6K. People need to put that into perspective which has been totally lost here. Not to mention inflation. Taking THAT into account you're not gonna buy much more for the "extra" cost. Would it have been nicer to have a truly Gen4 motor and boost built in? Heck yeah. But it wouldn't be anywhere near this price tag in today's market. Again, it is ignorant to say it's rebadged because it clearly is not no matter how much you wish it. I saw value in the Mach 1 and was interested save for the crazy cockpit that is in the S550 and a few other aesthetic reasons. I saw more value in the Dark Horse and appreciate the clean and forward looking IP. As for badges they should have done the grill and hub caps right but didn't so I do ding Ford for that. I'm not interested in the cross-plane crank, too unreliable for boost. As for Farley's pet project, you'd have to prove that and no the GTD isn't for everyone, but some seem to think it should be.
@BULZAYE ed krenz literally called the dark horse an evolution of the mach 1. Its a mach 1 dude. Yea its a new generation but its largely just the mach 1 even according to the chief engineer. The cross plane crank NA 5.2 would likely be reliable. Ur thinking of the Flat plane which is the one that has oiling issues in the gt350. I have a 2015 GT and drove a 2024 dark horse. I personally think the steering is faster but more numb. It may be the tires since they went to pirellis instead of the Michelins but idk. My issue with the s650 is that it didnt address ANY of the complaints of current mustang owners and instead added new issues like the dash out of a kia forte that nobody was asking for. I mean they literally polled gen z for a car thats priced for boomers. They didnt listen to mustang owners. The s650 didnt address the weight issues of the s550, didnt address the quality issues of the s550 and didnt address the mt82 issues of the s550. Instead they gave us some generic looking dashboard. A weird looking nose on the GT, a drift brake that nobody asked for or will ever use on their 55k+ car. The whole s650 is just phoned in right now.
@BULZAYE and also anytime i see the garbage Millennial marketing term "forward thinking", i instantly think of a Marvel slop failure. Im sure Jaguars new commercial was supposed to be "forward thinking". The reason dark horse wasn't used before 2024 is because the name sound like something thought up by a board room of middle aged women. The logo even looks like something drawn in a Middle School art project by the girl who loves horse. It looks like it belongs on a ranch, not a muscle car.
The best "mustang" Ford has made in the last 60 years was the 2015-2020 GT350.....really hard to beat that. Truly a special car, engine and experience.
@glvera749 not all of them, it definitely over blown and honestly there alot of owners that convince themselves they have oil consumption when they really don't and the oil consumption is just due to their driving habits and not a failure.
I totally agree. I’ve got a ‘19 GT-350 and it is such an incredible driving experience. It runs great, drives great, and sounds so fucking good! There’s no sound like it.
Yeah I definitely agree with you on that bro, these commenters obviously never really built fast cars that actually make sense 😅😅😅🤣🤣🤣🤣that's exactly why I bought a new 2022 Mach 1 with handling package, payed 45 for it, and after I blow it out I will be like 58 all in.
He's right. There isn't much of any difference between the GT and darkhorse other than the logo and chasis number. I can run down everything that the GT Premium performance pack has, but it is actually as good as a base darkhorse with better interior for 1k less. The Premium preformance pack darkhorse does have some updrades for 10k more, plus markups. I couldn't find a performance pack darkhorse MT near MSRP so I did the loaded GT Premium performance pack with mag ride. I probably should have just bought a Mach 1 and saved 10k, or the C7 Z06 for 10k more.
@@jessicaphoenix1312 53k fees in and out the door before taxes for darkhorse premium. The GT premium with performance package and magnaride suspension active valve exhaust, nite pony package with upgraded b&o sound system was 65k$ before taxes.. Which the 25s you now have to pay to have the better sound system that comes standard on DH, the magnaride went up hundreds of dollars, no more wireless phone charger, ect ect. You don't get the differential cooler you do on DH, you don't get the upgraded motor parts such as the better crankshaft the forged rods from the gt500.. You get less HP, differently tuned suspension, smaller exhaust tips, I can go on and on. They are no longer sitting at MSRP or above at least not here in Canada. Like I said I got my dark horse premium for over $10,000 less than a GT fully loaded 2025 custom order. In the exact color I wanted with all the features standard that they took away for the 2025 model year in the GT like the wireless charger and the B&o sound system etc that I mentioned. It would make absolutely no sense to not get the dark horse over the GT. It's a better built faster car at the end of the day that's it.
@@TheKingOfKings818 No, you do get ALL the coolers on the GT pp - I'm looking at one in my garage. And fully loaded with mag ride was 61k sticker - I didn't pay that - and it went up to 66,100 for 2025. There is a lot of misinformation going around about these crs. The extra horsepower is just in the tune. 14 bhp in a tune? not gonna matter when I get the blower installed anyway. I don't know why nobody seems to know thaat the GT pp has someMach 1, GT 350, and 500 suspension parts.
@@TheKingOfKings818 Your negotiating skills are irrelevant; "I got it for X" breaks the entire comparison, so it's useless; use MSRP, or we can all just claim to have gotten a better deal. I think the DH is the better option, but not because there's more value in a 'performance' package; there never is (again, your negotiating skills notwithstanding). The DH is the better option because it'll be the only one with any resale value, in 20-years, when all the more-affordable trims are horribly customized, or totaled.
Not disagreeing with your overall point, just want to interject the idea that the Dark Horse is a collector's edition car. I get that they added all of this 'performance' crap onto it, but we all know that you're not going to see Dark Horses at your local track days, either.
That’s actually hella funny, in my neighborhood there are 3 mustangs and 3 dodge chargers 🤡, no Camaro, no SS’s or G8’s, no CTSV’s and it’s pretty sad actually
If you want something different. You should consider a BMW G42 M240XDrive with a gen2 B58. Haha, I typed this right before you said. HIghly recommend a B58/S58 Xdrive. Excellent after market support, performance ceiling+versatility, and such a great value given all you get in those all season all weather practical daily platforms. You can easily push the G42 up to 700WHP, if you upgrade the trans & internals you can easily push it to 1200-1300WHP. Just depends on your budget. Black or Purple are the two best looking colors for the G42. The M340 is another great option if you want a sedan, tho the G42 is a bit lighter. I will say, the M340 isnt quite as snappy at high WHP levels(1000+WHP). The shorter wheelbase(while 5 inches may not seem significant) it does make the G42 a little more snappy at high WHP and require quicker responses. If you want something another level above, I can also highly recommend the G82/G80 Comp Xdrive with the S58. Build costs will be a bit higher cause its a true M car ie M Tax if you go further than stage 2, but just basic mods(Intake, downpipes, & custom E45-E50 tune) will hit approx 9.7 1/4 mile, which can be pushed down to approx 9.5 if you upgrade to lighter rims, better tires, and a little weight reduction. Ive owned a G80CXD and now a G82CXD with full carbon package & CCBs and could not recommend them more. I also have a few friends with heavily modified M340 & G42. Ill be fully building our the G82CXD later this winter. Will be a first-in-class drag & show car. Building her to be a low 8 second 1/4 car while maintaining most of her OEM drive-ability+feel... S58's are expensive to fully build out, but they are modern marvels of a platform. Tough to beat when all variables are considered. Reliability Build Quality Interior Materials Fuel Econ After Market Support+Community OEM Performance Performance Ceiling Performance gains with basic mods Performance versatility(dig, roll, prep, no prep, street, track, backroads) Adaptability & Drive-ability Practicality & Usability Technology They may not offer the performance ceiling of a GTR or the space of a Blackwing 5, but their damn better than a Jack of All trades... More like a King of All trades, Ace of None type of platform. Super easy to push up to 1200WHP, as long as you have the $... Even if you stick to around 1000WHP from Hybrids will put you in the 8.9-flat 9's with the right supporting upgrades. No matter if you choose a M240iXD, M340iXD, or G8xCXD you absolutely wont be disappointed! Itll quickly become your favorite car to drive!
Appreciate the info! I really am considering an M240i. The value on those are unreal. 600+whp would absolutely rip. Then get the trans built, and add another 100whp. Thing would be a monster lol
I also had a 2017 zl1 camaro and looking back that was the best bang for the buck car I've ever owned. Just picked up a hellcat durango and this vehicle is a BLAST to drive.
Awd power is super fun on the street. I definitely want to have one of my 2 vehicles coming up to have that capability. Can't beat the fun of a fast awd/4x4 vehicle!
Really ask yourself what you want to do with the car. Assess that, look at much that will cost, and compare. That's the best advice I can give. I could absolutely afford the car. But it just logically didn't make sense to have it based on what I ultimately like to do with my cars.
Hopes for tuning sooner than later and that the engine would be a lot more different. But after a recent engine teardown video came out, it's not special at all lol
I’m gonna give him a break. He didn’t really know what he had. He’s a little young by the looks of things and he just wants to go fast so you can do that with a goddamn cavalier.
@ lol Doesn’t matter what you’ve had. I just watched your whole video. All you wanna do is go fast doesn’t matter what car it is.Lol like I said, apparently you didn’t know what you had
No one knew until the engine teardown video. Literally not a single person knew 100% what the engine was like. NOW people know. Hence, car is gone. Overpriced GT confirmed.
The handling pack is the only way to go, that was your mistake. Drive one and you’ll recognize the stiffer suspension, aero, and Trofeos make all the difference in high speed turns
I could take a sharp turn in my ZL1 at 130mph, so...
I had a 24 Darkhorse with the Handling pack, that made for a great driving car.
The Dark Horse is special, period. How special? Well let’s see… For starters it recently won NASCAR Cup (1st and 2nd place). It also ran into the 8’s in the quarter mile. No GT’s to be seen anywhere doing that. Zero regrets here. Oh and I plan to “go fast” with it too with a little help from Roush. 😉
Twin Turbo GT's have been in the 7's for years now bro, so im not sure what are you saying?? Are you saying no GT has hit 8's with a supercharger?
justifying his purchase that’s all. A Cheaper gt is better than the dark horse for going fast.
@@timothygray4643 Nope. The serial number alone makes it special. Whether you or anyone else agrees with it or not is irrelevant. As for fast the Dark Horse is leading the pack and the higher price tag includes more than just the go fast button. Shit, a Tesla can go fast but it can't handle with a damn. 🙄
@@brianmiller1977 You are out of scope bro. Topic is on S650's namely between the Dark Horse and GT variants.
The dark horse is Mid as fuck lol
I say get a good used 2014 Shelby GT500 S197 and tune it, that's the best mustang in my opinion, the 5.8L is the most powerful engine.
You can argue about this spec or that or fractions of a second from the factory. Coming up on one year with mine and i still grow more in love daily. Was into mine very heavy out the door (I live in an area where a dealer premium to be one of the first guys on the road with one is unavoidable). Seemed outrageous at the time but as someone who has owned and driven a lot of the sport/track cars in this range dh compares very highly. Less than ten years ago you could get into a new Carrera for about that or m4. now a competition goes well into six figures and base carreras start at 130. I traded and e53 amg for it and ftype, sl550 before that. The horsy belongs and although those cars have luxury and sport features Ford will never have. I can honestly say the dark horse is probably the most thrilling and enjoyable daily driver of the bunch.
My 2010 IS F hangs with these mustangs 0 - 90 MPH. I paid 23.5k for it 5 years ago. Simply not interested going faster 0 - 60. If I did care about speed I'd definitely would've bought a corvette or CTS V. Out of my 4 vehicles - I still drive my 90's cars more. My newest being a '24 WRX. Mustangs are everywhere & most new owners are very cocky. Definitely had the pleasure of doing 3 pulls against a 2022 in my IS F at work. They were shocked to say the least 😊
Dark horse has gt500 internals though just without the boost right? That’s already special like a 03/04 Mach 1 4V considering the termi was a 4V too
Only GT500 rods. That's the only thing it shares with the GT500.
Predator rods aren't stronger than coyote rods.
It has strengthened cams and balanced crankshaft
@@nvadorzim9575 the crankshaft is only balanced differently for the GT500 rods. There's nothing special about that at all lol
Hope you do a 2018+ GT.
How do you feel about the Cadillac Blackwings? I have the CT4 Blackwing with a manual
I really like the interiors on those. Good car for the money. The aftermarket/tuning aspect hasn't caught up to the previous gen though. That'll change with time!
@@FitzCityGarage HP tuners now has full access to the ECU and there are at least two major tuning companies for them
@@GeronimoBiggles Yes, I'm aware of that. The aftermarket and people pushing the limits is still new. That's what I meant, my bad!
@@FitzCityGarage hope you get to try one out for yourself the handling and visibility is really nice and it comes with the tremec 6060 transmission
It's a Gen 3 with GT 500 Rod's.. I told everyone from the start it was a Gimmick and to just get a GT PP if you absolutely had to have an S650. But Honestly the best buy out there to this day is the S550.. It's the same car with 2 air boxes and a different Intake. Not trying to knock what anyone has but it's better to just do a Base Performance Pack..
It's definitely not worth the price jump from s550 to s650. S550 looks a lot better, too, especially the back end.
@@davothegreat9990 Agree !!!
Great video. Just found your channel. Subbed!
B58 and s58 are the best engines rn by far !
DH is a good looking waste of money. You're paying a premium for 16HP and predator connecting rods, which aren't any stronger than the stock ones.
Dodge has no fix for a recall on my 2019 charger. They abandoned us owners and I am looking at this car next
Would u pic a c8 or a dark horse ,no racing just around town toy
C8 100%
I agree kind of agree. Its not that fast or special of a car which is why I didn't buy it. And I really hate the front eyeliner look. I think if you buy a handling pack car in manual, keep the miles down and don't modify it, then it might be worth a little something someday. In my opinion, they need a new GT350. If you are going to modify a Mustang, your better off with the GT base car.
A good used Mach 1 can be a more affordable option. If money isn’t the issue? Go with the new one!
Good video, I opted for the same thing. I bought a 14 GT, I opted for that one because I really don't like the idea of independent rear suspension in the back. I'll keep my solid axles, no one can argue that the coyote is at one of the best v8s ever made though.
I just sold my 2021 gt500, I've owned 2 now and they just don't do much for Me and they do not put the power down very good at all. Much prefer driving my hellcat.
Smart move.. They are already dropping in Value now that people are realizing they can just get a GT and be happy.. Most people end up Mod'ing the hell out of these cars anyway and if you know you are that type of person just get a Base GT with some options.. And if you aren't into Mod'ing I would still get a GT and option it out how you want..
Companies have been doing this for yrs and we keep doing it
I will say, the 10R80 has been upgraded for 224 and up
One of the best new muscle cars on the market. And i have to respectfully disagree with you that these cars are not special, Right now you're looking at one of the biggest droughts in car sales since the collapse of the auto industry in 2008. As you know there's $100,000 vehicle sitting on lots getting lot rot. That's why you're seeing prices on everything not just a dark horse go down especially on trade-in value. No one's buying real expensive vehicles right now It's just a simple as that. My uncle has been the top salesman at Dodge in my area for over 40 years. He's actually 80 something and still working lol. That being said I'll respectfully disagree and I think that when you go to try to buy this car in 15 years you're going to see the price up like crazy when there's no more V8s being manufactured and hasn't been in over a decade I have a feeling you're going to regret this. I could be totally wrong but that's just my opinion. I also see people making massive power out of the lesser GT engine which, again I'm going to disagree with you and say that the dark horse engine is a lot more well built than the GT engine when it comes to forged parts different camshafts etc. Not to mention the better transmission. You're saying 7th gear is grenading on people but that's not entirely the case you've had people that have had this happen and when there was some back research done on it They had people working on the car that shouldn't have been to begin with! If we are talking about the same people. Anyways I likely won't watch this channel too much more because I'm a Mustang guy hands down unless you of course go through with what you said and build a GT up I'll definitely check in. But I'm going to set a reminder in my phone for a years time lol. So you better have two damn awesome cars built to the nine when I come back here in December 2025 lol! Be well man and God bless
I'm always moving on to new cars, so you must be new here lol. I'm a car enthusiast. More so for making fast cars and racing them. But, I'm not tied down to one specific brand. Life is too short to not experience as much as humanly possible. It's all good to disagree! No hate here!
@FitzCityGarage for sure I am new here. I am in the same Mustang group you are, I went and checked your subscribers and there's 3,000 most of the channels I watch are 100,000 plus. But like I said man all the best in your new endeavor. I also enjoy tons of cars I have an old Mark 4 Toyota Supra that you could comb your hair in the paint I keep it immaculate. As well as a new Acura Integra type S, I'm also very into motorcycles and off-road side by side and ATVs. Anything with an engine and I'm down to learn about it! Take care
get another camaro or a corvette Z06
there are more options than just Whipple, how come only the Whipple was discussed here? I'm going with a custom tuned stage II Procharger on my 2019 Challenger; doing forged internals and a cam, upgraded fuel system, upgraded drive train, etc. My mechanic tells me I'll be near or at 1000 WHP when it's done. Check my progress here: www.youtube.com/@1000HpScatPack
Whipple and Roush are the only ones that have a "Tune" for the superchargers on the 2024+ Mustangs. The ECUs are still locked unfortunately. That would be the route I take if I decide to. Good luck on your car! Going to be badass!
@@FitzCityGarage thanks man! Here in Europe there is no monopoly on unlocking the ECU like in the States; my understanding is that in the US you have to send Dodge ECU's to a specific firm to get them unlocked. Over here the guys doing custom builds unlock it themselves in house. My mechanic does it with his laptop and does the whole custom tune in-house as well. We have to, as it's too expensive to courier the ECU to the States every time you need to put a super charger in your ride. I'll do a video about that part of it when we get to that stage of the build. Right now we are putting in the forged internals, there is some videos up on my above second channel about where we are at right now. Planning to document the whole process on UA-cam. Note: if you get a stage I procharger that comes with a ready tune as well; it's the stage II ones that need a custom tune but that then allow you to mess around with nitrous and alcohol fuels and stuff (which is what I plan to do)
Unfortunately, the Dark Horse was just a rebadged Mach 1 for significantly more money. It's still a good car, but it's just a mach 1 that Ford's been gaslighting us about.
This is such an ignorant statement. The Dark Horse is not "just" a rebadge. A lot of R&D went into improving aero and handling among other notables like the engine and interior and exterior design elements which I find better and prefer. The Dark Horse makes refinements (not a complete overhaul) over the Mach 1 which is a good thing. Is it worth it? That's an individual choice but regardless the Dark Horse is a better car but perhaps not a lot better to appeal to everyone. That would be the GTD but then you're going to REALLY pay for it.
@BULZAYE maybe some R&D went into aero but handling!? The only difference between the DH and Mach 1 in the handling department is the steering knuckle, which many say is worse, and the new generation of magneride. Engine is nearly identical to the GT which is a gen3 coyote with dual throttle bodies. Watch this CCs other videos. Sure the dashboard is new. I personally cant stand the tacked on screen but thats just a personal preference. The GTD isnt even in the same universe since its $325k and nobody who traditionally shops for a mustang can afford that. Thats just Jim Farleys pet project. Its not ignorant to say the DH is a rebadged Mach 1 because thats exactly what it is. It's a mach 1 with a different name and graphics. It's kind of a waste of a nameplate. Couldve been an NA cross plane crank 5.2 or something truly different but instead Ford just phoned it in.
@@House_of_Schmidt Very few have said the steering was a little questionable, but the vast majority said it was an improvement. The Gen4 engine has more similarities than differences with the Gen3, but the changes are made in key areas. Fitz glossed over or misunderstood the some of the statements made by AED (cams for instance). This could be seen as a testament of the Gen3 block rather than a ding on Ford's decision making. Remember this is an S650 car incrementally up (in nomenclature) from an S550 car so it stands to reason similarities will exist. It's not like we went from an S95 to an S197 that some think should have been. The point of the GTD was in reference to delusional minds thinking that there should have been more. If you compared the price points (like I did) of a similarly equipped GT the price delta was around $5K-$6K. People need to put that into perspective which has been totally lost here. Not to mention inflation. Taking THAT into account you're not gonna buy much more for the "extra" cost. Would it have been nicer to have a truly Gen4 motor and boost built in? Heck yeah. But it wouldn't be anywhere near this price tag in today's market. Again, it is ignorant to say it's rebadged because it clearly is not no matter how much you wish it. I saw value in the Mach 1 and was interested save for the crazy cockpit that is in the S550 and a few other aesthetic reasons. I saw more value in the Dark Horse and appreciate the clean and forward looking IP. As for badges they should have done the grill and hub caps right but didn't so I do ding Ford for that. I'm not interested in the cross-plane crank, too unreliable for boost. As for Farley's pet project, you'd have to prove that and no the GTD isn't for everyone, but some seem to think it should be.
@BULZAYE ed krenz literally called the dark horse an evolution of the mach 1. Its a mach 1 dude. Yea its a new generation but its largely just the mach 1 even according to the chief engineer.
The cross plane crank NA 5.2 would likely be reliable. Ur thinking of the Flat plane which is the one that has oiling issues in the gt350.
I have a 2015 GT and drove a 2024 dark horse. I personally think the steering is faster but more numb. It may be the tires since they went to pirellis instead of the Michelins but idk.
My issue with the s650 is that it didnt address ANY of the complaints of current mustang owners and instead added new issues like the dash out of a kia forte that nobody was asking for. I mean they literally polled gen z for a car thats priced for boomers.
They didnt listen to mustang owners. The s650 didnt address the weight issues of the s550, didnt address the quality issues of the s550 and didnt address the mt82 issues of the s550. Instead they gave us some generic looking dashboard. A weird looking nose on the GT, a drift brake that nobody asked for or will ever use on their 55k+ car.
The whole s650 is just phoned in right now.
@BULZAYE and also anytime i see the garbage Millennial marketing term "forward thinking", i instantly think of a Marvel slop failure. Im sure Jaguars new commercial was supposed to be "forward thinking".
The reason dark horse wasn't used before 2024 is because the name sound like something thought up by a board room of middle aged women. The logo even looks like something drawn in a Middle School art project by the girl who loves horse. It looks like it belongs on a ranch, not a muscle car.
The best "mustang" Ford has made in the last 60 years was the 2015-2020 GT350.....really hard to beat that. Truly a special car, engine and experience.
I agree! The 2020+ GT500 could be argued 2nd!
Hmm gt350 blows engines and uses oil
@glvera749 not all of them, it definitely over blown and honestly there alot of owners that convince themselves they have oil consumption when they really don't and the oil consumption is just due to their driving habits and not a failure.
I totally agree. I’ve got a ‘19 GT-350 and it is such an incredible driving experience. It runs great, drives great, and sounds so fucking good! There’s no sound like it.
Yeah I definitely agree with you on that bro, these commenters obviously never really built fast cars that actually make sense 😅😅😅🤣🤣🤣🤣that's exactly why I bought a new 2022 Mach 1 with handling package, payed 45 for it, and after I blow it out I will be like 58 all in.
Badass man! Enjoy it 💪
He's right. There isn't much of any difference between the GT and darkhorse other than the logo and chasis number. I can run down everything that the GT Premium performance pack has, but it is actually as good as a base darkhorse with better interior for 1k less. The Premium preformance pack darkhorse does have some updrades for 10k more, plus markups. I couldn't find a performance pack darkhorse MT near MSRP so I did the loaded GT Premium performance pack with mag ride. I probably should have just bought a Mach 1 and saved 10k, or the C7 Z06 for 10k more.
@@jessicaphoenix1312 53k fees in and out the door before taxes for darkhorse premium. The GT premium with performance package and magnaride suspension active valve exhaust, nite pony package with upgraded b&o sound system was 65k$ before taxes.. Which the 25s you now have to pay to have the better sound system that comes standard on DH, the magnaride went up hundreds of dollars, no more wireless phone charger, ect ect. You don't get the differential cooler you do on DH, you don't get the upgraded motor parts such as the better crankshaft the forged rods from the gt500.. You get less HP, differently tuned suspension, smaller exhaust tips, I can go on and on. They are no longer sitting at MSRP or above at least not here in Canada. Like I said I got my dark horse premium for over $10,000 less than a GT fully loaded 2025 custom order. In the exact color I wanted with all the features standard that they took away for the 2025 model year in the GT like the wireless charger and the B&o sound system etc that I mentioned. It would make absolutely no sense to not get the dark horse over the GT. It's a better built faster car at the end of the day that's it.
@@TheKingOfKings818 No, you do get ALL the coolers on the GT pp - I'm looking at one in my garage. And fully loaded with mag ride was 61k sticker - I didn't pay that - and it went up to 66,100 for 2025. There is a lot of misinformation going around about these crs. The extra horsepower is just in the tune. 14 bhp in a tune? not gonna matter when I get the blower installed anyway. I don't know why nobody seems to know thaat the GT pp has someMach 1, GT 350, and 500 suspension parts.
@@TheKingOfKings818 Your negotiating skills are irrelevant; "I got it for X" breaks the entire comparison, so it's useless; use MSRP, or we can all just claim to have gotten a better deal.
I think the DH is the better option, but not because there's more value in a 'performance' package; there never is (again, your negotiating skills notwithstanding). The DH is the better option because it'll be the only one with any resale value, in 20-years, when all the more-affordable trims are horribly customized, or totaled.
The Dark Horse a track car, right? Why buy one if you're just going to drag race it. Better to go with a base GT
Not disagreeing with your overall point, just want to interject the idea that the Dark Horse is a collector's edition car.
I get that they added all of this 'performance' crap onto it, but we all know that you're not going to see Dark Horses at your local track days, either.
DUDE go buy back your ZL1 or get a ZO6 everyone and their dog has a boring mustang I bet every 3 houses in my Neiborhood probably has a mustang
That’s actually hella funny, in my neighborhood there are 3 mustangs and 3 dodge chargers 🤡, no Camaro, no SS’s or G8’s, no CTSV’s and it’s pretty sad actually
Look at BMW still🤣🤣🤣
If you want something different. You should consider a BMW G42 M240XDrive with a gen2 B58. Haha, I typed this right before you said. HIghly recommend a B58/S58 Xdrive. Excellent after market support, performance ceiling+versatility, and such a great value given all you get in those all season all weather practical daily platforms. You can easily push the G42 up to 700WHP, if you upgrade the trans & internals you can easily push it to 1200-1300WHP. Just depends on your budget. Black or Purple are the two best looking colors for the G42. The M340 is another great option if you want a sedan, tho the G42 is a bit lighter. I will say, the M340 isnt quite as snappy at high WHP levels(1000+WHP). The shorter wheelbase(while 5 inches may not seem significant) it does make the G42 a little more snappy at high WHP and require quicker responses.
If you want something another level above, I can also highly recommend the G82/G80 Comp Xdrive with the S58. Build costs will be a bit higher cause its a true M car ie M Tax if you go further than stage 2, but just basic mods(Intake, downpipes, & custom E45-E50 tune) will hit approx 9.7 1/4 mile, which can be pushed down to approx 9.5 if you upgrade to lighter rims, better tires, and a little weight reduction.
Ive owned a G80CXD and now a G82CXD with full carbon package & CCBs and could not recommend them more. I also have a few friends with heavily modified M340 & G42. Ill be fully building our the G82CXD later this winter. Will be a first-in-class drag & show car. Building her to be a low 8 second 1/4 car while maintaining most of her OEM drive-ability+feel... S58's are expensive to fully build out, but they are modern marvels of a platform. Tough to beat when all variables are considered.
Reliability
Build Quality
Interior Materials
Fuel Econ
After Market Support+Community
OEM Performance
Performance Ceiling
Performance gains with basic mods
Performance versatility(dig, roll, prep, no prep, street, track, backroads)
Adaptability & Drive-ability
Practicality & Usability
Technology
They may not offer the performance ceiling of a GTR or the space of a Blackwing 5, but their damn better than a Jack of All trades... More like a King of All trades, Ace of None type of platform. Super easy to push up to 1200WHP, as long as you have the $... Even if you stick to around 1000WHP from Hybrids will put you in the 8.9-flat 9's with the right supporting upgrades.
No matter if you choose a M240iXD, M340iXD, or G8xCXD you absolutely wont be disappointed! Itll quickly become your favorite car to drive!
Appreciate the info! I really am considering an M240i. The value on those are unreal. 600+whp would absolutely rip. Then get the trans built, and add another 100whp. Thing would be a monster lol
I also had a 2017 zl1 camaro and looking back that was the best bang for the buck car I've ever owned. Just picked up a hellcat durango and this vehicle is a BLAST to drive.
Awd power is super fun on the street. I definitely want to have one of my 2 vehicles coming up to have that capability. Can't beat the fun of a fast awd/4x4 vehicle!
Can’t tune the car should be the biggest 🚩should of really thought about that 🧐
I was cautiously optimistic that maybe it would be tunable by now 😭 lol
Damn bro I have a 2025 DH on order. Now you making me think if I should go through with it or not.
Really ask yourself what you want to do with the car. Assess that, look at much that will cost, and compare. That's the best advice I can give. I could absolutely afford the car. But it just logically didn't make sense to have it based on what I ultimately like to do with my cars.
@ Tnxs for the feedback 👍🏽
Who cares? Why did you buy it in the first place?
Hopes for tuning sooner than later and that the engine would be a lot more different. But after a recent engine teardown video came out, it's not special at all lol
I’m gonna give him a break. He didn’t really know what he had. He’s a little young by the looks of things and he just wants to go fast so you can do that with a goddamn cavalier.
I've had it all bud. Come talk to me when you've owned them all. This is an overpriced GT. End of story.
@ lol
Doesn’t matter what you’ve had. I just watched your whole video. All you wanna do is go fast doesn’t matter what car it is.Lol like I said, apparently you didn’t know what you had
No one knew until the engine teardown video. Literally not a single person knew 100% what the engine was like. NOW people know. Hence, car is gone. Overpriced GT confirmed.
I don't agree with this guy one bit.
Thanks for helping me pay off the depreciation 🤣😂 looking forward to picking up a used one soon 🫶🏾